Re: [maemo-developers] SDL, Re: SDL vertical blank (vbl) sync.
ext Frantisek Dufka wrote: Eero Tamminen wrote: Hi, Yes. So to draw without tearing effect either X of framebuffer driver should report when to draw (vblank period or which line is currently drawn by hardware) Another possibility is that (SDL) application could ask X server to ask Framebuffer to flush the framebuffer contents to the LCD controller when it's done with a frame. It might even do that directly by calling the fb ioctls (if there would be such ioctl and it would have access rights to do it). AFAIK the framebuffer doesn't have constant update rate to the LCD and it doesn't immediately push every framebuffer update to the LCD controller. It does updates only if the framebuffer contents have been updated (there's an ioctl to tell that) and there's a certain amount of time since last update. So, if application could force the framebuffer flush, it would have time to update the screen before the next (automated or application forced) flushing happens. Yes, that would be enough too. In fact that's what Kuisma Salonen already mentioned yesterday - synchronization in the driver. Now I see it too. Yep, normally clients should not bother too much about sync. As for the manual vs automatic updates, that brings another question. How often is the screen really updated? I saw in the kernel source there is manual vs automatic update mode but which one is actualy We are updating areas (dirty-rects), it would hog the memorybus if we would be updating whole screen all the time. enabled? With automatic updates in some intervals it would really not matter how fast you can blit to the SDL surface when the data will not actually make it to the screen. And when talking about SDL, how it is in fact optimized for N770? As there is no source for SDL in the maemo repository, is it a stock SDL over X? Maybe one using directly kernel framebuffer ioctls would be better, at least in full screen. X needs to know about this anyway, so there should be X extension for this kind of activity. Maybe that is what the video player does. It draws black rectangle via GTK/X and then accesses kernel framebuffer directly (with pixel doubling, and maybe even direct YUV blits). This would explain why it displays black rectangle when you bring up the menu in non-fullscreen mode. Optimizing SDL to use same methods would make it the best way to access the video hardware. Videoplayer tells X (using Xsp extension) which rectangle it's updating and after that X takes care of overlaps. If somethings going to overlap the video-area, it will tell videoplayer to stop. I'm not very convinced that we should have this kind of interface for SDL. Do you think blitting is too slow now? I don't think X is there the bottleneck at all, the true bottleneck is the memorybus. And as for the sound, how SDL uses sound hardware? SDL is not mentioned in http://www.maemo.org/platform/docs/multimedia/multimedia_architecture.html Does it go over esound? Is SDL supposed to be first class citizen in Maemo or it is there just for quick game ports but is actually expected to be slower? I'm asking because audio seems to lag a bit (in scummvm) and the same problem is mentioned in port of Flite TTS which solved it by moving from SDL to gstreaemer. Kuisma can answer the audio questions :-) Frantisek // Tapani or the controller has to have two buffers so single or multiple SDL_UpdateRects could be pushed to visible screen in one operation (SDL_Flip) in appropriate moment. Cannot/doesn't SDL do double buffering by itself when asked? (it would be much slower if it's done in the normal RAM where the framebuffer resides, but at least there wouldn't be tearing. :)) - Eero ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] SDL, Re: SDL vertical blank (vbl) sync.
ext Frantisek Dufka wrote: Tapani Pälli wrote: As for the manual vs automatic updates, that brings another question. How often is the screen really updated? I saw in the kernel source there is manual vs automatic update mode but which one is actualy We are updating areas (dirty-rects), it would hog the memorybus if we would be updating whole screen all the time. Yes, I didn't mean whole screen. As for the modes I later found dmesg prints only changes between states 'disabled' and 'manual' so the answer is manual. Do you think blitting is too slow now? I don't think X is there the bottleneck at all, the true bottleneck is the memorybus. No I was not concerned about speed but more about functionality and unneeded layers that may hide some of them. As for the functionality I mean vblank syncing/double buffering to take care of the tearing effect and maybe also direct YUV blits for implementing video player in SDL. As SDL can lie about Hmm let's see if we could come up with a nice solution with discussion. Direct access to fb would mean permission problems. But there could be another fb with different permissions (?) ... Maybe at first the tearing should be solved at driver level so that client can request the flush. everything I'm not sure if it supports YUV surfaces in software or uses kernel features. Also as for the pixel doubling, this was told it is basically unstable because you cannot turn it off fast enough or at all if X decides to draw something or your application crashes. http://maemo.org/maemowiki/GameDevelopment#head-6d05e5cc815205f4c0ac4ba09fee0ea5c9d3ff85 Yep this is sad but true :-/ Scaling should be handled better ... we have some plans for this. By using kernel driver directly from SDL it might be easier as you might set pixel doubling mode per each update rectangle separately (if I understood kernel source correctly, which may not be the case :) Yes, this is possible and quite ideal for applications. Right now the interface is through Xsp extension and scaling happens then for everything (without clipping). There was some discussion also that windowmanager could handle the global enabling and disabling of scaler, but individual rects sounds very nice indeed. so it will not remain turned on. Otherwise there is no need to use it directly if X allows to do all of this properly. Frantisek // Tapani ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] SDL, Re: SDL vertical blank (vbl) sync.
Tapani Pälli wrote: Hmm let's see if we could come up with a nice solution with discussion. Direct access to fb would mean permission problems. But there could be another fb with different permissions (?) ... Maybe at first the tearing should be solved at driver level so that client can request the flush. Yes permissions are the problem. I didn't think about that. But on the other way I don't think user can do more damage with using fb directly over using X with extensions and this is personal device anyway so maybe fb permissions may be relaxed a bit. But maybe not. My reasons to use fb was to be near the hardware so other layers do not interfere too much and it may be also less work to add such functionality. But true there is also a problem with overlapping regions as SDL over fb would overwrite screen. Which is not so bad too, this is how video overlays look on PC in linux and windows too. But maybe X is better after all if proper extensions can be easily added. Bonus would be that they could be used also in non-SDL pure X (or mixed GTK/X) apps. There was some discussion also that windowmanager could handle the global enabling and disabling of scaler, but individual rects sounds very nice indeed. Yes, the kernel seems to work like this and even remembers last mode and does not initialize different mode if last was the same so there should be no extra overhead with this, but I'm not sure how this is usable from userspace. Well anyway the X extension should allow setting it per each update and SDL could use it to implement virtual half resolution modes so there is no need to mess with this in SDL. But maybe it may remain as an option for games with main area that changes often (in low resolution) and nice hight resolution border area around. So both solutions could exist, either SDL could handle virtual resolution by itself or you could use real 800x480 and set pixel doubling mode for the updates. But you probably already know all this, the biggest problem is time and priorities :-) Frantisek ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: scratchbox installation
Devesh Kothari [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am not so upto date on all developments, but what would be the major reason to move to SB 1.0 and what are the impacts if any ? Dunno if it is major, but for me it would be nice to be able to use more recent SB as I would like to use the same SB installation for other things than just maemo. -- http://www.iki.fi/~ananaza/ ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
Dear All, Please help me to provide information regarding, where I can find the Changes made to GTK. i.e the changes between the GTK base version and Maemo GTK. I am in very urgent need of this information. Please reply. Madhusudan E, HTIPL, Bangalore-08 - 9980527224 www.huawei.com This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
Your probably after this http://maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoGtk26Contributions Peter On 5/31/06, Madhusudan E [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear All, Please help me to provide information regarding, where I can find the Changes made to GTK. i.e the changes between the GTK base version and Maemo GTK. I am in very urgent need of this information. Please reply. Madhusudan E, HTIPL, Bangalore-08 - 9980527224 www.huawei.com This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
I would guess that its relating to the mainline gtk libraries. So unmergable would not able to merge upstream etc On 5/31/06, Madhusudan E [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for the reply. I would just like to clarify my understanding of this page: Unmergable - Not been adopted to Maemo - GTK Change maemo-gtk/glib - Being adopted to Maemo - GTK Move to Hildon libs Done --- ??? In progress - the bug fix is in progress Outstanding ??? I have newly joined this group and my understanding over the Maemo is minimal, for initial understanding I would greatly appreciate ur help. Please clarify on above. Thanks in advance This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! -Original Message- From: Peter Robinson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 4:35 PM To: Madhusudan E Cc: maemo-developers@maemo.org Subject: Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK Your probably after this http://maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoGtk26Contributions Peter On 5/31/06, Madhusudan E [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear All, Please help me to provide information regarding, where I can find the Changes made to GTK. i.e the changes between the GTK base version and Maemo GTK. I am in very urgent need of this information. Please reply. Madhusudan E, HTIPL, Bangalore-08 - 9980527224 www.huawei.com This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Madhusudan E schreef: This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! Ehm. Shouldn't e-mails containing crap^H^H^H^Hstuff like this be discarded? With stuff like gmane, google-groups and list archives maemo/nokia is in for a world of hurt, legally speaking. regards, Koen -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFEfX01MkyGM64RGpERAia+AKCCufGm5KmaP+Bck98/ln4mGx1lUACeLgB6 2pLCcNmXxeFKKxAmsJsG3Ac= =bXC1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
Koen Kooi wrote: Ehm. Shouldn't e-mails containing crap^H^H^H^Hstuff like this be discarded? With stuff like gmane, google-groups and list archives maemo/nokia is in for a world of hurt, legally speaking. regards, Koen -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFEfX01MkyGM64RGpERAia+AKCCufGm5KmaP+Bck98/ln4mGx1lUACeLgB6 2pLCcNmXxeFKKxAmsJsG3Ac= =bXC1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ One could equally gripe about your PGP signature - is a trivial mail like this really deserving of being cryptographically signed? Of course, you are set up to sign ALL your mail. Well, guess what - many unfortunate people, due to lawyers, SarbOx, ITAR, and other laws get those sort of legal warts added to their emails at work (I am unfortunately one of them, but am currently sending this from my home account). They cannot do anything about it - the wart is added as a matter of corporate policy at the corporate mail server at the corporate firewall, the corporate lawyers insist upon it, and there is no way an individual is going to get that changed. So you either live with it, and don't contribute to the list clutter by commenting upon it, or you ban all such individuals - and thus ban any company with such laws from participating in Maemo development. ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
Dear All, I am actually looking for the main changes [Not including minor bug fix changes] that's being done over GTK base version, ex: The libs that are not included for memory reduction. Etc., I request for someone to guide me in this regard. Thanks in advance Madhu -Original Message- From: Peter Robinson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 4:48 PM To: Madhusudan E Cc: maemo-developers@maemo.org Subject: Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK I would guess that its relating to the mainline gtk libraries. So unmergable would not able to merge upstream etc On 5/31/06, Madhusudan E [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for the reply. I would just like to clarify my understanding of this page: Unmergable - Not been adopted to Maemo - GTK Change maemo-gtk/glib - Being adopted to Maemo - GTK Move to Hildon libs Done --- ??? In progress - the bug fix is in progress Outstanding ??? I have newly joined this group and my understanding over the Maemo is minimal, for initial understanding I would greatly appreciate ur help. Please clarify on above. Thanks in advance This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! -Original Message- From: Peter Robinson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 4:35 PM To: Madhusudan E Cc: maemo-developers@maemo.org Subject: Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK Your probably after this http://maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoGtk26Contributions Peter On 5/31/06, Madhusudan E [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear All, Please help me to provide information regarding, where I can find the Changes made to GTK. i.e the changes between the GTK base version and Maemo GTK. I am in very urgent need of this information. Please reply. Madhusudan E, HTIPL, Bangalore-08 - 9980527224 www.huawei.com This e-mail and attachments contain confidential information from HUAWEI, which is intended only for the person or entity whose address is listed above. Any use of the information contained herein in any way (including, but not limited to, total or partial disclosure, reproduction, or dissemination) by persons other than the intended recipient's) is prohibited. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by phone or email immediately and delete it! ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
2006/5/31, David D. Hagood [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Koen Kooi wrote: Ehm. Shouldn't e-mails containing crap^H^H^H^Hstuff like this be discarded? With stuff like gmane, google-groups and list archives maemo/nokia is in for a world of hurt, legally speaking. regards, Koen -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) iD8DBQFEfX01MkyGM64RGpERAia+AKCCufGm5KmaP+Bck98/ln4mGx1lUACeLgB6 2pLCcNmXxeFKKxAmsJsG3Ac= =bXC1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ One could equally gripe about your PGP signature - is a trivial mail like this really deserving of being cryptographically signed? No no, PGP signature is proof of origin, but legal mambo-jambo and threats are there just to whack mis-users of confidential information (which is of course ridiculous when sent to a public mailing list). BIG difference. -- Kalle Vahlman, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Powered by http://movial.fi Interesting stuff at http://syslog.movial.fi ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] Changes to GTK
Hello, On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 05:04:22PM +0530, Madhusudan E wrote: I am actually looking for the main changes [Not including minor bug fix changes] that's being done over GTK base version, ex: The libs that are not included for memory reduction. Etc., I request for someone to guide me in this regard. My sggestion is Use The Source, Luke. ;-) HTH. Olivier -- Olivier Bornet [EMAIL PROTECTED] Swiss Ice Hockey Results : http://puck.ch/ Get my PGP-key at http://puck.ch/pgp or at http://pgp.mit.edu/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] (no subject)
Hi To fully make use of the BlueZ stack, an application needs to run as root on the N770. Is there an easy way to make an application always run as "root" ? OR Is there an alternative for applications toaccessfunctions withinthe SDP without running as root. Regards ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] dspmpeg4sink doesn't work!
Hi,I am trying to usedspmpeg4sink on maemo, butit neverworks. I used the following pipeline.gst-launch-0.8 udpsrc ! video/x-h263 ! dspmpeg4sinkand this happensRUNNING pipeline . . . ERROR: pipeline doesn't want to play.I had sent mails and gotten very good responses, but I wonderif any body has any clue on why it doesn't work, atleast as normal gstreamer plugin.Regards, Michael and this happensRUNNING pipeline . . . ERROR: pipeline doesn't want to play.I had sent mails and gotten very good responses, but I wonderif any body has any clue on why it doesn't work, atleast as normal gstreamer plugin.Regards, Michael Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] hacking the kernel with the help of the serial console
Hi all, I'm currently playing with the production n770, porting an sdio driver to it. I fear, I'm now facing a kernel panic, and I will need the serial console to go further. with the help of search engin, you can find references how to enable the serial console, but no infomation on the effective pinouts of the connector near the battery pack. Can someone tell me where I can solder my 2 wires? Best regards, -- Pierre Tardy ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
Re: [maemo-developers] hacking the kernel with the help of the serial console
Pierre TARDY wrote: with the help of search engin, you can find references how to enable the serial console, but no infomation on the effective pinouts of the connector near the battery pack. Can someone tell me where I can solder my 2 wires? http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/6981?search_string=pinout;#6981 ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
