Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-25 Thread Lucas Rocha
Hi dudes,

Don't forget to add your precious suggestion at:

http://live.gnome.org/GnomeJournal/BehindTheScenes

p eace

--lucasr


2006/2/24, Quim Gil [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Continuing embarassing people, sorry if these names were already sung...

 Murray Cumming - The taoist non-leader
 Olav Vitters - Dancing with Bugs
 Andreas Nilsson - Visual identity  misc graphs
 Germán Poó Caamaño - Behind many scenes
 Owen Taylor - Post-chairing, he has a story
 Guilherme de S. Pastore - Knows The GNOME Matrix
 Ross Golder - The GNOME Matrix respects him
 Simos Xenitellis - I bet has something different to explain

 and well Shaun McCance - I'd like to see the interview where this
 priviledged mind unveils all what he is thinking about GNOME but didn't
 dare himself to explain.  B)

 Not to forget, all the let's say leaders of regional GNOME associations
 i.e. GNOME Hispano.

 And someone should dig deep in Asia and Latin America to bring the names
 of other unnamed heroes, difficult to remember by the average European
 citizen.


 En/na Sriram Ramkrishna ha escrit:
  I think some lesser known guys would be wonderful.  These are my personal
  favourites.  Your list may vary.
 
  Danilo Segan  -- il8n stuff
  Fernando Herrera -- bugzilla/gnome-love/general hacking
  Elijah Newman-- release engineering
  Carlos Garncho   -- gnome-vfs and others
  Christian Newmair -- gnome-vfs and others
  Davyd Mandeley  -- applets
  Federico Mena -Quintero -- performance/gtk+/gnome-vfs/printing
  Lucas Rocha  -- general hacking -- bugzilla
  Vincent Untz -- release engineering,bugzilla, and others.
 
  These people are doing the day to day type of stuff like bugzilla,
  gnome-love whatever.  These people are unsung heroes of the
  revolution. :-)

 --
 Quim Gil - http://desdeamericaconamor.org



 --
 marketing-list mailing list
 marketing-list@gnome.org
 http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list




--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-23 Thread Jeff Waugh
quote who=Jeff Waugh

 quote who=Steve George
 
  a.  They aren't that well-read other than if the person says something
  really outstanding.  People like celebrity and controversy.
 
 It's really important to mix up the questions - have some standard ones,
 but always think about the person on the other end, current events, and
 skewer them with tough questions. :-)

James Henstridge just reminded me of a couple of interviews I did a looong
time ago - they might be interesting as GJ 'flashback' interviews. :-) Or
perhaps something to refer to if we do fresh interviews from the same dudes!

  http://perkypants.org/projects/gnome-2.0-interviews/

- Jeff

-- 
FOSDEM 2006: Brussels, Belgiumhttp://www.fosdem.org/2006
 
   Science helps a lot, but people built perfectly good brick walls long
   before they knew why cement works. - Alan Cox
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-23 Thread Rajiv Vyas
On Wed, 2006-02-22 at 11:58 +, Steve George wrote:
 Hi,

 Sometimes the value is in being recognised; Miguel's been interviewed
 a hundred times, but the longest contributor to the bugsquad probably
 hasn't.
 


How about profiling someone who is involved in various projects and
focus the interview on GNOME, FOSS and where it's headed (depending on
his expertise), etc.

Rajiv









-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-23 Thread Sriram Ramkrishna
I think some lesser known guys would be wonderful.  These are my personal
favourites.  Your list may vary.

Danilo Segan  -- il8n stuff
Fernando Herrera -- bugzilla/gnome-love/general hacking
Elijah Newman-- release engineering
Carlos Garncho   -- gnome-vfs and others
Christian Newmair -- gnome-vfs and others
Davyd Mandeley  -- applets
Federico Mena -Quintero -- performance/gtk+/gnome-vfs/printing
Lucas Rocha  -- general hacking -- bugzilla
Vincent Untz -- release engineering,bugzilla, and others.

These people are doing the day to day type of stuff like bugzilla,
gnome-love whatever.  These people are unsung heroes of the
revolution. :-)

sri

ps sorry if I've embarassed those who are on the list that are on my list.

On Thu, Feb 23, 2006 at 10:33:46PM -0500, Rajiv Vyas wrote:
 On Wed, 2006-02-22 at 11:58 +, Steve George wrote:
  Hi,
 
  Sometimes the value is in being recognised; Miguel's been interviewed
  a hundred times, but the longest contributor to the bugsquad probably
  hasn't.
  
 
 
 How about profiling someone who is involved in various projects and
 focus the interview on GNOME, FOSS and where it's headed (depending on
 his expertise), etc.
 
 Rajiv
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 -- 
 marketing-list mailing list
 marketing-list@gnome.org
 http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list

-- 
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-23 Thread Quim Gil
Continuing embarassing people, sorry if these names were already sung...

Murray Cumming - The taoist non-leader
Olav Vitters - Dancing with Bugs
Andreas Nilsson - Visual identity  misc graphs
Germán Poó Caamaño - Behind many scenes
Owen Taylor - Post-chairing, he has a story
Guilherme de S. Pastore - Knows The GNOME Matrix
Ross Golder - The GNOME Matrix respects him
Simos Xenitellis - I bet has something different to explain

and well Shaun McCance - I'd like to see the interview where this
priviledged mind unveils all what he is thinking about GNOME but didn't
dare himself to explain.  B)

Not to forget, all the let's say leaders of regional GNOME associations
i.e. GNOME Hispano.

And someone should dig deep in Asia and Latin America to bring the names
of other unnamed heroes, difficult to remember by the average European
citizen.


En/na Sriram Ramkrishna ha escrit:
 I think some lesser known guys would be wonderful.  These are my personal
 favourites.  Your list may vary.
 
 Danilo Segan  -- il8n stuff
 Fernando Herrera -- bugzilla/gnome-love/general hacking
 Elijah Newman-- release engineering
 Carlos Garncho   -- gnome-vfs and others
 Christian Newmair -- gnome-vfs and others
 Davyd Mandeley  -- applets
 Federico Mena -Quintero -- performance/gtk+/gnome-vfs/printing
 Lucas Rocha  -- general hacking -- bugzilla
 Vincent Untz -- release engineering,bugzilla, and others.
 
 These people are doing the day to day type of stuff like bugzilla,
 gnome-love whatever.  These people are unsung heroes of the
 revolution. :-)

-- 
Quim Gil - http://desdeamericaconamor.org



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-22 Thread Steve George
Hi,

I did a couple of these back in the day when I doing the GNOME Weekly
summaries. One of the ideas was to extend interviews and put up a
gallery on the website so everyone would know the contributors.

Two things:

a. They aren't that well-read other than if the person says
something really outstanding. People like celebrity and
controversy. If it's Linus then everyone cares what {insert
personal item like favourite jam/movie/car} you like ... if don't have
a profile no-one cares. Readers did seem interested in computer
questions that they could learn from or identify personally with - like
how X got into Linux, experiences of GNOME, favourite applications,
favourite sites, gnome tips and anything about future of GNOME/app
etc. Controversy obviously gets interest.

b. Ask open questions, and you'll probably have to heavily edit
the answers - don't feel it has to be a transcript. Just have the
interviee check the final copy to ensure that it's captured what they'd
like to say. You can pick the most interesting answers from a
range of questions.

Sometimes the value is in being recognised; Miguel's been interviewed a
hundred times, but the longest contributor to the bugsquad probably
hasn't.

Regards,

SteveOn 2/6/06, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Way way better than mine.My next one was the The Knights that say GuhNOMEso glad you stopped me.sriOn Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 02:36:13PM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote: Hi, In a ultra-fast talk with Claus and Jimmy on IRC, we decided to call
 it Behind the Scenes: Contributor Name. Contribution goes here: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeJournal/BehindTheScenes
 p eace --lucasr 2006/2/6, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED]:  On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 09:47:17PM +1100, Hugh Buzacott wrote:
   Suggestion?   How about 'Meet a GNOME'. I'm not very enthused by the title.I keep thinking garden gnomes  and I'm not very interested in meeting those. :-)
   How about:   Meet a Knight of the GNOMEDesktop Revolution   It's silly enough to take notice.But I felt stupid killing your  suggestion and not coming up with one of my own.It's probably as
  good as yours.   sri  --  marketing-list mailing list  marketing-list@gnome.org  
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list  -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org 
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-listmarketing-list mailing listmarketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-22 Thread Jeff Waugh
quote who=Steve George

 a.  They aren't that well-read other than if the person says something
 really outstanding.  People like celebrity and controversy.

It's really important to mix up the questions - have some standard ones, but
always think about the person on the other end, current events, and skewer
them with tough questions. :-)

- Jeff

-- 
FOSDEM 2006: Brussels, Belgiumhttp://www.fosdem.org/2006
 
  Whoever wrote [the Twisted documentation] uses a vivid and interesting
 style of prose which triggers pleasure. - Francois Pinard
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-06 Thread Hugh Buzacott
Suggestion?How about 'Meet a GNOME'.Just my two cents.Thanks,Hugh Buzacott(I did it again and sent it to the wrong list)

2006/1/31, Simos Xenitellis [EMAIL PROTECTED]: O/H Lucas Rocha έγραψε:  Hi, 
  An initial basic set of questions (most of them from the KDE one):
   http://www.gnome.org/~lucasr/GJ.txt   Comments? Suggestion? Please send them 'now' because I need to send it
  to our first guest, Jeff. The deadline is tomorrow.:-)
  I like it. I have been looking into planet.gnome.org for inspiration for additional
 questions to ask. I could not find any. In the final profile it is good to put the hackergotchi, as it is a nice
 GNOME thing. Simos  --lucasr   2006/1/31, Sriram Ramkrishna 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:   Excellent!Go for it.
   sri   On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 09:59:54AM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote:   Hi Thilo,  
  Well, I think there are quite a lot interviews out there. I would  suggest if we want to make something different :-) that we interview  more users. A question of focus. Nonetheless we should take everything
  that is good. ;-) Not that I am not interested in interviews of  interesting people OSNews does a lot of them (  

http://osnews.com/article.php?kind=Interviewoffset=0rows=70 )   Well, my idea was to make interviews which informarly present the  GNOME contributors online. Not an interview to get *only* deep
  positionings about where GNOME project should go. IMHO, this is why  the KDE initiative is so nice, they interview the common  contributors with personal and project related questions.
   I had a fast chat with Jim on IRC and we agreed to begin this GJ  interview section with a well known GNOME person, like Jeff Waugh, to  get an initial attention from the readers.
   What do you all think?   p eace   --lucasr  --  marketing-list mailing list
  marketing-list@gnome.org  
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
   --  --marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
-- Thanks,Hugh Buzacott
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-06 Thread Lucas Rocha
Hi,

In a ultra-fast talk with Claus and Jimmy on IRC, we decided to call
it Behind the Scenes: Contributor Name.

Contribution goes here:
http://live.gnome.org/GnomeJournal/BehindTheScenes

p eace

--lucasr


2006/2/6, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 09:47:17PM +1100, Hugh Buzacott wrote:
  Suggestion?
  How about 'Meet a GNOME'.
 

 I'm not very enthused by the title.  I keep thinking garden gnomes
 and I'm not very interested in meeting those. :-)

 How about:

 Meet a Knight of the GNOME  Desktop Revolution

 It's silly enough to take notice.  But I felt stupid killing your
 suggestion and not coming up with one of my own.  It's probably as
 good as yours.

 sri
 --
 marketing-list mailing list
 marketing-list@gnome.org
 http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list

--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-06 Thread Sriram Ramkrishna
Way way better than mine.  My next one was the The Knights that say GuhNOME
so glad you stopped me. 

sri

On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 02:36:13PM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote:
 Hi,
 
 In a ultra-fast talk with Claus and Jimmy on IRC, we decided to call
 it Behind the Scenes: Contributor Name.
 
 Contribution goes here:
 http://live.gnome.org/GnomeJournal/BehindTheScenes
 
 p eace
 
 --lucasr
 
 
 2006/2/6, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
  On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 09:47:17PM +1100, Hugh Buzacott wrote:
   Suggestion?
   How about 'Meet a GNOME'.
  
 
  I'm not very enthused by the title.  I keep thinking garden gnomes
  and I'm not very interested in meeting those. :-)
 
  How about:
 
  Meet a Knight of the GNOME  Desktop Revolution
 
  It's silly enough to take notice.  But I felt stupid killing your
  suggestion and not coming up with one of my own.  It's probably as
  good as yours.
 
  sri
  --
  marketing-list mailing list
  marketing-list@gnome.org
  http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
 
 -- 
 marketing-list mailing list
 marketing-list@gnome.org
 http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list

-- 
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-02-02 Thread Lucas Rocha
One more thing: how do we call this? I had these ideas:

- Contributor Profile
- Developer Profile
- The People Behind GNOME (same as KDE)
- GNOMEr Profile
- Meet a GNOME Hacker
- Hacker Profile

Suggestion?

--lucasr

2006/1/31, Simos Xenitellis [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 O/H Lucas Rocha έγραψε:
  Hi,
 
  An initial basic set of questions (most of them from the KDE one):
 
  http://www.gnome.org/~lucasr/GJ.txt
 
  Comments? Suggestion? Please send them 'now' because I need to send it
  to our first guest, Jeff. The deadline is tomorrow.  :-)
 
 I like it.
 I have been looking into planet.gnome.org for inspiration for additional
 questions to ask. I could not find any.
 In the final profile it is good to put the hackergotchi, as it is a nice
 GNOME thing.

 Simos

  --lucasr
 
  2006/1/31, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 
  Excellent!  Go for it.
 
  sri
 
  On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 09:59:54AM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote:
 
  Hi Thilo,
 
 
  Well, I think there are quite a lot interviews out there. I would
  suggest if we want to make something different :-) that we interview
  more users. A question of focus. Nonetheless we should take everything
  that is good. ;-) Not that I am not interested in interviews of
  interesting people OSNews does a lot of them (
  http://osnews.com/article.php?kind=Interviewoffset=0rows=70 )
 
  Well, my idea was to make interviews which informarly present the
  GNOME contributors online. Not an interview to get *only* deep
  positionings about where GNOME project should go. IMHO, this is why
  the KDE initiative is so nice, they interview the common
  contributors with personal and project related questions.
 
  I had a fast chat with Jim on IRC and we agreed to begin this GJ
  interview section with a well known GNOME person, like Jeff Waugh, to
  get an initial attention from the readers.
 
  What do you all think?
 
  p eace
 
  --lucasr
  --
  marketing-list mailing list
  marketing-list@gnome.org
  http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
 
  --
 
 


-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-01-31 Thread Lucas Rocha
Hi Thilo,

 Well, I think there are quite a lot interviews out there. I would
 suggest if we want to make something different :-) that we interview
 more users. A question of focus. Nonetheless we should take everything
 that is good. ;-) Not that I am not interested in interviews of
 interesting people OSNews does a lot of them (
 http://osnews.com/article.php?kind=Interviewoffset=0rows=70 )

Well, my idea was to make interviews which informarly present the
GNOME contributors online. Not an interview to get *only* deep
positionings about where GNOME project should go. IMHO, this is why
the KDE initiative is so nice, they interview the common
contributors with personal and project related questions.

I had a fast chat with Jim on IRC and we agreed to begin this GJ
interview section with a well known GNOME person, like Jeff Waugh, to
get an initial attention from the readers.

What do you all think?

p eace

--lucasr
--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-01-31 Thread Sriram Ramkrishna
Excellent!  Go for it.

sri

On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 09:59:54AM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote:
 Hi Thilo,
 
  Well, I think there are quite a lot interviews out there. I would
  suggest if we want to make something different :-) that we interview
  more users. A question of focus. Nonetheless we should take everything
  that is good. ;-) Not that I am not interested in interviews of
  interesting people OSNews does a lot of them (
  http://osnews.com/article.php?kind=Interviewoffset=0rows=70 )
 
 Well, my idea was to make interviews which informarly present the
 GNOME contributors online. Not an interview to get *only* deep
 positionings about where GNOME project should go. IMHO, this is why
 the KDE initiative is so nice, they interview the common
 contributors with personal and project related questions.
 
 I had a fast chat with Jim on IRC and we agreed to begin this GJ
 interview section with a well known GNOME person, like Jeff Waugh, to
 get an initial attention from the readers.
 
 What do you all think?
 
 p eace
 
 --lucasr
 -- 
 marketing-list mailing list
 marketing-list@gnome.org
 http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list

-- 
-- 
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-01-31 Thread Lucas Rocha
Hi,

An initial basic set of questions (most of them from the KDE one):

http://www.gnome.org/~lucasr/GJ.txt

Comments? Suggestion? Please send them 'now' because I need to send it
to our first guest, Jeff. The deadline is tomorrow.  :-)

p az

--lucasr

2006/1/31, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Excellent!  Go for it.

 sri

 On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 09:59:54AM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote:
  Hi Thilo,
 
   Well, I think there are quite a lot interviews out there. I would
   suggest if we want to make something different :-) that we interview
   more users. A question of focus. Nonetheless we should take everything
   that is good. ;-) Not that I am not interested in interviews of
   interesting people OSNews does a lot of them (
   http://osnews.com/article.php?kind=Interviewoffset=0rows=70 )
 
  Well, my idea was to make interviews which informarly present the
  GNOME contributors online. Not an interview to get *only* deep
  positionings about where GNOME project should go. IMHO, this is why
  the KDE initiative is so nice, they interview the common
  contributors with personal and project related questions.
 
  I had a fast chat with Jim on IRC and we agreed to begin this GJ
  interview section with a well known GNOME person, like Jeff Waugh, to
  get an initial attention from the readers.
 
  What do you all think?
 
  p eace
 
  --lucasr
  --
  marketing-list mailing list
  marketing-list@gnome.org
  http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list

 --

--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-01-31 Thread Simos Xenitellis

O/H Lucas Rocha έγραψε:

Hi,

An initial basic set of questions (most of them from the KDE one):

http://www.gnome.org/~lucasr/GJ.txt

Comments? Suggestion? Please send them 'now' because I need to send it
to our first guest, Jeff. The deadline is tomorrow.  :-)
  

I like it.
I have been looking into planet.gnome.org for inspiration for additional 
questions to ask. I could not find any.
In the final profile it is good to put the hackergotchi, as it is a nice 
GNOME thing.


Simos


--lucasr

2006/1/31, Sriram Ramkrishna [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
  

Excellent!  Go for it.

sri

On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 09:59:54AM -0300, Lucas Rocha wrote:


Hi Thilo,

  

Well, I think there are quite a lot interviews out there. I would
suggest if we want to make something different :-) that we interview
more users. A question of focus. Nonetheless we should take everything
that is good. ;-) Not that I am not interested in interviews of
interesting people OSNews does a lot of them (
http://osnews.com/article.php?kind=Interviewoffset=0rows=70 )


Well, my idea was to make interviews which informarly present the
GNOME contributors online. Not an interview to get *only* deep
positionings about where GNOME project should go. IMHO, this is why
the KDE initiative is so nice, they interview the common
contributors with personal and project related questions.

I had a fast chat with Jim on IRC and we agreed to begin this GJ
interview section with a well known GNOME person, like Jeff Waugh, to
get an initial attention from the readers.

What do you all think?

p eace

--lucasr
--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
  

--




--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-01-30 Thread Lucas Rocha
Hi all,

I found this: http://www.kde.nl/people/

This is funny! There could be something similar in Gnome Journal. One
or two GNOME contributor interviews per release. Simple and nice
content for our awesome journal. :-)

p eace

--lucasr
--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list


Re: Simple Idea for Gnome Journal

2006-01-30 Thread Lucas Rocha
Hi, I forgot to say that I can take this task to me: creating an
interview draft and the people scheduling.

--lucasr


2006/1/30, Lucas Rocha [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Hi all,

 I found this: http://www.kde.nl/people/

 This is funny! There could be something similar in Gnome Journal. One
 or two GNOME contributor interviews per release. Simple and nice
 content for our awesome journal. :-)

 p eace

 --lucasr

--
marketing-list mailing list
marketing-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list