Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Dotan Cohen]

On 19 March 2010 22:25, Philiрp Rеichmuth phil.ipp.reich.m...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi,

 is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
 given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
 of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?

 Background: I use XeTeX to typeset a document in several scripts, including
 Arabic. The Arabic-script sections are not in the Arabic language, but in a
 variety of other languages. Because my document is left-to-right, they get
 displayed on screen in LTR order, which is wrong. I can get them to display
 in RTL by setting their language to Arabic (ArabTeX or Arabi). In both
 cases, LyX displays them right-to-left, but these options are both
 ncompatible with XeTeX because they make other assumptions on how to render
 the text in the final output.

 Ideally, I wouldn't have to mark them as in a different language at all -
 there are no benefits other than the writing direction.  I use logical
 markup and custom styles anyway for these passages, so I'd just like to
 mark all instances of a given style to display RTL in LyX.  Is that
 possible, or is there some workaround?

 Philipp



Have you tried the Unicode RLM character:
http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

-- 
Dotan Cohen

http://bido.com
http://what-is-what.com

Please CC me if you want to be sure that I read your message. I do not
read all list mail.

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Am Sat, 20 Mar 2010 12:31:17 +0200 schrieb Dotan Cohen:
 Have you tried the Unicode RLM character:
 http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

Yes, seems to do nothing here.

Philipp

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Am Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:25:59 +0100 schrieb Philiрp Rеichmuth:
 is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
 given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
 of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?
 
 Background: [...]

Clarification:  I use XeTeX, which has directionality commands inherited 
from eTeX; there's a package called bidi.sty that wraps them in a nice user 
interface.  To access this, I use a paragraph style for RTL paragraphs, and 
character styles for embedded RTL text (and embedded LTR text in RTL 
paragraphs).  These styles also change the font.

Now LyX obviously doesn't know that whatever is formatted in those styles 
is actually RTL.  So the display order is broken.  I've attached a sample 
file to show what this looks like.  It requires XeTeX, bidi.sty, and some 
fonts - I used Charis SIL and Scheherazade, both freely available from 
http://scripts.sil.org/.

It seems that the generated 46 kB PDF file is too large for an email
attachment to the list. For comparison to how it looks in the final output,
I've uploaded it to http://freepdfhosting.com/15665b4a39.pdf.

Setting the language of the text to Arabic doesn't work; it gets the 
display order right, but then LyX makes assumptions about rendering the 
text using either ArabTeX or arabi.sty, which is obsolete now thanks to 
XeTeX ;).  (It also activates the Arabic spellchecker, which is a nuisance 
because the text is in Arabic script, but not in the Arabic language.)  So 
what I'm looking for is a way to tell LyX that whatever is in a given style 
should be rendered in RTL.  Can this be done?

I reckon this kind of problem will pop up more frequently as soon as LyX
supports XeTeX regularly and more people start using it for their weird
alphabets.

Philipp

arbidi.lyx
Description: Attached file: arbidi.lyx

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Dotan Cohen]

On 19 March 2010 22:25, Philiрp Rеichmuth phil.ipp.reich.m...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi,

 is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
 given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
 of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?

 Background: I use XeTeX to typeset a document in several scripts, including
 Arabic. The Arabic-script sections are not in the Arabic language, but in a
 variety of other languages. Because my document is left-to-right, they get
 displayed on screen in LTR order, which is wrong. I can get them to display
 in RTL by setting their language to Arabic (ArabTeX or Arabi). In both
 cases, LyX displays them right-to-left, but these options are both
 ncompatible with XeTeX because they make other assumptions on how to render
 the text in the final output.

 Ideally, I wouldn't have to mark them as in a different language at all -
 there are no benefits other than the writing direction.  I use logical
 markup and custom styles anyway for these passages, so I'd just like to
 mark all instances of a given style to display RTL in LyX.  Is that
 possible, or is there some workaround?

 Philipp



Have you tried the Unicode RLM character:
http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

-- 
Dotan Cohen

http://bido.com
http://what-is-what.com

Please CC me if you want to be sure that I read your message. I do not
read all list mail.

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Am Sat, 20 Mar 2010 12:31:17 +0200 schrieb Dotan Cohen:
 Have you tried the Unicode RLM character:
 http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

Yes, seems to do nothing here.

Philipp

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Am Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:25:59 +0100 schrieb Philiрp Rеichmuth:
 is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
 given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
 of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?
 
 Background: [...]

Clarification:  I use XeTeX, which has directionality commands inherited 
from eTeX; there's a package called bidi.sty that wraps them in a nice user 
interface.  To access this, I use a paragraph style for RTL paragraphs, and 
character styles for embedded RTL text (and embedded LTR text in RTL 
paragraphs).  These styles also change the font.

Now LyX obviously doesn't know that whatever is formatted in those styles 
is actually RTL.  So the display order is broken.  I've attached a sample 
file to show what this looks like.  It requires XeTeX, bidi.sty, and some 
fonts - I used Charis SIL and Scheherazade, both freely available from 
http://scripts.sil.org/.

It seems that the generated 46 kB PDF file is too large for an email
attachment to the list. For comparison to how it looks in the final output,
I've uploaded it to http://freepdfhosting.com/15665b4a39.pdf.

Setting the language of the text to Arabic doesn't work; it gets the 
display order right, but then LyX makes assumptions about rendering the 
text using either ArabTeX or arabi.sty, which is obsolete now thanks to 
XeTeX ;).  (It also activates the Arabic spellchecker, which is a nuisance 
because the text is in Arabic script, but not in the Arabic language.)  So 
what I'm looking for is a way to tell LyX that whatever is in a given style 
should be rendered in RTL.  Can this be done?

I reckon this kind of problem will pop up more frequently as soon as LyX
supports XeTeX regularly and more people start using it for their weird
alphabets.

Philipp

arbidi.lyx
Description: Attached file: arbidi.lyx

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Dotan Cohen]

On 19 March 2010 22:25, Philiрp Rеichmuth  wrote:
> Hi,
>
> is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
> given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
> of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?
>
> Background: I use XeTeX to typeset a document in several scripts, including
> Arabic. The Arabic-script sections are not in the Arabic language, but in a
> variety of other languages. Because my document is left-to-right, they get
> displayed on screen in LTR order, which is wrong. I can get them to display
> in RTL by setting their language to Arabic (ArabTeX or Arabi). In both
> cases, LyX displays them right-to-left, but these options are both
> ncompatible with XeTeX because they make other assumptions on how to render
> the text in the final output.
>
> Ideally, I wouldn't have to mark them as in a different language at all -
> there are no benefits other than the writing direction.  I use logical
> markup and custom styles anyway for these passages, so I'd just like to
> mark all instances of a given style to display RTL in LyX.  Is that
> possible, or is there some workaround?
>
> Philipp
>
>

Have you tried the Unicode RLM character:
http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

-- 
Dotan Cohen

http://bido.com
http://what-is-what.com

Please CC me if you want to be sure that I read your message. I do not
read all list mail.

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Am Sat, 20 Mar 2010 12:31:17 +0200 schrieb Dotan Cohen:
> Have you tried the Unicode RLM character:
> http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/200f/index.htm

Yes, seems to do nothing here.

Philipp

Re: Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Am Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:25:59 +0100 schrieb Philiрp Rеichmuth:
> is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
> given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
> of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?
> 
> Background: [...]

Clarification:  I use XeTeX, which has directionality commands inherited 
from eTeX; there's a package called bidi.sty that wraps them in a nice user 
interface.  To access this, I use a paragraph style for RTL paragraphs, and 
character styles for embedded RTL text (and embedded LTR text in RTL 
paragraphs).  These styles also change the font.

Now LyX obviously doesn't know that whatever is formatted in those styles 
is actually RTL.  So the display order is broken.  I've attached a sample 
file to show what this looks like.  It requires XeTeX, bidi.sty, and some 
fonts - I used Charis SIL and Scheherazade, both freely available from 
.

It seems that the generated 46 kB PDF file is too large for an email
attachment to the list. For comparison to how it looks in the final output,
I've uploaded it to .

Setting the language of the text to Arabic doesn't work; it gets the 
display order right, but then LyX makes assumptions about rendering the 
text using either ArabTeX or arabi.sty, which is obsolete now thanks to 
XeTeX ;).  (It also activates the Arabic spellchecker, which is a nuisance 
because the text is in Arabic script, but not in the Arabic language.)  So 
what I'm looking for is a way to tell LyX that whatever is in a given style 
should be rendered in RTL.  Can this be done?

I reckon this kind of problem will pop up more frequently as soon as LyX
supports XeTeX regularly and more people start using it for their weird
alphabets.

Philipp

arbidi.lyx
Description: Attached file: arbidi.lyx

Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Hi,

is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?

Background: I use XeTeX to typeset a document in several scripts, including
Arabic. The Arabic-script sections are not in the Arabic language, but in a
variety of other languages. Because my document is left-to-right, they get
displayed on screen in LTR order, which is wrong. I can get them to display
in RTL by setting their language to Arabic (ArabTeX or Arabi). In both
cases, LyX displays them right-to-left, but these options are both
ncompatible with XeTeX because they make other assumptions on how to render
the text in the final output.

Ideally, I wouldn't have to mark them as in a different language at all -
there are no benefits other than the writing direction.  I use logical
markup and custom styles anyway for these passages, so I'd just like to
mark all instances of a given style to display RTL in LyX.  Is that
possible, or is there some workaround?

Philipp

Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Hi,

is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?

Background: I use XeTeX to typeset a document in several scripts, including
Arabic. The Arabic-script sections are not in the Arabic language, but in a
variety of other languages. Because my document is left-to-right, they get
displayed on screen in LTR order, which is wrong. I can get them to display
in RTL by setting their language to Arabic (ArabTeX or Arabi). In both
cases, LyX displays them right-to-left, but these options are both
ncompatible with XeTeX because they make other assumptions on how to render
the text in the final output.

Ideally, I wouldn't have to mark them as in a different language at all -
there are no benefits other than the writing direction.  I use logical
markup and custom styles anyway for these passages, so I'd just like to
mark all instances of a given style to display RTL in LyX.  Is that
possible, or is there some workaround?

Philipp

Force RTL onscreen rendering for paragraph or character style?

[Philiрp Rеichmuth]

Hi,

is there a way to force the onscreen rendering for the text contained in a
given character or paragraphy style to be right-to-left? Ideally some kind
of command within the InsetLayout or Style groups in the layout options?

Background: I use XeTeX to typeset a document in several scripts, including
Arabic. The Arabic-script sections are not in the Arabic language, but in a
variety of other languages. Because my document is left-to-right, they get
displayed on screen in LTR order, which is wrong. I can get them to display
in RTL by setting their language to Arabic (ArabTeX or Arabi). In both
cases, LyX displays them right-to-left, but these options are both
ncompatible with XeTeX because they make other assumptions on how to render
the text in the final output.

Ideally, I wouldn't have to mark them as in a different language at all -
there are no benefits other than the writing direction.  I use logical
markup and custom styles anyway for these passages, so I'd just like to
mark all instances of a given style to display RTL in LyX.  Is that
possible, or is there some workaround?

Philipp