Re: [Marxism] Massive gain for True Finns in Finnish election

2011-04-20 Thread Joonas Laine

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Einde O'Callaghan:

 for providing extra information. However I still think
 that this means a lurch to the nationalist right even if
 the party as such can't be described as far right - the
 very fact that it's a racist party and has a fascist wing
 makes it very suspect to me.


Forgot to mention in the previous mail that I wouldn't call the TF far 
right wing fascist. Modern racists (as opposed to old skool race 
hierachy racists) would be more accurate in my opinion. Depends of 
course on your definition of fascism whether that is a good label as 
well, but personally I'm inclined to see fascism more in classical 
terms, i.e. hostility towards bourgeois democratic institutions because 
some sector of society (most often the working class) that is seen to be 
splitting the people and/or threatening the common good (most often 
the accumulation of capital) has gained too much influence through those 
institutions.


The TF right-wingers have no problem with bourgeois democracy, as in 
these election it has served their purpose far better than that of the 
left; the SDP got its worst result since the second world war (19,1%) 
and the Left Alliance vote fell almost a percentage point too (to 8,1%).


Whether the TF far righters can *develop* into fascism or not... well 
that's of course possible, but then again that's possible for *any* 
bourgeois party that accepts that in order to keep things going you have 
to make sure that capital accumulation can continue.


--
jjonas @ nic.fi



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Re: [Marxism] Massive gain for True Finns in Finnish election

2011-04-18 Thread Einde O'Callaghan

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On 18.04.2011 16:04, Joonas Laine wrote:

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The petty-bourgeois nationalist True Finns have gained a whopping 15
percentage points in national elections yesterday, up to 19% from just
4% in 2007.

Earlier I've seen the True Finns being characterised as far right, so I
feel like saying that even though their victory means nothing good for
immigrants and minorities and I have no reason at all to defend them,
in my opinion they cannot be characterised as far right in the sense
that for example Sweden's Sweden Democrats are far right; Sweden
Democrats have roots in neo-nazism, whereas the True Finns are the
descendant of a rural protest party, and they have had no such need for
any moderation as the Sweden Democrats have.


I was the one who characterised them as far right - I claim no 
particular expertise in Finnish politics and was relying on reports in 
the bourgeois media AND the characterisation of somebody I know who 
works in Brussels for the GUE/NGL group in the European Parliament. 
thanks for providing extra information. However I still think that this 
means a lurch to the nationalist right even if the party as such can't 
be described as far right - the very fact that it's a racist party and 
has a fascist wing makes it very suspect to me.


Einde O'Callaghan


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