Re: Migrating to Mac mini

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

I don't believe you can, actually. Migration Assistant (which is also run 
post-install) shows you categories of information you'd like to transfer, but 
strangely, Applications is just a single category. I assume that the 
configuration data for your applications would be covered elsewhere, 
regardless. So I generally take the view that migrations should be all or 
nothing: either rely on it to completely restore your system, or don't use it 
at all and manually copy the data and apps you want out of your backups.

Good luck and have fun.

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RE: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[pdevasto0219]

Thank you for patiently trying to help me understand this. My older Mac Mini 
had thunderbolt 2 ports, which as I finally understand now after a little more 
research, is obsolete technology now that thunderbolt 3 and 4 are the standard. 
I did not realize that these ports take the standard USB-C connector. I now 
have a plan for whatever adapters I'm going to need for my new Mac Mini.

Thanks,
Pete

-Original Message-
From: 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
 
Sent: Monday, January 20, 2025 1:18 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

The confusion isn't unreasonable, really. This is the first Mac Mini, I think, 
which has identically-shaped ports with functionally different capabilities.

So to clarify: there are five USB-C ports: three rear, two front. The rear 
ports support both Thunderbolt (Thunderbolt 4 on the standard Mini with speeds 
up to 40 GBPS, Thunderbolt 5 on the Pro Mini with speeds up to 120 GBPS) and 
USB4, with speeds up to 40 GBPS, whilst the two on the front only support USB 
3.2 Gen2, with speeds up to 10 GBPS. You may then use USB adaptors to get an 
A-type port to connect your old accessories and docks.

I hope it helped.

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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   I had long ago decided on the M4 with 512gigs drive for $799.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/20/2025 1:17 PM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries wrote:

The confusion isn't unreasonable, really. This is the first Mac Mini, I think, 
which has identically-shaped ports with functionally different capabilities.

So to clarify: there are five USB-C ports: three rear, two front. The rear 
ports support both Thunderbolt (Thunderbolt 4 on the standard Mini with speeds 
up to 40 GBPS, Thunderbolt 5 on the Pro Mini with speeds up to 120 GBPS) and 
USB4, with speeds up to 40 GBPS, whilst the two on the front only support USB 
3.2 Gen2, with speeds up to 10 GBPS. You may then use USB adaptors to get an 
A-type port to connect your old accessories and docks.

I hope it helped.



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moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
caraqu...@caraquinn.com

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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

The confusion isn't unreasonable, really. This is the first Mac Mini, I think, 
which has identically-shaped ports with functionally different capabilities.

So to clarify: there are five USB-C ports: three rear, two front. The rear 
ports support both Thunderbolt (Thunderbolt 4 on the standard Mini with speeds 
up to 40 GBPS, Thunderbolt 5 on the Pro Mini with speeds up to 120 GBPS) and 
USB4, with speeds up to 40 GBPS, whilst the two on the front only support USB 
3.2 Gen2, with speeds up to 10 GBPS. You may then use USB adaptors to get an 
A-type port to connect your old accessories and docks.

I hope it helped.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

Pete,
   Since I am looking to buy one, I checked the specs for the 3 mini M4 
devices. Same ports on all 3.


On front-
2 USB-C ports, headphone jack

On back-
3 TB-4 ports, HDMI, Ethernet

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/20/2025 9:55 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:

Brad,

  


I really am appreciating your working to clarify the question about ports. I’m 
a bit confused about this sentence:

  


The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports 
on the front of the device.

  


First, are we talking about the one that retails for around $799 US? Isn’t that 
the Silver one?

  


You say 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear”. How many are thunderbolt, and 
how many are USB-C? So sorry to continuing to belabor this topic, but as 
someone else has already said, I think, the specs are very confusing. I’m 
thinking to get the one with 16GB RAM, 512GB drive.

  


Thank so very much,

Pete De Vasto

  


From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of Brad Snyder
Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2025 4:45 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

  


Well, I doubt he lied intentionally.

More likely, he just didn't know what he was talking about.

  


- Brad -


On Jan 19, 2025, at 17:37, Bill Gallik mailto:wfgal...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Well, if it’s true that the new Mac mini has only five USB-Cports than the 
Apple salesman lied…

  




- Sent from Ino Squire's iPhone SE (iOS 18.2.1) via Google Mail

 






On Jan 17, 2025, at 2:49 PM, Bradford Snyder mailto:wb...@swbell.net> > wrote:

The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports 
on the front of the device.

That is a total of 5 ports, not 6.


- Brad -



  


On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik mailto:wfgal...@gmail.com> > wrote:

  


I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy 
USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac 
mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I 
realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to 
discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are 
the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals 
you wish to use with the new computer.

  


Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac 
Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.

  


One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with 
more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that 
I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the 
most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.

  


I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on 
the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.

  


At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!



- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
- “More business is lost every year through”
- “neglect than through any other cause.”
- Rose Kennedy





On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com 
<mailto:pdevasto0...@gmail.com>  wrote:

  


Hello all,

  


I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my 
Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS 
Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new capabilities 
plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate with this new 
phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini in favor of the 
2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, and I’m really 
thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can follow along with the 
new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need it. I do have one big 
concern, which I know has been discussed previously here, and apologize for the 
repeat. But here goes:

  


I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come with 
a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them

RE: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[pdevasto0219]

Brad,

 

I really am appreciating your working to clarify the question about ports. I’m 
a bit confused about this sentence:

 

The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports 
on the front of the device.

 

First, are we talking about the one that retails for around $799 US? Isn’t that 
the Silver one?

 

You say 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear”. How many are thunderbolt, and 
how many are USB-C? So sorry to continuing to belabor this topic, but as 
someone else has already said, I think, the specs are very confusing. I’m 
thinking to get the one with 16GB RAM, 512GB drive.

 

Thank so very much,

Pete De Vasto

 

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of Brad Snyder
Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2025 4:45 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

 

Well, I doubt he lied intentionally.

More likely, he just didn't know what he was talking about.

 

- Brad -


On Jan 19, 2025, at 17:37, Bill Gallik mailto:wfgal...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Well, if it’s true that the new Mac mini has only five USB-Cports than the 
Apple salesman lied…

 



- Sent from Ino Squire's iPhone SE (iOS 18.2.1) via Google Mail  







On Jan 17, 2025, at 2:49 PM, Bradford Snyder mailto:wb...@swbell.net> > wrote:

The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports 
on the front of the device.

That is a total of 5 ports, not 6.


- Brad -



 

On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik mailto:wfgal...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy 
USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac 
mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I 
realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to 
discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are 
the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals 
you wish to use with the new computer.

 

Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac 
Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.

 

One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with 
more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that 
I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the 
most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.

 

I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on 
the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.

 

At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!



- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
- “More business is lost every year through”
- “neglect than through any other cause.”
- Rose Kennedy





On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com 
<mailto:pdevasto0...@gmail.com>  wrote:

 

Hello all,

 

I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my 
Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS 
Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new capabilities 
plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate with this new 
phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini in favor of the 
2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, and I’m really 
thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can follow along with the 
new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need it. I do have one big 
concern, which I know has been discussed previously here, and apologize for the 
repeat. But here goes:

 

I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come with 
a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem is that 
the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run Windows 10 on 
the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love to hear from 
anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac Mini. If people 
have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a five plus year old 
desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Tim,

Thanks for confirming my suspicions.  I remember reading about VO focus bugs 
when 18 came out, but for whatever reason, I only just started experiencing 
them  myself either with the last 18.1 or the 18.2 update.  I can’t remember 
exactly when it started, because the first couple of times, I just thought it 
was a fluke.  Anyway, I will definitely try your suggestion next time.  I’ve 
tried turning VO on and off, but I hadn’t tried swiping to another page while 
VO was off.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 19, 2025, at 4:25 PM, tim m  wrote:
> 
> For your info, this happends to be a bug.
> 
> To get out just turn off voiceover and swipe left or right for another page. 
> Then turn voiceover back on.
> 
> I did a screen share and file send for that bug and still no fix for it and a 
> few more bugs, and that was when 18 first came out..
> 
> On 1/12/2025 1:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
>> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple 
>> so kindly provided for us. 
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard... 
>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no. 
>> My e-Mail: 
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com <mailto:ancient.ali...@icloud.com> 
>> 
>> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>> Hi Pete, 
>>> 
>>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping 
>>> gestures not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related 
>>> problem.  Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going 
>>> until the volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just turn 
>>> the volume back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of 
>>> annoying.  The one thing that seems to be different about the App Library 
>>> thing, is that it seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  
>>> And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  
>>> Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by oping the app 
>>> switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home 
>>> Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and 
>>> send it to Accessibility. 
>>> Cheers, 
>>> Donna 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com 
>>>> <mailto:pdevasto0...@gmail.com> wrote: 
>>>> 
>>>> Donna, 
>>>> 
>>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>>> code. 
>>>> 
>>>> Pete De Vasto 
>>>> 
>>>> -Original Message- 
>>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries  
>>>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> 
>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM 
>>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> 
>>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library? 
>>>> 
>>>> 3 finger swipe right. 
>>>> 
>>>>  From E.T.'s Keyboard... 
>>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no. 
>>>> My e-Mail: 
>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com <mailto:ancient.ali...@icloud.com> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>>> Hi all, 
>>>>> 
>>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t 
>>>>> want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing 
>>>>> this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App 
>>>>> Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my 
>>>>> regular Home Screen. 
>>>>> TIA, 
>>>>> Donna 
>>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>>> Visionaries list. 
>>>> 
>>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the r

Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[Brad Snyder]

Well, I doubt he lied intentionally.More likely, he just didn't know what he was talking about.- Brad -On Jan 19, 2025, at 17:37, Bill Gallik  wrote:Well, if it’s true that the new Mac mini has only five USB-Cports than the Apple salesman lied…- Sent from Ino Squire's iPhone SE (iOS 18.2.1) via Google Mail      On Jan 17, 2025, at 2:49 PM, Bradford Snyder  wrote:The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports on the front of the device.That is a total of 5 ports, not 6.
- Brad -


On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik  wrote:I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals you wish to use with the new computer.Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.
I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin- “More business is lost every year through”- “neglect than through any other cause.”- Rose Kennedy

On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:Hello all, I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes: I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini.  I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move. I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again I do apologize for repeating this question. Pete De Vasto-- The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com The archives for this list can be searched at:http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@g

Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[Bill Gallik]

Well, if it’s true that the new Mac mini has only five USB-Cports than the Apple salesman lied…- Sent from Ino Squire's iPhone SE (iOS 18.2.1) via Google Mail      On Jan 17, 2025, at 2:49 PM, Bradford Snyder  wrote:The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports on the front of the device.That is a total of 5 ports, not 6.
- Brad -


On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik  wrote:I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals you wish to use with the new computer.Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.
I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin- “More business is lost every year through”- “neglect than through any other cause.”- Rose Kennedy

On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:Hello all, I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes: I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini.  I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move. I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again I do apologize for repeating this question. Pete De Vasto-- The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com The archives for this list can be searched at:http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/011a01db6914%2463bb18f0%242b314ad0%24%40gmail.com.

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Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

[tim m]

For your info, this happends to be a bug.

To get out just turn off voiceover and swipe left or right for another 
page. Then turn voiceover back on.


I did a screen share and file send for that bug and still no fix for it 
and a few more bugs, and that was when 18 first came out..


On 1/12/2025 1:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries wrote:
   I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that 
Apple so kindly provided for us.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi Pete,

Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping 
gestures not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a 
related problem.  Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, 
it keeps going until the volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal 
with, you just turn the volume back down using the side buttons, but 
it’s still kind of annoying.  The one thing that seems to be 
different about the App Library thing, is that it seems to happen 
most often when I’m unlocking my phone. And yeah, it’s impossible to 
exit the App Library when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been able to 
get out of the App Library by oping the app switcher, then going into 
an app from there, and then exiting to my Home Screen, but that 
doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and send it to 
Accessibility.

Cheers,
Donna



On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:

Donna,

This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've 
reliably found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask 
Siri: "hey siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want 
to do it, you say yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds 
after you enter your pass code.


Pete De Vasto

-Original Message-
From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

    3 finger swipe right.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi all,

A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my 
phone, it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be 
there, and don’t want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  
Anyone else experiencing this? Or does anyone know how to stop it 
or at least close the App Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem 
to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.

TIA,
Donna


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Re: Audio Hubs

[Lorie McCloud]

what about anaudio interface? when I was asking about a mixer that’s what I was 
directed to.

> On Jan 19, 2025, at 2:00 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Dave and Phil,
> 
>I have a mixer but was wanting to reduce its footprint, but am convinced 
> to stay with the mixer. Thanks.
> 
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/19/2025 9:27 AM, Phil Halton wrote:
>> A Behringer eight channel mixer comes immediately to mind. They’re cheap they
>> work. I use them for similar purposes quite a lot.
>> Sent from my IPhone
>> 
>> 
>> > On Jan 19, 2025, at 1:24 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
>> >
>> > Might be able to find a small mixer that would do the job nicely, and 
>> > allow > you to pre-adjust the volume levels if they are different.
>> >
>> >
>> > Dave Carlson
>> > Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer
>> >
>> > On Jan 18, 2025, at 6:48 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries > 
>> >  wrote:
>> >
>> > Hello,
>> >Is there such a thing? I want to be able to connect 3 or 4 sources one 
>> > of > which is the mac, and easily switch between them.
>> >
>> > From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> > Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>> > My e-Mail:
>> > ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> >
>> > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
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Re: Audio Hubs

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

Dave and Phil,

   I have a mixer but was wanting to reduce its footprint, but am 
convinced to stay with the mixer. Thanks.



From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/19/2025 9:27 AM, Phil Halton wrote:

A Behringer eight channel mixer comes immediately to mind. They’re cheap they
work. I use them for similar purposes quite a lot.
Sent from my IPhone


> On Jan 19, 2025, at 1:24 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
>
> Might be able to find a small mixer that would do the job nicely, and allow 
> you to pre-adjust the volume levels if they are different.

>
>
> Dave Carlson
> Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer
>
> On Jan 18, 2025, at 6:48 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:

>
> Hello,
>Is there such a thing? I want to be able to connect 3 or 4 sources one of 
> which is the mac, and easily switch between them.

>
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>
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Re: Audio Hubs

[Phil Halton]

A Behringer eight channel mixer comes immediately to mind. They’re cheap they work. I use them for similar purposes quite a lot.Sent from my IPhoneOn Jan 19, 2025, at 1:24 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:Might be able to find a small mixer that would do the job nicely, and allow you to pre-adjust the volume levels if they are different.
	Dave CarlsonFarfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer

On Jan 18, 2025, at 6:48 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries  wrote:Hello,   Is there such a thing? I want to be able to connect 3 or 4 sources one of which is the mac, and easily switch between them.From E.T.'s Keyboard...Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.My e-Mail:ancient.ali...@icloud.com-- The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list.If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.comThe archives for this list can be searched at:http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/e820e235-8dbc-46a0-be9e-6d9766a47d18%40icloud.com.



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Re: Audio Hubs

[Dave Carlson]

Might be able to find a small mixer that would do the job nicely, and allow you 
to pre-adjust the volume levels if they are different.


Dave Carlson
Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer

On Jan 18, 2025, at 6:48 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

Hello,
   Is there such a thing? I want to be able to connect 3 or 4 sources one of 
which is the mac, and easily switch between them.

>From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

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Re: UTM and VMWare

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

I need to do some testing to confirm it (or hear from others who have) but 
unfortunately I strongly suspect that MS have broken the Windows 11 24H2 
installer so that it no longer supports USB audio during initial setup. This is 
rumoured to affect both Intel and Apple Silicon. If so then, first of all, boo 
to Microsoft, and second you may have to rely on OCR or sighted help to get 
through that stage of the installation (unless you know how to use "Answer" 
files, which is a whole different kettle of fish).

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Re: Monitors for Mac mini

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

Pete,

   Is the HDMI port on the back side along with the Thunderbolt ports?


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/17/2025 11:55 PM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Certainly there are differences between HDMI and Thunderbolt, but for your 
purposes, that doesn't matter and in fact there's a clear benefit to using 
HDMI, namely, it frees up a Thunderbolt/USB port. Which you most certainly want 
to do, if all you intend to do is attach a monitor.

Of course, we don't know what you're intent on purchasing, but we suppose that 
if your monitor has downstream USB or Thunderbolt ports that you intend to use, 
probably you will already be aware that Thunderbolt is the only option 
available. But if, as I suspect, you're just aiming for visual output, then 
HDMI is clearly the better option.



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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

Correct, the 2014 Mac Mini runs, at least if one uses a supported 
configuration, macOS Monterey at the latest.

Fusion is now a free download, and you can use it to run the ARM64 version of 
Windows, which can also be freely downloaded but must then be activated by a 
valid license key (resellers of varying provenance are happy to sell you keys 
at a very reasonable price, but any existing key will also work if it’s not in 
use). I cannot stress enough, though, the need to upgrade the RAM from the base 
8 GB of the Mini in order to make this a good experience. Aim as high as you 
possibly can. Even then, you need to be aware that the ARM64 version of Windows 
is different from the x86-64 version (for Intel processors), and that 
especially where drivers and system software is concerned, there’s a high 
probability of incompatibility unless the vendor has provided software for the 
ARM version of Windows; software emulation of Intel processors only works for 
typical user-facing applications. So while moving to a new Mac Mini is highly 
encouraged, you need to think carefully about whether you can still do it all 
in one machine when you take your Windows apps into account. Check if the 
vendor provides the necessary drivers for Windows-on-ARM.

There is another thought that occurs. Depending on the age of your PC, you 
could consider using it just for those problematic Windows apps. It might be 
more tolerable if you nuke-and-pave and fresh-install everything, targeting 
unnecessary bloat and software. This is clearly a cost-saving exercise, because 
new Windows PCs are already pretty cheap, at the low end. Your 2014 Mac Mini, 
sadly, cannot run Windows 11, because the processor is far too old. It could 
continue to run Windows 10, but this puts it very close to end-of-life, unless 
you’re prepared to pay a subscription charge just to receive security updates. 
Maybe Microsoft will have a change of heart but I sincerely doubt this, so I 
don’t recommend taking your chances unless your PC can run Windows 11. Having 
access to both machines provides a simple, if less elegant, solution to the 
problem of compatibility with Windows apps.

The new Minis have 3 USB-C ports and 2 USB-A ports, as well as Ethernet, audio 
and HDMI. You can of course connect downstream ports through docks via 
Thunderbolt or USB using either type of port. The Mini is powered by a 
dedicated power socket.

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Re: Monitors for Mac mini

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

Certainly there are differences between HDMI and Thunderbolt, but for your 
purposes, that doesn't matter and in fact there's a clear benefit to using 
HDMI, namely, it frees up a Thunderbolt/USB port. Which you most certainly want 
to do, if all you intend to do is attach a monitor.

Of course, we don't know what you're intent on purchasing, but we suppose that 
if your monitor has downstream USB or Thunderbolt ports that you intend to use, 
probably you will already be aware that Thunderbolt is the only option 
available. But if, as I suspect, you're just aiming for visual output, then 
HDMI is clearly the better option.

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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[mr.robertcole via MacVisionaries]

Hi,
I got Windows 11 Arm running on my m4 Mac Mini.
After jumping through some hoops getting the free home use version of VMWare 
Fusion downloaded,
I was able to install Windows 11 Arm.
I had to use VOCR to read the screen after starting the VM.
It was on a boot screen. pressing enter started the setup process.
I cant be sure, But I think I used my USB sound card to use Narrator while 
installing.
You can download Windows 11 from the VMWare Fusion app when creating the new VM.

Rob

> On Jan 17, 2025, at 2:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Hello all,
>  
> I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my 
> Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS 
> Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new 
> capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate 
> with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini 
> in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, 
> and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can 
> follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need 
> it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously 
> here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:
>  
> I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come 
> with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem 
> is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run 
> Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love 
> to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac 
> Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a 
> five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini. 
>  
> I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks 
> I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so 
> that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move.
>  
> I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again 
> I do apologize for repeating this question.
>  
> Pete De Vasto
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
>  
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>  
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at:  
> mk...@ucla.edu  and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can 
> reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com 
>  
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   What port does the power use? Thanks.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/17/2025 12:49 PM, Bradford Snyder wrote:

The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports 
on the front of the device.
That is a total of 5 ports, not 6.

- Brad -



On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik  wrote:

I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy 
USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac 
mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I 
realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to 
discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are 
the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals 
you wish to use with the new computer.

Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac 
Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.

One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with 
more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that 
I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the 
most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.

I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on 
the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.

At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!


- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
- “More business is lost every year through”
- “neglect than through any other cause.”
- Rose Kennedy



On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

Hello all,
  
I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:
  
I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini.
  
I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move.
  
I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again I do apologize for repeating this question.
  
Pete De Vasto


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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   I solved the connection problem after buying the 2020 Macbook Pro. I 
order I think Belkin hubs with 2 each of the old ISB style and USB C 
connections.



From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/17/2025 12:30 PM, Bill Gallik wrote:

I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy 
USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac 
mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I 
realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to 
discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are 
the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals 
you wish to use with the new computer.

Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac 
Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.

One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with 
more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that 
I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the 
most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.

I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on 
the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.

At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!


- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
- “More business is lost every year through”
- “neglect than through any other cause.”
- Rose Kennedy



On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:

Hello all,
  
I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:
  
I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini.
  
I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move.
  
I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again I do apologize for repeating this question.
  
Pete De Vasto


--
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list.
  
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To view this discuss

Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[Herbie Allen]

I have had no issues with USB hubs.

> On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik  wrote:
> 
> I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to 
> buy USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new 
> Mac mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my 
> iPhone I realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple 
> directly to discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, 
> but they are the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any 
> legacy peripherals you wish to use with the new computer.
> 
> Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 
> Mac Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
> peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
> whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
> USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini 
> arrives.
> 
> One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
> having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
> with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
> you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through 
> with more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s 
> just that I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and 
> including the most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite 
> fascinating.
> 
> I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
> with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
> performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
> between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” 
> on the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.
> 
> At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!
> 
> 
> - Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
> - “More business is lost every year through”
> - “neglect than through any other cause.”
> - Rose Kennedy
> 
> 
>> On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello all,
>>  
>> I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my 
>> Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS 
>> Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new 
>> capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely 
>> integrate with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old 
>> Mac Mini in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 
>> 2024 iMac, and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine 
>> so I can follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she 
>> might need it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed 
>> previously here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:
>>  
>> I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come 
>> with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem 
>> is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run 
>> Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love 
>> to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac 
>> Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a 
>> five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini. 
>>  
>> I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the 
>> folks I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple 
>> systems, so that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move.
>>  
>> I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once 
>> again I do apologize for repeating this question.
>>  
>> Pete De Vasto
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>>  
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>  
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: 
>> mk...@ucla.edu  and your owner is Cara Quinn - you 
>> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com 
>>  
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
>> .
>> 

Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[Bill Gallik]

I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy 
USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac 
mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I 
realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to 
discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are 
the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals 
you wish to use with the new computer.

Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac 
Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.

One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with 
more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that 
I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the 
most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.

I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on 
the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.

At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!


- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
- “More business is lost every year through”
- “neglect than through any other cause.”
- Rose Kennedy


> On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Hello all,
>  
> I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my 
> Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS 
> Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new 
> capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate 
> with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini 
> in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, 
> and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can 
> follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need 
> it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously 
> here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:
>  
> I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come 
> with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem 
> is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run 
> Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love 
> to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac 
> Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a 
> five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini. 
>  
> I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks 
> I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so 
> that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move.
>  
> I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again 
> I do apologize for repeating this question.
>  
> Pete De Vasto
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
>  
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>  
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: 
> mk...@ucla.edu  and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can 
> reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com 
>  
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ 
> 
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
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> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
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>  
> 

Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

[Bradford Snyder]

The new Mac mini has 3 USB-C/Thunderbolt ports on the rear, and 2 USB-C ports 
on the front of the device.
That is a total of 5 ports, not 6.

- Brad -



On Jan 17, 2025, at 14:30, Bill Gallik  wrote:

I just ordered a new Mac mini and want to caution you that you will need to buy 
USB adapters for any peripherals you want to be able to use with a new Mac 
mini.  When I searched for a Mac Mini via the Apple Store app on my iPhone I 
realized that the specs were a bit unfamiliar so I called Apple directly to 
discuss configuration options.  The new Minis have 6 USB ports, but they are 
the newer USB-C ports so adapters must be purchased for any legacy peripherals 
you wish to use with the new computer.

Apple does sell the adapters at approximately $20/unit.  On my current 2014 Mac 
Mini I’ve installed a USB extension capable of linking such configured 
peripherals to the Mac via a single on-board USB port.  It remains to be seen 
whether or not I’ll be able to use that “USB Multiplying extension” via the 
USB-C adapters.  I’ll certainly offer my discovery once my new Mac Mini arrives.

One other thought to note however, my Mac Mini is likewise a late 2014 model; 
having bought it in February 2015.  I have no issues keeping this Mac updated 
with recent MacOS upgrades.  Frankly, I was quite surprised when I read that 
you had gone back to MS-Windows because you weren’t able to follow through with 
more recent upgrades.  I have no intention to be critical here, it’s just that 
I am curious why I was able to continue updating MacOS up to and including the 
most recent version but you were not.  I find this quite fascinating.

I should add here that a couple years ago I replaced the original hard drive 
with an SSD because the original drive was showing profoundly degraded 
performance.  I suppose that could possibly account for the incongruence 
between our similar Mac minis although I believe that to be a “Red Herring” on 
the face of it.  But, I suppose that might account for the difference.

At any rate, best of luck with your endeavor!


- Bill from Bayfield County, Wisconsin
- “More business is lost every year through”
- “neglect than through any other cause.”
- Rose Kennedy


> On Jan 17, 2025, at 1:17 PM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello all,
>  
> I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my 
> Windows PC when I realized I couldn’t upgrade that machine past Mac OS 
> Monterey. Now that I’ve got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new 
> capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely integrate 
> with this new phone, I’m seriously thinking about retiring the old Mac Mini 
> in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a 2024 iMac, 
> and I’m really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine so I can 
> follow along with the new OS’s and be more of a help if/when she might need 
> it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed previously 
> here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:
>  
> I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come 
> with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem 
> is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run 
> Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I’d love 
> to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac 
> Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a 
> five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini. 
>  
> I’m also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the folks 
> I’m working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple systems, so 
> that’s another reason I’m thinking to make the move.
>  
> I’d really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once again 
> I do apologize for repeating this question.
>  
> Pete De Vasto
> 
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Re: Coming Back To Mac From Windows

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

Pete,
   y plan is to but the new Mac mini and after it is setup and working, 
I will ditch VMware and Windows because VMware would need to be upgraded 
for sequoia. I don't need Windows that much anymore.


   Oh indeed, another good reason to go through this is to be inline 
with iOS 18.


   I will likely order the Mac mini next month. So while waiting, I 
will clean up Windows then go from there.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/17/2025 11:17 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:

Hello all,

  


I moved away from the late 2014 Mac Mini that I currently have back to my
Windows PC when I realized I couldn't upgrade that machine past Mac OS
Monterey. Now that I've got the iPhone 16 Pro and with all its new
capabilities plus how well the new Mini sounds like it would nicely
integrate with this new phone, I'm seriously thinking about retiring the old
Mac Mini in favor of the 2024 model. Besides that, My sighted wife has a
2024 iMac, and I'm really thinking it would be good for me to upgrade mine
so I can follow along with the new OS's and be more of a help if/when she
might need it. I do have one big concern, which I know has been discussed
previously here, and apologize for the repeat. But here goes:

  


I have two digital police scanners which have visual menus, but they come
with a cable that lets you connect it to a computer to program them. Problem
is that the app only runs on Windows, no Mac support. I did, in fact, run
Windows 10 on the old Mac Mini with VMWare fusion a while back, so I'd love
to hear from anyone who has been able to get Windows going on the newer Mac
Mini. If people have had good luck doing this, I might be able to retire a
five plus year old desktop PC in addition to the older Mac Mini.

  


I'm also getting into doing some podcasting for the first time, and the
folks I'm working with seem to really be more in favor of using Apple
systems, so that's another reason I'm thinking to make the move.

  


I'd really appreciate any tips or guidance anyone can give me, and once
again I do apologize for repeating this question.

  


Pete De Vasto



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Re: Displaying sender info

['Suzanne Erb' via MacVisionaries]

That always works for me, as well. I don’t like disabling smart addresses, 
because I don’t like to have to use complete addresses if I don’t have to.

Suzanne
> On Jan 16, 2025, at 15:17, Max  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> I forward the email without entering any addresses. I then go down till I 
> find the sender address and read it there.
> Max.
> 
>> On 17 Jan 2025, at 05:51, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I’ve so far failed to find the answer to this: how can I make Mail app on my 
>> mac display the email address of the sender rather than just their name.  I 
>> can locate the headers, interact with them but I can’t seem to be able to 
>> find out the email address of the sender.  This is awkward.  Any suggestions?
>> 
>> Andrew
>> 
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Re: Moving Text Document

[Brad Snyder]

Let me check my iPad keyboard command reference, and get back to you on this.

- Brad -

On Jan 16, 2025, at 18:44, E.T.  wrote:

Brad,

   Those commands did nothing.


>From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/16/2025 2:32 PM, Bradford Snyder wrote:
> This is easy if you are using a keyboard.
> Just use CMD + C, and CMD + OPT + V, respectively just like on a Mac.
> If you are not using a keyboard, it is a little more complicated, in that you 
> have to copy, via Share, and then go back and delete the original.
> I find performing basic file management tasks with iPadOS difficult, and is 
> one of the reasons I have never really been much of an iPad user.
> 
> - Brad -
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 16, 2025, at 15:30, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
>Is it possible to move a text document from iCloud Drive to the home 
> screen of my iPad? Thanks.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 

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Re: Displaying sender info

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

Interesting is right. I’ve never known disabling smart addresses to do 
anything—certainly not show me email addresses, as promised.

But there’s a convenient way to get the address. Interact with the “Header” 
area, and use VO-Shift-Left and VO-Shift-Right to precisely target the embedded 
sender’s name which will appear as a single object. Press VO-Space, and you get 
a nice menu showing you the address, and an option to copy it to the 
pasteboard. This always works.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Moving Text Document

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

Brad,

   Those commands did nothing.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/16/2025 2:32 PM, Bradford Snyder wrote:

This is easy if you are using a keyboard.
Just use CMD + C, and CMD + OPT + V, respectively just like on a Mac.
If you are not using a keyboard, it is a little more complicated, in that you 
have to copy, via Share, and then go back and delete the original.
I find performing basic file management tasks with iPadOS difficult, and is one 
of the reasons I have never really been much of an iPad user.

- Brad -



On Jan 16, 2025, at 15:30, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

Hello,
Is it possible to move a text document from iCloud Drive to the home screen 
of my iPad? Thanks.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com



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Re: Moving Text Document

[Bradford Snyder]

This is easy if you are using a keyboard.
Just use CMD + C, and CMD + OPT + V, respectively just like on a Mac.
If you are not using a keyboard, it is a little more complicated, in that you 
have to copy, via Share, and then go back and delete the original.
I find performing basic file management tasks with iPadOS difficult, and is one 
of the reasons I have never really been much of an iPad user.

- Brad -



On Jan 16, 2025, at 15:30, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

Hello,
   Is it possible to move a text document from iCloud Drive to the home screen 
of my iPad? Thanks.

>From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

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Re: Displaying sender info

[Bradford Snyder]

That’s interesting.
I am running macOS 15.2, Sequoia, and when I go to Mail Settings > Viewing, and 
turn off "Use Smart Addresses", the senders email address is displayed in the 
message header.
Perhaps after turning off Use Smart Addresses, you should close, and then 
reopen the Mail app, and see if the sender’s full address is displayed in the 
message header.

Alternatively, when in the message header, try interacting with the sender’s 
name, and then opening the Shortcut menu using VO + Shift + M, and see if the 
address info is available there.

HTH.


- Brad -



On Jan 16, 2025, at 14:05, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I’ve turned smart addresses off but the headers still display the name only.  
Thanks for the suggestion though.

Andrew

> On 16 Jan 2025, at 18:53, Jonathan C. Cohn  wrote:
> 
> It’s something like smart addresses that you need to look for and turn that 
> off.
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jan 16, 2025, at 12:52 PM, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I’ve so far failed to find the answer to this: how can I make Mail app on my 
>> mac display the email address of the sender rather than just their name.  I 
>> can locate the headers, interact with them but I can’t seem to be able to 
>> find out the email address of the sender.  This is awkward.  Any suggestions?
>> 
>> Andrew
>> 
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To

Re: Displaying sender info

[Max]

Hi,
I forward the email without entering any addresses. I then go down till I find 
the sender address and read it there.
Max.

> On 17 Jan 2025, at 05:51, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I’ve so far failed to find the answer to this: how can I make Mail app on my 
> mac display the email address of the sender rather than just their name.  I 
> can locate the headers, interact with them but I can’t seem to be able to 
> find out the email address of the sender.  This is awkward.  Any suggestions?
> 
> Andrew
> 
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Re: Displaying sender info

['Andrew' via MacVisionaries]

I’ve turned smart addresses off but the headers still display the name only.  
Thanks for the suggestion though.

Andrew

> On 16 Jan 2025, at 18:53, Jonathan C. Cohn  wrote:
> 
> It’s something like smart addresses that you need to look for and turn that 
> off.
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jan 16, 2025, at 12:52 PM, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I’ve so far failed to find the answer to this: how can I make Mail app on my 
>> mac display the email address of the sender rather than just their name.  I 
>> can locate the headers, interact with them but I can’t seem to be able to 
>> find out the email address of the sender.  This is awkward.  Any suggestions?
>> 
>> Andrew
>> 
>> --
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>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
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>> 
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>> 
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> 
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> 
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Re: Displaying sender info

[Jonathan C. Cohn]

It’s something like smart addresses that you need to look for and turn that off.
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 16, 2025, at 12:52 PM, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I’ve so far failed to find the answer to this: how can I make Mail app on my 
> mac display the email address of the sender rather than just their name.  I 
> can locate the headers, interact with them but I can’t seem to be able to 
> find out the email address of the sender.  This is awkward.  Any suggestions?
> 
> Andrew
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
> mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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RE: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

[pdevasto0219]

Actually, at least for me, case connected to USB wall plug via USB cable = 
charger. Let's not get too nit picky, though! LOL Glad all's well that ends 
well.

Pete

-Original Message-
From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 12:58 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

Yep.  I think it’s all good.  I was just surprised that they didn’t include a 
charger.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 15, 2025, at 2:36 PM,  
>  wrote:
> 
> Oh no, Donna! I'm the one who didn't understand you! If you have the case, 
> you should be good to go. When you put the glasses on and start Meta View on 
> the phone, does it tell you that glasses are connected and the battery is at 
> X percent? So sorry for the misunderstanding!
> 
> Pete
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 12:34 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
> 
> Pete, I’m confused.  I have the case, so that’s not an issue.  Is there any 
> reason to purchase a special charger?
> Thanks,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 15, 2025, at 2:29 PM,  
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Donna,
>> 
>> You hopefully already know this, but while you can, in fact, charge your 
>> glasses with any USB cable and charger, you're not going to be able to get 
>> firmware updates for the glasses. That could affect how much you'll be able 
>> to use them in the future with apps like Aira or Be My Eyes. If you have the 
>> means to do it, it probably would be best to go get a case from the meta 
>> store. You just need the case, any USB cable will work.
>> 
>> Pete
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 7:52 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
>> 
>> Hi Pete,
>> 
>> I wanted clear lenses, and Amazon didn’t have them, so I ordered them direct 
>> from Ray-Ban.  I did check, and cable and charger are not included.  Kinda 
>> lame if you ask me, but from what I’ve read, you can use chargers for other 
>> devices as long as they have a minimum of 5V.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 15, 2025, at 9:37 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> 
>>> Donna,
>>> 
>>> Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
>>> include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
>>> double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
>>> description. I'm very surprised!
>>> 
>>> Pete De Vasto
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
>>> To: MacVisionaries 
>>> Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
>>> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but 
>>> am wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use 
>>> an iPad or iPhone adapter?
>>> TIA,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>>> --- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/99876716-583D-4D9C-A7C7-829311BF6C1F%40me.com.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all

Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Yep.  I think it’s all good.  I was just surprised that they didn’t include a 
charger.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 15, 2025, at 2:36 PM,  
>  wrote:
> 
> Oh no, Donna! I'm the one who didn't understand you! If you have the case, 
> you should be good to go. When you put the glasses on and start Meta View on 
> the phone, does it tell you that glasses are connected and the battery is at 
> X percent? So sorry for the misunderstanding!
> 
> Pete
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 12:34 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
> 
> Pete, I’m confused.  I have the case, so that’s not an issue.  Is there any 
> reason to purchase a special charger?
> Thanks,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 15, 2025, at 2:29 PM,  
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Donna,
>> 
>> You hopefully already know this, but while you can, in fact, charge your 
>> glasses with any USB cable and charger, you're not going to be able to get 
>> firmware updates for the glasses. That could affect how much you'll be able 
>> to use them in the future with apps like Aira or Be My Eyes. If you have the 
>> means to do it, it probably would be best to go get a case from the meta 
>> store. You just need the case, any USB cable will work.
>> 
>> Pete
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 7:52 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
>> 
>> Hi Pete,
>> 
>> I wanted clear lenses, and Amazon didn’t have them, so I ordered them direct 
>> from Ray-Ban.  I did check, and cable and charger are not included.  Kinda 
>> lame if you ask me, but from what I’ve read, you can use chargers for other 
>> devices as long as they have a minimum of 5V.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 15, 2025, at 9:37 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> 
>>> Donna,
>>> 
>>> Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
>>> include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
>>> double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
>>> description. I'm very surprised!
>>> 
>>> Pete De Vasto
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
>>> To: MacVisionaries 
>>> Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
>>> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but 
>>> am wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use 
>>> an iPad or iPhone adapter?
>>> TIA,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>>> --- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/99876716-583D-4D9C-A7C7-829311BF6C1F%40me.com.
>>> 
>>> -- 
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>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries l

RE: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

[pdevasto0219]

Oh no, Donna! I'm the one who didn't understand you! If you have the case, you 
should be good to go. When you put the glasses on and start Meta View on the 
phone, does it tell you that glasses are connected and the battery is at X 
percent? So sorry for the misunderstanding!

Pete

-Original Message-
From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 12:34 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

Pete, I’m confused.  I have the case, so that’s not an issue.  Is there any 
reason to purchase a special charger?
Thanks,
Donna


> On Jan 15, 2025, at 2:29 PM,  
>  wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> You hopefully already know this, but while you can, in fact, charge your 
> glasses with any USB cable and charger, you're not going to be able to get 
> firmware updates for the glasses. That could affect how much you'll be able 
> to use them in the future with apps like Aira or Be My Eyes. If you have the 
> means to do it, it probably would be best to go get a case from the meta 
> store. You just need the case, any USB cable will work.
> 
> Pete
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 7:52 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
> 
> Hi Pete,
> 
> I wanted clear lenses, and Amazon didn’t have them, so I ordered them direct 
> from Ray-Ban.  I did check, and cable and charger are not included.  Kinda 
> lame if you ask me, but from what I’ve read, you can use chargers for other 
> devices as long as they have a minimum of 5V.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 15, 2025, at 9:37 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>> 
>> Donna,
>> 
>> Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
>> include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
>> double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
>> description. I'm very surprised!
>> 
>> Pete De Vasto
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
>> To: MacVisionaries 
>> Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
>> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but am 
>> wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use an 
>> iPad or iPhone adapter?
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/99876716-583D-4D9C-A7C7-829311BF6C1F%40me.com.
>> 
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>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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>> To vi

Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Pete, I’m confused.  I have the case, so that’s not an issue.  Is there any 
reason to purchase a special charger?
Thanks,
Donna


> On Jan 15, 2025, at 2:29 PM,  
>  wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> You hopefully already know this, but while you can, in fact, charge your 
> glasses with any USB cable and charger, you're not going to be able to get 
> firmware updates for the glasses. That could affect how much you'll be able 
> to use them in the future with apps like Aira or Be My Eyes. If you have the 
> means to do it, it probably would be best to go get a case from the meta 
> store. You just need the case, any USB cable will work.
> 
> Pete
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 7:52 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
> 
> Hi Pete,
> 
> I wanted clear lenses, and Amazon didn’t have them, so I ordered them direct 
> from Ray-Ban.  I did check, and cable and charger are not included.  Kinda 
> lame if you ask me, but from what I’ve read, you can use chargers for other 
> devices as long as they have a minimum of 5V.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 15, 2025, at 9:37 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>> 
>> Donna,
>> 
>> Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
>> include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
>> double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
>> description. I'm very surprised!
>> 
>> Pete De Vasto
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
>> To: MacVisionaries 
>> Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
>> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but am 
>> wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use an 
>> iPad or iPhone adapter?
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/99876716-583D-4D9C-A7C7-829311BF6C1F%40me.com.
>> 
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>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
>> mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>

RE: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

[pdevasto0219]

Donna,

You hopefully already know this, but while you can, in fact, charge your 
glasses with any USB cable and charger, you're not going to be able to get 
firmware updates for the glasses. That could affect how much you'll be able to 
use them in the future with apps like Aira or Be My Eyes. If you have the means 
to do it, it probably would be best to go get a case from the meta store. You 
just need the case, any USB cable will work.

Pete

-Original Message-
From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2025 7:52 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

Hi Pete,

I wanted clear lenses, and Amazon didn’t have them, so I ordered them direct 
from Ray-Ban.  I did check, and cable and charger are not included.  Kinda lame 
if you ask me, but from what I’ve read, you can use chargers for other devices 
as long as they have a minimum of 5V.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 15, 2025, at 9:37 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
> include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
> double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
> description. I'm very surprised!
> 
> Pete De Vasto
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
> To: MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but am 
> wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use an 
> iPad or iPhone adapter?
> TIA,
> Donna
> 
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Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Pete,

I wanted clear lenses, and Amazon didn’t have them, so I ordered them direct 
from Ray-Ban.  I did check, and cable and charger are not included.  Kinda lame 
if you ask me, but from what I’ve read, you can use chargers for other devices 
as long as they have a minimum of 5V.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 15, 2025, at 9:37 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
> include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
> double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
> description. I'm very surprised!
> 
> Pete De Vasto
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
> To: MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but am 
> wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use an 
> iPad or iPhone adapter?
> TIA,
> Donna
> 
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RE: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

[pdevasto0219]

Donna,

Where did you order them from? I got mine from Amazon, and my bundle did 
include a case/charger plus a USB cable. If you've not done so already, 
double-check to see if you can find a "what's included" section in the 
description. I'm very surprised!

Pete De Vasto

-Original Message-
From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2025 6:58 PM
To: MacVisionaries 
Subject: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

Hi all,

So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but am 
wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use an iPad 
or iPhone adapter?
TIA,
Donna

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Re: YouTube to MP3 app by humanware

[Bradford Snyder]

First of all, the application YouTube to MP3 is from a company called 
MediaHuman, not Humanware.
I have been using this application on my Mac for years, and while it isn’t 
perfect, I find it to be accessible enough to where I have no problem using it.
I have it installed on my 2022 Mac Studio, running macOS 15.2 Sequoia, and just 
used it to successfully convert a YouTube URL to an MP3 file without issue.

If you are having a problem using this app, I suggest going to the 
MediaHuman.com  website, and downloading the latest 
release, and replace whatever version you currently have, with the latest 
update.

HTH. 

- Brad -



On Jan 14, 2025, at 22:50, 'Dan Eickmeier' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I’d highly recommend an app called Downey for doing 
this.  Have been using it for years now, and it’s awesome.  

> On Jan 11, 2025, at 8:38 PM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
> 
> I sometimes use this site, but it can be tricky with extra downloads. 
> https://y2mate.nu/en-ADzn/
> 
>> On Jan 11, 2025, at 17:24, Phil Halton  wrote:
>> 
>> Since upgrading to Sonoma or is it Sequoia whatever the latest OS is, this 
>> app which was a great way to pull down audio off of YouTube videos no longer 
>> seems to work. I can copy the link off of the YouTube site but I can’t seem 
>> to paste it into the YouTube to MP3 app. Is anyone else having trouble with 
>> this app? Any workarounds? How about any free, accessible alternative apps?
>> Sent from my IPhone
>> 
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Re: YouTube to MP3 app by humanware

['Dan Eickmeier' via MacVisionaries]

I’d highly recommend an app called Downey for doing 
this.  Have been using it for years now, and it’s awesome.  

> On Jan 11, 2025, at 8:38 PM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
> 
> I sometimes use this site, but it can be tricky with extra downloads. 
> https://y2mate.nu/en-ADzn/
> 
>> On Jan 11, 2025, at 17:24, Phil Halton  wrote:
>> 
>> Since upgrading to Sonoma or is it Sequoia whatever the latest OS is, this 
>> app which was a great way to pull down audio off of YouTube videos no longer 
>> seems to work. I can copy the link off of the YouTube site but I can’t seem 
>> to paste it into the YouTube to MP3 app. Is anyone else having trouble with 
>> this app? Any workarounds? How about any free, accessible alternative apps?
>> Sent from my IPhone
>> 
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> 
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Re: Charging Ray-ban glasses?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi all,

Please disregard last message. I found a video where some guy was charging them 
with the charger for his MacBook, so that’s what I’m doing.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 14, 2025, at 8:58 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> So my Ray ban smart glasses finally arrived.  I was surprised to learn that 
> they do not come with either cable or charger.  I have a USB-C cable, but am 
> wondering what adapter you all use with yours?  Any reason I can’t use an 
> iPad or iPhone adapter?
> TIA,
> Donna
> 

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Re: Messenger app on mac running Sequoia

[Herbie Allen]

Yes

> On Jan 14, 2025, at 11:06, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Is the Messenger app accessible on the mac running Sequoia by any chance?  I 
> would normally access Messenger either on my iOS devices or via facebook 
> website on my mac but recently I’ve been having problems with the latter way.
> 
> Andrew
> 
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Re: Thunderbird and VoiceOver.

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   Look on the Tools menu.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/13/2025 7:38 AM, Anders Holmberg wrote:

Hi!
I press vo + m and try to arrow down on the file menu to see what’s there.
For example if I can import things like inboxes and contacts  from the native 
mail app.
/A


10 jan. 2025 kl. 19:23 skrev 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
:

Ok, what menus are you talking about then?


 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/10/2025 9:13 AM, Pipkrokodil.se wrote:

I can not navigate in the menus. I try both with and without quicknav
I am not a squeakertoy


9 jan. 2025 kl. 22:20 skrev E.T. :

Anders,
Explain. The menus work as expected for me. Latest version is 128.6 ESR.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com


On 1/9/2025 12:02 PM, Anders Holmberg wrote:
Hi!
Is anyone here using thunderbird on the Mac?
I have just downloaded  it and find that menus are not working properly.
I guess this is the latest version but is thunderbird working or somewhat 
working or not?
Best.
/A


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Re: Can Meta Glasses read text?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Oh, that’s really good to know.  Thanks for the tip.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 13, 2025, at 10:50 AM, Brett Campbell  wrote:
> 
> In my experience, saying something like read or describe in detail, provides 
> the most comprehensive information.
> 
>> On Jan 13, 2025, at 6:36 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Oh, interesting.  That makes sense.  Thanks, Jessica.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:30 AM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>>> 
>>> It takes some patience, but I’ve done anything from asking them “look and 
>>> tell me what’s in this can” to “look and read the text on this box” for 
>>> example.  Since these glasses are relying on AI, and not OCR, you just have 
>>> to do a lot of playing around with different phrases in regard to asking 
>>> them what you want them to do, and figure out what responses produce the 
>>> results you want.
>>> 
 On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:34 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
  wrote:
 
 Hi all,
 
 Have any of you had luck getting Meta glasses to read text?  If yes, what 
 command did you use?  My glasses should be arriving today, and I’ll be 
 curious to try this feature out.
 Cheers,
 Donna
 
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Re: Can Meta Glasses read text?

[Brett Campbell]

In my experience, saying something like read or describe in detail, provides 
the most comprehensive information.

> On Jan 13, 2025, at 6:36 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Oh, interesting.  That makes sense.  Thanks, Jessica.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:30 AM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>> 
>> It takes some patience, but I’ve done anything from asking them “look and 
>> tell me what’s in this can” to “look and read the text on this box” for 
>> example.  Since these glasses are relying on AI, and not OCR, you just have 
>> to do a lot of playing around with different phrases in regard to asking 
>> them what you want them to do, and figure out what responses produce the 
>> results you want.
>> 
>>> On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:34 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> Have any of you had luck getting Meta glasses to read text?  If yes, what 
>>> command did you use?  My glasses should be arriving today, and I’ll be 
>>> curious to try this feature out.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
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Re: Thunderbird and VoiceOver.

[Anders Holmberg]

Hi!
I press vo + m and try to arrow down on the file menu to see what’s there.
For example if I can import things like inboxes and contacts  from the native 
mail app.
/A

> 10 jan. 2025 kl. 19:23 skrev 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
> :
> 
>Ok, what menus are you talking about then?
> 
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/10/2025 9:13 AM, Pipkrokodil.se wrote:
>> I can not navigate in the menus. I try both with and without quicknav
>> I am not a squeakertoy
>> 
>>> 9 jan. 2025 kl. 22:20 skrev E.T. :
>>> 
>>> Anders,
>>>Explain. The menus work as expected for me. Latest version is 128.6 ESR.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>> My e-Mail:
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
 On 1/9/2025 12:02 PM, Anders Holmberg wrote:
 Hi!
 Is anyone here using thunderbird on the Mac?
 I have just downloaded  it and find that menus are not working properly.
 I guess this is the latest version but is thunderbird working or somewhat 
 working or not?
 Best.
 /A
 
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Re: Can Meta Glasses read text?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Oh, interesting.  That makes sense.  Thanks, Jessica.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:30 AM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> It takes some patience, but I’ve done anything from asking them “look and 
> tell me what’s in this can” to “look and read the text on this box” for 
> example.  Since these glasses are relying on AI, and not OCR, you just have 
> to do a lot of playing around with different phrases in regard to asking them 
> what you want them to do, and figure out what responses produce the results 
> you want.
> 
>> On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:34 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Have any of you had luck getting Meta glasses to read text?  If yes, what 
>> command did you use?  My glasses should be arriving today, and I’ll be 
>> curious to try this feature out.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
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Re: Can Meta Glasses read text?

[Jessica Moss]

It takes some patience, but I’ve done anything from asking them “look and tell 
me what’s in this can” to “look and read the text on this box” for example.  
Since these glasses are relying on AI, and not OCR, you just have to do a lot 
of playing around with different phrases in regard to asking them what you want 
them to do, and figure out what responses produce the results you want.

> On Jan 13, 2025, at 7:34 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Have any of you had luck getting Meta glasses to read text?  If yes, what 
> command did you use?  My glasses should be arriving today, and I’ll be 
> curious to try this feature out.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
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Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from Moderator Mark)

[Eric Oyen]

I hear quite a few discussions about Mac stuff over there, not just iOS. In 
some ways, consolidating a community can have benefits. Just wish groups.io 
<http://groups.io/> didn’t have their subscription policy for new lists (yes, 
it can get pricey if one has a new list and a lot of members subscribing).

-Eric


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 10:50 AM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I’m centrally interested in discussing the Mac as well, thus I think there’s 
> room for a Mac-oriented VoiceOver and accessibility mailing list which isn’t 
> dominated by iOS users who aren’t also Mac users.
>  
> 
> From: 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
> 
> Date: Saturday, January 11, 2025 at 09:59
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> Subject: Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from 
> Moderator Mark)
> 
> The address to subscribe is blindapples+subscr...@groups.io . If you have a 
> groups.io account, you can of course also log in and subscribe that way as 
> well. You can't post to the list address until you're a subscriber.
> 
> Bear in mind that this list is for all Apple, which means it's dominated by 
> iOS users. For myself, this is tolerable, but I am mostly on this list to 
> talk about Mac predominantly.
> 
> Cheers,
> Sabahattin
> 
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Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Chanelle,

I experience the App Switcher issue, as well.  Again, not all the time, but 
enough that it’s something of an annoyance.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 2:21 PM, Chanelle Allen  wrote:
> 
> I get stuck in the App Library when connecting or disconnecting my Braille 
> display unless I make sure that focus is inside an app. I am using iOS 18.2 
> on an iPhone 13 Pro. I cannot use my braille display to get out of the App 
> Library. I either have to do the home gesture or swipe three fingers, then 
> touch somewhere in the middle of the screen for focus to be placed on my home 
> screen. I have tried disabling the settings relating to library. Also, when 
> using the three finger swipe gesture to close an app in the app switcher, 
> sometimes the wrong app is closed. I rely entirely on VoiceOver and never let 
> anyone else touch my phone.
> Regards,
> Chanelle
> 
> On Jan 12, 2025, at 13:21, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
> had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve noticed 
> that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more slippy than it 
> used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, it is often the 
> case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>   I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
>> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple 
>> so kindly provided for us.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>> Hi Pete,
>>> 
>>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping 
>>> gestures not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related 
>>> problem.  Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going 
>>> until the volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just turn 
>>> the volume back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of 
>>> annoying.  The one thing that seems to be different about the App Library 
>>> thing, is that it seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  
>>> And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  
>>> Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by oping the app 
>>> switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home 
>>> Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and 
>>> send it to Accessibility.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Donna,
>>>> 
>>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>>> code.
>>>> 
>>>> Pete De Vasto
>>>> 
>>>> -Original Message-
>>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>>> 
>>>>   3 finger swipe right.
>>>> 
>>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>>> My e-Mail:
>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>>> 
>>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> 
>>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t 
>>>>> want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing 
>>>>> this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App 
>>>>> Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my 
>>>>> regular Home Sc

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Andrew,

After I saw that others reported experiencing this issue, I did report it to 
accessibility.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 2:07 PM, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I feel we should all be reporting these issues to Apple Accessibility so that 
> Accessibility in general won’t slip and drift towards unacceptable.  I can’t 
> imagine giving up Voiceover and yet recently it’s crossed my mind.  That 
> would mean giving up Apple and it would be a costly and difficult upheaval.
> 
> Andrew 
> 
>> On 12 Jan 2025, at 19:21, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
>> had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve 
>> noticed that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more 
>> slippy than it used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, 
>> it is often the case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>>  I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
>>> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that 
>>> Apple so kindly provided for us.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>> My e-Mail:
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>> Hi Pete,
>>>> 
>>>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>>>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping 
>>>> gestures not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related 
>>>> problem.  Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps 
>>>> going until the volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just 
>>>> turn the volume back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of 
>>>> annoying.  The one thing that seems to be different about the App Library 
>>>> thing, is that it seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  
>>>> And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  
>>>> Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by oping the app 
>>>> switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home 
>>>> Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and 
>>>> send it to Accessibility.
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Donna
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Donna,
>>>>> 
>>>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>>>> code.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Pete De Vasto
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Original Message-
>>>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>>>> 
>>>>>  3 finger swipe right.
>>>>> 
>>>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>>>> My e-Mail:
>>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and 
>>>>>> don’t want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else 
>>>>>> experiencing this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close 
>>>>>> the App Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to 
>>>>>> my regular Home Screen.
>>>>>> TIA,
>>>>>> Don

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Well, if it’s my user error, then it’s a lot of other people‘s as well. If 
you’ve been following this thread, several of us are having the same issue. I’m 
finding that gestures to exit don’t  work consistently. So, the three finger 
gesture that you mentioned, sometimes works but, but often does not. The same 
with the gesture that Brad mentioned. Swiping up with one finger sometimes 
works, but sometimes does not. It’s a weird voice over focus thing. I’m glad 
for you that you’re not experiencing it, but apparently several of us are.
Cheers,
Donna
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 12, 2025, at 3:42 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>    Hate to say it but it indeed sounds like user error. The gestures that 
> apply to the home screen apply to the app library, There is nothing unique 
> required for navigating the app library.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 1/12/2025 11:21 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
>> had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve 
>> noticed that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more 
>> slippy than it used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, 
>> it is often the case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>>I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
>>> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that 
>>> Apple so kindly provided for us.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>> My e-Mail:
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>> Hi Pete,
>>>> 
>>>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>>>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping 
>>>> gestures not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related 
>>>> problem.  Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps 
>>>> going until the volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just 
>>>> turn the volume back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of 
>>>> annoying.  The one thing that seems to be different about the App Library 
>>>> thing, is that it seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  
>>>> And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  
>>>> Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by oping the app 
>>>> switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home 
>>>> Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and 
>>>> send it to Accessibility.
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Donna
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Donna,
>>>>> 
>>>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>>>> code.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Pete De Vasto
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Original Message-
>>>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>>>> 
>>>>>3 finger swipe right.
>>>>> 
>>>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>>>> My e-Mail:
>>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I 

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   Hate to say it but it indeed sounds like user error. The gestures 
that apply to the home screen apply to the app library, There is nothing 
unique required for navigating the app library.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/12/2025 11:21 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve noticed 
that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more slippy than it 
used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, it is often the 
case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
Cheers,
Donna



On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple so kindly 
provided for us.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi Pete,

Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super annoying!  
I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures not stopping 
when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  Sometimes, when I 
swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the volume is at 100%.  
This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume back down using the side 
buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one thing that seems to be 
different about the App Library thing, is that it seems to happen most often 
when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library 
when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by 
oping the app switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to 
my Home Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead 
and send it to Accessibility.
Cheers,
Donna



On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:

Donna,

This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably found to get out 
of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey siri, restart my device". 
She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say yes, and the phone is back up in a few 
seconds after you enter your pass code.

Pete De Vasto

-Original Message-
From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

3 finger swipe right.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi all,

A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, it 
takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t want to 
be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing this? Or does 
anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App Library? Once I’m in 
there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.
TIA,
Donna


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Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

[Chanelle Allen]

I get stuck in the App Library when connecting or disconnecting my Braille 
display unless I make sure that focus is inside an app. I am using iOS 18.2 on 
an iPhone 13 Pro. I cannot use my braille display to get out of the App 
Library. I either have to do the home gesture or swipe three fingers, then 
touch somewhere in the middle of the screen for focus to be placed on my home 
screen. I have tried disabling the settings relating to library. Also, when 
using the three finger swipe gesture to close an app in the app switcher, 
sometimes the wrong app is closed. I rely entirely on VoiceOver and never let 
anyone else touch my phone.
Regards,
Chanelle

On Jan 12, 2025, at 13:21, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve noticed 
that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more slippy than it 
used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, it is often the 
case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>   I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple 
> so kindly provided for us.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hi Pete,
>> 
>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures 
>> not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  
>> Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the 
>> volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume 
>> back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one 
>> thing that seems to be different about the App Library thing, is that it 
>> seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s 
>> impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been 
>> able to get out of the App Library by oping the app switcher, then going 
>> into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home Screen, but that doesn’t 
>> work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and send it to Accessibility.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> 
>>> Donna,
>>> 
>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>> code.
>>> 
>>> Pete De Vasto
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>> 
>>>   3 finger swipe right.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>> My e-Mail:
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 
>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t 
>>>> want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing 
>>>> this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App 
>>>> Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular 
>>>> Home Screen.
>>>> TIA,
>>>> Donna
>>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  mk...@ucla.edu and your

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Andrew' via MacVisionaries]

I feel we should all be reporting these issues to Apple Accessibility so that 
Accessibility in general won’t slip and drift towards unacceptable.  I can’t 
imagine giving up Voiceover and yet recently it’s crossed my mind.  That would 
mean giving up Apple and it would be a costly and difficult upheaval.

Andrew 

> On 12 Jan 2025, at 19:21, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
> had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve noticed 
> that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more slippy than it 
> used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, it is often the 
> case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>   I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
>> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple 
>> so kindly provided for us.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>> Hi Pete,
>>> 
>>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping 
>>> gestures not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related 
>>> problem.  Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going 
>>> until the volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just turn 
>>> the volume back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of 
>>> annoying.  The one thing that seems to be different about the App Library 
>>> thing, is that it seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  
>>> And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  
>>> Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by oping the app 
>>> switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home 
>>> Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and 
>>> send it to Accessibility.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Donna,
>>>> 
>>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>>> code.
>>>> 
>>>> Pete De Vasto
>>>> 
>>>> -Original Message-
>>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>>> 
>>>>   3 finger swipe right.
>>>> 
>>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>>> My e-Mail:
>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>>> 
>>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> 
>>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t 
>>>>> want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing 
>>>>> this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App 
>>>>> Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my 
>>>>> regular Home Screen.
>>>>> TIA,
>>>>> Donna
>>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>>> Visionaries list.
>>>> 
>>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
>>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
>>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>>> 
>>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark 
>

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

[Brad Snyder]

I am not experiencing any issues with the app library, and find its behavior no 
different than in earlier versions of iOS.
To exit the app library, simply put your finger at the bottom of the screen and 
drag up to the first pop, then lift your finger. This will return you to the 
screen immediately to the left of the app library screen.
Repeat the same gesture to return to the home screen, or as it is sometimes 
called, screen number one.

HTH.
- Brad -

On Jan 12, 2025, at 13:22, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve noticed 
that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more slippy than it 
used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, it is often the 
case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>   I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple 
> so kindly provided for us.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hi Pete,
>> 
>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures 
>> not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  
>> Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the 
>> volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume 
>> back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one 
>> thing that seems to be different about the App Library thing, is that it 
>> seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s 
>> impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been 
>> able to get out of the App Library by oping the app switcher, then going 
>> into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home Screen, but that doesn’t 
>> work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and send it to Accessibility.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> 
>>> Donna,
>>> 
>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>> code.
>>> 
>>> Pete De Vasto
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>> 
>>>   3 finger swipe right.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>> My e-Mail:
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 
>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t 
>>>> want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing 
>>>> this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App 
>>>> Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular 
>>>> Home Screen.
>>>> TIA,
>>>> Donna
>>>> 
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macv

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

I could of course be wrong, but I don’t think this is a user error.  I never 
had this issue until IOS 18 or 18.1, not sure exactly which. And I’ve noticed 
that in general, since IOS 18 Voiceover focus is a little more slippy than it 
used to be.  So I think it’s some kind of bug.  As you know, it is often the 
case that not everyone experiences a given bug.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:07 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
> library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that Apple 
> so kindly provided for us.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hi Pete,
>> 
>> Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super 
>> annoying!  I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures 
>> not stopping when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  
>> Sometimes, when I swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the 
>> volume is at 100%.  This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume 
>> back down using the side buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one 
>> thing that seems to be different about the App Library thing, is that it 
>> seems to happen most often when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s 
>> impossible to exit the App Library when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been 
>> able to get out of the App Library by oping the app switcher, then going 
>> into an app from there, and then exiting to my Home Screen, but that doesn’t 
>> work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead and send it to Accessibility.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> 
>>> Donna,
>>> 
>>> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
>>> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey 
>>> siri, restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say 
>>> yes, and the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass 
>>> code.
>>> 
>>> Pete De Vasto
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
>>> 
>>>3 finger swipe right.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>>> My e-Mail:
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 
>>>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, 
>>>> it takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t 
>>>> want to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing 
>>>> this? Or does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App 
>>>> Library? Once I’m in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular 
>>>> Home Screen.
>>>> TIA,
>>>> Donna
>>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at: 
>>>  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
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>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/6fbf4029-b11b-4d01-b8fc-620eb5e06cfb%40icloud.com.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The 

Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   I do not experience such issues, have never been "stuck" in the app 
library. Suggest you put some time in the Voiceover practice area that 
Apple so kindly provided for us.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/12/2025 8:11 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi Pete,

Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super annoying!  
I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures not stopping 
when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  Sometimes, when I 
swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the volume is at 100%.  
This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume back down using the side 
buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one thing that seems to be 
different about the App Library thing, is that it seems to happen most often 
when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library 
when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by 
oping the app switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to 
my Home Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead 
and send it to Accessibility.
Cheers,
Donna



On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:

Donna,

This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably found to get out 
of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey siri, restart my device". 
She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say yes, and the phone is back up in a few 
seconds after you enter your pass code.

Pete De Vasto

-Original Message-
From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

3 finger swipe right.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi all,

A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, it 
takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t want to 
be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing this? Or does 
anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App Library? Once I’m in 
there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.
TIA,
Donna


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Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from Moderator Mark)

['Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries]

I’m centrally interested in discussing the Mac as well, thus I think there’s 
room for a Mac-oriented VoiceOver and accessibility mailing list which isn’t 
dominated by iOS users who aren’t also Mac users.

From: 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 

Date: Saturday, January 11, 2025 at 09:59
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from 
Moderator Mark)
The address to subscribe is blindapples+subscr...@groups.io . If you have a 
groups.io account, you can of course also log in and subscribe that way as 
well. You can't post to the list address until you're a subscriber.

Bear in mind that this list is for all Apple, which means it's dominated by iOS 
users. For myself, this is tolerable, but I am mostly on this list to talk 
about Mac predominantly.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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RE: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

[pdevasto0219]

This begs the following question: Some of you either have enough vision not to 
need Voiceover, or maybe you can grab a sighted friend or partner, but I'd love 
to know if this happens only when Voiceover is running, or does it happen when 
VO isn't running.

Pete

-Original Message-
From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2025 8:12 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

Hi Pete,

Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super annoying!  
I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures not stopping 
when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  Sometimes, when I 
swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the volume is at 100%.  
This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume back down using the side 
buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one thing that seems to be 
different about the App Library thing, is that it seems to happen most often 
when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library 
when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by 
oping the app switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to 
my Home Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead 
and send it to Accessibility.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey siri, 
> restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say yes, and 
> the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass code.
> 
> Pete De Vasto
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
> 
>3 finger swipe right.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, it 
>> takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t want 
>> to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing this? Or 
>> does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App Library? Once I’m 
>> in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
> 
> -- 
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Re: Possible solution Calendar in Sequoia

[Jürgen Fleger]

Mmh, hard to find out. But Calendar here works as expected now.


> Am 11.01.2025 um 02:00 schrieb Dave Carlson :
> 
> I have mine already set that way. Wonder if there is another setting you have 
> that is different.
> 
> 
>   Dave Carlson
> Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer
> 
> On Jan 10, 2025, at 11:58 AM, Jürgen Fleger  wrote:
> 
> Set VO to ignore mouse cursor. Since I changed this setting Calendar works 
> again as expected.
> Jürgen
> 
> 
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Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Pete,

Well, I guess I’m glad I’m not the only one. :). I agree, it’s super annoying!  
I think it has something to do with scrolling or swiping gestures not stopping 
when they should.  Because I’ve noticed a related problem.  Sometimes, when I 
swipe up to adjust music volume, it keeps going until the volume is at 100%.  
This is easier to deal with, you just turn the volume back down using the side 
buttons, but it’s still kind of annoying.  The one thing that seems to be 
different about the App Library thing, is that it seems to happen most often 
when I’m unlocking my phone.  And yeah, it’s impossible to exit the App Library 
when that happens.  Sometimes, I’ve been able to get out of the App Library by 
oping the app switcher, then going into an app from there, and then exiting to 
my Home Screen, but that doesn’t work all of the time.  Maybe I will go ahead 
and send it to Accessibility.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jan 12, 2025, at 9:32 AM, pdevasto0...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably 
> found to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey siri, 
> restart my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say yes, and 
> the phone is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass code.
> 
> Pete De Vasto
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?
> 
>3 finger swipe right.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, it 
>> takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t want 
>> to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing this? Or 
>> does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App Library? Once I’m 
>> in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
> 
> -- 
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> list.
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RE: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

[pdevasto0219]

Donna,

This happens to me too, and it's driving me nuts! Only way I've reliably found 
to get out of it is to restart the phone. You can ask Siri: "hey siri, restart 
my device". She'll ask if you really want to do it, you say yes, and the phone 
is back up in a few seconds after you enter your pass code.

Pete De Vasto

-Original Message-
From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:18 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

3 finger swipe right.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, it 
> takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t want 
> to be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing this? Or 
> does anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App Library? Once I’m 
> in there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.
> TIA,
> Donna
>

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Re: How To Add your driver's license or State Identification Card to Apple Wallet

[Bradford Snyder]

No, As I wrote before, this is not available in Texas.

- Brad -



On Jan 11, 2025, at 20:19, Lorie McCloud  wrote:

can you do this  in every state? I think somebody on here said you can’t do it 
in Texas. I’d love to be able to do it.

> On Jan 11, 2025, at 12:30 PM, MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I just added my state ID to the wallet and have already found doing so 
> extremely helpful and convenient.  
> 
> Even though Apple has done a superb job of making the process 100% VoiceOver 
> accessible, when taking a self photo, there is a bit too much lag time 
> between when the positioning directions are displayed and when VoiceOver 
> reads those directions outloud.  The same is true when prompted to look 
> towards the left or write.  For this reason, I strongly suggest that you have 
> a sighted person stand next to you during this portion of the process so that 
> they can read the display for you.  It’s a good idea to have a VoiceOver on / 
> off shortcut enabled in case the sited person gets distracted by VoiceOver.
> 
> Also, I suggest that you add your license or ID to iPhone, only.  Once the 
> issuing authority (Example, the California DMV) approves your request, then 
> you can easily add the license or ID to the watch without having to deal with 
> the issuing authority (example, Arazona DMV), again.
> 
> Also, for those living in California, it is not necessary to first download 
> the California DMV wallet app in order to have your license or ID added to 
> Apple wallet.  Android users must use the California DMV wallet app, however. 
>  Also, the California DMV mobile license program is still in it’s pilot stage 
> so you will see it listed as California, Pilot.  California is allowing only 
> 1.5 million people to participate so far.  At the time of my post, today, a 
> little over 900,000 people have been approved so there is still room for more 
> people.
> 
> Okay, good luck and enjoy,
> 
> Mark
> 
> Add your driver's license to Apple Wallet
> 
> Securely add your driver's license to Apple Wallet on your iPhone and Apple 
> Watch.
> December 18, 2024
> To add your license to Apple Wallet, you need:
> • An iPhone 8 or later, or an Apple Watch Series 4 or later, with the 
> latest version of iOS or watchOS.
> • Face ID or Touch ID turned on.
> • An Apple Account with two-factor authentication turned on.
> • A license or ID from a participating US state or territory.* 
> • Your device region set to United States.
> 
> IDs in Apple Wallet take advantage of the privacy and security features 
> already built into iPhone and Apple Watch to help protect against tampering 
> and theft. Your driver's license or ID data is encrypted. Neither the issuing 
> authority nor Apple can see when and where you use your license or ID, and 
> biometric authentication using Face ID and Touch ID helps make sure that only 
> you can view and use your license or ID.
> Learn how Apple protects your personal information and identity data
>  
> Add your driver's license to your iPhone and Apple Watch
> Only one license or ID can be associated with any Apple Account at a time, 
> but you can move your ID to your new device. 
> 
> The issuing authority, not Apple, makes the decision to approve or deny your 
> request to add your license or ID to Apple Wallet.
> 
> How to add your driver's license to your iPhone and Apple Watch
> 1.On your iPhone, open the Wallet app.
> 2.Tap the Add button .
> 3.Tap Driver's License or ID and choose your state or region.
> 4.Choose whether you want to add your license or ID to your iPhone only 
> or to both your iPhone and paired Apple Watch. 
> 5.Follow the onscreen instructions to scan the front and back of your 
> license or ID.
> 6.Use a well-lit area and a simple dark background. Make sure that your 
> image is clear and in focus before submitting. 
> 
> Next, you need to confirm that you're you.
> If you want to add your license or ID to your Apple Watch later: On your 
> iPhone, open the Apple Watch app and tap the My Watch tab. Then scroll down, 
> tap Wallet & Apple Pay, and find your license or ID listed under Other Cards 
> on Your Phone. Tap the Add button next to it and follow the onscreen 
> instructions.
> How to confirm that you are really you
> 
> To prove that you're really you, you'll be asked to take a Live Photo or a 
> selfie. In some cases, you might be prompted to also complete a series of 
> facial or head movements. For example, you might be asked to smile or turn 
> your head to the right. If you're asked to complete these movements, hold 
> each movement until your iPhone vibrates.
> 
> To help this process:
> • Stand in front of a plain background, like a wall with neutral paint.
> • Make sure that you're in a well-lit area with even lighting. Indoors 
> works best.
> • Take off any sunglasses, masks, hats, or other accessories.
> • Hold your iPhone as steady as possible.

Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

No, I have no Rogue Amoeba apps and it happens to me as well on Sonoma. There 
doesn't seem to be any proximate or obvious cause: it just happens randomly.

Glad it’s fixed in Sequoia though! I’ll be upgrading my main machine to that 
soon.

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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

Well, FWIW, I am on quite a few Discourse boards I find interesting, and I’m 
glad the “Mailing List Mode” feature is there, but honestly, it’s probably 
easier to just go to the board and reply there, at least on desktop. It’s 
bloated, but it’s not impossibly inaccessible. Also, yes, you can “Follow” just 
the topics/boards you’re interested in; that “Mailing List Mode” setting is 
somewhat misnamed, in that you must use the correct address to reach the right 
board (or reply to a post you have received). It’s a neat trick, when you can 
get it, but it’s not a pinch on a proper mailing list.

By contrast, I’m not on any Mailman3 or Sympa lists, that I’m aware of. This is 
strange, but it probably has something to do with the fact that both are very, 
very complex pieces of software, with large dependency lists; the transition 
from Mailman2 (which, in a distant and rosy past, even *I* thought was too 
heavy) doesn’t seem to have gone as quickly as perhaps the project hoped. What 
I have seen of them, though, does suggest that they are friendlier to us than 
most modern forum software. And Mailman3 has moved away from the silly 
requirement to use per-list passwords, greatly easing its use from a user 
perspective.

freelists.org  was still using Ecartis, the last time I 
checked. This is obsolete software, but while I ranted at Mailman2 for being 
bloated, this was what I used too. It was lovely. Unfortunately, it’s not 
really fit for our modern world, particularly in its MIME support. Guess that’s 
what you get for writing it in C.

Even though most of this software now has a web interface, I can’t think of 
software that doesn’t have an email interface of some sort. ezmlm-idx and mlmmj 
are still used to power some of the lists I’m on, and they’re email-only. The 
convention of listname+subscribe@ and listname+unsubscribe@ is something very 
much borrowed from these two spirit sisters of the original ezmlm. For 
blindness lists, I doubt there’s really much need for more than this, for most 
purposes, where these sorts of discussion drop boxes are concerned. It is 
surprising (and, honestly, delightful) to me that we keep using the email 
interface, simply because it’s intuitive and works. mlmmj is a compelling 
option if you don’t use the qmail mail server, which no right-thinking person 
does any more. :)

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: How To Add your driver's license or State Identification Card to Apple Wallet

[Lorie McCloud]

can you do this  in every state? I think somebody on here said you can’t do it 
in Texas. I’d love to be able to do it.

> On Jan 11, 2025, at 12:30 PM, MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I just added my state ID to the wallet and have already found doing so 
> extremely helpful and convenient.  
> 
> Even though Apple has done a superb job of making the process 100% VoiceOver 
> accessible, when taking a self photo, there is a bit too much lag time 
> between when the positioning directions are displayed and when VoiceOver 
> reads those directions outloud.  The same is true when prompted to look 
> towards the left or write.  For this reason, I strongly suggest that you have 
> a sighted person stand next to you during this portion of the process so that 
> they can read the display for you.  It’s a good idea to have a VoiceOver on / 
> off shortcut enabled in case the sited person gets distracted by VoiceOver.
> 
> Also, I suggest that you add your license or ID to iPhone, only.  Once the 
> issuing authority (Example, the California DMV) approves your request, then 
> you can easily add the license or ID to the watch without having to deal with 
> the issuing authority (example, Arazona DMV), again.
> 
> Also, for those living in California, it is not necessary to first download 
> the California DMV wallet app in order to have your license or ID added to 
> Apple wallet.  Android users must use the California DMV wallet app, however. 
>  Also, the California DMV mobile license program is still in it’s pilot stage 
> so you will see it listed as California, Pilot.  California is allowing only 
> 1.5 million people to participate so far.  At the time of my post, today, a 
> little over 900,000 people have been approved so there is still room for more 
> people.
> 
> Okay, good luck and enjoy,
> 
> Mark
> 
> Add your driver's license to Apple Wallet
> 
> Securely add your driver's license to Apple Wallet on your iPhone and Apple 
> Watch.
> December 18, 2024
> To add your license to Apple Wallet, you need:
> • An iPhone 8 or later, or an Apple Watch Series 4 or later, with the 
> latest version of iOS or watchOS.
> • Face ID or Touch ID turned on.
> • An Apple Account with two-factor authentication turned on.
> • A license or ID from a participating US state or territory.* 
> • Your device region set to United States.
> 
> IDs in Apple Wallet take advantage of the privacy and security features 
> already built into iPhone and Apple Watch to help protect against tampering 
> and theft. Your driver's license or ID data is encrypted. Neither the issuing 
> authority nor Apple can see when and where you use your license or ID, and 
> biometric authentication using Face ID and Touch ID helps make sure that only 
> you can view and use your license or ID.
> Learn how Apple protects your personal information and identity data
>  
> Add your driver's license to your iPhone and Apple Watch
> Only one license or ID can be associated with any Apple Account at a time, 
> but you can move your ID to your new device. 
> 
> The issuing authority, not Apple, makes the decision to approve or deny your 
> request to add your license or ID to Apple Wallet.
> 
> How to add your driver's license to your iPhone and Apple Watch
> 1.On your iPhone, open the Wallet app.
> 2.Tap the Add button .
> 3.Tap Driver's License or ID and choose your state or region.
> 4.Choose whether you want to add your license or ID to your iPhone only 
> or to both your iPhone and paired Apple Watch. 
> 5.Follow the onscreen instructions to scan the front and back of your 
> license or ID.
> 6.Use a well-lit area and a simple dark background. Make sure that your 
> image is clear and in focus before submitting. 
> 
> Next, you need to confirm that you're you.
> If you want to add your license or ID to your Apple Watch later: On your 
> iPhone, open the Apple Watch app and tap the My Watch tab. Then scroll down, 
> tap Wallet & Apple Pay, and find your license or ID listed under Other Cards 
> on Your Phone. Tap the Add button next to it and follow the onscreen 
> instructions.
> How to confirm that you are really you
> 
> To prove that you're really you, you'll be asked to take a Live Photo or a 
> selfie. In some cases, you might be prompted to also complete a series of 
> facial or head movements. For example, you might be asked to smile or turn 
> your head to the right. If you're asked to complete these movements, hold 
> each movement until your iPhone vibrates.
> 
> To help this process:
> • Stand in front of a plain background, like a wall with neutral paint.
> • Make sure that you're in a well-lit area with even lighting. Indoors 
> works best.
> • Take off any sunglasses, masks, hats, or other accessories.
> • Hold your iPhone as steady as possible.
> 
> When you're ready to send your information to your issuing authority, 
> authenticate with Face ID or Touch ID. T

Re: YouTube to MP3 app by humanware

[Herbie Allen]

I sometimes use this site, but it can be tricky with extra downloads. 
https://y2mate.nu/en-ADzn/

> On Jan 11, 2025, at 17:24, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> Since upgrading to Sonoma or is it Sequoia whatever the latest OS is, this 
> app which was a great way to pull down audio off of YouTube videos no longer 
> seems to work. I can copy the link off of the YouTube site but I can’t seem 
> to paste it into the YouTube to MP3 app. Is anyone else having trouble with 
> this app? Any workarounds? How about any free, accessible alternative apps?
> Sent from my IPhone
> 
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Re: Why does my phone keep taking me to the App Library?

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   3 finger swipe right.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/11/2025 2:08 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries wrote:

Hi all,

A weird thing has been happening for a while now.  When I open my phone, it 
takes me into my App library.  I have no reason to be there, and don’t want to 
be.  This seems to be an IOS 18 thing.  Anyone else experiencing this? Or does 
anyone know how to stop it or at least close the App Library? Once I’m in 
there, I can’t seem to get out and back to my regular Home Screen.
TIA,
Donna



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Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

['Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries]

Yes, I have both Airfoie and Audio Hijack installed. So perhaps that is
the answer!

Best,
Janina

joseph hodge writes:
>This is what I was hearing and i'm running the latest version as my Mac
>is brand new. I may have found what is causing it. I am mainly seeing
>this or rather hearing this when running programs by Rogamedia like
>Audio hijack or soundsource. Wondering if y'all ar running these too?
> 
>Sent from my iPad
> 
>  On Jan 10, 2025, at 4:32 PM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries
>   wrote:
> 
>
> 
>I haven’t noticed it. Definitely try Sequoia if that isn’t what you’re
>running already.
> 
>If the problem still occurs, we’ll need to try to work out why some of
>us are experiencing it and others not.
> 
> 
>From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries
>
>Date: Friday, January 10, 2025 at 16:04
>To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>Subject: Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty
> 
>Thanks, Brad. Good to know the update cures the problem! I'm
>downloading
>as I write this ...
>Brad Snyder writes:
>> VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release
>of Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get
>rid of it, however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really
>annoying to you I suggest you do the sequoia update.
>>
>> - Brad -
>>
>> On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries
> wrote:
>>
>> ???Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad
>nauseum?
>> How do I get rid of it?
>>
>> --
>>
>> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
>> Accessibility Consultant [1]https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
>>
>> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative
>(WAI)
>> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures
>[2]http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
>>
>> Linux Foundation Fellow
>> [3]https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
>>
>> --
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>Visionaries list.
>>
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
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>the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list
>itself.
>>
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>mark at:  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach
>Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>
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>>
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>Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
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>A844-E3129327BFC8%40swbell.net.
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>Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
>Accessibility Consultant [8]https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
>The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
>Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures
>[9]http://www

Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

['Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries]

So Sequoia seems to have fixed this blather bug! :) I've been up for
some 16 hours now and haven't heard this once.

PS: How I managed previously was to silence speech by tapping twice with
three fingres on the touchpad. Of course that also meant I had to
remember to turn speech back on when next I wanted to use my Macbook! :)

'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries writes:
> I haven???t noticed it. Definitely try Sequoia if that isn???t what you???re 
> running already.
> If the problem still occurs, we???ll need to try to work out why some of us 
> are experiencing it and others not.
> 
> From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> Date: Friday, January 10, 2025 at 16:04
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> Subject: Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty
> Thanks, Brad. Good to know the update cures the problem! I'm downloading
> as I write this ...
> 
> Brad Snyder writes:
> > VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release of 
> > Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get rid of 
> > it, however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really annoying to 
> > you I suggest you do the sequoia update.
> >
> > - Brad -
> >
> > On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> >  wrote:
> >
> > ???Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad nauseum?
> > How do I get rid of it?
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> > Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> >
> > The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> > Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectureshttp://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> >
> > Linux Foundation Fellow
> > https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
> >
> > --
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> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> 
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> https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
> 
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Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from Moderator Mark)

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi, Sabahattin,

Thanks for the info.  I haven’t had any issues with Google on this list, but I 
thought I’d at least check the BlindApples list out.
Cheers,
Donna



> On Jan 11, 2025, at 8:59 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> The address to subscribe is blindapples+subscr...@groups.io . If you have a 
> groups.io account, you can of course also log in and subscribe that way as 
> well. You can't post to the list address until you're a subscriber.
> 
> Bear in mind that this list is for all Apple, which means it's dominated by 
> iOS users. For myself, this is tolerable, but I am mostly on this list to 
> talk about Mac predominantly.
> 
> Cheers,
> Sabahattin
> 
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Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from Moderator Mark)

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

The address to subscribe is blindapples+subscr...@groups.io . If you have a 
groups.io account, you can of course also log in and subscribe that way as 
well. You can't post to the list address until you're a subscriber.

Bear in mind that this list is for all Apple, which means it's dominated by iOS 
users. For myself, this is tolerable, but I am mostly on this list to talk 
about Mac predominantly.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Blind apples subscription info, (wasRe: Some Comments from Moderator Mark)

[Tibor Niesner]

Hello,

what is it for an address? Is it another conference for the blind people?

Thanks.

Tibor.

> 11. 1. 2025 v 15:16, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
> :
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> When I send an email to blindapp...@groups.io , 
> the email is returned as undeliverable.  Can someone please provide the 
> correct address?
> Thank you,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jan 9, 2025, at 6:23 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> There’s also an existing list for blind Apple products. All you have to do 
>> is subscribe to blind apples all one word at groups.io. I think a lot of 
>> people have moved there from the original Google list, because of Google‘s 
>> ridiculous behavior. That means no need to set up anything new or screw 
>> around with Linux or anything else. Just subscribe to what already exists. 
>> Nice and easy.
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Jan 9, 2025, at 2:48 PM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I was mistaken: the free plan gives you just 100 members. This was a 
>>> relatively recent change and previous groups got off with their existing 
>>> plans. Details of the new structure are here, but basically it's about 
>>> $18.33 per month, if paid yearly, for a minimum of 500 members, and there's 
>>> support for receiving member donations to offset that.
>>> https://groups.io/static/pricing
>>> 
>>> And, yes, there is always the option of self-hosting the mailing list and 
>>> its web interface and archives on a smallish machine for a fixed cost. Is 
>>> it a mailing list, in particular, that we'd want though? Mailman3 can 
>>> pretend to be a web forum. Discourse is very popular and widely hosted 
>>> forum software that just so happens to support allowing people to send and 
>>> receive posts by email. Or we could just have an email server with no web 
>>> presence at all, old-school.
>>> 
>>> And don't forget AppleVis ...
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Sabahattin
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Possible solution Calendar in Sequoia

[Dave Carlson]

I have mine already set that way. Wonder if there is another setting you have 
that is different.


Dave Carlson
Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer

On Jan 10, 2025, at 11:58 AM, Jürgen Fleger  wrote:

Set VO to ignore mouse cursor. Since I changed this setting Calendar works 
again as expected.
Jürgen


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Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

[Brad Snyder]

I have Loopback running, and I'm not hearing it.- Brad -On Jan 10, 2025, at 16:10, joseph hodge  wrote:This is what I was hearing and i'm running the latest version as my Mac is brand new. I may have found what is causing it. I am mainly seeing this or rather hearing this when running programs by Rogamedia like Audio hijack or soundsource. Wondering if y'all ar running these too?Sent from my iPadOn Jan 10, 2025, at 4:32 PM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries  wrote:







I haven’t noticed it. Definitely try Sequoia if that isn’t what you’re running already.
If the problem still occurs, we’ll need to try to work out why some of us are experiencing it and others not.
 




From:
'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
Date: Friday, January 10, 2025 at 16:04
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty


Thanks, Brad. Good to know the update cures the problem! I'm downloading
as I write this ...

Brad Snyder writes:
> VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release of Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get rid of it, however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really annoying to you I suggest you do the sequoia
 update.
> 
> - Brad -
> 
> On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries  wrote:
> 
> ???Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad nauseum?
> How do I get rid of it?
> 
> --
> 
> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures    
http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> 
> Linux Foundation Fellow
> https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
> 
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-- 

Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka

The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures 
http://www.w3.org/wai/apa

Linux Foundation Fellow
https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/

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Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

[joseph hodge]

This is what I was hearing and i'm running the latest version as my Mac is brand new. I may have found what is causing it. I am mainly seeing this or rather hearing this when running programs by Rogamedia like Audio hijack or soundsource. Wondering if y'all ar running these too?Sent from my iPadOn Jan 10, 2025, at 4:32 PM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries  wrote:







I haven’t noticed it. Definitely try Sequoia if that isn’t what you’re running already.
If the problem still occurs, we’ll need to try to work out why some of us are experiencing it and others not.
 




From:
'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
Date: Friday, January 10, 2025 at 16:04
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty


Thanks, Brad. Good to know the update cures the problem! I'm downloading
as I write this ...

Brad Snyder writes:
> VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release of Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get rid of it, however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really annoying to you I suggest you do the sequoia
 update.
> 
> - Brad -
> 
> On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries  wrote:
> 
> ???Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad nauseum?
> How do I get rid of it?
> 
> --
> 
> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures    
http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> 
> Linux Foundation Fellow
> https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list.
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-- 

Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka

The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures 
http://www.w3.org/wai/apa

Linux Foundation Fellow
https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/

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Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

['Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries]

I haven’t noticed it. Definitely try Sequoia if that isn’t what you’re running 
already.
If the problem still occurs, we’ll need to try to work out why some of us are 
experiencing it and others not.

From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
Date: Friday, January 10, 2025 at 16:04
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty
Thanks, Brad. Good to know the update cures the problem! I'm downloading
as I write this ...

Brad Snyder writes:
> VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release of 
> Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get rid of it, 
> however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really annoying to you I 
> suggest you do the sequoia update.
>
> - Brad -
>
> On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
>
> ???Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad nauseum?
> How do I get rid of it?
>
> --
>
> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
>
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
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Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

['Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries]

Thanks, Brad. Good to know the update cures the problem! I'm downloading
as I write this ...

Brad Snyder writes:
> VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release of 
> Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get rid of it, 
> however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really annoying to you I 
> suggest you do the sequoia update.
> 
> - Brad -
> 
> On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> ???Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad nauseum?
> How do I get rid of it?
> 
> --
> 
> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectureshttp://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> 
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> https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
> 
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Re: Thunderbird and VoiceOver.

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   Ok, what menus are you talking about then?


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/10/2025 9:13 AM, Pipkrokodil.se wrote:

I can not navigate in the menus. I try both with and without quicknav
I am not a squeakertoy


9 jan. 2025 kl. 22:20 skrev E.T. :

Anders,
Explain. The menus work as expected for me. Latest version is 128.6 ESR.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com


On 1/9/2025 12:02 PM, Anders Holmberg wrote:
Hi!
Is anyone here using thunderbird on the Mac?
I have just downloaded  it and find that menus are not working properly.
I guess this is the latest version but is thunderbird working or somewhat 
working or not?
Best.
/A


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Re: In Login ... Window ... Content is empty

[Brad Snyder]

VoiceOver has been doing this for a while. At least since the release of 
Sonoma, and maybe longer than that. I don't know of any way to get rid of it, 
however I am not hearing it in Sequoia, so if it is really annoying to you I 
suggest you do the sequoia update.

- Brad -

On Jan 10, 2025, at 12:01, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

Is there some compelling reason I need to hear this read out ad nauseum?
How do I get rid of it?

--

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The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
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Re: Thunderbird and VoiceOver.

[Pipkrokodil.se]

I can not navigate in the menus. I try both with and without quicknav 
I am not a squeakertoy 

> 9 jan. 2025 kl. 22:20 skrev E.T. :
> 
> Anders,
>Explain. The menus work as expected for me. Latest version is 128.6 ESR.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 1/9/2025 12:02 PM, Anders Holmberg wrote:
>> Hi!
>> Is anyone here using thunderbird on the Mac?
>> I have just downloaded  it and find that menus are not working properly.
>> I guess this is the latest version but is thunderbird working or somewhat 
>> working or not?
>> Best.
>> /A
>> 
> 
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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

[Eric Oyen]

I’ve been over there for rather some time. Lots of users and quite a bit of 
apple related discussion going on. :)

-Eric


> On Jan 9, 2025, at 5:23 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> There’s also an existing list for blind Apple products. All you have to do is 
> subscribe to blind apples all one word at groups.io. I think a lot of people 
> have moved there from the original Google list, because of Google‘s 
> ridiculous behavior. That means no need to set up anything new or screw 
> around with Linux or anything else. Just subscribe to what already exists. 
> Nice and easy.
> Sent from my iPhone

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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

[Joseph Hudson]

Hi Mary, yes you and quite a few others have moved over there already. I think 
I counted, and there has been at least 15 people that have moved over there. 
Anybody wishing to still move over there can be more than welcomed. As we can 
have an unlimited membership because of when our group was created. So yes, 
most definitely come on. Come on. Let's go. Subscription info is below.

blindapples+subscr...@groups.io

And one of her I went to go look for the subscription address I see that we 
already have one more pending member. So if more people wanna apply, go ahead. 
I will approve all subscriptions by midnight central. So that way y'all can 
start posting right away.

On Jan 9, 2025, at 6:23 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:

There’s also an existing list for blind Apple products. All you have to do is 
subscribe to blind apples all one word at groups.io. I think a lot of people 
have moved there from the original Google list, because of Google‘s ridiculous 
behavior. That means no need to set up anything new or screw around with Linux 
or anything else. Just subscribe to what already exists. Nice and easy.
Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 9, 2025, at 2:48 PM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I was mistaken: the free plan gives you just 100 members. This was a 
relatively recent change and previous groups got off with their existing plans. 
Details of the new structure are here, but basically it's about $18.33 per 
month, if paid yearly, for a minimum of 500 members, and there's support for 
receiving member donations to offset that.
https://groups.io/static/pricing

And, yes, there is always the option of self-hosting the mailing list and its 
web interface and archives on a smallish machine for a fixed cost. Is it a 
mailing list, in particular, that we'd want though? Mailman3 can pretend to be 
a web forum. Discourse is very popular and widely hosted forum software that 
just so happens to support allowing people to send and receive posts by email. 
Or we could just have an email server with no web presence at all, old-school.

And don't forget AppleVis ...

Cheers,
Sabahattin


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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

[Mary Otten]

There’s also an existing list for blind Apple products. All you have to do is subscribe to blind apples all one word at groups.io. I think a lot of people have moved there from the original Google list, because of Google‘s ridiculous behavior. That means no need to set up anything new or screw around with Linux or anything else. Just subscribe to what already exists. Nice and easy.Sent from my iPhoneOn Jan 9, 2025, at 2:48 PM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries  wrote:I was mistaken: the free plan gives you just 100 members. This was a relatively recent change and previous groups got off with their existing plans. Details of the new structure are here, but basically it's about $18.33 per month, if paid yearly, for a minimum of 500 members, and there's support for receiving member donations to offset that.https://groups.io/static/pricingAnd, yes, there is always the option of self-hosting the mailing list and its web interface and archives on a smallish machine for a fixed cost. Is it a mailing list, in particular, that we'd want though? Mailman3 can pretend to be a web forum. Discourse is very popular and widely hosted forum software that just so happens to support allowing people to send and receive posts by email. Or we could just have an email server with no web presence at all, old-school.And don't forget AppleVis ...Cheers,Sabahattin



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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

['Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries]

Mailman3 and Sympa are the two options that seem to be attracting community 
issues in the communities I frequent.

The difficulty with Discourse (and this may have changed) is that it used to 
treat the entire forum as though it were a single mailing list. You couldn’t 
subscribe to one subforum only without receiving everything else as well. This 
is why the Orca screen reader mailing list moved to freelists.org instead of 
becoming a Discourse forum.

So far as VoiceOver accessibility is concerned, I haven’t tried Mailman3, Sympa 
(assuming it has a Web interface) or Discourse in a macOS environment. However, 
they’re all widely available and shouldn’t be hard to test.

From: 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 

Date: Thursday, January 9, 2025 at 17:48
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark
I was mistaken: the free plan gives you just 100 members. This was a relatively 
recent change and previous groups got off with their existing plans. Details of 
the new structure are here, but basically it's about $18.33 per month, if paid 
yearly, for a minimum of 500 members, and there's support for receiving member 
donations to offset that.
https://groups.io/static/pricing

And, yes, there is always the option of self-hosting the mailing list and its 
web interface and archives on a smallish machine for a fixed cost. Is it a 
mailing list, in particular, that we'd want though? Mailman3 can pretend to be 
a web forum. Discourse is very popular and widely hosted forum software that 
just so happens to support allowing people to send and receive posts by email. 
Or we could just have an email server with no web presence at all, old-school.

And don't forget AppleVis ...

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

I was mistaken: the free plan gives you just 100 members. This was a relatively 
recent change and previous groups got off with their existing plans. Details of 
the new structure are here, but basically it's about $18.33 per month, if paid 
yearly, for a minimum of 500 members, and there's support for receiving member 
donations to offset that.
https://groups.io/static/pricing

And, yes, there is always the option of self-hosting the mailing list and its 
web interface and archives on a smallish machine for a fixed cost. Is it a 
mailing list, in particular, that we'd want though? Mailman3 can pretend to be 
a web forum. Discourse is very popular and widely hosted forum software that 
just so happens to support allowing people to send and receive posts by email. 
Or we could just have an email server with no web presence at all, old-school.

And don't forget AppleVis ...

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Thunderbird and VoiceOver.

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

Thunderbird certainly works, but not being a "native" app, is noticeably quite 
clunky and web-like. I wouldn't use it every day but it's certainly doable and 
accessible. 

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Re: Thunderbird and VoiceOver.

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

Anders,
   Explain. The menus work as expected for me. Latest version is 128.6 ESR.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/9/2025 12:02 PM, Anders Holmberg wrote:

Hi!
Is anyone here using thunderbird on the Mac?
I have just downloaded  it and find that menus are not working properly.
I guess this is the latest version but is thunderbird working or somewhat 
working or not?
Best.
/A



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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

['Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries]

For $10 US per month (perhaps even $5 US per month), you could rent a Linux 
virtual server, install mailing list server software on it, configure 
everything appropriately, and run as many mailing lists as resources allow. 
Prices in Euro are similar if you prefer a European hosting provider.

I don’t know whether there are good no cost options. Freelists.org might be one 
of them, but I’m not acquainted with the details of what they offer.

From: 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
Date: Thursday, January 9, 2025 at 11:01
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark
   Most of the groups on Groups.io I subscribe to have well over200
members. Never seen anything about contributions etc.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/9/2025 2:04 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries wrote:
> I certainly agree that groups.io is much truer to the spirit of the 
> traditional mailing list than Google Groups has been for a long time now. But 
> on the other hand, GG is free no matter how large your group, whereas 
> groups.io has an insanely unrealistic pricing structure that rules out many 
> (most?) groups that attract even a moderately sized membership (200 as of 
> now, I think, before it becomes a paid affair with or without community 
> contributions). Maybe it'll work for this group—I certainly hope so—but I'd 
> hate to see it go under because of costs.
>

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Re: Native Calendar App w/ Sequoia OS

[Dave Carlson]

Recommend sending a message to Apple Accessibility.


Dave Carlson
Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer

On Jan 9, 2025, at 8:23 AM, Brett Campbell  wrote:

I’m having the same experience. I’m glad you said something, I thought 
something was wrong with my Mac.

Brett

> On Jan 9, 2025, at 7:10 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
> 
> Is it just me, or is it difficult to use the calendar app on Mac/Sequoia? It 
> is sluggish and entering an event title often causes it to stop completely. I 
> used to be able to type very simple statements like “dinner thursday  at 6 
> PM” and it would create the event just from that.
> 
> Comments? Experiences? Resolutions? All appreciated.
> 
> 
>   Dave Carlson
> Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer
> 
> 
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Re: Native Calendar App w/ Sequoia OS

[Brett Campbell]

I’m having the same experience. I’m glad you said something, I thought 
something was wrong with my Mac.

Brett

> On Jan 9, 2025, at 7:10 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
> 
> Is it just me, or is it difficult to use the calendar app on Mac/Sequoia? It 
> is sluggish and entering an event title often causes it to stop completely. I 
> used to be able to type very simple statements like “dinner thursday  at 6 
> PM” and it would create the event just from that.
> 
> Comments? Experiences? Resolutions? All appreciated.
> 
> 
>   Dave Carlson
> Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer
> 
> 
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Re: Some Comments from Moderator Mark

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   Most of the groups on Groups.io I subscribe to have well over200 
members. Never seen anything about contributions etc.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
My e-Mail:
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 1/9/2025 2:04 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries wrote:

I certainly agree that groups.io is much truer to the spirit of the traditional 
mailing list than Google Groups has been for a long time now. But on the other 
hand, GG is free no matter how large your group, whereas groups.io has an 
insanely unrealistic pricing structure that rules out many (most?) groups that 
attract even a moderately sized membership (200 as of now, I think, before it 
becomes a paid affair with or without community contributions). Maybe it'll 
work for this group—I certainly hope so—but I'd hate to see it go under because 
of costs.



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Re: Native Calendar App w/ Sequoia OS

[Jürgen Fleger]

yes, since Sequoya Calendar on Mac seems to be broken. I try to avoid it until Apple fixes it.Von meinem iPhone gesendetAm 09.01.2025 um 16:21 schrieb Anders Holmberg :Hi!I rather use the Iphone instead for the Mac calendar.Its a bit smoother than the Mac app.To be honest the Mac annoys me more and more when it comes to usability now than it has done before./A9 jan. 2025 kl. 15:15 skrev Jessica Moss :It’s not just you.  I’ve honestly found the calendar app vary clunky to work with for quite some time, and can’t remember when I first noticed this.  I’ve noticed for a while now that doing simple things like selecting the dates I want is more of a pain in the butt than it used to be, more often not, I’ll think I selected the correct date for a doctor’s appointment I’ve tried to create an event for , for example, only to go back in and find out the date didn’t save.  So at this point, I’ve just found the “add to calendar” option a lot of web sites offer a lot more convenient.On Jan 9, 2025, at 9:10 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:Is it just me, or is it difficult to use the calendar app on Mac/Sequoia? It is sluggish and entering an event title often causes it to stop completely. I used to be able to type very simple statements like “dinner thursday  at 6 PM” and it would create the event just from that.Comments? Experiences? Resolutions? All appreciated.
	Dave CarlsonFarfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer




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Re: Native Calendar App w/ Sequoia OS

[Anders Holmberg]

Hi!
I rather use the Iphone instead for the Mac calendar.
Its a bit smoother than the Mac app.
To be honest the Mac annoys me more and more when it comes to usability now 
than it has done before.
/A

> 9 jan. 2025 kl. 15:15 skrev Jessica Moss :
> 
> It’s not just you.  I’ve honestly found the calendar app vary clunky to work 
> with for quite some time, and can’t remember when I first noticed this.
>   I’ve noticed for a while now that doing simple things like selecting the 
> dates I want is more of a pain in the butt than it used to be, more often 
> not, I’ll think I selected the correct date for a doctor’s appointment I’ve 
> tried to create an event for , for example, only to go back in and find out 
> the date didn’t save.  So at this point, I’ve just found the “add to 
> calendar” option a lot of web sites offer a lot more convenient.
> 
>> On Jan 9, 2025, at 9:10 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
>> 
>> Is it just me, or is it difficult to use the calendar app on Mac/Sequoia? It 
>> is sluggish and entering an event title often causes it to stop completely. 
>> I used to be able to type very simple statements like “dinner thursday  at 6 
>> PM” and it would create the event just from that.
>> 
>> Comments? Experiences? Resolutions? All appreciated.
>> 
>> 
>>  Dave Carlson
>> Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
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>> Visionaries list.
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>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
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Re: Click feedback when using on screen keyboard on iPhone running IOS 18.2

[Matthew Janusauskas]

I’m also experiencing this and my settings are correct to enable the sounds.


> On Jan 6, 2025, at 11:34 AM, Paul Hopewell  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> I am running IOS 18.2 on my iPhone 15 pro which is set up for Apple 
> Intelligence.
> In earlier releases I used to hear a quiet click when I lifted my finger on a 
> desired key on the on screen keyboard. This was very helpful for example when 
> entering my passcode.
> I can now no longer hear that click. I tried turning on haptic feedback for 
> the on screen keyboard which I can just about feel if I concentrate.
> Is there some way I can restore the audible click or increase the strength of 
> the haptic feedback?
> Many thanks … Paul Hopewell
> 
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Re: Native Calendar App w/ Sequoia OS

['Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries]

I use the calendar in Microsoft Outlook for Mac these days. It comes with my 
Microsoft 365 subscription. That’s why I’m not using Apple’s Mail, Calendar or 
Contacts significantly.

From: 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
Date: Thursday, January 9, 2025 at 09:20
To: MacVisionaries 
Subject: Re: Native Calendar App w/ Sequoia OS
Hi,

Not yet running Sequoia,  but I’ve also found the calendar very hard to use.  
Generally, I just create my appointments using dictation on my phone, or, like 
Jessica, the Add to Calendar feature if there is one.
Cheers,
Donna



On Jan 9, 2025, at 8:15 AM, Jessica Moss  wrote:

It’s not just you.  I’ve honestly found the calendar app vary clunky to work 
with for quite some time, and can’t remember when I first noticed this.
  I’ve noticed for a while now that doing simple things like selecting the 
dates I want is more of a pain in the butt than it used to be, more often not, 
I’ll think I selected the correct date for a doctor’s appointment I’ve tried to 
create an event for , for example, only to go back in and find out the date 
didn’t save.  So at this point, I’ve just found the “add to calendar” option a 
lot of web sites offer a lot more convenient.


On Jan 9, 2025, at 9:10 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:

Is it just me, or is it difficult to use the calendar app on Mac/Sequoia? It is 
sluggish and entering an event title often causes it to stop completely. I used 
to be able to type very simple statements like “dinner thursday  at 6 PM” and 
it would create the event just from that.

Comments? Experiences? Resolutions? All appreciated.


Dave Carlson
Farfar,  Oregonian, Engineer, Musician, Woodworker, and Pioneer


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