Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman/SpamAssassin holding for moderation instead of discarding spam

2008-03-18 Thread Fletcher Cocquyt 
Yes, I had upgraded spamassassin, but not the spamd.py
After installing the latest version and bouncing its logging no more errors,
and the vette log has the spamassassin scores - looks good - thanks!
Fletcher


On 3/18/08 5:23 PM, "Mark Sapiro" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Fletcher Cocquyt wrote:
>> Hi, forgive me for replying directly ­ I¹m on the digest version of the list
>> and saw your reply on the web archive
>> 
>> [Bounced to list - MS]
>> 
>> "Post by non-member to a members-only list" is the reason
> 
> 
> 
>> I also see this in the mailman error log:
>> Mar 18 15:45:02 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:45:15 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:45:30 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:45:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:45:46 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:46:01 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:46:26 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:46:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:46:41 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:46:58 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:47:12 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:47:18 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> Mar 18 15:47:33 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
>> 
>> Which is from spamd.py:
>> 
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:19pm 133 # egrep "not enough"
>> ./Mailman/Handlers/*.py
>> ./Mailman/Handlers/spamd.py:raise error('not enough words in
>> response header')
>> 
>> 
>> But I'm not sure if that is relevant
> 
> It's relevant. It means that your spamd.py module is not compatible with
> the spamd daemon on your system.
> 
> I don't know what spamd.py you're using, but the one from
>  atid=300103> 
> is looking for a header (first line) in the response from spamd that
> contains at least 3 whitespace delimited words. If it doesn't get at
> least 3 words in the first line of the response, it throws the "not
> enough words in response header" exception which results in
> SpamAssassin.py assigning a score of -1.


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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull 
Dragon writes:

 > The problem is that the relevant RFC document is vague on 
 > how that should be handled and displayed in the MUA.

I don't see that it's vague at all.  RFC 2822 provides several headers
for identifying various roles in transmitting the message on behalf of
the author.  The "From" header is specified to be the author(s);
putting information about *non-authors* in there is just plain wrong.

IMNSHO Outlook's behavior is definitely nonconforming.  And given the
popularity of Outlook, its continuation constitutes deliberate sabotage.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Digests not going out and lots of errors in/var/log/cron

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Troy D. Knabe wrote:

>My digest messages are not going out, and I am seeing these messages in
>/var/log/cron every 5 minutes.
>
>Do I need a home directory for my mailman user?


crond is not able to run any of the commands in mailman's crontab. The
fact that you are seeing these log messages every 5 minutes indicates
it is reading your mailman crontab and trying to run gate_news so you
migh be able to make it work by putting

HOME=/path/to/mailman/prefix

in the initial lines of the crontab, but normally, this is set as
mailman's home directory.

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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman/SpamAssassin holding for moderation instead of discarding spam

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Fletcher Cocquyt wrote:
> Hi, forgive me for replying directly ­ I¹m on the digest version of the list
> and saw your reply on the web archive
> 
> [Bounced to list - MS]
> 
> "Post by non-member to a members-only list" is the reason



> I also see this in the mailman error log:
> Mar 18 15:45:02 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:45:15 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:45:30 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:45:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:45:46 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:46:01 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:46:26 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:46:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:46:41 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:46:58 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:47:12 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:47:18 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> Mar 18 15:47:33 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
> 
> Which is from spamd.py:
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:19pm 133 # egrep "not enough"
> ./Mailman/Handlers/*.py
> ./Mailman/Handlers/spamd.py:raise error('not enough words in
> response header')
> 
> 
> But I'm not sure if that is relevant

It's relevant. It means that your spamd.py module is not compatible with 
the spamd daemon on your system.

I don't know what spamd.py you're using, but the one from 

 
is looking for a header (first line) in the response from spamd that 
contains at least 3 whitespace delimited words. If it doesn't get at 
least 3 words in the first line of the response, it throws the "not 
enough words in response header" exception which results in 
SpamAssassin.py assigning a score of -1.

-- 
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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman/SpamAssassin holding for moderation instead of discarding spam

2008-03-18 Thread Fletcher Cocquyt 
³Post by non-member to a members-only list² is the reason

If I grep the logs for a sample spam that is held instead of discarded, I
see:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:16pm 129 # egrep 1205885237 /var/log/syslog
Mar 18 15:46:46 smtp-02 sendmail[4047]: [ID 801593 mail.info]
m2IMkcDw004047: from=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, size=1116, class=0,
nrcpts=6, msgid=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA-v4,
relay=[151.77.154.252]
Mar 18 15:46:46 smtp-02 spamd[2744]: spamd: checking message
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> for dcs:555
Mar 18 15:46:58 smtp-02 spamd[2744]: spamd: result: Y 11 -
BAYES_99,RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100,RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100,RAZOR2_CHECK,RDNS_
NONE,URIBL_BLACK,URIBL_JP_SURBL,URIBL_SC_SURBL,URIBL_WS_SURBL
scantime=12.2,size=1201,user=dcs,uid=555,required_score=5.0,rhost=localhost,
raddr=127.0.0.1,rport=36976,mid=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,bayes=1.00,
autolearn=spam

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:16pm 128 # egrep 1205885237 vette
Mar 18 15:46:58 2008 (18680) dcs post from [EMAIL PROTECTED] held,
message-id=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Post by non-member to a
members-only list

I also see this in the mailman error log:
Mar 18 15:45:02 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:15 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:30 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:46 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:01 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:26 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:41 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:58 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:47:12 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:47:18 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:47:33 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header

Which is from spamd.py:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:19pm 133 # egrep "not enough" ../Mailman/Handlers/*.py
../Mailman/Handlers/spamd.py:raise error('not enough words in
response header')

But I¹m not sure if that is relevant ­ any tips appreciated

Mark Sapiro wrote:

>Actually, it puts it second, but that should be good enough.
>What are the reason(s) why the messages are held?
>Did you restart Mailman after putting the above in mm_cfg.py?


On 3/18/08 3:17 PM, "Fletcher Cocquyt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
>> Hi, I am seeing the same issue from this thread:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/msg41720.html
>> 
>> (spamassassin scores the email as spam (> DISCARD THRESHOLD), but mailman
>> still holds it for moderation) ­ and my moderators are asking ³don¹t we have
>> spam filters?!²
>> 
>> Doesn¹t
>> GLOBAL_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')
>> put it first in the pipeline?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Fletcher.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman/SpamAssassin holding for moderation instead of discarding spam

2008-03-18 Thread Fletcher Cocquyt 
Hi, forgive me for replying directly ­ I¹m on the digest version of the list
and saw your reply on the web archive

[Bounced to list - MS]

³Post by non-member to a members-only list² is the reason

If I grep the logs for a sample spam that is held instead of discarded, I
see:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:16pm 129 # egrep 1205885237 /var/log/syslog
Mar 18 15:46:46 irt-smtp-02 sendmail[4047]: [ID 801593 mail.info]
m2IMkcDw004047: from=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, size=1116, class=0,
nrcpts=6, msgid=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA-v4,
relay=[151.77.154.252]
Mar 18 15:46:46 irt-smtp-02 spamd[2744]: spamd: checking message
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> for dcs:555
Mar 18 15:46:58 irt-smtp-02 spamd[2744]: spamd: result: Y 11 -
BAYES_99,RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100,RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100,RAZOR2_CHECK,RDNS_
NONE,URIBL_BLACK,URIBL_JP_SURBL,URIBL_SC_SURBL,URIBL_WS_SURBL
scantime=12.2,size=1201,user=dcs,uid=555,required_score=5.0,rhost=localhost,
raddr=127.0.0.1,rport=36976,mid=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,bayes=1.00,
autolearn=spam
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:16pm 130 #
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:16pm 128 # egrep 1205885237 vette
Mar 18 15:46:58 2008 (18680) dcs post from [EMAIL PROTECTED] held,
message-id=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Post by non-member to a
members-only list

I also see this in the mailman error log:
Mar 18 15:45:02 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:15 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:30 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:45:46 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:01 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:26 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:38 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:41 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:46:58 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:47:12 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:47:18 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header
Mar 18 15:47:33 2008 (18680) spamd: not enough words in response header

Which is from spamd.py:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:logs 4:19pm 133 # egrep "not enough"
./Mailman/Handlers/*.py
./Mailman/Handlers/spamd.py:raise error('not enough words in
response header')


But I¹m not sure if that is relevant ­ any tips appreciated ­ and I¹ll
summarize to the list

Thanks,
Fletcher

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[Mailman-Users] Digests not going out and lots of errors in /var/log/cron

2008-03-18 Thread Troy D. Knabe 
My digest messages are not going out, and I am seeing these messages in
/var/log/cron every 5 minutes.

Do I need a home directory for my mailman user?

-Troy


Mar 16 04:04:01 mx2 crond[2083]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:05:01 mx2 crond[2331]: (CRON) chdir(HOME) failed: (No such file or
directory)
Mar 16 04:05:01 mx2 crond[2331]: (CRON) /no/home (No such file or directory)
Mar 16 04:05:01 mx2 crond[2331]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: failed to open PAM
security session: No such file or directory
Mar 16 04:05:01 mx2 crond[2331]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: cannot set security
context
Mar 16 04:06:01 mx2 crond[2510]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:08:01 mx2 crond[2919]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:10:01 mx2 crond[3055]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:10:01 mx2 crond[3054]: (CRON) chdir(HOME) failed: (No such file or
directory)
Mar 16 04:10:01 mx2 crond[3054]: (CRON) /no/home (No such file or directory)
Mar 16 04:10:01 mx2 crond[3054]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: failed to open PAM
security session: No such file or directory
Mar 16 04:10:01 mx2 crond[3054]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: cannot set security
context
Mar 16 04:12:01 mx2 crond[4150]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:14:01 mx2 crond[4927]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:15:01 mx2 crond[5314]: (CRON) chdir(HOME) failed: (No such file or
directory)
Mar 16 04:15:01 mx2 crond[5314]: (CRON) /no/home (No such file or directory)
Mar 16 04:15:01 mx2 crond[5314]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: failed to open PAM
security session: No such file or directory
Mar 16 04:15:01 mx2 crond[5314]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: cannot set security
context
Mar 16 04:16:01 mx2 crond[6066]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:18:01 mx2 crond[6603]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:20:01 mx2 crond[6814]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:20:01 mx2 crond[6813]: (CRON) chdir(HOME) failed: (No such file or
directory)
Mar 16 04:20:01 mx2 crond[6813]: (CRON) /no/home (No such file or directory)
Mar 16 04:20:01 mx2 crond[6813]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: failed to open PAM
security session: No such file or directory
Mar 16 04:20:01 mx2 crond[6813]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: cannot set security
context
Mar 16 04:22:01 mx2 crond[7367]: (root) CMD (run-parts /etc/cron.weekly)
Mar 16 04:22:01 mx2 crond[7370]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:22:01 mx2 anacron[7372]: Updated timestamp for job `cron.weekly'
to 2008-03-16
Mar 16 04:24:01 mx2 crond[26779]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:25:01 mx2 crond[26876]: (CRON) chdir(HOME) failed: (No such file
or directory)
Mar 16 04:25:01 mx2 crond[26876]: (CRON) /no/home (No such file or
directory)
Mar 16 04:25:01 mx2 crond[26876]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: failed to open PAM
security session: No such file or directory
Mar 16 04:25:01 mx2 crond[26876]: CRON (mailman) ERROR: cannot set security
context
Mar 16 04:26:01 mx2 crond[27325]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:28:02 mx2 crond[27552]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:30:01 mx2 crond[27790]: (root) CMD (python
/usr/share/rhn/virtualization/poller.py)
Mar 16 04:30:01 mx2 crond[27789]: (CRON) chdir(HOME) failed: (No such file
or directory)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman/SpamAssassin holding for moderation instead of discarding spam

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Fletcher Cocquyt wrote:
>> Hi, I am seeing the same issue from this thread:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/msg41720.html
>>
>> (spamassassin scores the email as spam (> DISCARD THRESHOLD), but mailman
>> still holds it for moderation) ­ and my moderators are asking "don't we have
>> spam filters?!"
>>
>> Doesn't
>> GLOBAL_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')
>> put it first in the pipeline?

Actually, it puts it second, but that should be good enough.

What are the reason(s) why the messages are held?

Did you restart Mailman after putting the above in mm_cfg.py?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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[Mailman-Users] Mailman/SpamAssassin holding for moderation instead of discarding spam

2008-03-18 Thread Fletcher Cocquyt 

> Hi, I am seeing the same issue from this thread:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/msg41720.html
> 
> (spamassassin scores the email as spam (> DISCARD THRESHOLD), but mailman
> still holds it for moderation) ­ and my moderators are asking ³don¹t we have
> spam filters?!²
> 
> Doesn¹t
> GLOBAL_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')
> put it first in the pipeline?
> 
> Thanks,
> Fletcher.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list commands being limited?

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Brian Herold wrote

>Hmm, the problem of our lists not being fully populated with members must lie 
>elsewhere.


I was going to ask if your subscribe_policy involves confirmation
thinking that perhaps the subscribees weren't confirming, but I think
it must not because if it did, the autoresponses would be the
confirmations sent to the users and you presumably wouldn't be seeing
the "last autoresponse" notices.

I did however look back at your original post and I saw the subscribe
command was

  subscribe nodigest address=$theemailaddress

While this works, it doesn't do what you think. I'm going to fix this
for 2.1.10, but currently, the above command will subscribe the user
in the default digest mode with a password of 'nodigest'.

-- 
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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Chris Waltham wrote:

>On Mar 18, 2008, at 3:12 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>> I have the same problem with my lists.
>> Until recently we ran on an old version of Mailman.
>> Users with Outlook saw messages coming from [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>>  on behalf of
>> 
>>
>> Now they see messages coming from [EMAIL PROTECTED] on  
>> behalf of 
>
>I just noticed the same thing going from Mailman 2.0.12 to 2.1.9.
>
>Interesting...


Mailman 2.0.x had no automated bounce processing, so the envelope
sender was sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that the list admin would see
the bounces and be able to react to them manually.

With the advent of automated bounce processing in Mailman 2.1, the
envelope sender is sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and mail to that
address is processed automatically as a bounce.

In an attempt to avoid confusion, the [EMAIL PROTECTED] address was
deprecated in favor of [EMAIL PROTECTED]

None of this is directly relevant to MS Outlook's "on behalf of"
display which uses the Sender: header, not the envelope sender.

Mailman, in an attempt to accommodate non compliant MTAs which might
return DSNs (bounces) to other than the envelope sender, puts the
bounce processing address in the Sender: and Errors-To: headers of the
message. Outlook actually uses the Sender: header and displays

   From:  on behalf of 

instead of the

   From: 

displayed by most other MUAs.

Mailman's insertion of the bounce processing address in the Sender:
header is not completely wrong, but it probably isn't the best choice.
This will probably change in Mailman 2.2.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Chris Waltham 
On Mar 18, 2008, at 3:12 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I have the same problem with my lists.
> Until recently we ran on an old version of Mailman.
> Users with Outlook saw messages coming from [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>  on behalf of
> 
>
> Now they see messages coming from [EMAIL PROTECTED] on  
> behalf of 

I just noticed the same thing going from Mailman 2.0.12 to 2.1.9.

Interesting...


Chris

>
>
> They understand that a mail bounce is a bad thing, and so this  
> puzzles them.
>
> Pretty well 99% of my users use Outlook (because that is what their  
> employers give them).
>
> It is small consolation to any of us that they are using an inferior  
> mail system . . .
>
> Rod
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Kenneth Porter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 6:15 PM
> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address
>
>
>> --On Monday, March 17, 2008 1:20 PM -0400 Nick L  
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in  
>>> the from
>>> heading.
>>
>> Just curious, why would someone want to remove "bounces"? Is it a  
>> swear
>> word in some languages?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Kenneth Porter 
--On Tuesday, March 18, 2008 11:40 AM -0700 Dragon 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> It's also limited to particular versions of Microsoft Outlook

The most recent version? If not, one can simply say "upgrade your client". 
Either by going to the expensive one or switching to a free one.

(I *am* sympathetic to Outlook users because I see the value in the 
combined Outlook/Exchange groupware app, but if you're going to pay big 
bucks for that facility, you have to accept the compromises it imposes (to 
pure email use) and lay the blame where it belongs.)
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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
I have the same problem with my lists.
Until recently we ran on an old version of Mailman.
Users with Outlook saw messages coming from [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 
behalf of


Now they see messages coming from [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of 


They understand that a mail bounce is a bad thing, and so this puzzles them.

Pretty well 99% of my users use Outlook (because that is what their employers 
give them).

It is small consolation to any of us that they are using an inferior mail 
system . . .

Rod

- Original Message -
From: "Kenneth Porter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 6:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address


> --On Monday, March 17, 2008 1:20 PM -0400 Nick L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in the from
> > heading.
>
> Just curious, why would someone want to remove "bounces"? Is it a swear
> word in some languages?
>
>
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list commands being limited?

2008-03-18 Thread Brian Herold 
Hmm, the problem of our lists not being fully populated with members must lie 
elsewhere.  Thanks for the info on the autoresponse message though!
 
Brian
 
Brian Herold / Internet Applications Developer
Department of Medicine / University of Wisconsin 

>>> Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 3/14/2008 8:48 PM >>>
Brian Herold wrote:

>We have an automated system that programmatically adds users to lists using 
>the email command functionality (subscribe nodigest address=$theemailaddress). 
> Though, some of the lists are large and occasionally we get the returned 
>email response:
> 
>"We have received a message from your address [EMAIL PROTECTED]' 
>requesting an automated response from the
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list.  We have seen 10 such
>messages from you today.  In order to avoid problems such as mail
>loops between email robots, we will not be sending you any further
>email responses today.  Please try again tomorrow.
> 
>If you believe this message is in error, or if you have any questions,
>please contact the list owner at
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]" 
> 
>*Note that I renamed the sending and list email addresses.
> 
>Is there some limit that's being triggered causing this message, and what can 
>I do to prevent it?


The limit is MAX_AUTORESPONSES_PER_DAY which defaults to 10. It can be
set lower or higher, and it can be set to 0 for no limit, but note
that if you set it either to 0 or a large value, your server can be
used a spam reflector or for 'Joe Jobbing'.

Note however that the subscribe command(s) are still processed even
though the 10th one gets the above response and the remainder get no
response.

-- 
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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Dragon 
Kenneth Porter sent the message below at 11:15 3/18/2008:
>--On Monday, March 17, 2008 1:20 PM -0400 Nick L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>wrote:
>
> > I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in the from
> > heading.
>
>Just curious, why would someone want to remove "bounces"? Is it a swear
>word in some languages?
>
 End original message. -

This issue has come up a number of times on this list since I have 
been a member. I think it is really a cosmetic thing. It's also 
limited to particular versions of Microsoft Outlook that display the 
 From address as something like:

"From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of [EMAIL PROTECTED]"

It's not entirely incorrect for Outlook to do that as it is using the 
envelope-sender information not the actual From: header to display 
that info. The problem is that the relevant RFC document is vague on 
how that should be handled and displayed in the MUA.

Mailman sends outgoing e-mails using the listname-bounces address as 
the envelope-sender to enable proper bounce handling when a delivery 
failure occurs. So the problem comes down to living with this display 
in Outlook or disabling proper bounce handling. Personally, I want 
proper bounce handling and anyone using Outlook that complains to me 
about this is basically told (politely, usually) there is nothing I 
can do about fixing something Microsoft did in their e-mail client so 
they can either live with it or find an e-mail client to their liking.



Dragon

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Kenneth Porter 
--On Monday, March 17, 2008 1:20 PM -0400 Nick L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:

> I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in the from
> heading.

Just curious, why would someone want to remove "bounces"? Is it a swear 
word in some languages?


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Re: [Mailman-Users] Theming member options page

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Tom Chance wrote:
> 
>Unfortunately some pages don't have templates, they seem hard coded into
>the Python code! For example, when you enter your email address to
>change subscription options without already being logged in, you get a
>page whose contents is included in these files:
> 
>/var/lib/mailman/Mailman/htmlformat.py - header & footer
>/var/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/options.py - contents
> 
>Is there a cunning trick I'm missing / are there plans to abstract this
>out to a template file? Otherwise I'll try putting the "login-unsub" and
>password/login buttons directly onto the main listinfo page along with
>the email field to see if I can bypass this interim page altogether.



I think it would be really difficult to eliminate the options login
paqe completely without hacking the code. You could work around it
when coming from the listinfo page, but what if someone goes to the
options page directly without being logged in?

We are definitely aware of the shortcomings of the current GUI and are
trying to do better for Mailman 2.2.

In the mean time, one thing you can do which involves only a minor code
change is in the Format() method of the Document class in
htmlformat.py, you can insert a stylesheet reference immediately before

output.append('%s')
output.append('%s section.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
Nick L wrote:
>
>The way it would be nice if it was:
>
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] as the from, or even with the on behalf of, just
>not the word "bounces" in the address.
>
> 
>
>Is there a way to accomplish this if you cannot have access to the mailman
>files and the hosting company won't change it?


No.

Well, depending on exactly what you can do on your virtual host, It may
be possible to install your own Mailman, but it's a stretch. It might
be easier to get your users to switch from Outlook.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] fetchmail with gmail to mailman

2008-03-18 Thread Mark Sapiro 
billc wrote:

>Right.  So probably safer to reinstall.  Which I did.  That appears 
>to have repaired the problem of  /usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman 
>previously being a directory.
>
>Now when attempting to create the original 'mailman' list, i'm getting
>
>   illegal name [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>despite having the same stuff in default.py and mm_cfg.py as 
>previously (explicitly set to ns2.greenbuilder.com) and even when 
>specifying the list name in the newlist command as 
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Argh!  What am I missing here?


What is DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST, either in Defaults.py or overridden in
mm_cfg.py. If it is 'postfix', that is your answer. It must be a fully
qualified domain name.

If that isn't it, what is the exact newlist command or are you using
the GUI, and what is in Defaults.py for DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST and
DEFAULT_URL_HOST, and what is in mm_cfg.py for these and any
add_virtualhost() directives?

If DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST isn't 'postfix', you probably have

add_virtualhost('ns2.greenbuilder.com', 'postfix')

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Dragon 
Nick L sent the message below at 10:20 3/17/2008:
>New user so be kind.
>
>I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in the from
>heading. When you have hosting with some companies that use virtual hosting
>plans, you cannot hack the file necessary to remove this, is there another
>way to do the following?
>
>
>
>
>
>The way it is:
>
>Email comes in from the list and shows   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>on behalf of member...
>
>
>
>The way it would be nice if it was:
>
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] as the from, or even with the on behalf of, just
>not the word "bounces" in the address.
>
>
>
>Is there a way to accomplish this if you cannot have access to the mailman
>files and the hosting company won't change it?
>
>
>
>Worth a shot.
>
>
 End original message. -

That is not a problem with mailman, that is specifically a problem 
with Outlook (not sure exactly what versions).

More info:

http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?query=on+behalf+of&querytype=simple&casefold=yes&req=search
 


Dragon

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[Mailman-Users] Theming member options page

2008-03-18 Thread Tom Chance 
Hello,
 
I'm using the templates to integrate the Mailman pages into our web
site, e.g.:
http://lists.bioregional.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/newsletter
 
Unfortunately some pages don't have templates, they seem hard coded into
the Python code! For example, when you enter your email address to
change subscription options without already being logged in, you get a
page whose contents is included in these files:
 
/var/lib/mailman/Mailman/htmlformat.py - header & footer
/var/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/options.py - contents
 
Is there a cunning trick I'm missing / are there plans to abstract this
out to a template file? Otherwise I'll try putting the "login-unsub" and
password/login buttons directly onto the main listinfo page along with
the email field to see if I can bypass this interim page altogether.
 
Kind regards,
Tom Chance

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Re: [Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Attila Kinali 
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 13:20:41 -0400
"Nick L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in the from
> heading. When you have hosting with some companies that use virtual hosting
> plans, you cannot hack the file necessary to remove this, is there another
> way to do the following?
> The way it is:
> 
> Email comes in from the list and shows   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> on behalf of member...
>
> The way it would be nice if it was:
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] as the from, or even with the on behalf of, just
> not the word "bounces" in the address.

If i understand you correctly, you want the envelope-from
to be the same as the list adress? This wont work as the
envelope-from has to be different so that mailman can
distinguish bounces from regular mails. Also this should
never be a problem as the only place where people see
the envelope-from is in the headers and unless you have
a broken mail client (outlook comes to mind), you'll never
see this field.

Attila Kinali

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[Mailman-Users] word "bounces" in from address

2008-03-18 Thread Nick L 
New user so be kind.

I know that there is a workaround to remove the word 'bounces" in the from
heading. When you have hosting with some companies that use virtual hosting
plans, you cannot hack the file necessary to remove this, is there another
way to do the following?

 

 

The way it is:

Email comes in from the list and shows   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
on behalf of member...

 

The way it would be nice if it was:

[EMAIL PROTECTED] as the from, or even with the on behalf of, just
not the word "bounces" in the address.

 

Is there a way to accomplish this if you cannot have access to the mailman
files and the hosting company won't change it?

 

Worth a shot.

 

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