[meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hello Mike, Regine, and Listers Regine there are 486 HED meteorites that are non Antarctica. Mike and Listers I have a question... I was trying to search for the other two HEDOD Olivine diogenite, and Dunites on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database and under class they do not have those listed. Am I missing something? Or am I overlooking the classes and I need glasses? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?Michael Gilmer meteoritemike at gmail.com Wed Apr 6 22:58:02 EDT 2011 Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen fips_bruno at yahoo.de wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] More information about the Meteorite-list mailing list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
I had thought that dunites were Martian, like Chassigny. Have dunites been identified from other sources? Best! Tracy Latimer Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2011 22:58:02 -0400 From: meteoritem...@gmail.com To: fips_br...@yahoo.de CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Dunite is the Earth version of Tatahouine. Greg Catterton www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com IMCA member 4682 On Ebay: http://stores.shop.ebay.com/wanderingstarmeteorites On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WanderingStarMeteorites --- On Thu, 4/7/11, tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com wrote: From: tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 3:31 AM I had thought that dunites were Martian, like Chassigny. Have dunites been identified from other sources? Best! Tracy Latimer Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2011 22:58:02 -0400 From: meteoritem...@gmail.com To: fips_br...@yahoo.de CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hi Shawn: I do not think anyone responded to your question about olinive-bearing diogenites. Here is a links to articles: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2003/pdf/1502.pdf http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2008/pdf/1835.pdf Sorry, but have not been keeping up on the subject. Larry Hello Mike, Regine, and Listers Regine there are 486 HED meteorites that are non Antarctica. Mike and Listers I have a question... I was trying to search for the other two HEDOD Olivine diogenite, and Dunites on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database and under class they do not have those listed. Am I missing something? Or am I overlooking the classes and I need glasses? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?Michael Gilmer meteoritemike at gmail.com Wed Apr 6 22:58:02 EDT 2011 Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen fips_bruno at yahoo.de wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] More information about the Meteorite-list mailing list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hi Tracy, Yes, the meteorites that are actually called Dunites are believed to be from Vesta and represent a piece of the puzzle that had seemed to be missing from Vestan samples for years. A very important find was made in the form of two NWA's... specifically NWA 2968 (Dunite) and NWA 3329 (Diogenite). The amazing thing is that these two meteorites were found together with a few samples actually having both lithologies, thereby linking these Dunites with Diogenites and therefore strengthening the link with Vesta. Of course there is more to it than that but that's my basic understanding of it. Try these links for some interesting reading: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2006/pdf/5252.pdf http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2010/pdf/5304.pdf However, your point is also valid in regards to the Chassignites. The term dunite generally refers to an olivine-rich rock which Chassignites are and why they have been dubbed as Martian dunites in the past. Cheers, Jeff - Original Message - From: tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 5:31 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? I had thought that dunites were Martian, like Chassigny. Have dunites been identified from other sources? Best! Tracy Latimer Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2011 22:58:02 -0400 From: meteoritem...@gmail.com To: fips_br...@yahoo.de CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] NYT Story – Overseas and Local Distribution
“Overseas list members, if you have the opportunity, please peruse the International Herald Tribune to see if they picked up the story and run it in its entirety.” By searching the International Herald Tribune web site, I found that it was published in this newspaper on April 4 at: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/05/science/05meteorite.html?_r=1scp=1sq=meteoritesst=cse The entire story also appeared in the Sydney Morning Herald as “Souvenirs from space,” April 7, 2011, http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html Also, it appeared at: 1. rssbroadcast,com, April 4, 2011 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40828 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40742 2. WA.today, Australia, April 6, 2011. http://www.watoday.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html 3. Yahoo News http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NorthAmexemObservers/message/10634 4. Daily Comet, Lafourche Parish Louisiana http://www.dailycomet.com/article/NY/20110405/ZNYT03/104053033/1225/news100?Title=Black-Market-Trinkets-From-Space 5. A version of the New York Times story, “Il mercato nero dei meteoriti” appeared in the “Post” on April 6, 2011, http://www.ilpost.it/2011/04/06/il-mercato-nero-dei-meteoriti/ This entire text of this article is making the rounds of the Internet. This is something that definitely needs to be considered in any response. It certainly will make preparing an effective response to the article quite difficult as it is being reprinted, in some cases under different titles and in different languages, in a wild range of media outlets. To further complicate matters, the link to this article is being posted a number of web sites. For example; 1. Egyptology News at: http://egyptology.blogspot.com/2011/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space.html 2. environmental reporting at: http://word.emerson.edu/sprg11jr364/2011/04/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space/ and 3. American Scientist http://www.americanscientist.org/science/pub/-1875 Yours, Paul H __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] (meteorobs) Fireball Over Southern USA April 7th UT
Bob, You beat me to the punch. I literally just pushed publish on this report: http://www.amsmeteors.org/2011/04/large-fireball-event-reported-4611/ The NASA All Sky Camera Network captured the event on 2 cameras. The AMS post includes a still picture of the event and a map of the AMS plots. Early analysis of the AMS reports put the termination of the event SE of Louisville KY. The MEO will be releasing the videos, trajectory and orbit information later today. Thanks, MIke On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 7:12 AM, lunro.imo@cox.net wrote: A fireball as bright as the quarter moon (magnitude -9) was reported from South Carolina to Arkansas. It occurred near 01:20 Universal TIme on April 7th or the evening of April 6th local time. Reports of colors spanned the rainbow but the most often reported colors were white, blue, and green. Summaries of these reports may be viewed on the fireball table of the American Meteor Society at: http://www.amsmeteors.org/fireball2/public.php?start_date=2011-01-01end_date=2011-12-31 Refer to event #375 in the 2011 table. Clear Skies! Robert Lunsford American Meteor Society ___ Mailing list meteorobs: meteor...@meteorobs.org To UNSUBSCRIBE, email: owner-meteor...@meteorobs.org http://lists.meteorobs.org/mailman/listinfo/meteorobs __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] ??SaharaMet...who are they!
Hi Paul and list, The NYT story is bad enough, But who are these meteorite hunters, Roland and Richard Pelisson who have the Sahara Met website. They claim on there web site that NWA meteorites are International Contraband that support Terrorism. It looks to me that they want all the NWA finds for them selfs. Has anyone ever contacted them? They seem to have had a lot of there meteorites classified in the US. Just wondering if anyone knows these two guys, There does not seem to be much talk about them on this list? Dave Myers - Original Message From: Paul H. oxytropidoce...@cox.net To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 7:48:33 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] NYT Story – Overseas and Local Distribution “Overseas list members, if you have the opportunity, please peruse the International Herald Tribune to see if they picked up the story and run it in its entirety.” By searching the International Herald Tribune web site, I found that it was published in this newspaper on April 4 at: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/05/science/05meteorite.html?_r=1scp=1sq=meteoritesst=cse The entire story also appeared in the Sydney Morning Herald as “Souvenirs from space,” April 7, 2011, http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html Also, it appeared at: 1. rssbroadcast,com, April 4, 2011 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40828 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40742 2. WA.today, Australia, April 6, 2011. http://www.watoday.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html 3. Yahoo News http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NorthAmexemObservers/message/10634 4. Daily Comet, Lafourche Parish Louisiana http://www.dailycomet.com/article/NY/20110405/ZNYT03/104053033/1225/news100?Title=Black-Market-Trinkets-From-Space 5. A version of the New York Times story, “Il mercato nero dei meteoriti” appeared in the “Post” on April 6, 2011, http://www.ilpost.it/2011/04/06/il-mercato-nero-dei-meteoriti/ This entire text of this article is making the rounds of the Internet. This is something that definitely needs to be considered in any response. It certainly will make preparing an effective response to the article quite difficult as it is being reprinted, in some cases under different titles and in different languages, in a wild range of media outlets. To further complicate matters, the link to this article is being posted a number of web sites. For example; 1. Egyptology News at: http://egyptology.blogspot.com/2011/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space.html 2. environmental reporting at: http://word.emerson.edu/sprg11jr364/2011/04/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space/ and 3. American Scientist http://www.americanscientist.org/science/pub/-1875 Yours, Paul H __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] ??SaharaMet...who are they!
There was talk about the Pelissons, with regard to the topics just discussed on this list, many, many years ago - it´s just an old story... AlMetcentrallist-oldtimer for over 10 yrs nowex Berlin/Germany Original-Nachricht Datum: Thu, 7 Apr 2011 05:26:25 -0700 (PDT) Von: Dave Myers whitefalcons...@yahoo.com An: Paul H. oxytropidoce...@cox.net, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] ??SaharaMet...who are they! Hi Paul and list, The NYT story is bad enough, But who are these meteorite hunters, Roland and Richard Pelisson who have the Sahara Met website. They claim on there web site that NWA meteorites are International Contraband that support Terrorism. It looks to me that they want all the NWA finds for them selfs. Has anyone ever contacted them? They seem to have had a lot of there meteorites classified in the US. Just wondering if anyone knows these two guys, There does not seem to be much talk about them on this list? Dave Myers - Original Message From: Paul H. oxytropidoce...@cox.net To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 7:48:33 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] NYT Story – Overseas and Local Distribution “Overseas list members, if you have the opportunity, please peruse the International Herald Tribune to see if they picked up the story and run it in its entirety.” By searching the International Herald Tribune web site, I found that it was published in this newspaper on April 4 at: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/05/science/05meteorite.html?_r=1scp=1sq=meteoritesst=cse The entire story also appeared in the Sydney Morning Herald as “Souvenirs from space,” April 7, 2011, http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html Also, it appeared at: 1. rssbroadcast,com, April 4, 2011 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40828 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40742 2. WA.today, Australia, April 6, 2011. http://www.watoday.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html 3. Yahoo News http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NorthAmexemObservers/message/10634 4. Daily Comet, Lafourche Parish Louisiana http://www.dailycomet.com/article/NY/20110405/ZNYT03/104053033/1225/news100?Title=Black-Market-Trinkets-From-Space 5. A version of the New York Times story, “Il mercato nero dei meteoriti” appeared in the “Post” on April 6, 2011, http://www.ilpost.it/2011/04/06/il-mercato-nero-dei-meteoriti/ This entire text of this article is making the rounds of the Internet. This is something that definitely needs to be considered in any response. It certainly will make preparing an effective response to the article quite difficult as it is being reprinted, in some cases under different titles and in different languages, in a wild range of media outlets. To further complicate matters, the link to this article is being posted a number of web sites. For example; 1. Egyptology News at: http://egyptology.blogspot.com/2011/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space.html 2. environmental reporting at: http://word.emerson.edu/sprg11jr364/2011/04/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space/ and 3. American Scientist http://www.americanscientist.org/science/pub/-1875 Yours, Paul H __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] ??SaharaMet...who are they!
Hi Dave, just go to the list-archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com/ And enter terrorism or Pelissons That page is very old. With the upcoming NWAs and the first Oman finds, the Pelissons had to experience that nobody was interested in purchasing their overpriced DaG-finds. So they used the climate of fear directly after Sep-11 to try to decry their competitors as helpers of terrorism, in inventing that cock-and-bull-story, to lead laypeople and especially the American collectors astray from acquiring NWA-meteorites. That form of marketing failed. And it is not so surprising, that since then the Pelissons aren't part of the meteorite community any longer. But you're right, their dirty methods are similar to those used by some of the protectionists. I just googled a little bit, the NYT article spreads like a wildfire. If I were an US-citizen, I would start to think about to take legal action, to force NYT to a counterstatement. Btw. I don't join in the general criticism about media. There are also good articles about meteorites to be found. For Europe I want to mention e.g. the excellent and self-contained regular articles by Christian Pinter in the Wiener Zeitung or on local levels too. E.g. after the supposed fall in Winter this year in Germany, the local journalists did an excellent job, even joined the German meteorite forum to gather correct information. They delivered real quality journalism. That what Broad did, is gutter journalism, no matter, what for a standing he has. Best, Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Dave Myers Gesendet: Donnerstag, 7. April 2011 14:26 An: Paul H.; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] ??SaharaMet...who are they! Hi Paul and list, The NYT story is bad enough, But who are these meteorite hunters, Roland and Richard Pelisson who have the Sahara Met website. They claim on there web site that NWA meteorites are International Contraband that support Terrorism. It looks to me that they want all the NWA finds for them selfs. Has anyone ever contacted them? They seem to have had a lot of there meteorites classified in the US. Just wondering if anyone knows these two guys, There does not seem to be much talk about them on this list? Dave Myers - Original Message From: Paul H. oxytropidoce...@cox.net To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 7:48:33 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] NYT Story – Overseas and Local Distribution “Overseas list members, if you have the opportunity, please peruse the International Herald Tribune to see if they picked up the story and run it in its entirety.” By searching the International Herald Tribune web site, I found that it was published in this newspaper on April 4 at: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/05/science/05meteorite.html?_r=1scp=1sq=meteoritesst=cse The entire story also appeared in the Sydney Morning Herald as “Souvenirs from space,” April 7, 2011, http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html Also, it appeared at: 1. rssbroadcast,com, April 4, 2011 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40828 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40742 2. WA.today, Australia, April 6, 2011. http://www.watoday.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html 3. Yahoo News http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NorthAmexemObservers/message/10634 4. Daily Comet, Lafourche Parish Louisiana http://www.dailycomet.com/article/NY/20110405/ZNYT03/104053033/1225/news100?Title=Black-Market-Trinkets-From-Space 5. A version of the New York Times story, “Il mercato nero dei meteoriti” appeared in the “Post” on April 6, 2011, http://www.ilpost.it/2011/04/06/il-mercato-nero-dei-meteoriti/ This entire text of this article is making the rounds of the Internet. This is something that definitely needs to be considered in any response. It certainly will make preparing an effective response to the article quite difficult as it is being reprinted, in some cases under different titles and in different languages, in a wild range of media outlets. To further complicate matters, the link to this article is being posted a number of web sites. For example; 1. Egyptology News at: http://egyptology.blogspot.com/2011/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space.html 2. environmental reporting at: http://word.emerson.edu/sprg11jr364/2011/04/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space/ and 3. American Scientist http://www.americanscientist.org/science/pub/-1875 Yours, Paul H __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] NYT Addendum
Because I was asked, these were the articles I referred to: Science Is Precious - Meteorite for Sale http://news.softpedia.com/news/Science-Is-Precious-Meteorite-For-Sale-52101. shtml Meteorite smugglers anger scientists http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/6549197.stm Martin __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Diogenite Distinctions....was List of meteorites from Vesta?
Dunite is the Earth version of Tatahouine. Sorry, well but not exactly. Orthopyroxene is close elementally but chemically a different class of silicate mineral. Pyroxene isn't the same as dunite--aka olivine rock. There is an axiom in mineralogy : color is the list reliable characteristic for identification. Pyroxene forms when the available oxygen is less than optimal (as in Olivine)so it has to stack differently to double up on oxygen bonds. How-so-ever, there is at least one NWA achondrite described as Dunite with HED affinities yet the same literature keeps talking about olivine diogenites. What level of olivine content switches from Olivine Dio over to a Dunite Dio? Perhaps the use of dunite in the literature is more inline with the trend to describe achondrites in terms of rock-type/rock fabric, than traditional composition-based schemes. Remember the old days of Olivine, Bronzites, and Amphoterites instead of H, L and LL? Elton __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hello All, A dunite is a type of ultramafic rock composed of olivine. It is associated with conditions/an origin in the (upper) mantle of a differentiated body (not just Earth). They form at greater depths than one would find any significant amount of orthopyroxene, and are composed primarily of olivine (which is a denser mineral). Olivine diogenites are technically dunites from 4-Vesta; Chassigny is a Martian dunite. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunite Regards, Jason On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:33 AM, Greg Catterton star_wars_collec...@yahoo.com wrote: Dunite is the Earth version of Tatahouine. Greg Catterton www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com IMCA member 4682 On Ebay: http://stores.shop.ebay.com/wanderingstarmeteorites On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WanderingStarMeteorites --- On Thu, 4/7/11, tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com wrote: From: tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 3:31 AM I had thought that dunites were Martian, like Chassigny. Have dunites been identified from other sources? Best! Tracy Latimer Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2011 22:58:02 -0400 From: meteoritem...@gmail.com To: fips_br...@yahoo.de CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan
Hi Folks! I just heard, that there was a new earth quake in Japan. It had 7.4 on the Richter scale and there was given an tsunami warning, also. The quake was in the same region, the last one was and caused the trouble with the nuclear power station near Fukushima. Let's hope the best for all people there. Ingo __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan
Ingo and all, Thank you. Uncertain what the damage if any is in Miyagi and Iwate... Tsunami warnings have been issued, http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/ There is a link on my site for NHK Japan English Live. Best Always, Dirk... Tokyo --- On Fri, 4/8/11, Ingo Herkstroeter metopas...@gmx.de wrote: From: Ingo Herkstroeter metopas...@gmx.de Subject: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Friday, April 8, 2011, 12:23 AM Hi Folks! I just heard, that there was a new earth quake in Japan. It had 7.4 on the Richter scale and there was given an tsunami warning, also. The quake was in the same region, the last one was and caused the trouble with the nuclear power station near Fukushima. Let's hope the best for all people there. Ingo __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] NYT Addendum
Here is another piece of negative press where Dr. Ralph Harvey comments about the legality of meteorites. If you search the Google news archives, you will see that he is very familiar with the press and seems to bask in it. It is too bad that he doesn't focus more on the Antarctic program instead of commenting on laws he knows nothing about. I have met several researches that go on these Antarctic trips that do not share his views . Most are sample oriented scientists and could care less where they were found. Many of these same researchers have studied meteorites from Northwest Africa and have type specimens in their institutional collections. The Antarctic program has been very successful so I do not see the need to downgrade meteorites found elsewhere unless the influx coming from the private sector somehow endangers the program. I do not think this negative press will help the cause and demonstrates a lack of collaboration that is needed for long-term success. Most are happy with the Antarctic program so why make enemies in the private sector that funds these expeditions? Tax payers may soon ask why should we continue such a program since the head of it is perceived as putting out too much negative effort attacking others when he should be focused on science and logistics. Here is the link if anybody cares: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/1324361.stm I think it is time for me to start concentrating on more positive aspects and accept that the damage has already been done. Best Regards, Adam __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] New photos added
Hi All, I have added a couple new photos to my web page. While I am out in the field I come across some great outdoor photo opportunities. Of course I would rather photograph new meteorite discoveries in situ! Sonny http://www.nevadameteorites.com/nevadameteorites/NATURE_PHOTOS.html __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD - 1st ed. Mineralogy volume
Hi, Not strictly on topic of meteorites, but I have put on Ebay a particularly fine 1st American Edition (1874) of DIAMONDS AND PRECIOUS STONES Dieulafait, Louis. Ex- Joseph Freilich scientific collection, this is about the best condition volume out there for its age. If interested, clicky below! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=270732439196 Again, thank you for your indulgence seems I may prob post this twice as even if I change my email formatting from rich text to plain text, seems i never see it in the Metlist digests - so forgive me in advance! best regards dave IMCA #0092 Sec. BIMS __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] NASA's Next Mars Rover Nears Completion
http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2011-108 NASA's Next Mars Rover Nears Completion Jet Propulsion Laboratory April 06, 2011 Assembly and testing of NASA's Mars Science Laboratory spacecraft is far enough along that the mission's rover, Curiosity, looks very much as it will when it is investigating Mars. Testing continues this month at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., on the rover and other components of the spacecraft that will deliver Curiosity to Mars. In May and June, the spacecraft will be shipped to NASA Kennedy Space Center, Fla., where preparations will continue for launch in the period between Nov. 25 and Dec. 18, 2011. The mission will use Curiosity to study one of the most intriguing places on Mars -- still to be selected from among four finalist landing-site candidates. It will study whether a selected area of Mars has offered environmental conditions favorable for microbial life and for preserving evidence about whether Martian life has existed. JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena, manages the Mars Science Laboratory mission for the NASA Science Mission Directorate, Washington. For more information about the mission, visit http://www.nasa.gov/msl. Guy Webster 818-354-6278 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. guy.webs...@jpl.nasa.gov 2011-108 __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] MRO HiRISE Images - April 6, 2011
MARS RECONNAISSANCE ORBITER HIRISE IMAGES April 6, 2011 o Dry Ice Gone Wild http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_020914_0930 On Mars the seasonal polar caps are composed of dry ice. In the springtime as the sun shines on the ice, it turns from solid to gas and causes erosion of the surface. o Ponded Lava, Slope Streaks, and Inadvertent Change Detection http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_020963_1810 From examining the texture of the surrounding plains and the crater floor, we can conclude that a large lava flow overtopped and cut through a low part of the crater rim. o Ridged Crater Floor and Gullies http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_021489_1405 There are gullies on the pole-facing slopes, as well as an impressive ridged floor. Is the ridged floor older than gullies? All of the HiRISE images are archived here: http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ Information about the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is online at http://www.nasa.gov/mro. The mission is managed by NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, a division of the California Institute of Technology, for the NASA Science Mission Directorate, Washington, D.C. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, of Denver, is the prime contractor and built the spacecraft. HiRISE is operated by the University of Arizona. Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp., of Boulder, Colo., built the HiRISE instrument. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Earth-Companion Asteroid Discovered in Horseshoe-Shaped Orbit (2010 SO16)
http://www.technologyreview.com/blog/arxiv/26608/ Earth-Companion Asteroid Discovered in Horseshoe-Shaped Orbit Earth shares its orbit around the Sun with an asteroid in an exotic horseshoe-shaped orbit, say astronomers Technology Review April 5, 2011 In the 1969 film Doppelganger, scientists discover and then visit an Earth-like planet sharing our orbit but on exactly the other side of the Sun. Since then, astronomers have ruled out the possibility of such a planet on the grounds that its gravitational effects on other planets and spacecraft would be easy to see. But that doesn't rule out the possibility of smaller objects sharing Earth's orbit and today, Apostolos Christou and David Asher at the Armagh Observatory in Northern Ireland say they've found one--an asteroid called 2010 SO16 Near-Earth asteroids are common but SO16 is in a category of its own. First and foremost, it has an exotic horseshoe-shaped orbit (see diagram above) which astronomers believe to be very rare. Its worth taking a few moments to think about horseshoe orbits. Two points are worth bearing in mind. First, objects further from the Sun than Earth, orbit more slowly. Second, objects that are closer to the Sun orbit more quickly than Earth. So imagine an asteroid with an orbit around the Sun that is just a little bit smaller than Earth's. Because it is orbiting more quickly, this asteroid will gradually catch up with Earth. When it approaches Earth, the larger planet's gravity will tend to pull the asteroid towards it and away from the Sun. This makes the asteroid orbit more slowly and if the asteroid ends up in a orbit that is slightly bigger than Earth's, it will orbit the Sun more slowly than Earth and fall behind. After that, the Earth will catch up with the slower asteroid in the bigger orbit, pulling it back into the small faster orbit and process begins again. So from the point of view of the Earth, the asteroid has a horseshoe-shaped orbit, constantly moving towards and away from the Earth without ever passing it. (However, from the asteroid's point of view, it orbits the Sun continuously in the same direction, sometimes more quickly in smaller orbits and sometimes more slowly in bigger orbits.) For SO16, the period of this effect is about 350 years Horseshoe orbits are thought to be very unstable, since any small gravitational tug can destroy the fragile resonance that has been set up. However, SO16's orbit is surprisingly robust. Christou and Asher simulated its orbit with slightly different values for parameters such as its semi-major axis. In these simulations, SO16 remained in a horseshoe-shaped orbit for at least 120,000 years and sometimes for more than a million years. Astronomers know of three other horseshoe companions for Earth but these are all much smaller (SO16 is a few hundred meters across) and none have orbits that are likely to survive for more than a few thousands years. That makes SO16 kind of special. For anybody willing and able to look, it is currently near one of its points of closest approach, with an absolute magnitude of about 20, lagging the Earth by 0.13 AU, like a stray puppy. And it will be there for some time, say Christou and Asher. It will remain as an evening object in the sky for several decades to come. Ref: arxiv.org/abs/1104.0036 http://arxiv.org/abs/1104.0036 : A Long-Lived Horseshoe Companion To The Earth __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan
Hello Ingo, Dirk and all I keep my fingers crossed that there is no further damage and hopefully no further casulties. We feel for our Japanese friends. The Tsunami warning has meanwhile been cancelled. That is good news. Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Ingo Herkstroeter metopas...@gmx.de Gesendet: 07.04.2011 17:23:41 An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan Hi Folks! I just heard, that there was a new earth quake in Japan. It had 7.4 on the Richter scale and there was given an tsunami warning, also. The quake was in the same region, the last one was and caused the trouble with the nuclear power station near Fukushima. Let's hope the best for all people there. Ingo __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan (FYI)
Colleagues: No tsunami have appeared. All tsunami warnings have been cancelled. USGS has revised their magnitude estimate downward and now has a moment magnitude: 7.1. Japan Met.Agency now agrees with USGS on depth: 40 km. It sounds like they are calling it a backthrust earthquake. Shinkansen that were running after the March 11 EQ are running again. Sendai train station is damaged and trains have been stopped. There are widespread power outages, local fires, and some injured and trapped people. Two of the three external power lines running to Onagawa nuclear power station, on the north Tohoku coast, are down. Onagawa is on E side of the Oshika peninsula (the big peninsula), closer to the epicenter of the aftershock than Fukushima Daiichi or Daini stations. Onagawa has three boiling-water reactors like those at Fukushima Daiichi, but much newer (1984, 1995, 2002). All were in safe, cold shutdown after the great EQ, but all (of course) need continuing water flow to keep cores and spent-fuel pools cool. David R. Vann, Ph.D. Department of Earth and Environmental Science THE UNIVERSITY of PENNSYLVANIA 240 S. 33rd St. Philadelphia, PA 19104-6316 drv...@sas.upenn.edu office: 215-898-4906 FAX: 215-898-0964 | -Original Message- | From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com | [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On | Behalf Of karmaka | Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 12:22 PM | To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com | Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan | | | Hello Ingo, Dirk and all | | I keep my fingers crossed that there is no further damage | and hopefully no further casulties. We feel for our Japanese | friends. The Tsunami warning has meanwhile been cancelled. | That is good news. | | Martin | | | -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- | Von: Ingo Herkstroeter metopas...@gmx.de | Gesendet: 07.04.2011 17:23:41 | An: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com | Betreff: [meteorite-list] OT: New quake in Japan | | Hi Folks! | | I just heard, that there was a new earth quake in Japan. It | had 7.4 on | the Richter scale and there was given an tsunami warning, also. The | quake was in the same region, the last one was and caused | the trouble | with the nuclear power station near Fukushima. | | | Let's hope the best for all people there. | | Ingo | | | __ | Visit the Archives at | http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html | Meteorite-list mailing list | Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com | http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list | __ | Visit the Archives at | http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html | Meteorite-list mailing list | Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com | http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list | | __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New photos added
GREAT PHOTOS SONNY! Eric On 4/7/2011 8:53 AM, wahlpe...@aol.com wrote: Hi All, I have added a couple new photos to my web page. While I am out in the field I come across some great outdoor photo opportunities. Of course I would rather photograph new meteorite discoveries in situ! Sonny http://www.nevadameteorites.com/nevadameteorites/NATURE_PHOTOS.html __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been listed on the MBD. I find it odd, but again I have seen a few meteorites get these weird names or nick names to create a buzz. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: fips_br...@yahoo.de, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 5:40 AM Hi Shawn: I do not think anyone responded to your question about olinive-bearing diogenites. Here is a links to articles: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2003/pdf/1502.pdf http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2008/pdf/1835.pdf Sorry, but have not been keeping up on the subject. Larry Hello Mike, Regine, and Listers Regine there are 486 HED meteorites that are non Antarctica. Mike and Listers I have a question... I was trying to search for the other two HEDOD Olivine diogenite, and Dunites on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database and under class they do not have those listed. Am I missing something? Or am I overlooking the classes and I need glasses? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?Michael Gilmer meteoritemike at gmail.com Wed Apr 6 22:58:02 EDT 2011 Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen fips_bruno at yahoo.de wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] More information about the Meteorite-list mailing list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been listed on the MBD. I find it odd, but again I have seen a few meteorites get these weird names or nick names to create a buzz. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: fips_br...@yahoo.de, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 5:40 AM Hi Shawn: I do not think anyone responded to your question about olinive-bearing diogenites. Here is a links to articles: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2003/pdf/1502.pdf http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2008/pdf/1835.pdf Sorry, but have not been keeping up on the subject. Larry Hello Mike, Regine, and Listers Regine there are 486 HED meteorites that are non Antarctica. Mike and Listers I have a question... I was trying to search for the other two HEDOD Olivine diogenite, and Dunites on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database and under class they do not have those listed. Am I missing something? Or am I overlooking the classes and I need glasses? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?Michael Gilmer meteoritemike at gmail.com Wed Apr 6 22:58:02 EDT 2011 Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG
[meteorite-list] another freebie round to go
Hello list.Just an FYI for all who are interested.I have 15 unclassed stones and black campo crystals to give away.Just chime in with your address.Again USA only because of the postage situation.If you want to pay postage it will be appreciated.Please off list as usual and have a great day. Steve R.Arnold, Chicago! __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
MikeG and Listerites I am glad you added the HEDOD to the Vesta 4 question brought up by Regine. However, the question still stands but some people have said this that the reason why Olivine diogenite, and Dunite aren't listed on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database is because there needs to be more meteorites with that type of classification which isnt the case. But again I think the wording is different on the MDB because I did see a Diogenite-olivine class so does that mean that Diogenite-olivine are the same as Olivine diogenites? Also what are Diogenite-pm and Eucrite-mmict? All is I know I am going to be excited when when Dawn meets up with Vesta this summer. It will be interesting on the discoveries that will be found and old aged questions reconfirmed or dismissed. Time will tell. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: From: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 11:48 AM Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been listed on the MBD. I find it odd, but again I have seen a few meteorites get these weird names or nick names to create a buzz. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: fips_br...@yahoo.de,
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
The explanation is basically that olivine diogenites are diogenites, at least that has been the philosophy of nomcom. The term seems to date from 1991, according to NASA ADS (http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1991GeCoA..55.S). Classifications evolve, and if somebody cares to make a good case to nomcom, along with a list of all the group members, I'm sure we'd consider adopting the term formally. Jeff On 4/7/2011 1:18 PM, Shawn Alan wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been listed on the MBD. I find it odd, but again I have seen a few meteorites get these weird names or nick names to create a buzz. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edulebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edulebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alanphotoph...@yahoo.com Cc: fips_br...@yahoo.de, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 5:40 AM Hi Shawn: I do not think anyone responded to your question about olinive-bearing diogenites. Here is a links to articles: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2003/pdf/1502.pdf http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2008/pdf/1835.pdf Sorry, but have not been keeping up on the subject. Larry Hello Mike, Regine, and Listers Regine there are 486 HED meteorites that are non Antarctica. Mike and Listers I have a question... I was trying to search for the other two HEDOD Olivine diogenite, and Dunites on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database and under class they do not have those listed. Am I missing something? Or am I overlooking the classes and I need glasses? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?Michael Gilmer meteoritemike at gmail.com Wed Apr 6 22:58:02 EDT 2011 Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersenfips_bruno at yahoo.de wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- Previous message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Next message: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] More information about the Meteorite-list mailing list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __
Re: [meteorite-list] new terminology for Vestan meteorites
On behalf of Dr. Tony Irving who occasionally reads the MetList archives: Anne M. Black _http://www.impactika.com/_ (http://www.impactika.com/) _IMPACTIKA@aol.com_ (mailto:impact...@aol.com) President, I.M.C.A. Inc. _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) In a message dated 4/7/2011 8:23:40 AM Mountain Daylight Time, irv...@ess.washington.edu writes: I noticed the interest on the list about the wider variety of rock types among HED meteorites. In fact a new terminology proposed in a paper last year has been adopted by the NomCom, wherein all of the rocks previously called olivine diogenites as well as the Vestan dunites are called diogenites. Under this base name there is a wide range in the relative amounts of orthopyroxene and olivine (from zero olivine to over 90% olivine). By adopting established names for terrestrial peridotites as qualifying adjectives, the new names are as follows: Regular diogenite (with up to 10 volume% olivine) = orthopyroxenitic diogenite Olivine diogenite (with 40 volume% olivine) = harzburgitic diogenite Olivine-rich Vestan rocks (with 90 volume% olivine) = dunitic diogenite By analogy with established terrestrial nomenclature, there also should be a category for specimens containing between 10 and 40 volume% olivine (so far only one is known), and that would be olivine-orthopyroxenitic diogenite. I realize that these names are a bit cumbersome, but they do make sense. In addition, diogenites with 90 volume% olivine can contain up to 10 vol.% plagioclase, and still be called diogenites. Another effect of this nomenclature is that the acronym HEDOD (which we have used) is unnecessary, and so we can go back to calling the suite of (evidently) Vestan rocks by the traditional HED acronym. Actually there are at least three other dunitic diogenites: MIL 03443, NWA 5784 and NWA 5968. The first that Ted Bunch and I knew about the new terminology was when we submitted the classifications for NWA 5784 and NWA 5968, and were told (to our inital amazement) that they would be approved as diogenites. We presented our work on these specimens last summer at the MetSoc meeting in NYC: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2010/pdf/5315.pdf I am not a list member but I do check the archives periodically. Please feel free to share any of this with both IMCA and List members. Best regards, Tony __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hi Shawn and Vestoids, I've been following the Dawn mission (and Ron's regular links) with great interest. I feel like such a total geek, but this mission has me excited all across the board - for NASA, for space science, for planetary science, and for meteoritics. I think many of us would just love to see close-up photos and data from the surface of Vesta (and Ceres). Wouldn't it be wonderful to see big piles of eucrites, howardites, diogenites, and other meteorites laying around the surface of Vesta? I think, but I am not sure, that eucrite-mmict is a eucrite, monomict breccia. Meteorite nomenclature is an evolving beast. At one time, CK meteorites were part of the CV class - CV4, CV5. One thing about meteorite terminology is for certain - it can change when new data emerges. Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: MikeG and Listerites I am glad you added the HEDOD to the Vesta 4 question brought up by Regine. However, the question still stands but some people have said this that the reason why Olivine diogenite, and Dunite aren't listed on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database is because there needs to be more meteorites with that type of classification which isnt the case. But again I think the wording is different on the MDB because I did see a Diogenite-olivine class so does that mean that Diogenite-olivine are the same as Olivine diogenites? Also what are Diogenite-pm and Eucrite-mmict? All is I know I am going to be excited when when Dawn meets up with Vesta this summer. It will be interesting on the discoveries that will be found and old aged questions reconfirmed or dismissed. Time will tell. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: From: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 11:48 AM Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person
Re: [meteorite-list] new terminology for Vestan meteorites
Aaaah, poor HEDOD, we hardly knew ye. :) -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, impact...@aol.com impact...@aol.com wrote: On behalf of Dr. Tony Irving who occasionally reads the MetList archives: Anne M. Black _http://www.impactika.com/_ (http://www.impactika.com/) _IMPACTIKA@aol.com_ (mailto:impact...@aol.com) President, I.M.C.A. Inc. _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) In a message dated 4/7/2011 8:23:40 AM Mountain Daylight Time, irv...@ess.washington.edu writes: I noticed the interest on the list about the wider variety of rock types among HED meteorites. In fact a new terminology proposed in a paper last year has been adopted by the NomCom, wherein all of the rocks previously called olivine diogenites as well as the Vestan dunites are called diogenites. Under this base name there is a wide range in the relative amounts of orthopyroxene and olivine (from zero olivine to over 90% olivine). By adopting established names for terrestrial peridotites as qualifying adjectives, the new names are as follows: Regular diogenite (with up to 10 volume% olivine) = orthopyroxenitic diogenite Olivine diogenite (with 40 volume% olivine) = harzburgitic diogenite Olivine-rich Vestan rocks (with 90 volume% olivine) = dunitic diogenite By analogy with established terrestrial nomenclature, there also should be a category for specimens containing between 10 and 40 volume% olivine (so far only one is known), and that would be olivine-orthopyroxenitic diogenite. I realize that these names are a bit cumbersome, but they do make sense. In addition, diogenites with 90 volume% olivine can contain up to 10 vol.% plagioclase, and still be called diogenites. Another effect of this nomenclature is that the acronym HEDOD (which we have used) is unnecessary, and so we can go back to calling the suite of (evidently) Vestan rocks by the traditional HED acronym. Actually there are at least three other dunitic diogenites: MIL 03443, NWA 5784 and NWA 5968. The first that Ted Bunch and I knew about the new terminology was when we submitted the classifications for NWA 5784 and NWA 5968, and were told (to our inital amazement) that they would be approved as diogenites. We presented our work on these specimens last summer at the MetSoc meeting in NYC: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2010/pdf/5315.pdf I am not a list member but I do check the archives periodically. Please feel free to share any of this with both IMCA and List members. Best regards, Tony __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] 6.5 quake hits Mexico
Just heard Vera Cruz area of Mexico has been hit by 6.5 magnitude earthquake. Chris Spratt (Via my iPhone) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Pacific Ocean Meteor seen of Coast of Japan prior to Earthquake 7APR2011
Dear List, A large bolide passed near Hatoyama, Saitama, Japan on 7APR2011 (near my house; of course I missed it - winds were blowing to hard to be on the roof) a few hours prior to the earthquake. A photo of the event was taken by an mateur astronomer Mitsuo Muraoka in Hatoyama out of an observatory. There is a story on SpaceWeather; a link to it is on my site: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/2011/04/tohoku-another-major-earthquake-will-be.html Best Always, Dirk Ross...Tokyo __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] sale/ad Seymchan full slices great etch! Over 250 items
Hi all I have recently add some really great full slices of Seymchan siderite, they are small 20 grams and up. I have Dronino part slices, Chinga part slices and 1 full slice as well. I have small Morasko slices as well as bigger ones, Toluca full slices small and large, Canyon Diablo full slices small and large plus tiny individuals to several hundred grams. Many prices have been reduced to as low as I can go, so take a look here http://shop.ebay.com/flattoprocks/m.html?_trksid=p4340.l2562 I have some awesome Muonionalusta full slices, Morasko, Seymchan and tons more on the web site you can have a look here http://www.meteoritefinder.com/whats-new-sale.htm Many many more items than I have listed here. -- Mike Miller 3835 E Nicole Ave Kingman Az 86409 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-757-1378 __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Pacific Ocean Meteor seen of Coast of Japan prior to Earthquake 7APR2011
Are you sure??? That looks like an airplane to me and no mention of it being a meteor is made on spaceweather.com... Rather the story is simply about the conjunction of the moon with the Pleiades... Clear Skies! Elizabeth On 4/7/2011 5:08 PM, drtanuki wrote: Dear List, A large bolide passed near Hatoyama, Saitama, Japan on 7APR2011 (near my house; of course I missed it - winds were blowing to hard to be on the roof) a few hours prior to the earthquake. A photo of the event was taken by an mateur astronomer Mitsuo Muraoka in Hatoyama out of an observatory. There is a story on SpaceWeather; a link to it is on my site: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/2011/04/tohoku-another-major-earthquake-will-be.html Best Always, Dirk Ross...Tokyo __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Pacific Ocean Meteor seen of Coast of Japan prior to Earthquake 7APR2011
Elizabeth and List (Mike and Jason), Thank you! It appears that you are correct. I had received several queries about a meteor in the area at that time and maybe mis-read the post on SpaceWeather? Dirk...Tokyo --- On Fri, 4/8/11, Elizabeth Warner warne...@astro.umd.edu wrote: From: Elizabeth Warner warne...@astro.umd.edu Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Pacific Ocean Meteor seen of Coast of Japan prior to Earthquake 7APR2011 To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Friday, April 8, 2011, 6:24 AM Are you sure??? That looks like an airplane to me and no mention of it being a meteor is made on spaceweather.com... Rather the story is simply about the conjunction of the moon with the Pleiades... Clear Skies! Elizabeth On 4/7/2011 5:08 PM, drtanuki wrote: Dear List, A large bolide passed near Hatoyama, Saitama, Japan on 7APR2011 (near my house; of course I missed it - winds were blowing to hard to be on the roof) a few hours prior to the earthquake. A photo of the event was taken by an mateur astronomer Mitsuo Muraoka in Hatoyama out of an observatory. There is a story on SpaceWeather; a link to it is on my site: http://lunarmeteoritehunters.blogspot.com/2011/04/tohoku-another-major-earthquake-will-be.html Best Always, Dirk Ross...Tokyo __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] NYT Story ? Overseas and Local Distribution
Paul and list, Thanks Paul for supplying the list with the various papers and websites that are carrying the NYT article. I was especially disappointed to see The American Scientist carrying the story with the first threw paragraphs and then when you click on see more it goes to the NYT website with the entire story and photos. I'm saddened that the American Scientist apparently didn't do any legwork to review the story or do any of their own research before blindly posting it. I'm guessing it doesn't take much anymore to call yourself a scientist in America or the world. I'm sure Ben Franklin, Thomas Alva Edison and Albert Einstein must be rolling over in their graves now. I have been preparing a response to the article in the NYT and as others have mentioned it may not do any good with the Times, but at this point it's gone almost viral worldwide. It's a pity that there aren't more responsible journalist out there. I fear as Adam Hupe and others have mentioned that the damage is done. This almost surreal smear campaign has taken on a life of its own and I'm still curious as to why the writer Mr. Broad with the NYT decided to chose his words so vehemently as to sound to critical and to apparently not give much thought as to the sensationalism of how be constructed the article nor to the outcome and repercussions of what would come to the meteorite community. Hoping for a better rest of the week and month after this. All the best! Brian -- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 7 Apr 2011 6:48:33 -0500 From: Paul H. oxytropidoce...@cox.net Subject: [meteorite-list] NYT Story ? Overseas and Local Distribution To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Message-ID: 20110407074833.O0X65.28280.imail@eastrmwml37 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 ?Overseas list members, if you have the opportunity, please peruse the International Herald Tribune to see if they picked up the story and run it in its entirety.? By searching the International Herald Tribune web site, I found that it was published in this newspaper on April 4 at: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/05/science/05meteorite.html?_r=1scp=1sq=meteoritesst=cse The entire story also appeared in the Sydney Morning Herald as ?Souvenirs from space,? April 7, 2011, http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html Also, it appeared at: 1. rssbroadcast,com, April 4, 2011 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40828 http://rssbroadcast.com/?p=40742 2. WA.today, Australia, April 6, 2011. http://www.watoday.com.au/world/science/souvenirs-from-space-20110406-1d4g9.html 3. Yahoo News http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NorthAmexemObservers/message/10634 4. Daily Comet, Lafourche Parish Louisiana http://www.dailycomet.com/article/NY/20110405/ZNYT03/104053033/1225/news100?Title=Black-Market-Trinkets-From-Space 5. A version of the New York Times story, ?Il mercato nero dei meteoriti? appeared in the ?Post? on April 6, 2011, http://www.ilpost.it/2011/04/06/il-mercato-nero-dei-meteoriti/ This entire text of this article is making the rounds of the Internet. This is something that definitely needs to be considered in any response. It certainly will make preparing an effective response to the article quite difficult as it is being reprinted, in some cases under different titles and in different languages, in a wild range of media outlets. To further complicate matters, the link to this article is being posted a number of web sites. For example; 1. Egyptology News at: http://egyptology.blogspot.com/2011/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space.html 2. environmental reporting at: http://word.emerson.edu/sprg11jr364/2011/04/04/black-market-trinkets-from-space/ and 3. American Scientist http://www.americanscientist.org/science/pub/-1875 Yours, Paul H __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Shawn, Mike list, I may have this right? It is my understanding that parings are based not only on like lithology but like chemistry plays an equally important role as well. In determining origin such as assigning certain meteorites to a certain place of origin all of that is basically out the window. This because comparison of Oxygen isotopes rules when it comes to origins. For this reason this group of meteorites is all put into the same category as originating from the same parent body. What complicates this theory is the fact that Mesosiderites and Pallasites also have the same Oxygen isotopes range and therefore might also have come from the same parent. Trouble is , considering what part of a parent those types come from. Their parent may have been destroyed. This lends itself to a possible argument that yes, these are all part of the same parent but, whether it is Vesta remains to be seen. This is why it is a good idea to go to vesta and check it out. Because for all we know this group may no longer have a parent still out there. A case in point. GRA 06128,9. are grouped with the brachinites. This in spite of the fact that they are nothing like brachinites ( they are like Chassigny) . But the Oxygen isotopes says they are related so they became brachinites. Other studies by others showed their O isotopes to fall within the Ureilite zone so I guess it depends on which O isotopes is the correct one. Further, ALH 84001 has O isotopes that do not match the rest of the Martian clan as it is today . It instead has O isotopes that are what an ancient Mars used to have. But again, it is all on the O isotopes. They rule. Carl -- Carl or Debbie Esparza Meteoritemax Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Regine, List, Please correct me if I'm wrong but, I think Scientists base this origin theory on similar Oxygen isotopes and if that is correct then Mesosiderites and pallasites are also in that zone and are therefore also in the same category of HEDOD? Carl -- Carl or Debbie Esparza Meteoritemax Regine Petersen fips_br...@yahoo.de wrote: Thanks Mike. I was wondering if there was a site listing all the resp. meteorites by name. But I guess I can look up the types on MetBull and compile a list. Thanks, R. --- Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com schrieb am Do, 7.4.2011: Von: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? An: Regine Petersen fips_br...@yahoo.de CC: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Datum: Donnerstag, 7. April, 2011 04:58 Uhr Hi Regine, All HEDOD meteorites are assumed to be Vestan in origin - Howardite, Eucrite, Diogenite, Olivine diogenite, and Dunite. :) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/6/11, Regine Petersen fips_br...@yahoo.de wrote: Hi all, Is there a list of assumed Vesta meteorites? Regine __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hi Michael: Yes, there is a smoking gun and a trail of dust, too. Reflectance spectra of Vesta and areas of Vesta consistent with spectra of HED meteorites and composition of HEDs. Big crater that could be the source of said meteorites. Vestoids in an area where asteroids can be tossed out of the asteroid belt into Earth-crossing orbits. Vestoids IN Earth-crossing orbits. Short of a sample return, not sure what more evidence you need (smoking gun but not a confession). Larry Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been listed on the MBD. I find it odd, but again I have seen a few meteorites get these weird names or nick names to create a buzz. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html --- On Thu, 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: fips_br...@yahoo.de, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 5:40 AM Hi Shawn: I do not think anyone responded to your question about olinive-bearing diogenites. Here is a links to articles: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2003/pdf/1502.pdf http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2008/pdf/1835.pdf Sorry, but have not been keeping up on the subject. Larry Hello Mike, Regine, and Listers Regine there are 486 HED meteorites that are non Antarctica. Mike and Listers I have a question... I was trying to search for the other two HEDOD Olivine diogenite, and Dunites on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database and under class they do not have those listed. Am I missing something? Or am I overlooking the classes and I need glasses? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore
[meteorite-list] Dawn Approaches Asteroid Vesta
http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2011/07apr_dawn/ Dawn Approaches Asteroid Vesta NASA Science News April 7, 2011: After 3 ½ years of thrusting silently through the void, NASA's Dawn spacecraft is on the threshold of a new world. It's deep in the asteroid belt, less than 4 months from giant asteroid Vesta. We're closing in, says Marc Rayman, Dawn's chief engineer and mission manager. And I'm getting more excited every day! Dawn will enter orbit around Vesta in July 2011, becoming the first spacecraft ever to orbit a body in the asteroid belt. After conducting a detailed study of the uncharted alien world for a year, the spacecraft will pull off an even more impressive first. It will leave Vesta, fly to dwarf planet Ceres, and enter orbit there. This is unprecedented, says Rayman. No spacecraft has ever orbited two target bodies, much less worlds in the asteroid belt. A few probes have passed through this vast region of space, but not one could stop and develop an intimate portrait of its residents. A conventional spacecraft gets a boost from a big rocket, then coasts to its target. Carrying enough fuel for making significant changes in speed or direction along the way would make it too heavy to launch. Dawn is far more fuel efficient. Spanning 65 feet, its solar arrays collect power from the sun to ionize atoms of xenon gas. These ions are expelled silently out the back of the spacecraft by a strong electric field, producing a gentle thrust. The weightless, frictionless conditions of space flight allow this gossamer force effect to build up, so the spacecraft continuously gains speed. This spacecraft ultimately achieves fantastically high velocity while consuming very little propellant -- using only a kilogram of xenon every 4 days, though its engines are almost constantly active. With this system Dawn has been quietly, gradually reshaping its orbit around the sun, slowly spiraling out to its target, getting closer and closer as it loops around. By the time the spacecraft is in the vicinity of Vesta, its orbit will be very much like the asteroid's, explains Rayman. So upon arrival, Dawn can slip into orbit as gently as it's been moving for 3 ½ years.* A conventional spacecraft screeches into orbit in a single dramatic, nail biting instant. The mission team is usually gathered in the mission control room with their eyes riveted on the telemetry to see that the final critical maneuver goes smoothly. With Dawn, there is no one big maneuver, no fiery burn, no single critical moment. Dawn's entry into orbit will be no different from what the spacecraft does almost all the time, what it's doing as you read this article. In fact, when Dawn sidles into orbit, I might be asleep. Or if it's Friday night I'll be dancing, or if it's Saturday I might be out taking pictures of dragonflies. But you can bet he'll be in mission control when the pictures start coming in. It will be incredibly exciting to watch Dawn close in on Vesta. We'll witness the uninteresting smudge in the first distant images grow into a full-sized world as we loop closer and closer, ending up just 110 miles above the surface. That's closer than the ISS is to Earth! We'll be right there, and if there are no tall trees we'll be safe. After exploring Vesta for a year, Dawn will take leave of the rocky world as softly as it arrived there, climbing out along a spiral, gradually getting farther and farther away, the loops getting longer and longer, until the asteroid's gravity gently releases the spacecraft. Dawn will again be orbiting the sun on its own, just as it is now. It will complete about two thirds of a lap before arriving at Ceres. There it will once again slide gently into orbit around a new world, guided by ion thrusters as silent as space itself. Even if we imagined a sound, it would be the faintest of whispers, the softest of sighs. Yet it tells us the secret of making an interplanetary spaceship that can travel to and explore distant, alien worlds, carrying with it the dreams of those on Earth who long to know the cosmos. Author: Dauna Coulter Editor: Dr. Tony Phillips Credit: Science@NASA __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Wet, Carbonaceous Asteroids: Altering Minerals, Changing Amino Acids
http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/April11/amino_acids.html Wet, Carbonaceous Asteroids: Altering Minerals, Changing Amino Acids Planetary Science Research Discoveries April 7, 2011 --- Aqueous alteration in asteroids containing organic compounds leads to formation of hydrous minerals and changes in the mix of amino acids. Written by G. Jeffrey Taylor Hawai'i Institute of Geophysics and Planetology Many carbonaceous chondrites contain alteration products from water-rock interactions at low temperature and organic compounds. A fascinating fact known for decades is the presence in some of them of an assortment of organic compounds, including amino acids, sometimes called the building blocks of life. Murchison and other CM carbonaceous chondrites contain hundreds of amino acids. Early measurements indicated that the amino acids in carbonaceous chondrites had equal proportions of L- and D-structures, a situation called racemic. This was in sharp contrast to life on Earth, which heavily favors L-forms. However, beginning in 1997, John Cronin and Sandra Pizzarello (Arizona State University) found L-excesses in isovaline and several other amino acids in the Murchison carbonaceous chondrite. In 2009, Daniel Glavin and Jason Dworkin (Astrobiology Analytical Lab, Goddard Space Flight Center) reported the first independent confirmation of L-isovaline excesses in Murchison using a different analytical technique than employed by Cronin and Pizzarello. Inspired by this work, Daniel Glavin, Michael Callahan, Jason Dworkin, and Jamie Elsila (Astrobiology Analytical Lab, Goddard Space Flight Center), have done an extensive study of the abundance and symmetry of amino acids in carbonaceous chondrites that experienced a range of alteration by water in their parent asteroids. The results show that amino acids are more abundant in the less altered meteorites, implying that aqueous processing changes the mix of amino acids. They also confirmed the enrichment in L-structures of some amino acids, especially isovaline, confirming earlier work. The authors suggest that aqueously-altered planetesimals might have seeded the early Earth with nonracemic amino acids, perhaps explaining why life from microorganisms to people use only L-forms to make proteins. The initial imbalance caused by non-biologic processes in wet asteroids might have been amplified by life on Earth. Alternatively, the same processes that produced the L-amino acid excesses in carbonaceous asteroids also operated on the early Earth. Reference: * Glavin, D. P., Callahan, M. P., Dworkin, J. P., and Elsila, J. E. (2011) The Effects of Parent Body Processes on Amino Acids in Carbonaceous Chondrites. /Meteoritics and Planetary Science,/ v. 45(12), p. 1948-1972, doi: 10./j.1945-5100.2010.01132.x * *PSRDpresents:* Wet, Carbonaceous Asteroids: Altering Minerals, Changing Amino Acids --Short Slide Summary PSRD-amino_acids.ppt (with accompanying notes). Wet and Gunky Meteorites Carbonaceous chondrites have a range of properties. Some are wetter than others, some have more carbon than others, some have much higher concentrations of organic compounds than others. Daniel Glavin and his co-authors focused on those with significant amounts of organic compounds--up to only 2-3%, but that's enough to give the meteorites a distinctive earthy smell, a bit like tar. Their set of meteorites also included a range in the amount to which water affected their primary anhydrous minerals to produce a host of complicated hydrous minerals. Examples of the effects of aqueous alteration are shown in the electron microscope images below. BSE image of a typical chondrule in a meteorite that did not experience aqueous alteration. BSE image of a type of chondrule that was aqueously altered. [Left] Image taken in a scanning electron microscope using backscattered electrons of a typical chondrule in a meteorite that has not experienced aqueous alteration. The chondrule, which fills the field of view, is composed mostly of olivine (ol) with inclusions of iron sulfide (sf). None of the olivine crystals are altered. Even the mesostasis (mes), the last of the molten chondrule to crystallize, is unaffected. [Right] Backscattered scanning electron micrograph of a typical chondrule (specifically what cosmochemists call a Type IAB chondrule) in the CM chondrite ALH 81002. The high-temperature primary mineral enstatite has been partially altered to serpentine (ragged, darkest gray crystals). In the outer parts of the chondrule the enstatite crystals have been almost completely replaced by Mg-serpentine, though the outlines of the enstatities are preserved. The brighter interstitial regions are mainly altered mesostasis glass that has been replaced by an early generation of Fe-serpentine. This chondrule is surrounded by a broad, fine-grained rim. Chondritic meteorites vary substantially in their properties, although all but one type contain chondrules,
[meteorite-list] ANNOUNCEMENT: Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine Forum is LIVE!
Introducing the official MHC Magazine Forum: Join, Talk, Discuss, Debate, Learn, Laugh and Have FUN http://www.mhcmagazine.com/forum/ Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine http://www.mhcmagazine.com Magazine Questions Email: contact[at]mhcmagazine.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] New 5+ Kilo Lunar - Shisr 162
Hi List, A new lunar was approved into the Met Bulletin today - a 5kg rock held by anonymous which was found in Oman(!) in 2006. Does anyone know anything about this new lunar (other than what is in the write-up), and does anyone have a photo of it? Congratulations to Anonymous - a 5 kilo lunar is quite a prize. Best regards, MikeG PS - I hope whoever found it, didn't use a backhoe to remove it. ;) -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Vesta, for sure?
Hi Listthis is a completely neophyte question, so please accept my ignorance in things astronomicand allow me to ask you experts: I have always wondered why Vesta is the parent-body-de-jur for our HEDs, when so many unfound asteroids are no doubt cruizing around out there. Hence my question: Have any asteroids been paired yet, and if not, why Vesta alone gets the credit; as well, couldn't our HED cousins be cousins from a yet-to-be-discovered asteroid pairing? As you true scientists of course recognize, I'm completely green in this area. I guess it's my timeless query (X-factors-we-need-to consider) that has me bewildered. Has Vesta somehow distinguished itself as the one-and-only parent-body? I do understand reflection technology has identified our HED meteorites to be from Vesta, but why not an undiscovered twin? Or many multiple twins? With deference to those of you already in the know, Richard Montgomery - Original Message - From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu To: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 4:39 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Hi Michael: Yes, there is a smoking gun and a trail of dust, too. Reflectance spectra of Vesta and areas of Vesta consistent with spectra of HED meteorites and composition of HEDs. Big crater that could be the source of said meteorites. Vestoids in an area where asteroids can be tossed out of the asteroid belt into Earth-crossing orbits. Vestoids IN Earth-crossing orbits. Short of a sample return, not sure what more evidence you need (smoking gun but not a confession). Larry Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So what I am gathering at this time is that these two classes or sub or non at this time are not recognized by the MBD as a classification. Am I right? If it was wouldn't it be listed on the MBD as one. So do this mean its a subclass or something else. I have heard from some that dunites are not a meteorite classification. I have to believe that statement could be true because I don't see dunites coming up on the MDB classification menu or Olivine diogenites. By chance who coined these quote un quote classifications and why haven't they been listed on the MBD. I find it odd, but again I have seen a few meteorites get these weird names or nick names to create
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hi Larry and List, I stand corrected. We don't have a smoking gun, but we do have a smoking crater on Vesta. :) I didn't mean to imply that the origin of HEDs was still in doubt. But rather, just to point out that the Vestan origin is a theory, like relativity or evolution. We *know* them to be true, and we can produce evidence that supports the theory, but is the Vesta-HED connection as sure as the lunar or martian meteorite connection? We have moon rocks brought back by Apollo astronauts to compare first-hand with lunar meteorites. We have atmospheric data from Sojourner that we can compare directly with trapped gas in Martian meteorites. Those two connections are rock solid, pun intended. With Vesta, we have spectral analysis and a host of other convincing data (as Larry pointed out), but do we have the kind of solid evidence needed to rule out all other possible parent bodies? I'm guess what I am asking here is this - are there any holdouts in the scientific community who are not convinced that HEDs are from Vesta? And if so, will data from the Dawn mission finally push them into the yes camp? It was my understanding that in the spectrum of parent body and meteorite matching, the Vesta connection was right below lunar and mars, but well above angrites and Mercury. Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: Hi Michael: Yes, there is a smoking gun and a trail of dust, too. Reflectance spectra of Vesta and areas of Vesta consistent with spectra of HED meteorites and composition of HEDs. Big crater that could be the source of said meteorites. Vestoids in an area where asteroids can be tossed out of the asteroid belt into Earth-crossing orbits. Vestoids IN Earth-crossing orbits. Short of a sample return, not sure what more evidence you need (smoking gun but not a confession). Larry Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the write-up as diogenite-unique, but looks like an olivine diogenite. Note, there is at least one possible pairing to NWA 1877 floating around and NWA 6149 comes to mind. (although the latter may not be officially paired yet) Note, NWA 6149 (and 5 others) are classified as diogenite-olivine - 3 of the others are NWA and one is Antarctic. The earliest apparent classification for this type (that appears in the Bulletin) is NWA 5603. (2004) Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Larry and Listerites Thank you Larry for the links. But I think my question is still unanswered or it hasn't been directly spelled out, which I am that type of person that needs it all. I do not see Olivine diogenite, and Dunite on the classification menu on the Meteoritical Bulletin Database (MBD) which is the BIBLE of all bibles when it comes to classification of meteorites. So
Re: [meteorite-list] New 5+ Kilo Lunar - Shisr 162
--- On Thu, 4/7/11, Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: PS - I hope whoever found it, didn't use a backhoe to remove it. ;) That doesn't matter. Even if it was it is beyond the statute of limitations. :) Looking forward to hearing more. -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: My store is OPEN
Just wanted to let the list know that I now have my E-Bay store open for www.FallenStarHunters.com Meteorite Recovery Team. If you would care to, take a look and see what you think. I still have a lot more items to put on there, but I've got the hard part done now. We've already sold our first meteorite on the first day! I'm happy so far!!! Thanks! Barrett Roxanne Flowers http://stores.ebay.com/FallenStarHunters www.FallenStarHunters.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] ANNOUNCEMENT: Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine Forum is LIVE!
Hey guys, I'm going to be publishing a story about the dark market topic in an upcoming issue of MHC Magazine. I'd like some feedback and as many opinions on this as possible. I will be conducting interviews as well. I've spoken with a few of you already, (thanks for your participation) but would like you guys who normally keep quiet to step up and tell your side. A lot of opinions have been shared and I'd like some back and forth from your differing points of view on the forum. I'll be using this to create the article and pair it with interviews, and facts and opinions from all sides of this hot topic. This is your chance to get your opinion heard and the facts straight regardless of what side you're on. Here's an outlet, use it! Regards, Eric On 4/7/2011 5:52 PM, Meteorites USA wrote: Introducing the official MHC Magazine Forum: Join, Talk, Discuss, Debate, Learn, Laugh and Have FUN http://www.mhcmagazine.com/forum/ Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine http://www.mhcmagazine.com Magazine Questions Email: contact[at]mhcmagazine.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
Hey Michael. I'm sure Larry and other more learned people will respond, but until then, if you have it, take a look at _Meteorites and their Parent Planets_ (partly available online as a Google Book) I'm away from my bookshelf at the moment so can't cite pages unfortunately. To give you a short answer, we know the origin of only Lunars, Martians and Almahata Sitta. Other than that, the best we can do is compare reflectance spectra of asteroid at the telescope and meteorites in the lab, finding the best matches between the two. DAWN will be able to analyze the mineral make up of Vesta and determine if indeed HEDs come from there. I believe that we'll not only prove this connection, but in some cases it should be possible that we'll even be able to pinpoint specific locations on the surface as the origin of the meteorites in our labs and collections. Cheers -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 --- On Thu, 4/7/11, Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: From: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 6:14 PM Hi Larry and List, I stand corrected. We don't have a smoking gun, but we do have a smoking crater on Vesta. :) I didn't mean to imply that the origin of HEDs was still in doubt. But rather, just to point out that the Vestan origin is a theory, like relativity or evolution. We *know* them to be true, and we can produce evidence that supports the theory, but is the Vesta-HED connection as sure as the lunar or martian meteorite connection? We have moon rocks brought back by Apollo astronauts to compare first-hand with lunar meteorites. We have atmospheric data from Sojourner that we can compare directly with trapped gas in Martian meteorites. Those two connections are rock solid, pun intended. With Vesta, we have spectral analysis and a host of other convincing data (as Larry pointed out), but do we have the kind of solid evidence needed to rule out all other possible parent bodies? I'm guess what I am asking here is this - are there any holdouts in the scientific community who are not convinced that HEDs are from Vesta? And if so, will data from the Dawn mission finally push them into the yes camp? It was my understanding that in the spectrum of parent body and meteorite matching, the Vesta connection was right below lunar and mars, but well above angrites and Mercury. Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: Hi Michael: Yes, there is a smoking gun and a trail of dust, too. Reflectance spectra of Vesta and areas of Vesta consistent with spectra of HED meteorites and composition of HEDs. Big crater that could be the source of said meteorites. Vestoids in an area where asteroids can be tossed out of the asteroid belt into Earth-crossing orbits. Vestoids IN Earth-crossing orbits. Short of a sample return, not sure what more evidence you need (smoking gun but not a confession). Larry Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO group. I don't think anyone is expecting the Dawn mission to disprove this theory. Everyone expects Dawn to confirm what the circumstantial evidence has implied - that the HEDO group is truly Vestan. While olivine diogenite may not appear in the official classification tree, NWA 1877 is classified as diogenite-an (of which, there are only two approved as such). There other is Grosvenor Mountains 9, which is described in the
[meteorite-list] Vesta, for sure?
Hi List...this is a completely neophyte question, so please accept my ignorance in things astronomic...and allow me to ask you experts: I have always wondered why Vesta is the parent-body-de-jur for our HEDs, when so many unfound asteroids are no doubt cruizing around out there. Hence my question: Have any asteroids been paired yet, and if not, why Vesta alone gets the credit; as well, couldn't our HED cousins be cousins from a yet-to-be-discovered asteroid pairing? As you true scientists of course recognize, I'm completely green in this area. I guess it's my timeless query (X-factors-we-need-to-consider) that has me bewildered. Has Vesta somehow distinguished itself as the one-and-only parent-body? I do understand reflection technology has identified our HED meteorites to be from Vesta, but why not an undiscovered twin? Or many multiple twins? With deference to those of you already in the know, Richard Montgomery __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
G'Day Richard, Michael and list ( I'm away from my bookshelf at the moment so can't cite pages unfortunately. ) 92-93 a good starting point. Cheers John IMCA #2125 -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Richard Kowalski Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 6:37 PM To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? Hey Michael. I'm sure Larry and other more learned people will respond, but until then, if you have it, take a look at _Meteorites and their Parent Planets_ (partly available online as a Google Book) I'm away from my bookshelf at the moment so can't cite pages unfortunately. To give you a short answer, we know the origin of only Lunars, Martians and Almahata Sitta. Other than that, the best we can do is compare reflectance spectra of asteroid at the telescope and meteorites in the lab, finding the best matches between the two. DAWN will be able to analyze the mineral make up of Vesta and determine if indeed HEDs come from there. I believe that we'll not only prove this connection, but in some cases it should be possible that we'll even be able to pinpoint specific locations on the surface as the origin of the meteorites in our labs and collections. Cheers -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 --- On Thu, 4/7/11, Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: From: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta? To: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 6:14 PM Hi Larry and List, I stand corrected. We don't have a smoking gun, but we do have a smoking crater on Vesta. :) I didn't mean to imply that the origin of HEDs was still in doubt. But rather, just to point out that the Vestan origin is a theory, like relativity or evolution. We *know* them to be true, and we can produce evidence that supports the theory, but is the Vesta-HED connection as sure as the lunar or martian meteorite connection? We have moon rocks brought back by Apollo astronauts to compare first-hand with lunar meteorites. We have atmospheric data from Sojourner that we can compare directly with trapped gas in Martian meteorites. Those two connections are rock solid, pun intended. With Vesta, we have spectral analysis and a host of other convincing data (as Larry pointed out), but do we have the kind of solid evidence needed to rule out all other possible parent bodies? I'm guess what I am asking here is this - are there any holdouts in the scientific community who are not convinced that HEDs are from Vesta? And if so, will data from the Dawn mission finally push them into the yes camp? It was my understanding that in the spectrum of parent body and meteorite matching, the Vesta connection was right below lunar and mars, but well above angrites and Mercury. Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/7/11, lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu wrote: Hi Michael: Yes, there is a smoking gun and a trail of dust, too. Reflectance spectra of Vesta and areas of Vesta consistent with spectra of HED meteorites and composition of HEDs. Big crater that could be the source of said meteorites. Vestoids in an area where asteroids can be tossed out of the asteroid belt into Earth-crossing orbits. Vestoids IN Earth-crossing orbits. Short of a sample return, not sure what more evidence you need (smoking gun but not a confession). Larry Hi Shawn, Larry, and Expat Vestans, I included Dunite in my answer to Regine's question because I wanted to be all inclusive. Of course, the old axiom of damned if you, damned if you don't comes into play here. Had I left out Dunite, someone would have inevitably suggested it. Since I included it, the inevitable question of whether or not it actually belongs was brought up. This highlights the uncertainty inherent in theorizing about other worlds that we lack first-hand knowledge of. Even the widely-accepted HED's are theoretically assigned to Vesta. There is no smoking gun yet that any meteorite originates from Vesta - at least that is my understanding of the HEDO group. But, so much circumstantial evidence points to Vesta, that it is generally agreed upon to be the parent body of the HEDO
Re: [meteorite-list] List of meteorites from Vesta?
On Thu, 7 Apr 2011 19:15:53 -0700, you wrote: G'Day Richard, Michael and list ( I'm away from my bookshelf at the moment so can't cite pages unfortunately. ) 92-93 a good starting point. Check out page 149 (as numbered in the PDF) or page 137 (as numbered in the book) http://www.sendspace.com/file/3ps9qu __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 8, 2011
http://www.rocksfromspace.org/April_8_2011.html --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] ANNOUNCEMENT: Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine Forum is LIVE!
Looks Spiffy! Nice job and thanks for providing it to the meteorite community! Elton - Original Message From: Meteorites USA e...@meteoritesusa.com To: Meteorite-list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 8:52:30 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] ANNOUNCEMENT: Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine Forum is LIVE! Introducing the official MHC Magazine Forum: Join, Talk, Discuss, Debate, Learn, Laugh and Have FUN http://www.mhcmagazine.com/forum/ Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorite Hunting Collecting Magazine http://www.mhcmagazine.com Magazine Questions Email: contact[at]mhcmagazine.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New 5+ Kilo Lunar - Shisr 162
Hello Michael, All, You should check the WUSTL list more often; it's been posted for some months. http://meteorites.wustl.edu/lunar/stones/unnamed19.htm The list: http://meteorites.wustl.edu/lunar/moon_meteorites_list_alumina.htm The lunar you mention is largely uncut, and resides in the hands of the finder. I think he *may* have been looking to sell some, but I wouldn't be the person to ask. I assume he's a list-member, so if he sees this, maybe he'll chime in. Regards, Jason On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 6:06 PM, Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: Hi List, A new lunar was approved into the Met Bulletin today - a 5kg rock held by anonymous which was found in Oman(!) in 2006. Does anyone know anything about this new lunar (other than what is in the write-up), and does anyone have a photo of it? Congratulations to Anonymous - a 5 kilo lunar is quite a prize. Best regards, MikeG PS - I hope whoever found it, didn't use a backhoe to remove it. ;) -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Vesta, for sure?
Very good question Richard, which doesn't get explored often enough. Harry Hap McSween wrote a book titled Meteorites and their Parent Bodies where extensive spectral measurements were taken from meteorites and from asteroids and an extensive list of possible and probable asteroidal connections were given for many of the meteorites in our world collection. (BTW He also wrote much about transport theory to Earth) Several other scientists have followed with more research in the past decade and there is a conscientious that HEDs do come from Vesta or its fragmented daughters. My personal opinion is that the Vesta-HED connection is perhaps taken too literally at times, but going back far enough-- all HEDs do come from Vesta-- before it lost a part of its mass about 1 billion years ago in a big wack. The mineralogy we see today was from an intact planetary/differentiated body One would think for meteorites which are regolyths-- ( e.g. Howardites) we would have sampled many more asteroid bodies ( Ceres etc) and, it is very likely that we have sampled (via meteorite) some parent bodies which no longer exist: collision accretion, ejection etc and would not have any spectral measurements to compare them to. Here is one of many abstracts regarding 4 Vesta which discuss the probability HEDs are from Vesta or the 20 small bodies with similar spectra. Chips off of Asteroid 4 Vesta: Evidence for the Parent Body of Basaltic Achondrite Meteorite http://www.sciencemag.org/content/260/5105/186.abstract For more than two decades, asteroid 4 Vesta has been debated as the source for the eucrite, diogenite, and howardite classes of basaltic achondrite meteorites. Its basaltic achondrite spectral properties are unlike those of other large main-belt asteroids. Telescopic measurements have revealed 20 small (diameters ≤ 10 kilometers) main-belt asteroids that have distinctive optical reflectance spectral features similar to those of Vesta and eucrite and diogenite meteorites. Twelve have orbits that are similar to Vesta's and were previously predicted to be dynamically associated with Vesta. Eight bridge the orbital space between Vesta and the 3:1 resonance, a proposed source region for meteorites. These asteroids are most probably multikilometer-sized fragments excavated from Vesta through one or more impacts. The sizes, ejection velocities of 500 meters per second, and proximity of these fragments to the 3:1 resonance establish Vesta as a dynamically viable source for eucrite, diogenite, and howardite meteorites. Perhaps it is simply a matter of the postman's route and Vesta et.al. is the only candidate with the orbital dynamics to make deliveries to our sector of the solar system. To answer your question specifically-- the answer is Vesta is the only source--unless hypothedical twin was one of those early solar system bodies no longer with us. The size of Vesta is necessary to produce the variety of mineralogy we see in the HEDs. It had to be large enough to generate basalt/differentiation and also possess enough gravity to sort the mineralogy into layers akin to crust , mantle(s), and (probably) core AND it would also have to have a huge crater which excavated it down to the deep /lower mantle. So far as I know there is nothing else that can fill the bill. Safe to say ,all the larger asteroids in the inner solar system have been identified. Elton - Original Message From: Richard Montgomery rickm...@earthlink.net To: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu; Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 9:09:46 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Vesta, for sure? Hi Listthis is a completely neophyte question, so please accept my ignorance in things astronomicand allow me to ask you experts: I have always wondered why Vesta is the parent-body-de-jur for our HEDs, when so many unfound asteroids are no doubt cruizing around out there. Hence my question: Have any asteroids been paired yet, and if not, why Vesta alone gets the credit; as well, couldn't our HED cousins be cousins from a yet-to-be-discovered asteroid pairing? As you true scientists of course recognize, I'm completely green in this area. I guess it's my timeless query (X-factors-we-need-to consider) that has me bewildered. Has Vesta somehow distinguished itself as the one-and-only parent-body? I do understand reflection technology has identified our HED meteorites to be from Vesta, but why not an undiscovered twin? Or many multiple twins? With deference to those of you already in the know, Richard Montgomery __ Visit the
Re: [meteorite-list] Vesta, for sure? part 2
The wikipedia articles linked below fit very well with Richards question as well as the discussion of dunite and olivine diogenites. It also removes my caveat about ejected body in my last message by stating that a candidate Diogenite-like asteroid unrelated to Vesta has been identified which may be from a differentiated body no longer with us. 1459 Magnya: Orbits in the outer main belt, too far from Vesta to be genetically related. May be the remains of a different ancient differentiated body that was shattered long ago. Another candidate for a dunite or olivine diogenite is: 2579 Spartacus — contains a significant portion of olivine, which may indicate origin deeper within Vesta than other V-types. See list at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-type_asteroid http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4_Vesta 2 Pallas is a large and most certainly differentiated body but lacks evidence of an excavation and its spectrum shows carbonaceous chondriteaffinities Elton - Original Message From: Richard Montgomery rickm...@earthlink.net To: Meteorite-list List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 9:42:30 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Vesta, for sure? Hi List...this is a completely neophyte question, so please accept my ignorance in things astronomic...and allow me to ask you experts: I have always wondered why Vesta is the parent-body-de-jur for our HEDs, when so many unfound asteroids are no doubt cruizing around out there. Hence my question: Have any asteroids been paired yet, and if not, why Vesta alone gets the credit; as well, couldn't our HED cousins be cousins from a yet-to-be-discovered asteroid pairing? As you true scientists of course recognize, I'm completely green in this area. I guess it's my timeless query (X-factors-we-need-to-consider) that has me bewildered. Has Vesta somehow distinguished itself as the one-and-only parent-body? I do understand reflection technology has identified our HED meteorites to be from Vesta, but why not an undiscovered twin? Or many multiple twins? With deference to those of you already in the know, Richard Montgomery __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] One more asteroid type which might shake an old meteorite axom: G-type
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-type_asteroid This includes 1 Ceres and the significance is that the spectral absorption suggests a composition including clays and phylosilicates--aka micas. These mineral classes require free water somewhere in their formation, by the way . So the old axiom that mica is never found in meteorites might need this potential exception to be taken into consideration next time a candidate specimen is summarily discarded owing to mica cointent. Elton __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 8, 2011
I'll pay $40 for it! : ) On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 9:05 PM, Michael Johnson mich...@rocksfromspace.org wrote: http://www.rocksfromspace.org/April_8_2011.html --- __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
