Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/29/2016 02:19 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 10:51 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
>> On 02/29/2016 01:34 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>>> I think we can fix your issue fairly simply.
>>>
>>> Please, as I asked in my reply at
>>> ,
>>> post the output from 'postconf -n' and the contents of mm_cfg.py.
>>
>>
>> Sorry, I got mixed up.  Its just probably the frustration.  Everyone
>> uses mailman, I don't know why I'm so stupid
>>
>>
> 
>> smtpd_recipient_restrictions = check_client_access
>> hash:/etc/postfix/helo_client_exceptions check_sender_access
>> hash:/etc/postfix/sender_checks, reject_invalid_hostname,
>> reject_non_fqdn_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_sender,
>> reject_non_fqdn_recipient, reject_unknown_sender_domain,
>> reject_unknown_recipient_domain, permit_mynetworks,
>> reject_unauth_destination, permit_mynetworks, reject_unauth_destination,
>> reject_invalid_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_hostname,
>> reject_non_fqdn_sender, reject_non_fqdn_recipient,
>> reject_unknown_sender_domain, reject_unknown_recipient_domain,
>> reject_rbl_client zen.spamhaus.org, reject_rbl_client bl.spamcop.net
>> reject_rbl_client cbl.abuseat.org, permit
> 
> 
> This is almost certainly your problem. All those checks take time,
> especially if DNS is slow. If you send a message from a client and
> Postfix takes 5 seconds to accept it, it's no big deal. If Mailman sends
> to 10 or 20 recipients, and it takes Postfix a minute to respond, it
> still may be no big deal unless another two posts arrive in that minute
> , and so on until you have a big backlog.
> 
> I suggest that if you really want all those checks, that you set up a
> separate port for Mailman to send to without all those rbl lookups and
> recipient domain lookups. See below.
> 
> 
>> vim /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
>>
>> ###
>> # Here's where we get the distributed defaults.
>>
>> from Defaults import *
>>
>> ##
>> # Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
>> DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s/mailman/'
>> DEFAULT_NNTP_HOST = 'www.mrbrklyn.com'
>> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'nylxs.com'
>> DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'www.nylxs.com'
>> MTA = 'Postfix'
>> POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postalias'
>> POSTFIX_MAP_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postmap'
>> DELIVERY_MODULE = 'SMTPDirect'
>> SMTPHOST = 'mrbrklyn.com'
>> SMTPPORT = '25'
> 
> 
> Here's where I'm suggesting changes. Pick a port, say 8000, although it
> could be anything that doesn't conflict.
> 
> Then change the above to
> 
> SMTPHOST = '127.0.0.1'
> SMTPPORT = 8000
> 
> (don't quote the port - it's a number, not a string)
> 
> Also, while you're at it I suggest adding
> 
> VERP_PASSWORD_REMINDERS = Yes
> VERP_PERSONALIZED_DELIVERIES = Yes
> VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1
> 
> for more reliable bounce processing.
> 
> But, see below for changes to Postfix master.cf that you must make first.
> 
>> add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
>> add_virtualhost('lists.mrbrklyn.com', 'mrbrklyn.com')
>> IMAGE_LOGOS = '/mailmanicons/'
>>
>>
>>
>> There is another one in apache:
>> I don't know if it is being used.
>> vim /usr/local/apache/conf/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
> 
> No, that shouldn't be used.
> 
> 
> In Postfix master.cf add the following stanza
> 
> 127.0.0.1:8000  inet  n   -   -   --  smtpd
> -o smtpd_authorized_xforward_hosts=127.0.0.0/8
> -o mynetworks=127.0.0.0/8
> -o smtpd_recipient_restrictions=permit_mynetworks,reject
> -o smtpd_client_restrictions=
> -o smtpd_helo_restrictions=
> -o smtpd_sender_restrictions=
> -o smtpd_data_restrictions=
> 
> Make this addition to Postfix master.cf and reload Postfix. Only after
> you've done that and Postfix is listening on the loopback interface port
> 8000, make the changes to mm_cfg.py and restart Mailman.
> 

OK .  That port is restricted to a 12.0.0.0/8 relay?  The last thing I
need is for someone to be monitoring this list and pounding port 8000
for a spam relay.

-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
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Searchable Archives: 

Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/29/2016 02:12 AM, Carl Zwanzig wrote:
> Oh, and -nothing- involved in email handling is "real time", which has a
> fairly specific meaning in computing. *All* email is queued at least a
> couple of times along the way and delivered as those systems get around
> to it.

Use whatever terminology you wish.  RT is a scheduler term, but it has
meaning outside of that.  I can't have mailing list mail waiting for an
hour to reach users.  It kills the flow of discussion.



-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 11:19 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> 
> Also, while you're at it I suggest adding
> 
> VERP_PASSWORD_REMINDERS = Yes
> VERP_PERSONALIZED_DELIVERIES = Yes
> VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1
> 
> for more reliable bounce processing.


One more thing. If you add the above to mm_cfg.py, you also need

recipient_delimiter = +

in Postfix main.cf. If that's a problem, then don't add those 3 lines to
mm_cfg.py.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 10:51 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> On 02/29/2016 01:34 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>> I think we can fix your issue fairly simply.
>>
>> Please, as I asked in my reply at
>> ,
>> post the output from 'postconf -n' and the contents of mm_cfg.py.
> 
> 
> Sorry, I got mixed up.  Its just probably the frustration.  Everyone
> uses mailman, I don't know why I'm so stupid
> 
> 

> smtpd_recipient_restrictions = check_client_access
> hash:/etc/postfix/helo_client_exceptions check_sender_access
> hash:/etc/postfix/sender_checks, reject_invalid_hostname,
> reject_non_fqdn_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_sender,
> reject_non_fqdn_recipient, reject_unknown_sender_domain,
> reject_unknown_recipient_domain, permit_mynetworks,
> reject_unauth_destination, permit_mynetworks, reject_unauth_destination,
> reject_invalid_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_hostname,
> reject_non_fqdn_sender, reject_non_fqdn_recipient,
> reject_unknown_sender_domain, reject_unknown_recipient_domain,
> reject_rbl_client zen.spamhaus.org, reject_rbl_client bl.spamcop.net
> reject_rbl_client cbl.abuseat.org, permit


This is almost certainly your problem. All those checks take time,
especially if DNS is slow. If you send a message from a client and
Postfix takes 5 seconds to accept it, it's no big deal. If Mailman sends
to 10 or 20 recipients, and it takes Postfix a minute to respond, it
still may be no big deal unless another two posts arrive in that minute
, and so on until you have a big backlog.

I suggest that if you really want all those checks, that you set up a
separate port for Mailman to send to without all those rbl lookups and
recipient domain lookups. See below.


> vim /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py
> 
> ###
> # Here's where we get the distributed defaults.
> 
> from Defaults import *
> 
> ##
> # Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
> DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s/mailman/'
> DEFAULT_NNTP_HOST = 'www.mrbrklyn.com'
> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'nylxs.com'
> DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'www.nylxs.com'
> MTA = 'Postfix'
> POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postalias'
> POSTFIX_MAP_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postmap'
> DELIVERY_MODULE = 'SMTPDirect'
> SMTPHOST = 'mrbrklyn.com'
> SMTPPORT = '25'


Here's where I'm suggesting changes. Pick a port, say 8000, although it
could be anything that doesn't conflict.

Then change the above to

SMTPHOST = '127.0.0.1'
SMTPPORT = 8000

(don't quote the port - it's a number, not a string)

Also, while you're at it I suggest adding

VERP_PASSWORD_REMINDERS = Yes
VERP_PERSONALIZED_DELIVERIES = Yes
VERP_DELIVERY_INTERVAL = 1

for more reliable bounce processing.

But, see below for changes to Postfix master.cf that you must make first.

> add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
> add_virtualhost('lists.mrbrklyn.com', 'mrbrklyn.com')
> IMAGE_LOGOS = '/mailmanicons/'
> 
> 
> 
> There is another one in apache:
> I don't know if it is being used.
> vim /usr/local/apache/conf/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py

No, that shouldn't be used.


In Postfix master.cf add the following stanza

127.0.0.1:8000  inet  n   -   -   --  smtpd
-o smtpd_authorized_xforward_hosts=127.0.0.0/8
-o mynetworks=127.0.0.0/8
-o smtpd_recipient_restrictions=permit_mynetworks,reject
-o smtpd_client_restrictions=
-o smtpd_helo_restrictions=
-o smtpd_sender_restrictions=
-o smtpd_data_restrictions=

Make this addition to Postfix master.cf and reload Postfix. Only after
you've done that and Postfix is listening on the loopback interface port
8000, make the changes to mm_cfg.py and restart Mailman.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Carl Zwanzig]

On 2/28/2016 10:53 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:

On 02/29/2016 01:42 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:

dig  gnutelephony.org


that does hang.  These are OLD mailing lists and it is hard to be
responsible for 20 years of DNS errors by organizations I have no
control over.


I think that may be the crux of your problem. If half a list of 500 is 
addresses that timeout instead of being immediately rejected, well, 30 
seconds each times 250 timeouts equals 2 hours wasted.


I would run through the logs to find all the domains that are timing out on 
dns, then mark the recipients on those domains as "no mail". After that, see 
how delivery goes for the rest of them. Besides, why keep users on the list 
than don't exist or actually get delivery?



Oh, and -nothing- involved in email handling is "real time", which has a 
fairly specific meaning in computing. *All* email is queued at least a 
couple of times along the way and delivered as those systems get around to 
it. Often that's within seconds, but not always. I'm on some lists with 100s 
of users, and it's not uncommon for a message to take an hour to get to 
everyone.


z!

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/29/2016 01:50 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 10:42 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
>>
>> Can it be set up like that and if so, please tell me how.
> 
> 
> I'm trying to!
> 
> Please see my posts archived at
> 
> and
> .
> 
> Please as I ask, show me 'postconf -n' mm_cfg.py and you might as well
> include Postfix's master.cf too.
> 


I did ... sorry.  I'm trying to not let my frustration show.  I
apologize if my tone can be better.

-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/29/2016 01:42 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> dig  gnutelephony.org

that does hang.  These are OLD mailing lists and it is hard to be
responsible for 20 years of DNS errors by organizations I have no
control over.


-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/29/2016 01:34 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> I think we can fix your issue fairly simply.
> 
> Please, as I asked in my reply at
> ,
> post the output from 'postconf -n' and the contents of mm_cfg.py.


Sorry, I got mixed up.  Its just probably the frustration.  Everyone
uses mailman, I don't know why I'm so stupid


alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases, hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/aliases
biff = no
canonical_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/canonical
command_directory = /usr/sbin
config_directory = /etc/postfix
content_filter =
daemon_directory = /usr/lib/postfix
data_directory = /var/lib/postfix
debug_peer_level = 2
debugger_command = PATH=/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin ddd
$daemon_directory/$process_name $process_id & sleep 5
defer_transports =
delay_warning_time = 1h
disable_dns_lookups = no
disable_mime_output_conversion = no
disable_vrfy_command = yes
html_directory = /usr/share/doc/packages/postfix-doc/html
inet_interfaces = all
inet_protocols = ipv4
mail_owner = postfix
mail_spool_directory = /var/mail
mailbox_command = /usr/bin/procmail
mailbox_size_limit = 0
mailbox_transport =
mailq_path = /usr/bin/mailq
manpage_directory = /usr/share/man
masquerade_classes = envelope_sender, header_sender, header_recipient
masquerade_domains = mrbrklyn.com, mrbrklyn.com
masquerade_exceptions = root
message_size_limit = 0
message_strip_characters = \0
mydestination = www.mrbrklyn.com, www2.mrbrklyn.com, home.mrbrklyn.com,
mrbrklyn.com, nylxs.com, brooklyn-living.com, freedon_it.com
mydomain = mrbrklyn.com
myhostname = mrbrklyn.com
mynetworks_style = subnet
newaliases_path = /usr/bin/newaliases
queue_directory = /var/spool/postfix
readme_directory = /usr/share/doc/packages/postfix-doc/README_FILES
relay_clientcerts =
relayhost =
relocated_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/relocated
sample_directory = /usr/share/doc/packages/postfix-doc/samples
sender_canonical_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/sender_canonical
sendmail_path = /usr/sbin/sendmail
setgid_group = maildrop
smtp_enforce_tls = no
smtp_generic_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/generic
smtp_sasl_auth_enable = no
smtp_sasl_password_maps =
smtp_sasl_security_options =
smtp_tls_CAfile =
smtp_tls_CApath =
smtp_tls_cert_file =
smtp_tls_key_file =
smtp_tls_session_cache_database =
smtp_use_tls = no
smtpd_banner = $myhostname ESMTP
smtpd_client_restrictions = reject_rbl_client dnsbl.sorbs.net
smtpd_data_restrictions = reject_unauth_pipelining, permit
smtpd_delay_reject = yes
smtpd_helo_required = yes
smtpd_helo_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, reject_invalid_hostname,
regexp:/etc/postfix/helo.regexp, permit
smtpd_recipient_restrictions = check_client_access
hash:/etc/postfix/helo_client_exceptions check_sender_access
hash:/etc/postfix/sender_checks, reject_invalid_hostname,
reject_non_fqdn_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_sender,
reject_non_fqdn_recipient, reject_unknown_sender_domain,
reject_unknown_recipient_domain, permit_mynetworks,
reject_unauth_destination, permit_mynetworks, reject_unauth_destination,
reject_invalid_hostname, reject_non_fqdn_hostname,
reject_non_fqdn_sender, reject_non_fqdn_recipient,
reject_unknown_sender_domain, reject_unknown_recipient_domain,
reject_rbl_client zen.spamhaus.org, reject_rbl_client bl.spamcop.net
reject_rbl_client cbl.abuseat.org, permit
smtpd_sasl_auth_enable = no
smtpd_sender_restrictions = hash:/etc/postfix/access,
reject_unknown_sender_domain
smtpd_tls_CAfile =
smtpd_tls_CApath =
smtpd_tls_ask_ccert = no
smtpd_tls_cert_file =
smtpd_tls_key_file =
smtpd_tls_received_header = no
smtpd_use_tls = no
strict_8bitmime = no
strict_rfc821_envelopes = yes
transport_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/transport
unknown_local_recipient_reject_code = 550
virtual_alias_domains = hash:/etc/postfix/virtual
virtual_alias_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/virtual



vim /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py

###
# Here's where we get the distributed defaults.

from Defaults import *

##
# Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s/mailman/'
DEFAULT_NNTP_HOST = 'www.mrbrklyn.com'
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'nylxs.com'
DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'www.nylxs.com'
MTA = 'Postfix'
POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postalias'
POSTFIX_MAP_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postmap'
DELIVERY_MODULE = 'SMTPDirect'
SMTPHOST = 'mrbrklyn.com'
SMTPPORT = '25'
add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
add_virtualhost('lists.mrbrklyn.com', 'mrbrklyn.com')
IMAGE_LOGOS = '/mailmanicons/'



There is another one in apache:
I don't know if it is being used.
vim /usr/local/apache/conf/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py

###
# Here's where we get the distributed defaults.

from Defaults import *

##
# Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s/mailman/'

Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 10:42 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> 
> Can it be set up like that and if so, please tell me how.


I'm trying to!

Please see my posts archived at

and
.

Please as I ask, show me 'postconf -n' mm_cfg.py and you might as well
include Postfix's master.cf too.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 10:04 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> IIRC, that means that DNS
> lookup failed with no result, not that the relevant nameserver (the
> .org rootserver in this case) said there was no such domain.  That
> probably means multiple timeouts on DNS lookups, each of which might
> take 30 seconds.  (I tried "host gnutelephony.org" myself, and got a
> DNS timeout after 30 seconds.) 


It is a strange thought but failure of one message shouldn't prevent the
new messages in mailman to go out in real time.  The definition of real
time is immediately when the mail is received, it is processed and sent
through.  A sweep, which is how it currently behaves, means that mailman
holds on to all its messages, maybe for 10 minutes, and then shoots them
all through to postfix at that point, and then it stops doing sending
again until it feels like it.  What I want to set iut up to do, if it
can, is send the messages out right away as soon as it gets them.  I
want it to ignore the time outs and bounces and just send the messages
out right away, when they arrive and after post processing the headers etc.

I don't care if it takes 30 seconds to do dig  gnutelephony.org.  It
should just ignore that sent message and not do anything if it times
out.  I'm running mailing lists on coding and meetings and politics, not
running 911.

Can it be set up like that and if so, please tell me how.

Ruben

-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 10:31 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 10:04 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
>> By the way, when did you switch to Mailman?  Did you start
>> experiencing this problem immediately when you did?
> 
> 
> about 6 months ago and the problem was concurrent absolutely with the
> initiation of mailman.
> 
> There seems to be no settings I can set to make mailman work, if what
> your saying is true.


I think we can fix your issue fairly simply.

Please, as I asked in my reply at
,
post the output from 'postconf -n' and the contents of mm_cfg.py.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 10:04 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> By the way, when did you switch to Mailman?  Did you start
> experiencing this problem immediately when you did?


about 6 months ago and the problem was concurrent absolutely with the
initiation of mailman.

There seems to be no settings I can set to make mailman work, if what
your saying is true.



-- 
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that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 10:04 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> I don't see how any mailing list
> manager could deal efficiently with such a high rate of failure,

OK - I understand.  Another mailing list manager was doing it before
perl4 really died.  I guess the reality of this is beginning to sink in.



-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Ruben Safir writes:

 > When I read this, it just seems to me that you guys don't know how
 > the software works.

This is user-supported software.  Not everybody is all that expert,
but people contribute when and what they can.  And mild thread-
hijacking like asking if there's a way to get certain information
related to the thread isn't unusual.

 > I posted logs to postfix and what they are asking is frankly
 > impossible to acquire.

Then perhaps you have to live with the delays.  They (like us) ask for
information that is known to have been useful in diagnosing problems
in the past.  Without information, it's impossible to diagnose.

By the way, it is not unheard of that restarting the mail system
clears up backlogs just like that.  (Don't bet your house on it, but
it does happen.)  A typical reason is that in normal operation,
"exponential backoff" is used so that delays from retries increase
with each retry until you've tried for several days, but on system
startup there's provision for an attempt to "flush" the queue right
away, not worrying about when the next try for a message is scheduled.
If that succeeds, the backlog disappears.

Of course if there's a persistent problem, the backlog will reappear.

 > I can't get answers to basic questions such as

Short answer: you didn't ask.  In the posts I've seen, you just
announced that it wasn't working as you expected.

 > When the email comes to mailman, where does it go.

First it is delivered to the mailman program itself over a pipe,
according to the alias in the Postfix configuration.  If it's a post,
it is then saved in a .pck file in a queue directory (typically
/usr/var/mailman/queue/incoming/).  The incoming runner checks the
directory for changes, picks up the new .pck when it appears, decides
what to do with it after checking for spam, inserting footer and other
mailing list stuff like List-* headers, and finally puts in in one or
more queues (eg, archive, outgoing).  Those runners do the same
dance.  Typically the whole process occurs in under a second.

 > How does the MTA know to pick up the mail.

The Mailman outgoing runner connects to the well-known port for mail,
where the MTA is listening.  I think it's possible to configure
Mailman to use the "sendmail" program via stdin, but in modern systems
(specifically Postfix) it's much more efficient to use a socket, since
the sendmail program itself often just drops the message in a queue to
be processed by a daemon serving the outgoing queue.

 > It seems to process mail in sweeps, rather than in real time when
 > mail arrives.

What do you mean by "real time"?  If you look at what Postfix does,
it's just like Mailman: composed of several programs, each with a
specific responsibility, that receives a message as a file in a queue
directory, processes it, places the output in a file in another queue
directory, and only if that was successful, removes the input queue
file.  The final step is to connect to another mail server over the
network, but again the input queue file is not removed until the
remote server says "250 OK", which means that the message has been
saved as a file on the remote system.  This can be done quickly (my
system typically processes a post end-to-end in under a second, though
at most 20 subscribers), but often not in what communication engineers
mean by "real time".

In fact, when you see stuff like this:

 > 2016-02-28T10:27:00.724625-05:00 www postfix/smtpd[21374]: NOQUEUE: reject: 
 > RCPT from www.mrbrklyn.com[96.57.23.82]: 450
 > +4.1.2 : Recipient address rejected: Domain not 
 > found; from=
 > +to= proto=ESMTP helo=

what you're seeing is that you have quite a few possibly invalid
addresses that you're trying to send to.  In fact, the first ten were
rejected without a single success -- I don't see how any mailing list
manager could deal efficiently with such a high rate of failure,
especially if it frequently involves DNS failures as this one does,
and several of the other log entries report the same outcome.  Note
that the failure is considered temporary.  IIRC, that means that DNS
lookup failed with no result, not that the relevant nameserver (the
.org rootserver in this case) said there was no such domain.  That
probably means multiple timeouts on DNS lookups, each of which might
take 30 seconds.  (I tried "host gnutelephony.org" myself, and got a
DNS timeout after 30 seconds.)  If you have two nameservers
configured, it seems likely that we have just found one common reason
it takes your Mailman 60+ seconds to process one queue entry.

Temporary failure also means that the queue file will remain, as the
system believes that retrying may succeed.  (Any mailing list manager
that does not preserve the message in this way is losing mail.)  I
don't know precisely what you mean by "sweeps", but the fact that
there are quite a few temporary failure queuefiles hanging around
would account 

Re: [Mailman-Users] Modifying Privacy.py

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 03:23 PM, ListGnome ProtonMail wrote:
> Thanks Mark,
> 
> That worked, with one little "gotcha". I found that after editing
> Privacy.py, I had to go to the admin page of the list and although the
> Privacy option was showing "Requires approval" - until I re-submitted
> the Privay Options page it would operate as if it were set on "Confirm".


Which raises another point. I forgot to mention about the display of the
current value which is now wrong.

Your current two choices actually correspond to values of the
subscribe_policy attribute of 2 and 3, but in the HTML, the checked
attribute will apply to values of 1 and 2.

You also need to edit Mailman/Cgi/admin.py around line 672, change
if varname == 'subscribe_policy' and not
mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE:
checked = checked - 1

to

if varname == 'subscribe_policy' and not
mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE:
checked = checked - 2

Also note that if you were dealing with an other attribute and not the
one that already had this kludgey code to handle 3 vs 4 choices, it
would be even messier.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
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[Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.21 Final Release

[Mark Sapiro]

Please ignore the spurious, fumble fingered post of a few minutes ago.

I am pleased to announce the release of Mailman 2.1.21.

Python 2.4 is the minimum supported, but Python 2.7 is strongly recommended.

This release includes a few new features and several bug fixes. Most of
the changes since the second release candidate are i18n updates, but
there are a few more bug fixes. See the attached README for details.

Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.

For more information, please see our web site at one of:

http://www.list.org
http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
http://mailman.sourceforge.net/
http://mirror.list.org/

Mailman 2.1.21 can be downloaded from

https://launchpad.net/mailman/2.1/
http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mailman/
https://sourceforge.net/projects/mailman/

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
2.1.21 (28-Feb-2016)

  New Features

- There is a new dmarc_none_moderation_action list setting and a
  DEFAULT_DMARC_NONE_MODERATION_ACTION mm_cfg.py setting to optionally
  apply Munge From or Wrap Message actions to posts From: domains that
  publish DMARC p=none.  The intent is to eliminate failure reports to
  the domain owner for messages that would be munged or wrapped if the
  domain published a stronger DMARC policy.  See the descriptions in
  Defaults.py, the web UI and the bug report for more.  (LP: #1539384)

- Thanks to Jim Popovitch there is now a feature to automatically turn
  on moderation for a malicious list member who attempts to flood a list
  with spam.  See the details for the Privacy options ... -> Sender
  filters -> member_verbosity_threshold and member_verbosity_interval
  settings in the web admin UI and the documentation in Defaults.py for
  the DEFAULT_MEMBER_VERBOSITY_* and VERBOSE_CLEAN_LIMIT settings for
  information.

- bin/list_members now has options to display all moderated or all
  non-moderated members.

- There is now a mm_cfg.py setting GLOBAL_BAN_LIST which is like the
  individual list's ban_list but applies globally to all subscribe
  requests.  See the description in Defaults.py for more details.

  i18n

- The Japanese translation has been updated by Yasuhito FUTATSUKI.

- Also thanks to Miloslav Trmac and Yasuhito FUTATSUKI, the l10n for
  Mailman's bin/ commands has been fixed to display using the character
  set of the user's work station even when Mailman's character set for
  the language is different.  Because this has not been tested over a
  wide set of locales, there is an mm_cfg.py switch
  DISABLE_COMMAND_LOCALE_CSET to disable it if it causes problems.
  (LP: #558167)

- The Polish translation has been updated by Stefan Plewako.

- The German translation has been updated by Mirian Margiani and
  Bernhard Schmidt.

- The Russian translation has been updated by Danil Smirnov.

- Several Galician templates that were improperly encoded as iso-8859-1
  have been fixed.  (LP: #1532504)

- The Brazilian Portugese translation has been updated by Emerson Ribeiro
  de Mello.

  Bug fixes and other patches

- If DMARC lookup fails to find a policy, also try the Organizational
  Domain.  Associated with this is a new mm_cfg.py setting
  DMARC_ORGANIZATIONAL_DOMAIN_DATA_URL which sets the URL used to
  retrieve the data for the algorithm that computes the Organizational
  Domain.  See https://publicsuffix.org/list/ for info.  (LP: #1549420)

- Modified contrib/mmdsr to correctly report No such list names that
  contain ".

- User's "Acknowledge" option will now be honored for posts to anonymous
  lists.  (LP: #1546679)

- Fixed a typo in the Non-digest options regular_exclude_ignore
  description thanks to Yasuhito FUTATSUKI.

- DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES has been changed to accept text/plain sub-parts
  from message/rfc822 parts and multipart parts other than mixed and
  alternative and also accept pgp signatures.  This only applies to newly
  created lists and other than pgp signatures, still only accepts
  text/plain.  (LP: #1517446)

- Modified contrib/mmdsr to report held and banned subscriptions and DMARC
  lookups in their own categories.

- Fixed a bug that could create a garbled From: header with certain DMARC
  mitigation actions.  (LP: #1536816)

- Treat a poster's address which matches an equivalent_domains address as
  a list member for the regular_exclude_ignore check.  (LP: #1526550)

- Fixed an issue that sometimes left no white space following
  subject_prefix.  (LP: #1525954)

- Vette log entries for banned subscriptions now include the source of
  the 

Re: [Mailman-Users] Modifying Privacy.py

[ListGnome ProtonMail via Mailman-Users]

Thanks Mark,

That worked, with one little "gotcha". I found that after editing Privacy.py, I 
had to go to the admin page of the list and although the Privacy option was 
showing "Requires approval" - until I re-submitted the Privay Options page it 
would operate as if it were set on "Confirm".

To recap for anyone else interested:

1. Edit /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Gui/Privacy.py

ABOUT LINES 77 TO 90, CHANGE:


else:
sub_cfentry = ('subscribe_policy', mm_cfg.Radio,
# choices
(_('Confirm'),
_('Require approval'),
_('Confirm and approve')),
1,
_('What steps are required for subscription?'),
_('''Confirm (*) - email confirmation required 
Require approval - require list administrator
approval for subscriptions 
Confirm and approve - both confirm and approve


TO:


else:
sub_cfentry = ('subscribe_policy', mm_cfg.Radio,
# choices
(_('Require approval'),
_('Confirm and approve')),
1,
_('What steps are required for subscription?'),
_('''Require approval - require list administrator
approval for subscriptions 
Confirm and approve - both confirm and approve



ABOUT LINE 554, CHANGE:

if property == 'subscribe_policy' and not mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE:
val += 1

TO:

if property == 'subscribe_policy' and not mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE:
val += 2


2. RESTART MAILMAN

3. Go to the list's admin page and select (re-select) "Require approval"
or "Confirm and approve" and submit the page.


 Original Message 
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Modifying Privacy.py
Local Time: February 24, 2016 11:17 am
UTC Time: February 24, 2016 12:17 AM
From: m...@msapiro.net
To: mailman-users@python.org

On 02/23/2016 03:44 PM, ListGnome ProtonMail via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> There are currently three option and I'm trying to remove "Confirm"
> so that the only two options remain - "Require approval" and "Confirm
> and approve".
>
> In the file "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Gui/Privacy.py" I've tried
> removing the lines that relate to "Confirm" - and as expected the
> Admin page looks okay with only the two desired options showing.
> However, what happens when someone subscribs is they actually get the
> "Confirm" process - rather than the expected "Requires approval".
>
> Is there another file I need to be looking at also? Or am I most
> likely just screwing up the "Privacy.py" file?


It's much more complicated than that. There are actually four possible
values for subscribe_policy. These values and their meanings are

0 -> Open subscribe, no confirm or approve.
1 -> Confirm, require user confirmation
2 -> Require approval
3 -> Confirm and approve, require user confirmation, then approval

There is already code in Mailman/Gui/Privacy.py to test the
mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE setting and if it is false, not display the
open subscribe choice AND increment the return value allow for it's not
being there.

By removing the "Confirm" choice you are left with two choices whose
returned POST values will be 0 and 1. The mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE
code will increment the return, so the two choices are 1 and 2 which are
'Confirm' and 'Require approval' Regardless of what the words say.

So Assuming you will NEVER set ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE = Yes, you can just
change the statement in the definition of _setValue() in
Mailman/Gui/Privacy.py from

if property == 'subscribe_policy' and not
mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE:
val += 1

to

if property == 'subscribe_policy' and not
mm_cfg.ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE:
val += 2


--
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San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
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[Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Announce] Mailman 2.1.21 release - IMPORTANT update

[Mark Sapiro]

This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156)
--j6S4w6u3IBpq2Lhw4NRnht7WOGMvBbU6R
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
 boundary="060207060504090803080503"

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--060207060504090803080503
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I am pleased to announce the second release candidate for Mailman
2.1.21. This fixes a serious bug in the first release candidate in that
the few new list attributes weren't initialized for new lists. 2.1.21rc1
would work with lists migrated from older releases but lists created
under that release were unusable.

If you installed 2.1.21rc1, you should upgrade to 2.1.21rc2, and if you
created new lists under 2.1.21rc1, see the attached fix_list procedure.

Python 2.4 is the minimum supported, but Python 2.7 is strongly recommend=
ed.

This release includes a few new features and several bug fixes. See the
attached README for details.

Associated with these changes are six new and two modified strings in
the i18n message catalogs. I strongly encourage anyone with an interest
in translations of Mailman to get this release and help with updating
the translations for the final 2.1.21 release which is planned for the
end of February.

This candidate is expected to be quite stable. All the changes since
2.1.20 have been installed in the python.org Mailman as they were
developed and are running without known issues. The only reason why this
is a candidate and not a final release is to allow time for i18n updates
to be in the final.

Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.

For more information, please see our web site at one of:

http://www.list.org
http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
http://mailman.sourceforge.net/
http://mirror.list.org/

Mailman 2.1.21rc2 can be downloaded from

https://launchpad.net/mailman/2.1/
http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mailman/
https://sourceforge.net/projects/mailman/

--=20
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan


--060207060504090803080503
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8;
 name="README"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: attachment;
 filename="README"

2.1.21rc2 (05-Feb-2016)

  New Features

- There is a new dmarc_none_moderation_action list setting and a
  DEFAULT_DMARC_NONE_MODERATION_ACTION mm_cfg.py setting to optionall=
y
  apply Munge From or Wrap Message actions to posts From: domains tha=
t
  publish DMARC p=3Dnone.  The intent is to eliminate failure reports=
 to
  the domain owner for messages that would be munged or wrapped if th=
e
  domain published a stronger DMARC policy.  See the descriptions in
  Defaults.py, the web UI and the bug report for more.  (LP: #1539384=
)

- Thanks to Jim Popovitch there is now a feature to automatically tur=
n
  on moderation for a malicious list member who attempts to flood a l=
ist
  with spam.  See the details for the Privacy options ... -> Sender
  filters -> member_verbosity_threshold and member_verbosity_interval=

  settings in the web admin UI and the documentation in Defaults.py f=
or
  the DEFAULT_MEMBER_VERBOSITY_* and VERBOSE_CLEAN_LIMIT settings for=

  information.

- bin/list_members now has options to display all moderated or all
  non-moderated members.

- There is now a mm_cfg.py setting GLOBAL_BAN_LIST which is like the
  individual list's ban_list but applies globally to all subscribe
  requests.  See the description in Defaults.py for more details.

  i18n

- Several Galician templates that were improperly encoded as iso-8859=
-1
  have been fixed.  (LP: #1532504)

- The German translation has been updated by Mirian Margiani.

- The Brazilian Portugese translation has been updated by Emerson Rib=
eiro
  de Mello.

  Bug fixes and other patches

- Modified contrib/mmdsr to report held and banned subscriptions and =
DMARC
  lookups in their own categories.

- Fixed a bug that could create a garbled From: header with certain D=
MARC
  mitigation actions.  (LP: #1536816)

- Treat a poster's address which matches an equivalent_domains addres=
s as
  a list member for the regular_exclude_ignore check.  (LP: #1526550)=


- Fixed an issue that sometimes left no white space following
  subject_prefix.  (LP: #1525954)

- Vette log entries for banned subscriptions now include the source o=
f
  the request if available.  (LP: #1525733)

- Submitting the user options form for a user who was asynchronously
  unsubscribed would throw an uncaught NotAMemberError.  (LP: #152327=
3)

- It was possible under some circumstances for a message to be shunte=
d
   

Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 03:04 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 05:55 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>> bin/config_list -o - listname | grep -v '^#'


Ruben,

This sub-thread is unrelated to your questions.

-- 
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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 02:54 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> 
> Evidently... So what might be a fix?  Because whatever it is it doesn't 
> affect other mail. :(
> 
> Feb 28 17:17:18 2016 (29233) 
>  smtp to 
> hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.241 seconds
> Feb 28 17:18:27 2016 (29233) <56d30c67.7070...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
> for 10 recips, completed in 69.239 seconds
> Feb 28 17:19:37 2016 (29233) <56d311f1.8080...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
> for 10 recips, completed in 69.240 seconds
...


So it takes Mailman over a minute to deliver to Postfix for 10
recipients. No matter what Mailman is doing, this is way too long by
over a factor of 100.

Various things could be at the root of this, e.g.
reject_unknown_recipient_domain in smtpd_recipient_restrictions
particularly in combination with slow DNS lookups.

To say more, we'd need to see the output from 'postconf -n' and the
contents of mm_cfg.py, but this is really a Postfix tuning issue, soo
see  and other Postfix
resources as well. There is also information in our wiki, but a lot of
the Mailman specific stuff is out of date, but go to
 and search titles for "performance".

-- 
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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 05:55 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> bin/config_list -o - listname | grep -v '^#'

real_name = 'hangout'

owner = ['m...@here.com']

moderator = []

description = 'NYLXS Discussions List'

info = ''

subject_prefix = '[Hangout-NYLXS] '

anonymous_list = False

first_strip_reply_to = False

reply_goes_to_list = 1

reply_to_address = ''

umbrella_list = False

umbrella_member_suffix = '-owner'

send_reminders = 0

welcome_msg = """Welcome to the NYLXS Mailing List
See http://www.nylxs.com
Free Linux"""

send_welcome_msg = True

goodbye_msg = ''

send_goodbye_msg = True

admin_immed_notify = 0

admin_notify_mchanges = 1

respond_to_post_requests = 0

emergency = 0

-- 
new_member_options = 256

administrivia = True

max_message_size = 0

admin_member_chunksize = 300

host_name = 'nylxs.com'

include_rfc2369_headers = 1

include_list_post_header = 1

include_sender_header = 1

max_days_to_hold = 1


preferred_language = 'en'

available_languages = ['en']

encode_ascii_prefixes = 0


nondigestable = True

msg_header = ''

msg_footer = """___
%(real_name)s mailing list
%(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
http://www.nylxs.com/"";

scrub_nondigest = False

regular_exclude_lists = []

regular_exclude_ignore = True

regular_include_lists = []

digestable = True

digest_is_default = False

mime_is_default_digest = False

digest_size_threshhold = 30

digest_send_periodic = True

digest_header = ''

digest_footer = """___
%(real_name)s mailing list
%(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
%(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s"""

digest_volume_frequency = 1


advertised = 1

subscribe_policy = 1

unsubscribe_policy = 0

ban_list = []

private_roster = 1

obscure_addresses = 1


default_member_moderation = 0

member_moderation_action = 0

member_moderation_notice = ''

accept_these_nonmembers = ['some...@world.org']

hold_these_nonmembers = []

reject_these_nonmembers = []
discard_these_nonmembers = []

generic_nonmember_action = 3

forward_auto_discards = 0

nonmember_rejection_notice = ''


require_explicit_destination = 1

acceptable_aliases = ''

max_num_recipients = 3


header_filter_rules = []

bounce_matching_headers = """
to: fri...@public.com
message-id: relay.comanche.denmark.eu
from: l...@listme.com
from: .*@uplinkpro.com"""


bounce_processing = 1

bounce_score_threshold = 5.0

bounce_info_stale_after = 7

bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings = 2

bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings_interval = 3

bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner = 0

bounce_notify_owner_on_disable = True

bounce_notify_owner_on_removal = True


archive = 1

archive_private = 0

archive_volume_frequency = 1


nntp_host = ''

linked_newsgroup = ''

gateway_to_news = 0

gateway_to_mail = 0

news_moderation = 0

news_prefix_subject_too = 1


autorespond_postings = 0

autoresponse_postings_text = ''

autorespond_admin = 0

autoresponse_admin_text = ''

autorespond_requests = 0

autoresponse_request_text = ''

autoresponse_graceperiod = 90


filter_content = 1

filter_mime_types = ''

pass_mime_types = ''

filter_filename_extensions = """exe
bat
cmd
com
pif
scr
vbs
cpl"""

pass_filename_extensions = ''

collapse_alternatives = 0

convert_html_to_plaintext = True

filter_action = 0


topics_enabled = 0

topics_bodylines_limit = 5

topics = []



So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 12:57 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> 
> Would it be difficult to add a command similar to postfix's postconf -n
> that would dump the currently used config?


Mailman's

bin/config_list -o - listname | grep -v '^#'

will dump the current config. If you really want postconf -n like output
that shows only settings different from the Defaults.py/mm_cfg.py
settings, there's nothing currently available that I'm aware of, but
I'll think about a script.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 05:46 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 02:26 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
>> On 02/28/2016 12:33 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>>>
>>> If there are more than one or two files in the out/ queue, and if the
>>> smtp log has successive entries of the form
>>
>> there are 38 files in there at preseent
>> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman  4441 Feb 28 16:57 
>> 1456690111.419805+dd7dabe9420b90aad8e72ee0607a4eb015fb9976.pck
>> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 21731 Feb 28 16:33 
>> 1456695234.857981+952d2cfb1cfa9559943dc335ca8eced7d26aaa6f.pck
>> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 30549 Feb 28 16:33 
>> 1456695235.935237+55c1c60ede5771fa2960a0460011f82266dbcb8b.pck
>> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 26009 Feb 28 16:33 
>> 1456695236.069412+c268ffc9dfded5c93d3b3048831f058e184dd576.pck
>> www:/var/lib/mailman/qfiles/out # ls -al |wc
>>  38 3354028
> 
> 
> This indicates a serious backlog.
> 
> 
>>>
>>> Feb 28 08:55:43 2016 (30307)  smtp to list for nnn recips,
>>> completed in t.ttt seconds
>>
>> this is the postfix mail log?
> 
> 
> No. Look at Mailman's smtp log. This may be /var/lib/mailman/logs/smtp
> or /usr/local/mailman/logs/smtp or /var/log/mailman/smtp or somewhere
> else depending on how mailman was installed
> 
> 
>>> with each messages time stamp being t.ttt seconds later than the
>>> preceding message, the out/ queue is backlogged. If that is the case,
>>> Mailman isn't able to deliver fast enough to Postfix to keep up with
>>> it's volume.
> 


Evidently... So what might be a fix?  Because whatever it is it doesn't affect 
other mail. :(

Feb 28 17:17:18 2016 (29233) 
 smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.241 seconds
Feb 28 17:18:27 2016 (29233) <56d30c67.7070...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
for 10 recips, completed in 69.239 seconds
Feb 28 17:19:37 2016 (29233) <56d311f1.8080...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
for 10 recips, completed in 69.240 seconds
Feb 28 17:20:46 2016 (29233) <56d336aa.7060...@crossroadstech.com> smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.247 seconds
Feb 28 17:21:55 2016 (29233) <56d2f8d0.8080...@verizon.net> smtp to hangout for 
10 recips, completed in 69.229 seconds
Feb 28 17:23:27 2016 (29233) <20160222074941.b47c9c...@s8.hostlocal.com> smtp 
to hangout for 69 recips, completed in 91.821 seconds
Feb 28 17:24:37 2016 (29233) <56cd2795.4020...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
for 10 recips, completed in 69.305 seconds
Feb 28 17:25:46 2016 (29233) <56ce7ef5.6020...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
for 10 recips, completed in 69.235 seconds
Feb 28 17:26:56 2016 (29233) 
<50797049-1456397806-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1607713858-@b1.c1.bise6.blackberry>
 smtp to hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.238 seconds
Feb 28 17:28:05 2016 (29233) <20160226060443.ga18...@www.mrbrklyn.com> smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.249 seconds
Feb 28 17:29:14 2016 (29233) <20160226073323.gd20...@linuxmafia.com> smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.227 seconds
Feb 28 17:30:24 2016 (29233)  smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.236 seconds
Feb 28 17:31:33 2016 (29233) <20160227045303.gh20...@linuxmafia.com> smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.364 seconds
Feb 28 17:32:42 2016 (29233) <20160227080928.gh12...@linuxmafia.com> smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.198 seconds
Feb 28 17:33:52 2016 (29233) <56d28f54.1050...@mrbrklyn.com> smtp to hangout 
for 10 recips, completed in 69.465 seconds
Feb 28 17:35:02 2016 (29233) <20160228063512.gb14...@www.mrbrklyn.com> smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.229 seconds
Feb 28 17:36:11 2016 (29233) 
 smtp to 
hangout for 10 recips, completed in 69.301 seconds
Feb 28 17:37:20 2016 (29233) 

Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 02:26 PM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 12:33 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>>
>> If there are more than one or two files in the out/ queue, and if the
>> smtp log has successive entries of the form
> 
> there are 38 files in there at preseent
> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman  4441 Feb 28 16:57 
> 1456690111.419805+dd7dabe9420b90aad8e72ee0607a4eb015fb9976.pck
> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 21731 Feb 28 16:33 
> 1456695234.857981+952d2cfb1cfa9559943dc335ca8eced7d26aaa6f.pck
> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 30549 Feb 28 16:33 
> 1456695235.935237+55c1c60ede5771fa2960a0460011f82266dbcb8b.pck
> -rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 26009 Feb 28 16:33 
> 1456695236.069412+c268ffc9dfded5c93d3b3048831f058e184dd576.pck
> www:/var/lib/mailman/qfiles/out # ls -al |wc
>  38 3354028


This indicates a serious backlog.


>>
>> Feb 28 08:55:43 2016 (30307)  smtp to list for nnn recips,
>> completed in t.ttt seconds
> 
> this is the postfix mail log?


No. Look at Mailman's smtp log. This may be /var/lib/mailman/logs/smtp
or /usr/local/mailman/logs/smtp or /var/log/mailman/smtp or somewhere
else depending on how mailman was installed


>> with each messages time stamp being t.ttt seconds later than the
>> preceding message, the out/ queue is backlogged. If that is the case,
>> Mailman isn't able to deliver fast enough to Postfix to keep up with
>> it's volume.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 12:33 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 02/28/2016 07:29 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:
>>
>> No, I mean I send messages and they don't show up for a half hour even
>> in the postfix logs
> 
> 
> Assuming Mailman 2.1.x, the usual cause of this is a backlogged 'out'
> queue in Mailman. Look at Mailman's 'smtp' log, and look at how many
> files are in Mailman's qfiles/out/ directory (/var/spool/mailman/out in
> some packages).
> 
> If there are more than one or two files in the out/ queue, and if the
> smtp log has successive entries of the form

there are 38 files in there at preseent
-rw-rw  1 mailman mailman  4441 Feb 28 16:57 
1456690111.419805+dd7dabe9420b90aad8e72ee0607a4eb015fb9976.pck
-rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 21731 Feb 28 16:33 
1456695234.857981+952d2cfb1cfa9559943dc335ca8eced7d26aaa6f.pck
-rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 30549 Feb 28 16:33 
1456695235.935237+55c1c60ede5771fa2960a0460011f82266dbcb8b.pck
-rw-rw  1 mailman mailman 26009 Feb 28 16:33 
1456695236.069412+c268ffc9dfded5c93d3b3048831f058e184dd576.pck
www:/var/lib/mailman/qfiles/out # ls -al |wc
 38 3354028



> 
> Feb 28 08:55:43 2016 (30307)  smtp to list for nnn recips,
> completed in t.ttt seconds

this is the postfix mail log?


like this?

2016-02-28T17:17:14.802128-05:00 www postfix/qmgr[21586]: 0F2FB1616D8: 
from=, size=6960, nrcpt=41 (queue active)
2016-02-28T17:17:14.857414-05:00 www postfix/qmgr[21586]: 7C884163D99: 
from=, size=4936, nrcpt=42 (queue active)
2016-02-28T17:17:14.876153-05:00 www postfix/qmgr[21586]: 7E61E1616C8: 
from=, size=5354, nrcpt=40 (queue active)
2016-02-28T17:17:14.893215-05:00 www postfix/qmgr[21586]: 15E131617B9: 
from=, size=3740, nrcpt=41 (queue active)

and this
2016-02-28T17:17:43.841701-05:00 www postfix/local[667]: 47291163DA1: 
to=, relay=local, delay=0.55, delays=0.03/0/0/0.51, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
bounces hangout)

18260985136, Hostname=BLUPR09MB0181.namprd09.prod.outlook.com] 12753 bytes in 
0.183, 67.784 KB/sec Queued mail for delivery)
2016-02-28T15:51:56.553321-05:00 www postfix/local[25454]: E763B163D9C: 
to=, relay=local, delay=0.61, delays=0.1/0/0/0.51, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
bounces hangout)
2016-02-28T15:52:24.710239-05:00 www postfix/local[25458]: 18326163D9A: 
to=, relay=local, delay=0.61, delays=0.09/0/0/0.51, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
bounces hangout)
2016-02-28T16:06:18.504031-05:00 www postfix/local[25619]: A874B163DA1: 
to=, relay=local, delay=1.4, delays=0.88/0.02/0/0.52, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
post hangout)
2016-02-28T16:33:54.960832-05:00 www postfix/local[26033]: 0A854163DA2: 
to=, relay=local, delay=1, delays=0.17/0.05/0/0.79, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
post hangout)
2016-02-28T17:12:16.334190-05:00 www postfix/local[561]: BA2A3163DA2: 
to=, relay=local, delay=1.6, delays=0.19/0.04/0/1.4, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
bounces hangout)
2016-02-28T17:12:16.342511-05:00 www postfix/local[513]: ADAD9163DA1: 
to=, relay=local, delay=1.6, delays=0.05/0.01/0/1.6, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
bounces hangout)
2016-02-28T17:17:43.841701-05:00 www postfix/local[667]: 47291163DA1: 
to=, relay=local, delay=0.55, delays=0.03/0/0/0.51, 
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered to command: /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman 
bounces hangout)


> 
> with each messages time stamp being t.ttt seconds later than the
> preceding message, the out/ queue is backlogged. If that is the case,
> Mailman isn't able to deliver fast enough to Postfix to keep up with
> it's volume.
> 
> Even with full VERP, Mailman should be able to deliver tens of messages
> per second to Postfix. If it is slower than that, there is a n issue
> with delivery. Once we have more info on whether the queue is backlogged
> and what the delivery rate is, we can say more.
> You might find some of the hits from the google search
> 
> site:mail.python.org inurl:mailman backlogged out queue
> 
> of interest.
> 
> 


-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com 

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so 

Re: [Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

www:~ # /usr/lib/mailman/bin/version
Using Mailman version: 2.1.17

 www:~ # postconf -d | grep mail_version
mail_version = 2.11.3
milter_macro_v = $mail_name $mail_version



-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
--
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
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Unsubscribe: 
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[Mailman-Users] Config dump? - WAS Re: speed up mailman

[Tanstaafl]

On 2/28/2016 1:19 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull  wrote:
> If that doesn't make it obvious what you need to do, you might want to
> tell us something about your configuration and use case.  What version
> of Mailman?  Did you install as a package from a distribution or from
> source?  If from a distribution, which one?

Been meaning to ask...

Would it be difficult to add a command similar to postfix's postconf -n
that would dump the currently used config?

Sure would help with troubleshooting...
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Mark Sapiro writes:

 > Even with full VERP, Mailman should be able to deliver tens of messages
 > per second to Postfix. If it is slower than that, there is a n issue
 > with delivery. Once we have more info on whether the queue is backlogged
 > and what the delivery rate is, we can say more.
 > You might find some of the hits from the google search
 > 
 > site:mail.python.org inurl:mailman backlogged out queue
 > 
 > of interest.

@Ruben: If that doesn't make it obvious what you need to do, you might
want to tell us something about your configuration and use case.  What
version of Mailman?  Did you install as a package from a distribution
or from the source code?  If from a distribution, which one?

How big are the lists (number of subscribed addresses, maximum size
if there are several, and sizes can be order-of-magnitude like tens,
thousands, hundred million)?  How many such lists?  As Mark says, you
still should be able to move up to 100,000 messages/hour with modest
hardware under normal conditions.  You normally have to have a huge
backlog (thousands of individual messages in the outgoing queue) to
see significant slowdown -- a couple of hundred should clear within a
few minutes.  Note: one post typically translates to several outgoing
messages, up to the number of enabled subscribers for a list with full
personalization.

Are your lists configured for personalization (eg, per-user
information such as subscription management URL in the footer)?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Switching to Mailman?

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 07:41 AM, Christian F Buser wrote:
> 
> I woul dlike to use again a Mac Mini for this task, which will have
> no public IP-address and no DNS entry pointing to it for mail
> delivery. I found a solution to use "fetchmail" for getting inccoming
> messages from a standard POP3 mailbox.
> 
> * Does anybody have experience on such a setup, especially regarding
> whether it works reliably?


There is a FAQ on this at 


> * What Operating System should I prefer for Mailman? The standard
> MacOS, or the Server version? I have nearly every MacOS ar my
> disposal starting from 10.4 or so (but I think 10.6 should be the
> minimum to use) of the standard version, as well as 10.6 Server, as
> well as the "Server Apps" version 2.2.1, 3.0.3, 3.2.1. and 4 (which,
> I think, belongs to MacOS X 10.10).
> 
> * Can "standard" Mailman reliably work on MacOS X / MacOS X Server?
> What should be preferred?


Go to  and search titles for "mac".

I have a source install of Mailman 2.1 on Mac OS X 10.11 (originally
installed on 10.10) in a fink environment with the fink versions of
Postfix and Apache. This works fine for my development purposes.

Others have installed Mailman 3 in a similar environment and I will be
doing that too at some point, but I haven't yet.


> * Better use Mailman 2.1 or Mailman 3?


Mailman 3 is the future and arguably a better choice for new lists.


> * Does anybody here work with the Apple-version of Mailman?


There are some posts in the list archives from people who do. Maybe
they'll speak up.


> * Or, does anybody here have a proposal for a different List Server
> software than Mailman?


On a mailman-users list?


> I am presently running 2 mailing lists. Both are "announcement lists"
> where no discussion is possible. One has about 120 or so addresses,
> the other has about 500. The smaller one gets messages for
> distribution about twice a month, the bigger one once in about every
> 2-3 months. Both lists allow attachments.


Have you considered a Raspberry Pi ;)

Seriously, this is pretty low volume. I think almost anything can handle it.

I think your most serious issue would be getting your mail accepted by
recipient ISPs without a 'non-generic' domain name and 'full circle' DNS
unless you are using your ISP as a smart host to relay your outbound
mail, but that would not be any different than with your current
solution, so I guess you have it covered.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Mark Sapiro writes:

 > Even with full VERP, Mailman should be able to deliver tens of messages
 > per second to Postfix. If it is slower than that, there is a n issue
 > with delivery. Once we have more info on whether the queue is backlogged
 > and what the delivery rate is, we can say more.
 > You might find some of the hits from the google search
 > 
 > site:mail.python.org inurl:mailman backlogged out queue
 > 
 > of interest.

If that doesn't make it obvious what you need to do, you might want to
tell us something about your configuration and use case.  What version
of Mailman?  Did you install as a package from a distribution or from
source?  If from a distribution, which one?

How big are the lists (number of subscribed addresses, maximum size if
there are several, and sizes can be order-of-magnitude like tens,
thousands, hundred million)?  How many such lists?  (As Mark says, you
still should be able to move up to 100,000 messages/hour with modest
hardware under normal conditions.)

Are your lists configured for personalization (eg, per-user
information such as subscription management URL in the footer)?

If Mailman >= 2.1.16, are your lists configured to deal with DMARC
issues (bounces of posts from AOL and Yahoo! addresses)?  Do you get a
lot of posts from those addresses?  (This can matter because DNS
transactions for DMARC can take a long time if for some reason your
path to those nameservers is slow.)
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Jim Popovitch]

On Sun, Feb 28, 2016 at 3:57 AM, Ruben Safir  wrote:
> When I ran it with majordomo their was no problem.

How was majordomo submitting email to postfix, and how is mailman now
submitting email to postix?

-Jim P.
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Mark Sapiro]

On 02/28/2016 07:29 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> 
> No, I mean I send messages and they don't show up for a half hour even
> in the postfix logs


Assuming Mailman 2.1.x, the usual cause of this is a backlogged 'out'
queue in Mailman. Look at Mailman's 'smtp' log, and look at how many
files are in Mailman's qfiles/out/ directory (/var/spool/mailman/out in
some packages).

If there are more than one or two files in the out/ queue, and if the
smtp log has successive entries of the form

Feb 28 08:55:43 2016 (30307)  smtp to list for nnn recips,
completed in t.ttt seconds

with each messages time stamp being t.ttt seconds later than the
preceding message, the out/ queue is backlogged. If that is the case,
Mailman isn't able to deliver fast enough to Postfix to keep up with
it's volume.

Even with full VERP, Mailman should be able to deliver tens of messages
per second to Postfix. If it is slower than that, there is a n issue
with delivery. Once we have more info on whether the queue is backlogged
and what the delivery rate is, we can say more.
You might find some of the hits from the google search

site:mail.python.org inurl:mailman backlogged out queue

of interest.


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[Mailman-Users] Switching to Mailman?

[Christian F Buser]

Hi all

I did not so far use Mailman at all, but I am obviously forced to replace my 
current list server software :(

So far, I am using LetterRip (Version 4.07) on a Mac Mini with MacOS X 10.6. 
Earlier I also had used Macjordomo X 1.6a5 for some other lists. But both these 
softwares are programmed for the PowerPC processor and require "Rosetta" to use 
them on a more modern Intel-based Mac. And Rosetta is not available for 
operating systems after 10.6. So I am more or less forced to look for another 
solution. 

I woul dlike to use again a Mac Mini for this task, which will have no public 
IP-address and no DNS entry pointing to it for mail delivery. I found a 
solution to use "fetchmail" for getting inccoming messages from a standard POP3 
mailbox.  

* Does anybody have experience on such a setup, especially regarding whether it 
works reliably? 

* What Operating System should I prefer for Mailman? The standard MacOS, or the 
Server version? I have nearly every MacOS ar my disposal starting from 10.4 or 
so (but I think 10.6 should be the minimum to use) of the standard version, as 
well as 10.6 Server, as well as the "Server Apps" version 2.2.1, 3.0.3, 3.2.1. 
and 4 (which, I think, belongs to MacOS X 10.10).

* Can "standard" Mailman reliably work on MacOS X / MacOS X Server? What should 
be preferred?

* Better use Mailman 2.1 or Mailman 3? 

* Does anybody here work with the Apple-version of Mailman? 

* Or, does anybody here have a proposal for a different List Server software 
than Mailman? 

I am presently running 2 mailing lists. Both are "announcement lists" where no 
discussion is possible. One has about 120 or so addresses, the other has about 
500. The smaller one gets messages for distribution about twice a month, the 
bigger one once in about every 2-3 months. Both lists allow attachments.

Thank you, Christian 

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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 03:47 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
>  > How do I speed up mailman so that it works instantaneously and stops
>  > storing messages.
> 
> If you mean "Mailman is administratively holding messages until
> released by a moderator," you need to tell us more about your current
> configuration and needs.  There are several reasons why Mailman will
> hold messages -- what is the reason that Mailman gives for holding
> your messages?


No, I mean I send messages and they don't show up for a half hour even
in the postfix logs


-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
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http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
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Re: [Mailman-Users] date

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 04:01 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:
> Sun Feb 28 04:01:23 EST 2016
> [ruben@localhost ~]$


yeah - postfix works are about instantanious as it can get... so where
is mailman tripping up?


-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
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http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 03:47 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> If there's a performance
> problem, almost surely either your ISP is throttling you, or your MTA
> is misconfigured.  Again, we need to know more about how Mailman is
> installed, what you're trying to do, and what the other software
> involved is (at least an MTA such as Postfix, Exim, Sendmail, or
> Qmail, and preferably virus and spam filters).

When I ran it with majordomo their was no problem.  all mailing lists
went out instantaneously, or as fast as postfix could process it.   When
I send mail out with mutt, there is no problem.  When I send mail out
with dovecot there is no problem.  The only delay I ever have is with
mailman.  If your saying that mailman is putting out the files
efficiently, and postfix isn't picking them up, why does it then work
for every other mail source, and how do I fix this interface for mailman?

Ruben

-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
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[Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Ruben Safir writes:

 > How do I speed up mailman so that it works instantaneously and stops
 > storing messages.

If you mean "Mailman is administratively holding messages until
released by a moderator," you need to tell us more about your current
configuration and needs.  There are several reasons why Mailman will
hold messages -- what is the reason that Mailman gives for holding
your messages?

OTOH, if it's performance problem and messages are piling up in
queues, well, that is simply how mail works: put the message in a file
where the next program in the pipeline will find it and pass it on.
In fact, Mailman is capable of filling pretty much any pipe you're
likely to have available.  (People very frequently complain that
Mailman sends too much mail too fast.)  If there's a performance
problem, almost surely either your ISP is throttling you, or your MTA
is misconfigured.  Again, we need to know more about how Mailman is
installed, what you're trying to do, and what the other software
involved is (at least an MTA such as Postfix, Exim, Sendmail, or
Qmail, and preferably virus and spam filters).

Steve


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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Ruben Safir]

On 02/28/2016 03:15 AM, Seun Ojedeji wrote:
> It's a factor of postfix than it is for mailman. However you could reduce
> the level of moderation so things can pass scrutiny as fast on the mailman
> side.
> 

everything directly mailed through postfix goes straight through without
any delay.  So I'm at a loss to understand it.


> Cheers!
> 
> Sent from my LG G4
> Kindly excuse brevity and typos
> On 28 Feb 2016 07:58, "Ruben Safir"  wrote:
> 
>> Hello
>>
>> How do I speed up mailman so that it works instantaneously and stops
>> storing messages.
>>
>> Ruben
>> --
>> So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
>> that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
>> proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
>> http://www.mrbrklyn.com
>>
>> DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
>> http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
>> http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
>> http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
>> http://www.brooklyn-living.com
>>
>> Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
>> but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
>> --
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>> Searchable Archives:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>> Unsubscribe:
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/seun.ojedeji%40gmail.com
>>
> 


-- 
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
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Re: [Mailman-Users] speed up mailman

[Seun Ojedeji]

It's a factor of postfix than it is for mailman. However you could reduce
the level of moderation so things can pass scrutiny as fast on the mailman
side.

Cheers!

Sent from my LG G4
Kindly excuse brevity and typos
On 28 Feb 2016 07:58, "Ruben Safir"  wrote:

> Hello
>
> How do I speed up mailman so that it works instantaneously and stops
> storing messages.
>
> Ruben
> --
> So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
> that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
> proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
> http://www.mrbrklyn.com
>
> DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
> http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
> http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive
> http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
> http://www.brooklyn-living.com
>
> Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps,
> but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
> --
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe:
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/seun.ojedeji%40gmail.com
>
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