[Mailman-Users] Using mailman with dial-up Internet access

2004-09-05 Thread Steve Mansfield
I understand that it's perfectly possible to use mailman on a server that
has only dial-up access to the Internet. However, I'd like to get a firm
grasp of the downsides of doing this before I go to the effort of
installing it.

My setup is this: Linux box running Fetchmail, Postfix, Procmail, Qpopper,
Apache. This sits on a LAN and access the net through an ISDN router. My
plan was to have list messages go to a POP server at my hosting provided
from where I would download them with Fetchmail, which would then forward
them to user 'mailman' on this server. Any problem with that?

Now, obviously I'm going to lose the web-based features for users, so it's
going to be an email-only system. What I'd like to know is how much of a
loss that would really be. I can get a list of the features I'd be missing
from the manuals etc - what I really want to know is how important people
feel this is - ie, a subjective response. Am I really crippling the system
this way (and would therefore be better off opening a group on Yahoo), or
would I be losing only moderately useful features? All informed opinions
would be gratefully received.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Using mailman with dial-up Internet access

2004-09-05 Thread Hilton J Ralphs
Quoting Steve Mansfield [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 My setup is this: Linux box running Fetchmail, Postfix, Procmail, Qpopper,
 Apache. This sits on a LAN and access the net through an ISDN router. My
 plan was to have list messages go to a POP server at my hosting provided
 from where I would download them with Fetchmail, which would then forward
 them to user 'mailman' on this server. Any problem with that?
 
Certainly not, works like a charm.

 Now, obviously I'm going to lose the web-based features for users, so it's
 going to be an email-only system. What I'd like to know is how much of a
 loss that would really be. I can get a list of the features I'd be missing
 from the manuals etc - what I really want to know is how important people
 feel this is - ie, a subjective response. Am I really crippling the system
 this way (and would therefore be better off opening a group on Yahoo), or
 would I be losing only moderately useful features? All informed opinions
 would be gratefully received.
 
At the end of the day it depands on various factors;

a. what do you intend to use the list for? one way distribution list or 
interactive like this one?

b. if interactive, then the question is whether it is a closed list or open to 
anyone who wants to join. Closed shouldn't be a problem, subscribe everyone 
upfront and then it's no problem. Public list needs to be advertised somewhere.

c. hosting the list via dialup means that the response time between posting an 
email and getting the mail will obviously be longer and may cause frustrations.

Good luck.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Using mailman with dial-up Internet access

2004-09-05 Thread Steve Mansfield
---
On Sunday 05 September 2004 12:41, Hilton J Ralphs wrote:
| a. what do you intend to use the list for? one way distribution list or
| interactive like this one?

Interactive. I'm considering mailman for a couple of lists - one new, one 
already hosted on yahoogroups (but I don't like the advertising and scruffy 
HTML that comes with yahoo). One reason for considering mailman is greater 
ownership and access to the message archive, with the possibility to use it 
for web content, but in a format of my choosing.

| b. if interactive, then the question is whether it is a closed list or open
| to anyone who wants to join. Closed shouldn't be a problem, subscribe
| everyone upfront and then it's no problem. Public list needs to be
| advertised somewhere.

It's effectively an open list, but in one case supporting an existing web site 
where I can advertise it and provide an online form for people to subscribe. 
(I could do this for the new list, too). Maybe it wouldn't be too hard to 
replicate some of mailman's web features account management features on that 
site (I have some PHP experience).

| c. hosting the list via dialup means that the response time between posting
| an email and getting the mail will obviously be longer and may cause
| frustrations.

My set-up does fetchmail and sendmail every 30 mins, so shouldn't be too bad, 
if not exactly instantaneous.

Thanks for the input.

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[Mailman-Users] Re: Uncaught runner exception: unknown encoding

2004-09-05 Thread Zoran Dzelajlija
David Relson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Greetings,

 FWIW, I've checked email/Charsets.py and it does have a gb2312 entry

If you look carefully, you can see there's a typo in that file, line 109,
where it says gb2132 not gb2312.  If you fix that, you then get

Uncaught runner exception: unknown encoding: eucgb2312_cn 

which is admittedly not much better. :-)

I for myself don't care as we have no Chinese lists on my installation, so I
did not bother with installing the additional codecs.  I just assume it's
all spam, and delete the shunted messages in gb2312 every now and then.

Regards,
Zoran

 I'm running mailman-2.1.5 on Mandrake 10.0 on Intel with kernel-2.4.22. 
 Any other info needed??

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[Mailman-Users] remove footer and attachment

2004-09-05 Thread desi6n
 When my client send a newsletter it shows up with an attachment paperclip beside it 
and he does not want the footer that appears at the bottom of the newsletter  - any 
way to fix this? Thanks! This is the footer example: Mailman-Users mailing [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-usersMailman FAQ: 
http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.pySearchable Archives: 
http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/

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Re: [Mailman-Users] remove footer and attachment

2004-09-05 Thread Mark Sapiro
desi6n wrote:

 When my client send a newsletter it shows up with an attachment paperclip beside it 
 and he does not want the footer that appears at the bottom of the newsletter  - any 
 way to fix this? Thanks! This is the footer example: Mailman-Users mailing [EMAIL 
 PROTECTED]://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-usersMailman FAQ: 
 http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.pySearchable Archives: 
 http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/


Visit the FAQ wizard at the location indicated in the above footer
example (Mailman FAQ:) and read article 4.39

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Re: Uncaught runner exception: unknown encoding

2004-09-05 Thread David Relson
On Sun, 5 Sep 2004 17:05:58 +0200
Zoran Dzelajlija wrote:

 David Relson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Greetings,
 
  FWIW, I've checked email/Charsets.py and it does have a gb2312 entry
 
 If you look carefully, you can see there's a typo in that file, line
 109, where it says gb2132 not gb2312.  

Good eye!  CHARSETS has gb2312, while CODEC_MAPS has gb2132.  All looked
good as I only saw the first one.

 If you fix that, you then get
 
 Uncaught runner exception: unknown encoding: eucgb2312_cn 
 
 which is admittedly not much better. :-)

Agreed.  I've had qrunner stop running a couple of times, which brings
my mailing lists to a crashing halt.  I've been looking at the error log
for hints about what's wrong.  Whatever can be done to make qrunner more
reliable is a plus!

 I for myself don't care as we have no Chinese lists on my
 installation, so I did not bother with installing the additional
 codecs.  I just assume it's all spam, and delete the shunted messages
 in gb2312 every now and then.

I don't have any asian languages either.  I'm tempted to try spam
filtering the incoming messages.  However since the lists are for a spam
filter (bogofilter), incoming messages can say look at this spammy
message.  

Of course, spam filtering for non-subscribers would be ideal.  I just
need to figure out where to do it.

Regards,

David
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[Mailman-Users] [PATCH] Charset.py

2004-09-05 Thread David Relson
Fix typo.

--- mailman-2.1.5/misc/email-2.5.5/email/Charset.py.orig2004-09-05 
11:37:31.984281632 -0400
+++ mailman-2.1.5/misc/email-2.5.5/email/Charset.py 2004-09-05 11:37:39.941072016 
-0400
@@ -106,7 +106,7 @@
 'ks_c_5601-1987': 'korean.cp949',
 'iso-2022-kr': 'korean.iso-2022-kr',
 'johab':   'korean.johab',
-'gb2132':  'eucgb2312_cn',
+'gb2312':  'eucgb2312_cn',
 'big5':'big5_tw',
 'utf-8':   'utf-8',
 # Hack: We don't want *any* conversion for stuff marked us-ascii,
as all

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[Mailman-Users] Back-up question

2004-09-05 Thread Info VH
How can I back up and/or transfer the members of my Mailman list?
Thanks,
Chris Knudson
Houston, TX
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[Mailman-Users] Using mailman with dial-up Internet access

2004-09-05 Thread The Admirable Crichton
I understand that it's perfectly possible to use mailman on a server that
has only dial-up access to the Internet. However, I'd like to get a firm
grasp of the downsides of doing this before I go to the effort of
installing it.

My setup is this: Linux box running Fetchmail, Postfix, Procmail, Qpopper,
Apache. This sits on a LAN and access the net through an ISDN router. My
plan was to have list messages go to a POP server at my hosting provided
from where I would download them with Fetchmail, which would then forward
them to user 'mailman' on this server. Any problem with that?

Now, obviously I'm going to lose the web-based features for users, so it's
going to be an email-only system. What I'd like to know is how much of a
loss that would really be. I can get a list of the features I'd be missing
from the manuals etc - what I really want to know is how important people
feel this is - ie, a subjective response. Am I really crippling the system
this way (and would therefore be better off opening a group on Yahoo), or
would I be losing only moderately useful features? All informed opinions
would be gratefully received.


-- 
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Born to serve . . .

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[Mailman-Users] Mailing list sends multiple copies of itself

2004-09-05 Thread Benedetta Manocchio
Ooops. I created a mailing list, but when I send a test email to the mailing list, 
multiple copies arrive in the inboxes. What did I do wrong? How do I correct this?
Thanks,
B


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Do you Yahoo!?
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
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[Mailman-Users] Unauthorized Access to APPL Mailing list

2004-09-05 Thread Nancy Kotz
Hello -

APPL uses Jaguar PC as our web host and we have 2 mailing lists set up
through their service. We use 1 of those mailing list for our electronic
newsletter. When the newsletter went out today I received a call that when
it was forward to several other people by one of our subscribers those that
received the forward also received an unauthorized attachment that was
pornographic in nature.

Needless to say we are very upset by this incident. I did notice that on the
public html page when I chose to view the mailing lists for APPL.ORG, there
was an unauthorized list and none of our real lists were there. That
unauthorized list is
Immagina_percorsiumanisti.net. When I clicked on that list the public html
was all in Spanish. Fortunately, when I did the same thing from the password
protected administrative page, our real mailing lists were there.

Your immediate attention to this matter is greatly appreciated. Please do
not hesitate to contact me should you have any questions or need additional
information.


Nancy C. Kotz
Member Services Coordinator
Association of Partners for Public Lands
Strengthening Public Land Partnerships
[EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Phone: 301-946-9475, extension 24; FAX: 301-946-9478

See you in Portland, Oregon!
Portland Pathways 2005, March 6-10th
http://www.appl.org/conventions.html

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Unauthorized Access to APPL Mailing list

2004-09-05 Thread Mark Sapiro
Nancy Kotz wrote:

APPL uses Jaguar PC as our web host and we have 2 mailing lists set up
through their service. We use 1 of those mailing list for our electronic
newsletter. When the newsletter went out today I received a call that when
it was forward to several other people by one of our subscribers those that
received the forward also received an unauthorized attachment that was
pornographic in nature.

If the only people who received the attachment were those that received
the forward, it would seem to be an issue for the person who forwarded
the post. There's no way that any person or list management software
can control what a recipient might attach to a received e-mail and
forward on.

Needless to say we are very upset by this incident. I did notice that on the
public html page when I chose to view the mailing lists for APPL.ORG, there
was an unauthorized list and none of our real lists were there. That
unauthorized list is
Immagina_percorsiumanisti.net. When I clicked on that list the public html
was all in Spanish. Fortunately, when I did the same thing from the password
protected administrative page, our real mailing lists were there.

This would seem to be an issue for Jaguar PC. It appears that someone
may have hijacked their server.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list sends multiple copies of itself

2004-09-05 Thread Mark Sapiro
Benedetta Manocchio wrote:

Ooops. I created a mailing list, but when I send a test email to the mailing list, 
multiple copies arrive in the inboxes. What did I do wrong? How do I correct this?

Hard to say. Do all subscribers receive multiple copies, the same
number, how many? What do the mailman post and smtp logs show?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] error in posting message

2004-09-05 Thread Brad Knowles
At 9:21 PM -0700 2004-08-31, teuku hasbullah wrote:
 I use mailman 2.1.5, solaris 5.9 o/s, python 2.2 and sendmail for MTA
	Mailman 2.1.5 requires Python 2.3.  See 
http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=showfile=faq05.008.htp.

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[Mailman-Users] announce only

2004-09-05 Thread desi6n
 Sorry to bother you - I'm having trouble with one of my client's mail list. It should 
be set up so no one except the administrator / moderator can post to the list - but 
people have been responding to the email and it is getting distrubuted to everyone 
else on the list. How can I make it so the list is announce only and can't be 
responded to? Also how do I set it up so the footer does not get sent? Right now it is 
being sent as an attachment and my client doesn't want that. Thanks

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Re: [Mailman-Users] announce only

2004-09-05 Thread Brad Knowles
At 1:16 PM -0400 2004-09-05, desi6n wrote:
  How can I make
 it so the list is announce only and can't be responded to?
	Visit the FAQ Wizard at 
http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py and see questions 3.11 and 
3.34.

 Also how do
 I set it up so the footer does not get sent? Right now it is being sent
 as an attachment and my client doesn't want that. Thanks
See also question 4.39.
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Re: [Mailman-Users] announce only

2004-09-05 Thread Mike Phillips
Regarding the footer problem, the FAQ says:

1. Configure Mailman to remove the footer
 2. Configure Mailman to strip all HTML and MIME formatting and send out all
  messages as text-only (text/plain)
 3. Get everyone to change the MUA they use to one that is more
HTML/MIME-aware
 4. Live with the problem

What if you want a footer? Other mail programs, like iMail Server, do not
seem to have the problem, or either I am not able see what steps have been
taken to avoid the problem.

Mike

- Original Message - 
From: Brad Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] announce only


 At 1:16 PM -0400 2004-09-05, desi6n wrote:

How can I make
   it so the list is announce only and can't be responded to?

 Visit the FAQ Wizard at
 http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py and see questions 3.11 and
 3.34.

   Also how do
   I set it up so the footer does not get sent? Right now it is being sent
   as an attachment and my client doesn't want that. Thanks

 See also question 4.39.

 -- 
 Brad Knowles, [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little
 temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

  -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), reply of the Pennsylvania
  Assembly to the Governor, November 11, 1755

SAGE member since 1995.  See http://www.sage.org/ for more info.
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Re: [Mailman-Users] announce only

2004-09-05 Thread Brad Knowles
At 3:34 PM -0400 2004-09-05, Mike Phillips wrote:
 Regarding the footer problem, the FAQ says:
 1. Configure Mailman to remove the footer
  2. Configure Mailman to strip all HTML and MIME formatting and send out all
   messages as text-only (text/plain)
  3. Get everyone to change the MUA they use to one that is more
 HTML/MIME-aware
  4. Live with the problem
 What if you want a footer?
What do you mean?
Other mail programs, like iMail Server, do not
 seem to have the problem, or either I am not able see what steps have been
 taken to avoid the problem.
	This is not server problem.  This is a client problem -- not all 
clients interpret the input the same way.

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Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little
temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
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[Mailman-Users] couple quick questions - mailman on obsd

2004-09-05 Thread Will Yardley
So I installed Mailman from ports on OpenBSD 3.5, and added the
following to mm_cfg.py after from Defaults import *

DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'mailman.code404.com'
DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'mailman.code404.com'
add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)

yet messages that are sent out still reference localhost.my.domain.

I restarted mailman via mailmanctl just in case that was necessary (I
don't think it should be anyway), and tried reversing the order too.
Nothing weird in the Mailman logs that I can find. Must be missing
something dumb... anyone have any ideas?

Also, I should know this one, but what is needed for Apache (1.3.29) to
recognize the stuff in cgi-bin/ as executable without the .cgi
extension? I don't see anything weird in the Apache config on a FreeBSD
machine w/ a similar setup, yet if I go to the appropriate link on the
new machine, it just spits out the contents of the file rather than
executing it. Didn't see anything in the install documentation that
suggests the need to add anything for this.

In the VirtualHost container, I have:

DocumentRoot /usr/local/lib/mailman/cgi-bin/
ServerName mailman.code404.com
ServerAlias mailman.code404.com
UseCanonicalName off
Options Includes Indexes FollowSymLinks ExecCGI

Alias /pipermail/ /var/spool/mailman/archives/public/

Directory /var/spool/mailman/archives/public/
AllowOverride All
AddDefaultCharset Off
/Directory

Since I want it to show up at the base domain, there's no ServerAlias.
I'm sure I'm probably missing something important here too - someone
want to clue me in?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Using mailman with dial-up Internet access

2004-09-05 Thread Jim Tittsler
On Sun, Sep 05, 2004 at 12:16:56PM +0200, Steve Mansfield wrote:
 I understand that it's perfectly possible to use mailman on a server that
 has only dial-up access to the Internet. However, I'd like to get a firm
 grasp of the downsides of doing this before I go to the effort of
 installing it.

In addition to losing the Mailman web features for the users,
you should remember that there may be mail delivery issues not
directly related to Mailman when trying to run a list from a
dial-up system.  Many ISPs block direct connections to their
mail servers from address blocks of dial-up users, which will
limit your ability to deliver mail directly to all of your
subscribers.  If you route mail through your provider's SMTP
server (smarthost), you may run afoul of traffic limits they
set on their users.

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Python Starship  http://Starship.Python.net/
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Re: [Mailman-Users] couple quick questions - mailman on obsd

2004-09-05 Thread Jim Tittsler
On Sun, Sep 05, 2004 at 04:57:50PM -0700, Will Yardley wrote:
 add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
 
 yet messages that are sent out still reference localhost.my.domain.

Did you create the list(s) before configuring the
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST in your mm_cfg.py?  (Is the Host name this
list prefers for email on the General Options page set
correctly?  Or if it is the URLs you are referring to, did you
run bin/fix_url.py?)

 Also, I should know this one, but what is needed for Apache (1.3.29) to
 recognize the stuff in cgi-bin/ as executable without the .cgi
 extension? I don't see anything weird in the Apache config on a FreeBSD

ScriptAlias /mailman/ /usr/local/mailman/cgi-bin/


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Jim Tittsler http://www.OnJapan.net/  GPG: 0x01159DB6
Python Starship  http://Starship.Python.net/
Ringo MUG Tokyo  http://www.ringo.net/rss.html

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[Mailman-Users] Re: couple quick questions - mailman on obsd

2004-09-05 Thread Will Yardley
On Mon, Sep 06, 2004 at 10:18:55AM +0900, Jim Tittsler wrote:
 On Sun, Sep 05, 2004 at 04:57:50PM -0700, Will Yardley wrote:

  add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
  
  yet messages that are sent out still reference localhost.my.domain.
 
 Did you create the list(s) before configuring the
 DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST in your mm_cfg.py?  (Is the Host name this
 list prefers for email on the General Options page set
 correctly?

Ahh.. nope. I knew that changes there wouldn't override the values set
for lists, but I thought (because of the behavior of DEFAULT_URL) that
it wasn't necessary to rebuild the list configs in this case if the
default hadn't been specifically overridden for the list itself..

Recreating the list fixed it for me.

  Also, I should know this one, but what is needed for Apache (1.3.29) to
  recognize the stuff in cgi-bin/ as executable without the .cgi
  extension? I don't see anything weird in the Apache config on a FreeBSD

 ScriptAlias /mailman/ /usr/local/mailman/cgi-bin/

Ahh - so just doing
ServerAlias / /usr/local/lib/mailman/cgi-bin/
does the trick.

Thanks much.

-- 
Since when is skepticism un-American?
Dissent's not treason but they talk like it's the same...
(Sleater-Kinney - Combat Rock)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] couple quick questions - mailman on obsd

2004-09-05 Thread John Fleming
 Also, I should know this one, but what is needed for Apache (1.3.29)
 to
 recognize the stuff in cgi-bin/ as executable without the .cgi
 extension? I don't see anything weird in the Apache config on a
 FreeBSD

 ScriptAlias /mailman/ /usr/local/mailman/cgi-bin/

In case it saves someone looking, it's
/mailman/  /var/lib/mailman/cgi-bin/
in Debian-Testing

THANKS - I needed that too!  - John


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[Mailman-Users] Problem with incorrect link to archives: It links to someone elses site!!

2004-09-05 Thread Chanchao

Hi,

I'm not quite sure if this is a know bug or a configuration issue
somewhere.. Problem is that the Go to list archives link points to a
completely different site that I've never heard of. Note that this happens
no matter how I set the archiving settings (archiving on or off, public or
private, it makes no difference)

Now my users are worried that users of this other site are having access to
our mail.

Any thoughts?  The link is here:

http://bkknights.netasia.org/mailman/private/list_bkknights.netasia.org/

And somehow this results in some San Fransisco based astronomers website
that I have nothing to do with.

Virtual internet worm hole? :-)   It's possible that the SF based site is
hosted on the same hosting provider as my domain is; that's the only
connection I can think of.

Cheers,
Chanchao


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Re: [Mailman-Users] Problem with incorrect link to archives: It linksto someone elses site!!

2004-09-05 Thread Mark Sapiro
Chanchao wrote:

I'm not quite sure if this is a know bug or a configuration issue
somewhere.. Problem is that the Go to list archives link points to a
completely different site that I've never heard of. Note that this happens
no matter how I set the archiving settings (archiving on or off, public or
private, it makes no difference)

Now my users are worried that users of this other site are having access to
our mail.

Any thoughts?  The link is here:

http://bkknights.netasia.org/mailman/private/list_bkknights.netasia.org/

And somehow this results in some San Fransisco based astronomers website
that I have nothing to do with.


If I go to the above link, I get to the list Private Archives
Authentication page, presumably for your list. I can go no further
without the e-mail address and list password of a subscriber.

You should be aware that both domains netasia.org and
sfaa-astronomy.org appear to be hosted by TOTALCHOICEHOSTING.COM and
all four names bkknights.netasia.org, netasia.org,
www.sfaa-astronomy.org
and sfaa-astronomy.org resolve to the same IP address 66.36.242.244.

I don't think you need to worry about the San Francisco Amateur
Astronomers accessing your list archives because like me, they
wouldn't be able to log in. Anyway, if I try to go to their web site,
that's where I wind up.

Virtual internet worm hole? :-)   It's possible that the SF based site is
hosted on the same hosting provider as my domain is; that's the only
connection I can think of.


As I note above, this seems to be the case. This is an issue for your
hosting provider and/or your domain registrar to work out. It appears
to be either a mistake or a misconfiguration of the web server at
66.36.242.244.

--
Mark Sapiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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[Mailman-Users] Rejecting Posts from some members

2004-09-05 Thread David Richards
Hi,

We have a need to restrict the senders of a list to a very small number of 
people.  These people may or may not be members of the list.  All other posts 
we wish to reject, how can this be acheived?

At the moment, the following are set:

default_member_moderation = no   (no members set to moderation)
member_moderation_action = reject
accept_these_nonmembers = ['[EMAIL PROTECTED]','[EMAIL PROTECTED]']
generic_nonmember_action = reject

[EMAIL PROTECTED] is a member of the list.

Thanks in advance,

David Richards
Senior Network Programmer
Information Technology Services
Queensland University of Technology
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