Re: N810 European Power Adapter
On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 3:13 PM, Matt Emson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Our pugs are actually safer because you can't pull them out by the flex, > so you don't stress the chord or pull the wires out of the plug. All > plugs are easily removed though. They just pull out. The switch turns > off the power when not in use. Otherwise the outlet is live, even with > nothing plugged in. That is just insane. No, it's convenient. Worrying about live outlets is paranoid. > It's pretty hard for a child to > electrocute themselves with a UK plug socket because of this and the > shutters. People still use covers, but need them a lot less than in the > US/Europe. Actually, what we have at work here is Darwinism. The idiots take themselves out of the gene pool, and the rest of us figure out that the universe is a dangerous place, and we all need to take responsibility for our own safety. But seriously, people (of all ages) need to think and act for themselves. No one else can do that for them, including governments or regulations. Trying to legislate common sense invariably has the opposite effect. That said, you're also forgetting that in the US we have half the voltage to deal with, and anyway it's current, not voltage that kills (some people survive several-hundred-thousand volt lightning strikes). The human body has a high enough resistance that people who are shocked by household current seldom experience anything more than momentary discomfort, much less death. This includes infants. I've been shocked many times with no ill effects, and I know many others with the identical experience. On the other hand, I don't personally know of *anyone* who has been hospitalized, much less died from getting shocked by house current. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm just saying that it's statistically insignificant, and those people probably have a preexisting condition that would have got them sooner or later anyway. There are specialized outlets and many different kinds of covers and blank plugs for those who are paranoid or have problem children. > > I can also walk in to any hardware store an buy a replacement plug and > fit it, should I want to. European and US plugs always seem to be molded. If the plug itself is damaged, there's usually something else that needs to be addressed, like poor placement or a serious malfunction. Replacing a molded plug is trivial. Just buy a new plug, cut the cord at the base of the old plug and install the new one (as replacements are every bit as common and available at hardware stores on this side of the pond). If losing an inch or two of cord is a problem, just replace the whole cord, which probably should have been done anyway if the length is that critically close. Molded plugs tend to be much smaller, therefore leaving more room for plugs in adjacent sockets, and the built-in strain-relief that they provide is much more effective and reliable than that of separate plugs. They also use less material and a whole lot less energy in manufacturing, and therefore are more environmentally sound. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
En/na Matt Emson ha escrit: > Our pugs are actually safer because you can't pull them out by the flex, > so you don't stress the chord or pull the wires out of the plug. All > plugs are easily removed though. They just pull out. The switch turns > off the power when not in use. Otherwise the outlet is live, even with > nothing plugged in. That is just insane. It's pretty hard for a child to > electrocute themselves with a UK plug socket because of this and the > shutters. People still use covers, but need them a lot less than in the > US/Europe. Hey, my comment was tongue-in-cheek, however all of my outlets have shutter and you have to insert both prongs at once, otherwise they won't open, so it's extremely difficult for a child to electrocute even if he tries to stick, say, a screwdriver in one of the holes. And if he manages that, there's always the main RCD. [...] > Yeah, we have those too. You did read about the limitations though? > > >>Limitations > > > A residual current circuit breaker cannot remove all risk of electric > shock or fire. In particular, an RCD alone will not detect > > overload conditions, phase to neutral short circuits or > phase-to-phase short circuits. > Over-current protection (fuse or circuit > > > breaker ) must be provided. > So, really you need a fuse too :-) Or a circuit breaker (actually I have 9 or 10, each one for a specific circuit). Bye -- Luca ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Luca Olivetti wrote: >> I find US and European outlets scary as heck, because they usually >> have no on/off switch. It's fairly rare to find an outlet int he UK >> without a on/off switch. >> > > Maybe that's because your huge plug it's too difficult to unplug we > just unplug them ;-) > Our pugs are actually safer because you can't pull them out by the flex, so you don't stress the chord or pull the wires out of the plug. All plugs are easily removed though. They just pull out. The switch turns off the power when not in use. Otherwise the outlet is live, even with nothing plugged in. That is just insane. It's pretty hard for a child to electrocute themselves with a UK plug socket because of this and the shutters. People still use covers, but need them a lot less than in the US/Europe. I can also walk in to any hardware store an buy a replacement plug and fit it, should I want to. European and US plugs always seem to be molded. > >> The fuse will blow before the fuse in the fusebox at the mains >> dispatch board, so yeah, it does protect the device. >> > > Only if the device is less valuable than the fuse, otherwise the device > will blow up stealthily protecting the fuse :-D > > http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?ModuleNo=4526&doy=20m3 Yeah, really expensive ;-) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363 >> This is ignoring >> any internal fuses that might exist in the device to protect US and >> European users ;-) >> > > We in the continent are well protected by these gizmos: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differential_breaker > much more effective than a fuse and a plug dimensioned to power a > small factory ;-) > Yeah, we have those too. You did read about the limitations though? >Limitations > A residual current circuit breaker cannot remove all risk of electric shock or fire. In particular, an RCD alone will not detect > overload conditions, phase to neutral short circuits or phase-to-phase short circuits. Over-current protection (fuse or circuit > breaker ) must be provided. So, really you need a fuse too :-) Adios! ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
El Thu, 20 Mar 2008 15:11:06 + Matt Emson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> escribió: > > I find US and European outlets scary as heck, because they usually > have no on/off switch. It's fairly rare to find an outlet int he UK > without a on/off switch. Maybe that's because your huge plug it's too difficult to unplug we just unplug them ;-) > The fuse will blow before the fuse in the fusebox at the mains > dispatch board, so yeah, it does protect the device. Only if the device is less valuable than the fuse, otherwise the device will blow up stealthily protecting the fuse :-D > This is ignoring > any internal fuses that might exist in the device to protect US and > European users ;-) We in the continent are well protected by these gizmos: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differential_breaker much more effective than a fuse and a plug dimensioned to power a small factory ;-) Bye -- Luca ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Theodore Tso wrote: > This is all true, but those plugs take up a huge amount of space in > laptop bags... and the number of times that I've had my equipment > blow up due to grounding problems or power surges is nil. And a fuse > doesn't protect against voltage spikes. > Size is relative. Depends on what you are used to really. I find US and European outlets scary as heck, because they usually have no on/off switch. It's fairly rare to find an outlet int he UK without a on/off switch. The fuse will blow before the fuse in the fusebox at the mains dispatch board, so yeah, it does protect the device. This is ignoring any internal fuses that might exist in the device to protect US and European users ;-) ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 10:50:54PM +, Peter Flynn wrote: > The other charger that *does* work with the N800 (and is much smaller > and neater) is my daughter's Nokia cellphone charger, but AFAIK you > can't buy this particular one separately. Why Nokia screw us around this > way is beyond me, and why they'd go to all the trouble of designing and > making multiple chargers that do the identical thing is baffling. You are probably comparing Nokia's AC-3 (the "Compact Charger", usually bundled with mobile phones) and the AC-4 (the "Travel Charger", the one bundled with all Nokia Internet Tablets). The AC-3 is smaller, but it outputs a 2x lower current than the AC-4. Google provides some anecdotic evidence that charging the battery with an AC-3 takes twice as long: http://discussions.nokia.co.uk/discussions/board/message?board.id=phones&message.id=21453 Marius Gedminas -- Smoking is one of the leading causes of statistics. -- Fletcher Knebel signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 12:13:46PM +, Matt Emson wrote: > UK (and Irish) plugs are completely different. They are far, far safer > in practice. Each plug has a rated fuse (3, 5 and 13 amps are common in > various devices.) Our plugs are designed to fail at the plug before > damaging the appliance. We also have an earth pin on all plugs (though > some devices don't use it.) This means that we don't have the "my outlet > has no earth pin" issue that people some times hack around in the US/Europe. This is all true, but those plugs take up a huge amount of space in laptop bags... and the number of times that I've had my equipment blow up due to grounding problems or power surges is nil. And a fuse doesn't protect against voltage spikes. > > ...and the UK too, if you activate the interlock on the (missing) earth > > leg with a toothpick (240vAC scares me) when you plug it in. > > So, what you are advocating is electrocuting yourself if the earth is > "live" and bypassing the fuse so that you can blow up your device in > case of a power surge? :-P (yes, I know.. the UK charger has no user > accessible fuse) What I recommend to fellow road warriors, is if you ever go to Japan, get one of these: http://www.warrior.co.jp/go-con.htm (Scroll to the bottom of the page to see pictures of how it can be configured.) It takes up a very tiny amount of space in your laptop bag, and it has a nice safe plastic ground-defeat for the UK plugs which is much safer than using a toothpick or a screwdriver. Not available for sale in the US or EU, probably because the safety bureaucrats would have apoplectic seizures over the thing, but I've never had a problem using it in over ten years. - Ted ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Jerry Van Baren wrote: > Luca Olivetti wrote: > >> En/na Kip Warner ha escrit: >> >> >>> Thank you, I think I will do that. I haven't been to Europe, but is >>> there just one standard plug across the EU, or do they vary? >>> >> The do vary but generally only the earth plug, so if you use a 2 prongs >> adapter (i.e. with no earth plug, enough for the tablet), it will work >> in France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Switzerland and probably >> most other EU countries (the UK being the exception). >> IIRC on wikipedia you can find the details. >> They are *generally* the same, but there is still a *lot* of variations around Europe, even ignoring the earth pin. Some have thicker prongs, some have really skinny ones. UK (and Irish) plugs are completely different. They are far, far safer in practice. Each plug has a rated fuse (3, 5 and 13 amps are common in various devices.) Our plugs are designed to fail at the plug before damaging the appliance. We also have an earth pin on all plugs (though some devices don't use it.) This means that we don't have the "my outlet has no earth pin" issue that people some times hack around in the US/Europe. > ...and the UK too, if you activate the interlock on the (missing) earth > leg with a toothpick (240vAC scares me) when you plug it in. > So, what you are advocating is electrocuting yourself if the earth is "live" and bypassing the fuse so that you can blow up your device in case of a power surge? :-P (yes, I know.. the UK charger has no user accessible fuse) I personally like what Apple did with all it's current chargers. My UK iPod charger has a clip on UK plug. My MacBook charger has both the same type of plug attachment and also an attachment that gives a long lead with a plug on the end. Pure genuis!! I'm pretty sure I could just buy the plug replacement for Europe/USA from Apple and not the entire charger - this would seem a lot more economical. I could also buy one adapter and use it for either iPod or Macbook. M ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Hi, >Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2008 13:48:09 -0700 >From: Kip Warner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: N810 European Power Adapter > >I bought my N810 in Canada, and so it uses a standard North >American power adapter. > >Is it easy to acquire one usable in Europe from over there? If >so, how much are they, and can they be used all across Europe? European (in addition to other countries) Electric Plugs (with pictures), Sockets, Voltages and Frequencies can be found from here. http://www.travel-images.com-/electric-plugs.html You can compare voltage and frequency requirements given for your device to the country specs to check if your device is compatible or not. Cheers, //Jarmo ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Luca Olivetti wrote: > En/na Kip Warner ha escrit: > >> Thank you, I think I will do that. I haven't been to Europe, but is >> there just one standard plug across the EU, or do they vary? > > The do vary but generally only the earth plug, so if you use a 2 prongs > adapter (i.e. with no earth plug, enough for the tablet), it will work > in France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Switzerland and probably > most other EU countries (the UK being the exception). > IIRC on wikipedia you can find the details. > > Bye ...and the UK too, if you activate the interlock on the (missing) earth leg with a toothpick (240vAC scares me) when you plug it in. DAMHIKT, gvb ;-) ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Steve Yelvington wrote: > Kip Warner wrote: >> I bought my N810 in Canada, and so it uses a standard North American >> power adapter. >> >> Is it easy to acquire one usable in Europe from over there? If so, how >> much are they, and can they be used all across Europe? I bought mine for my N800 (I assume the N810 uses the same) in the local (Cork) Nokia store and they charged some ludicrously inflated price (€25 I think) but it *works* -- the other clones I'd tried didn't seem to deliver. I also had to show them the N800 so they could see that it needed the tiny plug on the N800 end -- these were Nokia staff and they'd never seen or heard of the N800 before, and were unwilling to believe it, even turning it over and examining the Nokia label :-) The other charger that *does* work with the N800 (and is much smaller and neater) is my daughter's Nokia cellphone charger, but AFAIK you can't buy this particular one separately. Why Nokia screw us around this way is beyond me, and why they'd go to all the trouble of designing and making multiple chargers that do the identical thing is baffling. UK/Ireland chargers have a different plug (square-pin) to the standard (continental) European (round-pin) ones. I went looking for a continental in Berlin a couple of weeks ago but everywhere was out of them -- dunno why (and nor did the store). > The light gray print on your power supply should have its specs, and > AFAIK they're all 100-240V, 50-60Hz, so one power supply will work > anywhere. (It's actually quite difficult to find any that aren't > internationally flexible these days.) > > Get yourself a plug adaptor kit This is what I wanted to avoid, as they take up space, and tend to fall out of power outlets because of the cantilevered weight of the charger. If I go to the UK, I bring my existing (Irish) charger, cos it fits those daft square-pin sockets we use. If I go elsewhere in Europe, I want to bring the one that fits without an adapter. If I go to the States, I want to bring a US charger, because adapters *always* fall out of those little flat-prong sockets over there. I don't tend to do multi-continent trips, though. YMMV. It's extra kit, but I've had it with waking up in my hotel to find the N800 didn't charge overnight because the adapter is loose. ///Peter ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 2:48 PM, Kip Warner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I bought my N810 in Canada, and so it uses a standard North American > power adapter. > > Is it easy to acquire one usable in Europe from over there? If so, how > much are they, and can they be used all across Europe? > > -- > Kip Warner -- Software Engineer > OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred > http://www.thevertigo.com In addition to the likelihood that your existing adapter is multi-voltage, I've been successfully using a universal USB adapter with mine ever since I got it. I have both 12V to USB and 110-240V to USB adapters as well as the USB to 2mm Nokia cable (which will also charge from any USB hub or device with a powered USB host port, including laptop and desktop computers), so I'm set for power wherever I go. The same kit works with my cell phone, mp3 player, etc. It works with basically any device for which a 5V input is acceptable. That cuts down on a whole bunch of adapters when traveling. The bonus is that the kit cost me less than $10, so if it gets killed by the foreign power lines it's not a big deal. (Both of the AA NiMH battery charges I took to London died - I still don't know why.) I leave the original adapter safely at home. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
En/na Kip Warner ha escrit: > Thank you, I think I will do that. I haven't been to Europe, but is > there just one standard plug across the EU, or do they vary? The do vary but generally only the earth plug, so if you use a 2 prongs adapter (i.e. with no earth plug, enough for the tablet), it will work in France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Switzerland and probably most other EU countries (the UK being the exception). IIRC on wikipedia you can find the details. Bye -- Luca ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
On Wed, 2008-03-19 at 16:53 -0400, Steve Yelvington wrote: > Kip Warner wrote: > > I bought my N810 in Canada, and so it uses a standard North American > > power adapter. > > > > Is it easy to acquire one usable in Europe from over there? If so, how > > much are they, and can they be used all across Europe? > > > The light gray print on your power supply should have its specs, and > AFAIK they're all 100-240V, 50-60Hz, so one power supply will work > anywhere. (It's actually quite difficult to find any that aren't > internationally flexible these days.) > > Get yourself a plug adaptor kit (just plugs, not the transformer kind) > and you're set. I've used my American unit in France, Germany and > Spain, and will be taking it to China, Malaysia and Thailand next month. Thank you, I think I will do that. I haven't been to Europe, but is there just one standard plug across the EU, or do they vary? -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: N810 European Power Adapter
Kip Warner wrote: > I bought my N810 in Canada, and so it uses a standard North American > power adapter. > > Is it easy to acquire one usable in Europe from over there? If so, how > much are they, and can they be used all across Europe? > The light gray print on your power supply should have its specs, and AFAIK they're all 100-240V, 50-60Hz, so one power supply will work anywhere. (It's actually quite difficult to find any that aren't internationally flexible these days.) Get yourself a plug adaptor kit (just plugs, not the transformer kind) and you're set. I've used my American unit in France, Germany and Spain, and will be taking it to China, Malaysia and Thailand next month. ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
N810 European Power Adapter
I bought my N810 in Canada, and so it uses a standard North American power adapter. Is it easy to acquire one usable in Europe from over there? If so, how much are they, and can they be used all across Europe? -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
