[meteorite-list] OT: Reality, Perception, Finiteness of Universe
Hi Eric, We're not talking about certainty. You certainly exist physically. Philosophy is not certainty. Much as I'd like to agree with you, there is no way for you to prove that I exist or you exist, or anything that you experience is real. That is the nature of philosophical introspection; the realization that you may not be able to trust your own senses. For instance, I would imagine you saw The Matrix. Suppose everything you see, hear, smell, taste, feel and think is simply illusion. Your first response might be, That's ridiculous! I can read the words you've typed, I can feel the keys of my keyboard, I can hear the whirr of the disk drive, smell dinner cooking, etc. But if you're really honest with yourself, you'll come to the perhaps unsettling realization that you can't prove ANY of it is real. ~Intellectually~ you reason that you are made up of billions of cells, that these cells are themselves constructed of various molecules, that the molecules can be broken down into atoms, the atoms into subatomic particles, and so on. But what are the fundamental building blocks of matter? They are really nothing more than a set of mathematical constructs invented by humans that try to match the reality that they observe. Again, very suspect, and not surprisingly our macroscopic notions of reality do not work so well in the realm of the very small. If you really want to get a reality check (pun intended), read up on Bell's Theorem, and the various experiments that show Bell's inequalities are violated, quantum mechanics is correct, and therefore the notion of local realism is disproven. But I'm getting off the subject a bit... Earlier I wrote: ...The universe is large (not to mention growing), but it is nevertheless finite... You replied: Really? Is there proof of its limited scope? If you ascribe to the Big Bang Theory, then the Universe is finite by definition. We can only see so far... Every few years we can see further. But what you may not know (don't feel bad, most people don't) is that the Universe is expanding at a rate considerably faster than the speed of light, and therefore the fraction of the total Universe that we can observe is getting smaller and smaller with time. There will reach a time in the distant future where we can only see our local cluster of galaxies -- the rest of the Universe will be closed off to us forever. Best, Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] On the other hand...
... there is no way for you to prove that I exist or you exist, or anything that you experience is real. You might want to try a modern, meteoritical spin on the rhetorical approach taken by Samuel Johnson in the 18th century, when he responded to Bishop Berkeley's claim that matter doesn't exist, but only ~seems~ to. Just drop a 10-kilo Campo on your foot from a height of one meter and proudly announce, I refute it thus! (and then have someone take you to the hospital) ;-) --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] On the other hand...
:) Like I said it's endless... I guess I'm not smart enough to figure out if we're really real or not, but that's not really what I care about. I care about knowledge. That's what I seek in my never ending quest for understanding. Now regardless of the reality of our own existence, knowledge is real. We are conscious, aware, and we think? Someone said that already though didn't they, a guy that was probably way smarter than me. A quick search and I realize it was Rene Descartes that said it first. Matter does exist, or rather we perceive the effects of matter to be measurable. Even if it is only in our minds. We see it, touch it, feel it, experience it, mold it, form it, and in some cases are controlled by it and surrounded by it. Does it matter? ;) Yes. because if matter isn't real, then your argument is moot. And if your argument is moot, then it doesn't matter, because our perception of the effects of matter is one that not only makes it exist, but makes it measurable. Does that make sense? Our own senses and the observable effects that our brains control tells me that when I drop that meteorite on my foot it's gonna hurt. And it would in fact cause measurable physical damage. Which is an effect we perceive. We do in fact think, Therefore our own thoughts are our proof that we exist. If you perceive something to be real, it is... Even if only in your own mind. Does this mean we're all having one mass hallucination? ;) Regards, Eric Rob Matson wrote: ... there is no way for you to prove that I exist or you exist, or anything that you experience is real. You might want to try a modern, meteoritical spin on the rhetorical approach taken by Samuel Johnson in the 18th century, when he responded to Bishop Berkeley's claim that matter doesn't exist, but only ~seems~ to. Just drop a 10-kilo Campo on your foot from a height of one meter and proudly announce, I refute it thus! (and then have someone take you to the hospital) ;-) --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
The corollary--I ask because they obviously have confederates (if not actual members themselves) on this list-- maybe they can bring us a Mercury sample? Maybe Venus? Phobos? Demos? Saturn ring tektites? I have some glass beads, tin mirrors, iron hatchets to swap. (It worked once before thought it might be worth a try). I agree that even 20 -100 years is unlikely unless we accidentally encounter them in distress, I can't imagine any advanced culture with even the slightest knowledge of our history feeling contact with us as a prudent step in their own history! Ask any surviving indigneous person on any contintent. Of course my dog is arguing that it is already occurred only we are too dim to recognize it. He does this all the time and what does he know? He has not been to college and hasn't read but half the books I have! Elton __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Why does everyone always assume aliens are super intelligent? based on the earth model 99.999% of all life in the universe (if there is any other) is actually not intelligent. There is a massive difference between, intelligent life, semi-intelligent life, and basic 'life'. Add up all the life forms that have existed on earth in 3+ billion years (it's a really rather large number), and consider that just 2 or 3 of those trillions and trillions of life forms actually invented a way of communicating over large distances (i.e. using radio waves), and it took billions of years for that to happen, that in itself is a mind boggling ratio. That's exactly why we haven't received any communication from aliens. A) There are [very] few planets with life, far fewer that can actually communicate b) The distances are just too vast. c) Based on our own human civilization we are not even sending out carefully directed messages, just mass radio pollution, - as someone else said maybe the only other intelligent planet is just listening!) My Guess is life is actually very rare, semi intelligent life is very, very, very rare, and intelligent life is just us (maybe plus or minus a remote planet or two somewhere very far away...) Mark CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us. Email i...@ssl.gb.com. You should not copy or use this email or attachment(s) for any purpose nor disclose their contents to any other person. GENERAL STATEMENT: Southern Scientific Ltd's computer systems may be monitored and communications carried on them recorded, to secure the effective operation of the system and for other lawful purposes. Registered address Rectory Farm Rd, Sompting, Lancing, W Sussex BN15 0DP. Company No 1800317 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ochansk wanted
Hi all, I am looking for a small sample of Ochansk, about 1 to 3 grams best regards, Christian Ing. Christian Anger Neustiftgasse 37 A-2405 Bad Deutsch Altenburg AUSTRIA email: christian.an...@aon.at website: www.austromet.com IMCA member # 2673 at www.imca.cc __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] dfgh
Zitat von joac...@1tt.net: dfgh __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] holes in stone meteorites
Another here:
http://www.agab.be/meteorites/historique/Connoisseur.html
Click on Dhofar 700 adio and enjoy (and learn some French).
7 or 8 tunnels could be guessed (in any language).
Zelimir
At 21:08 24/08/2009, Gary Fujihara wrote:
Holy Toledo! Here's a specimen of Dho700:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30562289id=1394318075
gary
On Aug 24, 2009, at 8:55 AM, Greg Stanley wrote:
Steve:
If you look on ebay and look for a MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal,
div.MsoNormal
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margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Times New Roman;
mso-fareast-font-family:Times New Roman;}
@page Section1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;
mso-header-margin:.5in;
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div.Section1
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--
Dhofar 700 Rare Vesiculated Diogenite Meteorite 45g
Rare Specimen With Vesicles And 2 Tunnels!I guess you could say it's
documented since there is a picture of it.Pretty cool specimen.
Greg S.
Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2009 11:15:50 -0700
From: stevenarnold60...@yahoo.com
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] holes in stone meteorites
Hi list.Well it is nice to see that the list has quieted down.I was
wondering.I know that there are alot of holes in iron
meteorites,but has there ever been any documented evidence of holes
in stone meteorites?I found a hole thru a terrestial rock 3 years
ago,but I have never seen one from space.Any comments?
Steve R. Arnold, Chicago!!
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Get back to school stuff for them and cashback for you.
http://www.bing.com/cashback?form=MSHYCBpubl=WLHMTAGcrea=TEXT_MSHYCB_BackToSchool_Cashback_BTSCashback_1x1
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Gary Fujihara
AstroDay Institute
105 Puhili Place, Hilo, HI 96720
(808) 640-9161, fuj...@mac.com
http://astroday.net
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Prof. Zelimir Gabelica
Université de Haute Alsace
ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC,
3, Rue A. Werner,
F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France
Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94
Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15
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Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Exactly, and our imagination, whether there are aliens and if, how they are, does in the end only reflect our occupation with ourselves. And I suppose, that has a longer tradition, our images of the aliens? From antique times on those fictions, where the protagonists travel to Moon or to space and met the people there, were used to hold up a mirror up to us, space was only the place for utopias, for satirical criticism on societies, mankind, politics and stuff or for philosophical thoughts. Hence that hadn't to do with aliens and science fiction directly, it was only the arena for such kind of projections. Like it was used to let such fiction play in far and unknown or fantastic lands, hence no difference to let's say e.g Gulliver's Travels. The basis for our todays imagination about the nature of aliens and Science Fiction with its different genres, I think, was set in 19th century. 3 archetypes you find there. One is the stalwartly optimistic believe, that the (new) technological progress will lead mankind to an ideal society and will solve all our worries and quarrels and that Earth and universe is waiting to be seized by the human civilization. (Aliens would be only debilitating and annoying for that purpose, hence there better shouldn't be any, I guess) Most popular exponent was perhaps Jules Verne. The antagonistic SfiFi to Jules Verne is best represented by the fictions of a H.G.Wells. That mankind will always be limited to its behaviour and the depths of its character. And that in its limitations the human society can be helplessly at mercy if e.g. the intruder from Mars will come, and that the society will fall in pieces. Third one, somewhat earlier, is that enthusiasm for the Middle Ages of the Romanticism. The escape into a manageable fairy-tale world, with noble knights, pretty damsles, dynasties and battles and with clear rules, where the Miller's son and underdog...nja you know. Wherefrom the whole stuff like Tolkien, fantasy literature and our today's role-plays were derived off. Well and from these three basic ingredients our conception of the aliens seems to be mingled together. And the prevalence of one or the other element is rather a question of temporary vogues. The breakdown of the old systems, the experiences of two World wars, the cold war. There we had more Wells than Verne and the Aliens and the robots and the prehistoric monsters and other communists had nothing better to do than to invade Colorado and California to eradicate mankind and even The Officer was powerless. A little later with the upcoming space flight enthusiasm we had some more Verne. And very important, the affreightment of the genre with esoteric and religious elements, mother nature, we are family and all the Hippie stuff. That the aliens are of course not evil, but kindly have to come to rescue us. (Therefrom btw the resumption of the old concept of the noble savage, if you remind one of the most popular aliens ever, the droll E.T.) Which SciFi had the most influence in my generation? And don't tell me that your concept of aliens isn't influenced by Scifi. Star Wars Saga - that was pure Popcorn-Middle-Ages-fun. Star Trek Series - was a kind, how should United Nations exemplarily behave in space, where the problems are the very same as here on Earth + Daily Soap. Well and perhaps cause of the visually new realization, the Alien movies, Good old Wells. Kubrick's film you'll say.. I'm not sure, that it is directly about aliens.. So you find always the same patterns, how the aliens should be. Either they will come to eat us all up or they are Messiahs. Both cases imply that they are more advanced than we, hence Wells. (That they would be underdeveloped, that we can conquer, exploit and kill them all, as we used to do so for the last thousands of years among our own kind and tribes, is definitely excluded, because it would be against any political correctness). That is one thing, the other thing is, why some are eager and some not, that there must be life in space. Well. In the beginning we were the center of the universe and we were effigies of a God. Little later we learned ooops, Sun is the center of the World. Again a little later, ouch the stars arenothing else than suns, than there is another galaxy full of suns and that our sun isn't the center of our galaxy, very soon after how obscenely large and far away other galaxies are, and that our galaxy isn't the center of universe, meanwhile we had learned that Grandpa was a chimpanzee, then we saw that the universe is full of galaxies and that its incredible huge, we experienced how old it is, how old Earth is (nasty meteorites), how old life is and that the human beings existed for a shorter time than a blink of an eye, and that the universe expanses so that maybe it will blow over (but before the sun will blow the Earth, that we are mortal we all knew before), as it wouldn't be enough we found 20 years ago other planets orbiting other
Re: [meteorite-list] holes in stone meteorites
Hi Dirk, Similar but not the same. Most probably cut from the same individual (only a few of Dho 700 pieces have vugs, perhaps only one of them ?). Mine was obtained through a special offer from Blaine Reed. My slice is 14.5 grams and seems to have more holes and thus less cheese than yours Take care Zelimir At 13:51 25/08/2009, drtanuki wrote: Dear Zelimir, Perhaps a sibling to the same slice? Looks familiar! http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/2009/08/meteorite-news-holes-in-meteorites.html Best Regards, Dirk...Tokyo Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] holes in stone meteorites
Hi Zelimir, I believe around half of the dozen stones that made up Dhofar 700 displayed vesicles. Some were more prominent than others. My individual shows just a few small ones on the exterior and I've never been able to bring myself to slice it up to see if there are many more! ;-) http://www.meteorites.com.au/features/dho700.html Cheers, Jeff - Original Message - From: Zelimir Gabelica zelimir.gabel...@uha.fr To: drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:12 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] holes in stone meteorites Hi Dirk, Similar but not the same. Most probably cut from the same individual (only a few of Dho 700 pieces have vugs, perhaps only one of them ?). Mine was obtained through a special offer from Blaine Reed. My slice is 14.5 grams and seems to have more holes and thus less cheese than yours Take care Zelimir At 13:51 25/08/2009, drtanuki wrote: Dear Zelimir, Perhaps a sibling to the same slice? Looks familiar! http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/2009/08/meteorite-news-holes-in-meteorites.html Best Regards, Dirk...Tokyo Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
That is just hogwash in my opinion---the Drake Equation proves that life MUST exist elsewhere. Not quite - Actually most sensible values for the drake equation (and subsequent improved variants) come up with surprisingly low values, given the scale and size of the universe! In fact it's quite easy to get values of 1! yes Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but evidence of absence is evidence of absence! If we search and find no other life in our own solar system, it lowers the odds somewhat, since the earth is so perfect for life, yet the similar sized planets that are very nearby are totally sterile (it seems so far). Mark -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Becky and Kirk Sent: 24 August 2009 22:10 To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted That is just hogwash in my opinion---the Drake Equation proves that life MUST exist elsewhere. Even the SETI scientists agree that LIFE is probably abundant! Absence of Evidence is NOT Evidence of Absence!! Kirk.. - Original Message - From: Phil Whitmer prairiecac...@rtcol.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 11:17 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted Eric: It's my belief that We Are Alone! There's nobody out there. Life and intelligence is a singularity, a miracle, call it what you will, it only happened once, here on good old Planet Earth. We are the Seed that will spread throughout the Universe by Space Migration. It's our manifest destiny and a matter of survival. Nobody knows how or why it happened, it just did. It was either God or chance, take your pick. There are those who claim otherwise, but they have yet to provide even the thinnest shred of evidence. Those who make extraordinary claims must provide some extraordinary evidence to back it up. And they never do! Not one person abducted by ETs has ever grabbed an alien cellphone or anything else to prove they were aboard an intergalactic space ship. The argument for aliens goes something like this: Well there's billions and billions of galaxies, one of them has to harbor life. It just has to! You know, a billion monkeys typing for a billion years, and one of them writes a Shakespearean Sonnet or the Book of Genesis, whatever. I think they will just type gibberish for eternity. Life doesn't just pop up all over the place. It can never be created in the laboratory. It's impossible to make live stuff out of dead stuff! (Except for that one time.) This argument puts a lot of faith in Chance and the Laws of Probability. Might as well say Yahweh or Brahma did it. Evolution guided by chance and probability, how is that any different from chaos and total randomness? And why do the aliens always appear in trailer parks and never at Houston Control, NAU, or the JPL? Now if I could see one bit of hard evidence, I would change my mind in a minute. Just my dos pesos, Phil Whitmer __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us. Email i...@ssl.gb.com. You should not copy or use this email or attachment(s) for any purpose nor disclose their contents to any other person. GENERAL STATEMENT: Southern Scientific Ltd's computer systems may be monitored and communications carried on them recorded, to secure the effective operation of the system and for other lawful purposes. Registered address Rectory Farm Rd, Sompting, Lancing, W Sussex BN15 0DP. Company No 1800317 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: Reality, Perception, Finiteness of Universe
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 23:54:45 -0700, you wrote: For instance, I would imagine you saw The Matrix. Suppose everything you see, hear, smell, taste, feel and think is simply illusion. Your first response might be, That's ridiculous! I can read the words you've typed, I can feel the keys of my keyboard, I can hear the whirr of the disk drive, smell dinner cooking, etc. But if you're really honest with yourself, you'll come to the perhaps unsettling realization that you can't prove ANY of it is real. A paper from a few years back: http://www.simulation-argument.com/ I must say, I do encounter people who don't pass the Turing test. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Drake says: N = R x Fp X ne X fl X Fi X fc X L my reckoning: 1 = 1 X 30% X 0.1 X 40% X 40% X 29% X 1000 Where R = The number of stars in a similar class to ours born each year Fp = Percentage of stars that for planets Ne = Number of planets for each star that have the right conditions for life Fl = Percentage of planets with suitable conditions for life to exist, which start life Fi = Percentage of planets with life that go on to develop intelligent life Fc = Percentage intelligent planets that develop communication technology L = Number of years each civilization survives for (in a communicable state) :. So no supprise we 'aint heard from no ET... (and imho, I'm being fairly optimistic about planets forming life supporting conditions) Mark Eric: It's my belief that We Are Alone! There's nobody out there. Life and intelligence is a singularity, a miracle, call it what you will, it only happened once, here on good old Planet Earth. We are the Seed that will spread throughout the Universe by Space Migration. It's our manifest destiny and a matter of survival. Nobody knows how or why it happened, it just did. It was either God or chance, take your pick. There are those who claim otherwise, but they have yet to provide even the thinnest shred of evidence. Those who make extraordinary claims must provide some extraordinary evidence to back it up. And they never do! Not one person abducted by ETs has ever grabbed an alien cellphone or anything else to prove they were aboard an intergalactic space ship. The argument for aliens goes something like this: Well there's billions and billions of galaxies, one of them has to harbor life. It just has to! You know, a billion monkeys typing for a billion years, and one of them writes a Shakespearean Sonnet or the Book of Genesis, whatever. I think they will just type gibberish for eternity. Life doesn't just pop up all over the place. It can never be created in the laboratory. It's impossible to make live stuff out of dead stuff! (Except for that one time.) This argument puts a lot of faith in Chance and the Laws of Probability. Might as well say Yahweh or Brahma did it. Evolution guided by chance and probability, how is that any different from chaos and total randomness? And why do the aliens always appear in trailer parks and never at Houston Control, NAU, or the JPL? Now if I could see one bit of hard evidence, I would change my mind in a minute. Just my dos pesos, Phil Whitmer __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us. Email i...@ssl.gb.com. You should not copy or use this email or attachment(s) for any purpose nor disclose their contents to any other person. GENERAL STATEMENT: Southern Scientific Ltd's computer systems may be monitored and communications carried on them recorded, to secure the effective operation of the system and for other lawful purposes. Registered address Rectory Farm Rd, Sompting, Lancing, W Sussex BN15 0DP. Company No 1800317 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us. Email i...@ssl.gb.com. You should not copy or use this email or attachment(s) for any purpose nor disclose their contents to any other person. GENERAL STATEMENT: Southern Scientific Ltd's computer systems may be monitored and communications carried on them recorded, to secure the effective operation of the system and for other lawful purposes. Registered address Rectory Farm Rd, Sompting, Lancing, W Sussex BN15 0DP. Company No 1800317 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Trappists fireballs
Hi David, Mark, Dirk, list, Gods can come to you. In Belgium we have officially about 800 different brands of beer (unofficially something like 2000, some very local). Up to 14% strength available (but through special request). By far more than fireballs and meteorite falls! (olny 4 meteorite falls authenticated so far since 'free Belgium exists (1830). (this last line is here to justify this post, that should be exclusively devoted to meteorites and related (Unless Art considers that 12%+ Trappist issue is definitely a related topic ?) My car is driving Mulhouse-Belgium back-and-forth every week and the trunk is not always full My car can then be called God, if you are on visit here. It does not consume Trappists, just carries them One of the good opportunities for a visit can well be the Ensisheim blast...otherwise (and if you are in a hurry), just call (Christopher Cokinos know that very well!) Also prepare your orders. Payment in meteorites, cash always possible, upon preliminary agreement (kidding). All always welcome ! (David got it this year, Dirk promised, Mike is invited, who else interested ? - Btw, Martin and Rob, I'll be at you later today...) Best, Zelimir At 15:30 24/08/2009, Peter Davidson wrote: Mike Actually can we just skip the meteorite hunting and the chocolate and concentrate on the case of Trappist Beer. I think if I could drink enough of that 12% strength nectar, I could just about see anything I want. Cheers Peter Davidson Curator of Minerals National Museums Collection Centre National Museums Scotland 242 West Granton Road Edinburgh EH5 1JA Phone: +44 131 247 4283 p.david...@nms.ac.uk www.nms.ac.uk -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Mike Bandli Sent: 21 August 2009 16:27 To: 'drtanuki'; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Belgian Fireball of 15AUG09 update Belgian fireball? There is nothing I would want more than to stand in line at the Westvletren Monastery for a case of the Abt 12 Trappist Ale, and to have some fine chocolate, and to hunt meteorites all at the same time... this would be heaven and those of you lucky enough to taste the Abt 12 know that this is the same beer that is consumed by the gods. Cheers, Mike Bandli -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of drtanuki Sent: Friday, August 21, 2009 7:37 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Belgian Fireball of 15AUG09 update Dear List, Major update on the Belgian bolide of 15AUG09: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/ Thank you Vincent from Belgium!! Dirk Ross...Tokyo Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Trappists fireballs
Sorry for mistake in the preceding post. Please replace David by Peter. I confused with a David Peterson another friend of mine, also Trappist enthousiast... (Peter, I owe you somechocolate!) Zelimir At 15:40 25/08/2009, Zelimir Gabelica wrote: Hi David, Mark, Dirk, list, Gods can come to you. In Belgium we have officially about 800 different brands of beer (unofficially something like 2000, some very local). Up to 14% strength available (but through special request). By far more than fireballs and meteorite falls! (olny 4 meteorite falls authenticated so far since 'free Belgium exists (1830). (this last line is here to justify this post, that should be exclusively devoted to meteorites and related (Unless Art considers that 12%+ Trappist issue is definitely a related topic ?) My car is driving Mulhouse-Belgium back-and-forth every week and the trunk is not always full My car can then be called God, if you are on visit here. It does not consume Trappists, just carries them One of the good opportunities for a visit can well be the Ensisheim blast...otherwise (and if you are in a hurry), just call (Christopher Cokinos know that very well!) Also prepare your orders. Payment in meteorites, cash always possible, upon preliminary agreement (kidding). All always welcome ! (David got it this year, Dirk promised, Mike is invited, who else interested ? - Btw, Martin and Rob, I'll be at you later today...) Best, Zelimir At 15:30 24/08/2009, Peter Davidson wrote: Mike Actually can we just skip the meteorite hunting and the chocolate and concentrate on the case of Trappist Beer. I think if I could drink enough of that 12% strength nectar, I could just about see anything I want. Cheers Peter Davidson Curator of Minerals National Museums Collection Centre National Museums Scotland 242 West Granton Road Edinburgh EH5 1JA Phone: +44 131 247 4283 p.david...@nms.ac.uk www.nms.ac.uk -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Mike Bandli Sent: 21 August 2009 16:27 To: 'drtanuki'; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Belgian Fireball of 15AUG09 update Belgian fireball? There is nothing I would want more than to stand in line at the Westvletren Monastery for a case of the Abt 12 Trappist Ale, and to have some fine chocolate, and to hunt meteorites all at the same time... this would be heaven and those of you lucky enough to taste the Abt 12 know that this is the same beer that is consumed by the gods. Cheers, Mike Bandli -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of drtanuki Sent: Friday, August 21, 2009 7:37 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Belgian Fireball of 15AUG09 update Dear List, Major update on the Belgian bolide of 15AUG09: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/ Thank you Vincent from Belgium!! Dirk Ross...Tokyo Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
This is an urban legend. Walt Disney was cremated. Andre Bordeleau From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] on behalf of Phil Whitmer [prairiecac...@rtcol.com] Sent: August 25, 2009 1:58 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted Darren: That's funny! But realistically, the percentage is much lower if you figure in the complete lack of evidence for life on the Moon, Mars, all the other planets and their moons, the Sun, all the asteroids, all the comets, and any other stuff that might be hanging around the edges of the Solar System. If there is no evidence for life anywhere in the entire Solar System, (that I know of), even on such a life friendly place as Mars, then maybe life doesn't just pop into existence just because conditions are right. Maybe it is just a one time thing. I wish I could afford to be cryogenically frozen like Walt Disney and wake up in a few million years to find out! Phil Whitmer __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Six Year Old finds meteorite? UGH!
I just saw this this morning. What a bunch of rubbish. More to confuse the un-informed, with Ebay prices to boot! http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/6063717/Six-year-old-boy-finds-meteorite-in-his-garden.html Tell me, does that look like a meteorite? Don't think so. Steve Schoner Wanna lose weight? Weight Loss Programs that work. Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdf49oZzsomQxR9Jlh6iyk9EnSWRRmqPGGHNXmwEApf4EIP0tPM8K0/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Trappists fireballs
Zelimir You are putting temptation in front of me. I should resist, I must resist, but I am a weak and feeble man! Belgian beer and Belgian chocolate are like two small pieces of heaven. In Scotland, the surname Davidson is perhaps the sixth most common. Peter is also a fairly common first name. So technically there should be no problem. But in my life I have been called David Peterson, David Davidson and Peter Peterson. I have also been addressed as Peter Ferguson and Peter Jamieson. Where those ones came from I don't know. Too much trappiste!?! Sante Peter Davidson Curator of Minerals National Museums Collection Centre National Museums Scotland 242 West Granton Road Edinburgh EH5 1JA Phone: +44 131 247 4283 p.david...@nms.ac.uk www.nms.ac.uk -Original Message- From: Zelimir Gabelica [mailto:zelimir.gabel...@uha.fr] Sent: 25 August 2009 14:40 To: Peter Davidson; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Trappists fireballs Hi David, Mark, Dirk, list, Gods can come to you. In Belgium we have officially about 800 different brands of beer (unofficially something like 2000, some very local). Up to 14% strength available (but through special request). By far more than fireballs and meteorite falls! (olny 4 meteorite falls authenticated so far since 'free Belgium exists (1830). (this last line is here to justify this post, that should be exclusively devoted to meteorites and related (Unless Art considers that 12%+ Trappist issue is definitely a related topic ?) My car is driving Mulhouse-Belgium back-and-forth every week and the trunk is not always full My car can then be called God, if you are on visit here. It does not consume Trappists, just carries them One of the good opportunities for a visit can well be the Ensisheim blast...otherwise (and if you are in a hurry), just call (Christopher Cokinos know that very well!) Also prepare your orders. Payment in meteorites, cash always possible, upon preliminary agreement (kidding). All always welcome ! (David got it this year, Dirk promised, Mike is invited, who else interested ? - Btw, Martin and Rob, I'll be at you later today...) Best, Zelimir At 15:30 24/08/2009, Peter Davidson wrote: Mike Actually can we just skip the meteorite hunting and the chocolate and concentrate on the case of Trappist Beer. I think if I could drink enough of that 12% strength nectar, I could just about see anything I want. Cheers Peter Davidson Curator of Minerals National Museums Collection Centre National Museums Scotland 242 West Granton Road Edinburgh EH5 1JA Phone: +44 131 247 4283 p.david...@nms.ac.uk www.nms.ac.uk -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Mike Bandli Sent: 21 August 2009 16:27 To: 'drtanuki'; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Belgian Fireball of 15AUG09 update Belgian fireball? There is nothing I would want more than to stand in line at the Westvletren Monastery for a case of the Abt 12 Trappist Ale, and to have some fine chocolate, and to hunt meteorites all at the same time... this would be heaven and those of you lucky enough to taste the Abt 12 know that this is the same beer that is consumed by the gods. Cheers, Mike Bandli -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of drtanuki Sent: Friday, August 21, 2009 7:37 AM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Belgian Fireball of 15AUG09 update Dear List, Major update on the Belgian bolide of 15AUG09: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/ Thank you Vincent from Belgium!! Dirk Ross...Tokyo Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Université de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 Free Fringe music. Celebrate Homecoming at the National Museum of Scotland 8-30 August. www.nms.ac.uk/music National Museums Scotland, Scottish Charity, No. SC 011130 This communication is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the addressee please inform the sender and delete the email from your system. The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of National Museums Scotland. This message is subject to the Data Protection Act 1998 and Freedom of Information (Scotland) Act 2002. No liability is accepted for any harm that may be caused to your systems or data by this message. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Seems to me that the Mars rovers have pretty much proved that at one time Mars probably supported life based on their findings and observations---and that is right in our own back yard! Kirk. - Original Message - From: Phil Whitmer prairiecac...@rtcol.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 12:24 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted To all listees pondering the Eternal Verities: Just because the Universe is really big is not an argument that there is Life out there. The Ocean is really big, but that's not an argument for the existence of a Loch Ness monster or any other species of pleisosaur. I have to actually see a unicorn before I'll believe that they exist. I'm Old School, I have to actually see a visible light photograph of just one of these supposed googols of Earth like planets. All I've heard is pure speculation, forumulae, projections of our loneliness, (there has to be someone out there!) extrapolations, computer models, mathematical probabilities, etc. Still waiting on the evidence! Not proof, just a simple tiny shred of evidence. One simple SOS in Morse Code on any one of the billions and billions of channels monitered by Seti. One peer reviewed, in focus, well lit, properly exposed photograph of an actual flying saucer. One little tiny fossil in a meteorite. Anything! Closer to home, I'm still waiting for anything at all from the Mars probes. Just one incontrovertible shred of evidence where all the scientists go: Yes, there's life on Mars! Until I see this evidence I have to conclude that on the closest planet that was once very Earth like, there is no sign of life. If we can't even find it on Mars, which should have been teeming with life, which should have left tons of evidence which should have been found by now, then I must conclude that the Universe is a vast lifeless place. The only life that I can verify by empirical evidence is right here on this planet. You can do all the thought experiments you want, in your imagination you can populate the entire vast Universe with bacteria, or Star Trek/Star Wars like critters, whatever you like, it's all pure speculation. All that we know for sure is that is Life here on Earth. Plenty of it. The problem is nobody knows where it came from. Nobody is really sure even what it is. Can someone tell me what the Life Force is that differentiates living things from inanimate objects? Is it Chi?, Ki? Prana? What the heck is it? Did it originate here on Earth. (I think it did.) If it did, then how did that first coacervate of organic molecules become alive in the first place? How did it know how to assemble a strand of self replicating RNA? At exactly what point did the Life Force enter this assemblage of non living stuff? Don't even get me started on the Miracle of Intelligence/Consciousness! As if anyone knows what that little voice in your head is! This should be pretty simple stuff to figure out, even for a young, dumb species like homo sapiens. After all, it happened right here on our home planet just a few billion years ago right under our noses. People will tell you otherwise, but we don't have a clue as to what life is or how it got started. Until these basic questions about the origins of life on our own planet are answered I think we're getting way ahead of ourselves by believing in aliens. Little green men or tall gray men, I have to see one to believe in them. Dos mas pesos, Phil Whitmer Nota bene: Of course I could be completely wrong and Dr. Edgar Mitchell could be completely right! __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space?
Alien life discussion is interesting, but, this is what our cities look like from space: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/5973258/Cities-at-night-from-space-photographed-by-NASA-astronauts-on-the-International-Space-Station.html Looks like mold. Our planet is rotting! Steve Schoner IMCA #447m Shop save on the supplements you want. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdohpFmlD1bl8g9IAEv8JJcrpp8m0eXTSNn09eRf1SYg1yffvBiQzG/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Six Year Old finds meteorite? UGH!
Steve and List, We have since 2002 or so been bombarded with false news reports about meteorites being seen to fall, hitting houses and people and etc. Here is a link to the 2002 case: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/2218755.stm If anyone would like to keep current with the Worldwide Meteor/Meteorite Mews (TM), most daily or more, either add yourself as a follower to the weblog or sign up for RSS feed from the weblog page. Followers and RSS provides subscribers to get the first published version of any post as soon as the post is made on the site. OR continue to check the weblog anytime you wish. Worldwide Meteor/Meteorite News: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/2009_08_01_archive.html Thank you! Dirk Ross..Tokyo --- On Tue, 8/25/09, Steve Schoner scho...@mybluelight.com wrote: From: Steve Schoner scho...@mybluelight.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Six Year Old finds meteorite? UGH! To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 10:56 PM I just saw this this morning. What a bunch of rubbish. More to confuse the un-informed, with Ebay prices to boot! http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/6063717/Six-year-old-boy-finds-meteorite-in-his-garden.html Tell me, does that look like a meteorite? Don't think so. Steve Schoner Wanna lose weight? Weight Loss Programs that work. Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdf49oZzsomQxR9Jlh6iyk9EnSWRRmqPGGHNXmwEApf4EIP0tPM8K0/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space?
Steve, Your observation is not far from the truth. Large areas of native untouched lands are daily destroyed to build houses and other needless constructions worldwide. The human worldwide population is far beyond what the Earth safely can support and Earth is faced with a very virulent form of life that is life threatening for 99% of all life on the planet- minus the bacteria, molds, and a number of other human resistant life forms. The most destructive and dangerous lifeform on Earth- humans! Best, Dirk...Tokyo --- On Tue, 8/25/09, Steve Schoner scho...@mybluelight.com wrote: From: Steve Schoner scho...@mybluelight.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space? To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 11:20 PM Alien life discussion is interesting, but, this is what our cities look like from space: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/5973258/Cities-at-night-from-space-photographed-by-NASA-astronauts-on-the-International-Space-Station.html Looks like mold. Our planet is rotting! Steve Schoner IMCA #447m Shop save on the supplements you want. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdohpFmlD1bl8g9IAEv8JJcrpp8m0eXTSNn09eRf1SYg1yffvBiQzG/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] On the other hand...
Do not try and bend the spoon. That's impossible. Instead... only try to realize the truth. There is no spoon. Then you'll see, that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself. On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 4:05 AM, Meteorites USAe...@meteoritesusa.com wrote: :) Like I said it's endless... I guess I'm not smart enough to figure out if we're really real or not, but that's not really what I care about. I care about knowledge. That's what I seek in my never ending quest for understanding. Now regardless of the reality of our own existence, knowledge is real. We are conscious, aware, and we think? Someone said that already though didn't they, a guy that was probably way smarter than me. A quick search and I realize it was Rene Descartes that said it first. Matter does exist, or rather we perceive the effects of matter to be measurable. Even if it is only in our minds. We see it, touch it, feel it, experience it, mold it, form it, and in some cases are controlled by it and surrounded by it. Does it matter? ;) Yes. because if matter isn't real, then your argument is moot. And if your argument is moot, then it doesn't matter, because our perception of the effects of matter is one that not only makes it exist, but makes it measurable. Does that make sense? Our own senses and the observable effects that our brains control tells me that when I drop that meteorite on my foot it's gonna hurt. And it would in fact cause measurable physical damage. Which is an effect we perceive. We do in fact think, Therefore our own thoughts are our proof that we exist. If you perceive something to be real, it is... Even if only in your own mind. Does this mean we're all having one mass hallucination? ;) Regards, Eric Rob Matson wrote: ... there is no way for you to prove that I exist or you exist, or anything that you experience is real. You might want to try a modern, meteoritical spin on the rhetorical approach taken by Samuel Johnson in the 18th century, when he responded to Bishop Berkeley's claim that matter doesn't exist, but only ~seems~ to. Just drop a 10-kilo Campo on your foot from a height of one meter and proudly announce, I refute it thus! (and then have someone take you to the hospital) ;-) --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space?
Dear Dirk, and List; I'd like to share a revelation that I've had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species. I've realized that you are not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment. But you humans do not. You move to an area and you multiply and multiply until every natural resource is consumed and the only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet. You are a plague. And we are... the cure. ...Agent Smith: The Matrix Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 07:42:33 -0700 From: drtan...@yahoo.com To: scho...@mybluelight.com; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space? Steve, Your observation is not far from the truth. Large areas of native untouched lands are daily destroyed to build houses and other needless constructions worldwide. The human worldwide population is far beyond what the Earth safely can support and Earth is faced with a very virulent form of life that is life threatening for 99% of all life on the planet- minus the bacteria, molds, and a number of other human resistant life forms. The most destructive and dangerous lifeform on Earth- humans! Best, Dirk...Tokyo --- On Tue, 8/25/09, Steve Schoner wrote: From: Steve Schoner Subject: [meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space? To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 11:20 PM Alien life discussion is interesting, but, this is what our cities look like from space: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/5973258/Cities-at-night-from-space-photographed-by-NASA-astronauts-on-the-International-Space-Station.html Looks like mold. Our planet is rotting! Steve Schoner IMCA #447m Shop save on the supplements you want. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdohpFmlD1bl8g9IAEv8JJcrpp8m0eXTSNn09eRf1SYg1yffvBiQzG/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list _ Send and receive email from all of your webmail accounts. http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9671356 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] On the other hand...
Hola Eric, Rob, Like I said it's endless... I guess I'm not smart enough to figure out if we're really real or not, but that's not really what I care about. I care about knowledge. That's what I seek in my never ending quest for understanding. Pfft - it's just being able to stand back - and being willing to look at things from a different angle. Props for the knowledge bit though; not everyone's willing to say that. Now regardless of the reality of our own existence, knowledge is real. If you're going to *assume* that to be true to back up your argument that we're real, then you're just using circular reasoning. If we're assuming that matter can't be proven real, and knowledge is a construct of non-real material minds, then there really is nothing to say that knowledge is the least bit real. See Rob's analogy where he references The Matrix. We are conscious, aware, and we think? Someone said that already though didn't they, a guy that was probably way smarter than me. A quick search and I realize it was Rene Descartes that said it first. Matter does exist, or rather we perceive the effects of matter to be measurable. Even if it is only in our minds. We see it, touch it, feel it, experience it, mold it, form it, and in some cases are controlled by it and surrounded by it. Does it matter? ;) Yes. because if matter isn't real, then your argument is moot. And if your argument is moot, then it doesn't matter, because our perception of the effects of matter is one that not only makes it exist, but makes it measurable. Does that make sense? I thought Rob's main point was that there's no proving that matter exists. What you seem to be saying is that from a perceptual point of view, the question is irrelevant, because we observe matter and because our observations of matter makes it measurable. Not sure exactly what you mean there, but I'm assuming that you're talking about the perceived regularity in the behavior of matter we can observe...? This is nothing more than a philosophical argument, though. Yes, for all intensive purposes, for humanity's sake, we should probably assume that the observable universe is, in fact, real. But you do note above that you care about knowledge. If that is true, you should detest Descartes' point of view on the matter, because he's willing to say I don't know - and look - it doesn't matter! If your true goal is knowledge, Descartes, at least in this case, is your enemy. Our own senses and the observable effects that our brains control tells me that when I drop that meteorite on my foot it's gonna hurt. And it would in fact cause measurable physical damage. Which is an effect we perceive. We do in fact think, Therefore our own thoughts are our proof that we exist. No. You're misinterpreting Descartes, if you did state his argument clearly - from what you said, his point would suggest not that the foot or the meteorite were actually real, but rather that the effect of one upon the other would relegate the argument either way as irrelevant - especially to whomever the foot belongs. Descartes' point pretty much says that there's no reason to question existence, because...well, you can stand there asking yourself if the mangled foot is real, or you can just assume it is and go to the hospital. A logical point of view, but not one than answers the question of existence. If you perceive something to be real, it is... Even if only in your own mind. Right. Even if only in your own mind. I think we've all been lied to at one point or another by another person after all, never mind by the misconceptions of the entire human race... Does this mean we're all having one mass hallucination? ;) Well, exactly... Best, Jason Regards, Eric Rob Matson wrote: ... there is no way for you to prove that I exist or you exist, or anything that you experience is real. You might want to try a modern, meteoritical spin on the rhetorical approach taken by Samuel Johnson in the 18th century, when he responded to Bishop Berkeley's claim that matter doesn't exist, but only ~seems~ to. Just drop a 10-kilo Campo on your foot from a height of one meter and proudly announce, I refute it thus! (and then have someone take you to the hospital) ;-) --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Phil, Little green men or tall gray men, I have to see one to believe in them. Here is the evidence you seek: http://www.mikesastrophotos.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/steve-arnold-with-alien.jpg I hope that clears things up for you. Mike Hankey http://www.mikesastrophotos.com On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 1:24 AM, Phil Whitmerprairiecac...@rtcol.com wrote: To all listees pondering the Eternal Verities: Just because the Universe is really big is not an argument that there is Life out there. The Ocean is really big, but that's not an argument for the existence of a Loch Ness monster or any other species of pleisosaur. I have to actually see a unicorn before I'll believe that they exist. I'm Old School, I have to actually see a visible light photograph of just one of these supposed googols of Earth like planets. All I've heard is pure speculation, forumulae, projections of our loneliness, (there has to be someone out there!) extrapolations, computer models, mathematical probabilities, etc. Still waiting on the evidence! Not proof, just a simple tiny shred of evidence. One simple SOS in Morse Code on any one of the billions and billions of channels monitered by Seti. One peer reviewed, in focus, well lit, properly exposed photograph of an actual flying saucer. One little tiny fossil in a meteorite. Anything! Closer to home, I'm still waiting for anything at all from the Mars probes. Just one incontrovertible shred of evidence where all the scientists go: Yes, there's life on Mars! Until I see this evidence I have to conclude that on the closest planet that was once very Earth like, there is no sign of life. If we can't even find it on Mars, which should have been teeming with life, which should have left tons of evidence which should have been found by now, then I must conclude that the Universe is a vast lifeless place. The only life that I can verify by empirical evidence is right here on this planet. You can do all the thought experiments you want, in your imagination you can populate the entire vast Universe with bacteria, or Star Trek/Star Wars like critters, whatever you like, it's all pure speculation. All that we know for sure is that is Life here on Earth. Plenty of it. The problem is nobody knows where it came from. Nobody is really sure even what it is. Can someone tell me what the Life Force is that differentiates living things from inanimate objects? Is it Chi?, Ki? Prana? What the heck is it? Did it originate here on Earth. (I think it did.) If it did, then how did that first coacervate of organic molecules become alive in the first place? How did it know how to assemble a strand of self replicating RNA? At exactly what point did the Life Force enter this assemblage of non living stuff? Don't even get me started on the Miracle of Intelligence/Consciousness! As if anyone knows what that little voice in your head is! This should be pretty simple stuff to figure out, even for a young, dumb species like homo sapiens. After all, it happened right here on our home planet just a few billion years ago right under our noses. People will tell you otherwise, but we don't have a clue as to what life is or how it got started. Until these basic questions about the origins of life on our own planet are answered I think we're getting way ahead of ourselves by believing in aliens. Little green men or tall gray men, I have to see one to believe in them. Dos mas pesos, Phil Whitmer Nota bene: Of course I could be completely wrong and Dr. Edgar Mitchell could be completely right! __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] To Answer Steve's Question
Hola All, I've seen a few examples, and one is viewable online (it's for sale, oddly enough) on Marcin's Gao page: http://www.gao-guenie.com/gao_oriented.htm If you scroll down a bit, it's on the right side - it's hard to miss the HOLE note in the photograph - click for better pics. It looks like the thick fusion crust on the trailing edge of the stone formed a natural bridge between two protuberances. Regards, Jason On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 9:20 PM, meteorh...@aol.com wrote: Dr. King had a Nuevo Mercurio in his collection, about 25 grams in size, that had a hole in it. It was fully crusted, and the hole was big enough to run a fishing line through. Steve Arnold of Meteorite Men In a message dated 8/22/2009 10:04:45 P.M. Central Daylight Time, anitawestl...@att.net writes: Dear List: I think it would be helpful if someone not only answered Steve's question, but provided proof of the holiness of non-iron rocks. I hope this helps, Anita __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Mike: OK, now I believe in the tall gray men from outer space men, now prove to me the existence of little green men! LOL, Phil __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: Reality, Perception, Finiteness of Universe
Hu---Do I hear the faint echoes of a seventeenth century discussion where Descartes replies, I think, therefore, I am. -- From: Rob Matson mojave_meteori...@cox.net Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 2:54 AM To: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com; Matson, Robert D. robert.d.mat...@saic.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] OT: Reality, Perception, Finiteness of Universe Hi Eric, We're not talking about certainty. You certainly exist physically. Philosophy is not certainty. Much as I'd like to agree with you, there is no way for you to prove that I exist or you exist, or anything that you experience is real. That is the nature of philosophical introspection; the realization that you may not be able to trust your own senses. For instance, I would imagine you saw The Matrix. Suppose everything you see, hear, smell, taste, feel and think is simply illusion. Your first response might be, That's ridiculous! I can read the words you've typed, I can feel the keys of my keyboard, I can hear the whirr of the disk drive, smell dinner cooking, etc. But if you're really honest with yourself, you'll come to the perhaps unsettling realization that you can't prove ANY of it is real. ~Intellectually~ you reason that you are made up of billions of cells, that these cells are themselves constructed of various molecules, that the molecules can be broken down into atoms, the atoms into subatomic particles, and so on. But what are the fundamental building blocks of matter? They are really nothing more than a set of mathematical constructs invented by humans that try to match the reality that they observe. Again, very suspect, and not surprisingly our macroscopic notions of reality do not work so well in the realm of the very small. If you really want to get a reality check (pun intended), read up on Bell's Theorem, and the various experiments that show Bell's inequalities are violated, quantum mechanics is correct, and therefore the notion of local realism is disproven. But I'm getting off the subject a bit... Earlier I wrote: ...The universe is large (not to mention growing), but it is nevertheless finite... You replied: Really? Is there proof of its limited scope? If you ascribe to the Big Bang Theory, then the Universe is finite by definition. We can only see so far... Every few years we can see further. But what you may not know (don't feel bad, most people don't) is that the Universe is expanding at a rate considerably faster than the speed of light, and therefore the fraction of the total Universe that we can observe is getting smaller and smaller with time. There will reach a time in the distant future where we can only see our local cluster of galaxies -- the rest of the Universe will be closed off to us forever. Best, Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted
Phil, Here is the proof you are looking for: http://www.mikesastrophotos.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/proof-aliens-exist.jpg Mike Hankey http://www.mikesastrophotos.com On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Phil Whitmerprairiecac...@rtcol.com wrote: Mike: OK, now I believe in the tall gray men from outer space men, now prove to me the existence of little green men! LOL, Phil __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Alien Contact Predicted-- books
I've recently been downloading science books from a huge number available on a web site (http://avaxhome.ws/ebooks/science_books) and have picked out some that are either directly about the possibilities of extraterrestrial life (both pro and con) or are about exoplanets in general. I've archived them together here: http://www.sendspace.com/file/dyap00 Of course, you probably won't want to read whole books from your computer screen, but these can give you a sampling for what you can look for in a book store or library (toss a few coins the author's way, I'm sure they need it.) List of books in the archive: A Decade of Extrasolar Planets Around Normal Stars Exoplanets- Detection, Formation, Properties, Habitability Extrasolar Planets - Formation, Detection and Dynamics Extrasolar Planets Fitness of the Cosmos for Life Habitable Planets for Man If the Universe is Teeming With Aliens Where Is Everybody? Just 6 Numbers-- the Forces that Shape the Universe Life Everywhere Life in the Universe Lonely Planets-- The Natural Philosophy of Alien Life Prebiotic Evolution and Astrobiology Rare Earth-- Why Complex Life is Uncommon in the Universe Terraforming-- the Creating of Habitible Worlds The Crowded Universe-The Search for Living Planets The New Worlds Extrasolar Planets The Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence The Search for Life Continued __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] test
test _ Hotmail® is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HYGN_faster:082009 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD - Libyan Desert Glass ending in 1hr on Ebay
Dear List, I have a few very nice GEM quality LDG on E-Bay right now, still at low bids. Ending in about 1hr. Also 1cm scale cubes still available. Have a look if interested. Thank you and have a great day. Thomas www.sahara-gems.com http://stores.shop.ebay.com/SAHARAGEMS-DESERT-STONES-AND-MORE__W0QQ_armrsZ1 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Alien life? or Fungus from space? Or VIRAL HUMANITY?
Interesting perspective. I always thought it looked rather like bacteria growth in a petri dish. Kinda sad really. Maybe you're right. Maybe we are parasites on the earth. Using up Earth's natural resources, devouring the planet, and chewing up the growth media that is the land. When we're finished maybe we'll start to devour ourselves, notwithstanding we might even destroy ourselves completely with fire by war as the disease of humanity spreads forth across the Earth. Hmmm... Ok maybe that's a little melodramatic and over the top, but when viewed from space and outside our little bubble of Earth, it's certainly easy to see we're having a great impact on our planet. What if these aliens we we're talking about are way more technologically advanced by millions of years of adaptation and genetic engineering enough to have evolved their thought processes to see early human, or humanoid life as threats to developing planets? If extra terrestrial life exists and they are much more technologically and intellectually advanced than us, we might be in trouble if they ever come visit. What if we are the virus that infests the living cells of the universe called planets? I've seen video animations or simulations of what our universe looks like from the outside as the camera slowly zooms out from our planet showing first our system, then other systems, then our own galaxy, galaxy clusters, and large dark voids between clusters, and finally what seem to be pathways between these super clusters of galaxies which are not unlike the neural pathways in our own brains. Are we merely a virus, living on a brain cell of a larger living organism? Gives a new perspective on Rob's earlier comment that our reality isn't really real. Maybe it's just relative... Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA Steve Schoner wrote: Alien life discussion is interesting, but, this is what our cities look like from space: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/5973258/Cities-at-night-from-space-photographed-by-NASA-astronauts-on-the-International-Space-Station.html Looks like mold. Our planet is rotting! Steve Schoner IMCA #447m Shop save on the supplements you want. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdohpFmlD1bl8g9IAEv8JJcrpp8m0eXTSNn09eRf1SYg1yffvBiQzG/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD - Meteorite Book Magazine Lot - Entire 2008 Year of Meteorite, plus Meteorite Craters, MAPS.
Hi Folks! This is a one-time deal. I am cleaning out my meteorite bookshelves and have put together this lot of books and magazines. Each item is in excellent to near-mint condition with only minor shelf wear. Items included in this lot : 1) All four (4) issues of Meteorite Magazine from 2008.If you missed out on last year's issues, here is your chance to catch up. There is some great stuff in these magazines - too many articles and highlights to list here. 2) 1987 UK-Hardcover edition of Kathleen Mark's Meteorite Craters - I've always preferred this old vintage-type cover art compared to the newer editions that have a stock photo of Meteor Crater on them. This book is crisp, tight and clean - with only a couple of minor bends on the dustjackets. 3) MAPS Journal from June 2009. This is the official journal of the Meteoritical Society and it contains the latest papers on all things meteoritical. Here is your chance to get a copy of this journal if you are not a member. NOTE - the price for this lot includes FREE PRIORITY SHIPPING TO ANYWHERE IN THE CONUS OR CANADA. Shipping to Europe or other Overseas destinations will extra - contact me for a quote. To see photos, see this link - http://www.galactic-stone.com/product/0/Meteorite-Magazine-Book-Lot--MUST-SEE_960653.html I will also include a free book on rock tumbling if the buyer wants it. Thanks for looking! MikeG PS - NOTE, store coupon-codes do NOT apply to this lot. -- . Michael Gilmer (Florida, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Personal Site - http://www.glassthrower.com FaceBook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale Twitter - Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone eBay - http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/maypickle .. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] nwa 482 for trade
Hi all.I have a .164 gram part slice of NWA 482 lunar for trade.I am either looking for a slice of nwa 1109,a nice size taza or a slice of estherville.Please off list. Steve R. Arnold, Chicago!! __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Viral Humanity, Insignificant Denial. Evolution of Thought Knowledge
Hi everyone, A Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zr7wNQw12l8 Though I disagree with the narrators obvious bias of capable human understanding, I think I can look past that and view the universe for what it is, and what we are to the universe in scale, both in size and time. We are in fact minuscule and insignificant when compared to the vastness of our known universe. Our lives, averaging only 70-80 years long, would not show so much leas a blip on the plotted timeline of our galaxy alone, much less the the entire universe. Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? Do most people realize that when they look out at night and see the stars we love so much that they are looking Back in Time? Stars are literally a window to our past, and the door to the future. Granted, our argument for contact with alien life usually is accompanied by the assumptive prediction that it might be more technologically advanced than us... but what about something more close to home. We're here! We do exist (aside from philosophy). And our universe is real. and huge. How the hell can someone actually believe that we are the only living intelligent beings capable of technological advancement? That seems right along the understanding and wave length of the 13 and 14th century explorers who thought the world was flat, and the fact that we thought the Sun revolved around us, or ancient beliefs that the stars were gods! Our understanding is growing everyday. The size of the universe and our part in it is not fully understood. Yet... Our insignificance is only outweighed by our ignorance. Though some might argue that it's our arrogant assumption of significance that dictates our understanding. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA P.S. I think I'm all philosphied out right now... ;) Meteorites USA wrote: Interesting perspective. I always thought it looked rather like bacteria growth in a petri dish. Kinda sad really. Maybe you're right. Maybe we are parasites on the earth. Using up Earth's natural resources, devouring the planet, and chewing up the growth media that is the land. When we're finished maybe we'll start to devour ourselves, notwithstanding we might even destroy ourselves completely with fire by war as the disease of humanity spreads forth across the Earth. Hmmm... Ok maybe that's a little melodramatic and over the top, but when viewed from space and outside our little bubble of Earth, it's certainly easy to see we're having a great impact on our planet. What if these aliens we we're talking about are way more technologically advanced by millions of years of adaptation and genetic engineering enough to have evolved their thought processes to see early human, or humanoid life as threats to developing planets? If extra terrestrial life exists and they are much more technologically and intellectually advanced than us, we might be in trouble if they ever come visit. What if we are the virus that infests the living cells of the universe called planets? I've seen video animations or simulations of what our universe looks like from the outside as the camera slowly zooms out from our planet showing first our system, then other systems, then our own galaxy, galaxy clusters, and large dark voids between clusters, and finally what seem to be pathways between these super clusters of galaxies which are not unlike the neural pathways in our own brains. Are we merely a virus, living on a brain cell of a larger living organism? Gives a new perspective on Rob's earlier comment that our reality isn't really real. Maybe it's just relative... Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA Steve Schoner wrote: Alien life discussion is interesting, but, this is what our cities look like from space: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/5973258/Cities-at-night-from-space-photographed-by-NASA-astronauts-on-the-International-Space-Station.html Looks like mold. Our planet is rotting! Steve Schoner IMCA #447m Shop save on the supplements you want. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/BLSrjpdohpFmlD1bl8g9IAEv8JJcrpp8m0eXTSNn09eRf1SYg1yffvBiQzG/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Re: [meteorite-list] Have a Gut Feeling
Interesting, it would be great if they were, but I got the impression that none of the 'professional' meteorite hunters wanted to look for this one as the terrain was too difficult / the chances of recovery were too slim. All of the people you mention with the exception of farmer have pretty much told me they aren't interested unless something dramatically changes. On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 3:17 PM, geo...@aol.com wrote: Hello everyone...I got this gut feeling that several of our list members are out in Pennsylvania looking for a Mason/Dixon meteorite or two. Little tidbits embedded(and not embedded) in various emails seems to point that way to me. I'm just guessing, but I think Steve Arnold of Meteorite Men and Geoff Notkin might be there as well as Mike Farmer. It seems that Eric Wichman was there, but is back. Perhaps Reuben is there too? Anyhow...I could be off, but the guessing is fun. Good Luck :O) GeoZay __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Have a Gut Feeling
Interesting, it would be great if they were, but I got the impression that none of the 'professional' meteorite hunters wanted to look for this one as the terrain was too difficult / the chances of recovery were too slim. All of the people you mention with the exception of farmer have pretty much told me they aren't interested unless something dramatically changes. Well...there goes that hunch. :O) What thru me off was a posting by you leading to a photo showing an alien image in the bushes with what looked like Steve Arnold (meteorite Men) in the foreground...with who I assumed was you, looking at a map. Then someone asked if they had seen you and Mike Farmer in the same room to note their simularities...which got me to thinking that perhaps you guys were indeed seen together. As for everyone else...pure speculation. :O) As for the difficult terrain to look for a meteorite...I thought the possible recovery area was suppose to be in Amish corn fields? Oh well... GeoZay __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fw: Meteorite fell in front of children
Hi Dirk, Just glad to see that you have posted this little cute story at your news weblog :-) Just a remark, the text in the last paragraph reflects my own personal opinion, after having looking closer at the picture of the meteorite. Anyway, I will post any additional information to this story on the list. Now to some other Scottish whiskies that can be used to facilitate the prononciation of Finnish - samic words. I can warmly reccomend this two (and they are also easy to prononce!!): Glenrothes 72 (bottled march 29, 2004, Signatory Vintage) Rosebank 90 (Duncan Taylor Co) Happy hunting! Thomas - Original Message - From: drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com To: Thomas Österberg marie.m.osterb...@telia.com Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 4:11 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite fell in front of children Dear Thomas, Thank you for your report! I have posted it to the meteor/meteorite news weblog and given you credit. I added a title so if not correct please advise- Kinder Fabel- Molly des??? Beasthund und Meteoriten Best Always in LIFE, Dirk...Tokyo --- On Mon, 8/24/09, Thomas Österberg marie.m.osterb...@telia.com wrote: From: Thomas Österberg marie.m.osterb...@telia.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite fell in front of children To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Monday, August 24, 2009, 3:43 AM Dear Listoids, It looks like the dog Hopper now has got a competitor, living in southern Sweden! Her name is Molly. According to the newspaper Sydsvenska Dagbladet, a meteorite fell down in front of a group of cildren (and the dog Molly) last week, just outside the small village St.Olof, situated in the Swedish provice of Scania, about 100 km east of Copenhagen. Heres a link to the article: http://sydsvenskan.se/sverige/article538923/Barn-nara-att-traffas-av-mystisk-flygande-sten.html I have tried to translate the text content to English. The children Villmaron Andreasson 9, Linn-Klara Andreasdaughter 7, Ebba Larsson 8, and Vinga Andreasdaughter 11, was out and went with the family dogs in the grove behind Sankt Olof (in the province of Scania, southernmost Sweden). It said schwiss, said Villmaron and shows with his arms how fast the stone damp down, just a few meters in front of them. It was like smoke. When the stone hit the ground, dust and smoke swirled up. Villmaron first thought it was a branch that had fallen down, but the dog Molly, that first got very scared, finally took courage, and sniffed her way to the stone, situated in a hole a few inches down. It was Molly who found it! The stone is very black and full of holes. Looks like it was burnt of fire, says Villmaron. It almost looks like a piece of petrified lava says Villmarons father Andreas Johansson. The children immediately took the stone with them and run home. They were very excited, says their mother Maja Larsson. They talked in mouth of each other and told their parents that the rock fell from the sky with a high velocity and how the gravel had whirled up and how scared the dog had been. Then the kids run on to Grandma and Grandpa living in the same village, in order to show them the stone too. When the children had left, their mother Maja started to brood. First after a while it went up for me how lucky the children had been. Imagine if anybody of them had been hit by the stone? It could have gone really bad. The first I found out to do was to call Ystads Allehanda (a local newspaper) says Maja laughing. Is it really a meteorite? Well the family is convinced that it is! At the official web site of the National Museum of Natural History in Stockholm, we learn that a meteorite will be magnetic. Maja ties a refrigerator magnet to a sewing thread and holds the magnet next to the stone. The magnet attracts directly to the stone. The shape and colour also corresponds to the description of a meteorite at the National Museum web site. Can it be of any worth wonder Maja tactfully? But she rapidly concludes that this issue is not important. The stone will be framed and hanged up on the wall, as a memory of an exceptionally event. First the stone will be sent to the Swedish Museum of Natural History for identification. If it's turns up to is genuine meteorite the story will be even better! The picture of the stone makes me a little bit suspicious. Has some similarities to a piece of slag. Happy hunting. Thomas Österberg __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Have a Gut Feeling
the picture of steve was from 2 days after the fall. He was out along with a bunch of other people the first week, but everyone threw in the towel after about 10 days. as for the difficult terrain, its certainly not Antarctica or Iraq, but have you ever tried looking for meteorites inside corn fields? according to the guys I've talked to there are better/easier places to find meteorites (like the desert) On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 3:32 PM, geo...@aol.com wrote: Interesting, it would be great if they were, but I got the impression that none of the 'professional' meteorite hunters wanted to look for this one as the terrain was too difficult / the chances of recovery were too slim. All of the people you mention with the exception of farmer have pretty much told me they aren't interested unless something dramatically changes. Well...there goes that hunch. :O) What thru me off was a posting by you leading to a photo showing an alien image in the bushes with what looked like Steve Arnold (meteorite Men) in the foreground...with who I assumed was you, looking at a map. Then someone asked if they had seen you and Mike Farmer in the same room to note their simularities...which got me to thinking that perhaps you guys were indeed seen together. As for everyone else...pure speculation. :O) As for the difficult terrain to look for a meteorite...I thought the possible recovery area was suppose to be in Amish corn fields? Oh well... GeoZay __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Have a Gut Feeling
the picture of steve was from 2 days after the fall. He was out along with a bunch of other people the first week, but everyone threw in the towel after about 10 days. Oh that was Steve...Hopefully no one got abducted and experimented on. :O) as for the difficult terrain, its certainly not Antarctica or Iraq, but have you ever tried looking for meteorites inside corn fields? Can't say I have...but I'd think it would be easier than in the mountains. according to the guys I've talked to there are better/easier places to find meteorites (like the desert) Probably right. Too bad I wasn't into meteorite hunting when I lived near the desert. GeoZay __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] 30-Pound Meteorite Stolen
This seems odd: A 30 Lb Iron meteorite valued at $2,200; that's only 16 cents per gram. In any case, I hope it gets found. Greg S. http://www.courant.com/news/connecticut/hc-web-montville-meteor-0826aug26,0,1462776.story MONTVILLE — - A meteorite has been stolen from The Dinosaur Place's gift shop. Workers at the business, a nature activity center with a retail store, noticed on Monday that the 30-pound chunk of nickel and iron was missing, state police said today. The meteorite is valued at $2,200 and is believed to have been taken Friday or Saturday, said Sgt. Chris Johnson, state police spokesman. The Dinosaur Place, also called Nature's Art, has family-style programs involving rocks, minerals and life-size replicas of dinosaurs. They have gem and fossil digs, host children's birthday parties and sell everything from jewelry to fossilized dinosaur dung. Roger Phillips, who owns the business with his wife, Linda, said toys and other items have been shoplifted in the past, but the Phillips don't usually report them. This is different. How many times do you have an object from outer space missing? Phillips said Tuesday. Phillips thinks a customer walked off with the meteorite during business hours; there was no sign of a break-in. He's been looking through surveillance videos to try to determine who stole the meteorite, which had been found in Argentina. It is the size of a cantaloupe and is black with a bit of a metallic shine, he said. Something like this is unusual because of its weight, he said. Of course, we wonder, how did they get it out of the store? He doesn't think this is a case of employee theft; there are much more valuable things at the center, including a dinosaur tusk valued at more than $20,000 and a 100-pound meteorite valued at $7,500. Of course, they'd be even more challenging to steal. He doesn't think the thief stole it for a quick buck. He suspects the person took the meteorite for a private collection. Would you tell the person who took it we would like it back? he said. Anyone who sees the meteorite is asked to call the Troop E barracks of the state police at 860-848-6500. Copyright © 2009, The Hartford Courant _ With Windows Live, you can organize, edit, and share your photos. http://www.windowslive.com/Desktop/PhotoGallery __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] 30-Pound Meteorite Stolen
He's been looking through surveillance videos to try to determine who stole the meteorite, which had been found in Argentina. It is the size of a cantaloupe and is black with a bit of a metallic shine, he said. Look for a young person leaning over, that walks with a hobble. GeoZay __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Thanks... Tweet Tweet!
Hi listees and all my philosopher friends, I'm really philosophied out right now. My brain hurts from thinking too much. I'd like to send out a BIG THANK YOU to all of you who've given their feedback on both my alien questions, and the new Spacifieds.com website which was created with you guys in mind. As kind of an even larger thank you I wanted to further the fast growth of the site by offering something I know all you dealers out there will appreciate very much. You buyers, collectors and lurkers should check it out too... A FREE LINK! I want to give you a free link on the Spacifieds.com blogroll. The site is growing at a rapid rate, and everyone knows the more items listed the more buyers, collectors and visitors it will garner. All you have to do is post free ad listings for your items for sale or trade. Post 10 minimum listings, preferably 20 or more, but 10 is good, and I'll put a link to your site on the blogroll. This is a permanent link! It is displayed on every page of the website in the right sidebar and gives you great exposure! You can view the blogroll here: http://www.spacifieds.com I've also added some features and have taken the advice you guys have been so kind to provide via private emails. I've adjusted the look and feel somewhat too. One very cool feature I've added is an Auto-Tweet. Now every ad posted to Spacifieds.com gets posted to my Twitter page AUTOMATICALLY! It also provides a DIRECT link back to your ad listing. This means your ad listings gets a HUGE boost of traffic and visits for every ad listed, not just your ad. The more ads you post , the more visitors will automatically visit the site! You don't have to do anything other than post your ad listing to get traffic to your ad. In addition I've added a VERY powerful marketing tool to each ad listing. Each new ad listing posted now has a ReTweet button. This allows site visitors to Tweet directly to their Twitter accounts automatically without having to fill out any forms. It only takes two clicks and your ad is seen by hundreds and thousands of visitors depending on who Tweets your ad. This feature alone is hugely powerful word of mouth advertising. You can even ReTweet your own ad listings if you are on Twitter too. Let's keep this growth moving! There's over 30+ meteorite ad listings already from a number of very reputable dealers, check it... List it. It's free and it's easy. Now go post your free listings... Thanks everyone... Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA www.spacifieds.com P.S. Don't forget the Free Meteorite Contest is still running! http://www.spacifieds.com/meteorites/free-meteorite-contest-post-ads-win-details/ __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Blocking Google Ads on Meteorite Sites
Hi Folks, I notice that Google ads are becoming more widespread and intrusive. Google and other advertising servers have gotten wise to Ad-Blocker software, so now they are embedding text advertising links into sneaky spots inside the body of a webpage - effectively eluding many Ad-Blocker programs who primarily block graphical banners. I found an *easy* solution to this problem, that wipes out the ads without the need to download or install any software. I know some vendors on this List are currently using Google Ads - and I they have every right to. I do not begrudge them that. Hopefully they respect my desire not to see the ads. If anyone on this List would like to learn this easy fix, simply email me off-list at meteoritem...@gmail.com. This fix is easy, legal, and does not involve any form of coding, downloads, or software. I use an Ad-Blocker plug-in for FireFox that works for the majority of graphic ad banners, but it doesn't remove the sneaky Google text ads. This new fix that I found on the web takes care of the text ads as well. I don't want to share it openly on the List because I understand that some other List members use Google Ads as a source of revenue. So contact me offlist. Best regards and clear skies, MikeG -- . Michael Gilmer (Florida, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Personal Site - http://www.glassthrower.com FaceBook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale Twitter - Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone eBay - http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/maypickle .. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information
Meteorite hunters banished from Burke By Elizabeth Billips lizbill...@yahoo.com The two meteorite hunters caught trespassing in Burke County won't be coming back. They've been banished. In state court last Wednesday morning, Las Vegas meteorite hunter Ralph Sonny Clary Jr., 49, and ... http://www.thetruecitizen.com/news/2009/0408/for_the_record/032.html __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information
And why is this being RE-posted? Rehtorical question of course... Old news such as this, needn't be rehashed. I'm sure everyone on here is very aware of it and In my opinion it's disrespectful to those involved in my opinion to repost it. Regards, Eric drtanuki wrote: Meteorite hunters banished from Burke By Elizabeth Billips lizbill...@yahoo.com The two meteorite hunters caught trespassing in Burke County won't be coming back. They've been banished. In state court last Wednesday morning, Las Vegas meteorite hunter Ralph Sonny Clary Jr., 49, and ... LINK REMOVED __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information
Eric and List, It was being re-posted because new information came to light about the circumstances of Sonny Clary and Millers arrest. It was posted on this list that the law, Court and Judge in the State of Georgia were somehow unfair. And previously it was hinted that the old lady was some gun-toting old hag. Please read this new article that has not been posted and you will see that: ...While the pair was originally charged with only one misdemeanor count each, another charge was added after they admitted going onto the property two days in a row ...returned the next day with materials to construct a foot bridge... ...it was the landowner who kept them out of prison uniforms How many of you would appreciate to have someone visiting your backyard or property and then trying to construct a foot bridge? The old lady saved their butts in the end from a prison cell; they should be grateful that the judge was generous. Best, Dirk Ross...Tokyo --- On Wed, 8/26/09, Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com wrote: From: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information To: drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 10:00 AM And why is this being RE-posted? Rehtorical question of course... Old news such as this, needn't be rehashed. I'm sure everyone on here is very aware of it and In my opinion it's disrespectful to those involved in my opinion to repost it. Regards, Eric drtanuki wrote: Meteorite hunters banished from Burke By Elizabeth Billips lizbill...@yahoo.com The two meteorite hunters caught trespassing in Burke County won't be coming back. They've been banished. In state court last Wednesday morning, Las Vegas meteorite hunter Ralph Sonny Clary Jr., 49, and ... LINK REMOVED __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information
Hi Dirk and List, Respectfully, this article is dated April 2009. I recall reading a similar article months ago that contained the same new information about the foot-bridge allegation, return to the land on consecutive days, etc. This is not new information. Best regards, MikeG On 8/25/09, drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com wrote: Eric and List, It was being re-posted because new information came to light about the circumstances of Sonny Clary and Millers arrest. It was posted on this list that the law, Court and Judge in the State of Georgia were somehow unfair. And previously it was hinted that the old lady was some gun-toting old hag. Please read this new article that has not been posted and you will see that: ...While the pair was originally charged with only one misdemeanor count each, another charge was added after they admitted going onto the property two days in a row ...returned the next day with materials to construct a foot bridge... ...it was the landowner who kept them out of prison uniforms How many of you would appreciate to have someone visiting your backyard or property and then trying to construct a foot bridge? The old lady saved their butts in the end from a prison cell; they should be grateful that the judge was generous. Best, Dirk Ross...Tokyo --- On Wed, 8/26/09, Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com wrote: From: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information To: drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 10:00 AM And why is this being RE-posted? Rehtorical question of course... Old news such as this, needn't be rehashed. I'm sure everyone on here is very aware of it and In my opinion it's disrespectful to those involved in my opinion to repost it. Regards, Eric drtanuki wrote: Meteorite hunters banished from Burke By Elizabeth Billips lizbill...@yahoo.com The two meteorite hunters caught trespassing in Burke County won't be coming back. They've been banished. In state court last Wednesday morning, Las Vegas meteorite hunter Ralph Sonny Clary Jr., 49, and ... LINK REMOVED __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- . Michael Gilmer (Florida, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Personal Site - http://www.glassthrower.com FaceBook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale Twitter - Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone eBay - http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/maypickle .. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information
Dirk: I concur with Eric and Mike Gilmer. This is not news and no new information has come to light. The piece you linked to was published on April 8 and today is August 25. How is that a new article? Just yesterday, I wrote a complimentary profile of my good friend Sonny Clary, and it was published by TucsonCitizen.com. Isn't that just the most amazing coincidence given the timing of your supposed new story? http://tucsoncitizen.com/lizard/2009/08/24/ralph-sonny-clary-meteorite-hunter-and-philanthropist-makes-important-donation-to-british-school-kids/ In my opinion, the above article is an accurate reflection of Sonny's character -- a fine gentleman whom I've had the pleasure of knowing for years. Anyone who has done any serious meteorite hunting has likely wandered down the wrong path in the boonies at some point in their career. I know I have. But how many of you have made a major donation to school kids overseas? Dirk, it's really obvious to anyone who knows these guys personally that you are just meddling. Get some sense of perspective and stop being so petty. Geoff N. www.aerolite.org www.meteoritemen.com www.meteoriteblog.org __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information
Dear Geoff, Mike and Eric, Thank you all for your constructive and deserved criticism. I owe an apology to Sonny and Mike (and the List) for not realizing that this was NOT new news and that it had already been reported on my weblog on April 9th. It may be inadequate at this point to say, but I am sorry. Mike Miller is a very good meteorite hunter and have spoken with him several times about his success at Glorieta Mtn.; I have never had the pleasure of speaking with Sonny, but from his public record he is well known for his hunting successes as well. I had not read your article about Sonny`s donation of meteorites to the U.K. as it has not yet made it to the search engines. His actions should be commended. It is great to see that so many meteorite people are active in promoting meteorites to young people. http://tucsoncitizen.com/lizard/2009/08/24/ralph-sonny-clary-meteorite-hunter-and-philanthropist-makes-important-donation-to-british-school-kids/ Thank you for posting a link to your article. I have now read it. Sonny should be commended for his generous donation and support for meteorite promotion and education. Best Regards, Dirk Ross...Tokyo --- On Wed, 8/26/09, Notkin geok...@notkin.net wrote: From: Notkin geok...@notkin.net Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunters Sentenced- new information To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 10:54 AM Dirk: I concur with Eric and Mike Gilmer. This is not news and no new information has come to light. The piece you linked to was published on April 8 and today is August 25. How is that a new article? Just yesterday, I wrote a complimentary profile of my good friend Sonny Clary, and it was published by TucsonCitizen.com. Isn't that just the most amazing coincidence given the timing of your supposed new story? http://tucsoncitizen.com/lizard/2009/08/24/ralph-sonny-clary-meteorite-hunter-and-philanthropist-makes-important-donation-to-british-school-kids/ In my opinion, the above article is an accurate reflection of Sonny's character -- a fine gentleman whom I've had the pleasure of knowing for years. Anyone who has done any serious meteorite hunting has likely wandered down the wrong path in the boonies at some point in their career. I know I have. But how many of you have made a major donation to school kids overseas? Dirk, it's really obvious to anyone who knows these guys personally that you are just meddling. Get some sense of perspective and stop being so petty. Geoff N. www.aerolite.org www.meteoritemen.com www.meteoriteblog.org __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Australia's prospective massive catastrophic meteorite tax
Australia's prospective massive catastrophic meteorite tax Australia.TO This morning I was watching Dr Karl Kruszelnicki as he described the probability of a massive meteorite hitting the earth in the next 50 to 100 years and ... http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/ Interesting that someone is thinking of a new reason to tax. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
Hi Eric and List, Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? At the speed of light, you can actually travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* -- from your own reckoning of time. Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
On Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:56:29 -0700, you wrote: Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? Just off the top of my head, I'd say that you would have to travel under an acceleration of roughly .716716g. You didn't say anything about stopping when you get there... If you had to stop at Alpha C, you would need to reach the middle of the trip, then start decelerating, at-- oh, again a total guess, at a constant accelration of around 1.4335g both ways. Oh, and I've never heard of this web site: http://home.att.net/~srschmitt/script_starship.html So don't say I used it. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - August 26, 2009
http://www.rocksfromspace.org/August_26_2009.html __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
Well, I don't know about *my* reckoning, but for my dogs it would be either 0.624 or 29.89 years. I'm not sure if I'm supposed to multiply or divide by seven;-) My best guess is that it would be a fraction of instantaneous. John The Bewildered At 08:56 PM 8/25/2009, Rob Matson wrote: Hi Eric and List, Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? At the speed of light, you can actually travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* -- from your own reckoning of time. Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list John Gwilliam Too many people were born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a triple. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
Hi Rob, As you may remember from my earlier writings to you, I'm no scientist. But, if what you have written is true, and if I've understood you correctly, and if someone traveling at the speed of light can travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* from their own reckoning of time, then it would seem to me that traveling to the nearest star (other than our sun) would also be *instantaneous*, from the traveler's own reckoning of time. The 4.73 years of travel time would be impossible. Or did I misunderstand what you wrote? Regards, Greg Lindh From: mojave_meteori...@cox.net To: e...@meteoritesusa.com Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:56:29 -0700 CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question Hi Eric and List, Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? At the speed of light, you can actually travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* -- from your own reckoning of time. Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
Oh one of these Gamow deals ... lets see, is it: 0.707106781times the speed of light (dividing by the square root of two to cancel out the dilution of someone watching you, who thinks you have traveled at 6.18... years?)? The ... because exactly is a pretty strong statement and I am keyboard challenged to write (1/(sqrt(2))*c since the parentheses get confusing. Best wishes, Doug -Original Message- From: Rob Matson mojave_meteori...@cox.net To: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 11:56 pm Subject: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question Hi Eric and List, Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? At the speed of light, you can actually travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* -- from your own reckoning of time. Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
On Wed, 26 Aug 2009 00:20:31 -0500, you wrote: If you had to stop at Alpha C, you would need to reach the middle of the trip, then start decelerating, at-- oh, again a total guess, at a constant accelration of around 1.4335g both ways. Scratch my second calculation here. The calculator already accounts for halfway point deceleration. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
Greg, if you walked to Alpha Centuri, it would take a long time. (And if you wanted to go exactly there, it would be quite a warm welcome). If you traveled at the speed of light it would be like Juan Salvador Gaviota (instant from your point of view). So the question isn't that you traveled at the speed of light (impossible), but what is the speed you would have to haul at to make all these light year distances in astronomy make sense from the point of view of actually getting in a ship and going there and taking as long as the star atlas says. It is clearly between 7 trillion hours (hours, not dollars) which is how long it would taker to walk, and 0 hours (instant) if you went at the speed of light in the traveling frame of reference. So you just need to find the happy medium to adjust the detached observer's dilation of time to be the inverse of your time, I think. 70.1% the speed of light seems to do it. The Factor you need to divide the speed of light by might be, 1/sqrt(1-(v^2/c^2)). Setting v=1/sqrt(2), you get 1/sqrt(1-(1/2)) = 1/sqrt(1/2) = sqrt(2). Anyways, something like that, and with that Mr. Thompkins bid the Professor Goodnight :-) Doug -Original Message- From: GREG LINDH gee...@msn.com To: mojave_meteori...@cox.net Cc: meteorite-list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 12:22 am Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question Hi Rob, As you may remember from my earlier writings to you, I'm no scientist. But, if what you have written is true, and if I've understood you correctly, and if someone traveling at the speed of light can travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* from their own reckoning of time, then it would seem to me that traveling to the nearest star (other than our sun) would also be *instantaneous*, from the traveler's own reckoning of time. The 4.73 years of travel time would be impossible. Or did I misunderstand what you wrote? Regards, Greg Lindh From: mojave_meteori...@cox.net To: e...@meteoritesusa.com Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:56:29 -0700 CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question Hi Eric and List, Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? At the speed of light, you can actually travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* -- from your own reckoning of time. Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question
Hi, All, Speaking to this thread, and all the people who find this sort of thing fun, there are many other relativity brain teasers you can tease your brain with... Like this one: QUOTE Consider the admittedly unrealistic situation of a man carrying horizontally a 20-ft pole and wanting to get it into a 10-ft garage. He will run at speed v = 0.866c to make γ = 2, so that the pole contracts to 10 ft. It will be well to insist on having a sufficiently massive block of concrete at the back of the garage, so that there is no question of whether the pole finally stops in the inertial frame of the garage, or vice versa. So the man runs with his (now contracted) pole into the garage and a friend quickly closes the door. In principle we do not doubt the feasibility of this experiment; that is, the reality of length contraction. When the pole stops in the rest-frame of the garage, it will tend to assume, if it can, its original length relative to the garage. Thus, if it survived the impact, it must now either bend, or burst the door, or remain compressed. At this point a paradox might occur to the reader: What about the symmetry of the phenomenon? Relative to the runner, won’t the garage be only 5 ft long? And, if so, how can the 20-ft pole get into the 5-ft garage? Very well, let us consider what happens... UNQUOTE from Wolfgang Rindler's Relativity, probably the best and clearest book on the subject ever written. It contains a lot of brain teasers and it is downloadable at: http://avaxhome.ws/ebooks/science_books/astronomy_cosmology/relativity_special_general_and_cosmological.html And the answer? I won't spoil it, but you can get the 20-foot pole into the 5-foot garage easily, no problemo. and with room to spare! (p. 63) Sterling K. Webb -- - Original Message - From: Mexicodoug mexicod...@aim.com To: mojave_meteori...@cox.net Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 11:44 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question Oh one of these Gamow deals ... lets see, is it: 0.707106781times the speed of light (dividing by the square root of two to cancel out the dilution of someone watching you, who thinks you have traveled at 6.18... years?)? The ... because exactly is a pretty strong statement and I am keyboard challenged to write (1/(sqrt(2))*c since the parentheses get confusing. Best wishes, Doug -Original Message- From: Rob Matson mojave_meteori...@cox.net To: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 11:56 pm Subject: [meteorite-list] Speed-of-light question Hi Eric and List, Light itself travels 186,000 miles per second. Do most people really understand how fast that truly is? Do people realize how long it would take to travel ANYWHERE in our universe? At the speed of light, you can actually travel anywhere in the universe *instantaneously* -- from your own reckoning of time. Which brings up a special relativity question for you all: at what velocity must you travel in order to reach Alpha Centauri (4.37 light-years away) in exactly 4.37 years -- by *your* reckoning of time? --Rob __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
