Re: [Mailman-Users] Seeing your own sig appear in (someone else's) email to the list

[Laura Creighton]

Some long dormant bits in my brain are remembering something like this
happening when the MIME type application/pgp-signature was introduced.
Before then, people were using application/pgp for such things, and
some were using other things like pgp-encrypt.  

If the signature problem is a pgp signature problem, these docs may
prove illuminating.  


http://www.phildev.net/pgp/pgp_clear_vs_mime.html
http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2015.txt

Laura
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Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and Bellsouth, etc.

[Lindsay Haisley]

On Fri, 2014-04-18 at 16:23 -0700, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 04/17/2014 09:13 AM, Lindsay Haisley wrote:
> 
> > Someone, maybe it was you, posted on this forum earlier that perhaps 90%
> > or more of spam with a yahoo.com origin (or one of their international
> > DNs) actually _does_ come from Yahoo and that their response to abuse
> > notifications is abysmal to nonexistent.
> 
> 
> The post is at
> 

On Fri Apr 11 12:13:58 CEST 2014 Rich Kulawiec rsk at gsp.org said:
> This is just (a) propaganda,
> so that they claim to be "doing something"

Which pretty much meshes with what you've suggested about Yahoo's
motives.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and Bellsouth, etc.

[Mark Sapiro]

On 04/17/2014 09:13 AM, Lindsay Haisley wrote:

> Someone, maybe it was you, posted on this forum earlier that perhaps 90%
> or more of spam with a yahoo.com origin (or one of their international
> DNs) actually _does_ come from Yahoo and that their response to abuse
> notifications is abysmal to nonexistent.


The post is at


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Re: [Mailman-Users] Seeing your own sig appear in (someone else's) email to the list

[Mark Sapiro]

On 04/17/2014 07:40 PM, Conrad G T Yoder wrote:
> One of my users on one of my lists is seeing something odd.  His own 
> signatures are appearing on other people’s emails sent to a Mailman (2.1.14) 
> list.  Some points of info:
> 
> - He has his own domain, hosted by google
> - Email is read on the web (not sure which browser)
> - It appears on some, but not all list posts
> - Started happening “about a week ago”
> - I do not see his signatures when the same emails come to me, nor are they 
> in the archive.
> - He is a list admin and moderator.  The list is fully moderated and he 
> approves/rejects most of the posts.
> 
> Is he crazy?  Any idea how to track this “problem” down?


The first thing that comes to mind is he sees this in posts which are
direct Cc replies to his own posts from some user(s). Thus, what he is
seeing isn't the list post, and something in the poster to list path is
stripping signatures so other list members and the archive don't see it.
(Perhaps the sig is in a MIME part removed by the list's content filtering.)

You need to get a complete, raw message from him with the spurious sig,
all headers, etc. If he uses the gmail/googlemail web client, he can
click the down triangle 'more' button just right of the swooping arrow
'reply' button, click 'Show original' and copy/paste the result. This
will tell you whether the message even came to him via the list and
where in the message parts his sig appears.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Emails from yahoo members, are getting rejected by yahoo, "Service Unavailable".

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Sylvain Viart writes:
 > Le 18/04/2014 09:41, Alain Williams a écrit :
 > >> I may have missed some topic, but why SRS
 > >> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sender_Rewriting_Scheme) doesn't
 > >> come to rescue here?
 > > SRS rewrites the *envelope* sender.
 > >
 > > My understanding is that the YAHOO DKIM uses the From: header,
 > > not the envelope sender.
 > 
 > Oh I see. Thanks.
 > So to use mail's Header terminology, only the Return-path: is modified, 
 > not the From:

No, the envelope sender often does end up in Return-Path, but it need
not.  The envelope sender is the entity in the SMTP "MAIL FROM"
command, not anything in the headers.

 > Is this related to DMARC in general?

Yes.  DMARC is designed to work with "From alignment", that is,
authenticating the domain in the from header.  It *can* also
authenticate the mailbox using DKIM, but there's no guarantee that a
third party can see.

The reason for this is that the DMARC authors are concerned about
phishing, which basically works by sending a fake "From".  Therefore
they want to ensure that only the real domain can send "From" that
domain.

 > May be not corrected by SRS, because of DMARC is more recent than
 > SRS…

They're completely unrelated.

 > Or this is a yahoo challenging with a somewhat too strong
 > configuration?

Yahoo is following the DMARC standard.  They don't believe it is "too
strong".  See above.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and Bellsouth, etc.

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Jim Popovitch writes:
 > On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 2:32 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull 
 > wrote:
 > 
 > > So maybe it does, but in my spamtrap I have only 67/4359 (1.5%)
 > > messages from Yahoo (based on grepping for "^From:.*yahoo" and
 > > "^From:" respectively), vs. 658/38748 (1.7%) in my saved mail folders.
 > > It seems to me that spam using Yahoo addresses is hardly a big
 > > problem, whether it's spoofed or using throwaway addresses.

 > I'm curious, what numbers do you currently see for tumblr (also a yahoo
 > company) spam?

Zero.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and From header munging

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Lindsay Haisley writes:

 > > It's very ugly, though, especially if for some reason you have no
 > > display name to work with.
 > 
 > Agreed!  But the display name is free form and strictly informational.
 > Could this not be the subscriber name of the author, if it's part of the
 > subscription record?

Sure.  But that's putting even more burden on the Mailman server, and
in many cases it won't be close to 100%.  That's all I'm saying.




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Re: [Mailman-Users] Emails from yahoo members, are getting rejected by yahoo, "Service Unavailable".

[Sylvain Viart]

Le 18/04/2014 09:41, Alain Williams a écrit :

I may have missed some topic, but why SRS
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sender_Rewriting_Scheme) doesn't come to rescue 
here?

SRS rewrites the *envelope* sender.

My understanding is that the YAHOO DKIM uses the From: header, not the envelope 
sender.


Oh I see. Thanks.
So to use mail's Header terminology, only the Return-path: is modified, 
not the From:


Is this related to DMARC in general?
May be not corrected by SRS, because of DMARC is more recent than SRS…

Or this is a yahoo challenging with a somewhat too strong configuration?
I mean, did they configure to specifically check the From: header?

Regards,
Sylvain.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mirror mailing list with web forum

[Tim Walter]

On 18 Apr 2014, at 02:26, Jon 1234  wrote:

> > From: t...@yingtong.co.uk
> > Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2014 00:36:37 +0100
> > ref identity I really mean at present most of the traffic is on the mailing 
> > list (and the forum is more of an archive for 80% of the joint community) 
> > where users complain they can’t easily identify forum posters as people 
> > (its a friendly bunch) as I’ve set it to post to the list as the single 
> > subscribed list address. They/I would like to see the forum users 
> > name/email address somewhere inside the body text so they can say “Hi 
> > Peter, good to hear from you, I think I can answer this one…” I’ve searched 
> > within FUDforum for documentation of how to format posts to include posters 
> > names etc. to no avail.
> 
>  
> This seems to work. Go to forum/theme/default/post.php and find the line:
>  
>  
> if (!empty($r[3])) { // Use the forum's fixed "From:" address.
>  
>  
> After it add words to the following effect:
>  
>  
> $body .= "\n-- \nThis message was sent via the web forum by $from"; 
>  
>  
> You should get a footer along the lines of:
>  
>  
> This message was sent via the web forum by Name 
>  
>  
> Which will be followed by the Mailman footer.
>  
>  
> > In reality for membership intergration between the two I suspect I wouldn’t 
> > be first in the queue currently as I have several hundred subscribers both 
> > places, with significant overlap between them!
> > 
> > BW TIm
>  
>  
> If I manage to solve this how about I mention it here but post the detail on 
> the FUDforum website?
>  
>  
> Best wishes
>  
>  
> Jon

Hi Jon, brilliant.  Works exactly as it says on the tin.  I’m guessing however 
it will be overwritten with the next patch, but I can live with that.  In this 
life I am a user rather than a contributor I’m afraid, is there a way of 
putting that at the top such as “Tim Walter wrote on the forum…”  

As to the integration I suspect both places seem sensible, I hang out in both.

(Sorry to have slightly hijacked the mailman list for FUDForum stuff, though 
hopefully moderately relevant.)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.18 release

[Mark Sapiro]

On 04/18/2014 12:14 AM, Sylvain Viart wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> 
> Le 17/04/2014 20:32, Mark Sapiro a écrit :
>> I am pleased to announce the first release candidate for Mailman 2.1.18.
>>
>> http://www.list.org
>> http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
>> http://mailman.sourceforge.net/
> 
> No topic are presented about the fresh release on those website, right?


There wasn't when you wrote, but there is now.

I didn't have my full release tool set at PyCon :(


> So a "postable" url about this announce would be?
> 
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/msg64098.html
> 
> Is there a better one?


If you want to link to the announcement itself, I would use


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Re: [Mailman-Users] Emails from yahoo members, are getting rejected by yahoo, "Service Unavailable".

[Alain Williams]

On Fri, Apr 18, 2014 at 09:26:28AM +0200, Sylvain Viart wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I may have missed some topic, but why SRS
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sender_Rewriting_Scheme) doesn't come
> to rescue here?
> 
> It isn't its original purpose?
> Resigning outgoing messages with messaging server own DKIM's key.
> 
> Seem to be available by setuping  mm_cfg.py:
> 
>  - ALLOW_FROM_IS_LIST = Yes
>  - REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS = Yes
>  - FROM_IS_LIST = 1
> 
> 
> Did I miss something?

SRS rewrites the *envelope* sender.

My understanding is that the YAHOO DKIM uses the From: header, not the envelope 
sender.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Emails from yahoo members, are getting rejected by yahoo, "Service Unavailable".

[Sylvain Viart]

Hi,

I may have missed some topic, but why SRS 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sender_Rewriting_Scheme) doesn't come to 
rescue here?


It isn't its original purpose?
Resigning outgoing messages with messaging server own DKIM's key.

Seem to be available by setuping  mm_cfg.py:

 - ALLOW_FROM_IS_LIST = Yes
 - REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS = Yes
 - FROM_IS_LIST = 1


Did I miss something?

Regards,
Sylvain.
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.18 release

[Sylvain Viart]

Hi,


Le 17/04/2014 20:32, Mark Sapiro a écrit :

I am pleased to announce the first release candidate for Mailman 2.1.18.

http://www.list.org
http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
http://mailman.sourceforge.net/


No topic are presented about the fresh release on those website, right?

So a "postable" url about this announce would be?

http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/msg64098.html

Is there a better one?

Regards,
Sylvain.
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