Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
Hi Luc,
Thanks for all the comments! Much appreciated.
Luc Pionchon wrote:
Hello,
I am looking at http://wptest.gnome.org/. There has been a huge work
done since last time I looked at it, wow! Here are a few quick
comments,
In the front page,
For more GNOME news:
I would not point at planet.go in first place, especially for people
discovering GNOME it might be confusing. I see planet.go more as the
voice of the community than a news feed for everybody. Maybe we
should point at twitter feed or the whole archive of the main page
news, or?
Agreed. I'd prefer to have the social media links there.
On the bottom links,
The GNOME project
I would rename teams to The GNOME Community the same way as The
GNOME Foundation. It would include also the people's map, traditional
meetings (confs, hackfest), the https://live.gnome.org/CodeOfConduct,
link to planet.go etc. So it is more *people* oriented than just a
team list.
It could be nice to have a community page. We certainly need a place for
the worldwide map. I'd quite like to leave the teams page separate,
though. GNOME is a hard project to navigate, and I was hoping that a
clearly labeled guide to the various working groups in the project would
help newcomers to find their way around.
Products
I would rename Applications to GNOME Applications
I figured it would be obvious that the apps are GNOME apps... maybe this
point could do with reiteration though.
Products / GNOME is free software
I would add a link to a page GNOME is free software. The page would
explain what is free software, link to GPL, LGPL and source code.
The About page already asserts GNOME's Free Software values. Do we need
a separate page for this? We already link to the GNU site. That does a
good job of explaining what Free Software is.
Resources
Wikis are used for so many things, I would rename wiki to Live
documentation (wiki)
But it's not just documentation...
I would rename Code hosting to [Browse ]GNOME source code
Yeah, 'Code hosting' isn't good. 'Development Code', perhaps? ('GNOME
Source Code' could be tarballs.)
I would not link to jhbuild, this is pretty hot for a high level
entry.
I kinda like it that the footer links to the key development resources
(and JhBuild is pretty key). The site isn't just for users; it's for
developers too. I understand the concern about making it too development
focused, though. Anybody else got a view on this?
Resources / User support
It think there should be a top level entry, in first place, for users
only: User support. I am a user, I am lost on jhbuild page, where
should I go? Documentation, forums, ml, irc, bug reports, etc. The
GNOME support portal [1], and the GNOME support Forums [2] are doing a
pretty good job here too.
[1] http://gnomesupport.org/
[2] http://gnomesupport.org/forums/
I am not sure who is behind and what is the relation between gnome and
gnomesupport though i think they should work hand in hand (or foot in
foot?)
I don't think GNOME is in the position to offer high-quality support
yet, and I don't want to users' hopes up. Maybe in the future...?
There's some advice about this on the contact page, the first piece of
which is 'go to your distro first'.
News
overall I feel it is missing a place for general news on gnome.
You're right - there are gaps in our news coverage (which isn't to say
that there aren't *some* good sources of GNOME news).
Another source for news is footnotes (http://gnomedesktop.org/) which
used to do a pretty good job, though seems a bit down recently. Again,
foot in foot work would be great!
Footnotes doesn't have the right level of quality, imo. Plus it seems a
bit too independent of the GNOME project.
I would put identi.ca and twitter on the same line, as the content is
identi.cal: GNOME tweets at identi.ca or twitter
Nice idea. That would be a bit long though, wouldn't it?
On the language selection:
It is pretty neat :) though I feel it non obvious. map = language? is
click-able? I found it by chance. Isn't it all the opposite of GNOME
design philosophy? An arrow down would help. Or why not just a simple
permanent language list?
Good catch. I think Andreas is working on this. :)
Another idea: why not keep this underground for developer resource
links? And use the grassy middle ground for users, partners and press?
(the separation line could be more like grass/soil with little stones
and roots)
I'm not sure I want to separate user stuff and developer stuff that
much. The wiki is applicable to both, as are the mailing lists, IRC and
Bugzilla.
GNOME 3.0 Desktop http://wptest.gnome.org/desktop/
I would simplify the first sentence as Get things done with ease,
comfort and control
I've been wondering about that too. I'd wanted to keep the word design
in there because good design seems to be something that many users look
for. Maybe it would be better being shorter though...
Paragraphs in general
would be much easier
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
Hi, Can we all meet at 16h (UTC) today for a meeting to draw plan for the deployment? Olav, maybe Christer could join to help us too? What do you think? --lucasr 2011/4/3 Olav Vitters o...@vitters.nl: On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 12:51:28AM +0100, Andreas Nilsson wrote: http://wptest.gnome.org/ is design-wise in a pretty good shape. I've created a page on live.gnome.org to describe the things which needs to be figured out: https://live.gnome.org/MigrateWwwGnomeOrg It is really incomplete, but at least a start. It needs to be expanded and then converted into a step-by-step plan of things to do when a switch is made. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
In the #webhackers channel, of course :-) --lucasr 2011/4/5 Lucas Rocha luc...@gnome.org: Hi, Can we all meet at 16h (UTC) today for a meeting to draw plan for the deployment? Olav, maybe Christer could join to help us too? What do you think? --lucasr 2011/4/3 Olav Vitters o...@vitters.nl: On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 12:51:28AM +0100, Andreas Nilsson wrote: http://wptest.gnome.org/ is design-wise in a pretty good shape. I've created a page on live.gnome.org to describe the things which needs to be figured out: https://live.gnome.org/MigrateWwwGnomeOrg It is really incomplete, but at least a start. It needs to be expanded and then converted into a step-by-step plan of things to do when a switch is made. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Tue, Apr 05, 2011 at 01:37:37AM -0300, Vinicius Depizzol wrote: On Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 14:37, Olav Vitters o...@vitters.nl wrote: I've created a page on live.gnome.org to describe the things which needs to be figured out: https://live.gnome.org/MigrateWwwGnomeOrg Thanks for this, Olav! I filled the list with some more things. The two main points I can see are: (the others are just about copying files and creating redirect links afaik) My biggest one is Incomplete Todo list -- it is incomplete. Also, putting random things in Wordpress might not be the right solution. Let's discuss at the meeting. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Tue, Apr 05, 2011 at 10:40:01AM +0100, Lucas Rocha wrote: Can we all meet at 16h (UTC) today for a meeting to draw plan for the deployment? Olav, maybe Christer could join to help us too? What do you think? Ok. Note: I have almost 0 wordpress experience. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Tue, Apr 05, 2011 at 09:38:57AM +0100, Allan Day wrote: Resources / User support It think there should be a top level entry, in first place, for users only: User support. I am a user, I am lost on jhbuild page, where should I go? Documentation, forums, ml, irc, bug reports, etc. The GNOME support portal [1], and the GNOME support Forums [2] are doing a pretty good job here too. [1] http://gnomesupport.org/ [2] http://gnomesupport.org/forums/ I am not sure who is behind and what is the relation between gnome and gnomesupport though i think they should work hand in hand (or foot in foot?) I don't think GNOME is in the position to offer high-quality support yet, and I don't want to users' hopes up. Maybe in the future...? There's some advice about this on the contact page, the first piece of which is 'go to your distro first'. So just say that: 1) go to your distro support page 2) gnomesupport.org exists, but we don't have the resources and would appreciate anyone who could help answer existing questions (call them the gnome support group or something) IMO developers should not visit forums. Too much whining/trolling, negativity and waste of resources (generally same question is answered loads of times). Instead: gnome support group -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 14:37, Olav Vitters o...@vitters.nl wrote: I've created a page on live.gnome.org to describe the things which needs to be figured out: https://live.gnome.org/MigrateWwwGnomeOrg Thanks for this, Olav! I filled the list with some more things. The two main points I can see are: (the others are just about copying files and creating redirect links afaik) - Split of projects.gnome.org and people.gnome.org from gnomeweb-wml ^ Can this be done before the switch? - Migrate Friends of GNOME (and ruler) to gnomeweb-wp repo FoG have the only pieces that should stay together with the new website that still uses WML. Pages should go be place back in HTML -- am I right? Who can we contact to cover this and the other things? Thanks! -- Vinicius Depizzol vdepiz...@gmail.com http://vinicius.depizzol.com.br -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 11:34:50PM -0300, Vinicius Depizzol wrote: | $cmd = /usr/bin/xml2po -m xhtml -p . PO_DIR . $po_file -o $translated_xml_file . XML_DIR . gnomesite.xml; that is also *very* bad. Don't execute via shell! I fully agree this is pretty ugly. Do you have any suggestion regarding this (a way to execute xml2po via php without executing it with shell)? Thank you! This seems the nicest way: http://nl3.php.net/manual/en/function.pcntl-exec.php Also noticed the following: http://nl3.php.net/manual/en/function.escapeshellcmd.php http://nl3.php.net/manual/en/function.escapeshellarg.php but IMO that is a bad solution. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 12:51:28AM +0100, Andreas Nilsson wrote: http://wptest.gnome.org/ is design-wise in a pretty good shape. I've created a page on live.gnome.org to describe the things which needs to be figured out: https://live.gnome.org/MigrateWwwGnomeOrg It is really incomplete, but at least a start. It needs to be expanded and then converted into a step-by-step plan of things to do when a switch is made. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
Vinicius Depizzol wrote: Hey Allan and Andreas! I'll be working the most I can to help on that during all the following days. I'll give a pause in the localization plugin by now and focus in the design of the pages (we can't have translated content in time anyway). Great news. By the way, I got a question regarding this structure. Do we want to keep the news area[1] right now? Let's keep it, and add a 'More News' button to the bottom of the news section on the home page. Ooo, also: can we have the snazzy Identica/Twitter/Facebook links on the home page too? PS: I just changed the way WordPress handles the footer menu. Now there is only one footer tab, instead of footer-N for each column. To make a different column, just adjust the tree. Code is committed, but if it is not correctly displayed in the website, it needs to wait to be updated in the server. Got it. Would it be possible to make the footer section headers not be links? Best, Allan -- Blog: https://afaikblog.wordpress.com/ IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 04:49:19PM +0100, Lucas Rocha wrote: If the current css is the only thing that causes problems on other sites, maybe we could just keep it inside our Wordpress instance (using same path) while we figure out a long-term plan after the release? It wasn't the only thing I raised... I'm not saying no, just saying: please make a migration plan. E.g. having wptest.gnome.org is nice, but it is not on the final server. I have 0 experience with Wordpress, so not sure how much I can do. We also have blogs.go with is an old Wordpress. I'd like both to be served by the same thing.. puppetized, etc. All these things is just off the top of my head; it is not complete, for that we need to document what the implications are. -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 02:39:46PM +0200, Olav Vitters wrote: Did you talk to someone from gnome-sysadmin or arrange it'll actually happen? Looking at: http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnomeweb-wp/tree/wp-content/plugins/wppo/wppo.php | $wppo_cache[$p-ID] = $wpdb-get_row (SELECT * FROM . $wpdb-prefix . wppo WHERE post_id = ' . $p-ID . ' AND (lang = ' . $lang . ' OR lang = ' . $fallback_lang . '), ARRAY_A); That is bad. Please do proper escaping. It doesn't matter if the $lang and so on is restricted to well known values; it *must* be escaped! Further, the SQL returns 2 rows, no? Dealt with (the PHP is a bit difficult to read)? | $cmd = /usr/bin/xml2po -m xhtml -p . PO_DIR . $po_file -o $translated_xml_file . XML_DIR . gnomesite.xml; that is also *very* bad. Don't execute via shell! Similarly: | mkdir (WPPO_DIR, 0777); | mkdir (PO_DIR, 0777); | mkdir (POT_DIR, 0777); | mkdir (XML_DIR, 0777); Can't this be 755? -- Regards, Olav -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 15:35, Olav Vitters o...@vitters.nl wrote: Looking at: http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnomeweb-wp/tree/wp-content/plugins/wppo/wppo.php | $wppo_cache[$p-ID] = $wpdb-get_row (SELECT * FROM . $wpdb-prefix . wppo WHERE post_id = ' . $p-ID . ' AND (lang = ' . $lang . ' OR lang = ' . $fallback_lang . '), ARRAY_A); That is bad. Please do proper escaping. It doesn't matter if the $lang and so on is restricted to well known values; it *must* be escaped! Hey Olav! The localization plugin won't be used the first days after GNOME 3.0 release. This is clearly something that must fixed before using it. | $cmd = /usr/bin/xml2po -m xhtml -p . PO_DIR . $po_file -o $translated_xml_file . XML_DIR . gnomesite.xml; that is also *very* bad. Don't execute via shell! I fully agree this is pretty ugly. Do you have any suggestion regarding this (a way to execute xml2po via php without executing it with shell)? Thank you! Similarly: | mkdir (WPPO_DIR, 0777); | mkdir (PO_DIR, 0777); | mkdir (POT_DIR, 0777); | mkdir (XML_DIR, 0777); Can't this be 755? Changed and commited. Thank you! -- Vinicius Depizzol vdepiz...@gmail.com http://vinicius.depizzol.com.br -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
Hey Allan and Andreas! I'll be working the most I can to help on that during all the following days. I'll give a pause in the localization plugin by now and focus in the design of the pages (we can't have translated content in time anyway). By the way, I got a question regarding this structure. Do we want to keep the news area[1] right now? PS: I just changed the way WordPress handles the footer menu. Now there is only one footer tab, instead of footer-N for each column. To make a different column, just adjust the tree. Code is committed, but if it is not correctly displayed in the website, it needs to wait to be updated in the server. Good night from 04:33 in the morning! :) [1] http://wptest.gnome.org/news/2010/10/desktop-summit-2011-to-be-held-in-berlin-germany/ On Tue, Mar 29, 2011 at 02:57, Allan Day allanp...@gmail.com wrote: I've redrafted quite a few of the pages. I'd appreciate any feedback people might have. Me and Andreas have been working on the site at the Bangalore hackfest, and have been discussing the content that should go on the desktop and get involved pages. We've come up with a new structure for the footer, which indicates the content that we'll be aiming to have on the site when it relaunches: The GNOME Project - About Get involved Team Workspaces The GNOME Foundation Support GNOME Contact Resources - Wiki IRC Bug tracker JhBuild Code hosting Documentation Mailing lists News Planet GNOME GNOME News GNOME Journal Latest release We'll be cracking on with this over the next few days, so please chip in with ideas and comments. Allan -- Blog: https://afaikblog.wordpress.com/ IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list -- Vinicius Depizzol vdepiz...@gmail.com http://vinicius.depizzol.com.br -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
Re: The last long steps of the gnome.org website
On Wed, 2011-03-09 at 00:51 +0100, Andreas Nilsson wrote: I won't go about with some kind of inpirational blah-blah-blah about how the last steps of climbing a mountain, when you are closest to the top are the hardest, because I never did that. I saw some dude on TV saying that though. Anyway. http://wptest.gnome.org/ is design-wise in a pretty good shape. What's needed right now is taking it the last steps and making it a great website for our great project. For this to happen we need to sharpen the focus of it, make sure the texts and images are good and that everything works as expected when we launch GNOME 3. There are some darlings to be killed, some very dear ones. But this is needed in order to get the most fundamental parts in place. The basic navigation would be: home | about | desktop | applications | developer technologies Home - (very) Brief introduction, latest news and all that. About - Our community, history, organization etc. Desktop - Present shell (pretty much lifting info from http://www.gnome3.org/), Control Center, etc. Applications - The really cool applications we want to highlight. You know, Banshee, Deja-dup, Gedit and those guys from the GNOME Apps module [1] Developer tech - Languages, GTK+, Clutter, Gstreamer, Telepathy and all those guys. I expect us to figure out the exact subpages along the way, but if these guys are the basis and I want to start in that end. Allan have said he would help with the content, myself will be doing some design stuff and Vdepizzol will be taking care of the translation stuff the following weeks leading up to the GNOME 3 Hackfest in Bangalore. I hope we'll be done with most of the basics by then and are as close to deployment as possible. Final release would be together with GNOME 3 on April 6th. Me and Allan also created a Etherpad document here: http://etherpad.tugraz.at/x593dDuQ2C 1. http://git.gnome.org/browse/jhbuild/plain/modulesets/gnome-apps-3.0.modules - Andreas I've redrafted quite a few of the pages. I'd appreciate any feedback people might have. Me and Andreas have been working on the site at the Bangalore hackfest, and have been discussing the content that should go on the desktop and get involved pages. We've come up with a new structure for the footer, which indicates the content that we'll be aiming to have on the site when it relaunches: The GNOME Project - About Get involved Team Workspaces The GNOME Foundation Support GNOME Contact Resources - Wiki IRC Bug tracker JhBuild Code hosting Documentation Mailing lists News Planet GNOME GNOME News GNOME Journal Latest release We'll be cracking on with this over the next few days, so please chip in with ideas and comments. Allan -- Blog: https://afaikblog.wordpress.com/ IRC: aday on irc.gnome.org -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/marketing-list
