MC betas
Hi Scott, if you read this: any chance to mirror the new betas somewhere, too ? As long as your ISP is doesn't support anonymous ftp ? I would love to check these new versions... (Maybe i am not alone... ;-) Regards Klaus Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Stray lines
Does anyone know how to get rid of stray lines which remain on screen after using a pulldown button? I'm getting a border where the pulldown's rectangular area of contents opened on mouseDown. I've only found this on Windows 98 (it was a Dell OptiPlex, GXA machine). Thanks, Ray Horsley ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Feature request: open stack visuals
Not only does this demonstrate window cloaking of sorts, but it can also do a simple magnify effect. A reset button is included but will have to be messed with to work correctly on Windows without recapturing the stack window (interesting that taking a capture on the Windows desktop reveals any hidden MC windows). The above technique was recently discussed a bit on the list. At a high level, faking a custom window is fairly easy to do, but it is not a very good workaround for 2 reasons: 1) If the user switches to another application and places yours in the background, any changes to foreground window positions will not be reflected in your false backdrop. 2) In OSX, all windows are drawn with a live dropshadow cast by the window's true dimensions, thus any fake masking is clearly visible. Still waiting anxiously for a custom window solution in MC 2.4... :-) As it's intended for use on Mac, Windows and OS X any solution that will not work on all three is out. With my neat new tool Metacard, all projects from here forward get coded once, specifically for cross platform compatibility, with no changes to the stacks later (except improvements, bug squishes, etc. :-) It's tough because there are still XCMD's I'd love to use, one specifically that queries Internet Config for the user name, or ones that get the specific machine id (I've followed that thread and tried out the final piece of code that was cross platform, but it produced a popup dialog window asking for the location of Apple System Profiler, as mine is not in the Apple folder. I figure if mine isn't, others aren't, and I'd rather avoid having someone else get that dialog and wanting to know what it's all about.) I'd love to use the resource fork still for sounds and graphics, it would be so much simpler! If I edit a graphic, just paste the new graphic where the old one was. But I want cross platform programs, to expand my user base so lots more people can register my programs, so some sacrifices to accommodate Microsnot are necessary. Speaking of graphics, it would be nice if Metacard recognized slots, so that you could have several small graphics together in an image, and just pull one from the appropriate slot as needed. So that makers of adventure games don't end up with 1000 icon sized graphics to import. Though the slots should be rectangular rather than true square, as that is the standard size for this ... So that when you say set the icon of btn x to slot 15 of image id 1234 you get just that one slot's image :-) -- --Shareware Games for the Mac-- http://www.gypsyware.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Stray lines
If it is a screen redraw issue, you could do: lock screen unlock screen and that will force a redraw. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ - Original Message - From: Ray Horsley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2002 11:27 AM Subject: Stray lines Does anyone know how to get rid of stray lines which remain on screen after using a pulldown button? I'm getting a border where the pulldown's rectangular area of contents opened on mouseDown. I've only found this on Windows 98 (it was a Dell OptiPlex, GXA machine). Thanks, Ray Horsley ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Script: missing '' after literal
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 01:24 AM, erik hansen wrote: why would the Script Editor return 0,0? could this be a bug? Maybe. Or the missing quotation mark isn't in a place that the parser can accurately recognize, so it can't get a value for the location. You may just have to scan through the script searching for quotes and making sure all pairs match. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Feature request: open stack visuals
Very cool stuff, Geoff! This is a great resource! Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ - Original Message - From: Geoff Canyon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2002 12:37 PM Subject: Re: Feature request: open stack visuals At 10:21 AM -0500 3/13/02, Shari wrote: It's tough because there are still XCMD's I'd love to use, one specifically that queries Internet Config for the user name, or ones that get the specific machine id (I've followed that thread and tried out the final piece of code that was cross platform, but it produced a popup dialog window asking for the location of Apple System Profiler, as mine is not in the Apple folder. I figure if mine isn't, others aren't, and I'd rather avoid having someone else get that dialog and wanting to know what it's all about.) I don't remember the original post very well, but if it was an AppleScript, the dialog is avoidable. Check out: http://www.AppleScriptSourcebook.com/tips/tellbyvariable.html and http://www.AppleScriptSourcebook.com/tips/launchbycreator.html If for any reason they're not available, check with me off-list -- I have the text. regards, Geoff ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Feature request: open stack visuals
Speaking of graphics, it would be nice if Metacard recognized slots, so that you could have several small graphics together in an image, and just pull one from the appropriate slot as needed. So that makers of adventure games don't end up with 1000 icon sized graphics to import. Though the slots should be rectangular rather than true square, as that is the standard size for this ... So that when you say set the icon of btn x to slot 15 of image id 1234 you get just that one slot's image :-) Interesting idea, Shari. The closest you can get to this is just by setting the fileName of images and managing the files in a directory system on your hard drive. I like this system a lot (mostly since it's the only one I'm familiar with, I'm too scared to import all those images and try to keep track of them with only my eyes!) , and it makes changing an image much easier. Though you can't simply paste in a graphic in ResEdit, you can simply track down the gif or jpeg image, open it up in graphicconverter, paste in your new graphic, save and you're done! Next thing I'm hoping for is a new property for images to complement fileName - alphaMaskFileName... mmm... imagine the funky effects you could produce with that! -- Karl Becker, KB Productions - http://www.karlbecker.com Featuring:New Tricks, Tiger's Eye Pub, and The Fishin' Hole ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Feature idea/request: move object along equation
I have an idea for improving the move command but I'm having a tricky time figuring out how the syntax, and even the concept itself, would work. I'd like to be able to use the move command to move objects in non-linear, time-variable ways. If, let's say, the current move command moves objects like a billiard ball that rolls straight across a table and stops after a particular time period, this new move command would be like a subway train starting from a dead stop, accelerating up to a constant speed, turning this way and that, changing its acceleration along the way (both + and - ) , and eventually stopping. I know I could use a repeat loop (or do a bunch of send...in messages) and manually set the location of the object each time to achieve an effect similar to this, but calculating all that can cause a serious performance penalty (especially on Mac OS X, where using the move command produces motion ten times more fluid than using a bunch of set the location of commands) . One way I had envisioned this working would be with a command like this: move object from a starting x-value to an ending x-value along some math function, in the form of (2x-3) or (x^3 - 2x^2 + 3/4x - 5) (in some separate time periods that would be differentiated by the x-values, like (in 2 seconds for 3x7) ) The last part would mean it would take the object 2 seconds to move from through the range of x-values of 3 to 7 in 2 seconds. The syntax needs cleaning, and I don't even know if this is feasible to implement, but it would be great if scripters could offload moving lots of objects even more onto the system than they currently can (not having to make their own scripts for moving things in non-linear lines) . I'd even be happy if someone could dream up a way to move things in linear lines but in different time periods (from x1,y1 to x2,y2 in 2 seconds, then from x2,y2 to x3,y3 in 8 seconds, etc...) . Apologies for the long message, but I think a feature like this would really be quite useful. Hopefully I've explained it clearly enough. I've had enough words to do so :-) -- Karl Becker, KB Productions - http://www.karlbecker.com Featuring:New Tricks, Tiger's Eye Pub, and The Fishin' Hole ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: metacard digest, Vol 1 #127 - 13 msgs
Scott Rossi wrote ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Stray lines
Ray Horsley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone know how to get rid of stray lines which remain on screen after using a pulldown button? I'm getting a border where the pulldown's rectangular area of contents opened on mouseDown. I've only found this on Windows 98 (it was a Dell OptiPlex, GXA machine). This is a screen driver bug. You'll most likely have to update the drivers to the latest version from the vendor. In some cases turning acceleration to its lowest level in the System and/or Display control panels will also work around the problem, but in some other cases (and Dells that shipped with Windows 98 are among the worst in this respect) the only reliable solution is to get a newer (and better) graphics card. Regards, Scott Thanks, Ray Horsley Scott Raney [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.metacard.com MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that... ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: mc 2.4.2 request
On Wed, 13 Mar 2002 Alex Shaw [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wouldn't it be nice if there was a simple function which returned the host ip address (whichever was current or a list of valid ones) without having to open a socket. What use would this be? You'd always get a list, and wouldn't know which one would be used until you actually opened a socket. Regards, Scott In respect to a particular app I'm developing.. just a simple p2p mac/pc file/msg transfer program. I can't have a server involved (yet), and the users know little about ftp etc but they do understand what a phone number is, so basically the IP address of their machine becomes their 'phone number'. Instead of providing each with a piece of paper with their IP address (not helpful because the users could be anywhere) I would like them to just run the app.. if connected to the internet use the IP for that (andu suggested a check for www.yahoo.com but who can guarantee yahoo be around a year from now) else connected via LAN adpater so display the associated address (in this particular case I know the users will have either a modem or 1 LAN adapter). Once they know their IP address, that can be shared with other users etc.. they can 'dial' connect with each other. Just easier from a user ( programming) perspective. Unfortunately I think this won't work. IP addresses change, in some cases with each time you open a connection. At the very least, with DHCP (which most large networks use), you can get a different address each time the machine reboots. The only way to do what you want is to have some sort of server that collects the IP addresses and distributes them to the other clients. And of course this means opening a connection to a server, at which point figuring out the local IP address is a no brainer because it comes in as a parameter with the socket messages you get from that server. Regards, Scott regards alex Scott Raney [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.metacard.com MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that... ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Feature idea/request: move object along equation
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 01:04 PM, Karl Becker wrote: I have an idea for improving the move command but I'm having a tricky time figuring out how the syntax, and even the concept itself, would work. I'd like to be able to use the move command to move objects in non-linear, time-variable ways. I for one am glad to see someone else in need of this feature. I had been trying to figure out some way to script this as well, but built-in control would be excellent. What you are asking for is the equivalent of ease in and ease out features of animation packages. Percentages are one way to specify where the acceleration or deceleration occur: ease out 20% would mean the moving object starts to slow down during the last 20% of the overall moved distance. So in theory, you could write syntax as: move grc ball from 10,10 to 100,100 easein 20 easeout 40 ...to accelerate the moved object to the moveSpeed during the first 20% of the moved distance, and decelerate during the last 40%. One could get even more complex defining how quickly the acceleration/deceleration takes place within the easein/easeout intervals, but even just the above percentage control with a fixed a/d rate would be very much appreciated. Can we get this?... Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director, Tactile Media [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.tactilemedia.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Mc betas
jihugzft On Wed, 13 Mar 2002 Klaus Major wrote: Hi Scott, if you read this: any chance to mirror the new betas somewhere, too ? As long as your ISP is doesn't support anonymous ftp ? I would love to check these new versions... (Maybe i am not alone... ;-) Regards Klaus Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] It is now a week that we don't have access to the Metacard ftp-site. This must be a very special company that is unable to provide free access to an ftp site. Hope this nuisance will be fixe soon. Best regards, Wilhelm Sanke ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Feature idea/request: move object along equation
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 01:04 PM, Karl Becker wrote: I have an idea for improving the move command but I'm having a tricky time figuring out how the syntax, and even the concept itself, would work. I'd like to be able to use the move command to move objects in non-linear, time-variable ways. I for one am glad to see someone else in need of this feature. I had been trying to figure out some way to script this as well, but built-in control would be excellent. ... So in theory, you could write syntax as: move grc ball from 10,10 to 100,100 easein 20 easeout 40 ...to accelerate the moved object to the moveSpeed during the first 20% of the moved distance, and decelerate during the last 40%. Yes, that's a good way of putting it. That functionality would be wonderful! I'd also like to move stuff along an equation, too, but that's a minor thing - this easein/out is a nice way of phrasing it, yes. Can we get this?... Hear hear, I second. -- Karl Becker, KB Productions - http://www.karlbecker.com Featuring:New Tricks, Tiger's Eye Pub, and The Fishin' Hole ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Mc betas
Wilhelm Sanke wrote: It is now a week that we don't have access to the Metacard ftp-site. This must be a very special company that is unable to provide free access to an ftp site. Hope this nuisance will be fixe soon. Indeed this is a very strange arrangement, I use one of the least expansive web hosts available and providing anonymous ftp was up to me at no extra cost. Best regards, Wilhelm Sanke ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard -- Regards, Andu Novac ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re:Disabling text lines
Listers, Anyone know of a way to display a disabled line in a list field like the - (dash) in a button's list? Are there a flock of little known meta-characters (no pun intended) which can perform wondrous effects (i.e., bold, italics, disabled) on individual lines in these List Fields? Does anyone miss true list objects? Or LDEFs? Ray G. Miller --- Turtlelips Productions 4009 Everett Ave. Oakland, CA 94602 MailTo:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (V) 510.530.1971 (F) 510.482.3491 ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
properties stack freezing up
when attempting to write something in an object's properties stack, like a name or icon number, the little stack goes blank when i press a letter key. i thought it might be something i was not setting up, and re-took the tutorials, but i can't figure out why this happens. my older objects seem to be ok. sometimes i get this: go to card (word 1 of ctype properties) if the lookAndFeel is Macintosh or the lookAndFeel is Appearance Manager then set the textsize of button 1 to 10 # HERE else set the textsize of button 1 to empty send getprops to this card = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Disabling text lines
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 06:05 PM, Ray G Miller wrote: Listers, Anyone know of a way to display a disabled line in a list field like the - (dash) in a button's list? Haven't tried it, but could you set the textcolor of the line to a light grey? Then check the textcolor before operating on a selection; if it is grey then don't do anything. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
properties stack freezing
when attempting to write something in an object's properties stack, like a name or icon number, the little stack goes blank when i press a letter key. i thought it might be something i was not setting up, and re-took the tutorials, but i can't figure out why this happens. sometimes i get this: go to card (word 1 of ctype properties) if the lookAndFeel is Macintosh or the lookAndFeel is Appearance Manager then set the textsize of button 1 to 10 # HERE else set the textsize of button 1 to empty send getprops to this card = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 09:07 PM, erik hansen wrote: when attempting to write something in an object's properties stack, like a name or icon number, the little stack goes blank when i press a letter key. I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Do you mean you are trying to assign new properties to an object by using the property editor? (I always call it the properties dialog out of habit, though you are right it is really just a stack.) i thought it might be something i was not setting up, and re-took the tutorials, but i can't figure out why this happens. my older objects seem to be ok. sometimes i get this: go to card (word 1 of ctype properties) if the lookAndFeel is Macintosh or the lookAndFeel is Appearance Manager then set the textsize of button 1 to 10 # HERE else set the textsize of button 1 to empty send getprops to this card It looks like you might be getting a bug from one of MetaCard's scripts. I get those too occasionally, usually from the control browser. If you can reproduce it with a short example, send the report in to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
It looks like you might be getting a bug from one of MetaCard's scripts. I get those too occasionally, usually from the control browser. if i create an image object, (for example) then bring up the properties dialog, then try to type a char into the Image Name field- the whole dialog goes blank. this occurs after clicking on the object as well as when using the Control Browser. reproduce it with a short example, send the report in to [EMAIL PROTECTED] thanks for the tip, i will. = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 09:27 PM, erik hansen wrote: if i create an image object, (for example) then bring up the properties dialog, then try to type a char into the Image Name field- the whole dialog goes blank. What version of the OS and what version of MetaCard? I had the same thing happen, only I was trying to take a snapshot of a window in Classic while running the OS X version of MC. I also had it happen while using the color picker inside MC. What you describe sounds similar, but I've never seen it in the properties stack. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
mac OS 9.2 MC 2.4.1 MetaCardPPC if i create an image object, (for example) then bring up the properties dialog, then try to type a char into the Image Name field- the whole dialog goes blank. What version of the OS and what version of MetaCard? I had the same thing happen, only I was trying to take a snapshot of a window in Classic while running the OS X version of MC. I also had it happen while using the color picker inside MC. What you describe sounds similar, but I've never seen it in the properties stack. = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
I ran 2.4.1 under OS 9.1 for ages and never saw anything like that. Sounds like a bug though. On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 09:57 PM, erik hansen wrote: mac OS 9.2 MC 2.4.1 MetaCardPPC if i create an image object, (for example) then bring up the properties dialog, then try to type a char into the Image Name field- the whole dialog goes blank. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
put the properties of stack MexCho, or bg btn id 1234, or whatever puts empty into the msg. yet, i can set the name using a line command in the msg. i remember noticing this while going through the Presentation tutorial. --- Jacqueline Landman Gay [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I ran 2.4.1 under OS 9.1 for ages and never saw anything like that. Sounds like a bug though. On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 09:57 PM, erik hansen wrote: mac OS 9.2 MC 2.4.1 MetaCardPPC if i create an image object, (for example) then bring up the properties dialog, then try to type a char into the Image Name field- the whole dialog goes blank. = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 10:16 PM, erik hansen wrote: put the properties of stack MexCho, or bg btn id 1234, or whatever puts empty into the msg. yet, i can set the name using a line command in the msg. What you want is customkeys. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | [EMAIL PROTECTED] HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: properties stack freezing up
--- Jacqueline Landman Gay [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wednesday, March 13, 2002, at 10:16 PM, erik hansen wrote: put the properties of stack MexCho, or bg btn id 1234, or whatever puts empty into the msg. yet, i can set the name using a line command in the msg. What you want is customkeys. same result. i will just deal with MC now. thanks for the help. = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
icon id 3001 where are you?
the custom icons created in HC and opened in MC cannot be found. in HC they are referenced to the stack and appear in the icon window with the id the creator chooses. guys 4001 etc., dolls 3001 etc. where they can be edited. after going through tutorials, concepts, and references, re: icons images, the dancers remain elusive. My Icons shows no trace, Icon Chooser- nothing. are custom icons supposed to show up somewhere to be edited? or could my Properties dialog bug be the culprit... = [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.erikhansen.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Feature request: open stack visuals
On Tuesday, March 12, 2002, at 07:56 PM, Ken Ray wrote: Quick correction - the URL is: http://www.tactilemedia.com/download/ Thanks, Scott! Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard This is very cool! Thanks for sharing. -Mark Talluto ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
