Re: MPlayer and Free42 for OS 2008

[Martin Grimme]

Hi,

> A chinook version of mplayer is available in extras-devel and will, 
> presumably, be promoted to maemo Extras when better tested.

I'm a heavy user of the chinook version of mplayer and want to confirm
that this version is really very stable on OS 2008. Not a single
mplayer crash so far.


Cheers,
Martin
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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Steve Greenland]

According to  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Sat, Dec 29, 2007 at 07:23:15PM -0500, James Knott wrote:
> > 
> > Ping is there, but you have to be root to use it.
> 
> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
> necessary is itself a security problem.

Ping is root-only not because the actual ping function is a security
issue, but because you have to open a raw socket to send ICMP packets,
which *is* a security issue. Making ping suidroot is a reasonable
solution, but not when it's a link to busybox.

Steve
-- 
Steve Greenland
The irony is that Bill Gates claims to be making a stable operating
system and Linus Torvalds claims to be trying to take over the
world.   -- seen on the net

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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Neil MacLeod]

Marius Gedminas wrote:
> 
> I've built some today (less, links, mc, wget; made vim actually
> installable).  I don't have upload privileges to maemo extras yet, so
> you can find them only at http://mg.pov.lt/770/
> 

Just to say that wget, less and traceroute are already available in 
repos[i]tory.maemo.org for chinook and bora.

links is also present in r.m.o for chinook (but not bora).

I've installed wget, traceroute and links from r.m.o chinook and they all seem 
fine.

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Re: MPlayer and Free42 for OS 2008

[Andrew Flegg]

[No attribution line with Modest, sorry]
>
> Are there any plans to make these apps available for OS 2008?

A chinook version of mplayer is available in extras-devel and will, presumably, 
be promoted to maemo Extras when better tested.

I've not heard anything about Free42.

HTH,

Andrew


--
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MPlayer and Free42 for OS 2008

[William Gordon Rutherdale]

Hi.

This came up before but hasn't been answered yet.\

Are there any plans to make these apps available for OS 2008?

Right now they are only available on the Downloads page for OS 2007, and 
those versions do not work on OS 2008.

-Will

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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Marius Gedminas]

On Sun, Dec 30, 2007 at 12:10:27AM +, Peter Flynn wrote:
> Marius Gedminas wrote:
> > So, what command-line tools do you miss?  I've got an idle scratchbox
> > here.
> 
> ping and traceroute would be useful.

Here you are:

  http://mg.pov.lt/770/ping.install
  http://mg.pov.lt/770/traceroute.install

Both were tested and both work on chinook.  I haven't tested the bora
and mistral versions (that's the problem with having only one tablet and
there being no full-hardware emulator).

Cheers!
Marius Gedminas
-- 
I used to be an agnostic, but now I'm not so sure.


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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Marius Gedminas]

On Sun, Dec 30, 2007 at 07:54:44PM +0200, Tuomas Kulve wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > There's a big difference between setuid root ahd having to be root.
> 
> Ping is just a link to busybox and setting busybox as setuid wouldn't
> probably be a good solution either.

How about a /usr/bin/ping like this

  #!/bin/sh
  exec /usr/bin/sudo /bin/ping "$@"

with

  user ALL = NOPASSWD: /usr/bin/ping

in /etc/sudoers?

In the default $PATH /usr/bin comes before /bin, so it would work.

Marius Gedminas
-- 
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-- Linus Torvalds


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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[sebastian maemo]

2007/12/30, Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
> http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot


I created this one, so please don't delete it ;-)


The nice thing about using your favourite ssh client is that you get to
> use a normal keyboard.


That's truly fine, I usually connect to my 770 via my Linux Desktop.
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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps

[inode0]

On Dec 30, 2007 11:13 AM, James Knott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Ari Yrjölä wrote:
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> >
> >
> >> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would
> >> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not
> >> necessary is itself a security problem.
> >>
> >
> > I guess ping requires root, because it's not a separate binary but
> > included in busybox. /bin/ping is just a symlink to /bin/busybox,
> > which is not setuid root, for obvious reasons.
> >
> >
>
> Others, such as vi and pwd also link to busybox, but can still be run by
> user.

vi and pwd do not require the use of raw sockets.

John
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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[sebastian maemo]

2007/12/30, Ed Bartosh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
> Just one suggestion. '4. Open xterm' item in your list looks a bit
> confusing for me.
> I'd replace it with something like 'run your favorite ssh client on your
> desktop'.



I think Marius is just talking about how to become root opening a ssh
session directly from the device, not from desktop...
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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[sebastian maemo]

2007/12/30, Ari Yrjölä <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

>
> Red pill + 'sudo gainroot' doesn't work either for me:
>
> ~ $ sudo gainroot
> cal_read_block(r&d_mode): size zero, block not found?
> Enable RD mode if you want to break your device



You need to install the 'becomeroot' package.
See: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot
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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Marius Gedminas]

On Sun, Dec 30, 2007 at 12:42:38PM +0200, Ed Bartosh wrote:
> Hi Marius,
> 
> This info looks like a good candidate for the next 'howdoibecomeroot'
> page on maemo wiki :).
> 
> Seriously we should probably have only one page for all 'become root'
> recipes.

+1

Where are the existing ones?  I found

http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howdoibecomeroot/
http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_BecomeRoot
http://maemo.org/community/wiki/hardwaytobecomeroot/

(I'm ignoring the ones with /oldwiki/ in the URL)

Are there more?

> Just one suggestion. '4. Open xterm' item in your list looks a bit
> confusing for me.  I'd replace it with something like 'run your
> favorite ssh client on your desktop'. 

The nice thing about xterm is that it's preinstalled and doesn't require
you to have another computer.

The nice thing about using your favourite ssh client is that you get to
use a normal keyboard.

Marius Gedminas
-- 
Microsoft -- because God hates us.


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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[James Knott]

Tuomas Kulve wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>   
>> There's a big difference between setuid root ahd having to be root.
>> 
>
> Ping is just a link to busybox and setting busybox as setuid wouldn't
> probably be a good solution either.
>
>   

So are vi and pwd, but they both work, without being root.


-- 
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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Marius Gedminas]

On Sun, Dec 30, 2007 at 06:40:31PM +0200, Ari Yrjölä wrote:
> "Andrew Flegg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> > On Dec 30, 2007 12:42 PM, Ari Yrjölä <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >>
> >> >  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
> >> >  2. Install openssh
> >> >  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)
> >>
> >> Doesn't ask anything here with N800.
> >
> > There seem to be a couple of different openssh packages. Only one
> > asked me to enter a new root account password, the other was more
> > "traditional".
> 
> Ach. I think there was some other openssh in extras-devel, but it
> refused to install. Cannot see it there now. Maemo-extras has
> version 1:4.6p1-5maemo3, which doesn't ask anything.

This is the version that I installed.

According to /var/lib/dpkg/info/openssh-server.postinst, it only asks
for a new root password when you install openssh-server, not when you
upgrade.

Marius Gedminas
-- 
System going down at 5 this afternoon to install scheduler bug.


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Re: OS2008 beautiful!

[Marius Gedminas]

On Sun, Dec 30, 2007 at 10:08:45AM -0500, John Holmblad wrote:
> did you have any problem with apps that you had installed and were 
> running on OS2007 that are now "broken/not yet upgraded" on/to OS2008?

There are some changes/bugs in osso-xterm that I'm not entirely happy
about [1].  I miss the statusbarclock somewhat.  I did have to build several
command-line apps myself.  Other than that, no.

  [1] https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2473
  https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2392

Marius Gedminas
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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Tuomas Kulve]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> There's a big difference between setuid root ahd having to be root.

Ping is just a link to busybox and setting busybox as setuid wouldn't
probably be a good solution either.

-- 
Tuomas



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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[hendrik]

On Sun, Dec 30, 2007 at 05:03:42PM +0200, Tuomas Kulve wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
> > mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
> > necessary is itself a security problem.
> 
> Ping seems to be setuid root on my debian. So it's run as root here too.

There's a big difference between setuid root ahd having to be root.
I presume ping can handle its own security issues and ping properly and 
unobjectionably.  But if I have to become root before executing ping, 
there's a whole load of trouble I can get into by forgetting the stop 
being root after I've run ping.  Not to mention that I might be a 
know-little user who can't be trusted with full root access.  Who might 
know just enough to get into serious trouble but not enough not to.

-- hendrik

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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Tuukka Tolvanen]

Ed Bartosh wrote:

> Just one suggestion. '4. Open xterm' item in your list looks a bit confusing 
> for me.
> I'd replace it with something like 'run your favorite ssh client on your 
> desktop'.

That change to step 4 would complicate step 5; you'd have to know where 
to reach the tablet, you might not have network or your favorite ssh 
client or a desktop available, etc. ...iow, it would take prerequisites 
that aren't known to be available.

> On Sun, 2007-12-30 at 01:00, ext Marius Gedminas wrote:
>> Easy!
>>
>>  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
>>  2. Install openssh
>>  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)
>>  4. Open xterm
>>  5. ssh [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Type the password you set in step 3.

't.
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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Ari Yrjölä]

"Andrew Flegg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> On Dec 30, 2007 12:42 PM, Ari Yrjölä <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>>
>> >  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
>> >  2. Install openssh
>> >  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)
>>
>> Doesn't ask anything here with N800.
>
> There seem to be a couple of different openssh packages. Only one
> asked me to enter a new root account password, the other was more
> "traditional".

Ach. I think there was some other openssh in extras-devel, but it
refused to install. Cannot see it there now. Maemo-extras has
version 1:4.6p1-5maemo3, which doesn't ask anything.

I used dropbear-ssh with OS2007, and getting root was easy, as root's
password was always 'rootme'. Dropbear installer didn't say anything
about this huge security hole though.



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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps

[James Knott]

Ari Yrjölä wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
>   
>> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
>> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
>> necessary is itself a security problem.
>> 
>
> I guess ping requires root, because it's not a separate binary but
> included in busybox. /bin/ping is just a symlink to /bin/busybox,
> which is not setuid root, for obvious reasons.
>
>   

Others, such as vi and pwd also link to busybox, but can still be run by
user.


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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps

[Ari Yrjölä]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
> necessary is itself a security problem.

I guess ping requires root, because it's not a separate binary but
included in busybox. /bin/ping is just a symlink to /bin/busybox,
which is not setuid root, for obvious reasons.


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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Tuukka Tolvanen]

Peter Flynn wrote:
> Tuomas Kulve wrote:
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>
>>> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would
>>> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not
>>> necessary is itself a security problem.
>> Ping seems to be setuid root on my debian. So it's run as root here too.
> 
> That's because 'debianite' is an anagram of 'anal-retentive'
> (well, it's not, but it ought to be :-)

Here's some hints for why that might not be the reason for a debian 
ping's setuidness, plus why changing the itos in this regard could 
require jumping through some extra hoops:

a-random-debian-machine$ cp /bin/ping not-setuid-ping
a-random-debian-machine$ ./not-setuid-ping -c 1 maemo.org
ping: icmp open socket: Operation not permitted

Nokia-N800-50-2:~# ls -l /bin/ping
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 7 Dec 11 17:41 /bin/ping -> busybox

't.
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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Peter Flynn]

Tuomas Kulve wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
>> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
>> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
>> necessary is itself a security problem.
> 
> Ping seems to be setuid root on my debian. So it's run as root here too.

That's because 'debianite' is an anagram of 'anal-retentive'
(well, it's not, but it ought to be :-)

A Debian contributor once told me that all utilities which access the 
network should be root-privileged because otherwise they would allow 
ordinary users to know of (or detect) the existence of other machines, 
which might be a security breach.

///Peter
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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Krischan Keitsch]

> I've built some today (less, links, mc, wget; made vim actually
> installable).  I don't have upload privileges to maemo extras yet, so
> you can find them only at http://mg.pov.lt/770/
>
...
>
> Marius Gedminas

Hi Marius,

thanks for providing "mc". That makes remote working on the device much more 
convenient (at least for me ;-)

Happy new year to you and the community

Best regards 
Krischan

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Re: How to run a Nokia 770 as a HMI

[Mike Lococo]

> I am trying to find out how I could use the Nokia 770 as a human machine 
> interface. After starting the device only a webbrowser should appear in 
> fullscreen mode. The user should not be permitted to change anything. Has 
> anybody an idea?  

There is no out of the box functionality that will do this for you. 
You'll have to start by hacking the init files to start the tablet in 
the state you wish to have it in, and then start hacking on the security 
features you want in order to prevent the user from making undesirable 
state changes.

Search the archives for "kiosk" and you'll find the existing discussions 
about this topic.  Others have expressed interest, but no one has 
followed through to my knowledge.

http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/

Thanks,
Mike Lococo
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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Zoran Kolic]

> > That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
> > mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
> > necessary is itself a security problem.
> 
> I have no idea, but I've come across a few things in the N800 that cause
> me to question someone's decisions.

I do understand that device was intended for "non-geeks"
in mind, whatever it means. But, this sudo puzzle is more
to worry about. I think having user and root is better
than splitted privs for mundane things. The very principles
are changed and a lot of people just cannot find the way
out. Take a look at subjects on this list. Never found on
any mailing list for "normal" os. I see eee was made the
same way. Luckily, customized debian project, eeeos, just
goes the "debian" way, with all regular, obvious functions.
And nobody cares if zillion games/medias/sounds show up;
the problem is if someone wants firewall or to change privs
for underground processes.

Zoran

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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[James Knott]

Tuomas Kulve wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>   
>> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
>> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
>> necessary is itself a security problem.
>> 
>
> Ping seems to be setuid root on my debian. So it's run as root here too.
>
>   

Other than my N800, I have never experienced having to be root to ping. 
It is a useful user level diagnostic.  Imaging someone providing user
support in a large corporation, as I have done.  A user cannot connect
to something.  You talk them through various tests they can do, to help
isolate a problem.  One of the tools to use is ping.  Another is
traceroute.  I pity the support person, who doesn't have those available.


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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[James Knott]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> Ping is there, but you have to be root to use it.
>> 
>
> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
> necessary is itself a security problem.
>
>   

I have no idea, but I've come across a few things in the N800 that cause
me to question someone's decisions.

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Re: OS2008 beautiful!

[John Holmblad]

Marius,

did you have any problem with apps that you had installed and were 
running on OS2007 that are now "broken/not yet upgraded" on/to OS2008?

Best Regards,

 

John Holmblad

 

Acadia Secure Networks, LLC

* *



Marius Gedminas wrote:
> Flashed OS2008 on my N800 today.  My heartfelt thanks to everyone who
> participated in creating the beautiful theme, and all the user interface
> improvements.
>
> Also big thanks to those responsible for the enhanced osso-xterm in the
> default install image, extras repository predefined in the app
> installer, and openssh-server root password prompt.
>
> Marius Gedminas
>   
> 
>
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>   

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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[Tuomas Kulve]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
> mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
> necessary is itself a security problem.

Ping seems to be setuid root on my debian. So it's run as root here too.

-- 
Tuomas



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Re: Missing OS2008 cmdline apps (was Re: how to install OS2007?)

[hendrik]

On Sat, Dec 29, 2007 at 07:23:15PM -0500, James Knott wrote:
> Peter Flynn wrote:
> > Marius Gedminas wrote:
> >   
> >> On Thu, Dec 27, 2007 at 04:43:51PM +0100, Zoran Kolic wrote:
> >> 
>  If you're a new user, I'd forget O7 and go directly to 08.  There's
>  enough 08 stuff for a new user that you'll spend a week or more
>  exploring all that's available, and by then, even more stuff will be
>  available.
>  
> >>> A lot of useful command line tools have gone to the mist.
> >>> Hope the same will not get perl, python, ruby...
> >>>   
> >> So, what command-line tools do you miss?  I've got an idle scratchbox
> >> here.
> >> 
> >
> > ping and traceroute would be useful.
> >
> >   
> 
> Ping is there, but you have to be root to use it.

That's bizarre.  What security implications are there in ping that would 
mean it has to be run only by root?  Forcing people to use root when not 
necessary is itself a security problem.

-- hendrik
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Re: PhoneLink or CellPhoneTool or gnokii on OS2008

[Peter Bart]

On Sat, 29 Dec 2007 19:21:56 -0500
"Adam Nelson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> > Hi,
> > Depending on the carrier you have, they may have it
> > disabled. I use Verizon in the US and it's never worked. They
> > purposely disable most of bluetooth's capability by flashing their
> > own firmware onto the the handset.
> 
> 
> Thanks for the response.  Any idea how I would determine that
> conclusively?  Since I can't seem to get any meaningful error message
> or debug logs it seems the problem could be anything at all...
> 
> Thanks,
> Adam

Try 

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How to run a Nokia 770 as a HMI

[Kappler]

Hi,

I am trying to find out how I could use the Nokia 770 as a human machine 
interface. After starting the device only a webbrowser should appear in 
fullscreen mode. The user should not be permitted to change anything. Has 
anybody an idea?  

Best regards and a Happy New Year 

Andreas
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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Tuomas Kulve]

Ari Yrjölä wrote:
> Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> 
>> Easy!
>>
>>  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
>>  2. Install openssh
>>  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)
> 
> Doesn't ask anything here with N800.

Did work for me with n800 & os2008.

> Red pill + 'sudo gainroot' doesn't work either for me:

Red pill mode and "sudo gainroot" doesn't have anything to do with each
other.

> ~ $ sudo gainroot
> cal_read_block(r&d_mode): size zero, block not found?
> Enable RD mode if you want to break your device

You need to use the linux flasher tool to enable the R&D mode and to get
the "sudo gainroot" to work. The ssh thing is easier though.

-- 
Tuomas



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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Andrew Flegg]

On Dec 30, 2007 12:42 PM, Ari Yrjölä <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> >  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
> >  2. Install openssh
> >  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)
>
> Doesn't ask anything here with N800.

There seem to be a couple of different openssh packages. Only one
asked me to enter a new root account password, the other was more
"traditional".

> Red pill + 'sudo gainroot' doesn't work either for me:

"Red pill" mode only affects the Application Manager, and disables
checks in the GUI which prevent the direct installation of packages
which don't start with a section of "user/".

"sudo gainroot" will only work as a command in these cases:

1) R&D mode is enabled using the command line flasher or 0x
2) The "becomeroot" package is installed (easiest way, IMHO).

There are other mechanisms for getting root access, though, Marius
outlines one using SSH, for example. However, these only enable "sudo
gainroot" to work if the /usr/sbin/gainroot script is modified once
root access is available.

Hope that helps,

Andrew

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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Ari Yrjölä]

Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Easy!
>
>  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
>  2. Install openssh
>  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)

Doesn't ask anything here with N800.

Red pill + 'sudo gainroot' doesn't work either for me:

~ $ sudo gainroot
cal_read_block(r&d_mode): size zero, block not found?
Enable RD mode if you want to break your device

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Re: Getting root on OS2008

[Ed Bartosh]

Hi Marius,

This info looks like a good candidate for the next 'howdoibecomeroot' page on 
maemo wiki :).

Seriously we should probably have only one page for all 'become root' recipes.

Just one suggestion. '4. Open xterm' item in your list looks a bit confusing 
for me. 
I'd replace it with something like 'run your favorite ssh client on your 
desktop'. 

On Sun, 2007-12-30 at 01:00, ext Marius Gedminas wrote:
> Easy!
> 
>  1. Enable the Maemo Extras repository
>  2. Install openssh
>  3. Define a root password (openssh's installer prompts you for this)
>  4. Open xterm
>  5. ssh [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Type the password you set in step 3.
> 
> No 3rd-party packages or R&D mode necessary.
> 
> For extra geeks like me (warning: vi knowledge necessary):
> 
>  6. visudo
>  7. Add
> 
>   user ALL = (ALL) NOPASSWD: ALL
>   root ALL = (ALL) NOPASSWD: ALL
> 
> at the end.
> 
> Marius Gedminas
-- 
Best regards,
Ed
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