Re: jumping to the top of an email box

[Gabe Griffith]

Hi,

Thanks both for your responses. Both of these commands seem to work but the 
opt-cmd up or down I find much easier as they have about half the key commands.

Thanks again,

Gabe


> On Apr 1, 2017, at 3:58 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
> 
> How about cmd-opt-up and cmd-opt-down
> Chris
>> On Apr 1, 2017, at 12:47 PM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Use FN-VO-shift-left to go to the beginning, FN-VO-shift-right to get to the 
>> end.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>> On Apr 1, 2017, at 09:53, Gabe Griffith  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> I have a late 2011 macbook pro running sierra. Can anyone tell me the 
>> command to jump to the top of an email box? I sometimes need to go in and 
>> look at either sent or deleted messages and find myself several hundred 
>> emails down in the list and can't figure out the command to immediately jump 
>> to the top of that list.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Gabe
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are 

Re: Monitoring Heart Rate in Real Time

[E.T.]

   Not much help as I do not have an Apple Watch.

From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
  "God for you is where you sweep away all the
  mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
  our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
  and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 4/2/2017 5:37 PM, Chris Moore wrote:

I use the workout app on my Apple Watch.
Chris

On Apr 2, 2017, at 4:18 PM, E.T.  wrote:

  Its been a while since I checked into this and since related apps have been 
updated, I want to ask about it. Is it possible to get this data in real time 
while working out? I have the Polar H7 HRM.

  I tried testing with the Polar Beat, Wahoo Fitness and Apple's Health apps. 
The first two I can only refresh by tapping the data.

From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
 "God for you is where you sweep away all the
 mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
 our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
 and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com

--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.




--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: Mail Threading is working again and I love my Earpods.

[Jessica Moss]

Ok, I thought you were talking about the IOS mail app, my mistake.  I can do 
fine with the mac mail client, but IOS is a pain in the neck to navigate, 
unless someone knows a trick to it I don’t yet.
> On Apr 2, 2017, at 6:24 AM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> Make sure you are not in the classic view.
> 
> Then if you have more than two messages in a conversation, right arrow and 
> the thread will be expanded.  Voice over will read automatically if you 
> highlight each message but you must not open it.
> 
> This will not work if you only have one message so you need to press enter on 
> that message to read it as at times `i have found that voice over will not 
> always read the entire message.
>> On 2 Apr 2017, at 00:25, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>> 
>> How exactly do you navigate mail threading?  I can manage to find the first 
>> 2 messages after I press the next message button, but forget it after that 
>> if there are more than 2 messages in a thread; it only shows the first 2 
>> messages, and that’s usually it.
>>> On Apr 1, 2017, at 5:37 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Mail Threading is working again and I love my Ear Pods.  I got them today.
>>> 
>>> Kawal.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - 
>>> you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>>> --- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  

Re: Some Questions Regarding Pages

[Chris Moore]

Randy,
You need to interact with the are for those keystrokes to work.  I’m very new 
to Pages, but I’ve noticed that reading line by line with the cursor will 
announce the page changes.
Chris
> On Apr 2, 2017, at 3:42 PM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Hello anne:
> I Shall try this today, but i noticed that Vo-fn-up or down didn’t move me 
> between  pages, why is this? and are there any  alternatives for that?
> Thanks in advance 
> 
>> On Apr 2, 2017, at 8:59 PM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello Ramy,
>> 
>> If you set a hotspot on the Paragraph styles button, then press VO-Cmd-Shift 
>> and the same number, as you navigate through the document, VO will say 
>> things like “Heading level 1” before reading the Heading, then “Body” before 
>> reading the text in Body style. I’ve just tested it and it works for me.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> Anne
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 1 Apr 2017, at 23:45, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Aha, thanks so much for your explnations.
>>> but, for you Anne:, if the style that am using, changed, will Voice
>>> over tell me?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 4/1/17, Anne Robertson  wrote:
 Hello Ramy,
 
 Align Natural appears to be the same as Align Left. Why Apple calls it
 Natural is beyond me.
 
 Cheers,
 
 Anne
 
 
> On 1 Apr 2017, at 12:36, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> sorry for sending another email:
> but I forgot to say that, I mean by natural that I don't know
> something called natural  inside styoles, I know, left , right
> centered, hiding, etc.
> so, what is natural is refers to?
> 
> 
> On 4/1/17, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>> Thanks so much TIm:
>> but sorry,
>> when moving between my styles with f1, f2, etc.
>> is there any way that the Voice over can say the Style name?
>> I forgot what style are connected what
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> 
>> On 3/31/17, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Answers below with your questions.
>>> 
>>> Later...
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
>>> On Mar 30, 2017, at 18:39, Ramy Moustafa 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello all:
>>> Am now studying the My Mac pages, and I recommend it to anyone that
>>> will
>>> use
>>> Pages on his or her work.
>>> But i have some questions that i hope to find an answer for them as
>>> soon
>>> as
>>> possible please.
>>> 
>>> Here are my questions:
>>> 1- I can’t understand this sentence at all:
>>> 
>>> Always use the VO keys in the Formatter to avoid changing the focus.
>>> The
>>> insertion point will be moved if you just use the arrow keys, but most
>>> of
>>> the time, the arrow keys alone simply won’t work."
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> TK:  What it's telling you to do is to make sure that you hold down the
>>> VO
>>> (ctrl+option) keys when modifying things within the Formatter area.  If
>>> you
>>> simply try to use the arrow keys, without the VO modifiers, then you'll
>>> change the cursor location and/or affect other elements of your
>>> document
>>> that you may not have planned on affecting.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 2- my observation is that, When i read the text format when am standing
>>> on
>>> Hidding, using the Vo+t, it told me, alined Natural,
>>> 
>>> what is it? is it left or right or what?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> TK:  It was telling you the format of the text the cursor was connected
>>> with.  Understand that with the Mac, if you're moving right through a
>>> document, it will be connected with the item it just passed over,
>>> therefore
>>> the textual item just to the left of the cursor.  If you're travelling
>>> from
>>> right to left, the same consideration is taken.  That is, since you
>>> were
>>> moving to the left, then the last item passed over is just to the right
>>> of
>>> the cursor, and therefore that is the item that will be focused on.
>>> 
>>> 3- How can i move page by page inside pages?
>>> 
>>> TK:  Normally, as long as you've interacted with the body of the
>>> document,
>>> you should be able to use the VO keys with Page up or down.  On a
>>> laptop,
>>> that would be VO-fn-down or VO-fn-up.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sorry if some of my Questions are not professional
>>> but i need a very quick help ignorer to complete my research.
>>> Thanks in advance
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
>>> or
>>> if
>>> you feel that a 

Re: Monitoring Heart Rate in Real Time

[Chris Moore]

I use the workout app on my Apple Watch.
Chris
> On Apr 2, 2017, at 4:18 PM, E.T.  wrote:
> 
>   Its been a while since I checked into this and since related apps have been 
> updated, I want to ask about it. Is it possible to get this data in real time 
> while working out? I have the Polar H7 HRM.
> 
>   I tried testing with the Polar Beat, Wahoo Fitness and Apple's Health apps. 
> The first two I can only refresh by tapping the data.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
>  "God for you is where you sweep away all the
>  mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
>  our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
>  and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
> E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Watch OS or voiceover bug

[Nickus de Vos]

Hi 
I've had my Apple Watch less than a week now so not very experienced. 
When I first got it, I updated the OS to 3.2, so I don't know if this behavior 
was also in the previous version. I use a watch face with complication for 
battery life. 

Thing is, The complication on the watch face, and the battery status in the 
control centre, is often spoken as two different values by voiceover. The one 
will for example report The battery life to be at 79%, while the other report 
it as 85%. 
Anyone know whether this is a Voice over bug or a WatchOS 3.2 bug?

Nickus

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Digital signiture, how?

[Nickus de Vos]

Hi all
As a blind person, how do you deal with signatures?
In general how do you make your signature at the bank and so forth, and how 
about digitally have you find any good accessible software to use, for 
inserting your digital signature on PDF and Word documents etc?

Sent from my iPhone

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Monitoring Heart Rate in Real Time

[E.T.]

   Its been a while since I checked into this and since related apps 
have been updated, I want to ask about it. Is it possible to get this 
data in real time while working out? I have the Polar H7 HRM.


   I tried testing with the Polar Beat, Wahoo Fitness and Apple's 
Health apps. The first two I can only refresh by tapping the data.


From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
  "God for you is where you sweep away all the
  mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
  our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
  and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com

--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

RE: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

[M. Taylor]

I completely agree with you, Scott.  This would be my suggestion, as well.

Mark


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2017 9:24 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

My suggestion is to use Open VPN on a server. While you have the ongoing server 
cost as little as $5 per month, you do have a lot more flexibility.  You can 
attach your phone, tablets, or Mac with totally free clients (windows as well) 
that are totally accessible.  Y ou also have the advantage of not necessarily 
being in a VPN database so you’re not blocked from Netflix for example.



> On Apr 1, 2017, at 11:30 PM, Cameron Strife  wrote:
> 
> Hi everybody. I'm looking for a vpn that is reliable and works with 
> voiceover on OSX, iOS, and any screen reader on windows, although that 
> last point is no big deal either way. Free or a one time license fee 
> would be preferred.
> 
> I've found that express vpn works very well with voiceover but I don't 
> want to pay fourteen dollars a month forever to use it.
> 
> I bought a lifetime subscription to shymo vpn and while the specs are 
> good, it's not working on the older mac that I use for various 
> internet activities.
> 
> Anyways, I tried hide me vpn for mac that didn't even want to launch 
> for some reason, and, I recently tried cyberghost on mac and windows 
> and had no joy on either operating system...
> 
> I see that tiger vpn for mac, iOS, and windows is on sale for $29 for 
> the next two days. I don't see anything about accessibility on any 
> platform anywhere though and don't want to waste more money on a vpn I 
> won't be able to use.
> 
> This price only lasts for the next two days though so I need to make 
> up my mind pretty quickly.
> 
> Has anybody used Tiger vpn and if so, what are your thoughts? Also, 
> any other recommendations would be greatly appreciated!
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Cameron.
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach 
> mark at:  macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is 
> Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 

Re: Some Questions Regarding Pages

[Ramy Moustafa]

Hello anne:
I Shall try this today, but i noticed that Vo-fn-up or down didn’t move me 
between  pages, why is this? and are there any  alternatives for that?
Thanks in advance 

> On Apr 2, 2017, at 8:59 PM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> Hello Ramy,
> 
> If you set a hotspot on the Paragraph styles button, then press VO-Cmd-Shift 
> and the same number, as you navigate through the document, VO will say things 
> like “Heading level 1” before reading the Heading, then “Body” before reading 
> the text in Body style. I’ve just tested it and it works for me.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
> 
>> On 1 Apr 2017, at 23:45, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>> 
>> Aha, thanks so much for your explnations.
>> but, for you Anne:, if the style that am using, changed, will Voice
>> over tell me?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 4/1/17, Anne Robertson  wrote:
>>> Hello Ramy,
>>> 
>>> Align Natural appears to be the same as Align Left. Why Apple calls it
>>> Natural is beyond me.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Anne
>>> 
>>> 
 On 1 Apr 2017, at 12:36, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
 
 sorry for sending another email:
 but I forgot to say that, I mean by natural that I don't know
 something called natural  inside styoles, I know, left , right
 centered, hiding, etc.
 so, what is natural is refers to?
 
 
 On 4/1/17, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> Thanks so much TIm:
> but sorry,
> when moving between my styles with f1, f2, etc.
> is there any way that the Voice over can say the Style name?
> I forgot what style are connected what
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> On 3/31/17, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Answers below with your questions.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>> On Mar 30, 2017, at 18:39, Ramy Moustafa 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello all:
>> Am now studying the My Mac pages, and I recommend it to anyone that
>> will
>> use
>> Pages on his or her work.
>> But i have some questions that i hope to find an answer for them as
>> soon
>> as
>> possible please.
>> 
>> Here are my questions:
>> 1- I can’t understand this sentence at all:
>> 
>> Always use the VO keys in the Formatter to avoid changing the focus.
>> The
>> insertion point will be moved if you just use the arrow keys, but most
>> of
>> the time, the arrow keys alone simply won’t work."
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> TK:  What it's telling you to do is to make sure that you hold down the
>> VO
>> (ctrl+option) keys when modifying things within the Formatter area.  If
>> you
>> simply try to use the arrow keys, without the VO modifiers, then you'll
>> change the cursor location and/or affect other elements of your
>> document
>> that you may not have planned on affecting.
>> 
>> 
>> 2- my observation is that, When i read the text format when am standing
>> on
>> Hidding, using the Vo+t, it told me, alined Natural,
>> 
>> what is it? is it left or right or what?
>> 
>> 
>> TK:  It was telling you the format of the text the cursor was connected
>> with.  Understand that with the Mac, if you're moving right through a
>> document, it will be connected with the item it just passed over,
>> therefore
>> the textual item just to the left of the cursor.  If you're travelling
>> from
>> right to left, the same consideration is taken.  That is, since you
>> were
>> moving to the left, then the last item passed over is just to the right
>> of
>> the cursor, and therefore that is the item that will be focused on.
>> 
>> 3- How can i move page by page inside pages?
>> 
>> TK:  Normally, as long as you've interacted with the body of the
>> document,
>> you should be able to use the VO keys with Page up or down.  On a
>> laptop,
>> that would be VO-fn-down or VO-fn-up.
>> 
>> 
>> Sorry if some of my Questions are not professional
>> but i need a very quick help ignorer to complete my research.
>> Thanks in advance
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
>> or
>> if
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
>> owners
>> or
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark
>> at:
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn
>> -
>> you
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can 

Re: Some Questions Regarding Pages

[Anne Robertson]

Hello Ramy,

If you set a hotspot on the Paragraph styles button, then press VO-Cmd-Shift 
and the same number, as you navigate through the document, VO will say things 
like “Heading level 1” before reading the Heading, then “Body” before reading 
the text in Body style. I’ve just tested it and it works for me.

Cheers,

Anne



> On 1 Apr 2017, at 23:45, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Aha, thanks so much for your explnations.
> but, for you Anne:, if the style that am using, changed, will Voice
> over tell me?
> 
> 
> 
> On 4/1/17, Anne Robertson  wrote:
>> Hello Ramy,
>> 
>> Align Natural appears to be the same as Align Left. Why Apple calls it
>> Natural is beyond me.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> Anne
>> 
>> 
>>> On 1 Apr 2017, at 12:36, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>>> 
>>> sorry for sending another email:
>>> but I forgot to say that, I mean by natural that I don't know
>>> something called natural  inside styoles, I know, left , right
>>> centered, hiding, etc.
>>> so, what is natural is refers to?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 4/1/17, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
 Thanks so much TIm:
 but sorry,
 when moving between my styles with f1, f2, etc.
 is there any way that the Voice over can say the Style name?
 I forgot what style are connected what
 
 Thanks
 
 
 On 3/31/17, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Answers below with your questions.
> 
> Later...
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
> On Mar 30, 2017, at 18:39, Ramy Moustafa 
> wrote:
> 
> Hello all:
> Am now studying the My Mac pages, and I recommend it to anyone that
> will
> use
> Pages on his or her work.
> But i have some questions that i hope to find an answer for them as
> soon
> as
> possible please.
> 
> Here are my questions:
> 1- I can’t understand this sentence at all:
> 
> Always use the VO keys in the Formatter to avoid changing the focus.
> The
> insertion point will be moved if you just use the arrow keys, but most
> of
> the time, the arrow keys alone simply won’t work."
> 
> 
> 
> TK:  What it's telling you to do is to make sure that you hold down the
> VO
> (ctrl+option) keys when modifying things within the Formatter area.  If
> you
> simply try to use the arrow keys, without the VO modifiers, then you'll
> change the cursor location and/or affect other elements of your
> document
> that you may not have planned on affecting.
> 
> 
> 2- my observation is that, When i read the text format when am standing
> on
> Hidding, using the Vo+t, it told me, alined Natural,
> 
> what is it? is it left or right or what?
> 
> 
> TK:  It was telling you the format of the text the cursor was connected
> with.  Understand that with the Mac, if you're moving right through a
> document, it will be connected with the item it just passed over,
> therefore
> the textual item just to the left of the cursor.  If you're travelling
> from
> right to left, the same consideration is taken.  That is, since you
> were
> moving to the left, then the last item passed over is just to the right
> of
> the cursor, and therefore that is the item that will be focused on.
> 
> 3- How can i move page by page inside pages?
> 
> TK:  Normally, as long as you've interacted with the body of the
> document,
> you should be able to use the VO keys with Page up or down.  On a
> laptop,
> that would be VO-fn-down or VO-fn-up.
> 
> 
> Sorry if some of my Questions are not professional
> but i need a very quick help ignorer to complete my research.
> Thanks in advance
> 
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac
> Visionaries list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
> or
> if
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
> owners
> or
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark
> at:
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn
> -
> you
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> 
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an
> email to 

Re: Very useful utility.

[Kliphton Miller]

Also, I don’t see how the caps lock key as a modifier has anything to do with 
this subject.  The caps lock key can’t launch pages or numbers for me with a 
single keystroke.  It can’t open safari for me, and it sure can’t tell me the 
time.  I am one that is against the caps lock key as a modifier for 2 reasons, 
1.  Quick nav pretty much takes care of having to use it or the vo keys.  2. It 
reminds me to much of the screen reader most of us left behind, why would I 
want to be reminded of that layout?  JMO

> On Apr 2, 2017, at 12:59 PM, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> Sorry, let me reply with some more here.
> 
> Keyboard Commander can also be toggled on and off anywhere with a keystroke. 
> Either control-option-shift-k or caps lock-shift-k. Finally, by default, some 
> commanders are provided, such as one to speak the time and date, one to 
> announce how many unread messages within a mailbox in Mail, to name but two.
> 
> 
>> On 2 Apr 2017, at 17:56, christopher hallsworth  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Gary.
>> 
>> Just an FYI, this has been around ever since I first used the mac back in 
>> 2012. Nothing new here, but definitely overlooked since it's buried within 
>> the VoiceOver Utility. Also, it is probably used less now caps lock can be 
>> used as the VoiceOver modifier since OS X 10.11 Yosemite. Thank you for 
>> sharing though.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 2 Apr 2017, at 17:08, Gary Price  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Afternoon everyone!
>>> 
>>> If some people know about this utility already then I do apologise.
>>> 
>>> Thanks to the Applevis podcasts, I've discovered an excellent utility on 
>>> the Mac called Keyboard commander.
>>> This lets you assign any key to a command for performing certain actions.
>>> It also lets you change things to your liking.
>>> 
>>> What I mean is for example instead of that really complex keystroke 
>>> Control, Option, Shift and F11 to toggle the screen curtain on or off, I've 
>>> added the keyboard key C. So now I just have to press right option key and 
>>> C.
>>> 
>>> Today I've added a few others as well.
>>> 
>>> To access the keyboard commander, open the VoiceOver utility by pressing 
>>> either Control Option F8 or depending on people's configuration you might 
>>> need to hold down the FN key as well.
>>> Once in the VoiceOver utility, interact with the utility categories table 
>>> by either Control Option Shift Down arrow, or if using the quick nav option 
>>> down and right arrow I think.
>>> Select Commanders and then stop interacting with CTRL Option Shift up arrow 
>>> or if using quick nav down and left arrow.
>>> 
>>> Your then presented with a list of tabs, the one you need is keyboard.
>>> Move to it with VO and the arrow keys.
>>> 
>>> Once selected, you should see a keyboard commander table where the commands 
>>> currently supported are listed.
>>> To add a command, press the add button.
>>> 
>>> After you do this, you will be in the keyboard key edit field.
>>> I'm telling you this because if you down arrow or move away from this field 
>>> you won't be able to add it.
>>> So put the key you want into this edit field.
>>> Then VO right arrow once, you should hear Command menu button.
>>> Activate this button, and look through the different options.
>>> 
>>> Once you've found the command you want to add, press Enter and bingo!
>>> 
>>> I should add that all the commands are listed as menus.
>>> 
>>> I hope this Email is useful to some people!
>>> 
>>> If anyone wants any more information or help, feel free to Email off list.
>>> Gary Price
>>> Sent from my 13 inch Macbook pro.
>>> 
>>> This address is for personal contact:
>>> garypric...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> Twitter:
>>> http://www.twitter.com/gazwprice
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - 
>>> you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>>> --- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>> 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for 

Re: Apple Two-Factor Authentication Finally Enabled on all of my Devices and Accounts

[Karen Lewellen]

on a side note, something to consider.
There is a well established scam where you get an email branded from 
apple, claiming that your apple id has been compromised.

I get them regularly, and I do not even have an apple device.
The scam is one of many those who  successfully hacked large players use to 
further the  work of stealing your devices.
be very very careful that once you make this change you can easily and 
effortlessly verify to your devices that it is really  you.
Simply fortifying the importance of Andrew's question.  if there is a time 
limit, you may sart to look like  a hacker.

Kare


On Sun, 2 Apr 2017, Anders Holmberg wrote:


Hi!
If its valid up to ten minutes then i have to try to get it going on apple 
music on android again.
I don’t know why but i got a verification code and entered it directly after my 
password but it did not work.
I wonder if its because i have to digits at the end of it.
BUt this shouldn’t be any problem.
/A

1 apr. 2017 kl. 23:06 skrev M. Taylor :

Hello Andrew,

You ask a very interesting question.

Even though the field to which you are prompted to enter the 6-digit code has 
disappeared after switching to the messaging app, try re-initiating the 
process, in the original app, as the code should still be valid for at least a 
few minutes.  I thought I read somewhere that the code is valid for up to 10 
minutes.

Mark

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Andrew Lamanche
Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2017 1:28 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple Two-Factor Authentication Finally Enabled on all of my 
Devices and Accounts

Dear Mark,

Thank you for posting this.  I have two factor verification turned on, and i  
usually use a trusted device (my ipad) to receive a 6 digit code.  But say, no 
trusted device is available.  If the code arrives via text message on the 
iphone from which I'm trying to log in, how can I reliably read repeatedly the 
code that's been sent to me?  I've tried this, and I couldn't.  When I went to 
messaging application to read and memorise the code, and then returned to the 
application which required my entering the code, the field to which I'd have to 
type the code was gone.  Any tips or suggestions? Or does this mean that I 
always have to have another device at the ready while logging in?

On 1 Apr 2017, at 08:10, M. Taylor  wrote:

Hello All,

Well, I cannot say that it was easy, given that I have multiple Apple
accounts on a wide variety of devices including Windows 10, Windows 7,
Windows 8, Mac, iOS, etc and also that I access my various email
accounts from legacy Windows based clients but, after updating all
components, including the latest versions of the iCloud Control Panel
for Windows, and, after resurrecting a couple of old iPhones and Macs
from the grave to serve as on the fly trusted devices, all of my
products are now protected via Two-Factor authentication.

I dare say that most will not find the upgrade to two-factor as
arduous as I so, I do recommend upgrading if you have both the time
and patience to learn the entire process.

To those of you who only have one device? I say go for it as you will
be prompted for a telephone number that can always provide the on the
fly code you will need to login to new Apple devices or any web
browsers.  The best thing is that once you select to trust the device
or web browser, you will not be prompted for the security code again,
unless you choose to be prompted.

I have spent the past two days really putting two-factor
authentication on all of my devices and products to the test and I
must say that it performs as beautifully as Apple claims, including
when it is necessary to generate an application-specific password for
non-apple legacy clients such as older versions of Outlook or Thunderbird.

Keep in mind that this is something that you do not want to rush through.
Take your time and read all of the information that is displayed
during the upgrade process as it will help you a great deal.

One more thing, I strongly suggest that before you decide to upgrade
to two-factor, that you login to http://appleid.apple.com and
familiarize yourself with the site because after upgrading to
two-factor for longer than
30 days, the only way you will be able to turn it off is by logging
into that site with a verification code from either a trusted
device/phone number.

Good Luck to you all and I'll see you on the other side of the
security wall (smile).

Mark

--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach
mark at:  

can't find icloud backup

[jean parker]

E T:

Thanks so much. Sure enough, it is right there. I went right past it.

Thanks again,

Jean

Dr. Jean Parker, Ph.D.
Senior Research Fellow
Trans4m Center For Integral Development
Geneva, Switzerland

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: Very useful utility.

[christopher hallsworth]

Sorry, let me reply with some more here.

Keyboard Commander can also be toggled on and off anywhere with a keystroke. 
Either control-option-shift-k or caps lock-shift-k. Finally, by default, some 
commanders are provided, such as one to speak the time and date, one to 
announce how many unread messages within a mailbox in Mail, to name but two.


> On 2 Apr 2017, at 17:56, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Gary.
> 
> Just an FYI, this has been around ever since I first used the mac back in 
> 2012. Nothing new here, but definitely overlooked since it's buried within 
> the VoiceOver Utility. Also, it is probably used less now caps lock can be 
> used as the VoiceOver modifier since OS X 10.11 Yosemite. Thank you for 
> sharing though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On 2 Apr 2017, at 17:08, Gary Price  wrote:
>> 
>> Afternoon everyone!
>> 
>> If some people know about this utility already then I do apologise.
>> 
>> Thanks to the Applevis podcasts, I've discovered an excellent utility on the 
>> Mac called Keyboard commander.
>> This lets you assign any key to a command for performing certain actions.
>> It also lets you change things to your liking.
>> 
>> What I mean is for example instead of that really complex keystroke Control, 
>> Option, Shift and F11 to toggle the screen curtain on or off, I've added the 
>> keyboard key C. So now I just have to press right option key and C.
>> 
>> Today I've added a few others as well.
>> 
>> To access the keyboard commander, open the VoiceOver utility by pressing 
>> either Control Option F8 or depending on people's configuration you might 
>> need to hold down the FN key as well.
>> Once in the VoiceOver utility, interact with the utility categories table by 
>> either Control Option Shift Down arrow, or if using the quick nav option 
>> down and right arrow I think.
>> Select Commanders and then stop interacting with CTRL Option Shift up arrow 
>> or if using quick nav down and left arrow.
>> 
>> Your then presented with a list of tabs, the one you need is keyboard.
>> Move to it with VO and the arrow keys.
>> 
>> Once selected, you should see a keyboard commander table where the commands 
>> currently supported are listed.
>> To add a command, press the add button.
>> 
>> After you do this, you will be in the keyboard key edit field.
>> I'm telling you this because if you down arrow or move away from this field 
>> you won't be able to add it.
>> So put the key you want into this edit field.
>> Then VO right arrow once, you should hear Command menu button.
>> Activate this button, and look through the different options.
>> 
>> Once you've found the command you want to add, press Enter and bingo!
>> 
>> I should add that all the commands are listed as menus.
>> 
>> I hope this Email is useful to some people!
>> 
>> If anyone wants any more information or help, feel free to Email off list.
>> Gary Price
>> Sent from my 13 inch Macbook pro.
>> 
>> This address is for personal contact:
>> garypric...@icloud.com
>> 
>> Twitter:
>> http://www.twitter.com/gazwprice
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from 

Re: Very useful utility.

[christopher hallsworth]

Hi Gary.

Just an FYI, this has been around ever since I first used the mac back in 2012. 
Nothing new here, but definitely overlooked since it's buried within the 
VoiceOver Utility. Also, it is probably used less now caps lock can be used as 
the VoiceOver modifier since OS X 10.11 Yosemite. Thank you for sharing though.




> On 2 Apr 2017, at 17:08, Gary Price  wrote:
> 
> Afternoon everyone!
> 
> If some people know about this utility already then I do apologise.
> 
> Thanks to the Applevis podcasts, I've discovered an excellent utility on the 
> Mac called Keyboard commander.
> This lets you assign any key to a command for performing certain actions.
> It also lets you change things to your liking.
> 
> What I mean is for example instead of that really complex keystroke Control, 
> Option, Shift and F11 to toggle the screen curtain on or off, I've added the 
> keyboard key C. So now I just have to press right option key and C.
> 
> Today I've added a few others as well.
> 
> To access the keyboard commander, open the VoiceOver utility by pressing 
> either Control Option F8 or depending on people's configuration you might 
> need to hold down the FN key as well.
> Once in the VoiceOver utility, interact with the utility categories table by 
> either Control Option Shift Down arrow, or if using the quick nav option down 
> and right arrow I think.
> Select Commanders and then stop interacting with CTRL Option Shift up arrow 
> or if using quick nav down and left arrow.
> 
> Your then presented with a list of tabs, the one you need is keyboard.
> Move to it with VO and the arrow keys.
> 
> Once selected, you should see a keyboard commander table where the commands 
> currently supported are listed.
> To add a command, press the add button.
> 
> After you do this, you will be in the keyboard key edit field.
> I'm telling you this because if you down arrow or move away from this field 
> you won't be able to add it.
> So put the key you want into this edit field.
> Then VO right arrow once, you should hear Command menu button.
> Activate this button, and look through the different options.
> 
> Once you've found the command you want to add, press Enter and bingo!
> 
> I should add that all the commands are listed as menus.
> 
> I hope this Email is useful to some people!
> 
> If anyone wants any more information or help, feel free to Email off list.
> Gary Price
> Sent from my 13 inch Macbook pro.
> 
> This address is for personal contact:
> garypric...@icloud.com
> 
> Twitter:
> http://www.twitter.com/gazwprice
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

[Anders Holmberg]

Hi!
Does a server means that you can have a raspberry pi to act as a vpn server to?
This could be something to dig into.
/A
> 2 apr. 2017 kl. 18:23 skrev Scott Granados :
> 
> My suggestion is to use Open VPN on a server. While you have the ongoing 
> server cost as little as $5 per month, you do have a lot more flexibility.  
> You can attach your phone, tablets, or Mac with totally free clients (windows 
> as well) that are totally accessible.  Y ou also have the advantage of not 
> necessarily being in a VPN database so you’re not blocked from Netflix for 
> example.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 1, 2017, at 11:30 PM, Cameron Strife  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi everybody. I'm looking for a vpn that is reliable and works with
>> voiceover on OSX, iOS, and any screen reader on windows, although that
>> last point is no big deal either way. Free or a one time license fee
>> would be preferred.
>> 
>> I've found that express vpn works very well with voiceover but I don't
>> want to pay fourteen dollars a month forever to use it.
>> 
>> I bought a lifetime subscription to shymo vpn and while the specs are
>> good, it's not working on the older mac that I use for various
>> internet activities.
>> 
>> Anyways, I tried hide me vpn for mac that didn't even want to launch
>> for some reason, and, I recently tried cyberghost on mac and windows
>> and had no joy on either operating system...
>> 
>> I see that tiger vpn for mac, iOS, and windows is on sale for $29 for
>> the next two days. I don't see anything about accessibility on any
>> platform anywhere though and don't want to waste more money on a vpn I
>> won't be able to use.
>> 
>> This price only lasts for the next two days though so I need to make
>> up my mind pretty quickly.
>> 
>> Has anybody used Tiger vpn and if so, what are your thoughts? Also,
>> any other recommendations would be greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Cameron.
>> 
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> ---
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 

Re: Apple Two-Factor Authentication Finally Enabled on all of my Devices and Accounts

[Anders Holmberg]

Hi!
If its valid up to ten minutes then i have to try to get it going on apple 
music on android again.
I don’t know why but i got a verification code and entered it directly after my 
password but it did not work.
I wonder if its because i have to digits at the end of it.
BUt this shouldn’t be any problem.
/A
> 1 apr. 2017 kl. 23:06 skrev M. Taylor :
> 
> Hello Andrew,
> 
> You ask a very interesting question.
> 
> Even though the field to which you are prompted to enter the 6-digit code has 
> disappeared after switching to the messaging app, try re-initiating the 
> process, in the original app, as the code should still be valid for at least 
> a few minutes.  I thought I read somewhere that the code is valid for up to 
> 10 minutes.
> 
> Mark
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Lamanche
> Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2017 1:28 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Apple Two-Factor Authentication Finally Enabled on all of my 
> Devices and Accounts
> 
> Dear Mark,
> 
> Thank you for posting this.  I have two factor verification turned on, and i  
> usually use a trusted device (my ipad) to receive a 6 digit code.  But say, 
> no trusted device is available.  If the code arrives via text message on the 
> iphone from which I'm trying to log in, how can I reliably read repeatedly 
> the code that's been sent to me?  I've tried this, and I couldn't.  When I 
> went to messaging application to read and memorise the code, and then 
> returned to the application which required my entering the code, the field to 
> which I'd have to type the code was gone.  Any tips or suggestions? Or does 
> this mean that I always have to have another device at the ready while 
> logging in?
>> On 1 Apr 2017, at 08:10, M. Taylor  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello All,
>> 
>> Well, I cannot say that it was easy, given that I have multiple Apple 
>> accounts on a wide variety of devices including Windows 10, Windows 7, 
>> Windows 8, Mac, iOS, etc and also that I access my various email 
>> accounts from legacy Windows based clients but, after updating all 
>> components, including the latest versions of the iCloud Control Panel 
>> for Windows, and, after resurrecting a couple of old iPhones and Macs 
>> from the grave to serve as on the fly trusted devices, all of my 
>> products are now protected via Two-Factor authentication.
>> 
>> I dare say that most will not find the upgrade to two-factor as 
>> arduous as I so, I do recommend upgrading if you have both the time 
>> and patience to learn the entire process.
>> 
>> To those of you who only have one device? I say go for it as you will 
>> be prompted for a telephone number that can always provide the on the 
>> fly code you will need to login to new Apple devices or any web 
>> browsers.  The best thing is that once you select to trust the device 
>> or web browser, you will not be prompted for the security code again, 
>> unless you choose to be prompted.
>> 
>> I have spent the past two days really putting two-factor 
>> authentication on all of my devices and products to the test and I 
>> must say that it performs as beautifully as Apple claims, including 
>> when it is necessary to generate an application-specific password for 
>> non-apple legacy clients such as older versions of Outlook or Thunderbird.
>> 
>> Keep in mind that this is something that you do not want to rush through.
>> Take your time and read all of the information that is displayed 
>> during the upgrade process as it will help you a great deal.
>> 
>> One more thing, I strongly suggest that before you decide to upgrade 
>> to two-factor, that you login to http://appleid.apple.com and 
>> familiarize yourself with the site because after upgrading to 
>> two-factor for longer than
>> 30 days, the only way you will be able to turn it off is by logging 
>> into that site with a verification code from either a trusted 
>> device/phone number.
>> 
>> Good Luck to you all and I'll see you on the other side of the 
>> security wall (smile).
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach 
>> mark at:  macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is 
>> Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> ---
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from 

Re: Accessible bitcoin wallet?

[Scott Granados]

So I’ve found a place to get 9 gigahash USB mounted processors for $69 each.  
I’m thinking about getting 10 of them and powering them with a USB hub and then 
use the pi as a controller and install 2 USB powered fans for the cooling.  
Hashes per watt is pretty good with these adapters.  The pie itself can chug 
away on hashes but not fast enough to be worth while.


> On Apr 1, 2017, at 11:49 PM, Eric Oyen  wrote:
> 
> I will have to look into the bit coin wallet app for iOS. However, generating 
> the bit coins still requires an external processor and a lot of time.
> 
> -eric
> 
> On Apr 1, 2017, at 12:10 PM, Scott Granados wrote:
> 
>> The unlock keypad seemed to work for me, I’ll try again but I was having 
>> moderate success with the same app and was going to bring it up.
>> 
>> I’m trying to figure out mining right now but didn’t realize I needed extra 
>> hardware.
>> 
>>> On Mar 31, 2017, at 3:15 PM, Douglas Lawlor  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I should add this is for iOs.
>>> 
>>> Doug
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
 On Mar 31, 2017, at 9:12 AM, Scott Granados  
 wrote:
 
 Eric, it seems there is some discussion of this that appears in google.  
 Wallety appears to be an open source attempt at this although I haven’t 
 tried the code yet.  Others appear to be open source and available in 
 various repositories.
 Over all though, the blockchain algorithm itself shouldn’t have anything 
 about it that’s inaccessible, it’s just math.  I wonder if there are any 
 skilled blind coders (your self maybe) or someone else that would take 
 this on as a project.  I myself am not a coder at least not on this level, 
 I script for various things but that’s about it.  Seems like a problem 
 that should be able to be solved.
 
> On Mar 30, 2017, at 6:07 PM, Eric Oyen  wrote:
> 
> you aren't the only one that's been looking. in the last 3 years, I have 
> found no such animal for any platform. You would think that this wouldn't 
> be the case in Linux (or the mac), but there it is.
> 
> I have even tried contacting the developers of the various wallet type 
> packages. Most of the time, I have not gotten a response and the one time 
> I did get a response, it was along the lines of "go pound sand!".
> 
> Now, if I were a coder, I could take apart their programs, re-engineer it 
> with accessibility in mind and then market it. That would have the net 
> effect of putting other developers on notice and also making Bitcoin (and 
> other cryptographic currencies) available to us. The second thing it 
> would do is get me published. :) The third thing (depending on whether 
> its closed source or not) might end up with me defending my actions in a 
> lawsuit.
> 
> The biggest issue I have with developers is that they make it so damned 
> hard to contact them. In some cases, there is just no means available 
> other than through a bug reporting system. Frustrating is the mildest 
> perm I can come up with.
> 
> anyway, perhaps we (as a community) just need to hit these guys with a 
> mass campaign. If positive action won't work, then negative publicity 
> will force the issue.
> 
> -eric
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2017, at 2:08 PM, Scott Granados wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, does anyone know of an accessible bitcoin wallet for the Mac or any 
>> platform for that matter, ideally on the Mac.  I’m having trouble 
>> finding one although some googling yields results that makes me think 
>> there may be no solution.  Anyone have any more luck with this?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> Scott
>> 
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark 
>> at:  macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara 
>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> ---
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>> an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit 

Re: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

[Scott Granados]

My suggestion is to use Open VPN on a server. While you have the ongoing server 
cost as little as $5 per month, you do have a lot more flexibility.  You can 
attach your phone, tablets, or Mac with totally free clients (windows as well) 
that are totally accessible.  Y ou also have the advantage of not necessarily 
being in a VPN database so you’re not blocked from Netflix for example.



> On Apr 1, 2017, at 11:30 PM, Cameron Strife  wrote:
> 
> Hi everybody. I'm looking for a vpn that is reliable and works with
> voiceover on OSX, iOS, and any screen reader on windows, although that
> last point is no big deal either way. Free or a one time license fee
> would be preferred.
> 
> I've found that express vpn works very well with voiceover but I don't
> want to pay fourteen dollars a month forever to use it.
> 
> I bought a lifetime subscription to shymo vpn and while the specs are
> good, it's not working on the older mac that I use for various
> internet activities.
> 
> Anyways, I tried hide me vpn for mac that didn't even want to launch
> for some reason, and, I recently tried cyberghost on mac and windows
> and had no joy on either operating system...
> 
> I see that tiger vpn for mac, iOS, and windows is on sale for $29 for
> the next two days. I don't see anything about accessibility on any
> platform anywhere though and don't want to waste more money on a vpn I
> won't be able to use.
> 
> This price only lasts for the next two days though so I need to make
> up my mind pretty quickly.
> 
> Has anybody used Tiger vpn and if so, what are your thoughts? Also,
> any other recommendations would be greatly appreciated!
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Cameron.
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP

Re: Very useful utility.

[Kliphton Miller]

Yes, I have been using this since 2011, and also write about it on my group blog
Peeltheapple.wordpress.com
It is nice though.
> On Apr 2, 2017, at 12:08 PM, Gary Price  wrote:
> 
> Afternoon everyone!
> 
> If some people know about this utility already then I do apologise.
> 
> Thanks to the Applevis podcasts, I've discovered an excellent utility on the 
> Mac called Keyboard commander.
> This lets you assign any key to a command for performing certain actions.
> It also lets you change things to your liking.
> 
> What I mean is for example instead of that really complex keystroke Control, 
> Option, Shift and F11 to toggle the screen curtain on or off, I've added the 
> keyboard key C. So now I just have to press right option key and C.
> 
> Today I've added a few others as well.
> 
> To access the keyboard commander, open the VoiceOver utility by pressing 
> either Control Option F8 or depending on people's configuration you might 
> need to hold down the FN key as well.
> Once in the VoiceOver utility, interact with the utility categories table by 
> either Control Option Shift Down arrow, or if using the quick nav option down 
> and right arrow I think.
> Select Commanders and then stop interacting with CTRL Option Shift up arrow 
> or if using quick nav down and left arrow.
> 
> Your then presented with a list of tabs, the one you need is keyboard.
> Move to it with VO and the arrow keys.
> 
> Once selected, you should see a keyboard commander table where the commands 
> currently supported are listed.
> To add a command, press the add button.
> 
> After you do this, you will be in the keyboard key edit field.
> I'm telling you this because if you down arrow or move away from this field 
> you won't be able to add it.
> So put the key you want into this edit field.
> Then VO right arrow once, you should hear Command menu button.
> Activate this button, and look through the different options.
> 
> Once you've found the command you want to add, press Enter and bingo!
> 
> I should add that all the commands are listed as menus.
> 
> I hope this Email is useful to some people!
> 
> If anyone wants any more information or help, feel free to Email off list.
> Gary Price
> Sent from my 13 inch Macbook pro.
> 
> This address is for personal contact:
> garypric...@icloud.com
> 
> Twitter:
> http://www.twitter.com/gazwprice
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Very useful utility.

[Gary Price]

Afternoon everyone!

If some people know about this utility already then I do apologise.

Thanks to the Applevis podcasts, I've discovered an excellent utility on the 
Mac called Keyboard commander.
This lets you assign any key to a command for performing certain actions.
It also lets you change things to your liking.

What I mean is for example instead of that really complex keystroke Control, 
Option, Shift and F11 to toggle the screen curtain on or off, I've added the 
keyboard key C. So now I just have to press right option key and C.

Today I've added a few others as well.

To access the keyboard commander, open the VoiceOver utility by pressing either 
Control Option F8 or depending on people's configuration you might need to hold 
down the FN key as well.
Once in the VoiceOver utility, interact with the utility categories table by 
either Control Option Shift Down arrow, or if using the quick nav option down 
and right arrow I think.
Select Commanders and then stop interacting with CTRL Option Shift up arrow or 
if using quick nav down and left arrow.

Your then presented with a list of tabs, the one you need is keyboard.
Move to it with VO and the arrow keys.

Once selected, you should see a keyboard commander table where the commands 
currently supported are listed.
To add a command, press the add button.

After you do this, you will be in the keyboard key edit field.
I'm telling you this because if you down arrow or move away from this field you 
won't be able to add it.
So put the key you want into this edit field.
Then VO right arrow once, you should hear Command menu button.
Activate this button, and look through the different options.

Once you've found the command you want to add, press Enter and bingo!

I should add that all the commands are listed as menus.

I hope this Email is useful to some people!

If anyone wants any more information or help, feel free to Email off list.
Gary Price
Sent from my 13 inch Macbook pro.

This address is for personal contact:
garypric...@icloud.com

Twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/gazwprice

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: Accessible FTP client?

[Nektarios Mallas]

Hello.
Cyberduck. 
Very accessible many features. 
It is donations based. 

Regards.
Nektarios.

> On 17 Mar 2017, at 00:06, Kliphton Miller  wrote:
> 
>> Anyone know of an accessible FTP client?  Prefribley free, but don’t mind 
>> paying a little 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

My clock on my MacMini is working again

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

My clock on my MacMini is now working again automatically.  I had to turn the 
display off.  That's fine as I have no screen connected.  I don't know why the 
Imac doesn't have to do that as the display is on it's default schedule because 
of the built in screen.

Kawal.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

[alia robinson]

I have, and it works flawlessly on mac and iphone. it’s about 44 dollars per 
year.
> On Apr 2, 2017, at 7:44 AM, Brian Hansen  wrote:
> 
> Has anyone tried Nord VPN? It's recommended by CNET. 

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

[Brian Hansen]

Has anyone tried Nord VPN? It's recommended by CNET. 

Blessings,

Brian


> On Apr 2, 2017, at 3:07 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Try express vpn 
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Cameron Strife
> Sent: Sunday, 2 April 2017 3:30 PM
> To: macvisionaries 
> Subject: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?
> 
> Hi everybody. I'm looking for a vpn that is reliable and works with voiceover 
> on OSX, iOS, and any screen reader on windows, although that last point is no 
> big deal either way. Free or a one time license fee would be preferred.
> 
> I've found that express vpn works very well with voiceover but I don't want 
> to pay fourteen dollars a month forever to use it.
> 
> I bought a lifetime subscription to shymo vpn and while the specs are good, 
> it's not working on the older mac that I use for various internet activities.
> 
> Anyways, I tried hide me vpn for mac that didn't even want to launch for some 
> reason, and, I recently tried cyberghost on mac and windows and had no joy on 
> either operating system...
> 
> I see that tiger vpn for mac, iOS, and windows is on sale for $29 for the 
> next two days. I don't see anything about accessibility on any platform 
> anywhere though and don't want to waste more money on a vpn I won't be able 
> to use.
> 
> This price only lasts for the next two days though so I need to make up my 
> mind pretty quickly.
> 
> Has anybody used Tiger vpn and if so, what are your thoughts? Also, any other 
> recommendations would be greatly appreciated!
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Cameron.
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: Mail Threading is working again and I love my Earpods.

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

Make sure you are not in the classic view.

Then if you have more than two messages in a conversation, right arrow and the 
thread will be expanded.  Voice over will read automatically if you highlight 
each message but you must not open it.

This will not work if you only have one message so you need to press enter on 
that message to read it as at times `i have found that voice over will not 
always read the entire message.
> On 2 Apr 2017, at 00:25, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> How exactly do you navigate mail threading?  I can manage to find the first 2 
> messages after I press the next message button, but forget it after that if 
> there are more than 2 messages in a thread; it only shows the first 2 
> messages, and that’s usually it.
>> On Apr 1, 2017, at 5:37 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>> 
>> Mail Threading is working again and I love my Ear Pods.  I got them today.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

RE: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

[Simon Fogarty]

 Try express vpn 



-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Cameron Strife
Sent: Sunday, 2 April 2017 3:30 PM
To: macvisionaries 
Subject: free or paid vpn that works with Voiceover on Mac and iOS?

Hi everybody. I'm looking for a vpn that is reliable and works with voiceover 
on OSX, iOS, and any screen reader on windows, although that last point is no 
big deal either way. Free or a one time license fee would be preferred.

I've found that express vpn works very well with voiceover but I don't want to 
pay fourteen dollars a month forever to use it.

I bought a lifetime subscription to shymo vpn and while the specs are good, 
it's not working on the older mac that I use for various internet activities.

Anyways, I tried hide me vpn for mac that didn't even want to launch for some 
reason, and, I recently tried cyberghost on mac and windows and had no joy on 
either operating system...

I see that tiger vpn for mac, iOS, and windows is on sale for $29 for the next 
two days. I don't see anything about accessibility on any platform anywhere 
though and don't want to waste more money on a vpn I won't be able to use.

This price only lasts for the next two days though so I need to make up my mind 
pretty quickly.

Has anybody used Tiger vpn and if so, what are your thoughts? Also, any other 
recommendations would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks,

Cameron.

--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"MacVisionaries" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.