Re: Break from the past?
Yes. On 29-Jan-05, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So in short, the question is: Are we comfortable with the final release of MC IDE v2.6 being compatible only with engine v2.6 and later? -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list metacard@lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: tools stack version (2.6) doesn't match engine version
Thank you, Richard. Does that mean that there will be scripted versions of the engine changes to compensate for the use of an older engine, or merely that the IDE will not rely on any of these changes, or what? On 17-Oct-04, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All, I just installed the latest test version of the MC IDE for Mac OS X, and I get the (harmless) error in the subject line. That error comes from the Home stack. To date we've only been working on mctools.mc, and will revise the Home stack when the license scheme changes (portions are locked so I'll have to get Scott Raney's assistance). If you find it annoying you can remove that warning from your Home stack. The current plan is to make the MC IDE work with all engine versions from the time it went open source to the present (that is, if we can stay on top of the incompatibilities introduced by Rev's stewardship of the engine). -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
tools stack version (2.6) doesn't match engine version (2.6.1)
All, I just installed the latest test version of the MC IDE for Mac OS X, and I get the (harmless) error in the subject line. -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Basic scrollbar question
The Thumb Size also affects the number and distribution of the tick marks. On 22-Sep-04, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ken Ray wrote: Also not sure how to control the marks - it would make sense if they were representing the pageInc value - but it is a smaller setting. It actually represents the pageInc value *plus one* (I'm assuming for the 0 setting). So if I set up a scale with a min of 0 and a max of 100, with a pageInc of 10 and a lineInc of 1, I'll get 11 tick marks, for: 0 10 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 90 100 Well actually not: if you set the pageInc to 11 you get the thumb to jump 10 steps, but the markers see to be separated in steps of 8.3 (ie 83 / 10) To get tick marks like this (for the scale running from 0 -100): 0102030405060708090 100 You need to set the pageInc to 12 ! And then of course clicking on the scroll bar jumps 11. Seems logical :) Can someone confirm this with recent engines? -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: metacard Digest, Vol 8, Issue 25
On 27-May-04, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Should I proceed with a change from opening as toplevel to simply opening in the stack's native mode? No; retain the original behaviour of 14 years. What do you think is most appropriate option for an IDE with 28 users? There are a lot more than 28 MC IDE users; I know of 4 beside myself who use the MC IDE exclusively, and none of them belongs to this list (they rely on me to keep the up-to-date). -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Standalone builder problem
Fellow Metacardians, I don't often build standalones in Metacard (I run stacks instead), but today I had need of, so I tried it (Mac OS X 10.3.3, MC 2.5). Problem is, it doesn't work: it gets as far as creating the app bundle, but then quits with the error that it can't open MetaCard *within the bundle*. It doesn't do so for all stacks (e.g., if I create a quick test stack, all is fine), just the one I need to build. What gives (i.e., what produces the error in one case and not the other)? I receive this list in digest mode, so if you have a quick answer, please email me directly [EMAIL PROTECTED]. -- John R. Vokey ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Plug ins in MC 2.6b1 and other questions
Metacardians, I see that the new MC IDE 2.6 has a plug-ins menu. Having never used one, what constitutes a plug-in? Is it just a main stack that serves a particular function? It is anything other than a stack being put in use, or do all scripts and properties of the plug-in stack become available to the stack using the plug-in? Do the plug-in properties apply only within the IDE, or do they migrate automagically to stand-alones? And, more generally, how are we to distinguish between properties, procedures and functions of the engine, the MC IDE, and the RR IDE? Should we (yes us) be updating the MC help files so that they reflect the engine and the MC IDE? As it stands now, one is forced to use the RR documentation for new features of the engine amidst a plethora of RR IDE specific stuff. RR staff could help if all engine additions and changes were published as such, distinct from RR IDE specific changes. -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
I know this should be simple, but...
Fellow Metacardians, For the first time in all my years using metacard on the Mac OS (currently MC 2.5 under OS X), I have the need to create a standalone for Windoze, and, to be honest, I don't have a clue how to do it. I gather I need the Windoze engine, but I have no idea where I would get that. I presume there are also other steps and ``gotchas'' that I should be aware of. Would one of you be kind enough to provide me with a step by step set of instructions (including how I get the Windoze engine on Mac OS X)? As I receive this list in digest mode, I would appreciate it if you could respond directly to my email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank you. -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Graph object
Here's a start: http://www.rpi.edu/~simonk/mc/ On 26-Mar-04, at 10:00 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Listers, Does anybody have any ready-to-go scripts which draw charts? Preferably, I'd like to be able to draw bar, column, area, line, scatter and pie charts. (Several of those are virtually the same.) Thanks, Ray Horsley Developer, LinkIt! Software -- John R. Vokey, PhD Professor B.E.R.G. - Behaviour and Evolution Research Group Micro-Cognition Laboratory Department of Psychology Neuroscience University of Lethbridge Lethbridge, Alberta T1K 3M4 CANADA ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Script Limits vs dynamic programming
On Thursday, August 7, 2003 Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote: I don't understand what you mean by this. Your extensible stacks are your products. (Product does not mean commercial product, nor is it restricted to standalone applications.) It sounds from your description like your products would in fact impact the products you make, so my suggestion of discussing this with Kevin is still my advice. This is missing the point. The principle advantage of metacard/RR is that it provides for dynamic programming *and* it does so in a cross-platform way. I have and use c, c++ compilers, Futurebasic, RealBasic, and so on, but for different purposes. None of these other programming environments is *dynamic*. Scott Raney's important statement that metacard is written in metacard was not to make the point that, as with c or Basic or Fortran compilers one could write a c, or Basic or Fortran compiler with it, but rather that the system is bootstrapped. The possibility of producing ``standalones'' in hypercard and metacard has unfortunately helped disguise this fact to the point where many (Shari C is a fine example, here, and more power to her) think of metacard/RR as just another IDE with fine cross-platform capabilities. That it no doubt is, but that's not what makes it either unique or important: it is the possibility for dynamic programming that the engine provides, as with hypercard. Limiting script length and ``do'' to non-licensed RR users means that *only* licensed RR users of the stacks I produce can can partake of the dynamic nature. Thus, rather being an essential part of metacard/RR, this dynamism becomes a feature *only* licensed users (developers?) can use, but can't retain in the stacks they produce. By all means, strip it out of standalones if need be, but leave it as an essential feature of stacks. For those who remember them, think of the completely different experience one has programming in and using TILs (threaded interpretative languages) such as APL, and forth: as with hypercard, programming is not distinct from using; they are seamlessly integrated. *That* is what we will be losing by these limits. For those who use metacard/RR to produce applications without those dynamic capabilities, I can understand why they don't feel these limits amount to much. But for some, at least me, it is the dynamism that is my whole reason for using metacard, recommending it to students, and so on. John R. Vokey ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re: Script Limit
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote: I'd urge people to drop a line to Kevin if this change would impact their products, describing how you use the capability. I can't speak for Kevin but I know he listens carefully to concerns of current customers when changes are being considered. Good advice *if one is producing ``products'', i.e., applications that just so happen to be written in metacard , but could have been done in c or BASIC)* I, however, produce extensible ``stacks''---following the original hypercard model--- that I freely exchange with my students and colleagues. Often, these stacks are boot-strapped in that they provide for a simple scripting language---a mixture of metatalk and procedures and functions I have added---to accomplish some goal, such as a stack that provides a resampling statistics language so that students and colleagues can program their own resampling solutions, or a language to program experiments that is itself extensible. Thus, the user writes lines of code (the afore-mentioned mixture of metatalk and new commands) that are then executed (usually via `do', but sometimes by replacing the script of some object): the user is not knowingly programming metacard, but using the new language. The proposed limits mean that the metacard (ok, RR) ``player'' is broken. To make use of my ``stacks'', the user must now have a licensed version of metacard (RR). It is (was?) this boot-strapping extensibility of xtalks (as with their threaded-interpretive-language, TILs, predecessors) that has been the core secret of their success, and the proposed loss of it in metacard/RR---the alleged successor to hypercard, is anathema. RR just becomes yet another cluttered IDE with an odd programming language. At a minimum, ``do'' should remain unlimited, but I would prefer to remove the limit on replacing scripts, as well. After all, haven't licensed users agreed not to produce a new RR in RR/metacard? And now that the free (but 10-line script limited) metacard is to be gone, to be replaced by a 30-day, web-checked (ugh!) demo, why are the limits needed at all? The whole direction is ominous. -- John R. Vokey, Ph.D. |\ _,,,---,,_ Professor /,`.-'`'-. ;-;;,_ Department of Psychology and Neuroscience |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' University of Lethbridge '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
On RR acquiring Metacard
As with some others, I have the disquieting feeling of being ``hoist by my own petard'': on initially moving from hypercard to metacard years ago, my principle complaint (voiced on this list) with metacard was the, then, incomprehensible interface (why or why could it not be more like hypercard?), and the lousy documentation. RR comes along and fixes both, but in the interim I've come to appreciate the deep intelligence and elegant simplicity of Dr. Raney's metacard interface (and no longer need the documentation), to the point (as with my earlier belief about the hypercard way) that I find RR way to be bloated, incomprehensible, clumsy, and annoying: it just gets in my way! However, I am confident that it is none of these things, despite the wailing and gnashing of teeth I'll no doubt go through as I adapt to it. And I will. Congratulations to Metacard corp and RR on their ultimate union! -- John R. Vokey, Ph.D. |\ _,,,---,,_ Professor /,`.-'`'-. ;-;;,_ Department of Psychology and Neuroscience |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' University of Lethbridge '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
Re:C function in metaTalk?
On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 10:03 AM, on [EMAIL PROTECTED], Wouter Abraham wrote: Hi Eric, Something like this? : local theResult on mouseUp put into theResult put abra(fld orig) into fld result end mouseUp function abra x if x then put char 2 to -1 of x into y repeat until x = put cr x before theCollector delete char -1 of x end repeat put theCollector after theResult get abra(y) else return char 2 to -1 of theResult end abra Have a nice evening, WA Unfortunately, this function does not return all the different sets of the letters as input. If the input is abc, for example, it returns: a ab abc b bc c but misses bc. The missed sets are even more obvious with abcd as input: a ab abc abcd b bc bcd c cd d In general, there are 2^k-1 possible sets, where k=the number of letters. For 4 letters, there should be 15 sets, not the 10 shown here. -- John R. Vokey, Ph.D. |\ _,,,---,,_ Professor /,`.-'`'-. ;-;;,_ Department of Psychology and Neuroscience |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' University of Lethbridge '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ___ metacard mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/metacard
