Re: [Marxism] Readers of Marx and Engels Decry Publisher’s Assertion of Copyright - Research - The Chronicle of Higher Education
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Isn't there also a major project to do an actually complete edition in German? That could make the L&W translation of the shorter collected works outdated in any event. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] "Marxists", Marx and copyright (was: • Lawrence & Wishart: independent radical publishers)
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Exactly so, Lüko. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] L&W: a mercenary London publisher empowering imperialist privilege
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == wtf? I didn't dismiss anything cavalierly. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Pacification of the American Working Class: A Time Series Analysis | George S. Rigakos - Academia.edu
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Was the American working class not pacified before this point? The last decade has certainly been marked by a qualitative implosion. This state has lost over 1/3 of its union members and the AFL-CIO is patting itself on the back because things aren't worse than they are. And everything is about electing politicians, none of whom are even making anything like the pro-labor rhetoric of earlier days. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] *Re: * Lawrence & Wishart: independent radical publishers,
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Libraries are a very limited market when it comes to things people actually use and need . . . like books. Electronic subscriptions that never really work well and about which nobody knows much are trendy and give the appearance of being cutting edge. And, yes, insofar as we are talking subscriptions, they do just give and give. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Bohemians
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Good news. I'm told it used my book for a lot of the early material. I wish I could be there. And I really wish they'd have been able to hold it at Pfaff's. :-) Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] *Re: * Lawrence & Wishart: independent radical publishers,
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == >From what they're saying L&W sees this as a significant amount of money, but I'm sure that, from a broader perspective, David's right and the amount represents mere crumbs. To clarify how these things seem to work . . . various of the spiffy new entrepreneural education projects bundle digitized sources and sell university libraries subscriptions to the bundles. As with any such operation, the universities pay the top dollar to ProQuest, Haithi Trust, etc. and a group like L&W will get a few crumbs. If you're a scholar recruited to such a project, you get even less. The actual value of making works available this way is debatable. It certainly provides a somewhat narrow access to a much wider variety of sources, and we all like the convenience of having the material online. However, if readers generally are looking for something at all lengthy, complicated or demanding, they almost always want to download it. My students almost invariably print what they download. So much for the paperless academy. I don't see this changing. What of the Collected Works that doesn't fall into this category are correspondence and short pieces, mostly of interests to specialists. I suspect that this will be most of what will be lost to the MIA. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The importance of independent electoral politics
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Victory around this issue has had a great impact on other currents which have been "just going through the motion." Sawant's victory has played its role in radicalizing the relatively lackluster Green organization here. The Ohio party has taken up the $15/hr slogan (some candidates saying it should be $21), all of which rather clearly demonstrates what that paltry Democratic response (maybe $9-11 phased in over two years) is all about.. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] •Re: • Lawrence & Wishart: independent radical publishers
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I am entirely opposed to the L&W resort to the law and to their claims to exclusive control over the output of Marx and Engels--as I am to Pathfinder's claims over the writings of Trotsky. That said, the temptation they faced on this has to be very strong. Opening these to library subscriptions will provide a whopping amount of money and an ongoing source of income. It's easy to see how institutional thinkers could go for this. I raise this point because periodically the idea that institutional interest in radicalism generally and Marxism in particular is a sign that "our idea are getting a hearing." Rather, I'd suggest that institutions like universities exist to establish a kind of hegemony over such discussions and define them into rather harmless dead ends. This current problem simply represents another aspect of this. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Announcement: Marxists Internet Archive forced to remove some works of Marx & Engels
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Surely, with everything posted on the internet, including pirated versions of newly released movies, there should be someplace to post this material that would not be subject to legal action. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] What does state ownership have to do with socialism? | Louis Proyect: The Unrepentant Marxist
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == That is the essence of the question--who owns the state? If the workers rule, they can adopt the forms that they're ready to collectively manage at the pace they're ready to do so. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Careers as Marxist intellectuals
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This is the same Max Horkheimer who took professorial wages and administrative salaries at various institutions from Frankfort University to Columbia and the School for Social Research, right? On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 8:17 PM, Louis Proyect wrote: > > "a revolutionary career does not lead to banquets and honorary titles, > interesting research and professorial wages. It leads to misery, disgrace, > ingratitude, prison and a voyage into the unknown, illuminated by only an > almost superhuman belief." > > --Max Horkheimer > > > Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu > Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/ > marxism/markalause%40gmail.com > Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] New book on Trotsky
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == http://www.niupress.niu.edu/niupress/scripts/Book/bookresults.asp?ID=685 Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Socialist Action secedes from internationalism, joins tankies
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == So, Ernie got the Trots thrown out of the Hapsburg Empire? Damn, that Jeff Mackler is sure sneaky. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] social roots of Black Death
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == No doubt, the upper crust that were out on their isolated estates may have stood a better chance of survival. However, the overwhelming majority of people in Europe were terribly poor, undernourished, overworked, etc.--especially where you had the kinds of concentrations that really spread the plague. Certainly, the more you are undernourished and overworked, the better your chances of ending in a plague pit, but most of the bones in the plague pit Mrs. Miggens finds while digging in her rose bed are not likely to be royals. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Daily Show's "The Weakest Lincoln"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/0lmlup/the-weakest-lincoln Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] progressive academics and bds
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Yes, I always wonders what qualifies people to be called "progressive' nowadays. Having once voted for Lyndon B . Johnson because of the imminent threat of fascism in America in 1964? Taking a firm stand against using the "'n' word" when discussing acceptable levels of poverty? ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] re St. Patrick's Day bullshit - The real Irish-American story not taught in schools
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Here's a representative sample of what Irish labor faced very regularly. This is exceptional only in that it had light thrown on it.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1UosxS9ahE Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Comments on Tony Benn's quotes from the Guardian
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == http://lawcha.org/wordpress/2014/03/16/tony-benns-quotes-guardian-worth-reflection/ Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Myth of Bernie Sanders » CounterPunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == What is "the political Left in the United States" that is being discussed in this piece? What happened to make people hallucinate such a unitary, well-disciplined coherent entity? In the interests of accuracy, perhaps they should consider chasing Bigfoot. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Bitcoin firm CEO jumped from 25-story building to her death | New York Post
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == It's been in the news quite a bit . . . at least NPR . . . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin . . but, yes, Louis, we are getting old. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Greatest Defeat Since .... >> CounterPunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Note the LAWCHA blog on this subject . . . http://lawcha.org/wordpress/2014/02/23/perspectives-uaw-defeat-chattanooga/ Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] new Social-Darwinist study needing reply
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I concur. These things are puked up every once in a while without convincing anyone of anything. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] A short piece on Lincoln's birthday
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == http://lawcha.org/wordpress/2014/02/15/remember-president-free-labor/ https://portside.org/2014-02-17/remember-president-free-labor Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] "For members only" ISO documents now available: when will they ever learn?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The assertion that the democratic centralism" self- imposed on voluntary participants should also apply to non-members is terribly revealing. A regroupment around such a concept will just make a slightly larger irrelevant group. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Onion: America's Finest Marxist News Source | New Republic
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == New Republic has become FOX News?? Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Campus Wage Gap
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == People interested in this issue should join the New Faculty Majority at http://www.newfacultymajority.info/equity/ Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] ON THE SOCIALIST GROUP SOLIDARITY: LET THE DEAD BURY THE DEAD
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The key issue on which Joaquin and I focused was the practical responses to Occupy, the best shot we had at reviving a movement in the U.S. in many years. All priorities of all serious organizations should have centered on that. I don't know Paul, but his misrepresentation of a political criticism into a personal charge that my feelings were hurt is not only a childish misrepresentation but one that illustrates wwhat happens to one's sense of proportion when you fetishize your lodge memberships. In general, if the main thing I'd have done with my life over that last 20-30 years was building an organization of 6-8 people into an organization of 6-8 people, I'd probably not be so cocky. I certainly never whispered a complaint that the local chapter never asked me to speak, and certainly made no complaints about the two trade union people, who I tried to talk into sticking around. But they found nothing there to hold them? To return to the political point, all members of any socialist organization should be thinking about what they're investing in an organization--any organization--if it can't master the most basic requirements necessary to sustaining something like Occupy . . . . Imho, a regional local of the old YSA--hell, a cluster of at-largers--would not have some of these mistakes. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Hegel : 'hopeless baggage'?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Yes, it's "an unfair reduction." As to the terms being introduced here, I prefer Marx's "historical materialism." Joseph Dietzgen coined the term "dialectical materialism" in 1887 and Engels first used "scientific socialism" a bit after that. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Hegel : 'hopeless baggage'?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Getting back to the original point about Positivism. The conceit of bourgeois social science was that they were going to develop sciences capable of managing society--as of scientific management of the workplace. So much inflation vs. so much employment, or efforts to define and manage housing supply, etc. This is what I was discussing when I talked about predictive social science. I should not have responded glibly about sunrises and sunsets, because "predictions" of a mass rebellion are not the same thing. Anyone paying attention to sunrises and sunsets can tell us down to the time and place where these will happen. A better analogy to mass rebellion might be something like a meteor or comet impact. But, wait, these actually can be predicted with considerably better certainty if we have the observations. Mass rebellions are not so predictable. Of course, the idea that people on a Marxism List would deny that rebellion can and will take place is absurd . . . I hope. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Hegel : 'hopeless baggage'?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == In many respects, though, much of what passes for Marxism--the blind faith in technological progress, for example--demonstrates the ongoing appeal of Comte to this day. You also see this in the assumption that Marxism can, in some serious alchemical way, be a predictive science. As Lenin once noted, the organizational success of Marxism in the late 19th century simply subsumed a lot of these older and contemporary alternatives to Marxism ., . . though they do bob up within the movement very regularly. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Critique of Solidarity in one piece
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I write to confirm Joaquín's experience as concisely as I can. I happily participated in the founding convention of Solidarity and was, with my wife, a member of the Chicago chapter before we moved from the city. After coming to Cincinnati, I participated in several efforts to launch a chapter here. I brought to this a record of activism going back to the SDS and including years in the YSA and the SWP, including the tendency wars of the 1970s, as well as a brief membership in the early ISO until it dropped almost the entire Chicago branch for reasons I never quite understood. Through all of these venues, I urged a regroupment of the socialist left. So participating in Solidarity came naturally enough, but I told everyone who'd listen to me from the beginning calling for a regroupment or talking about a regroupment could not set it apart form the rest of the left. It had to demonstrate the validity of a regroupment strategy in practice. However, it never did and never really seemed to be concerned that it never did. By the time we left Chicago, I had already come to think of the group as a social circle of dear old friends who had been to the wars together but had little practical desire to be more. Still, I hoped, events change things and might here. Probably for this reason, I became involved in trying to start a group here in Cincinnati. There were eight, maybe nine of us who made the first try, including a few local trade unionist, but it quickly devolved into a small circle of white people, mostly guys and all with hair in the gray to white range . . . and centered in the trendiest neighborhood near the campus. It seemed to replicate the worst aspects of Chicago, and I concluded that I thought the existence of such a group would be a positive discouragement to any new young people coming around. After I expressed this view, I was never contacted again by Solidarity for anything . . . ever, rather similar to Joaquín's entry into non-personhood. I did begin gravitating to the local ISO, which had its own problems, but, at least, was actually recruiting people who were young enough to have not grown gray with self-satisfaction. The ISO's success rose and fell over the years, but it owed some of its success to the fact that everything Solidarity did was by invitation only, and those young people invited generally responded predictably. Of course, the chapter got some young people, notably the two sons of a member. Throughout, I continued to describe myself as a sympathizer of Solidarity and of the ISO. I was invited to be on the national email list for Solidarity, accepted the invitation, and then had the invitation retracted. I am an experienced historian with a tenth book manuscript at the publishers right now. I could be of use in speaking or writing on behalf of either or both of these groups. Periodically, over the last 15 years, I've suggested this to them. I never even once received an answer from either of them. There is no explanation for this consistency other than the institutional belief in both organizations that those who are not members of the club aren't serious. It was simply an extension of what I had seen for years in the SWP--an approach that contributed so much to making the SWP what it now is. Still, I continued to express my sympathy for both organizations, neither of which would have anything to do with me officially. The responses to Occupy opened my eyes to the same kinds of shortcomings Joaquín pointed out. I don't know the details of what happened in the Bay Area or New York or Boston, but I suspect that what happened in Cincinnati was probably closer to that of the hundreds of communities in which Occupy surfaced. As soon as the large numbers of people were clearly involving themselves, a few union officials began showing up. Immediately, the inexperienced began saying that they had brought the working class into motion. It seemed obvious to me that they were there simply to hijack the movement in the interests of the Democrats and get it off the streets and inactive. I quietly approached people and suggested we should consult and begin formulating a strategy to keep the movement independent and active. In particular, I said that we needed to get Occupy out into the neighborhoods, particularly those of African American participants and those threatened by gentrification beyond the city center. Everybody tended to smile and nod but a disturbing number actually parroted what the inexperienced people had been saying . . . that Occupy had drawn the working class into motion. Later, it transpired that Solidarity had formed a secret invitation-only "radical front" into which it drew the few members of the ISO around at the time. I was, of
Re: [Marxism] my novel
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Those of us in teaching might find it useful to pass on this information to others in the biz. I've circulated the notice in my union and suspect that it might contribute to some interesting discussions down the line. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] British education secretary Michael Gove blasts classic sitcom Blackadder for spreading 'left wing myths' on war
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The entire series is superb. It ranges from the most lowbrow humor to the most sublime. The last scene of the World War I series where they go over the top is just gut-wrenching. Let us hope that the official celebrations of this upcoming centennial of the Great War are marred by the unwashed mutinous masses. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] There Is No Academic “Profession” | A Post-Academic in NYC
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Understand that I've gotten my position after about twenty years as an academic galley slave, so I am entirely sympathetic to your position. And, certainly the tenured (and tenure-track) faculty have been complicit in creating the current situation. However, as with other structural changes in other industries, it reaches a point where it's too far along for the workers who had some power to be likely to do anything about it. Management gets used to its impositions and demands a little more, year after year. The next thing you know, the established faculty has helped make itself less and less important. Some ten years ago, I found myself in the real fight that touched on these things, and it took nothing but an administration-seeded rumor that the tenured faculty were going to be turned out to cause a panic from which lemmings could have learned much. I do suspect that none of this is likely to bother those with connections and the right jobs in the right places. :-) Solidarity! Mark L. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] There Is No Academic “Profession” | A Post-Academic in NYC
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Academe is now--as it always has been--a tiered hierarchy. It's shape and steepness has varied over time, but it's never been anything like an open, democratic and egalitarian system--save in the hallucinations of the right wing. Simply put, a "newly minted" PhD coming out of an elite university has priority in the job market over published scholar with years of teaching experience. When I was entering the job market, five or six departments filled well over half the available jobs. This arrangement, in part, the functional "profession"--the core of the people with good tenured jobs--protect its self-perception from the realities. Frankly, though, I don't think we'd be hearing much about these issues today if the situation hadn't gotten so bad that it's affected so many of the . However, an academic profession exists and will survive, even if most of the practitioners of a discipline aren't really full members. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Confronting the Stalinist Legacy
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'd like to know who'd view them as "Stalinist" rather than "sensible." ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Why celebrities love twitter and I hate it
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == . . . which was my point. That the people who wanted to dissolve Occupy used it as the exclusive vehicle for communications in building a movement . . . not a means for conveying news or making announcements. Just "we're having a rally tomorrow at noon.". And, as I suggested, this was the key decision, which--like any such decision--reflected a broad range of strategic and tactical assumptions and a convergence of the various forces that had combined to build (and then fritter away) a promising start on a movement. And I don't just mean anarchists and liberals but the more Trotly local forces as well . . . . Btw, communications were a lot faster in the Civil War than mounted couriers. They had a Signal Corps that used flags and lights to flash messages that would be relayed very quickly over rapid distances. And they strung telegraph behind them right up to the front . . . as was done in the conflicts of 1870 and 1914. Sometimes, these worked very well because when the people using them wanted to accomplish something and not just go through the motions, these permitted some extended exchanges of information and processing of that information from both ends of the line of communication. But I guess we'll see if Twitter's superseded the need for such things. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Why celebrities love twitter and I hate it
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Twitter was the singlemost immediate cause of death for Occupy Cincinnati. Nothing was ever "built" in the old sense. As fewer people began showing up for things, the architects of the movement's got everything was twittered and nothing existed outside of it. So, you'd get demos called on 24 hour notice. Still fewer. Just what the official labor movement and the Democrats wanted. And the grouplettes found it convenient because "opponents" or possible "opponents" weren't showing up. When I complained about this, I was told that I was some kind of Luddite because "the young people love twitter." I asked how many young people they were getting to these things . . . About as many as the number of people over 90. Twitter isn't just a really crappy means of non-communication. It's a perfect way of turning a potential movement into a corpse. It fits a faux "movement" interested in nothing but going through the motions. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] socialism of retreat
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Well, the list is open to any and all who want to be on it, so it's hard to hold it responsible for any views expressed here. My interest in this exchange has waned, as my eyes glaze over when the Marx quotes start flying. But I do have a last comment. I admit that I'm unfamiliar with the quality of foresight among the ruling class of most other nations, but the U.S. ruling class is constitutionally incapable of not doing things that do it severe damage . . . The notion that it COULD do something positively beneficial seems strange. The notion that it WOULD something positively beneficial seems stranger. The notion that it could do something positively beneficial that didn't put the rest of the world and the rest of American society in an even more decidedly disadvantageous position is more unbelievable than something you'd hear from Lourdes. :-) Bests of what's left of the season to all. ML. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Looming Danger of Abrupt Climate Change : reply to David Walters
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Marxism came out of a movement with a long history of seeing human development as part of the unfolding of the natural world, almost mystically so in the case of thinker such as Charles Fourier. This was not only foundational for Marxism in Europe, but the U.S. John A. Etzler's _The Paradise Within the Reach of All Men, Without Labor, by Powers of Nature and Machinery_ from the 1830s proposed a kind of industrialization that would fit into the natural world. There was a good essay on this in _Science & Society_ in 1986, which cites a body of literature on radical responses to industrialism. It was also an idea central to the various currents of land reform that became prominent here in the 1840s and beyond. One even sees glimpses of this anticapitalist environmentalism in George P. Marsh's _Man and Nature_, a foundational, if wordy, text of the movement. So, are there reasons to believe that an industrialization shaped by those with concerns other than immediate profit would not be so bad for the environment? The question kind of answers itself. Solidarity! Mark L. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] "Workers Internationalism before 1914"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == "Workers Internationalism before 1914" at the University of East Anglia, Norwich UK February 15-16, 2014. It marks the 150th anniversary of the foundation of the International Working Men's Association (1864), and the 125th of the Socialist International (1889) https://www.uea.ac.uk/history/news-and-events/workers-internationalism Attendance is free, but registration is required. To register, contact Francis King at internationalism1...@gmail.com. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] ISR on Haymarket
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == As a brief postscript, the exchange between the author and the reviewer is posted online http://blogs.bgsu.edu/trial/excerpt-2/isr-shouts-capitalist-tool/ As an aside, I am always amused how members of a socialist group, when they make their living in academe attack their fellow workers in the field as academic flunkeys in the pay of the capitalist class. Apparently, in their own minds, an employed academic affiliated with a group has levitated above the grubby little materialist realities that plague those of us who make our living the same way. :-) One wonders if that applies to other sections of the working class. That members who were auto workers, for example, would attack non-members as contributors to global warming in the employ of the capitalist class. Group psychology is a fearsome thing, particularly if your goal is an organization with the members in charge. It plays out all the more absurdly in the small groups of the socialist left in the U.S. Regrettably, as some of us pointed out years ago, this kind of dynamic is a factor in creating a kind of institutionally self-defined limit on just how large and broad such a group can be . . . and that addressing these things would be one of the wisest things the American movement could do. Solidarity, Mark L. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Haymarket
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I probably will write it at some point this coming year, though first claim are projects that have publishers. The point isn't that there was little or no evidence that any of the eight defendants actually threw the bomb. My recollection is that they were charged with a conspiracy to create the conditions that led to the bomb's being thrown. The law was one of many such absurdities in legal history. I personally think the radical lawyer who defended them, William P. Black would have done much better to challenge that directly, but he was hamstrung by the fact that he wanted to accommodate the conflicting strategies the accused individuals wanted to pursue. I have argued for the permeability of the line between anarchism and socialism (and other currents of nineteenth century radicalism) for many years. The IWPA's strategy essentially rediscovered Blanqui's old insurrectionist strategy--which got a new lease on life thanks to the vicious repression of the Paris Commune and, closer to home, of the 1877 general strike on the railroads here, coupled to the wave of blatant electoral fraud that shattered hopes for simply electing labor or socialist candidates to office. In this particularly case, of course, the IWPA came right out of the Socialist Labor Party. However, Bernette Haskell's organization on the west coast had no connection at all to the IWPA. The California organization called itself the International Workingmen's Association (using the name of the defunct "First International"), and contemporaries distinguished between them by calling the IWPA "the Black International" and Haskell's organization "the Red International. >From my perspective, the issue isn't guilt or innocence, but getting an accurate handle on what these currents represented and advocated. Nobody familiar with the nature of of the Chicago police at the time can doubt that elements of it would have no problem setting up movement leaders. But neither could such a highly politicalized, factionalized, and gang-ridden organization kept such a complicated scheme secret. There's as much evidence against the vicious invisible aliens from Alpha Centauri--that is none. On the other hand, you have the IWPA, which openly praised the political power of bombs, trained people in how to make and use them, and advocated their use in this particular setting. There were times when such things actually had positive results--consider old John Brown's armed raid on Harpers Ferry. The initiative in 1886 simply failed to detonate a mass rising against capitalism. But to deny who the Haymarket anarchists were in order to gentrify their image for contemporaries strikes me as the same as redefining Nat Turner as a civil rights activist or Gene Debs as a man who could write a cracking good labor law. Solidarity! Mark L. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] ISR on Haymarket
t revolution. Where there were insiders and outsiders. The insiders had the right idea or, at least, enjoyed the fraternal protection of the other insiders, while the outsiders were not to be trusted and to be treated as "opponents," if not enemies. Understanding how these kinds of pre-Marxist traditions came to be seen as something the movement needed (needs) to outgrow would be quite beneficial to us today. Just saying. Solidarity! Mark Lause Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] How Slavery Led to Modern Capitalism: Echoes - Bloomberg
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == And, of course, the elephant in the room in this discussion is the contribution of slaveholding to the dominant feature of American politics, the two-party system. It was no coincidence that the construction of the American party system coincided with the needs of the dominant interests to find a mode of apparent representation that would permit any vested interests at the top of the society to veto any discussion that threatened their asserted "right" to private ownership of the means of production--even human beings as long as they could maintain it. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Thoughts on Thanksgiving | Louis Proyect: The Unrepentant Marxist,
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == All holidays are certainly part and parcel of rationalizing a system of hierarchy and oppression. And we get far too few in the U,S. We should take what leisure we can where we can and share it with our friends and family and do as much as we can with it. This is ultimately our task, isn't it?--to reclaim the time of our lives and our world. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Professor predicts human time travel this century
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I saw Mallett on a reputable documentary. In it, he was discussing a very limited kind of time travel . . . for particles rather than people. And he even said that backward time travel for people was impossible. Maybe he's changed. Or, more likely, the journalist was getting confused. Personally, I think time travel is possible, but only with a police box and a very long scarf. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Lee Harvey Oswald was a Marxist!
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == About as honest as anything they say about the assassination., Fortunately, almost nobody trusts them on that subject any more. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] James C. Scott reviews ‘The World until Yesterday’ by Jared Diamond · LRB 21 November 2013
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == They absolutely never get it right, do they? If there's any room for their bizarre ideological assumptions to frame and shape the most important features of their arguments. If I never see another documentary about the Stone Age that doesn't end in furred actors assaulting each other in the primordial quest for Lebensraum, it'll be too soon. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Sawant Campaign Optimistic Of Eventual Victory!
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm trying to figure out what a member of the Seattle City Council would have to do with Syria anyway. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] How Teddy Roosevelt saved football
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm a bit surprised nobody's referred to George Carlin's insightful piece . . . . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-638Vd6Hteg Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Query I was asked to forward to Marxmail
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == My starting point would be the mutinies within the armies. For a short introduction to the issues, see the episode of the 1914-1918 documentary on YouTube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOiadmX1D5Y&list=PLEae1RaRheqjqml_5j6agMuuJ7MYY3Iu4 These detonated the revolts at home. To a surprising extent, the bibliographies at the end of the Wiki articles are remarkably good. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Army_Mutinies http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Étaples_Mutiny http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Percy_Toplis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiel_mutiny http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Artelt Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Talking Third Party Blues
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Contrasting a movement party to an electoral party seems to me to be contrasting one nonentity to another at this point. There was nothing in what I proposed that precluded either or both or something else altogether. I am continually astonished at the reluctance to do what we all know should be done. The longest march starts with the first step. And we can complain about how the first step isn't good enough all our lives. Some here have essentially done that. Or we can take the first step. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Why is There Still No Socialist Movement In the US?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == It's rather strange to think about this in such binary terms--either there is a movement or there isn't. Sentiment for socialism is very broad and has been for years, particularly among the under 25s since the economic crisis. The issue is why the people in groups, networks, coveys, and covens haven't figured out what they need to do in order to jell such sentiment and help it find a way to express itself. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Armond White on "12 Years a Slave"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This is essentially the same story in any creative field, though. Movies, writing, music. The trailblazers and original people are almost always going to get ignored in favor of the people who find a way to make it into a commercial success. This is why the prattle about capitalism's alleged encouragement of originality is simply a cruel hoax. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Study says about 75% of cave art was done by women . . .
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == http://phys.org/news/2013-10-archeologist-paleolithic-cave-art-women.html Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] History News Network | History's Mad Hatters: The Strange Career of Tea Party Populism
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This has been pointed out before, so I won't repeat it all here, other than to note for the record . . . . . The historiography behind this incorporates a lot of regional Cold War two-party liberal misrepresentations of Populism, made when they were deeply engaged in misrepresenting, all other alternatives in the U.S. The term itself, though has probably become the most abused term in American history, particularly with the media lobotomizing itself. Populism as a distinct, coherent political movement in the 1890s was simply not composed of pig ignorant Bible-thumping bigots, regardless of what people on the East Coast were telling themselves or might be telling themselves now. Populism in the South and West represented a third party movement of much greater tolerance and radicalism than could have been found in either of the corporate capitalist parties. A big part of the Socialist movement came directly out of the Populists and some of its largest and most promising features came directly from the Populists. Conversely, the capitalist system acted to crush it as soon as it got the chance. But perhaps everything that didn't happen on the coasts all tends to look alike to the movers and shakers. :-) ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] 30 Statistics About Americans Under The Age Of 30 That Will Blow Your Mind
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == People in this age group are also much more hostile to capitalism. Everybody push away from the keyboard for one day and go out exploring the possibilities of Unemployed Unions among them. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] De Blasio: I am a "progressive activist fiscal conservative"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I take that to mean that he'll talk about his feelings as he tightens the belt on the workers (and the noose on their unions). ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Call for Papers: "Workers' Internationalism before 1914"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == - Original Message - From: "Dr. William A. PELZ" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2013 8:44 AM Subject: Call for papers for conference: "Workers' Internationalism before 1914" Call for papers for conference: "Workers' Internationalism before 1914" Date: 15-16 February 2014 Venue: School of History, University of East Anglia, Norwich, NR4 7TJ, UK 2014 is the 150th anniversary of the foundation of the International Working Men's Association in 1864. It is also the 125th anniversary of the foundation of the Socialist International in 1889, and the centenary of the outbreak of the war which precipitated the collapse of that International. To mark these anniversaries, UEA School of History, in conjunction with the journal Socialist History and the Institute of Working Class History (Chicago) are organising a conference on "Workers' internationalism before 1914". We are inviting proposals for papers on any aspect of the subject. Themes might include: . the historical experience of the internationals and their affiliated organisations . cross-border labour organisation . resistance to nationalist politics in multi-national states . transnational and international solidarity . migration and the transplantation of labour movement culture . international causes celèbres . political asylum and revolutionary exile . speaking tours of socialist leaders We are seeking papers of 5000 to 1 words on various experiences or aspects of working-class internationalism before 1914, to be presented at the seminar. Selected papers will be published in 2014 in a special issue of Socialist History devoted to the subject. Enquiries and proposals for papers should be submitted by 1 November 2013 to the organisers, Francis King, Matthias Neumann and Bill Pelz on internationalism1...@gmail.com. Attendance at the conference will be free of charge. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] North Star site.....
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == But what's the point of trying to have a discussion with people who just don't want to have that discussion? You have a site that selectively blocs Marxists and provides a platform for self-described "traditionalist Catholics." I wouldn't waste any more electrons on them. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Are US Blacks still most advanced or now suddenly backwards on "Hands Off Syria"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Interesting, Clay, though I'm sure we both remember how those pro-Vietnam War whites used to talk about their positions in terms of supporting "freedom," opposing tyranny, etc. My own experience discussing these things with pro-war African Americans is that, like pro-war whites, they aren't even necessarily pro-war as much as they feel obligated to make those kinds of noises. The real issue here is a well-trained reaction by an overworked and ever-distracted American public to political questions of all sorts. The tendency is to delegate to this or that leader the authority to make these decisions on your behalf and to trust them enough to support their decisions without looking too closely into them. After all, if you have a family to feed and support, and all sorts of bills, and the requirement of having to learn how to deal with a succession of unexpected technological twists and turns in your computer updates just to keep getting your email, unraveling the problems in Syria winds up way down on the list. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Another instance of political censorship on Facebook
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I just tried to share a funny video spoofing the Obama supporters: "Help Kickstart World War III" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-sdO6pwVHQ I couldn't share it because it said that someone had reported it as "abusive." I'm sharing it here because it's funny and rings true. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Moderator's note
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Trolls building their own bridges. But there is a real value of subbing under multiple email addresses. You can throw out all the posts you don't read several times. Or maybe you can read them all several times. It certainly allows you the luxury of a flaming theatrical screech of self-righteousness pretending to be in a livid rage over something someone did (or didn't actually) say. Then, there's always the chance that someone ask for a straw vote on something, and you'd get to vote multiple times. Most intriguing, though, subbing under various addresses would allows you to unsub noisily, storming out and slamming the door . . . and still be able to stick around to listen to all the gnashing of teeth. Better yet, you can storm out slamming the door in the multiple incarnations and see if you can get a movement going. And this leaves you the option of starting your own email list with as many members as you can get email addresses. I think there are several Facebook communities like this already. Still better, you can start your own online socialist group with as many members as you can get email addresses. Then elect yourself Lenin for a Day. The possibilities are really endless. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Symmetry in the universe: Physics says you shouldn’t exist. - Slate Magazine
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == At Fermilab .. . http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/robert-r-wilsons-broken-symmetry-sculpture-sits-at-the-news-photo/168962888 http://history.fnal.gov/photos/broken.jpg Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] FAIR asseses Ghouta attack reports: John Kerry vs. Mint Press
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I have come particularly close to unsubbing myself over the past month because of the pointlessness of trying to have a discussion of any sort with people who persist in tilting at strawmen of their own making. Are there just not enough people who actually urge the U.S. to bomb and poison people overseas that we have add to their numbers in our own minds? If American radicals spent more time arguing these points with people who actually held these positions and less time challenging people to a showdown in Main Street, their time would be better spent. And they would waste a lot less of my time, for which I would most sincerely be grateful. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Is College Worth It? - Book Review - Truthdig
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The most laughable thing about this--aside from stating the obvious--is their equation between college and "the stories we tell ourselves about ourselves—concerning hard work, opportunity, meritocracy, achievement and social mobility." . .. . As if these socially agreed upon lies aren't true, then people shouldn't go to college. If you come from a working class background--and don't define your reality based on what media tells you--nobody should need to present you with a long dissertation on how meritocracy is a myth and mobility is loaded concept. But the question you face is one of alternatives. If you come from money or have an entrepreneural drive to skin consumers---or if you plan on using your head for nothing but bashing against things--don't go to college. If you want a future doing something other than skinning consumers or living on your parents, your spouse or your trust fund, the answer might be more complicated. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The Significance of the Referral to Congress
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Shane is entirely correct on the U.S. Constitution, which is probably why it's not really taught any more. It's become a mantra, the meaningless appeal to a dusty antique stuffed and mounted over the mantel along with its amended Bill of Rights. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] n+1: Slave Capitalism
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This idea has been knocking around for some time and it has always made the most sense to me. Slavery was integrated into a labor process right alongside free labor and they were hardly working in different economic systems. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The New Nuclear Craze
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I don't think there's any more a basis for distinguishing between nuclear energy under capitalism and nuclear energy under a non-existent post-capitalist world. Not more than between fossil fuels burned in a capitalist nation and those burned in the old Soviet Union. Maybe the Trotskyist tradition should expand its vision to embrace the idea of a "polluted workers' state" in which the peoples' coal dust settles joyously in the lungs . . . or the glorious peoples' radiation enlightens the world. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] What Lenin thought a vanguard was
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The (pre-revolutionary) position of Lenin on what the social democratic parties should look like became untenable because that opportunistic wing of the party chose to make it untenable not because Lenin changed his perspective on this. Applying this to American conditions today, much of what's often put forward as an essentially unquestionable matter of principle simply is not. This includes the insistence that "class politics" requires a clear class label, though only a tiny portion of the population sees the significance attributed to this. Or that the campaign call itself "socialist," "communist," etc. Indeed, to a great extent, the imposition of these ritualistic demands on the real world have contributed their share to what can only be regarded as a tendency of most of the self-described Marxists in the U.S. to surrender the electoral field to the Democrats. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] How Laura Poitras Helped Snowden Spill His Secrets - NYTimes.com
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Actually the original point Louis made seems to be obviously true on the face of it. How many people actually read the sect press? And I have to say that I'm quite satisfied that this is the case in a country where we members of self-defined revolutionary vanguard groups that supported the president who bears the primary responsibility for the treatment of Bradley Manning and is going after Edward Snowden like Captain Queeg looking for his strawberries, You have organizations and people presuming to micromanage the conduct of revolutions overseas while they were generally quite content to have the Democrats and the AFL-CIO dissipate almost all of the Occupy movements . . . Certainly, the authorities realize the pointlessness of expending political capital to go after these revolutionary vanguards in the U.S., even as they find it worthwhile to go after David Miranda . . . . Solidarity! Mark L. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Censorship on Pham Binh's thenorthstar.info
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == My impulses are to agree with Joaquin's position on moderation, but I honestly find it impossible to equate a common norm on blogs and other sites with "the vices and bullshit of the 20th Century socialist movement that I think a scorched-earth/zero tolerance approach should be taken to combating all continuations/resurgences of those problems." Democracy and a viable movement will not be forged on the internet but in RL. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Censorship on Pham Binh's thenorthstar.info
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I've had the same experience. I don't think it's censorship. The broader the discussion, the better, at this point. . In contrast, some years back, after participating in numerous ill-fated efforts to get a chapter of Solidarity going in this city, I was invited to join the Solidarity email list. When I tried, I was told that it was members only. This struck me as utterly bizarre for an organization professing to favor regroupment and disinterested in repeating the kind of political discipline over its membership that has accomplished little in the past. I'm told by students interested in socialism that it only holds meetings by invitation only. Btw, I've since been on ISO lists without being a member. Certainly, any group is entitled to define who it wants to talk to and how it wants to do it. But I've never seen any indication that North Star is doing that. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Two Steps Back, One Step Forward
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm not sure what this means. The entire vocabulary has historically been used by very diverse groups of "progressives" with very mixed applications, some explicitly racist and anti-working class. Many of the leading self-described feminists, for example, protested that black men were allowed to vote while white women were not. And that immigrant men were polluting the sanctity of the polling place while properly educated native-born women were still denied the suffrage. My point here isn't intended to be pedantic but aims to clairfy the context in which these folks were discussing "feminism." What did this mean in terms of how they related to the politics of the women's movement of the 1970s, for example, is more important than any residual vocabulary issues. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Apologies regarding Muscular Christianity, Eugenics, War, Football, and Imperialism
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This was also actually discussed as a factor in the U.S. decision to declare war on Britain in 1812. Essentially, it was the first generaiton governing the country since that which had led the Revolution, and there was already a bit of an obsession over whether the sons of the fathers were up to snuff . . . probably because of the quantity of snuff they were using. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] A critique of Bob Wing’s “Rightwing Neo-Secession or a Third Reconstruction?” | Louis Proyect: The Unrepentant Marxist
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm glad you took the time and spent the effort to do this, Louis. I was looking at myself when I first saw it and tried, without success, to take up the cudgel over it. But it struck me as o internally circular and ahistorical that is seemed like a Herculean labor just to unravel all the flawed assumptions, half-truths, etc. It's a bit like those Ronald Reagan buttons from the 1980s that threw an image of Lincoln alongside Reagon for the sake of giving it some historical street cred . . . but not really going deeper than the paint . . . though volumes could be written correcting the misunderstandings of such comparisons. Reconstructions don't happen because of some top-down decision from within the structure of power. And you don't get pressure from the bottom up, unless you are ready to challenge the legitimacy of that power structure, In Bat-crap Crazy Upside-down Inside-out America, the people who want to keep doing what hasn't accomplished anything for decades call themselves "pragmatists," who call those who propose thinking about doing something innovative "idealogues." In reality, the only real "idealogue" in this debate, are those with a ready made formulaic solution to be applied to each and every election based on a fantasy of what happened 80 years ago. All to do what's deflated the labor movement, demobilized the black community, and left the antiwar forces befuddled and iosolated. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] McCarthyism at Harvard by Robert N. Bellah | The New Yor k Review of Books
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm following this discussion with real amusement, given that Harvard is hosting that upcoming 50th anniversary conference on _The Making of the English Working Class_, E.P. Thompson, and Marxism. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] George Zimmerman Juror Says He 'Got Away With Murder' - ABC News
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The only real issue is whether the black community has taken up the matter, not how it came to do so . . . . What's transpired has been pretty much grass roots and I don't expect anyone to start mobilizing the really large numbers on it, though the NAACP call for the Justice Department to take up the case is an excellent approach. However, the Obama factor is a real brake on any tendency on their part to go for really mass mobilizations . . . as it was for the labor movement in Wisconsin and Ohio. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Query: Who was A. Landy?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Thanks, Ethan. That actually explains some of the problems. Landy's piece on General Cluseret and the Paris Commune interprets his continued correspondece with old abolitionists like Charles Sumner as proof that Cluseret was actually functioning as a kind of American agent cleverly working to betray Paris to the Germans . . . and even "American domination of the world." The approach entirely ignored how mid-ninettenth century radical aspirations towards "the republic" blurred into ideas of "the social republic" and socialism of various stripes. I suspect he spoke/wrote too soon in discussing his "forthcoming" book on the Commune, and any serious readers found it just too batty. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Query: Who was A. Landy?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I just read a bizarre article by this writer in a PAST & PRESENT for 1951, allegedly from his forthcoming book _The United States and the Paris Commune_. I can't find any indication that such a book appeared, but, judging from the article, it would make for an interesting bit of fiction. Anybody know anything about who he was and any connections to the movement? Thanks. Mark L. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] George Zimmerman Juror Says He 'Got Away With Murder' - ABC News
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == The decisive consideration for me was when the NAACP jumped on the case and called for action by Obama's Justice Department. That had the potential of underscoring a real contradiction, and the potential of creating a real dyanamic. Perhaps because of it, the national organizaiton hasn't seemed to pursue it beyond a petition. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Racism and The North Star
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I don't get it. What kind of thread on the case? Something to decry racism? To plan strategy? And I certainly don't get the idea that the absence of a thread merits the accusation in the subject line. Is there something I don't know about the website? ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The North Star's Failure to Start a Thread on Trayvon Martin
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == On the actual subject of this particular piece, it seems to me that most of these discussions on party and party-building seem to me to be little more than the ritual encantation of algebraic formulas in which everybody is careful not to define for the unknowns. People seem to have some idea what they're talking about when they say "Old Left" or "New Left," but there is no established definition of these things that offers anything useful. Talk abourt regroupment rarely ventures beyond these pious platitudes either. It seems to me that we need to consider these problems from a perspective rooted in a rigorous materialism. What bothers me about the abstractions is that it seems to me that people just don't know how to build a demonstration any more or, really, what a demonstration is for. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] What passes for academic discourse . . . . an example from H-Net
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == - Original Message - From: "Donna Sinclair" To: Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 8:04 AM Subject: REPLY: REVIEW: Weyant on Nick Turse. Kill Anything That Moves: The Real American War in Vietnam > From: Trent Telenko > To: H-NET Military History Discussion List > Subject: REPLY: REVIEW: Weyant on Nick Turse. Kill Anything That Moves: The Real American War in Vietnam > Date: Sun, 21 July 2013 10:50:24 -0400 (EDT) > > > Since the subject of spitting on Vietnam vets and the denial of same > by some in academic community has come up, I'll throw in my two bits > in terms of a research opportunity based on my family history. > > My father was one of those vets who was spat upon. He is a 1962 > graduate of the United States Military Academy at West Point, served > two tours in Vietnam and one in Thailand and retired a Colonel in the > late 1980's. > > His spitting incident happened at the San Francisco International Airport. > > From what I understand of the Vietnam era military air charter system, > most military charted commercial airliners flew the San Francisco to > Hawaii route on their way too and from Vietnam. > > San Francisco International Airport developed a reputation among long > service soldiers like my father for such spitting incidents, as it was > both a "target rich environment" and near one of the centers of the > 1960's era counter-culture. > > Too date, I have seen no creditable academic study to look at Vietnam > era records of military charters and reported spitting incidents to > statistically compare incident locations, air movement of soldiers and > locations of counter-culture geographic strongholds. > > Statistical correlation between reported spitting incident locations > and air movements of soldiers would provide objective measures of the > reported social phenomena. > > Given that universities are publishing books like " Weyant on Nick > Turse. Kill Anything That Moves: The Real American War in Vietnam", I > don't expect any such study to be done soon, it ever. > > -- > Trent Telenko > Quality Assurance Specialist > Defense Contract Management Agency > > Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] 150th anniversary of the Battle of Honey Springs
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This battle in mid-July 1863 pit a little tri-racial Union Army against a Confederate force twice its size. This battle was the set piece for my book _Race and Radicalism in the Union Army_, which is, rather bizarrely, uncited at the end of the piece, which mentions a generally irrelevant article older than I am. http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/07/19/fighting-the-white-mans-war/?ref=opinion ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Federal charges against Zimmerman?
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == That's a terribly strange way for the Justice Department to do this. The Florida prosecutors didn't want to pursue the case and did only to look better. It now seems as though the Justice Department is doing the same thing, right? ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Petition to Nobel Prize Committee to give it to Bradley Manning
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == http://act.rootsaction.org/p/salsa/web/tellafriend/public/?tell_a_friend_KEY=9192 Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] More doubts about "Peak Oil"
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm on the road and don't have time to answer this fully. It seems to me that whether the term is useful (for what?) or not has little importance. The fact that there were no WMDs in Iraq had little use. The reality of global warming has had little use. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Whites and African-Americans in America by the numbers | Informed Comment
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'd suggest that if anyone is living in a situation where they're not finding themselves in a continual dialogue about race they probably don't know many black people. The problem is a civic culture in which discussions of race in America have become a substitute for doing something about it. And it hasn't helped that so many have decided to make assumptions about basic changes in the system. So, talk, yes . . . that's essential, particularly across that horrific color bar that still divides the society. But wouldn't it be refreshing to be up and DOING! Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Thoughts on a post-racial lynching | Louis Proyect: The Unrepentant Marxist
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == It surprised me, for all the reasons suggested. Perhaps I was forgetting that it was Florida. Maybe Obama can have Zimmerman by for a beer to have a heart-to-heart. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Zimmerman found not guilty
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == You could almost see this one coming, though. And yet, people sat politely and deferntially glued to their TV sets rather than being up and doing BEFORE it got to this point. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The End of the “Leaderless” Revolution » CounterPunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Surely as many tiny self-selected vanguard parties have been fully as successful at levitating the Pentagon as any vast crowds of counterculturalists chanting and munching brownies. :-) Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] [Pen-l] Blocking the scammers | Louis Proyect: The Unrepentant Marxist
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == A friend of mine told me that that when you order a trial bottle of that particular product, the fine print obliges you to pay for a year's worth or something. All these scams and frauds leave a clear trail across a well monitored cyberspace, but never seem to face any legal action. Not even Nigerian princes. The government is too busy tracking down people who are trying to learn Arabic online. This mirrors what happens in RL, of course. We had one of those advertising newspapers that they'd throw in your yard peddling crap you'd never want. One or another of our dogs would rip it up and I'd have to go clean it up every week. The had several phone numbers on the paper, none of which worked, a PO Box that was no longer being rented, and an address that was a vacant office space. The city absolutely refused to do anything about it. If I parked in front of the house too far from the curb, of course . . . . In capitalist America, businesses just don't seem to break the law. People who complain about them are skirting the edges of criminal activity, though . . . . :-) ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Bolivia, Nicaragua and Venezuela all offer Snowden asylum
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Yes, indeed. The Obama adminsitration is trying to make itself immune from criticism by the flag-lapel fetishists by having a pissing contest with every other govenrment on the planet. There's not much in it for any of the other governments to help them out of this bind. The hubirs of the US brought on these disclosures, which are causing genuine scanadals--not so much in the US with its rather domesticated news media--but abroad where the secrets of their own intelligence activities are beginning to unravel. It makes sense that they're not willing to put themselves out too much. Probalby, we're seeing another way in which the massive institutions crank out the lowest-common-denominator, flat-out dumbest psswoble solution. ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Bolivia, Nicaragua and Venezuela all offer Snowden asylum
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I think the best answer is that these various governments don't want to depart too much from the norm in finding a solution. Remember that while this leaves Snowden on the hook, it also leaves his psychotic Uncle dangling as well. Obama made a serious mistake in authorizing his underlings to lean on France and Portugal over that flight from Moscow. It seems to me that the longer this goes on, there will be more discrediting incidencents., ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] The ISO’s multiple personalities | Louis Proyect: The Unrepentant Marxist
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Any socialist organization in a capitalist civilization is going to experience symptoms of this. There is no special cure beyond the cure for the working class as a whole, but there's much a group can do to make matters worse. Our experience with the American SWP certainly informs this understanding. The longer their qualitative and quantitative development tends to stagnate, the more the group's natural tendency to rationalize that stagnation will exacerbate the problem. Members of the SWP thought at the time that it would help to get the organization to use a language and political rhetoric more open to the new radicalization and sounding less like a ritual incantation of the 1930s or 1917, which it did, but without really helping. Others thought the SWP needed to orient more to the working class, but when it did, it only seemed to make matters worse. And changing its program in terms of changing what a group says is equally cosmetic. The SWP defined itself as both "the" party and only "the nucleus" of a future party. Its leadership had its fingers on the switched that strobed these definitions as suited its immediate needs. In the end, an internal culture existed that harnessed the psychological needs of an understandably extremely alienated membership that defined themselves in terms of group identity that members felt obligated to reaffirm continually. Worse, those who broke from the SWP to escape its shortcomings have somehow never managed to break from from this dynamic. My point is that the problem isn't the ISO, though the scale of its organization makes the issues more obvious. And, based on our experience with the SWP, the solution is not going to be version of "the talking cure." ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Slavery's threat to early democracy - Ta-Nehisi Coates - The Atlantic
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I recently encountered an interesting piece by American spiritualist Benjamin N. Kinyon. In May 1864, he described elections in America as “sugar coating” to disguise the reality that most residents in the U.S. lived under a tyranny as bad as anywhere. Women, children and minors "are as powerless as the serfs of Russia," and if you add several million blacks and Indians, he estimated that six-sevenths of the country lacked even the most formal voice in its government. Like his cothinkers, Kinyon elsewhere pointed out that class considerations substantively muted that formal voice for most who did have it. Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Second revolution brings down Egypt's president
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == A coup is where a small group already exercising some limited authority moves to seize power. This can happen--as it seems to have in this case--to head off a mass movement before it can get to the point where it realizes the need to organize itself politically and make a bid for power itself. It may also be a passing phase, swept away by developments. My sense was that the army has always been the real power behind the successive adminsitrations, and that Morsi's great failure from their perspective was not being able to prevent the little dog from pulling aside the curtain . . . . ML Send list submissions to: Marxism@greenhouse.economics.utah.edu Set your options at: http://greenhouse.economics.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
