Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[John Rudd]

Alan Williamson wrote:
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7033352.stm
> 
> "The N800 has support from a wealth of third parties and looks to be 
> more of a hobbyist device."


I think that's true.  In some regards, the N800 is still a hobbyist 
device.  Certain things I think you'd find as "key functions" in a PDA 
aren't bundled into it from the factory, and don't have syncing ability 
with desktop applications.  So, you have to depend on 3rd parties to get 
basic functionality into the PDA ... and while that's fine with me, it's 
also more of a hobbyist thing than a consumer thing.

I'm not sure where they got the idea that the menus are difficult or 
annoying ... the one and only annoyance I have with the application 
menus are that pop-up/context menus are difficult to invoke reliably.  I 
asked, via an enhancement request, that there be some other way to 
invoke that functionality, but the response I got back wasn't positive.


But, it certainly wouldn't hurt for the various pieces of the review to 
be taken as "feature requests" by Nokia :-}   For example, a less 
menu/button driven version of zooming (where you can pick the screen 
region to zoom into, and things like that) would be nice.  A little bit 
better video support (video out ... I don't know if any of the 3rd party 
video players add DivX and n.264, if not, then a nokia 
supplied/supported add-on for that would be nice).


Though, one thing I found lacking in the review: while they mention, 
prominently, the "core functionality" of the other three devices (games 
for the PSP, video player for the archos, music player for the iPod), 
they only mention the Nokia's communication capability in passing (one 
small mention of "internet telephony").  Lets see you make skype VOIP 
calls, and google-talk video chats, on the other devices.  I think they 
should have mentioned this as one of the major bullet items, since a) 
it's a nokia device, and communication is as big to Nokia as music is to 
an iPod, and video is to the archos, and b) it rounds out the mention of 
the core functions of _all_ 4 devices.

The top 3 apps I have on simple launcher are, after all, communication 
applications.  Pidgin, Claws-Mail, and xterm (for ssh).  To me, that's 
what the N800 is about: staying connected.  The iPod Touch certainly 
doesn't give me those capabilities (my final choice was "iPod Touch" vs 
"N800", and the N800, so I compared them on this very closely).  I don't 
recall it being a strength of the archos either ... though, if the PSP 
has AIM, YIM, Jabber, IMAP, and ssh ... I'd love to hear about it.  Even 
if it does, I wouldn't expect Sony to make them a core supported piece 
of the PSP's design, yet Nokia did make communication a core part of the 
N800.

(the other annoyance I have with the review: they talk about how easy it 
is to do music with the iPod, but completely forget to mention that the 
Nokia has a built in rhapsody client, internet radio player, AND FM 
radio ... I know people who wont buy the iPod Touch nor iPhone because 
it lacks the FM radio)



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RE: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Dr. Nicholas Shaw]

John,

I agree with your comments regarding PDA software as well as the difficulty
of menus.  I found the menus on the N800 to be extremely simple.  I have a
PSP (original) and it is nowhere near as functional as the N800 and
certainly more challenging to move around (I mostly use it for games).

I also agree with the communications.  The PSP has 802.11b versus the N800s
11g.  Thus, it's much faster.  I also have no issues with the size of the
N800.

Regarding music, I have never gotten the FM radio to work, even in a large
city.  But it's still better (what there is) than a PSP... :-)

Nick.
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of John Rudd
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 9:18 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: maemo-users@maemo.org
Subject: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

Alan Williamson wrote:
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7033352.stm
> 
> "The N800 has support from a wealth of third parties and looks to be 
> more of a hobbyist device."


I think that's true.  In some regards, the N800 is still a hobbyist 
device.  Certain things I think you'd find as "key functions" in a PDA 
aren't bundled into it from the factory, and don't have syncing ability 
with desktop applications.  So, you have to depend on 3rd parties to get 
basic functionality into the PDA ... and while that's fine with me, it's 
also more of a hobbyist thing than a consumer thing.

I'm not sure where they got the idea that the menus are difficult or 
annoying ... the one and only annoyance I have with the application 
menus are that pop-up/context menus are difficult to invoke reliably.  I 
asked, via an enhancement request, that there be some other way to 
invoke that functionality, but the response I got back wasn't positive.


But, it certainly wouldn't hurt for the various pieces of the review to 
be taken as "feature requests" by Nokia :-}   For example, a less 
menu/button driven version of zooming (where you can pick the screen 
region to zoom into, and things like that) would be nice.  A little bit 
better video support (video out ... I don't know if any of the 3rd party 
video players add DivX and n.264, if not, then a nokia 
supplied/supported add-on for that would be nice).


Though, one thing I found lacking in the review: while they mention, 
prominently, the "core functionality" of the other three devices (games 
for the PSP, video player for the archos, music player for the iPod), 
they only mention the Nokia's communication capability in passing (one 
small mention of "internet telephony").  Lets see you make skype VOIP 
calls, and google-talk video chats, on the other devices.  I think they 
should have mentioned this as one of the major bullet items, since a) 
it's a nokia device, and communication is as big to Nokia as music is to 
an iPod, and video is to the archos, and b) it rounds out the mention of 
the core functions of _all_ 4 devices.

The top 3 apps I have on simple launcher are, after all, communication 
applications.  Pidgin, Claws-Mail, and xterm (for ssh).  To me, that's 
what the N800 is about: staying connected.  The iPod Touch certainly 
doesn't give me those capabilities (my final choice was "iPod Touch" vs 
"N800", and the N800, so I compared them on this very closely).  I don't 
recall it being a strength of the archos either ... though, if the PSP 
has AIM, YIM, Jabber, IMAP, and ssh ... I'd love to hear about it.  Even 
if it does, I wouldn't expect Sony to make them a core supported piece 
of the PSP's design, yet Nokia did make communication a core part of the 
N800.

(the other annoyance I have with the review: they talk about how easy it 
is to do music with the iPod, but completely forget to mention that the 
Nokia has a built in rhapsody client, internet radio player, AND FM 
radio ... I know people who wont buy the iPod Touch nor iPhone because 
it lacks the FM radio)



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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Brad Midgley]

Nicholas

> Regarding music, I have never gotten the FM radio to work

fyi the headphones have to be in to act as an antenna even if you're
using the speakers.

since I'd rather have fewer wires I've been enjoying the itech
bluetooth headset with an fm radio of its own. This will be great once
the bluetooth drivers are in maemo.

Brad
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RE: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Dr. Nicholas Shaw]

Thanks, Brad. I'll give that a try!

Nick.
 

-Original Message-
From: Brad Midgley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 1:26 PM
To: Dr. Nicholas Shaw
Cc: John Rudd; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; maemo-users@maemo.org
Subject: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

Nicholas

> Regarding music, I have never gotten the FM radio to work

fyi the headphones have to be in to act as an antenna even if you're
using the speakers.

since I'd rather have fewer wires I've been enjoying the itech
bluetooth headset with an fm radio of its own. This will be great once
the bluetooth drivers are in maemo.

Brad

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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Steve Yelvington]

I was surprised that the reviewer had troubles getting online through 
Bluetooth and a mobile phone, as that's one of the coolest and easiest 
things about the N800. By contrast, getting either Windows or OS X to 
connect via GPRS can be hellishly difficult.


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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Peter Bart]

On Wed, 10 Oct 2007 13:25:32 -0600
"Brad Midgley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Nicholas
> 
> > Regarding music, I have never gotten the FM radio to work
> 
> fyi the headphones have to be in to act as an antenna even if you're
> using the speakers.

Make sure you plug them all the way in, until it clicks. Mine
takes way more force than I would have thought.

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm on the Road
State Licensed Plumber
State Certified Backflow Device Tester
Factory Trained Boiler Install/Service

24h Service 313.215.5175

Don't sleep with a drip! Call a licensed and experienced plumber.
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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Gary Baribault]

The other thing, is that I couldn't get it to work until I downloaded
the presets by using the "tower' icon in the botom right of the applet,
after that it worked great!

Gary Baribault


Dr. Nicholas Shaw wrote:
> Thanks, Brad. I'll give that a try!
> 
> Nick.
>  
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Brad Midgley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 1:26 PM
> To: Dr. Nicholas Shaw
> Cc: John Rudd; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; maemo-users@maemo.org
> Subject: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices
> 
> Nicholas
> 
>> Regarding music, I have never gotten the FM radio to work
> 
> fyi the headphones have to be in to act as an antenna even if you're
> using the speakers.
> 
> since I'd rather have fewer wires I've been enjoying the itech
> bluetooth headset with an fm radio of its own. This will be great once
> the bluetooth drivers are in maemo.
> 
> Brad
> 
> ___
> maemo-users mailing list
> maemo-users@maemo.org
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
> 
> 
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RE: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Dr. Nicholas Shaw]

Thanks, guys! I'll try this out along with your suggestions for success!!

Nick.
 

-Original Message-
From: Gary Baribault [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 4:21 PM
To: Dr. Nicholas Shaw
Cc: 'Brad Midgley'; maemo-users@maemo.org
Subject: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

The other thing, is that I couldn't get it to work until I downloaded
the presets by using the "tower' icon in the botom right of the applet,
after that it worked great!

Gary Baribault


Dr. Nicholas Shaw wrote:
> Thanks, Brad. I'll give that a try!
> 
> Nick.
>  
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Brad Midgley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 1:26 PM
> To: Dr. Nicholas Shaw
> Cc: John Rudd; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; maemo-users@maemo.org
> Subject: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices
> 
> Nicholas
> 
>> Regarding music, I have never gotten the FM radio to work
> 
> fyi the headphones have to be in to act as an antenna even if you're
> using the speakers.
> 
> since I'd rather have fewer wires I've been enjoying the itech
> bluetooth headset with an fm radio of its own. This will be great once
> the bluetooth drivers are in maemo.
> 
> Brad
> 
> ___
> maemo-users mailing list
> maemo-users@maemo.org
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
> 
> 

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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Mike Klein]

I believe DUN was removed from WM5 phones and will be reintroduced with 
WM6it might've been carriers which asked for it disabled.

They would prefer you be on an explicit tethering plan. Bluetooth PAN is 
now default instead of DUN.


mike

Steve Yelvington wrote:
> I was surprised that the reviewer had troubles getting online through 
> Bluetooth and a mobile phone, as that's one of the coolest and easiest 
> things about the N800. By contrast, getting either Windows or OS X to 
> connect via GPRS can be hellishly difficult.
>
>
> ___
> maemo-users mailing list
> maemo-users@maemo.org
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
>   
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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[Ivan N. Zlatev]

On 10/11/07, Mike Klein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I believe DUN was removed from WM5 phones and will be reintroduced with
> WM6it might've been carriers which asked for it disabled.
>
> They would prefer you be on an explicit tethering plan. Bluetooth PAN is
> now default instead of DUN.
>
>

AFAIK Bluetooth DUN is back in WM6. And yes PAN is pain on the N800,
but it's possible
http://i-nz.net/2007/09/14/windows-mobile-5-device-as-a-bluetooth-modem-for-the-nokia-n800/

-- 
Ivan N. Zlatev

Web: http://www.i-nZ.net
"It's all some kind of whacked out conspiracy."
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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[sebastian maemo]

That's right... When trying to connect my laptop via bluetooth to my 3G
phone was really hard and complex. But connecting my N770 with my phone is
EASY and ALWAYS works :)

And as John said, communicating with my family via GoogleTalk when I'm
abroad is also terribly EASY (and CHEAP if I can hack a free WLAN) and
ALWAYS works :)



2007/10/10, Steve Yelvington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> I was surprised that the reviewer had troubles getting online through
> Bluetooth and a mobile phone, as that's one of the coolest and easiest
> things about the N800. By contrast, getting either Windows or OS X to
> connect via GPRS can be hellishly difficult.
>
>
> ___
> maemo-users mailing list
> maemo-users@maemo.org
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
>
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Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices

[A J Thew]

On 10/11/07, sebastian maemo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> That's right... When trying to connect my laptop via bluetooth to my 3G
> phone was really hard and complex. But connecting my N770 with my phone is
> EASY and ALWAYS works :)

I can only comment on Nokia 3G phones but my 770 has always worked
with all phones I've tried

A Thew
>
> And as John said, communicating with my family via GoogleTalk when I'm
> abroad is also terribly EASY (and CHEAP if I can hack a free WLAN) and
> ALWAYS works :)
>
>
>
> 2007/10/10, Steve Yelvington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > I was surprised that the reviewer had troubles getting online through
> > Bluetooth and a mobile phone, as that's one of the coolest and easiest
> > things about the N800. By contrast, getting either Windows or OS X to
> > connect via GPRS can be hellishly difficult.
> >
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[Fwd: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices]

[Acadia Secure Networks]

All,

fyi.

Best Regards,

 

John Holmblad

 

Acadia Secure Networks, LLC

*Serving the SmartDigital^TM home, entrepreneurial enterprise, and 
emerging network service provider markets*




 Original Message 
Subject:Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices
Date:   Wed, 10 Oct 2007 20:15:09 -0400
From:   Acadia Secure Networks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Organization:   Acadia Secure Networks
To: Mike Klein
References: 



Mike,

WM5 originally had DUN, although some operators apparently suppressed 
it. My understanding is that Microsoft eventually removed the DUN 
software components from a later version of the WM5 build so that, for 
example, CD's from the operators with the WM5 object code no longer had 
the DUN  .exe (or perhaps it was a .dll).

In any case I suspect that an enterprising user could, if they so chose, 
find the necessary WM5 DUN components on the www and install them to get 
DUN working in WM5 by first googling

   "dun wm5".

and proceeding from there.

I know that Bluetooth DUN works on WM5, or, at least on the build 
version that I have (OS 5.1.195 - (Build14928.2.2.0)), because I use WM5 
DUN + the N800 whenever I am "on the road" for business. I have also 
used USB DUN between my WM5 device and a Windows 2000 Laptop successfully.


Best Regards,



John Holmblad



Acadia Secure Networks, LLC

*Serving the SmartDigital^TM home, entrepreneurial enterprise, and 
emerging network service provider markets*




Mike Klein wrote:
> I believe DUN was removed from WM5 phones and will be reintroduced with 
> WM6it might've been carriers which asked for it disabled.
>
> They would prefer you be on an explicit tethering plan. Bluetooth PAN is 
> now default instead of DUN.
>
>
> mike
>
> Steve Yelvington wrote:
>   
>> I was surprised that the reviewer had troubles getting online through 
>> Bluetooth and a mobile phone, as that's one of the coolest and easiest 
>> things about the N800. By contrast, getting either Windows or OS X to 
>> connect via GPRS can be hellishly difficult.
>>
>>
>> ___
>> maemo-users mailing list
>> maemo-users@maemo.org
>> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
>>   
>> 
> ___
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> maemo-users@maemo.org
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>
>   



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Re: [Fwd: Re: BBC reviews N800 with 3 other devices]

[Brad Midgley]

hey

Even when they do have the profile, MS DUN performance is too pathetic
to get excited about. I've never seen over 128Kbps using 3 different
ppc devices. This was on a network that should be hitting the bt1.2
ceiling of 600+kbps.

Strangely, their desktop DUN *client* is slow too, even when used with
the motorola e815 flip phone that provides over 600kbps to linux
clients.

Brad
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