Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
yep. that fixed it for me. 2011/12/20 Alan Skipp > OK folks, I think I've fixed the problem. Though I've only got the one mac > here, so can't be certain. Those interested in animated superimposed > moustaches, please find the code at: > > https://gist.github.com/1469659 > > To attempt a hi-definition facial appendage, use the following settings > (appropriate hardware is required). > > width = 1280 > height = 720 > session.sessionPreset = AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720 > > Do let me know if this fixes the issue. > > Al > > On 19 Dec 2011, at 19:37, Matt Aimonetti wrote: > > When I tried the live video script, the items weren't properly located > either. > > -m > Sent from my iPhone > > On Dec 19, 2011, at 12:34, Alan Skipp wrote: > > Hmm… curious. > The positioning code could certainly do with some refinement, but from my > testing it's close enough for rock 'n' roll, as they say. Perhaps you added > the code to an existing project which set-up the window/view/layer slightly > differently? If not, then I'm confused also… > > Al > > On 19 Dec 2011, at 14:56, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: > > the mustache is off even in your original gist. am i right? or is this > some kind of weird setup where its works on your mac and not on mine.. > > On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 4:22 PM, Alan Skipp wrote: > >> Hi, >> Could you create a new gist with your additions and post a link to it. >> I'll then take a look and see if I can discover the problem. It could be >> something to do with setting the anchorPoint on the CALayer, but that's >> just a wild guess at the minute. >> >> Al >> >> >> On 19 Dec 2011, at 13:42, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: >> >> hello alan. i was playing around with your gist, but the glasses and all >> the extra layers are off. i positioned the layers over the face, but they >> always stay to the right of the face, and the distance they are to the >> right, is not even fixed. it comes closer to the face when i move to the >> left. >> >> i'm confused.. >> >> On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:07 AM, Alan Skipp wrote: >> >>> A bit late to the moustachioed party. But here is an attempt at the live >>> moustachification problem. The effect is perhaps more like being pursued by >>> a persistent tache, rather than wearing a tache. Those with more powerful >>> hardware (or less inclination to move around in front of the camera) may >>> have more convincing results. >>> I have stolen the moustache and moustache positioning method from the >>> previous submissions - I hope that's OK. With any luck there'll be >>> something worth stealing back from my submission. >>> No attempts as yet at recording the effect (AVFoundation is a scary >>> labyrinth). >>> >>> https://gist.github.com/1469659 >>> >>> Al >>> >>> On 8 Dec 2011, at 09:23, Sean Mateus wrote: >>> >>> > Hi Pavlos, >>> > as we talked yesterday on twitter; I hope we can use this code >>> https://gist.github.com/1427886 as basis for the video version your >>> mustachification-script! >>> > >>> > you can ping me on twitter @seanlilmateus >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Sean Mateus >>> > ___ >>> > MacRuby-devel mailing list >>> > [email protected] >>> > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >>> >>> ___ >>> MacRuby-devel mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Pavlos Vinieratos >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> >> >> >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> >> > > > -- > Pavlos Vinieratos > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > -- Pavlos Vinieratos ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
https://gist.github.com/1501117 how is that? :) On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 11:32 AM, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: > yep. that fixed it for me. > > > 2011/12/20 Alan Skipp > >> OK folks, I think I've fixed the problem. Though I've only got the one >> mac here, so can't be certain. Those interested in animated superimposed >> moustaches, please find the code at: >> >> https://gist.github.com/1469659 >> >> To attempt a hi-definition facial appendage, use the following settings >> (appropriate hardware is required). >> >> width = 1280 >> height = 720 >> session.sessionPreset = AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720 >> >> Do let me know if this fixes the issue. >> >> Al >> >> On 19 Dec 2011, at 19:37, Matt Aimonetti wrote: >> >> When I tried the live video script, the items weren't properly located >> either. >> >> -m >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Dec 19, 2011, at 12:34, Alan Skipp wrote: >> >> Hmm… curious. >> The positioning code could certainly do with some refinement, but from my >> testing it's close enough for rock 'n' roll, as they say. Perhaps you added >> the code to an existing project which set-up the window/view/layer slightly >> differently? If not, then I'm confused also… >> >> Al >> >> On 19 Dec 2011, at 14:56, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: >> >> the mustache is off even in your original gist. am i right? or is this >> some kind of weird setup where its works on your mac and not on mine.. >> >> On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 4:22 PM, Alan Skipp wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> Could you create a new gist with your additions and post a link to it. >>> I'll then take a look and see if I can discover the problem. It could be >>> something to do with setting the anchorPoint on the CALayer, but that's >>> just a wild guess at the minute. >>> >>> Al >>> >>> >>> On 19 Dec 2011, at 13:42, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: >>> >>> hello alan. i was playing around with your gist, but the glasses and all >>> the extra layers are off. i positioned the layers over the face, but they >>> always stay to the right of the face, and the distance they are to the >>> right, is not even fixed. it comes closer to the face when i move to the >>> left. >>> >>> i'm confused.. >>> >>> On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:07 AM, Alan Skipp wrote: >>> A bit late to the moustachioed party. But here is an attempt at the live moustachification problem. The effect is perhaps more like being pursued by a persistent tache, rather than wearing a tache. Those with more powerful hardware (or less inclination to move around in front of the camera) may have more convincing results. I have stolen the moustache and moustache positioning method from the previous submissions - I hope that's OK. With any luck there'll be something worth stealing back from my submission. No attempts as yet at recording the effect (AVFoundation is a scary labyrinth). https://gist.github.com/1469659 Al On 8 Dec 2011, at 09:23, Sean Mateus wrote: > Hi Pavlos, > as we talked yesterday on twitter; I hope we can use this code https://gist.github.com/1427886 as basis for the video version your mustachification-script! > > you can ping me on twitter @seanlilmateus > > > -- > Sean Mateus > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Pavlos Vinieratos >>> ___ >>> MacRuby-devel mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> MacRuby-devel mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Pavlos Vinieratos >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> >> >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> >> >> >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> >> > > > -- > Pavlos Vinieratos > -- Pavlos Vinieratos _
Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
On Dec 20, 2011, at 11:34 AM, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: > https://gist.github.com/1501117 > how is that? :) Now broken on the MacBook Air. :-) 2011-12-20 14:19:52.115 macruby[4131:60b] *** Can't add because the device does not support AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720. Use -[AVCaptureDevice supportsAVCaptureSessionPreset:]. - Jordan ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
oh.. I changed the preset. replace all 1280 with 640 and all 720 with 480 and check again. On 20 Δεκ 2011, at 15:20, "Jordan K. Hubbard" wrote: > > On Dec 20, 2011, at 11:34 AM, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: > >> https://gist.github.com/1501117 >> how is that? :) > > Now broken on the MacBook Air. :-) > > 2011-12-20 14:19:52.115 macruby[4131:60b] *** Can't add > because the > device does not support AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720. Use > -[AVCaptureDevice supportsAVCaptureSessionPreset:]. > > - Jordan > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
Yeah, I figured as much and was able to fix it by making that change right after reporting the bug, but shouldn't we be able to some how make this camera resolution independent? I'm no expert on the AvCapture class, but AVCaptureSessionPresetHigh is another preset which at least does not hard-code the resolution of the camera, leaving as the sole exercise to the reader the size of the frame. I'm not sure how to query that bit of info, and on the MacBook Air the 720p resolution results in the same incorrect offset for mustache, glasses and hat - only 640x480 delivers the correct results there. Clearly, we haven't quite made this hardware independent yet, but we're getting closer I think! - Jordan P.S. Kudos to Matt for posting such an interesting and amusing challenge! I've already learned far more about the AVCaptureSession class than I would have ever been motivated to learn otherwise, and I work for the company! :) On Dec 20, 2011, at 2:24 PM, Paul Vinieratos wrote: > oh.. I changed the preset. replace all 1280 with 640 and all 720 with 480 and > check again. > > On 20 Δεκ 2011, at 15:20, "Jordan K. Hubbard" wrote: > >> >> On Dec 20, 2011, at 11:34 AM, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: >> >>> https://gist.github.com/1501117 >>> how is that? :) >> >> Now broken on the MacBook Air. :-) >> >> 2011-12-20 14:19:52.115 macruby[4131:60b] *** Can't add >> because the >> device does not support AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720. Use >> -[AVCaptureDevice supportsAVCaptureSessionPreset:]. >> >> - Jordan >> >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
[MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
I would like to probe sentiment around the future for MacRuby ? is there a future ? I am drawn to it - I like Ruby as a language and development approach. I appreciate the entrance it provides into Cocoa without having to sign up for Objective-C. But where does it fit within Apple's longer term view ? Is MacRuby about to be Orphaned ? It seems like something happened around march 2011.What are the groups within Apple that hate MacRuby and want to kill it as a threat to Objective-C ? I am loath to invest a lot of time and coding in something that is a dead-end. Would love to hear insights from anyone with better insight. Dan Farrand 1-307-367-2276 This message is intended only for the person or company to which it is addressed and is considered to be confidential unless otherwise identified as not being confidential. Please prohibit any dissemination of this information by or to persons or entities other than the intended recipient. If you received this in error, please contact the sender. Green River Computing Services is a Wyoming corporation. ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
The version below supports 640x480 and 1280x720 resolutions. https://gist.github.com/1501766 I've also added support for multiple live video Santas. I'm not keen on my use of class variables to store images, but it was the only way I could think of to prevent repeatedly downloading the same image. Al On 20 Dec 2011, at 13:53, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Yeah, I figured as much and was able to fix it by making that change right > after reporting the bug, but shouldn't we be able to some how make this > camera resolution independent? > > I'm no expert on the AvCapture class, but AVCaptureSessionPresetHigh is > another preset which at least does not hard-code the resolution of the > camera, leaving as the sole exercise to the reader the size of the frame. > I'm not sure how to query that bit of info, and on the MacBook Air the 720p > resolution results in the same incorrect offset for mustache, glasses and hat > - only 640x480 delivers the correct results there. Clearly, we haven't quite > made this hardware independent yet, but we're getting closer I think! > > - Jordan > > P.S. Kudos to Matt for posting such an interesting and amusing challenge! > I've already learned far more about the AVCaptureSession class than I would > have ever been motivated to learn otherwise, and I work for the company! :) > > On Dec 20, 2011, at 2:24 PM, Paul Vinieratos wrote: > >> oh.. I changed the preset. replace all 1280 with 640 and all 720 with 480 >> and check again. >> >> On 20 Δεκ 2011, at 15:20, "Jordan K. Hubbard" wrote: >> >>> >>> On Dec 20, 2011, at 11:34 AM, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: >>> https://gist.github.com/1501117 how is that? :) >>> >>> Now broken on the MacBook Air. :-) >>> >>> 2011-12-20 14:19:52.115 macruby[4131:60b] *** Can't add >>> because >>> the device does not support AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720. Use >>> -[AVCaptureDevice supportsAVCaptureSessionPreset:]. >>> >>> - Jordan >>> >>> ___ >>> MacRuby-devel mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
if you don't have fun, you are doing it wrong. On 20 Dec 2011, at 17:06, Dan Farrand wrote: > I would like to probe sentiment around the future for MacRuby ? is there a > future ? I am drawn to it - I like Ruby as a language and development > approach. I appreciate the entrance it provides into Cocoa without having to > sign up for Objective-C. But where does it fit within Apple's longer term > view ? Is MacRuby about to be Orphaned ? It seems like something happened > around march 2011.What are the groups within Apple that hate MacRuby and > want to kill it as a threat to Objective-C ? I am loath to invest a lot of > time and coding in something that is a dead-end. Would love to hear insights > from anyone with better insight. > > > Dan Farrand > 1-307-367-2276 > > This message is intended only for the person or company to which it is > addressed and is considered to be confidential unless otherwise identified as > not being confidential. Please prohibit any dissemination of this information > by or to persons or entities other than the intended recipient. If you > received this in error, please contact the sender. Green River Computing > Services is a Wyoming corporation. > > > > > > > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
Ha. I like that. It should be fun. MacRuby is fun. MacRuby is also not yet perfect. Whatever politics are happening inside Apple, we're not privy to them. I don't think anyone at Apple "hates" it, given that they've fixed major bugs relatively recently. Don't consider it a waste of time. You will need to learn to work with the Cocoa API no matter what to develop for Mac or iOS, and that is a huge part of the learning curve. Choose your tools based on what suits you. On Tuesday, December 20, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Benjamin Almeida wrote: > if you don't have fun, you are doing it wrong. > > > On 20 Dec 2011, at 17:06, Dan Farrand (mailto:[email protected])> wrote: > > > I would like to probe sentiment around the future for MacRuby ? is there a > > future ? I am drawn to it - I like Ruby as a language and development > > approach. I appreciate the entrance it provides into Cocoa without having > > to sign up for Objective-C. But where does it fit within Apple's longer > > term view ? Is MacRuby about to be Orphaned ? It seems like something > > happened around march 2011. What are the groups within Apple that hate > > MacRuby and want to kill it as a threat to Objective-C ? I am loath to > > invest a lot of time and coding in something that is a dead-end. Would love > > to hear insights from anyone with better insight. > > > > > > Dan Farrand > > 1-307-367-2276 > > > > This message is intended only for the person or company to which it is > > addressed and is considered to be confidential unless otherwise identified > > as not being confidential. Please prohibit any dissemination of this > > information by or to persons or entities other than the intended recipient. > > If you received this in error, please contact the sender. Green River > > Computing Services is a Wyoming corporation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > MacRuby-devel mailing list > > [email protected] > > (mailto:[email protected]) > > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] (mailto:[email protected]) > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
I wonder if we couldn't kickstarter a fund to let apple hire someone full time to do macruby work? Anyone @ the mothership know if that'd be well received? -Kevin On Dec 20, 2011, at 12:02 PM, Dominic Dagradi wrote: > Ha. I like that. It should be fun. > > MacRuby is fun. MacRuby is also not yet perfect. Whatever politics are > happening inside Apple, we're not privy to them. I don't think anyone at > Apple "hates" it, given that they've fixed major bugs relatively recently. > > Don't consider it a waste of time. You will need to learn to work with the > Cocoa API no matter what to develop for Mac or iOS, and that is a huge part > of the learning curve. Choose your tools based on what suits you. > On Tuesday, December 20, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Benjamin Almeida wrote: > >> if you don't have fun, you are doing it wrong. >> >> >> On 20 Dec 2011, at 17:06, Dan Farrand wrote: >> >>> I would like to probe sentiment around the future for MacRuby ? is there a >>> future ? I am drawn to it - I like Ruby as a language and development >>> approach. I appreciate the entrance it provides into Cocoa without having >>> to sign up for Objective-C. But where does it fit within Apple's longer >>> term view ? Is MacRuby about to be Orphaned ? It seems like something >>> happened around march 2011. What are the groups within Apple that hate >>> MacRuby and want to kill it as a threat to Objective-C ? I am loath to >>> invest a lot of time and coding in something that is a dead-end. Would love >>> to hear insights from anyone with better insight. >>> >>> >>> Dan Farrand >>> 1-307-367-2276 >>> >>> This message is intended only for the person or company to which it is >>> addressed and is considered to be confidential unless otherwise identified >>> as not being confidential. Please prohibit any dissemination of this >>> information by or to persons or entities other than the intended recipient. >>> If you received this in error, please contact the sender. Green River >>> Computing Services is a Wyoming corporation. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> MacRuby-devel mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel >> ___ >> MacRuby-devel mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] MacRuby challenge
Confirmed to work on my recent MacBook Pro. - Matt On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 11:19 AM, Alan Skipp wrote: > The version below supports 640x480 and 1280x720 resolutions. > > https://gist.github.com/1501766 > > I've also added support for multiple live video Santas. > I'm not keen on my use of class variables to store images, but it was the > only way I could think of to prevent repeatedly downloading the same image. > > Al > > > > > On 20 Dec 2011, at 13:53, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Yeah, I figured as much and was able to fix it by making that change right > after reporting the bug, but shouldn't we be able to some how make this > camera resolution independent? > > I'm no expert on the AvCapture class, but AVCaptureSessionPresetHigh is > another preset which at least does not hard-code the resolution of the > camera, leaving as the sole exercise to the reader the size of the frame. > I'm not sure how to query that bit of info, and on the MacBook Air the > 720p resolution results in the same incorrect offset for mustache, glasses > and hat - only 640x480 delivers the correct results there. Clearly, we > haven't quite made this hardware independent yet, but we're getting closer > I think! > > - Jordan > > P.S. Kudos to Matt for posting such an interesting and amusing challenge! > I've already learned far more about the AVCaptureSession class than I > would have ever been motivated to learn otherwise, and I work for the > company! :) > > On Dec 20, 2011, at 2:24 PM, Paul Vinieratos wrote: > > oh.. I changed the preset. replace all 1280 with 640 and all 720 with 480 > and check again. > > On 20 Δεκ 2011, at 15:20, "Jordan K. Hubbard" wrote: > > > On Dec 20, 2011, at 11:34 AM, Pavlos Vinieratos wrote: > > https://gist.github.com/1501117 > how is that? :) > > > Now broken on the MacBook Air. :-) > > 2011-12-20 14:19:52.115 macruby[4131:60b] *** Can't add > because > the device does not support AVCaptureSessionPreset1280x720. Use > -[AVCaptureDevice supportsAVCaptureSessionPreset:]. > > - Jordan > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
[MacRuby-devel] Speed
Hi, I have written a function with 461 queries in a MySQL database. With macirb, it takes more or less 1s for all queries. I put my file in a Xcode project and when I click on a button, the action is to run this function. However, it takes more or less 1s for EACH query! I use normal schedule, not deployment as explained in the definitive guide, (I don't want give the exact title to not make advertisement in a post lol ) What's wrong? François ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
On Dec 20, 2011, at 6:07 PM, Kevin Poorman wrote: > I wonder if we couldn't kickstarter a fund to let apple hire someone full > time to do macruby work? MacRuby is an open source project and, as such, is (and always has been) free to seek or employ additional resources entirely on its own; it does not need Apple to hand-hold or broker such an arrangement, assuming that such was even possible or desirable. While it is also true that Apple has historically put a fair amount of energy into MacRuby, playing a significant role in bootstrapping it to the (IMO, quite functional) state it is in today, the greater MacRuby community should certainly not take this in any way as an indication that it should simply wait passively on the sidelines vs taking an active role in determining its future. MacRuby, just as with pretty much every other dialect or implementation of Ruby, is not (or at least shouldn't be) something driven by a single person or corporation. Even Matz himself is not the sole arbiter of what Ruby is or can become, it being far more of a group effort at this point, and MacRuby is no different. If it were a bird, I would say that it's spent a fair amount of time in the nest, its wings are fully grown, and it's fully capable of flying by itself at this point. :) - Jordan ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
As someone who has been trying to help in my vanishing spare time, the actions of Apple with regard to MacRuby are very important to my motivation. No one outside of Apple can integrate it with XCode, or allow it on iOS devices. If these things don't happen, MacRuby will be much less than it could be if these things do happen. So, it would be very good for external support of the project to get real indications that Apple is at least beneficent toward the project if not directly dedicating resources. Jeff Hemmelgarn On Dec 20, 2011, at 3:04 PM, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > MacRuby is an open source project and, as such, is (and always has been) free > to seek or employ additional resources entirely on its own; it does not need > Apple to hand-hold or broker such an arrangement, assuming that such was even > possible or desirable. > > While it is also true that Apple has historically put a fair amount of energy > into MacRuby, playing a significant role in bootstrapping it to the (IMO, > quite functional) state it is in today, the greater MacRuby community should > certainly not take this in any way as an indication that it should simply > wait passively on the sidelines vs taking an active role in determining its > future. MacRuby, just as with pretty much every other dialect or > implementation of Ruby, is not (or at least shouldn't be) something driven by > a single person or corporation. Even Matz himself is not the sole arbiter of > what Ruby is or can become, it being far more of a group effort at this > point, and MacRuby is no different. If it were a bird, I would say that it's > spent a fair amount of time in the nest, its wings are fully grown, and it's > fully capable of flying by itself at this point. :) > > - Jordan ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
> > No one outside of Apple can integrate it with XCode, or allow it on iOS > devices. While the XCode part is partly true (due to limited APIs to say the least), MacRuby doesn't need to be blessed by Apple to run on iOS. Legally, Apple isn't blocking anything. I see that as a double edged sword, yes Apple support allowed MacRuby to be where it is at, but IMHO, it also limits/restricts the project, or at least Apple's contribution on some aspect that the community is interested in. As someone mentioned on twitter the other day, some major parts of OS X are built/using MacRuby such as the PodcastProducer (or whatever the name is). But I personally prefer my open source project to be a bit more independent. If you want full Apple support, use Objective-C, if you are interested in what MacRuby has to offer and are willing to take a (small) risk, take the leap. Furthermore, I think too many people rely on the fact that MacRuby is an Apple backed project and therefore don't contribute/participate to the project, which is quite regrettable. The future of MacRuby? MacRuby isn't going anywhere, we are having some technical hosting issues pushing the 0.11 release which should be solved soon hopefully. 0.11 is hopefully the last release before 1.0. Once 1.0 will be out, we will be able to focus on the next big things. As shown in the various email threads and the interesting projects people are building, MacRuby is solid and fun. The challenge seems to be that the interest around the OS X app store isn't as big as expected and maybe we should seriously consider spend some resources on an iOS version? - Matt On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 4:25 PM, Jeff Hemmelgarn wrote: > As someone who has been trying to help in my vanishing spare time, the > actions of Apple with regard to MacRuby are very important to my > motivation. No one outside of Apple can integrate it with XCode, or allow > it on iOS devices. If these things don't happen, MacRuby will be much less > than it could be if these things do happen. So, it would be very good for > external support of the project to get real indications that Apple is at > least beneficent toward the project if not directly dedicating resources. > > Jeff Hemmelgarn > > On Dec 20, 2011, at 3:04 PM, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > MacRuby is an open source project and, as such, is (and always has been) > free to seek or employ additional resources entirely on its own; it does > not need Apple to hand-hold or broker such an arrangement, assuming that > such was even possible or desirable. > > > > While it is also true that Apple has historically put a fair amount of > energy into MacRuby, playing a significant role in bootstrapping it to the > (IMO, quite functional) state it is in today, the greater MacRuby community > should certainly not take this in any way as an indication that it should > simply wait passively on the sidelines vs taking an active role in > determining its future. MacRuby, just as with pretty much every other > dialect or implementation of Ruby, is not (or at least shouldn't be) > something driven by a single person or corporation. Even Matz himself is > not the sole arbiter of what Ruby is or can become, it being far more of a > group effort at this point, and MacRuby is no different. If it were a > bird, I would say that it's spent a fair amount of time in the nest, its > wings are fully grown, and it's fully capable of flying by itself at this > point. :) > > > > - Jordan > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
Good questions. I'd certainly like to see Apple put its weight behind MacRuby and leave us with an official word of support. Like you I have a hard time putting much effort into something that is wishy washy in its relationship with Apple. I still use Python for most of my scripting needs and need compelling reasons to pull away from it. As to Objective-C it really isn't that bad. Especially if development is done on modern hardware, where it is almost as interactive as working with an interpreter. I'm not sure if a reasonable person would see MacRuby as a threat to Objective-C. I could see people developing the opinion that it is a waste of time. There is a difference! In any event my impression is a bit different than yours, I actually thought things where going fairly well at Apple MacRuby wise. Maybe I missed something. Sent from my iPad On Dec 20, 2011, at 11:06 AM, Dan Farrand wrote: > I would like to probe sentiment around the future for MacRuby ? is there a > future ? I am drawn to it - I like Ruby as a language and development > approach. I appreciate the entrance it provides into Cocoa without having to > sign up for Objective-C. But where does it fit within Apple's longer term > view ? Is MacRuby about to be Orphaned ? It seems like something happened > around march 2011.What are the groups within Apple that hate MacRuby and > want to kill it as a threat to Objective-C ? I am loath to invest a lot of > time and coding in something that is a dead-end. Would love to hear insights > from anyone with better insight. > > > Dan Farrand > 1-307-367-2276 > > This message is intended only for the person or company to which it is > addressed and is considered to be confidential unless otherwise identified as > not being confidential. Please prohibit any dissemination of this information > by or to persons or entities other than the intended recipient. If you > received this in error, please contact the sender. Green River Computing > Services is a Wyoming corporation. > > > > > > > > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
The XCode integration is actually something that I find bothersome, especially the reliance upon nibs or whatever they are called. As an IDE goes XCode has never really been professional level, though I know that statement frustrates many it is very much true. As to nibs well the whole thing is just very obtuse and frustrating to me. Mind you my background is not the same as many here, being focused on industrial automation, but if find the use of nibs and Interface builder to be very taxing and not very object Oriented. MacRuby would likely generate a lot more interest if they moved away from the interface builder approach to GUI development.I know this will result in many arrows coming my way, but really folks lets be objective here IB is a very strange departure from most GUI development systems. Sent from my iPad On Dec 20, 2011, at 4:53 PM, Matt Aimonetti wrote: > No one outside of Apple can integrate it with XCode, or allow it on iOS > devices. > > While the XCode part is partly true (due to limited APIs to say the least), > MacRuby doesn't need to be blessed by Apple to run on iOS. Legally, Apple > isn't blocking anything. > > I see that as a double edged sword, yes Apple support allowed MacRuby to be > where it is at, but IMHO, it also limits/restricts the project, or at least > Apple's contribution on some aspect that the community is interested in. As > someone mentioned on twitter the other day, some major parts of OS X are > built/using MacRuby such as the PodcastProducer (or whatever the name is). > But I personally prefer my open source project to be a bit more independent. > If you want full Apple support, use Objective-C, if you are interested in > what MacRuby has to offer and are willing to take a (small) risk, take the > leap. Furthermore, I think too many people rely on the fact that MacRuby is > an Apple backed project and therefore don't contribute/participate to the > project, which is quite regrettable. > > The future of MacRuby? MacRuby isn't going anywhere, we are having some > technical hosting issues pushing the 0.11 release which should be solved soon > hopefully. 0.11 is hopefully the last release before 1.0. > Once 1.0 will be out, we will be able to focus on the next big things. > > As shown in the various email threads and the interesting projects people are > building, MacRuby is solid and fun. The challenge seems to be that the > interest around the OS X app store isn't as big as expected and maybe we > should seriously consider spend some resources on an iOS version? > > - Matt > > > > On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 4:25 PM, Jeff Hemmelgarn wrote: > As someone who has been trying to help in my vanishing spare time, the > actions of Apple with regard to MacRuby are very important to my motivation. > No one outside of Apple can integrate it with XCode, or allow it on iOS > devices. If these things don't happen, MacRuby will be much less than it > could be if these things do happen. So, it would be very good for external > support of the project to get real indications that Apple is at least > beneficent toward the project if not directly dedicating resources. > > Jeff Hemmelgarn > > On Dec 20, 2011, at 3:04 PM, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > MacRuby is an open source project and, as such, is (and always has been) > > free to seek or employ additional resources entirely on its own; it does > > not need Apple to hand-hold or broker such an arrangement, assuming that > > such was even possible or desirable. > > > > While it is also true that Apple has historically put a fair amount of > > energy into MacRuby, playing a significant role in bootstrapping it to the > > (IMO, quite functional) state it is in today, the greater MacRuby community > > should certainly not take this in any way as an indication that it should > > simply wait passively on the sidelines vs taking an active role in > > determining its future. MacRuby, just as with pretty much every other > > dialect or implementation of Ruby, is not (or at least shouldn't be) > > something driven by a single person or corporation. Even Matz himself is > > not the sole arbiter of what Ruby is or can become, it being far more of a > > group effort at this point, and MacRuby is no different. If it were a > > bird, I would say that it's spent a fair amount of time in the nest, its > > wings are fully grown, and it's fully capable of flying by itself at this > > point. :) > > > > - Jordan > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel > > ___ > MacRuby-devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected]
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
I guess my main angst is with the the direction and philosophy of the project. One vision of MacRuby has it being a fully compatible ruby implementation, that happens to be built on the Objective-C runtime and have good integration to all of the libraries provided by Apple, but wrap the guts so that everything is a ruby object. This is basically how I see the JRuby project. Access to java libraries and code, but regular ruby runs correctly. Another vision of MacRuby is instead an Apple-centric tool that exposes it's Objective-C underpinnings in non-compatile ways. I am talking about using named parameters and having classes like NSMutableArray in the class hierarchy, at least. There may be other things that I am not aware of. If the project had been started outside of Apple I would expect the first vision to hold sway. The second vision is how I perceive the project from what I have had a chance to glean from the code and the Trac database. As an Apple outsider, it is harder to get behind the project when I see it as very Apple-centric. It is a big problem that there are gems that currently look like they will never work under MacRuby (anything using Fibers, or less importantly string encodings). I agree that integration with XCode is tangential to the core questions. However, iOS is another matter unless either 1) iOS now has garbage collection (I wouldn't know because I don't follow iOS, I just think it is important to the community of (possible) MacRuby developers) or 2) MacRuby can be compiled to work without built-in garbage collection. I am perfectly happy to be educated on how either of those things are true. If they aren't true then there is a lot of developer time between now and being able to run MacRuby apps on iOS, whether Apple allows it or not. I don't have the time to fix all of these things myself, and I fear that the current direction of MacRuby is not what I would choose. Therefore anything I contributed would potentially be rejected because I was not pulling in the right direction. I am not complaining about that: it is the prerogative of the project lead to take it where they want to go. To be honest even if the project was running exactly as I wished I wouldn't have the time to contribute too much. But I think it would be easier for other people outside of Apple to contribute if they saw that MacRuby was trying to be compliant first and Apple-serving second. A large part of the problem is that there seems to be no communication out of Apple about what is going on. This is generally regarded as a bad sign for an open source project. It will be very hard to convince people to contribute when it looks like Apple is taking anyone's contributions and not reciprocating by being open about the process. How does someone propose a change to the architecture of MacRuby? Where are the archives of discussions about the design decisions made so far? Where are the design documents? Where is the roadmap for bringing MacRuby to 100% compatibility to matzruby? The contents of the MacRuby Trac component is not sufficient. All that being said, I will be trying to contribute what I can, especially over the next week and a half since I have the time off. I do want to help. I just have quite a learning curve and little time left over from my family and day job. I look forward to the day I can use MacRuby and be confident that I can use any ruby code, any gem, any library while still using the Objective-C libraries available on MacOSX. To clarify, I think MacRuby should take all valid ruby code and compile and run it correctly. I don't have a problem with it also taking the named parameters syntax when I want to work with Objective-C code, as long as it doesn't interfere with regular code. It is a bold vision but if you can communicate that vision convincingly you may be surprised at the support you would get. Jeff Hemmelgarn ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
Re: [MacRuby-devel] A Future for MacRuby
On Dec 21, 2011, at 12:43 AM, David Frantz wrote: > As to nibs well the whole thing is just very obtuse and frustrating to me. > Mind you my background is not the same as many here, being focused on > industrial automation, but if find the use of nibs and Interface builder to > be very taxing and not very object Oriented. MacRuby would likely generate a > lot more interest if they moved away from the interface builder approach to > GUI development.I know this will result in many arrows coming my way, but > really folks lets be objective here IB is a very strange departure from most > GUI development systems. That was essentially the goal of the HotCocoa project, but it seems that very few folks shared your concerns or your desire for XIB-less UI development since outside contributions (once Rich moved on to other things) have been extremely minimal. - Jordan ___ MacRuby-devel mailing list [email protected] http://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/macruby-devel
