RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
On Fri, 20 Sep 2002, Barry A. Warsaw wrote: > > "TR" == Tom Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > TR> Sorry, I should have clarified that.. however, doesn't Barry > TR> need at least *some* people to run the beta under load to help > TR> iron out the problems :) Oh, absolutely! The early adopters play a crucial role in moving the beta toward a solid release. If it were not for these folks, we would all be stuck with being forced to be beta-testers. (Probably paying for the privilege, too, because the best way to make something sub-standard into something valuable is to put a lot of marketing behind it and charge people money for it. For example, Windows 95 and 98 are both (IMHO) beta software that Micro$oft made a pile of money off of on the way toward Windows 2000, all-in-all a solid product.) I -much- prefer the way it is done in the open source community. > TR> Needless to say, I am one of those persons :) > > Yes! And greatly appreciated, not just by me, but by all those other > folks who have to or want to wait until the final release. Every bug > we squash now is one that (hopefully ) won't bite people later. > > -Barry I, too, greatly appreciate the time, energy, efforts, and contributions of those who elect to run with beta versions. I owe a countless debt to you, Tom, and thousands like you, since I use a wide variety of open source software for many aspects of both my personal and professional life. In fact, I would greatly like to join your ranks; alas! I do not have the time to give; I wouldn't even have the time to keep Mailman up to date with the latest beta version, which Barry has pointed out in a recent posting is an important part of being a beta tester. So, my original purpose in waving the yellow flag for Nathan was just to make sure that these aspects were "on the table", in addition to the discussion about the sought-after feature. I had the sense that Nathan is in a situation more like mine, where beta software is (no offense!) to be avoided when possible. - Andrew Mailman Administrator - http://www.tux.org/mailman/listinfo/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
> "TR" == Tom Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: TR> Sorry, I should have clarified that.. however, doesn't Barry TR> need at least *some* people to run the beta under load to help TR> iron out the problems :) TR> Needless to say, I am one of those persons :) Yes! And greatly appreciated, not just by me, but by all those other folks who have to or want to wait until the final release. Every bug we squash now is one that (hopefully ) won't bite people later. -Barry -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Re: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
I inadvertently ran into another approach to blocking unsubscription. I recently added subscribers using a dump from a database list which I manually edited to remove some extraneous characters. I didn't look hard enough: there were a couple of null (and therefore invisible) characters at the end of some of the names. Mail went out successfully, and it wasn't until someone tried to turn delivery off while they went on vacation that I found there was a problem. The password note told them to access their info pages at http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]%00 but all that got them was an error message. The address looked fine on my member management page, but any attempt by the user to reach the info page was rejected. Removing the %00 didn't work - it just resulted in a different error. I didn't try email, but I doubt it would have worked either. I had to manually cancel the subscriptions for several users and re-subscribe them - there was no way they could do it themselves. On Wednesday, September 18, 2002, at 05:58 PM, Moz wrote: > Nathan wrote: > As far as I know, you can unsubscribe by: sending email to > -unsubscribe@... or by using the web form. A little judicious > editing of the user HTML page (via the admin interface) would remove > both the unsubscribe and nomail options (but them smart users can > still create requests that use those options). Changing the > ~alias/.-unsubscribe file so it is empty will stop that from > having any effect. -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Re: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
Nathan wrote: > ability to block unsubscribing from a list. We have a number of > required campus mailing lists that our users must remain subscribed > to at all times. As far as I know, you can unsubscribe by: sending email to -unsubscribe@... or by using the web form. A little judicious editing of the user HTML page (via the admin interface) would remove both the unsubscribe and nomail options (but them smart users can still create requests that use those options). Changing the ~alias/.-unsubscribe file so it is empty will stop that from having any effect. I think that should work. Moz -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
Naturally we don't use beta software in our production environment unless we: A.) Have no choice or B.) Have sufficiently tested it. Mailman is currently being installed on a test box that may become live if we determine it to be an acceptable replacement (which is looking good at the moment). To ease your fears, I am currently working with the 2.0.13 version. :-) Nathan Beittenmiller Systems Administrator -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2002 3:30 PM To: Tom Ryan Cc: Nathan Beittenmiller; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe? On Wed, 18 Sep 2002, Tom Ryan wrote: > The latest betas of mailman can allow the admin to block unsubscribe > requests. However, you can't block the users setting "nomail", etc. > > Seems we're almost there, just not quite :) Please note however, Nathan, the use of the word "beta" in Tom's reply. I am sure you have read on the Mailman site that v2.1 is in development, and explicitly -not- recommended for production mailing list service, and that good ole' v2.0.x is the current stable version (v2.0.13 is the latest). It sounds like you are definitely running a production service, so I just wanted to emphasize the point, in case it had missed your eye. HTH, - Andrew Mailman Administrator - http://www.tux.org/mailman/listinfo/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Re: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 16:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Tom Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > On Wed, 18 Sep 2002, Tom Ryan wrote: > > > > > The latest betas of mailman can allow the admin to block > > > unsubscribe requests. However, you can't block the users > > > setting "nomail", etc. > > > > > > Seems we're almost there, just not quite :) > > > > Please note however, Nathan, the use of the word "beta" in Tom's > > reply. I am sure you have read on the Mailman site that v2.1 is > > in development, and explicitly -not- recommended for production > > mailing list service, and that good ole' v2.0.x is the current > > stable version (v2.0.13 is the latest). It sounds like you are > > definitely running a production service, so I just wanted to > > emphasize the point, in case it had missed your eye. > > > > HTH, > > - Andrew > > > Sorry, I should have clarified that.. however, doesn't Barry need > at least *some* people to run the beta under load to help iron out > the problems :) > > Needless to say, I am one of those persons :) > > Tom > Although I'm not on a list of people doing it and officially providing feedback, I have several "production" lists that have been running happily under 2.13b for the past 7 days. -- Raquel Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. --Winston Churchill -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
Sorry, I should have clarified that.. however, doesn't Barry need at least *some* people to run the beta under load to help iron out the problems :) Needless to say, I am one of those persons :) Tom On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Wed, 18 Sep 2002, Tom Ryan wrote: > > > The latest betas of mailman can allow the admin to block unsubscribe > > requests. However, you can't block the users setting "nomail", etc. > > > > Seems we're almost there, just not quite :) > > Please note however, Nathan, the use of the word "beta" in Tom's reply. > I am sure you have read on the Mailman site that v2.1 is in development, > and explicitly -not- recommended for production mailing list service, and > that good ole' v2.0.x is the current stable version (v2.0.13 is the > latest). It sounds like you are definitely running a production service, > so I just wanted to emphasize the point, in case it had missed your eye. > > HTH, > - Andrew > > > Mailman Administrator - http://www.tux.org/mailman/listinfo/ > -- ___ Tom RyanVoice: 856-225-6361 Consulting System Administrator Fax: 856-969-7900 Rutgers School of Law - Camden -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
On Wed, 18 Sep 2002, Tom Ryan wrote: > The latest betas of mailman can allow the admin to block unsubscribe > requests. However, you can't block the users setting "nomail", etc. > > Seems we're almost there, just not quite :) Please note however, Nathan, the use of the word "beta" in Tom's reply. I am sure you have read on the Mailman site that v2.1 is in development, and explicitly -not- recommended for production mailing list service, and that good ole' v2.0.x is the current stable version (v2.0.13 is the latest). It sounds like you are definitely running a production service, so I just wanted to emphasize the point, in case it had missed your eye. HTH, - Andrew Mailman Administrator - http://www.tux.org/mailman/listinfo/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
> "TR" == Tom Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: TR> The latest betas of mailman can allow the admin to block TR> unsubscribe requests. However, you can't block the users TR> setting "nomail", etc. TR> Seems we're almost there, just not quite :) I hadn't thought about that, but I've put it on the todo list. -Barry -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
The latest betas of mailman can allow the admin to block unsubscribe requests. However, you can't block the users setting "nomail", etc. Seems we're almost there, just not quite :) tom On Wed, 18 Sep 2002, Nathan Beittenmiller wrote: > About five minutes after I sent this, I came up with a solution that > somewhat works. If I add users at the command line nightly (which is > how I build the lists with Majordomo), they need a password to > unsubscribe or change their settings. For most users, that would be a > deterrent right there. Unfortunately, the determined ones can still > request the password be mailed to them (and then they receive what I'm > hoping is a random password). Using that, they can unsubscribe, but > this is more work than filtering the mail, as you suggested that many do > anyway. So it's not optimal, but it is acceptable. Thanks. > > > Nathan Beittenmiller > Systems Administrator > > -Original Message- > > I think that the closest you can come is to have the server notify > you when someone unsubscribes. At that point a letter can be sent > saying it is required that they be subscribed. I would think though > that if someone were asking to be unsubscribed, and they were told > they were required to be subscribed, they probably aren't reading > the mail anyway. I know that I wouldn't. I'd find some way to > filter it out. > > -- > Raquel > > Finish each day and be done with it. You have done what you could; > some blunders and absurdities have crept in; forget them as soon as > you can. Tomorrow is a new day; you shall begin it serenely and with > too high a spirit to be encumbered with your old nonsense. > --Ralph Waldo Emerson > > > > -- > Mailman-Users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > -- ___ Tom RyanVoice: 856-225-6361 Consulting System Administrator Fax: 856-969-7900 Rutgers School of Law - Camden -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
RE: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
About five minutes after I sent this, I came up with a solution that somewhat works. If I add users at the command line nightly (which is how I build the lists with Majordomo), they need a password to unsubscribe or change their settings. For most users, that would be a deterrent right there. Unfortunately, the determined ones can still request the password be mailed to them (and then they receive what I'm hoping is a random password). Using that, they can unsubscribe, but this is more work than filtering the mail, as you suggested that many do anyway. So it's not optimal, but it is acceptable. Thanks. Nathan Beittenmiller Systems Administrator -Original Message- I think that the closest you can come is to have the server notify you when someone unsubscribes. At that point a letter can be sent saying it is required that they be subscribed. I would think though that if someone were asking to be unsubscribed, and they were told they were required to be subscribed, they probably aren't reading the mail anyway. I know that I wouldn't. I'd find some way to filter it out. -- Raquel Finish each day and be done with it. You have done what you could; some blunders and absurdities have crept in; forget them as soon as you can. Tomorrow is a new day; you shall begin it serenely and with too high a spirit to be encumbered with your old nonsense. --Ralph Waldo Emerson -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Re: [Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 09:12:58 -0500 "Nathan Beittenmiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Greetings all! > > I am currently looking into replacing Majordomo with Mailman for > our enterprise mailing list solutions. So far, I can duplicate > everything I've customized on Majordomo with default settings in > Mailman except the ability to block unsubscribing from a list. We > have a number of required campus mailing lists that our users must > remain subscribed to at all times. Majordomo allows us to > restrict unsubscribing to moderator-approved, but I can't seem to > find something similar in Mailman. While this isn't critical (or > really a show-stopper), I wanted to see if I'm just missing > something. Thanks in advance and sorry if this is a duplicate > post; the search feature was down when I checked yesterday. > > > Nathan Beittenmiller I think that the closest you can come is to have the server notify you when someone unsubscribes. At that point a letter can be sent saying it is required that they be subscribed. I would think though that if someone were asking to be unsubscribed, and they were told they were required to be subscribed, they probably aren't reading the mail anyway. I know that I wouldn't. I'd find some way to filter it out. -- Raquel Finish each day and be done with it. You have done what you could; some blunders and absurdities have crept in; forget them as soon as you can. Tomorrow is a new day; you shall begin it serenely and with too high a spirit to be encumbered with your old nonsense. --Ralph Waldo Emerson -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
[Mailman-Users] Blocking Unsubscribe?
Greetings all! I am currently looking into replacing Majordomo with Mailman for our enterprise mailing list solutions. So far, I can duplicate everything I've customized on Majordomo with default settings in Mailman except the ability to block unsubscribing from a list. We have a number of required campus mailing lists that our users must remain subscribed to at all times. Majordomo allows us to restrict unsubscribing to moderator-approved, but I can't seem to find something similar in Mailman. While this isn't critical (or really a show-stopper), I wanted to see if I'm just missing something. Thanks in advance and sorry if this is a duplicate post; the search feature was down when I checked yesterday. Nathan Beittenmiller Systems Administrator -- Mailman-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
