RE: is there a way to copy videos and photos like windows from Iphone to Computer?

[Simon Fogarty]

If the videos are on your windows machine try using one drive and then you can 
get them through one drive on your phone also,
 On the mac you could try one drive also or iCloud drive 
I've never tried the iCloud drive option but might be worth a try.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Ramy Moustafa
Sent: Wednesday, 11 October 2017 7:51 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: is there a way to copy videos and photos like windows from Iphone to 
Computer?

Hi all:

i need to copy some videos from my computer to my Iphone, In windows, i don’t 
need iTunes at all, it opens the Iphone as USB drive, just for Photos, but i 
tried this in mac, but with no luck, any other ideas?
Thanks in advance 

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Re: is there a way to copy videos and photos like windows from Iphone to Computer?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Thanks in so much
will gona try that

On 10/11/17, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> If the videos are on your windows machine try using one drive and then you
> can get them through one drive on your phone also,
>  On the mac you could try one drive also or iCloud drive
> I've never tried the iCloud drive option but might be worth a try.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ramy Moustafa
> Sent: Wednesday, 11 October 2017 7:51 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: is there a way to copy videos and photos like windows from Iphone
> to Computer?
>
> Hi all:
>
> i need to copy some videos from my computer to my Iphone, In windows, i
> don’t need iTunes at all, it opens the Iphone as USB drive, just for Photos,
> but i tried this in mac, but with no luck, any other ideas?
> Thanks in advance
>
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-- 
Ramy MoustafaSaber
Music instructor @:
Faculty ofmusical education
Music arranger and Sound engineer @:
Harmony Recording Studio
https://www.facebook.com/HarmonyRecordingStudio.eg

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Re: Vo+cmd+shift+space, can i understand it?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Jonathan:
Thanks for your detailed explanation, however, I need this feature in
my Pro tools, but not in finder or something,
 But frankly, I can not understand again,
I press the short cut and it told me, mousse down, I press again, and
it told me mouse up.
so, why?

sorry again may be my language can not help me understand it


On 10/11/17, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
> This key sequence does not move the mouse it just does a press and then
> undress when done a second time. You can move the mouse about on the screen
> either by having the Mouse Follow the VoiceOver cursor or by using the
> VoiceOver command route mouse to VoiceOver cursor
> (control-option-command-F5).
>
> So using this technique you would use the vo-command-shift-space to press
> the mouse, you would then move the voiceOver cursor to where you want to
> drop the item. Then depending on routing of cursors you might need to move
> the mouse with the "route mouse to VoiceOver cursor" command mentioned
> above. Then you  would need to retype the VO-shift-command-space patter to
> release the mouse button. Obviously not a very efficient way to do drag and
> drop operations but it can be done.
>
> There is also the vo drag and drop commands that often don't work
>
> 1. Both source and target need to be visible in the screen at the same
> time.
> 2. The selection should not change between when you do the drag command and
> when you do the drop command.
> 3. Drag and drop commands that take advantage of holding the mouse over a
> target so that it springs open have no way to work with VoiceOver drag and
> drop.
>   Best wishes,
>
> Jonathan Cohn
>
>
>
>> On Oct 10, 2017, at 3:45 PM, Ramy Moustafa 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all:
>>
>> sorry for my many questions,
>> i know that this short cut perform mouse up  mouse down, how is that?
>> i Mean, if i need to move my mouse down down down, how will i do that? or
>> it has some lamentations?
>>
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-- 
Ramy MoustafaSaber
Music instructor @:
Faculty ofmusical education
Music arranger and Sound engineer @:
Harmony Recording Studio
https://www.facebook.com/HarmonyRecordingStudio.eg

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Re: is there a way to copy videos and photos like windows from Iphone to Computer?

[Donna Goodin]

I move photos and files between phone and computer and between Mac and PC all 
the time using iCloud drive.  Works like a charm.
Best,
Donna
> On Oct 11, 2017, at 6:12 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Thanks in so much
> will gona try that
> 
> On 10/11/17, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> If the videos are on your windows machine try using one drive and then you
>> can get them through one drive on your phone also,
>> On the mac you could try one drive also or iCloud drive
>> I've never tried the iCloud drive option but might be worth a try.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ramy Moustafa
>> Sent: Wednesday, 11 October 2017 7:51 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: is there a way to copy videos and photos like windows from Iphone
>> to Computer?
>> 
>> Hi all:
>> 
>> i need to copy some videos from my computer to my Iphone, In windows, i
>> don’t need iTunes at all, it opens the Iphone as USB drive, just for Photos,
>> but i tried this in mac, but with no luck, any other ideas?
>> Thanks in advance
>> 
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Ramy MoustafaSaber
> Music instructor @:
> Faculty ofmusical education
> Music arranger and Sound engineer @:
> Harmony Recording Studio
> https://www.facebook.com/HarmonyRecordingStudio.eg
> 
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Re: Resetting an iPhone 8 after VO bug

[Jenine Stanley]

Thanks. That would make sense and I’ll have to try it. My phone rebooted on its 
own once the battery went completely dead. VO came back and I changed the voice 
to Allison to avoid the Siri issues. Let’s hope this works. 

> On Oct 11, 2017, at 12:16 AM, Shawn Krasniuk  wrote:
> 
> Hi. I don't have an iPhone 8 but I've heard from people that do. Apparently, 
> the volume buttons reset the phone now. It's either hold both the volume 
> buttons down for 5 seconds or hold the volume down button for 5 seconds and 
> the volume up button for 5 seconds individually. Sorry I can't be of any 
> help, a group from Whatsapp was talking about this.
> 
> Shawn
> Sent From My White MacBook
> Facebook Username: Shawn Krasniuk
> Twitter Handle: shawnk_aka_bbs
> Skype username: bbstheblindrapper
> Facetime: bbssh...@icloud.com
> 
>> On Oct 10, 2017, at 11:44 AM, Jenine Stanley  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I’m running iOS 11.1 beta and my VO, which was running the British Siri 
>> voice, just stopped. I have VO sounds but no voice. I have Siri. 
>> 
>> I have tried the 3finger double tap and nothing speaks. 
>> How do you reboot the phone? 
>> 
>> I’ve tried holding the home button and power button together but that 
>> doesn’t seem to work. I learned quickly not to do this with the volume 
>> buttons and power button. that calls 911. Oops. 
>> 
>> Of course Apple recommended going back to 11.02. 
>> 
>> I’d like to continue with the beta though. in the past beta cycles,  
>> 
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Re: Two Step Gone Wild!

[christopher hallsworth]

Hi all regarding turning off two factor authetication, please be aware this is 
no longer an option for some or all users. Just saying and if you can turn it 
off then that's great but if you can't then so be it.

> On 11 Oct 2017, at 07:18, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> yeah turn off two factor authentication 
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Berwick
> Sent: Tuesday, 10 October 2017 11:37 PM
> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Two Step Gone Wild!
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I upgraded to High Sierra when it came out and I am running IOS 11 on all my 
> devices.  
> 
> Last night, my devices started going crazy with the following notification:
> 
> “Apple ID Sign Requested:  Your Apple Id is being used to sing into a device 
> near Oshawa On.”
> 
> This notification is appearing approximately every five minutes on all my 
> devices and it is annoying and making it difficult to actually do anything.  
> 
> Does anybody have any advice on how I can solve this?
> 
> Tia,
> Jeff
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Vo+cmd+shift+space, can i understand it?

[Jonathan Cohn]

Again! That keystroke does not move the mouse up or down. It moves the mouse 
button up or down or in better english pressed and released.

What are the actions you are attempting to do? Also, if this is something you 
are doing quite often I suggest looking to see if Keyboard Maestro or another 
keyboard macro utility could help.


Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 11, 2017, at 7:15 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Jonathan:
> Thanks for your detailed explanation, however, I need this feature in
> my Pro tools, but not in finder or something,
> But frankly, I can not understand again,
> I press the short cut and it told me, mousse down, I press again, and
> it told me mouse up.
> so, why?
> 
> sorry again may be my language can not help me understand it
> 
> 
> On 10/11/17, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
>> This key sequence does not move the mouse it just does a press and then
>> undress when done a second time. You can move the mouse about on the screen
>> either by having the Mouse Follow the VoiceOver cursor or by using the
>> VoiceOver command route mouse to VoiceOver cursor
>> (control-option-command-F5).
>> 
>> So using this technique you would use the vo-command-shift-space to press
>> the mouse, you would then move the voiceOver cursor to where you want to
>> drop the item. Then depending on routing of cursors you might need to move
>> the mouse with the "route mouse to VoiceOver cursor" command mentioned
>> above. Then you  would need to retype the VO-shift-command-space patter to
>> release the mouse button. Obviously not a very efficient way to do drag and
>> drop operations but it can be done.
>> 
>> There is also the vo drag and drop commands that often don't work
>> 
>> 1. Both source and target need to be visible in the screen at the same
>> time.
>> 2. The selection should not change between when you do the drag command and
>> when you do the drop command.
>> 3. Drag and drop commands that take advantage of holding the mouse over a
>> target so that it springs open have no way to work with VoiceOver drag and
>> drop.
>>  Best wishes,
>> 
>> Jonathan Cohn
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 10, 2017, at 3:45 PM, Ramy Moustafa 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all:
>>> 
>>> sorry for my many questions,
>>> i know that this short cut perform mouse up  mouse down, how is that?
>>> i Mean, if i need to move my mouse down down down, how will i do that? or
>>> it has some lamentations?
>>> 
>>> --
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>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Ramy MoustafaSaber
> Music instructor @:
> Faculty ofmusical education
> Music arranger and Sound engineer @:
> Harmony Recording Studio
> https://www.facebook.com/HarmonyRecordingStudio.eg
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any 

Re: Two Step Gone Wild!

[Jonathan Cohn]

No thanks! If I have two factor turned off and somebody steals my password they 
have my account. If I leave it on then as long as they can't get my text 
messages I am fairly safe though will get a stream of two factor requests.

I can't understand people that have their street  address or their mothers made 
name as their password let alone having no password at all. If you don't want 
to use a password set up the guest account and then when you log out all 
evidence of what you just did is wiped from the computer. For that matter don't 
use your Guide Dogs name as a password unless you never post your guide dogs 
name and most people don't hear you use it.

 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 11, 2017, at 2:18 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> yeah turn off two factor authentication 
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Berwick
> Sent: Tuesday, 10 October 2017 11:37 PM
> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Two Step Gone Wild!
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I upgraded to High Sierra when it came out and I am running IOS 11 on all my 
> devices.  
> 
> Last night, my devices started going crazy with the following notification:
> 
> “Apple ID Sign Requested:  Your Apple Id is being used to sing into a device 
> near Oshawa On.”
> 
> This notification is appearing approximately every five minutes on all my 
> devices and it is annoying and making it difficult to actually do anything.  
> 
> Does anybody have any advice on how I can solve this?
> 
> Tia,
> Jeff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
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> 
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Re: Problem with Mail on iPad under iOS 11

[Jonathan Cohn]

That definitely sounds like a bug.
It sounds like they changed the default reading order to a pane that was not 
visible. I wonder what is in the dialog that wants to be closed.


Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 9, 2017, at 10:55 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> Exploring by touch, there's the message list on the left, and the rest of the 
> screen says "dismiss popup. Double tap to dismiss popup." But swiping left or 
> right reads elements of the email message which should be closed, as though 
> that message were still being displayed. It's as though touching and swiping 
> are seeing two different things.
> 
> --
> Alex Hall
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Oct 9, 2017, at 01:45, Simon Fogarty > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Alex,
>>  
>> Down in the bottom right hand corner you don’t get a pop up message which 
>> you might get saying tap to remove Popup or something similar to that.
>>  
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>  
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> ] On Behalf Of Alex Hall
>> Sent: Monday, 9 October 2017 9:23 AM
>> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries > >
>> Subject: Problem with Mail on iPad under iOS 11
>>  
>> Hi all,
>> I'm having a very odd problem on a client's iPad under iOS 11. Despite my 
>> warning, the client updated the device, so now I get to explain the rotor 
>> craziness. But the problem I'm having is with displaying messages, not the 
>> stupid new rotor changes.
>>  
>> When I go from a message back to the inbox, VO often reports that it's still 
>> focused on the message content. I'm in full screen mode, so this should be 
>> impossible. I can touch the message list to get back to it, but flicking 
>> left or right, or doing anything else to navigate, acts like I'm in the 
>> message. My back button takes me to all mailboxes, so I'm definitely in the 
>> inbox. I'm confused, so my client is a great deal more so. What might be 
>> going on here? Is there anything I can do about this? Thanks for any ideas.
>> 
>> --
>> Alex Hall
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>>  
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
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>> 
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>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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>> 
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>>  and your owner is Cara 
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>> 
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>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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>> 
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>> 

Re: Vo+cmd+shift+space, can i understand it?

[Anne Robertson]

When you press this shortcut, visually a hand grips the mouse pointer. It is 
the equivalent of holding down the mouse button or pressing and holding on the 
trackpad.
To use this for drag&drop, you need to turn cursor tracking off (VO-Shift-F3) 
so that moving the VoiceOver cursor does not move anything else. Use VO keys 
and arrow keys to navigate to where you wish to drop the item under the mouse, 
then bring the mouse pointer (VO-Cmd-F5) and press your shortcut again to 
release the mouse.
If you are actually needing to move the mouse pointer to a place on the screen 
where VoiceOver cannot go, you need to install a utility called MoveMouse.
MoveMouse is a utility created by Dorothy Renton to help VoiceOver users to 
position the mouse on objects that VoiceOver doesn’t recognise. Each movement 
moves the mouse a tenth of an inch up, down, left or right. It saves us having 
to turn on Mouse Keys. Here’s the link to download MoveMouse:

About MoveMouse

MoveMouse was written to solve a very specific problem for the blind. Some 
developers neglect to label some of their buttons, so VoiceOver can’t identify 
them.  Now assume the blind person knows a sighted person with the same 
application.  The sighted person could tell the blind person, “start at this 
(good) button and go half an inch to the right and a quarter inch up to find 
the hidden button”.  That’s only useful if the blind person could move the 
cursor by a precise amount.  Enter MoveMouse.

MoveMouse is an executable program that calls four OSX Services (which are 
Automator Workflows). The Four Workflows move the mouse 0.1" left, right, up or 
down using keystroke combinations. For testing purposes each Service can also 
invoke a different sound to allow the user to verify that they're moving in the 
correct direction (available on request).

Installing MoveMouse Services

1. Unzip the Distribution zip file.

2. This will create a subdirectory, called “MoveMouseDistribution” with two 
items: MoveMouse and a folder called FourWorkflows.

3. Move MoveMouse to  your Applications Folder. (Make sure you put it in 
/Applications, not the user level Applications.)

4. Next we need to open your (hidden) user Library folder.  Open a new Finder 
window or tab.
Under the Go menu, navigate to "Computer" and press the Option key. The menu 
item will change to "Library." While holding down the Option key, press the 
Control key and press the Space Bar. The Finder window will now display the 
hidden Library folder. Open the Services folder within the user Library folder.

5. Now open the FourWorkflows folder.  Copy and paste all four of the workflows 
into the Services folder we just opened in the previous step.

6. You should now be able to use the four workflows. In all of your 
applications and the Finder, if you click on the name of the application in the 
menubar and pull down to Services, you should now see the four workflows 
MoveMouseUp, Down, Right, and Left.

7. You can test them right now.  As you invoke each of them you should hear 
four different sounds indicating that the workflow is moving the cursor 0.1" 
up, down, right, or left.

8. If MoveMouse works for you - skip to step 9. If not, read on. Because 
MoveMouse is an executable that you just downloaded from the Internet, 
depending on your security setting, Mac OS X may not let you just run it. To 
bypass this security feature (because you trust US, don’t you?), navigate to 
the Applications folder in your Finder window. Locate ‘MoveMouse’ in the list 
of applications. Right-click on the file name and select ‘Open’. A dialog box 
should appear, saying “‘MoveMouse’ is from an unidentified developer. Are you 
sure you want to open it?”.  Click ‘Open’ to allow Mac OS X to always run this 
application.

9. If you'd like to use keystrokes to invoke the four workflows, open System 
Preferences, Keyboard, Shortcuts. In the left pane, click on Services and 
scroll down in the right pane until you find the four services (MoveMouseUp, 
etc).

10. Check the box to the left of each one, and then tap on the right where it 
says "none", which will change to a button that says "add shortcut". At this 
point you can tap on the “add shortcut” button and then hold down the key 
combination you desire to assign to that workflow. We have been using 
command-option-control-shift and the corresponding arrow key, but you can 
choose any keystroke you desire.

11. Cleanup: You can now safely delete the Distribution zip file, and the 
folders created when you unzipped that file.

For feedback, please send all inquiries to alli...@podfeet.com

How MoveMouse Works

MoveMouse is hard-wired to move your mouse 0.1 inches each time you invoke one 
of the Services, so it needs to determine the pixels per inch of your screen. 
MoveMouse queries your computer’s Primary display for its physical dimensions 
and pixel resolution in x/y.  From that, it de

Re: Vo+cmd+shift+space, can i understand it?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Hi Jonathan:

I understand now, so , what are the difference between using this
feature and using the drag and drop which is VO+period?
sorry again.

On 10/11/17, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> When you press this shortcut, visually a hand grips the mouse pointer. It is
> the equivalent of holding down the mouse button or pressing and holding on
> the trackpad.
> To use this for drag&drop, you need to turn cursor tracking off
> (VO-Shift-F3) so that moving the VoiceOver cursor does not move anything
> else. Use VO keys and arrow keys to navigate to where you wish to drop the
> item under the mouse, then bring the mouse pointer (VO-Cmd-F5) and press
> your shortcut again to release the mouse.
> If you are actually needing to move the mouse pointer to a place on the
> screen where VoiceOver cannot go, you need to install a utility called
> MoveMouse.
> MoveMouse is a utility created by Dorothy Renton to help VoiceOver users to
> position the mouse on objects that VoiceOver doesn’t recognise. Each
> movement moves the mouse a tenth of an inch up, down, left or right. It
> saves us having to turn on Mouse Keys. Here’s the link to download
> MoveMouse:
> 
> About MoveMouse
>
> MoveMouse was written to solve a very specific problem for the blind. Some
> developers neglect to label some of their buttons, so VoiceOver can’t
> identify them.  Now assume the blind person knows a sighted person with the
> same application.  The sighted person could tell the blind person, “start at
> this (good) button and go half an inch to the right and a quarter inch up to
> find the hidden button”.  That’s only useful if the blind person could move
> the cursor by a precise amount.  Enter MoveMouse.
>
> MoveMouse is an executable program that calls four OSX Services (which are
> Automator Workflows). The Four Workflows move the mouse 0.1" left, right, up
> or down using keystroke combinations. For testing purposes each Service can
> also invoke a different sound to allow the user to verify that they're
> moving in the correct direction (available on request).
>
> Installing MoveMouse Services
>
> 1. Unzip the Distribution zip file.
>
> 2. This will create a subdirectory, called “MoveMouseDistribution” with two
> items: MoveMouse and a folder called FourWorkflows.
>
> 3. Move MoveMouse to  your Applications Folder. (Make sure you put it in
> /Applications, not the user level Applications.)
>
> 4. Next we need to open your (hidden) user Library folder.  Open a new
> Finder window or tab.
> Under the Go menu, navigate to "Computer" and press the Option key. The menu
> item will change to "Library." While holding down the Option key, press the
> Control key and press the Space Bar. The Finder window will now display the
> hidden Library folder. Open the Services folder within the user Library
> folder.
>
> 5. Now open the FourWorkflows folder.  Copy and paste all four of the
> workflows into the Services folder we just opened in the previous step.
>
> 6. You should now be able to use the four workflows. In all of your
> applications and the Finder, if you click on the name of the application in
> the menubar and pull down to Services, you should now see the four workflows
> MoveMouseUp, Down, Right, and Left.
>
> 7. You can test them right now.  As you invoke each of them you should hear
> four different sounds indicating that the workflow is moving the cursor 0.1"
> up, down, right, or left.
>
> 8. If MoveMouse works for you - skip to step 9. If not, read on. Because
> MoveMouse is an executable that you just downloaded from the Internet,
> depending on your security setting, Mac OS X may not let you just run it. To
> bypass this security feature (because you trust US, don’t you?), navigate to
> the Applications folder in your Finder window. Locate ‘MoveMouse’ in the
> list of applications. Right-click on the file name and select ‘Open’. A
> dialog box should appear, saying “‘MoveMouse’ is from an unidentified
> developer. Are you sure you want to open it?”.  Click ‘Open’ to allow Mac OS
> X to always run this application.
>
> 9. If you'd like to use keystrokes to invoke the four workflows, open System
> Preferences, Keyboard, Shortcuts. In the left pane, click on Services and
> scroll down in the right pane until you find the four services (MoveMouseUp,
> etc).
>
> 10. Check the box to the left of each one, and then tap on the right where
> it says "none", which will change to a button that says "add shortcut". At
> this point you can tap on the “add shortcut” button and then hold down the
> key combination you desire to assign to that workflow. We have been using
> command-option-control-shift and the corresponding arrow key, but you can
> choose any keystroke you desire.
>
> 11. Cleanup: You can now safely delete the Distribution zip file, and the
> folders created when you unzipped that file.
>
> For feedback, please send all inquiries to alli...@podfeet.com
>
> Ho

Re: Vo+cmd+shift+space, can i understand it?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Hi Anne:

Thanks so much for this great utility.
but can we change it's movement to be in point s or something?
 and if without this, what can I use to drag and drop an item? the
mouse press and release or the drag and drop voice  over feature with
vo+shift+period?

Thanks


On 10/11/17, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> When you press this shortcut, visually a hand grips the mouse pointer. It is
> the equivalent of holding down the mouse button or pressing and holding on
> the trackpad.
> To use this for drag&drop, you need to turn cursor tracking off
> (VO-Shift-F3) so that moving the VoiceOver cursor does not move anything
> else. Use VO keys and arrow keys to navigate to where you wish to drop the
> item under the mouse, then bring the mouse pointer (VO-Cmd-F5) and press
> your shortcut again to release the mouse.
> If you are actually needing to move the mouse pointer to a place on the
> screen where VoiceOver cannot go, you need to install a utility called
> MoveMouse.
> MoveMouse is a utility created by Dorothy Renton to help VoiceOver users to
> position the mouse on objects that VoiceOver doesn’t recognise. Each
> movement moves the mouse a tenth of an inch up, down, left or right. It
> saves us having to turn on Mouse Keys. Here’s the link to download
> MoveMouse:
> 
> About MoveMouse
>
> MoveMouse was written to solve a very specific problem for the blind. Some
> developers neglect to label some of their buttons, so VoiceOver can’t
> identify them.  Now assume the blind person knows a sighted person with the
> same application.  The sighted person could tell the blind person, “start at
> this (good) button and go half an inch to the right and a quarter inch up to
> find the hidden button”.  That’s only useful if the blind person could move
> the cursor by a precise amount.  Enter MoveMouse.
>
> MoveMouse is an executable program that calls four OSX Services (which are
> Automator Workflows). The Four Workflows move the mouse 0.1" left, right, up
> or down using keystroke combinations. For testing purposes each Service can
> also invoke a different sound to allow the user to verify that they're
> moving in the correct direction (available on request).
>
> Installing MoveMouse Services
>
> 1. Unzip the Distribution zip file.
>
> 2. This will create a subdirectory, called “MoveMouseDistribution” with two
> items: MoveMouse and a folder called FourWorkflows.
>
> 3. Move MoveMouse to  your Applications Folder. (Make sure you put it in
> /Applications, not the user level Applications.)
>
> 4. Next we need to open your (hidden) user Library folder.  Open a new
> Finder window or tab.
> Under the Go menu, navigate to "Computer" and press the Option key. The menu
> item will change to "Library." While holding down the Option key, press the
> Control key and press the Space Bar. The Finder window will now display the
> hidden Library folder. Open the Services folder within the user Library
> folder.
>
> 5. Now open the FourWorkflows folder.  Copy and paste all four of the
> workflows into the Services folder we just opened in the previous step.
>
> 6. You should now be able to use the four workflows. In all of your
> applications and the Finder, if you click on the name of the application in
> the menubar and pull down to Services, you should now see the four workflows
> MoveMouseUp, Down, Right, and Left.
>
> 7. You can test them right now.  As you invoke each of them you should hear
> four different sounds indicating that the workflow is moving the cursor 0.1"
> up, down, right, or left.
>
> 8. If MoveMouse works for you - skip to step 9. If not, read on. Because
> MoveMouse is an executable that you just downloaded from the Internet,
> depending on your security setting, Mac OS X may not let you just run it. To
> bypass this security feature (because you trust US, don’t you?), navigate to
> the Applications folder in your Finder window. Locate ‘MoveMouse’ in the
> list of applications. Right-click on the file name and select ‘Open’. A
> dialog box should appear, saying “‘MoveMouse’ is from an unidentified
> developer. Are you sure you want to open it?”.  Click ‘Open’ to allow Mac OS
> X to always run this application.
>
> 9. If you'd like to use keystrokes to invoke the four workflows, open System
> Preferences, Keyboard, Shortcuts. In the left pane, click on Services and
> scroll down in the right pane until you find the four services (MoveMouseUp,
> etc).
>
> 10. Check the box to the left of each one, and then tap on the right where
> it says "none", which will change to a button that says "add shortcut". At
> this point you can tap on the “add shortcut” button and then hold down the
> key combination you desire to assign to that workflow. We have been using
> command-option-control-shift and the corresponding arrow key, but you can
> choose any keystroke you desire.
>
> 11. Cleanup: You can now safely delete the Distribution zip file, an

Re: Will my computer continue downloading while sleeping?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Thanks so much


On 10/10/17, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Basically, yes.  I do that with most of my machines.  Desktops like iMacs,
> Minis and MacPros, I always set them that way.  Laptops like MacBook Pro or
> MacBook Air, I set it that way when plugged in and let them go to sleep when
> on battery power.
>
> Later...
>
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>
> On Oct 10, 2017, at 12:45, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>
> So, your suggestion is to leave my computer always awake but sleeps my
> screen?
>> On Oct 10, 2017, at 4:11 PM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> There are a few things that remain active during sleep, but downloading
>> usually is not one of them.  If you are concerned about security and wish
>> to limit access, just put the display to sleep but leave the computer
>> awake.  This is accomplished in the Energy Saver pane of System Prefs.
>> For best security, you should have your Mac set to require your password
>> after sleep or screen saver, which is in the General pane of System Prefs.
>>  With both of these items set as suggested, your computer will be loced
>> once the display goes to sleep but all background activities will continue
>> naturally.
>>
>> Later...
>>
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>
>> On Oct 10, 2017, at 01:53, Ramy Moustafa 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all:
>>
>> I set my studio mac mini computer to sleep after 5 mintes, but
>> yesterday, I need to leave it downloading a bing thing, so, when I
>> came today, I don't know if he was downloading or not, I saw some
>> progress, but not the progress that I was looking for in about 12
>> hours,
>> so, in this issue, what can I do?
>> must I disable sleeping or what?
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ramy MoustafaSaber
>> Music instructor @:
>> Faculty ofmusical education
>> Music arranger and Sound engineer @:
>> Harmony Recording Studio
>> https://www.facebook.com/HarmonyRecordingStudio.eg
>>
>> --
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>> Visionaries list.
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Re: Vo+cmd+shift+space, can i understand it?

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi Ramy,

As mentioned earlier, the VO-comma/VO-period drag & drop feature in VoiceOver 
requires that both the pickup and drop--off locations be visible on the screen 
at the same time.  From a VO prospective, this is often difficult to know for 
sure.  Therefore, if both items are visible on the screen and if the pickup and 
drop-off locations are accessible to VO, then there's no need for using the 
utility recommended by Anne, a simple drag & drop with VO-comma/VO-period 
should do the trick.  Again, if the items don't appear to be visible on the 
same screen, but the pickup and drop-off locations are accessible to VoiceOver, 
then the Move Mouse utility is not needed, but you do need to pay attention to 
the cursor tracking constraints outlined by Anne.  The only time you really 
need the Move Mouse utility is when the pickup or drop-off locations are not 
accessible to VoiceOver.  That is, if you move around the application window 
and the item or button you wish to manipulate is not announced by VO, but it is 
actually there somewhere and is visible/accessible to a sighted user.

To clarify some semantics with respect to drag and drop.  In the sighted user 
world, in order to drag an item, the user must press the mouse or trackpad 
button down, and continue to hold it down while they "drag" or move the mouse 
to the desired location.  Once they have the mouse located at the new location 
where they wish to drop it, they release the mouse or trackpad button which 
allows the button to move up.  The mouse-down and mouse-up that VO announces 
refers to the action of the button being depressed and released and has nothing 
to do with the direction of movement on the screen.  Both Anne and Jonathan 
have given quite good instructions, so I will not repeat any of that here.

HTH.

Later...


Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Oct 11, 2017, at 06:54, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:

Hi Anne:

Thanks so much for this great utility.
but can we change it's movement to be in point s or something?
and if without this, what can I use to drag and drop an item? the
mouse press and release or the drag and drop voice  over feature with
vo+shift+period?

Thanks


On 10/11/17, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> When you press this shortcut, visually a hand grips the mouse pointer. It is
> the equivalent of holding down the mouse button or pressing and holding on
> the trackpad.
> To use this for drag&drop, you need to turn cursor tracking off
> (VO-Shift-F3) so that moving the VoiceOver cursor does not move anything
> else. Use VO keys and arrow keys to navigate to where you wish to drop the
> item under the mouse, then bring the mouse pointer (VO-Cmd-F5) and press
> your shortcut again to release the mouse.
> If you are actually needing to move the mouse pointer to a place on the
> screen where VoiceOver cannot go, you need to install a utility called
> MoveMouse.
> MoveMouse is a utility created by Dorothy Renton to help VoiceOver users to
> position the mouse on objects that VoiceOver doesn’t recognise. Each
> movement moves the mouse a tenth of an inch up, down, left or right. It
> saves us having to turn on Mouse Keys. Here’s the link to download
> MoveMouse:
> 
> About MoveMouse
> 
> MoveMouse was written to solve a very specific problem for the blind. Some
> developers neglect to label some of their buttons, so VoiceOver can’t
> identify them.  Now assume the blind person knows a sighted person with the
> same application.  The sighted person could tell the blind person, “start at
> this (good) button and go half an inch to the right and a quarter inch up to
> find the hidden button”.  That’s only useful if the blind person could move
> the cursor by a precise amount.  Enter MoveMouse.
> 
> MoveMouse is an executable program that calls four OSX Services (which are
> Automator Workflows). The Four Workflows move the mouse 0.1" left, right, up
> or down using keystroke combinations. For testing purposes each Service can
> also invoke a different sound to allow the user to verify that they're
> moving in the correct direction (available on request).
> 
> Installing MoveMouse Services
> 
> 1. Unzip the Distribution zip file.
> 
> 2. This will create a subdirectory, called “MoveMouseDistribution” with two
> items: MoveMouse and a folder called FourWorkflows.
> 
> 3. Move MoveMouse to  your Applications Folder. (Make sure you put it in
> /Applications, not the user level Applications.)
> 
> 4. Next we need to open your (hidden) user Library folder.  Open a new
> Finder window or tab.
> Under the Go menu, navigate to "Computer" and press the Option key. The menu
> item will change to "Library." While holding down the Option key, press the
> Control key and press the Space Bar. The Finder window will now display the
> hidden Library folder. Open the Services folder within the user Library
> folder.
> 
> 5. Now open the FourWorkflows folder.  Copy and paste all f

Re: High Sierra Speech

[E.T.]

Jonathan,
   I had turned this off and after waiting for a while, I still get the 
2nd voice. Will try to dig into it. I really need to nail this down. :(


From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
  "God for you is where you sweep away all the
  mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
  our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
  and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/1/2017 6:03 AM, Jonathan Cohn wrote:
Oh, just for error dialogs? I seem to remember a speak dialog checkbox 
in system settings I wonder if that is getting in your way.



Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



On Sep 30, 2017, at 12:24 PM, E.T. > wrote:


  No that does not do it. This happens in some dialogs such as error 
dialogs. Sometimes at the same time the normal speech is playing, 
sometimes with a delay.


From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
 "God for you is where you sweep away all the
 mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
 our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
 and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com 

On 9/30/2017 6:16 AM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:

Allow AppleScript control VoiceOver?
Best wishes,
Jonathan Cohn
On Sep 27, 2017, at 8:22 PM, E.T. > wrote:


  Its been a long long time since I experienced this issue so do not 
remember the solution. While working in HS today, on occasion I 
would hear two voices, one much slower than the normal voice. What 
is the fix? Thanks.


From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
 "God for you is where you sweep away all the
 mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
 our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
 and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com 

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Drobo dashboard software with Voiceover

[Nickus de Vos]

Hi all
Have anyone used a Drobo NAS storage device and have experience with its 
dashboard software? Just wondering if it’s accessible with Voiceover.

Thanks

Nickus

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Re: Twitterrific returns to the Mac as a modern Twitter client w/ themes, muffle syncing, more

[christopher hallsworth]

Hello, have just purchased this app, love the iOS client so will love this.,

> On 10 Oct 2017, at 16:53, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Good news for Twitterrific lovers.
> 
> Twitterrific returns to the Mac as a modern Twitter client w/ themes, muffle 
> syncing, more
> 9to5Mac  /  Zac Hall
> 
> 
> The Iconfactory has officially launched Twitterrific 5 for Mac after a 
> successful Kickstarter campaign for Project Phoenix earlier this year. 
> Twitterrific for macOS is a totally new version of the Twitter client with a 
> modern design that includes a dark theme, visual customization, 
> muffle/mute/timeline syncing to the iOS app, and more.
> 
> 
> Twitterrific for Mac has been effectively dead for the last few years as the 
> market shifted to iOS where Twitterrific 5 has experimented with in-app 
> purchases to remove ads and unlock features.
> 
> With Project Phoenix, however, The Iconfactory used crowdfunding to ensure 
> demand for a modern Mac client before devoting months of development work to 
> the project. Ultimately, the Kickstarter campaign received $108,346 from 
> 2,852 backers.
> 
> For users of Twitterrific for iOS, this launch means there’s finally a modern 
> version of their favorite Twitter client for the desktop again. But even if 
> you’re not yet a Twitterrific user, the interest in the new app existing is 
> both good news for the Mac as a platform as well as the Mac Twitter client 
> competition (which Twitter tries to prevent without maintaining its own app 
> well).
> 
> Twitterrific lets you choose between two themes (light and dark), a handful 
> of fonts including Menlo (shown below), nine text sizes ranging from Tiny to 
> CHOCK, and three media thumbnail options.
> 
> 
> 
> Changing between light and dark theme also changes the window color for menus 
> even if you’re not using the basic ‘Use dark menu bar and Dock’ preference 
> which is a nice touch, and media opens in a whimsical and fluid popover with 
> share options and even playback controls for video included.
> 
> Twiterrific also includes VoiceOver support for navigating the timeline, 
> composing tweets, and the option to add a text description to images as a 
> fantastic accessibility feature.
> 
> And like the iOS version, Twitterrific 5 for macOS lets you quickly fix typo 
> tweets with an edit workaround that actually deletes the typo tweet and 
> replaces it with your edited version without manually copying and pasting the 
> tweet.
> 
> 
> Here’s the full feature list for Twitterrific 5.0 for macOS:
> 
>   •  Simple to use, easy to understand
>   •  True multi-account/multi-window support
>   •  View mentions, messages, and favorites quickly and easily
>   •  Timeline syncing of reading position across all platforms via iCloud
>   •  System-wide alerts for mentions & direct messages via Notification 
> Center
>   •  Fully accessible via VoiceOver
>   • Support for Retweet (RT) & Quoted tweets
>   • Quick access to Emoji when composing new tweets
>   •  Autocompletion of usernames & hashtags while editing tweets
>   • View Twitter saved searches and lists
>   • Check out global and local trending topics
>   • Browse conversation threads between users
>   • Support for tweet storms & chained tweet threads
>   • Quickly Delete & Edit your own tweets
>   • Translate tweets to your native language
>   • Helpful color-coding of tweet types
>   • In-app media viewing for images, animated GIFs, Instagram & more
>   • Share a tweet with actions for email, Messages, Safari Reading List & 
> more
>   • Muffles & mutes synced from Twitterrific for iOS via iCloud
>   • Robust in-app media viewer with detachable popovers
>   • Customize the appearance of media in the timeline or hide it 
> completely
>   • View user profiles including past tweets, likes & mentions
>   • Follow and unfollow other users directly from their user profile
>   • Block and report spammers with a single click
>   • Theme control (light or dark)
>   • Font size & type face control
>   • Robust keyboard control
> Twitterrific 5 for macOS is available to purchase on the Mac App Store for 
> $19.99 and runs on macOS 10.11 El Capitan or later.
> 
> Subscribe to 9to5Mac on YouTube for more Apple news:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Original Article: https://9to5mac.com/2017/10/10/twitterrific-5-mac/
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
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> The archives f

Re: SuperDuper vs Carbon Copy Cloner

[E.T.]

   I do. It may be redundant but better safe than sorry. And, I put 
backups on separate external drives. The drives are partitioned but if 
the drive itself goes belly up, that will take all the data with it.


From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
  "God for you is where you sweep away all the
  mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
  our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
  and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/10/2017 7:18 PM, Michael Marshall wrote:

i have never played with CCC but have thought about it.
Do you use the program in conjunction with Time Machine?
How would you restore a Mac cloned with this program?


On 11 Oct 2017, at 3:05 am, Mike Arrigo  wrote:

Sounds like their development is falling behind, with high sierra, all SSD 
drives are converted automatically, CCC was ready to go the day high Sierra was 
released.
Original message:

Good information, thanks. I too like to do clean installs.The more I
do the easier it is.



By the way, for anyone who uses Superduper. I took a closer look at
their web site. The current version does not support APFS. Their version
3 which is in beta will support APFS.



 From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/10/2017 7:05 AM, Mike Arrigo wrote:

Cloning the recovery partition makes it much easier if you want to do a
clean install on another mac, just boot from the cloned recovery, erase
the hard drive and you can do a clean install which I prefer to do for
each major release of the operating system, it takes a bit more time but
it's well worth it.
Original message:

 Thanks Mike. I am curious, what is the advantage of cloning the
recovery partition?



  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
"God for you is where you sweep away all the
mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/9/2017 12:52 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:

CCC 5 is fairly similar to version 4, it has more features than super
duper and does work with APFS drives. CCC also has the ability to clone
Apple's recovery partition which Super Duper does not do last I checked.
Original message:

 I had been using CCC 4 for some time but switched to Superduper as
it was faster to set up and use.



 Now I may switch back because the current version of Superduper,
2.92,  although it should support High Sierra, does not see any APFS
formatted drives.



 If any of you are running CCC 5, how does it compare to the
previous
version 4?



  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
"God for you is where you sweep away all the
mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



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Re: SuperDuper vs Carbon Copy Cloner

[Mike Arrigo]

I use CCC for my backups, I don't use time machine, mainly because I 
don't make a lot of changes to a lot of files at once. As far as 
restoring from a CCC backup, you would boot your mac from your backup 
drive, you can then use CCC to clone back to your internal drive, 
fortunately I have never had to do this.

Original message:

I do. It may be redundant but better safe than sorry. And, I put
backups on separate external drives. The drives are partitioned but if
the drive itself goes belly up, that will take all the data with it.



 From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/10/2017 7:18 PM, Michael Marshall wrote:

i have never played with CCC but have thought about it.
Do you use the program in conjunction with Time Machine?
How would you restore a Mac cloned with this program?



On 11 Oct 2017, at 3:05 am, Mike Arrigo  wrote:


Sounds like their development is falling behind, with high sierra, all 
SSD drives are converted automatically, CCC was ready to go the day 
high Sierra was released.

Original message:

Good information, thanks. I too like to do clean installs.The more I
do the easier it is.



By the way, for anyone who uses Superduper. I took a closer look at
their web site. The current version does not support APFS. Their version
3 which is in beta will support APFS.



 From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/10/2017 7:05 AM, Mike Arrigo wrote:

Cloning the recovery partition makes it much easier if you want to do a
clean install on another mac, just boot from the cloned recovery, erase
the hard drive and you can do a clean install which I prefer to do for
each major release of the operating system, it takes a bit more time but
it's well worth it.
Original message:

 Thanks Mike. I am curious, what is the advantage of cloning the
recovery partition?



  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
"God for you is where you sweep away all the
mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/9/2017 12:52 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:

CCC 5 is fairly similar to version 4, it has more features than super
duper and does work with APFS drives. CCC also has the ability to clone
Apple's recovery partition which Super Duper does not do last I checked.
Original message:

 I had been using CCC 4 for some time but switched to Superduper as
it was faster to set up and use.



 Now I may switch back because the current version of Superduper,
2.92,  although it should support High Sierra, does not see any APFS
formatted drives.



 If any of you are running CCC 5, how does it compare to the
previous
version 4?



  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
"God for you is where you sweep away all the
mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



--
The following information is important for all members of the Mac
Visionaries list.



If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact
the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list
itself.



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Collaborating on a Google doc using an iPad mini, iPhone, or a Mac

[Mary Otten]

I am on a committee that has chosen to use Google docs as the platform for 
collaborative work on documents. That's disappointing to me, because I've never 
used it and I'm really not feeling like I want to learn a whole new way of 
doing things at this point, but that's not a choice I have. So, I have a 
Bluetooth keyboard and an iPad mini or my iPhone 7 Plus. I also have a Mac. I 
really don't want to learn chrome fox if I don't have to, because I just don't 
think I'm up for it. So how is Google docs on iOS or under OS X with VoiceOver?

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: SuperDuper vs Carbon Copy Cloner

[Michael Marshall]

hey,
can CCC keep track of file changes?

> On 12 Oct 2017, at 8:19 am, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> I use CCC for my backups, I don't use time machine, mainly because I don't 
> make a lot of changes to a lot of files at once. As far as restoring from a 
> CCC backup, you would boot your mac from your backup drive, you can then use 
> CCC to clone back to your internal drive, fortunately I have never had to do 
> this.
> Original message:
>>I do. It may be redundant but better safe than sorry. And, I put
>> backups on separate external drives. The drives are partitioned but if
>> the drive itself goes belly up, that will take all the data with it.
> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
>>   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
>>   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
>>   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
>>   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
>> E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 10/10/2017 7:18 PM, Michael Marshall wrote:
>>> i have never played with CCC but have thought about it.
>>> Do you use the program in conjunction with Time Machine?
>>> How would you restore a Mac cloned with this program?
> 
 On 11 Oct 2017, at 3:05 am, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
 Sounds like their development is falling behind, with high sierra, all SSD 
 drives are converted automatically, CCC was ready to go the day high 
 Sierra was released.
 Original message:
>Good information, thanks. I too like to do clean installs.The more I
> do the easier it is.
> 
>By the way, for anyone who uses Superduper. I took a closer look at
> their web site. The current version does not support APFS. Their version
> 3 which is in beta will support APFS.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
>   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
>   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
>   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
>   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
> E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 10/10/2017 7:05 AM, Mike Arrigo wrote:
>> Cloning the recovery partition makes it much easier if you want to do a
>> clean install on another mac, just boot from the cloned recovery, erase
>> the hard drive and you can do a clean install which I prefer to do for
>> each major release of the operating system, it takes a bit more time but
>> it's well worth it.
>> Original message:
>>> Thanks Mike. I am curious, what is the advantage of cloning the
>>> recovery partition?
> 
>>>  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
>>>"God for you is where you sweep away all the
>>>mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
>>>our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
>>>and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
>>> E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>>> On 10/9/2017 12:52 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:
 CCC 5 is fairly similar to version 4, it has more features than super
 duper and does work with APFS drives. CCC also has the ability to clone
 Apple's recovery partition which Super Duper does not do last I 
 checked.
 Original message:
> I had been using CCC 4 for some time but switched to Superduper as
> it was faster to set up and use.
> 
> Now I may switch back because the current version of Superduper,
> 2.92,  although it should support High Sierra, does not see any APFS
> formatted drives.
> 
> If any of you are running CCC 5, how does it compare to the
> previous
> version 4?
> 
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
>"God for you is where you sweep away all the
>mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
>our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
>and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
> E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac
> Visionaries list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
> or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact
> the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list
> itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach
> mark at:  macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is
> Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
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>

Re: SuperDuper vs Carbon Copy Cloner

[E.T.]

   Yes. Its called SafetyNet.

From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
  "God for you is where you sweep away all the
  mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
  our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
  and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/11/2017 5:47 PM, Michael Marshall wrote:

hey,
can CCC keep track of file changes?


On 12 Oct 2017, at 8:19 am, Mike Arrigo  wrote:

I use CCC for my backups, I don't use time machine, mainly because I don't make 
a lot of changes to a lot of files at once. As far as restoring from a CCC 
backup, you would boot your mac from your backup drive, you can then use CCC to 
clone back to your internal drive, fortunately I have never had to do this.
Original message:

I do. It may be redundant but better safe than sorry. And, I put
backups on separate external drives. The drives are partitioned but if
the drive itself goes belly up, that will take all the data with it.



 From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/10/2017 7:18 PM, Michael Marshall wrote:

i have never played with CCC but have thought about it.
Do you use the program in conjunction with Time Machine?
How would you restore a Mac cloned with this program?



On 11 Oct 2017, at 3:05 am, Mike Arrigo  wrote:



Sounds like their development is falling behind, with high sierra, all SSD 
drives are converted automatically, CCC was ready to go the day high Sierra was 
released.
Original message:

Good information, thanks. I too like to do clean installs.The more I
do the easier it is.



By the way, for anyone who uses Superduper. I took a closer look at
their web site. The current version does not support APFS. Their version
3 which is in beta will support APFS.



 From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
   "God for you is where you sweep away all the
   mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
   our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
   and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/10/2017 7:05 AM, Mike Arrigo wrote:

Cloning the recovery partition makes it much easier if you want to do a
clean install on another mac, just boot from the cloned recovery, erase
the hard drive and you can do a clean install which I prefer to do for
each major release of the operating system, it takes a bit more time but
it's well worth it.
Original message:

 Thanks Mike. I am curious, what is the advantage of cloning the
recovery partition?



  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
"God for you is where you sweep away all the
mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



On 10/9/2017 12:52 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:

CCC 5 is fairly similar to version 4, it has more features than super
duper and does work with APFS drives. CCC also has the ability to clone
Apple's recovery partition which Super Duper does not do last I checked.
Original message:

 I had been using CCC 4 for some time but switched to Superduper as
it was faster to set up and use.



 Now I may switch back because the current version of Superduper,
2.92,  although it should support High Sierra, does not see any APFS
formatted drives.



 If any of you are running CCC 5, how does it compare to the
previous
version 4?



  From E.T.'s Keyboard. . .
"God for you is where you sweep away all the
mysteries of the world, all the challenges to
our intelligence. You simply turn your mind off
and say God did it." --Carl Sagan
E-mail: ancient.ali...@icloud.com



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Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach
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Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com



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Re: Collaborating on a Google doc using an iPad mini, iPhone, or a Mac

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

I've found it better to use it on iOS with the Docs app and the related Googly 
things like Drive and Sheets.  Using VO on the Mac is recommended by some, 
including people from Google, but I find it difficult to locate and work within 
the editable area of a Doc.  It's not impossible, just awkward.  ChromeVox 
works better for me when on the Mac, but I still prefer it on iOS with a 
keyboard.

Others may differ, but that's my experience.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Oct 11, 2017, at 17:03, Mary Otten  wrote:

I am on a committee that has chosen to use Google docs as the platform for 
collaborative work on documents. That's disappointing to me, because I've never 
used it and I'm really not feeling like I want to learn a whole new way of 
doing things at this point, but that's not a choice I have. So, I have a 
Bluetooth keyboard and an iPad mini or my iPhone 7 Plus. I also have a Mac. I 
really don't want to learn chrome fox if I don't have to, because I just don't 
think I'm up for it. So how is Google docs on iOS or under OS X with VoiceOver?

Sent from my iPhone

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Hey Siri, Google Assistant is winning the AI game and it's not even close

[M. Taylor]

Macworld - Wednesday, October 11, 2017 at 4:00 AM
Hey Siri, Google Assistant is winning the AI game and it's not even close
You might have missed the Apple references during last week's Google Pixel 2
event, but they were there. There was VP of Product Management Mario Queiroz
telling the crowd, "We don't set aside better features for the larger
devices." Or pointing out that "even iMessages" would be transferred over
when you decide to switch. And let's not forget the woman taking a big bite
out of an apple during the Pixel 2's intro video.
In fact, it seemed like every new Google product released last week had a
singular message seemingly aimed squarely at Apple. Google might have a long
way to go before it starts selling iPhone-like numbers of Pixel phones, but
there is one important area where it's firmly in the lead, and it has
nothing to do with bezels or beats. It's about intelligence.
At its recent iPhone X event, Tim Cook pulled out Steve Jobs's old Wayne
Gretzky quote about skating to where the puck is going, but there's only one
company that's thinking forward right now and it's not Apple-it's Google.
New hardware might have been the reason for the event, but machine learning
was the strongest undercurrent, and the message Google sent was clear: Our
AI is better than your AI.
Brains before beauty
Google CEO Sundar Pichai kicked off the the Made by Google event by talking
about his favorite topic: machine learning. It's not enough that Google
makes uncannily accurate search algorithms anymore. Google is using its AI
smarts to make its products more responsive and adaptable to each user's
lifestyle.
 Google 
Google Home Mini will put Google Assistant in every room of your house.
It's not about specs (although the Pixel phones have really good ones) or
design (although the Google Home Max will look good in any room). In fact,
none of Google's new products are all that interesting on the surface, but
what's inside is leaps and bounds ahead of what Apple is doing with Siri and
iPhone X. It's about smarts, and Google has integrated Google Assistant and
machine learning into every one of its devices in a, dare I say it,
Apple-like way.
There's the impulse-buy Google Home Mini and the high-fidelity Max to put
Assistant in every room of your house. Active Edge on the Pixel lets you
squeeze the sides of your phone to launch Assistant. And the
Assistant-powered Pixel Buds feature a remarkable live translation feature.
Google's latest products are designed from the inside out to be smarter than
they are pretty, a big bet that consumers are tired of good-looking gadgets
that put form before function. And if it's right, Apple could be playing
catch-up for years to come.
Conversations, not commands
Apple's first home AI speaker won't hit shelves until December, but Google
already has three of them. When it was announced in June, HomePod appeared
to have an advantage over Google Home and Amazon Echo with its
high-fidelity, room-sensing smarts, but now Google Home Max has landed, and
it might be even better.
 Apple 
HomePod intelligently scans your room to deliver the perfect sound.
Like HomePod, Google Home Max uses machine learning to analyze your space to
deliver optimal sound, but Google's method gets more granular and fine-tunes
the sound based on the song you're listening to as well as adjusting based
on Max's surroundings. But if they're even when it comes to sound, the real
difference-maker is Google Assistant.
Apple has improved Siri's speech patterns in iOS 11, but for the most part,
its AI ambitions have been relatively conservative. Google Assistant isn't
just better at recognizing what you're saying, it's more contextual and
conversational, which leads to an all-around better experience. And with the
new routines feature, you'll be able to combine several tasks (like shutting
the lights, setting an alarm, and activating your security system) with a
single phrase. It even recognizes your voice over the other people in your
home. With Siri, commands are islands unto themselves, while Google
Assistant is practically like talking to an actual person.
A smarter camera lens
It was just a year ago when Assistant was limited to Pixel phones and Google
Home, and now it's everywhere: headphones, watches, speakers, not to mention
hundreds of millions of Android phones.
 Google 
Google Lens is like AI for you eyes.
And now Google is branching out beyond simple voice commands. Exclusive to
the Pixel phones (at least for now) is a new app called Google Lens, and it
has the potential to be just as instrumental to Google's AI push, if not
more so. A combination of augmented reality and artificial intelligence,
Google Lens uses your phone's camera to identify buildings or flowers, scan
and store phone numbers, even input Wi-Fi passwords, all without needing to
jump around to various apps.
This isn't a fancy box for Google Assistant, it's a whole new set of skills.
Apple doesn't have anything close to this type of fu

Yelp for iOS updated with in-app support for Apple Pay checkout

[M. Taylor]

9to5Mac - Wednesday, October 11, 2017 at 4:51 PM
Yelp for iOS updated with in-app support for Apple Pay checkout
 
Popular iOS app Yelp has today been updated with a notable addition: Apple
Pay support. Bringing the app to version 11.25.0, the update lets users opt
to pay with Apple Pay when booking with local businesses, restaurants, and
more.
 
 
Spigen TEKA RA200 Airpods Earhooks Cover
 
For those unfamiliar, Yelp is a popular crowd-sourced application that makes
it easy for users to quickly find nearby restaurants, events, shopping
amenities, and more. The Yelp backend also supports reservations, booking,
and more for participating businesses.
With Apple Pay support, users can now use their Apple Pay information to
make it even easier to book. Apple Pay now appears as a payment option in
the app, alongside standard options such as PayPal and debt/credit cards.
Yelp describes it like this:
Big news. You can now use Apple Pay to make purchases from local businesses
on Yelp. So go ahead - book an oceanside couples massage, get tickets to
that John Mayer concert, or get those lobster rolls delivered.
Yelp is available on the App Store for free. It offers iPhone, iPad,
iMessage, and Apple Watch applications so you can access it from any of your
Apple devices. Let us know if you're a big Yelp user down in the comments
below.
Subscribe to 9to5Mac on YouTube for more Apple news:
[embedded content]

Original Article at:
http://9to5mac.com/2017/10/11/yelp-for-ios-updated-with-in-app-support-for-a
pple-pay-checkout/


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How to fix 7 annoyances in iOS 11 - CNET

[M. Taylor]

CNET How To - Thursday, October 5, 2017 at 1:05 PM
How to fix 7 annoyances in iOS 11 - CNET
There's an adjustment period with any new iOS. New features get added.
Things get moved around. If some of iOS 11's changes have left you feeling
frustrated, then perhaps the following seven fixes will have you feeling
better about yourself and your updated iPhone or iPad.
1. Stop autoplay videos in the App Store
Auto-play videos are everywhere you turn, which you have probably noticed if
you have visited Facebook, Twitter or pretty much any website lately. With
iOS 11, auto-play videos have come to the redesigned App Store. If you don't
want demos of games and other apps to automatically start playing when you
are scrolling through the App Store, it's easy to disable them. Open
Settings, go to iTunes & App Store, tap Video Autoplay and select Off.
 Screenshot by Matt Elliott/CNET 
2. Put an end to app rating requests
Apps asking you for your thoughts and opinion isn't new to iOS 11, but a
setting to disable them is. Now, you can put an end to an app interrupting
you with a request for you to rate it. Head to Settings > iTunes & App Store
and toggle off In-App Ratings & Reviews.
 Screenshot by Matt Elliott/CNET 
3. Turn off Bluetooth and Wi-Fi for reals
The buttons in the Control Center for Bluetooth and Wi-Fi no longer turn off
your device's Bluetooth and Wi-Fi radios. Instead, they simply disconnect
you from devices and networks so you can continue to use AirDrop and AirPlay
and the Apple Pencil and the Apple Watch. Read Rick Broida's informative
post on the topic for more detail, but the short of it is you need to dig
into Settings to actually turn off Bluetooth and Wi-Fi. Those paths:
Settings > Bluetooth > Off and Settings > Wi-Fi > Off.
4. What to do with screenshot thumbnails
I agree, the new iOS 11 screenshot tool is awesome. But if you want to take
a screenshot and quickly save it to your camera roll without editing or
annotating it, then you might get annoyed by the thumbnail preview that
appears in the lower left corner of the screen. Turns out, you can just
ignore them. Better yet, swipe to get rid of them. You do not need to tap on
the thumbnail, tap 
Done and then tap Save to Photos to save a screenshot. Just let the
thumbnail disappear after a few seconds or flick it away -- either way,
it'll be saved to your photos.
5. Uncover the hidden auto-brightness setting
The auto-brightness control has moved from its logical spot in the Display &
Brightness page in Settings. Where did it go? It's now hiding out in the
Accessibility page. Follow this path to find it: Settings > General >
Accessibility > Display Accommodations.
 Screenshot by Matt Elliott/CNET 
6. No Night Shift in Control Center?
There are many new buttons you can add to the revamped Control Center, but
the Night Shift button it not one of them. It is, however, only a 3D Touch
or long-press away. Call up the Control Center and 3D Touch or long-press
the brightness slider and you'll see the Night Shift button at the bottom of
the screen. 
 Screenshot by Matt Elliott/CNET 
7. Declutter the iPad's busy keyboard
This one is iPad-only. With iOS 11, the iPad's keyboard gets double-mapped
keys to make it easy to access symbols and numbers, which you might find to
be #convenient. If you can't get the hang of the flick gesture to type a
key's secondary symbol, however, and want to return to the old iPad keyboard
without the double-mapped keys, head to Settings > General > Keyboard and
toggle off Enable Key Flicks.

Original Article at:
https://www.cnet.com/how-to/how-to-fix-7-annoyances-in-ios-11/#ftag=CAD5457c
2c


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Twitter updates tvOS app with new iOS integration to easily tweet while watching Apple TV

[M. Taylor]

9to5Mac - Wednesday, October 11, 2017 at 12:28 PM
Twitter updates tvOS app with new iOS integration to easily tweet while
watching Apple TV
 
In the latest version of Twitter for tvOS, the social media service has
brought a new feature that allows you to pair your iOS device with your
Apple TV as an easy way to tweet while watching specific shows and games.

In a tweet today, Twitter announced the newest tvOS Twitter update features
the ability to browse Twitter on the set top box while watching your
favorite content, and then easily tweet with a Handoff-style connection from
Apple TV to an iPhone or iPad.
Adweek heard from Twitter about how the new feature works:
.   Open Twitter on your iOS device and on the same Wi-Fi network as
your Apple TV.
.   Use the Siri remote while in Twitter for Apple TV and long-press for
three seconds.
.   Select @anyone to link your iOS device with your Apple TV.
.   Send any tweet from the live timeline on the TV to your iOS device.
.   Join the conversation on your iOS device and reply, like, retweet or
add images and GIFs.
Twitter TV product manager Ryan Troy also shared a short statement to Adweek
on the update.
People love to tweet while watching their favorite TV shows because it
allows everyone to experience what's happening together. This update,
combined with Twitter's daily programming that's shaped by tweets from the
audience, helps enable true interactive TV.
After the controversial move to raise the 140 character limit to 280,
Twitter is also working on a "Save for Later" feature and just released a
"Happening Now" feature.
Twitter for tvOS and iOS is a free download from the App Store.

Original Article at:
http://9to5mac.com/2017/10/11/twitter-apple-tv-tvos-update/


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Re: Collaborating on a Google doc using an iPad mini, iPhone, or a Mac

[Des Delgadillo]

Personally, ChromeVox is invaluable in learning Google Docs. I tried learning 
it with Voiceover and I got nowhere. Your iOS experience may be better, as I’ve 
heard lots of folks prefer it to the Mac with VO, but ChromeVox really isn’t 
all that hard to learn and works like a charm in Docs, Sheets, and Drive. You 
can even map the ChromeVox key to be the same as the VO key so you don’t have 
to learn all that much.

hTH

—Des


> On Oct 11, 2017, at 4:03 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I am on a committee that has chosen to use Google docs as the platform for 
> collaborative work on documents. That's disappointing to me, because I've 
> never used it and I'm really not feeling like I want to learn a whole new way 
> of doing things at this point, but that's not a choice I have. So, I have a 
> Bluetooth keyboard and an iPad mini or my iPhone 7 Plus. I also have a Mac. I 
> really don't want to learn chrome fox if I don't have to, because I just 
> don't think I'm up for it. So how is Google docs on iOS or under OS X with 
> VoiceOver?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
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