Re: [Mageia-dev] soundwrapper
Le mercredi 7 mars 2012 22:57:40, Colin Guthrie a écrit : > So when testing make sure you do NOT use soundwrapper before doing your > test. > Yes. In fact, I tested on a system without pulseaudio, playing music through mplayer. I launched the game, if this failed (crash or no sound), I kept soundwrapper.
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
2012/3/8 Colin Guthrie : > 'Twas brillig, and Juan Luis Baptiste at 07/03/12 23:45 did gyre and gimble: >> On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Colin Guthrie wrote: >>> As I said last time to this question, I'd certainly be extremely annoyed >>> if mga2 does not default to systemd. I've given up a massive amount of >>> my free time over this cycle working towards this. I would be massively >>> annoyed if this effort was ultimately towards a secondary option. >>> >>> >> >> Don't worry, no one has said that it shouldn't :), but it's clear >> there's a confusion as you have seen, many people understood that >> systemd would come as an alternative to mga2 and sysvinit as default, >> and systemd as default in mga3. I also remember reading last year this >> but never the change of plans, maybe it was decided on the meetinfgs, >> but as I can't attend to them because of the schedule I missed the >> announcement. > > Well that's just the thing, I don't see it as a change... As far as I'm > concerned I've always been targeting a systemd-by-default mga2. I thought as well that this will be the case. Related question: Just started updates and urpmi asks me to select either - systemd-sysvinit or - sysvinit-legacy for installation. I suppose when using systemd I should install systemd-sysvinit, right? -- wobo
Re: [Mageia-dev] Release_blocker bugs
Le mercredi 07 mars 2012 à 21:43 +0100, Manuel Hiebel a écrit : > Hello, > > How can we (the bugsquad or other people) determinate what can be a > release_blocker bug ? > > in the triage guide we can see: > > "The release_blocker priority is only relevant to bugs filed on Cauldron > or beta releases, and should only be used for issues which are > sufficiently critical that it would severely impair the overall quality > of a release if it were made available without the issue being > resolved." > > That is not clear for me. And the only mail relating to that, was from > Anne in May and not useful for me. I would say "stuff that cannot be fixed after release" would be release blocker. Not to say that the rest cannot be too, but at least, that's the first criteria. So a software on livecd that crash on startup would also be a blocker. -- Michael Scherer
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
On Wed, 7 Mar 2012, Charles A Edwards wrote: On Wed, 07 Mar 2012 22:06:19 + Colin Guthrie wrote: The actual use case of using a text login and then starting X is quite small. Of course some people (like Wobo) do use this but it's definitely the exception rather than the rule. You can also add me to that 'small' list. +1 Dale Huckeby
Re: [Mageia-dev] rpmsrate cleaning
2012/2/23 Anne nicolas : > Hi there Hi Here is a reminder > > While working on debugging isos, we found out that a big cleanning > should be done on rpmsrate. Below a list of packages non available in > Mageia. Can you please add a status deprecated / imported / don't import > > so that we can clean this > > https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Cleaning_rpmsrate Cheers -- Anne http://www.mageia.org
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
'Twas brillig, and Wolfgang Bornath at 08/03/12 08:24 did gyre and gimble: > 2012/3/8 Colin Guthrie : >> 'Twas brillig, and Juan Luis Baptiste at 07/03/12 23:45 did gyre and gimble: >>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Colin Guthrie wrote: As I said last time to this question, I'd certainly be extremely annoyed if mga2 does not default to systemd. I've given up a massive amount of my free time over this cycle working towards this. I would be massively annoyed if this effort was ultimately towards a secondary option. >>> >>> Don't worry, no one has said that it shouldn't :), but it's clear >>> there's a confusion as you have seen, many people understood that >>> systemd would come as an alternative to mga2 and sysvinit as default, >>> and systemd as default in mga3. I also remember reading last year this >>> but never the change of plans, maybe it was decided on the meetinfgs, >>> but as I can't attend to them because of the schedule I missed the >>> announcement. >> >> Well that's just the thing, I don't see it as a change... As far as I'm >> concerned I've always been targeting a systemd-by-default mga2. > > I thought as well that this will be the case. > > Related question: > Just started updates and urpmi asks me to select either > - systemd-sysvinit or > - sysvinit-legacy > for installation. I suppose when using systemd I should install > systemd-sysvinit, right? Yup! This should have happened earlier (in fact I thought it was already asking you that but with the sysvinit package called just "sysvinit" but it seems we needed to rename it to get urpmi to really do the right thing. Due to the vendor list, it should prefer the systemd version and thus pick it by default for you or use it without question if you pass --auto. Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] Mageia support for GMA 3600 (Cedar Trail Atom)
On Wed, 7 Mar 2012, David W. Hodgins wrote: > On Wed, 07 Mar 2012 21:00:38 -0500, wrote: > > > On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 tux99-...@uridium.org wrote: > > > >> > >> Hi, > >> I just tried Mageia 2 beta 1 on a Intel DN2800MT board hoping that it > >> would have framebuffer support for the GMA 3600, but the attached > >> monitor goes into standby (no signal) as soon as the frame buffer gets > >> activated during boot. > > Try disabling kms by adding either nokmsboot or modeset.i915=0 to > the kernel options. > > Regards, Dave Hodgins > Thanks but neither nokmsboot nor i915.modeset=0 make much of a difference. With nokmsboot I get the mageia splash screen for a second or too (I wasn't seeing that before), but after that the monitor still goes into standby. i915.modeset=0 has no effect. The following Meego ISO works fine with this mobo (both kms and xorg): http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/updates/1.2.0/images/meego-netbook-ia32-cedartrail/ Also Centos 6.2 boots fine to runlevel 3 without disabling anything (probably because the Centos 6.2 kernel doesn't have any support for the GMA3600).
Re: [Mageia-dev] Mageia support for GMA 3600 (Cedar Trail Atom)
'Twas brillig, and tux99-...@uridium.org at 08/03/12 02:00 did gyre and gimble: > On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 tux99-...@uridium.org wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> I just tried Mageia 2 beta 1 on a Intel DN2800MT board hoping that it >> would have framebuffer support for the GMA 3600, but the attached >> monitor goes into standby (no signal) as soon as the frame buffer gets >> activated during boot. >> >> As far as I understand there is frame buffer support in the 3.3 kernel >> for the GMA 3600 so in theory it should work. >> >> Are you aware of this issue or should I do a bug report? >> >> Has anyone else tested a GMA 3600 (the GPU that's in all Cedar Trail >> Atom cpus) with Mageia so far? >> >> Regards, >> tux99 > > Just to add: I have tried all grub opptions (normal, non-fb and > failsafe) on each of them the same thing happens. with non-fb I can see > the boot process until almost the end, I guess it's the start of the dm > that triggers the loss of signal in that case. > > I tried editing the grub line adding a "3" at end hopeing to get it to > boot to runlevel 3 but that doesn't seem to work as the behaviour > doesn't change. Is "3" on the grub line still supposed to work? > > I imagine this GMA3600 issue needs solving before the final release as > CedarTrail Atoms will be in most Netbooks sold this year, and even > though netbooks are less popular then they used to be, they are still > selling by the milions especially in Asia. > > Let me know what I could do to help debug this. This depends on your upgrade path of your Mageia install. Is it a fresh install? Runlevel 3 works fine here, but if you've upgraded your box from cauldron for a while, they it's possible that the static getty on tty1 is not configured. Switch to tty2 after booting to runlevel 3. It should let you log in. Then make sure to run "systemctl enable getty@.service" to ensure your tty1 is enabled. Don't know about that chipset in particular tho'. Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] Mageia support for GMA 3600 (Cedar Trail Atom)
On Thu, 8 Mar 2012, Colin Guthrie wrote: > 'Twas brillig, and tux99-...@uridium.org at 08/03/12 02:00 did gyre and > gimble: > > On Thu, 8 Mar 2012 tux99-...@uridium.org wrote: > > > >> > >> Hi, > >> I just tried Mageia 2 beta 1 on a Intel DN2800MT board hoping that it > >> would have framebuffer support for the GMA 3600, but the attached > >> monitor goes into standby (no signal) as soon as the frame buffer gets > >> activated during boot. > >> > >> As far as I understand there is frame buffer support in the 3.3 kernel > >> for the GMA 3600 so in theory it should work. > >> > >> Are you aware of this issue or should I do a bug report? > >> > >> Has anyone else tested a GMA 3600 (the GPU that's in all Cedar Trail > >> Atom cpus) with Mageia so far? > >> > >> Regards, > >> tux99 > > > > Just to add: I have tried all grub opptions (normal, non-fb and > > failsafe) on each of them the same thing happens. with non-fb I can see > > the boot process until almost the end, I guess it's the start of the dm > > that triggers the loss of signal in that case. > > > > I tried editing the grub line adding a "3" at end hopeing to get it to > > boot to runlevel 3 but that doesn't seem to work as the behaviour > > doesn't change. Is "3" on the grub line still supposed to work? > > > > I imagine this GMA3600 issue needs solving before the final release as > > CedarTrail Atoms will be in most Netbooks sold this year, and even > > though netbooks are less popular then they used to be, they are still > > selling by the milions especially in Asia. > > > > Let me know what I could do to help debug this. > > This depends on your upgrade path of your Mageia install. Is it a fresh > install? Yes, fresh install using the Mageia 2 beta 1 netinstall ISO, I selected the LXDE desktop to keep the install size small. > Switch to tty2 after booting to runlevel 3. It should let you log in. Well if I press Ctrl-Alt-F2 after waiting 10-15 seconds after the screen goes into standby during boot, I still don't get the a video signal back. I can then press Ctrl-Alt-Del and the system will shut down cleanly so it's not frozen, it's only the video output that doesn't work with Mageia.
[Mageia-dev] Version freeze: reminder
Hi there Version freeze is now active. As a reminder please have a look here https://www.mageia.org/pipermail/mageia-dev/2012-March/012533.html for more details. Cheers -- Anne http://www.mageia.org
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
08.03.2012 14:04, kamil kirjutas:
Name: get-skypeRelocations: (not relocatable)
- remove noarch tag
- add ExclusiveArch tag with value %{ix86}, Skype for Linux is currently 32-bit
only and it needs 32-bit libraries
+ sander85
- fix some typos
Skype is pretty popular nowdays. 64-bit systems are pretty popular too,
you know. Yes, we had conflict with policy. But in this case i think the
policy is the one that must be changed. For exeptions like Skype. Or we
need to add Nonfree 32 for 64-bit systems which makes a lot less sense
to me. Or you will start explaining to users again, why we don't have
Skype in our distro :(
It worked w/o any problems on 64-bit systems. Now we are back in square one.
--
Sander
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
Le 08/03/2012 13:20, Sander Lepik a écrit :
08.03.2012 14:04, kamil kirjutas:
Name : get-skype Relocations: (not relocatable)
- remove noarch tag
- add ExclusiveArch tag with value %{ix86}, Skype for Linux is
currently 32-bit only and it needs 32-bit libraries
+ sander85
- fix some typos
Skype is pretty popular nowdays. 64-bit systems are pretty popular too,
you know. Yes, we had conflict with policy. But in this case i think the
policy is the one that must be changed. For exeptions like Skype. Or we
need to add Nonfree 32 for 64-bit systems which makes a lot less sense
to me. Or you will start explaining to users again, why we don't have
Skype in our distro :(
If you start explaining issues, maybe you could directly explain the
truth, aka:
- skype itself is not present, because its licensing prevent redistribution
- a skype installer is present, in a specific package section
- in order to install it, they may have to first configure a new urpmi media
Requesting policy exception just because 'life is otherwise too much
complex for our poor users base' isn't going to get much suffrage...
--
BOFH excuse #226:
A star wars satellite accidently blew up the WAN.
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
Le jeudi 08 mars 2012 à 14:20 +0200, Sander Lepik a écrit :
> 08.03.2012 14:04, kamil kirjutas:
> > Name: get-skypeRelocations: (not relocatable)
> >
> > - remove noarch tag
> > - add ExclusiveArch tag with value %{ix86}, Skype for Linux is currently
> > 32-bit only and it needs 32-bit libraries
> >
> >+ sander85
> > - fix some typos
> Skype is pretty popular nowdays. 64-bit systems are pretty popular too,
> you know. Yes, we had conflict with policy. But in this case i think the
> policy is the one that must be changed. For exeptions like Skype. Or we
> need to add Nonfree 32 for 64-bit systems which makes a lot less sense
> to me. Or you will start explaining to users again, why we don't have
> Skype in our distro :(
Like with flash for some month ?
https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Mageia_1_Errata#The_skeleton_Adobe_Flash_Player_package_only_exists_in_the_Nonfree_repository
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
2012/3/8 Colin Guthrie : > 'Twas brillig, and Wolfgang Bornath at 08/03/12 08:24 did gyre and gimble: >> 2012/3/8 Colin Guthrie : >>> 'Twas brillig, and Juan Luis Baptiste at 07/03/12 23:45 did gyre and gimble: On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 6:34 PM, Colin Guthrie wrote: > As I said last time to this question, I'd certainly be extremely annoyed > if mga2 does not default to systemd. I've given up a massive amount of > my free time over this cycle working towards this. I would be massively > annoyed if this effort was ultimately towards a secondary option. > > Don't worry, no one has said that it shouldn't :), but it's clear there's a confusion as you have seen, many people understood that systemd would come as an alternative to mga2 and sysvinit as default, and systemd as default in mga3. I also remember reading last year this but never the change of plans, maybe it was decided on the meetinfgs, but as I can't attend to them because of the schedule I missed the announcement. >>> >>> Well that's just the thing, I don't see it as a change... As far as I'm >>> concerned I've always been targeting a systemd-by-default mga2. >> >> I thought as well that this will be the case. >> >> Related question: >> Just started updates and urpmi asks me to select either >> - systemd-sysvinit or >> - sysvinit-legacy >> for installation. I suppose when using systemd I should install >> systemd-sysvinit, right? > > Yup! This should have happened earlier (in fact I thought it was already > asking you that but with the sysvinit package called just "sysvinit" but > it seems we needed to rename it to get urpmi to really do the right thing. > > Due to the vendor list, it should prefer the systemd version and thus > pick it by default for you or use it without question if you pass --auto. Thx, after I selected '1' urpmi told me that the package sysvinit is going to be uninstalled. After installing 440 updates (including kernel) and reboot system comes up fine without any failure messages. Desktop (KDE) is on tty1, using ctrl+Alt+F2 (-F6) takes me to a text login on tty2-6 as expected. tty7-11 are not accessible, tty12 shows syslog messages. -- wobo
Re: [Mageia-dev] [Mageia-sysadm] no more mails from bugzilla?
On 8 March 2012 12:59, Thierry Vignaud wrote: >>> It looks like bugzilla no more send mails when new comments are added >>> to bugs where I'm in the cc list since a couple days... >>> See you >> >> I didn't notice any problem. Do you have an exemple of bug where you >> didn't receive email ? > > https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4724 > https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4432 > https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4197 > https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4769 > > Thus I've opened https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4850 Anybody else not receiving bugzilla mails anymore?
[Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache (was: Re: [changelog] [RPM] cauldron core/release rutorrent-3.4-2.mga2)
08.03.2012 13:48, kamil kirjoitti: > Name: rutorrentRelocations: (not relocatable) > Version : 3.4 Vendor: Mageia.Org [...] > kamil 3.4-2.mga2: > + Revision: 221417 > - fix a requirement and use now apache (apache-conf is obsoleted by apache) WTF, so e.g. lighttpd requires apache now? Isn't that a bit strange? (rutorrent only required 'apache-conf' for the apache user, and I guess the same was true for lighttpd) -- Anssi Hannula
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache (was: Re: [changelog] [RPM] cauldron core/release rutorrent-3.4-2.mga2)
On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 13:33, Anssi Hannula wrote: > 08.03.2012 13:48, kamil kirjoitti: >> Name : rutorrent Relocations: (not relocatable) >> Version : 3.4 Vendor: Mageia.Org > [...] >> kamil 3.4-2.mga2: >> + Revision: 221417 >> - fix a requirement and use now apache (apache-conf is obsoleted by apache) > > WTF, so e.g. lighttpd requires apache now? Isn't that a bit strange? > > (rutorrent only required 'apache-conf' for the apache user, and I guess > the same was true for lighttpd) And for /var/www/html This should really be a server-neutral thing (with a better name for the user, like www-data) but I never took the time to do it :(
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On 08.03.2012 14:33, Anssi Hannula wrote: 08.03.2012 13:48, kamil kirjoitti: Name: rutorrentRelocations: (not relocatable) Version : 3.4 Vendor: Mageia.Org [...] kamil 3.4-2.mga2: + Revision: 221417 - fix a requirement and use now apache (apache-conf is obsoleted by apache) WTF, so e.g. lighttpd requires apache now? Isn't that a bit strange? (rutorrent only required 'apache-conf' for the apache user, and I guess the same was true for lighttpd) From the Apache .spec: "Summary:The most widely used Web server on the Internet Name: apache (...) Obsoletes: apache-conf"
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On 08.03.2012 14:43, Kamil Rytarowski wrote: On 08.03.2012 14:33, Anssi Hannula wrote: 08.03.2012 13:48, kamil kirjoitti: Name: rutorrentRelocations: (not relocatable) Version : 3.4 Vendor: Mageia.Org [...] kamil 3.4-2.mga2: + Revision: 221417 - fix a requirement and use now apache (apache-conf is obsoleted by apache) WTF, so e.g. lighttpd requires apache now? Isn't that a bit strange? (rutorrent only required 'apache-conf' for the apache user, and I guess the same was true for lighttpd) From the Apache .spec: "Summary:The most widely used Web server on the Internet Name: apache (...) Obsoletes: apache-conf" * Thu Sep 01 2011 guillomovitch 2.2.20-2.mga2 + Revision: 137745 - merge apache-conf and apache-base, to reduce dependencies hell - rework dependencies to a comprehensive model: apache is an empty package, requiring the configuration, the modules and an engine - rework post/preun scripts to use 'service httpd condrestart' - ensure post/preun dependencies consistency with post/preun scriptlets - simplify macros mess - stop preventing initscript to be localized
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
Le jeudi 8 mars 2012 03:08:03, Colin Guthrie a écrit : > This is why I give far less credence to "old habits" and "how it's been > done in the past" and much more to "what would my mum expect" or "what > would a novice computer user expect". I understand why you want to remove startx and I agree. But a lot of people dont't read this mailing list. My suggestion is to put in /usr/bin/startx #!/bin/sh echo "startx is deprecated, use instead kdm or gdm or lxdm" echo "More informations on http://.."; Then old linux users will be not not lost... for Mageia. -- Pierre Jarillon - http://pjarillon.free.fr/ Vice-président de l'ABUL : http://abul.org Microsoft est à l'informatique ce que McDonald est à la gastronomie
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
On 08.03.2012 13:20, Sander Lepik wrote:
08.03.2012 14:04, kamil kirjutas:
Name: get-skypeRelocations: (not
relocatable)
- remove noarch tag
- add ExclusiveArch tag with value %{ix86}, Skype for Linux is
currently 32-bit only and it needs 32-bit libraries
+ sander85
- fix some typos
Skype is pretty popular nowdays. 64-bit systems are pretty popular
too, you know. Yes, we had conflict with policy. But in this case i
think the policy is the one that must be changed.
Do you want to merge 32-bit and 64-bit software for nonfree and tainted?
For exeptions like Skype.
Why?
Or we need to add Nonfree 32 for 64-bit systems which makes a lot less
sense to me.
If we add core 32-bit, then why not nonfree 32-bit? Why to bloat our
servers with pseudo 64-bit packages?
Or you will start explaining to users again, why we don't have Skype
in our distro :(
1. Skype isn't in our distro, just a dummy package.
2. Moving into the right place = not shipping at all?
3. Tagging Skype as noarch is a falsehood. What about the coming ARM?
What about other 32-bit only software?
It worked w/o any problems on 64-bit systems. Now we are back in
square one.
Every 32-bit software should work without any problems with 64-bit
systems.. this is not a real argument.
--
Sander
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
Le 08/03/2012 14:38, Pascal Terjan a écrit : On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 13:33, Anssi Hannula wrote: 08.03.2012 13:48, kamil kirjoitti: Name: rutorrentRelocations: (not relocatable) Version : 3.4 Vendor: Mageia.Org [...] kamil 3.4-2.mga2: + Revision: 221417 - fix a requirement and use now apache (apache-conf is obsoleted by apache) WTF, so e.g. lighttpd requires apache now? Isn't that a bit strange? (rutorrent only required 'apache-conf' for the apache user, and I guess the same was true for lighttpd) And for /var/www/html This should really be a server-neutral thing (with a better name for the user, like www-data) but I never took the time to do it :( What is needed exactly by various web servers ? I really doubt anything else as apache requires apache configuration file. And if it is just a /var/www/html directory, there is no use to have a dependency for something any sysadmin is able to create himself. -- A dropped nut will seek the least level of accessibility -- Assembly General Shefields Corollaries n°5
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
'Twas brillig, and Pierre Jarillon at 08/03/12 13:58 did gyre and gimble: > Le jeudi 8 mars 2012 03:08:03, Colin Guthrie a écrit : >> This is why I give far less credence to "old habits" and "how it's been >> done in the past" and much more to "what would my mum expect" or "what >> would a novice computer user expect". > > I understand why you want to remove startx and I agree. But a lot of people > dont't read this mailing list. > My suggestion is to put in /usr/bin/startx > > #!/bin/sh > echo "startx is deprecated, use instead kdm or gdm or lxdm" > echo "More informations on http://.."; > > Then old linux users will be not not lost... for Mageia. Yup, that's exactly what I was proposing to do until such times as there is a replacement that can act like a real session manager. Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] [RFC] Nonresponsive or absent package maintainers & policy discussion
Am 16.02.2012 10:25, schrieb Florian Hubold: Hi, due to the fact that this problem has already been encountered, it was brought up in yesterdays meeting that we need to discuss on a policy about how to handle unresponsive package maintainers, or if somebody is absent for a longer time (say more than a few days) we should also have guidelines or at least an official way to notify others of the absence. So to start and support the discussion, i've imported and adapted a Fedora policy on this subject into our wiki, the original version can be seen at: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackageMaintainers/Policy/NonResponsiveMaintainers I've imported it to: https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Nonresponsive_package_maintainers Remember this is just a proposal, so details may need to be readjusted, For example in place of the FESCo (Fedora Engineering Steering Committee) i've put a placeholder "packaging team leader/representative/member" but maybe this could also be a task for the council, it's just that we have a basis for discussion of the policy. About the absence, or if somebody is on vacation, i've imported also https://wiki.mageia.org/en/Absent So please add an entry there if you will be absent from Mageia contribution or not responding to emails/IRC for more than a few days. Regards Maybe "nonresponsive" should have been removed from the subject, then it wouldn't have infected everyone else ... :/ No comments, objections or anything about that proposal in the wiki?
Re: [Mageia-dev] [Mageia-sysadm] no more mails from bugzilla?
'Twas brillig, and Thierry Vignaud at 08/03/12 13:17 did gyre and gimble: > On 8 March 2012 12:59, Thierry Vignaud wrote: It looks like bugzilla no more send mails when new comments are added to bugs where I'm in the cc list since a couple days... See you >>> >>> I didn't notice any problem. Do you have an exemple of bug where you >>> didn't receive email ? >> >> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4724 >> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4432 >> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4197 >> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4769 >> >> Thus I've opened https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4850 > > Anybody else not receiving bugzilla mails anymore? I'm still getting them. Maybe it's just for @mageia.org addresses or something? Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
'Twas brillig, and Wolfgang Bornath at 08/03/12 13:06 did gyre and gimble: >> Yup! This should have happened earlier (in fact I thought it was already >> asking you that but with the sysvinit package called just "sysvinit" but >> it seems we needed to rename it to get urpmi to really do the right thing. >> >> Due to the vendor list, it should prefer the systemd version and thus >> pick it by default for you or use it without question if you pass --auto. > > Thx, after I selected '1' urpmi told me that the package sysvinit is > going to be uninstalled. > After installing 440 updates (including kernel) and reboot system > comes up fine without any failure messages. > Desktop (KDE) is on tty1, using ctrl+Alt+F2 (-F6) takes me to a text > login on tty2-6 as expected. Lovely. > tty7-11 are not accessible, tty12 shows syslog messages. Yeah, this is expected. If you like, you can configure getty's on tty7-11 if you set the NAutoVTs= to 11 (rather than the default of 6) in /etc/systemd/systemd-logind.conf Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
[Mageia-dev] plt compilation error
Hello! I can't build plt in our BS. There are files named "%something" how to pass with this package that block? Submission errors, aborting: - plt-mzscheme-4.2.4-2.mga2.i586: - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a18.ss %3a18 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a39/compiled %3a39 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/compiled/%3a98_ss.zo %3a98_ss - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a48/compiled/intermediate-format-strings_ss.dep %3a48 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a14/compiled/char-sets_ss.dep %3a14 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a42/compiled/eager-comprehensions_ss.dep %3a42 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/compiled/%3a5_ss.dep %3a5_ss - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a67/compiled/compare-procedures_ss.zo %3a67 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a57/compiled %3a57 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/compiled/%3a1_ss.zo %3a1_ss - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a71.ss %3a71 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/compiled/%3a28_ss.zo %3a28_ss - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/compiled/%3a38_ss.dep %3a38_ss - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a29/compiled/localization_ss.dep %3a29 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a57/records.ss %3a57 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a9.ss %3a9 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a2/and-let%2a.ss %3a2 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a2/and-let%2a.ss %2a - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/compiled/%3a17_ss.zo %3a17_ss - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a29/compiled/localization_ss.zo %3a29 - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a43.ss %3a43 (...)
[Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
Hi, Since switching to systemd, the mingetty we used to default to in inittab has been replaced by agetty (the default choice upstream). The question is should we switch it back to mingetty? An argument against mingetty is that the current support in systemd will automatically work over serial consoles. With embedded systems and such more common these days, this might actually be a common situation (for very small values of "common" of course!). >From the man page of mingetty: mingetty is a minimal getty for use on virtual consoles. Unlike agetty(8), mingetty is not suitable for serial lines. I recommend using mgetty(8) for this purpose. So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing serial console support. Have people got strong opinions on this? Can anyone remember why we ended up defaulting to mingetty in the first place? Col PS I'm aware of some "strange" behaviour on the current gettys. When on a getty you can use the cursor keys and move the cursor around. Keys such as backspace don't seem to work if you mistype your username or password (I'm pretty sure this used to work, but maybe I'm misremembering?). This is slightly improved with mingetty - in that the cursor keys don't move the text entry area, but they do print non-printable characters that still can't be deleted. I'll try and make this nicer, but it's probably not the highest priority problem on my list :p -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
08.03.2012 16:00, Kamil Rytarowski kirjutas: On 08.03.2012 13:20, Sander Lepik wrote: Skype is pretty popular nowdays. 64-bit systems are pretty popular too, you know. Yes, we had conflict with policy. But in this case i think the policy is the one that must be changed. Do you want to merge 32-bit and 64-bit software for nonfree and tainted? No, i don't. For exeptions like Skype. Why? Because this can't be done any other way. Or we need to add Nonfree 32 for 64-bit systems which makes a lot less sense to me. If we add core 32-bit, then why not nonfree 32-bit? Why to bloat our servers with pseudo 64-bit packages? Bloat? Noarch packages should be hardlinked AFAIK. Or you will start explaining to users again, why we don't have Skype in our distro :( 1. Skype isn't in our distro, just a dummy package. User has no idea what it is, (s)he either can find it in rpmdrake or not. 2. Moving into the right place = not shipping at all? For 64-bit users it is not shipping at all. 3. Tagging Skype as noarch is a falsehood. What about the coming ARM? What about other 32-bit only software? Lets deal with ARM problems when ARM is supported. For that time we might have 64-bit Skype. It worked w/o any problems on 64-bit systems. Now we are back in square one. Every 32-bit software should work without any problems with 64-bit systems.. this is not a real argument. Yes, but 32-bit nonfree packages are not available to 64-bit users. I was quite sure that Mageia would keep the usability bit that Mandriva had. But with our current direction Gentoo is soon easier to use for non-developer/sysadmin user. -- Sander
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
On Thursday 08 March 2012 15:17, Colin Guthrie wrote: > So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing > serial console support. Then you're also sacrificing a few braille users. (e.g. blind users.) -- Johnny A. Solbu PGP key ID: 0xFA687324 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
'Twas brillig, and Johnny A. Solbu at 08/03/12 14:29 did gyre and gimble: > On Thursday 08 March 2012 15:17, Colin Guthrie wrote: >> So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing >> serial console support. > > Then you're also sacrificing a few braille users. (e.g. blind users.) Can you give more details on this? Do you know how this was handled in our inittab setup? Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
Sander Lepik skrev 8.3.2012 16:18: I was quite sure that Mageia would keep the usability bit that Mandriva had. But with our current direction Gentoo is soon easier to use for non-developer/sysadmin user. You do realize we promote open source wich skype is not... And since MS is aquiring skype I guess there will soon be no linux version. but we can put info in errata / release notes on how to get skype for those that want it -- Thomas
Re: [Mageia-dev] [changelog] [RPM] cauldron nonfree/release get-skype-2.2.0.35-18.mga2.nonfree
Le 08/03/2012 15:18, Sander Lepik a écrit : I was quite sure that Mageia would keep the usability bit that Mandriva had. But with our current direction Gentoo is soon easier to use for non-developer/sysadmin user. Gentoo is still too much user-friendly for my taste, I'd rather target LFS :) C'mon guy, stop the FUD, and write correct user-readable documentation instead of ressorting to this kind of dirty hacks. -- The book or periodical most vital to the completion of your term paper will be missing from the library. Corollary: If it is available, the most important page will be torn out. -- Murphy's Rule of the Term Paper
Re: [Mageia-dev] plt compilation error
On 08/03/12 14:17, Kamil Rytarowski wrote: > Hello! > > I can't build plt in our BS. There are files named "%something" how to pass > with > this package that block? > > Submission errors, aborting: > - plt-mzscheme-4.2.4-2.mga2.i586: > - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a18.ss %3a18 You need to add an exception to rpmlint-mageia-policy. -- Malo
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 15:02, Guillaume Rousse wrote: > Le 08/03/2012 14:38, Pascal Terjan a écrit : >> And for /var/www/html >> This should really be a server-neutral thing (with a better name for >> the user, like www-data) but I never took the time to do it :( > > What is needed exactly by various web servers ? I really doubt anything else > as apache requires apache configuration file. And if it is just a > /var/www/html directory, there is no use to have a dependency for something > any sysadmin is able to create himself. It helps when it works out of the box. A user may not be aware, at first, that a /var/www/html has to be created + an index.html file put in it, to see its Web server work. It's a good default behaviour confirming the install succeeded and that the server works, it saves a few seconds to everyone trying/doing it first. Now, maybe each web server package should check if this /var/www/html directory exists and create it if needed (or have /var/www/apache, /var/www/lighttpd, etc.)? Or should that be better handled by a separate unique package?
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 14:57, Romain d'Alverny wrote: > On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 15:02, Guillaume Rousse > wrote: >> Le 08/03/2012 14:38, Pascal Terjan a écrit : >>> And for /var/www/html >>> This should really be a server-neutral thing (with a better name for >>> the user, like www-data) but I never took the time to do it :( >> >> What is needed exactly by various web servers ? I really doubt anything else >> as apache requires apache configuration file. And if it is just a >> /var/www/html directory, there is no use to have a dependency for something >> any sysadmin is able to create himself. > > It helps when it works out of the box. A user may not be aware, at > first, that a /var/www/html has to be created + an index.html file put > in it, to see its Web server work. It's a good default behaviour > confirming the install succeeded and that the server works, it saves a > few seconds to everyone trying/doing it first. > > Now, maybe each web server package should check if this /var/www/html > directory exists and create it if needed (or have /var/www/apache, > /var/www/lighttpd, etc.)? Or should that be better handled by a > separate unique package? I would prefer a package providing a web user and a default webroot. Else we can have such shared user created in each of the packages... It would be annoying to have to chown the writable directories when switching between servers.
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On 08.03.2012 15:57, Romain d'Alverny wrote: It helps when it works out of the box. +1 A user may not be aware, at first, that a /var/www/html has to be created + an index.html file put in it, to see its Web server work. It's a good default behaviour confirming the install succeeded and that the server works, it saves a few seconds to everyone trying/doing it first. It can save hours to less experienced users (who just wonder why there isn't "it works" page in Mageia). Now, maybe each web server package should check if this /var/www/html directory exists and create it if needed (or have /var/www/apache, /var/www/lighttpd, etc.)? It will be easier to maintain just one single package and add one common requirement then syncing different http services. Or should that be better handled by a separate unique package? +1
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
On Thu, 2012-03-08 at 14:17 +, Colin Guthrie wrote: > So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing > serial console support. Web hosting companies sometimes provide access to a serial console. > PS I'm aware of some "strange" behaviour on the current gettys. When on > a getty you can use the cursor keys and move the cursor around. Keys > such as backspace don't seem to work if you mistype your username or > password In "Mageia Release 1" (and Mandriva) backspace does work, but cursor keys will just insert esc [ A or whatever, with the ESC printed as ^[. BSD systems did this from 4.1 or maybe earlier (1980 or so), except it was DEL rather than BS to erase a character. Version 7 Unix had # and @ as erase character and back-to-start-of-word, not the DEC-style del and ^u. But maybe that's going back further than you meant ;-) -- Liam Quin - XML Activity Lead, W3C, http://www.w3.org/People/Quin/ Pictures from old books: http://fromoldbooks.org/ The barefoot programmer
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
Le 08/03/2012 16:13, Pascal Terjan a écrit : On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 14:57, Romain d'Alverny wrote: On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 15:02, Guillaume Rousse wrote: Le 08/03/2012 14:38, Pascal Terjan a écrit : And for /var/www/html This should really be a server-neutral thing (with a better name for the user, like www-data) but I never took the time to do it :( What is needed exactly by various web servers ? I really doubt anything else as apache requires apache configuration file. And if it is just a /var/www/html directory, there is no use to have a dependency for something any sysadmin is able to create himself. It helps when it works out of the box. A user may not be aware, at first, that a /var/www/html has to be created + an index.html file put in it, to see its Web server work. It's a good default behaviour confirming the install succeeded and that the server works, it saves a few seconds to everyone trying/doing it first. Now, maybe each web server package should check if this /var/www/html directory exists and create it if needed (or have /var/www/apache, /var/www/lighttpd, etc.)? Or should that be better handled by a separate unique package? I would prefer a package providing a web user and a default webroot. Else we can have such shared user created in each of the packages... It would be annoying to have to chown the writable directories when switching between servers. Fine with me. Unfortunatly, it's a bit late in the release process the change the 'apache' user name to a more neutral 'www-user' :/ -- If the food is fine, - it is cancerogenic - makes you fat - or both. -- The doctor's axioms
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
Le 08/03/2012 15:57, Romain d'Alverny a écrit : It helps when it works out of the box. A user may not be aware, at first, that a /var/www/html has to be created + an index.html file put in it, to see its Web server work. It's a good default behaviour confirming the install succeeded and that the server works, it saves a few seconds to everyone trying/doing it first. My point was just 'if only a directory is needed, just add it to basesystem, and don't create another package just for this'. -- Every activity takes more time than you have -- Murphy's In Laws n°3
Re: [Mageia-dev] plt compilation error
On 08.03.2012 15:42, Malo wrote: On 08/03/12 14:17, Kamil Rytarowski wrote: Hello! I can't build plt in our BS. There are files named "%something" how to pass with this package that block? Submission errors, aborting: - plt-mzscheme-4.2.4-2.mga2.i586: - unexpanded-macro /usr/lib/plt/collects/srfi/%3a18.ss %3a18 You need to add an exception to rpmlint-mageia-policy. Thank you, there was a need to edit one of the sources from rpmlint-mageia-policy.
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
Le jeudi 08 mars 2012 à 10:38 -0500, Liam R E Quin a écrit : > On Thu, 2012-03-08 at 14:17 +, Colin Guthrie wrote: > > > So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing > > serial console support. > > Web hosting companies sometimes provide access to a serial console. Then I guess they can also take the step of installing agetty or mgetty and configure it, since they have to configure it anyway. So we are just adding 1 rpm to install, documented to in the man pages ( and the rest of the web ). -- Michael Scherer
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
On Thursday 08 March 2012 15:33, Colin Guthrie wrote: > > Then you're also sacrificing a few braille users. (e.g. blind users.) > > Can you give more details on this? Some braille devices use the serial port in order to operate. How they communicate I don't really know. A blind friend of mine use serial console's when he cannot access the machine via network, during installation and when he cannot acess a system over the network for some reason, and brltty is not installed on it. I also believe some admins access servers which do not have a screen attached to it using serial console, and they can't or don't want to access it over the network. (A mailserver I used to maintain, had serial console access as requirement from the management.) If we are in the posistion to be able to chose between having serial console access or not, and it's not a big change in code, configuration and what not, my vote is to keep serial console access. -- Johnny A. Solbu PGP key ID: 0xFA687324 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [Mageia-dev] Build system bugs
On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 08:22, Pascal Terjan wrote: > On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 03:12, Funda Wang wrote: >> Well, here it is: >> >> http://pkgsubmit.mageia.org/uploads/failure/cauldron/core/release/20120307030202.fwang.valstar.13118/log/kdenetwork4-4.8.1-1.mga2/install_deps-2.0.20120307030203.log > > Thanks, I uploaded the missing packages. > It is the exact bug that should have been fixed by my change yesterday :( This time, it should really be fixed.
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 16:48, Guillaume Rousse wrote: > My point was just 'if only a directory is needed, just add it to basesystem, > and don't create another package just for this'. Ah, yes. Why not too. It doesn't take much room.
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
On 08/03/12 17:19, Romain d'Alverny wrote: > On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 16:48, Guillaume Rousse > wrote: >> My point was just 'if only a directory is needed, just add it to basesystem, >> and don't create another package just for this'. > > Ah, yes. Why not too. It doesn't take much room. +1 And what about user? lighttpd uses apache user, no? -- Malo
Re: [Mageia-dev] Mageia support for GMA 3600 (Cedar Trail Atom)
On Thu, 08 Mar 2012 04:52:46 -0500, wrote: Thanks but neither nokmsboot nor i915.modeset=0 make much of a difference. With nokmsboot I get the mageia splash screen for a second Probably best to open a bug report then. My guess is that it needs a firmware file, but I have no idea which one. Regards, Dave Hodgins
Re: [Mageia-dev] deprecate text installer
On 03/07/2012 09:34 PM, Maarten Vanraes wrote: considering https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4724 and that it's likely not working in cauldron for months, and also considering it's beyond our perl guru jq and our drakx-guru tv, and considering it looks like google didn't help... and considering there's 4 or 5 text-installer bugs i wanted to test out... perhaps we should consider in fact that text installer does not work... after all, if we get this fixed, there's still the other text-installer bugs... maybe it's premature for me, but considering this is version freeze... we're getting closer to the end... WDYT? This made me think of systems managed through IPMI or ALOM (yup, that later is only a Sun thing, but to get the idea...), and I don't think this interfaces are capabe of VGA graphics. That is not a big deal, but it forces you to attach a monitor to the VGA to install. BTW, will the text installer ever work through IMPI ? Is it even possible that kinkd of install ? -- J.A. Magallon \ Winter is coming...
Re: [Mageia-dev] lighttpd and others now require apache
'Twas brillig, and Malo at 08/03/12 17:22 did gyre and gimble: > On 08/03/12 17:19, Romain d'Alverny wrote: >> On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 16:48, Guillaume Rousse >> wrote: >>> My point was just 'if only a directory is needed, just add it to basesystem, >>> and don't create another package just for this'. >> >> Ah, yes. Why not too. It doesn't take much room. > +1 > > And what about user? > > lighttpd uses apache user, no? Yeah. It would be better if the user was www or similar rather than apache, but that will be a bit of a pita to change. But I'd suggest a common package here to deal with the creation of the user, folder and default index page. Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
'Twas brillig, and Michael Scherer at 08/03/12 16:27 did gyre and gimble: > Le jeudi 08 mars 2012 à 10:38 -0500, Liam R E Quin a écrit : >> On Thu, 2012-03-08 at 14:17 +, Colin Guthrie wrote: >> >>> So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing >>> serial console support. >> >> Web hosting companies sometimes provide access to a serial console. > > Then I guess they can also take the step of installing agetty or mgetty > and configure it, since they have to configure it anyway. So we are just > adding 1 rpm to install, documented to in the man pages ( and the rest > of the web ). Well I'm pretty sure the configuration is very minimal with systemd right now. Just a simply a matter of creating a getty@ttys1.service symlink or similar. If we patch the systemd to use mingetty, they'll maybe follow upstream docs and do this only to have it fail which is not goot. Of course we should perhaps not change getty@.service, but rather write a new mingetty@.service and link autovt@.service to that instead but we'll also have to patch prefdm.service too to ensure the appropriate conflicts are updated. While this is totally possible, I've not seen any arguments in favour of mingetty. I believe agetty is lighter weight and uses less memory. Any actual arguments to specifically use mingetty? Col -- Colin Guthrie colin(at)mageia.org http://colin.guthr.ie/ Day Job: Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/ Open Source: Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/ PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/ Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] Deprecating startx
'Twas brillig, and Colin Guthrie at 07/03/12 09:26 did gyre and gimble:
> Hi,
>
> Unless someone comes along and does a reasonable amount of coding before
> mga2, I think we'll have to deprecate supporting startx (it can still be
> used in some circumstances, but audio and accelerated graphics will not
> be available).
>
> See this comment (and the link therein) for more info on the issue:
> https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4652#c9
OK, so there is some good news on this issue.
After discussing this upstream and poking some Fedora folks, they came
up with a very simple and nice way of keeping 95% of the startx behaviour.
Simply patch it to use the argument -novtswitch when starting X
This would basically "temporarily convert" the text session to a
graphical one. There will be a couple of quirks but at least all devices
and such will work as before.
There are some drawbacks. Running startx over ssh will not work, but
then it wasn't ever officially supported anyway and was full of quirks.
I believe this will be detected and specifically disabled now.
Also you won't be able to "switch back" to the text console and look at
the output from the X server. This is easily enough worked around
however ("startx >x.log 2>&1" then just look at the x.log inside X or a
second text terminal).
If no one has a problem, I'll look to include the patch.
Col
--
Colin Guthrie
colin(at)mageia.org
http://colin.guthr.ie/
Day Job:
Tribalogic Limited http://www.tribalogic.net/
Open Source:
Mageia Contributor http://www.mageia.org/
PulseAudio Hacker http://www.pulseaudio.org/
Trac Hacker http://trac.edgewall.org/
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
On Thu, 2012-03-08 at 17:27 +0100, Michael Scherer wrote: [...] > > Web hosting companies sometimes provide access to a serial console. > > Then I guess they can also take the step of installing agetty or mgetty > and configure it, since they have to configure it anyway. This is not a good argument. You're more likely to find debian, centos, fedora used by web hosting companies than Mageia, partly because Mageia is new. Putting up obstacles isn't a good way to get adoption. But maybe a wiki page or a forum thread or even this email thread would be enough. -- Liam Quin - XML Activity Lead, W3C, http://www.w3.org/People/Quin/ Pictures from old books: http://fromoldbooks.org/ The barefoot typographer.
Re: [Mageia-dev] agetty vs. mingetty
On 03/08/2012 03:17 PM, Colin Guthrie wrote: Hi, Since switching to systemd, the mingetty we used to default to in inittab has been replaced by agetty (the default choice upstream). The question is should we switch it back to mingetty? Lookin other things I also looked at agetty manual, and found a couple useful things: o Optionally displays an alternative issue file instead of /etc/issue. o Optionally does not ask for a login name. o Optionally invokes a non-standard login program instead of /bin/login. This looks ideal for the case where prefdm fails and you want to show a big barner about it on tty1, or even drop the user direcly into drakx text mode without any login. Perhaps it can be done in prefdm if launching DISPLAYMANAGER fails. So, if space or memory is not an issue, I will go for agetty in both systemd and inittab. An argument against mingetty is that the current support in systemd will automatically work over serial consoles. With embedded systems and such more common these days, this might actually be a common situation (for very small values of "common" of course!). From the man page of mingetty: mingetty is a minimal getty for use on virtual consoles. Unlike agetty(8), mingetty is not suitable for serial lines. I recommend using mgetty(8) for this purpose. So if we switch to mingetty in getty@.service we'll be sacrificing serial console support. Have people got strong opinions on this? Can anyone remember why we ended up defaulting to mingetty in the first place? Col PS I'm aware of some "strange" behaviour on the current gettys. When on a getty you can use the cursor keys and move the cursor around. Keys such as backspace don't seem to work if you mistype your username or password (I'm pretty sure this used to work, but maybe I'm misremembering?). This is slightly improved with mingetty - in that the cursor keys don't move the text entry area, but they do print non-printable characters that still can't be deleted. I'll try and make this nicer, but it's probably not the highest priority problem on my list :p -- J.A. Magallon \ Winter is coming...
Re: [Mageia-dev] deprecate text installer
On Wednesday 07 March 2012 21:34, Maarten Vanraes wrote: > perhaps we should consider in fact that text installer does not work... As long as it is not removed all together in the future. My blind friend cannot use our GUI installer, so he is forced to use the text installer. The only GUI installer he's managed to get working is the Ubuntu installer, because it is a Gnome installer which use orca. (Maybe he's using the live-part of the Ubuntu CD/DVD to do it.) It is not so much that it's not working as it is the braille doesn't see it, hence he can't see it. He says that a distro which does not have a text installer is not a system he's willing to use. If we deprecate and remove the abillity to use a text installer, we are effectlively blocking blind users from beeing able to install the system. -- Johnny A. Solbu PGP key ID: 0xFA687324 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [Mageia-dev] deprecate text installer
On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 04:11 +0100, Johnny A. Solbu wrote: > If we deprecate and remove the abillity to use a text installer, we > are effectlively blocking blind users from beeing able to install the > system. The reason that I first started using Mandrake Linux years ago was that it was the first whose installer ran to completion out of 6 I tried, and which was neither red hat nor debian. There were problems with the default X configuration on that system; I always had to use "startx" on it, too, for that matter. One place where Linux-based systems do well is in catering to minority needs, not just the 70%. Languages (e.g. Icelandic or Welsh), unusual or older hardware, and people with individual needs, all can be included. Liam -- Liam Quin - XML Activity Lead, W3C, http://www.w3.org/People/Quin/ Pictures from old books: http://fromoldbooks.org/ The barefoot programmer
Re: [Mageia-dev] deprecate text installer
Op vrijdag 09 maart 2012 04:29:39 schreef Liam R E Quin: > On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 04:11 +0100, Johnny A. Solbu wrote: > > If we deprecate and remove the abillity to use a text installer, we > > are effectlively blocking blind users from beeing able to install the > > system. [..] I know how you guys feel, but the fact is that we're at beta1 and it's not working and it doesn't seem to be a simple problem... we're trying to fix it, but it doesn't seem good atm: https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4724 and if it's not working, we shouldn't advertise it
[Mageia-dev] Strings in bootloader.pot
Hi there, at the moment the Bootloader shows "Boot Mageia 2 (Cauldron)", this should be changed before the release to "Boot Mageia 2" with enough time for i18n to fix the translations and the installer to be rebuilt before the final isos are built. This is just a reminder so this won't be forgotten. Oliver
Re: [Mageia-dev] Strings in bootloader.pot
On 9 March 2012 08:30, Oliver Burger wrote: > at the moment the Bootloader shows "Boot Mageia 2 (Cauldron)", this should > be changed before the release to "Boot Mageia 2" with enough time for i18n > to fix the translations and the installer to be rebuilt before the final > isos are built. > > This is just a reminder so this won't be forgotten. We should _always_ have 2 strings: - "Boot Mageia %s" - "Boot Mageia %s (%s)" Translated once for ever. No harcoded version, no hardcoded product version
Re: [Mageia-dev] Strings in bootloader.pot
Am 09.03.2012 08:33, schrieb Thierry Vignaud: On 9 March 2012 08:30, Oliver Burger wrote: at the moment the Bootloader shows "Boot Mageia 2 (Cauldron)", this should be changed before the release to "Boot Mageia 2" with enough time for i18n to fix the translations and the installer to be rebuilt before the final isos are built. This is just a reminder so this won't be forgotten. We should _always_ have 2 strings: - "Boot Mageia %s" - "Boot Mageia %s (%s)" Translated once for ever. No harcoded version, no hardcoded product version I was suggesting this to Damien, but the question is, do languages not using latin letters keep the arabic number "2" and the word "Cauldron" here? Or do they replace it with a number and a word in their alphabet? Oliver
Re: [Mageia-dev] Strings in bootloader.pot
On 9 March 2012 08:44, Oliver Burger wrote: >> We should _always_ have 2 strings: >> - "Boot Mageia %s" >> - "Boot Mageia %s (%s)" >> >> Translated once for ever. >> No harcoded version, no hardcoded product version > > > I was suggesting this to Damien, but the question is, do languages not using > latin letters keep the arabic number "2" and the word "Cauldron" here? Or do > they replace it with a number and a word in their alphabet? That's not an issue, the argument would be another translated string
