Re: [meteorite-list] Ad Tissint and several other goodies

[Mike Jensen]

Hi All
I have included several new offerings. Please continue to look down
the list as I have lowered several previous offerings.

Tissint Martian Shergottite Fell July 18 2011
These tiny stones are absolute lustrous gems. Priced at $900/g for the
75%+ crusted stones and $800/g for the stones under 75%
0.127 g 98 % crusted Tiny little gem. Has one tiny chip. $127
0.334 g 98 % crusted Three almost imperceptible chips. $300
0.438 g 95% crusted. One small chip. $394
0.806 g 90% oriented beauty with one chip. $725
2.72 g g 99% crusted Oriented beauty with two tiny chips $2720
0.533 g 60+% crusted  $426
0.321 g 60+% crusted  $256
0.137 g 75% crusted  $109

Check the photos out of these even if you are not interested in buying one.
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/Tissint?authkey=Gv1sRgCJ_msde_q-y_kAE


Bassikounou H5  Fell Oct 16, 2006
2.07 g  $31.00 100% crusted
2.40 g  $36.00 80% crusted
2.94 g  $44.00 80% crusted
3.16 g  $47.00 100% crusted 

Bediasite Tektite Texas
3.5 g  $50.00

Katol  India Fell May 22, 2012 possibly a primitive achondrite.
2.98 g 95%+ crusted whole stone. Whole crusted stone this small are
extremely rare. $596
7.08 g 60% crusted ½ stone. $700

Unclassified NWA possible Howardite 295 g $2950

Imilac Pallasite
13.1 g $130

Here are some pictures of the meteorites listed above:
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/October42012?authkey=Gv1sRgCOfOz_CugbqMXA


Here is a great lot of LDG that I purchased some years ago. Each piece
has been professionally cleaned. So most will not have the reddish
tint that is common with the typical LDG. I am trying to sell this
quickly so I have dropped the price down to lower that I have ever
seen it. The lot has had all the highest grade pieces removed but there
are still plenty of individuals that should sell for over $1 per gram.
Please look here for pictures of the typical quality of material available:
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/LDG

Prices are:
500 grams -1kg35 cents/gram reduced to 30 cents
1kg - 5kg 30 cents/gram reduced to 25 cents
5kg - 25kg   25 cents/gram reduced to 20 cents
25kg - 50kg 20 cents/gram reduced to 15 cents

Shipping is extra.

Here are several other previous offers:
Pictures for pieces below can be seen here;
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/May242012

Allende CV3 Fall 1969 Mexico
Here are several thin slices. Though the price per gram is high the
surface area is exceptional.
0.59 g $44.00
0.70 g $52.50
0.51 g $38.25

Bilanga Diogenite Fall 1999 Burkina Faso More super thin slices.
0.48 g $36.00
0.54 g $40.50
0.38 g $28.50

Millbillillie Eucrite Fall 1960 Australia Only one thin slice
0.22 g $25.00

NWA 3118 CV3 Another thin one
0.21g 25.00

Wagon Mound L6 New Mexico
39.4 g $69.00

Campo Tree Wire tied Campo del Cielo chips on a hematite base. These
were sold by Hans Kosher years ago. He sold them out quickly but I
managed to buy a few from him. If I remember correctly he mentioned
that they had 10 grams of Campos in each tree. Each comes in a
presentation box as pictured. I have several of these available.
Price is $17.50 each.

Pictures for pieces below can be seen here;
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/May17201202

Udei Station IAB-ungr Om Tons of silicates in this little piece.
16.6 g  $99

Huckitta Pallasite Super thin slice. Has "Rocks on Fire" label.
4.9 $9.00

Unclassified NWA Mostly NWA 869 but at least two that are different.
212 g $49.00

Chergach Stone H5 fell 2007 Mali
Dealer lot
280.8 g $500.00

Gibeon Jewelry pieces. I have several of these. They are etched and
coated with some very thick "glop" that certainly would have to be
removed with a solvent before they could be used. Only the largest
piece is shown.
$13.50 each or all for $9 each

Camel Donga Eucrite
65.5 g $800

Pictures for pieces below can be seen here;
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/May102012

Campo Del Cielo Iron IAB Og Argentina
Huge high quality whole iron below wholesale.
16 kg $1750

Nice smaller whole iron with great character.
3.64 kg $400.00

Nice silicated end cut. Contains some tiny olivine so it could be
called pallasitic. Does have a couple of rust spots.
432 g $432.00

NWA 869 Gotta be one of the largest slices available for sale.
971 g $650.00

NWA unclassified lot. Ex Mark Bostick label
35.4 g  $15.00

Zag Stone H3-5 Fell 1998 Western Sahara
4 stone lot
259 g $175.00

Philippinites Tektites Flat piece is very chipped. The photo does not
show that very well.
74.5 g $40.00

Pultusk Meteorite Coin Cook Islands - Pultusk Meteorite Fragment - $5
- 2008 - Palladium - Proof Silver Crown - Box & COA
$110.00

Nantan Meteorite Coin Palau - Genuine Nantan Meteorite Proof Silver
Crown - 2006 - $5 - Box & COA
$110.00

Pictures for pieces below can be seen here;
https://picasaweb.google.com/109538410126952617536/May32012

Kunashak L6 Fell June 1949 Very nice thin slices probably around 1mm or less.
0.514g $36.

Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites that are never classified

[Michael Farmer]

I own the Guadalajara mass, fell through a house in Zapopan, suburb of 
Guadalajara in sept 07. 
Sadly Zunhua seems to have been ignored by Chinese, Xining seems to be in same 
purgatory despite hundreds of news articles and at least 100 kg found. 
Katol is being worked on, very unique meteorite unlike anything known.
Rockhaven seems to be a scam.
Oslo, well, we see how fast Norway does classifications, good thing I sent Moss 
to the USA for quick work.
Draveil, who cares, French museum blackballed all collectors so let it be 
forgotten,


Michael Farmer

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 3, 2012, at 6:40 PM, "Galactic Stone & Ironworks" 
 wrote:

> Hi List,
> 
> The following meteorite falls from the 21st century have not been
> officially classified.  Does anyone have any updated information on
> these falls (such as the types)?  Since these are not official, I am
> using the most-common unofficial names.
> 
> In descending chronological order :
> 
> 2012 :
> 
> Katol (India, this is fairly recent, so the lack of official
> classification is understandable)
> Diplo (Pakistan, also recent)
> Oslo (Norway)
> Rockhaven (Canada)
> Huangzhong/Xining (China)
> 
> 2011 :
> 
> Draveil (France)
> 
> 2010 :
> 
> Breja (Algeria)
> 
> 2009 :
> 
> Cartersville (Georgia USA)
> 
> 2008 :
> 
> Zunhua (China)
> 
> 2007 :
> 
> Guadalajara (Mexico)
> 
> 2005 :
> 
> Montney (Canada)
> 
> Is there any reason(s) why some of these falls have not been classified?
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> MikeG
> 
> -- 
> -
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Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Ed Deckert]

I may be wrong, but only the owner of the cemetery could claim ownership. 
Families of the deceased who were buried there would not (AFAIK) have any 
claim to a meteorite landing on a family member's grave.  They do not own 
the plot they "purchased" to bury their deceased.  "Buying" the plot 
essentially gives them the limited property rights to use the land as a 
final resting place for their deceased.  There can be variations on that, I 
suppose.


Laws and rules will vary for Private, Public, Church and Military 
Cemeteries, etc.as they will have different ownership situations.  There is 
a lot to be considered there.


Someone visiting a cemetery and finds a meteorite on the ground would not 
likely be considered the rightful owner.


Ed


- Original Message - 
From: "Thunder Stone" 
To: "Brian Burrer" ; 


Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:42 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership



What about cemeteries? Who would claim ownership there?

-Original Message-

From: Brian Burrer
Sent: 3 Oct 2012 12:52:31 GMT
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

Greetings List,

I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
recoveries.
I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
on what roadside it was found on.
Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
the rest of their land.  The road is public but the bar-ditch is
private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
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Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?

[Richard Montgomery]

As Adam predicts, the oxymoron will emerge.  Public Land unavialable to the 
publicalready happening en masse with our forestsgates locked, 
supposedly to protect public lands from the public.


Pogo said is well,
"We have met then Enemy, and it is us!"

I've been looking for the constitutional authority to do all thisstill 
looking.


-Richard M

- Original Message - 
From: "Adam Hupe" 

To: "Adam" 
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 10:54 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?



The problem is we already have self-proclaimed spokespeople working our 
behalf. You will find them showing off the latest Mohave finds in front of 
the media or selling them on eBay claiming they are worth an outrageous 
fortune for full effect. The BLM claims that increased publicity has made 
them aware of the need to protect this exceedingly valuable treasure from 
space at all costs. This has hastened the end of a fine and wholesome 
avocation.


I would like to take this opportunity to thank those responsible for the 
soon-to-come complete closure of public land and the government for doing a 
fine job of protecting meteorites.


For the record, I have never sold any meteorite I have found on public land. 
I guess the 10.1 pounder will have to be left in the field or buried so 
somebody else doesn't accidentally find it and be tempted to break the law.


Joyful Hunting,

Adam

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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites that are never classified

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for info and for the frank commentary on the state of affairs
with these falls.  I didn't have a day/date for Guadalajara, so I
updated my recent falls list to include the Sept 07 date.

Agree about Katol.  It's the weirdest thing I have ever had my hands
on.  I'm very eager to learn more about this one.

What's the scoop on Rockhaven?  I never heard anything about it being
a scam.  I'd love to know, so if it's bogus, I can strike it from the
list.

I heard about what the French museum said in regards to Draveil.  That
is very unfortunate and uncalled for.  Apparently the French have a
few things to learn about meteorite collectors.  What nerve!

Best regards and happy huntings,

MikeG

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On 10/3/12, Michael Farmer  wrote:
> I own the Guadalajara mass, fell through a house in Zapopan, suburb of
> Guadalajara in sept 07.
> Sadly Zunhua seems to have been ignored by Chinese, Xining seems to be in
> same purgatory despite hundreds of news articles and at least 100 kg found.
>
> Katol is being worked on, very unique meteorite unlike anything known.
> Rockhaven seems to be a scam.
> Oslo, well, we see how fast Norway does classifications, good thing I sent
> Moss to the USA for quick work.
> Draveil, who cares, French museum blackballed all collectors so let it be
> forgotten,
>
>
> Michael Farmer
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Oct 3, 2012, at 6:40 PM, "Galactic Stone & Ironworks"
>  wrote:
>
>> Hi List,
>>
>> The following meteorite falls from the 21st century have not been
>> officially classified.  Does anyone have any updated information on
>> these falls (such as the types)?  Since these are not official, I am
>> using the most-common unofficial names.
>>
>> In descending chronological order :
>>
>> 2012 :
>>
>> Katol (India, this is fairly recent, so the lack of official
>> classification is understandable)
>> Diplo (Pakistan, also recent)
>> Oslo (Norway)
>> Rockhaven (Canada)
>> Huangzhong/Xining (China)
>>
>> 2011 :
>>
>> Draveil (France)
>>
>> 2010 :
>>
>> Breja (Algeria)
>>
>> 2009 :
>>
>> Cartersville (Georgia USA)
>>
>> 2008 :
>>
>> Zunhua (China)
>>
>> 2007 :
>>
>> Guadalajara (Mexico)
>>
>> 2005 :
>>
>> Montney (Canada)
>>
>> Is there any reason(s) why some of these falls have not been classified?
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> MikeG
>>
>> --
>> -
>> Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com
>> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
>> Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone
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>> RSS - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
>> -
>> __
>>
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>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
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>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Thunder Stone]

What about cemeteries? Who would claim ownership there?

-Original Message-

From: Brian Burrer
Sent: 3 Oct 2012 12:52:31 GMT
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

Greetings List,

I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
recoveries.
I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
on what roadside it was found on.
Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
the rest of their land.  The road is public but the bar-ditch is
private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
__

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Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[Don Merchant]

Lol. Good one!
Don
- Original Message - 
From: "Ed Deckert" 
To: "Don Merchant" ; ; 


Cc: "Don Merchant" 
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 6:17 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection


Well big whoop-de-doo to the three of ya.  My collection is so priceless 
that even I can't afford it!!!


Ed  :-)

- Original Message - 
From: "Don Merchant" 

To: ; 
Cc: "Don Merchant" 
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 6:11 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection



Big deal to both of ya, my collection is priceless!

Sincerely
Don Merchant
Founder-Cosmic Treasures Celestial Wonders
www.ctreasurescwonders.com
IMCA #0960

- Original Message - 
From: 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 1:01 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection



Big deal!

My collection is worth $9 million. All I need is a buyer.

Paul Swartz


The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/

"But what about us?"

?We'll always have the pictures." ;-)

Best wishes

Martin


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Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks]

Hi Ed, Don, Paul, Adam, and Innocent Bystanders,

I'll side-step the valuation problem and skip to the comments section
of the article.  It never ceases to amaze me how the comments section
of any online article brings out the rocket scientists and geniuses.
If you ever want to see the worst of man's lack of intellect, just
scroll down to the comments area of any given article.  The comments
below this article are absolutely stupid.

The man earned his money, let him spend it the way he sees fit.  There
are much worse things a grown man can do with his money than buy
meteorites.

Best regards,

MikeG

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On 10/3/12, Ed Deckert  wrote:
> Well big whoop-de-doo to the three of ya.  My collection is so priceless
> that even I can't afford it!!!
>
> Ed  :-)
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Don Merchant" 
> To: ; 
> Cc: "Don Merchant" 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 6:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection
>
>
>> Big deal to both of ya, my collection is priceless!
>>
>> Sincerely
>> Don Merchant
>> Founder-Cosmic Treasures Celestial Wonders
>> www.ctreasurescwonders.com
>> IMCA #0960
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 1:01 PM
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection
>>
>>
>>> Big deal!
>>>
>>> My collection is worth $9 million. All I need is a buyer.
>>>
>>> Paul Swartz
>>>
 The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

 http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/

 "But what about us?"

 ?We'll always have the pictures." ;-)

 Best wishes

 Martin

>>> __
>>>
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>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
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>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
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Re: [meteorite-list] Critical Assessment of the Comet as Provider of Earth's Waters

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks]

Hi Elton, Steve, and List,

The reason we don't see a similar amount of water on the Moon is due
in part to insufficient gravitation.  The Moon doesn't have the
ability to retain water vapor and volatiles like the Earth does.
Secondly, the Moon is a smaller target and probably suffered fewer
water-bearing impacts.

The Earth's water is due to a combination of factors, including
cometary bombardment, and local processes like volcanism.  And, it's a
known fact, that Mother Nature left the tap running for several
million years, resulting in a larger volume of water on the planet's
surface, and a massive water bill that took her thousands of years to
pay off.

Best regards,

MikeG

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On 10/3/12, Steve Dunklee  wrote:
> If the oceans were from comet impacts both the moon and mars would have
> similar amounts of water. Or shall we delve into the atmosphere of Venus?
> Things at the beginning of the system were most probably interesting. why
> not just accept it was  random bombardment and outgassing from solar
> radiation which caused a variety of  planets and planetismals.
>
> --- On Wed, 10/3/12, MstrEman  wrote:
>
>> From: MstrEman 
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Critical Assessment of the Comet as Provider of
>> Earth's Waters
>> To: "Meteorite-list" 
>> Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 6:53 AM
>>  What do we know about the origin of
>> the earth's oceans? Is it more
>> likely that they derive from icy comets that struck the
>> young earth or
>> from material released from the earth's interior during
>> volcanic
>> activity?
>>
>> Full Article at
>> 
>>
>> Tobias C. Owen of the Institute for Astronomy in Honolulu,
>> Hawaii,
>> offers this overview:
>> "This is a very good question, because we do not yet have an
>> answer
>> that everyone accepts.
>>
>> "The origin of the oceans goes back to the time of the
>> earth's
>> formation 4. 6 billion years ago, when our planet was
>> forming through
>> the accumulation of smaller objects, called planetesimals.
>> There are
>> basically three possible sources for the water. It could
>> have (1)
>> separated out from the rocks that make up the bulk of the
>> earth; (2)
>> arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of water- rich
>> meteorites,
>> similar to the carbonaceous chondrites that we see today; or
>> (3)
>> arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of icy
>> planetesimals, that
>> is, comets.
>>
>> "The composition of the ocean offers some clues as to its
>> origin. If
>> all the comets contain the same kind of water ice that we
>> have
>> examined in Comets Halley and Hyakutake- -the only ones
>> whose water
>> molecules we've been able to study in detail-- then comets
>> cannot have
>> delivered all the water in the earth's oceans. We know this
>> because
>> the ice in the comets contains twice as many atoms of
>> deuterium (a
>> heavy isotope of hydrogen) to each atom of ordinary hydrogen
>> as we
>> find in seawater.
>>
>> "At the same time, we know that the meteorites could not
>> have
>> delivered all of the water, because then the earth's
>> atmosphere would
>> contain nearly 10 times as much xenon (an inert gas) as it
>> actually
>> does. Meteorites all carry this excess xenon. Nobody has yet
>> measured
>> the concentration of xenon in comets, but recent laboratory
>> experiments on the trapping of gases by ice forming at low
>> temperatures suggest that comets do not contain high
>> concentrations of
>> the xenon. A mixture of meteoritic water and cometary water
>> would not
>> work either, because this combination would still contain a
>> higher
>> concentration of deuterium than is found in the oceans.
>>
>> "Hence, the best model for the source of the oceans at the
>> moment is a
>> combination of water derived from comets and water that was
>> caught up
>> in the rocky body of the earth as it formed. This mixture
>> satisfies
>> the xenon problem. It also appears to solve the deuterium
>> problem--but
>> only if the rocky material out near the earth's present
>> orbit picked
>> up some local water from the solar nebula (the cloud of gas
>> and dust
>> surrounding the young sun) before they accreted to form the
>> earth.
>> Some new laboratory studies of the manner in which deuterium
>> gets
>> exchanged between hydrogen gas and water vapor have
>> indicated that the
>> water vapor in the local region of the solar nebula would
>> have had
>> about the right (low) proportion of deuterium to balance the
>> excess
>> deuterium seen in comets.
>>
>> "The point to emphasize here is that this is a model, a
>> working
>> hypothesis t

Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[Ed Deckert]

Well big whoop-de-doo to the three of ya.  My collection is so priceless 
that even I can't afford it!!!


Ed  :-)

- Original Message - 
From: "Don Merchant" 

To: ; 
Cc: "Don Merchant" 
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 6:11 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection



Big deal to both of ya, my collection is priceless!

Sincerely
Don Merchant
Founder-Cosmic Treasures Celestial Wonders
www.ctreasurescwonders.com
IMCA #0960

- Original Message - 
From: 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 1:01 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection



Big deal!

My collection is worth $9 million. All I need is a buyer.

Paul Swartz


The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/

"But what about us?"

?We'll always have the pictures." ;-)

Best wishes

Martin


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Re: [meteorite-list] Critical Assessment of the Comet as Provider of Earth's Waters

[Steve Dunklee]

If the oceans were from comet impacts both the moon and mars would have similar 
amounts of water. Or shall we delve into the atmosphere of Venus? Things at the 
beginning of the system were most probably interesting. why not just accept it 
was  random bombardment and outgassing from solar radiation which caused a 
variety of  planets and planetismals.

--- On Wed, 10/3/12, MstrEman  wrote:

> From: MstrEman 
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Critical Assessment of the Comet as Provider of 
> Earth's Waters
> To: "Meteorite-list" 
> Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 6:53 AM
>  What do we know about the origin of
> the earth's oceans? Is it more
> likely that they derive from icy comets that struck the
> young earth or
> from material released from the earth's interior during
> volcanic
> activity?
> 
> Full Article at
> 
> 
> Tobias C. Owen of the Institute for Astronomy in Honolulu,
> Hawaii,
> offers this overview:
> "This is a very good question, because we do not yet have an
> answer
> that everyone accepts.
> 
> "The origin of the oceans goes back to the time of the
> earth's
> formation 4. 6 billion years ago, when our planet was
> forming through
> the accumulation of smaller objects, called planetesimals.
> There are
> basically three possible sources for the water. It could
> have (1)
> separated out from the rocks that make up the bulk of the
> earth; (2)
> arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of water- rich
> meteorites,
> similar to the carbonaceous chondrites that we see today; or
> (3)
> arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of icy
> planetesimals, that
> is, comets.
> 
> "The composition of the ocean offers some clues as to its
> origin. If
> all the comets contain the same kind of water ice that we
> have
> examined in Comets Halley and Hyakutake- -the only ones
> whose water
> molecules we've been able to study in detail-- then comets
> cannot have
> delivered all the water in the earth's oceans. We know this
> because
> the ice in the comets contains twice as many atoms of
> deuterium (a
> heavy isotope of hydrogen) to each atom of ordinary hydrogen
> as we
> find in seawater.
> 
> "At the same time, we know that the meteorites could not
> have
> delivered all of the water, because then the earth's
> atmosphere would
> contain nearly 10 times as much xenon (an inert gas) as it
> actually
> does. Meteorites all carry this excess xenon. Nobody has yet
> measured
> the concentration of xenon in comets, but recent laboratory
> experiments on the trapping of gases by ice forming at low
> temperatures suggest that comets do not contain high
> concentrations of
> the xenon. A mixture of meteoritic water and cometary water
> would not
> work either, because this combination would still contain a
> higher
> concentration of deuterium than is found in the oceans.
> 
> "Hence, the best model for the source of the oceans at the
> moment is a
> combination of water derived from comets and water that was
> caught up
> in the rocky body of the earth as it formed. This mixture
> satisfies
> the xenon problem. It also appears to solve the deuterium
> problem--but
> only if the rocky material out near the earth's present
> orbit picked
> up some local water from the solar nebula (the cloud of gas
> and dust
> surrounding the young sun) before they accreted to form the
> earth.
> Some new laboratory studies of the manner in which deuterium
> gets
> exchanged between hydrogen gas and water vapor have
> indicated that the
> water vapor in the local region of the solar nebula would
> have had
> about the right (low) proportion of deuterium to balance the
> excess
> deuterium seen in comets.
> 
> "The point to emphasize here is that this is a model, a
> working
> hypothesis that must be rigorously tested by many
> additional
> measurements. We need to study more comets. We also need to
> learn more
> about the water on Mars, where we have another chance to
> investigate
> the sources described above. On the earth, plate tectonics
> has caused
> oceanic water to mix considerably with material from the
> planet's
> interior; such contamination probably did not occur on Mars,
> where
> plate tectonics does not seem to occur. These investigations
> (and
> other related studies) are currently under way. This is an
> active area
> of research!"
> 
> James C. G. Walker of the University of Michigan confirms
> that
> conclusion, adding his perspective:
> 
> "The best current thinking is that volatiles (elements and
> compounds,
> including water, that vaporize at low temperatures) were
> released from
> the solid phase as the earth accreted. Thus, the earth and
> its oceans
> and atmosphere grew together.
> 
> During accretion, the kinetic energy of the colliding
> planetesimals
> was converted into thermal energy, so the earth grew
> extremely hot as
> it came together. The material forming the earth was
> probably too hot
> for ice to h

Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Steve Dunklee]

All of this really depends on the state you live in and the state laws. It is 
up to each individual to research this for the area they plan to search.
Typically in Arkansas counties, the land owner owns the property to the 
center of the roadway, or as described in the deed where cities have claimed 
ownership.
In most cases you own the property to the center of the road so the acreage 
can still be taxed. Yet the county or state retains right of way.
If you have a road on your property and buy all the land on both sides of 
the road . you can have the road closed if you own the entire length of the 
road.
   It may be that in BLM lands, the BLM still owns the land of the road yet 
maintains a right of way to the state.
   Cheers
Steve Dunklee

--- On Wed, 10/3/12, Count Deiro  wrote:

> From: Count Deiro 
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership
> To: "Michael Mulgrew" , "Meteorite List" 
> 
> Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 8:15 PM
> Hey Michael and List,
> 
> All you have to do..is what I have done. Call, or Email, the
> source at BLM that I posted and propose the question. Why
> are we doubting each other on the LIST? You want the truth
> as much as I do.
> 
> Guido
> 
> -Original Message-
> >From: Michael Mulgrew 
> >Sent: Oct 3, 2012 10:47 AM
> >To: Count Deiro ,
> Meteorite List 
> >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and
> Ownership
> >
> >Count Deiro and list,
> >
> >Really?  Well I guess I learned my new thing for
> the day and I can go home!  :)
> >
> >I've never come across anything like the Count described
> before, I am
> >assuming it's only practiced in remote rural
> locations?  Now my
> >curiosity have been sparked, as state departments of
> transportaion are
> >typically VERY protective of their right-of-ways, a case
> can be made
> >for them being more stringent than the BLM in several
> regards.  Even
> >my boss, who had double my years of experience, had
> never heard of
> >this.  I would love to see a specific example, time
> to do some
> >research!
> >
> >Best,
> >Michael in so. Cal.
> >
> >On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Count Deiro 
> wrote:
> >> Dear List,
> >>
> >> Michael has said that BLM does not manage any
> federal or state right of way
> >> systems. That information may be partially, or
> completely, incorrect. The
> >> BLM has co-operating land management agreements
> with federal, state and
> >> county right of way owners in most western states,
> Nevada, as an example and
> >> DOES manage the land under those right of ways and
> it's uses.
> >>
> >> My source is the BLM:
> >>
> >> Las Vegas Field Office
> >> 4701 North Torrey Pines Drive
> >> Las Vegas, NV 89130
> >> Phone: 702-515-5000
> >> Fax: 702-515-5023
> >> Office hours: 7:30 am-4:30 pm, M-F
> >> Field Manager: Bob Ross
> >> Email: lvfo...@blm.gov
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >>
> >> Count Deiro
> >>
> >> IMCA 3536
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >>>From: Michael Mulgrew
> >>>Sent: Oct 3, 2012 9:55 AM
> >>>To: Meteorite List
> >>>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting
> and Ownership
> >>>
> >>>Brian and List,
> >>>
> >>>I am a practicing Civil Engineer and have a lot
> of experience with
> >>>road right-of-ways. Generally the right-of-way
> for Federal highways
> >>>are owned by the State through which they pass.
> States acquire the
> >>>right-of-way and build the highways and then can
> apply for the
> >>>acceptance into the Federal system, but
> sometimes for cost and other
> >>>reasons only part of a highway may be introduced
> into the Federal
> >>>system (such as the recent extension of
> I-210/SR-210 in southern
> >>>California). The rural road example you give
> would be one where an
> >>>easement for access across private land has been
> granted for purposes
> >>>of road construction, operation, and
> maintenance. In the case you
> >>>cite the easement probably only extends from
> edge of pavement to edge
> >>>of pavement, thus the ditch is considered
> private. Ownership of road
> >>>rights-of-way should be discoverable at your
> local County offices.
> >>>
> >>>The BLM does not manage right-of-ways with the
> Federal or any of the
> >>>State systems, so this new BLM policy would not
> apply to finds made
> >>>there. Finds made there would technically belong
> to the people of the
> >>>State in which it was found, and that State's
> individual rules should
> >>>apply.
> >>>
> >>>Best,
> >>>Michael in so. Cal.
> >>>
> >>>On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:52 AM, Brian Burrer
> wrote:
> 
>  Greetings List,
> 
>  I have been following with interest the
> recent chatter concerning BLM
>  regulations; questions arise in my mind
> concerning roadside
>  recoveries.
>  I would guess that ownership of the find
> could vary widely depending
>  on what roadside it was found on.
>  Rural county roads in Texas are typically
> privately owned; the land
>  under the road is owned by individ

Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Count Deiro]

Hey Michael and List,

All you have to do..is what I have done. Call, or Email, the source at BLM that 
I posted and propose the question. Why are we doubting each other on the LIST? 
You want the truth as much as I do.

Guido

-Original Message-
>From: Michael Mulgrew 
>Sent: Oct 3, 2012 10:47 AM
>To: Count Deiro , Meteorite List 
>
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership
>
>Count Deiro and list,
>
>Really?  Well I guess I learned my new thing for the day and I can go home!  :)
>
>I've never come across anything like the Count described before, I am
>assuming it's only practiced in remote rural locations?  Now my
>curiosity have been sparked, as state departments of transportaion are
>typically VERY protective of their right-of-ways, a case can be made
>for them being more stringent than the BLM in several regards.  Even
>my boss, who had double my years of experience, had never heard of
>this.  I would love to see a specific example, time to do some
>research!
>
>Best,
>Michael in so. Cal.
>
>On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Count Deiro  wrote:
>> Dear List,
>>
>> Michael has said that BLM does not manage any federal or state right of way
>> systems. That information may be partially, or completely, incorrect. The
>> BLM has co-operating land management agreements with federal, state and
>> county right of way owners in most western states, Nevada, as an example and
>> DOES manage the land under those right of ways and it's uses.
>>
>> My source is the BLM:
>>
>> Las Vegas Field Office
>> 4701 North Torrey Pines Drive
>> Las Vegas, NV 89130
>> Phone: 702-515-5000
>> Fax: 702-515-5023
>> Office hours: 7:30 am-4:30 pm, M-F
>> Field Manager: Bob Ross
>> Email: lvfo...@blm.gov
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Count Deiro
>>
>> IMCA 3536
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>>>From: Michael Mulgrew
>>>Sent: Oct 3, 2012 9:55 AM
>>>To: Meteorite List
>>>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership
>>>
>>>Brian and List,
>>>
>>>I am a practicing Civil Engineer and have a lot of experience with
>>>road right-of-ways. Generally the right-of-way for Federal highways
>>>are owned by the State through which they pass. States acquire the
>>>right-of-way and build the highways and then can apply for the
>>>acceptance into the Federal system, but sometimes for cost and other
>>>reasons only part of a highway may be introduced into the Federal
>>>system (such as the recent extension of I-210/SR-210 in southern
>>>California). The rural road example you give would be one where an
>>>easement for access across private land has been granted for purposes
>>>of road construction, operation, and maintenance. In the case you
>>>cite the easement probably only extends from edge of pavement to edge
>>>of pavement, thus the ditch is considered private. Ownership of road
>>>rights-of-way should be discoverable at your local County offices.
>>>
>>>The BLM does not manage right-of-ways with the Federal or any of the
>>>State systems, so this new BLM policy would not apply to finds made
>>>there. Finds made there would technically belong to the people of the
>>>State in which it was found, and that State's individual rules should
>>>apply.
>>>
>>>Best,
>>>Michael in so. Cal.
>>>
>>>On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:52 AM, Brian Burrer wrote:

 Greetings List,

 I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
 regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
 recoveries.
 I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
 on what roadside it was found on.
 Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
 under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
 the rest of their land. The road is public but the bar-ditch is
 private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
 But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
 typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
 __

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>>>
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Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[Don Merchant]

Big deal to both of ya, my collection is priceless!

Sincerely
Don Merchant
Founder-Cosmic Treasures Celestial Wonders
www.ctreasurescwonders.com
IMCA #0960

- Original Message - 
From: 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 1:01 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection



Big deal!

My collection is worth $9 million. All I need is a buyer.

Paul Swartz


The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/

"But what about us?"

?We'll always have the pictures." ;-)

Best wishes

Martin


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[meteorite-list] AD eBey auction include beauty diogenite, Martian meteorite, beauty Main Mass or CV3 huge slice..

[Tomasz Jakubowski]

Dear List Members
I just list few eBay auction.
Amazing fresh Diogenite NWA 7464
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190734370409?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190734371414?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

Nice huge NWA 6409 L6 main Mass
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190734372713?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

Two Martian shertogottite NWA 6963
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Martian-Meteorite-NWA-6963-1-78g-with-crust-beauty-shergiottite-/190734373339?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c68a791db
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Martian-Meteorite-NWA-6963-0-46g-with-crust-beauty-shergiottite-/190734373727?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c68a7935f

Or huge carbonaceous chondrite slice
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amazing-carbonaceous-chondrite-NWA-4446-very-huge-slice-75g-/190734401401?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c68a7ff79

All auction
http://www.ebay.com/sch/meteoritepoland/m.html?item=190734372713&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562

Thanks for watching, if You have any question please fell free 
illae...@gmail.com


With best regards
Tomasz Jakubowski
Managing Editor
meteorites.pwr.wroc.pl


-- 
Free Tibet



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[meteorite-list] AD: Gustav Rose / E.L. Krinov / Norman Lockyer / G. Tschermak / Berwerth / Tammann / Dellmann

[Gegenschein]

Dear listmembers:

4 different publications:
1867 Dr. F. Dellmann: Die Meteoriten
1875 G. Tschermak: Die Bildung der Meteoriten und der Vulcanismus 
1879 G. Tschermak: Der Meteoritenfall bei Tieschitz in Mähren
1911 Berwerth/Tammann: Über die natürliche und künstliche Brandzone der 
Meteoreisen und das Verhalten der "Neumann'schen Linien" im erhitzten Kamacit

I am asking for 199 $



Author is Gustav Rose
Title is Beschreibung und Eintheilung der Meteoriten auf Grund der Sammlung im 
mineralogischen Museum zu Berlin
Book is written in German

1864 - Classification of Meteorites: The most important 19th century work on 
the classification of meteorites: Gustav Rose (1864) Beschreibung und 
Eintheilung der Meteoriten auf Grund der Sammlung im mineralogischen Museum zu 
Berlin, 138 pp., 4 plates.

I am asking for 599 $



Author is E.L. Krinov 
Title is Principles Of Meteoritics 
Book is written in English

Hardcover
Publisher: Pergamon Press, NY, 1960
PP xi + 535 with 7 plates; 154 b&w figures. Contains a broad exposition of 
problems dealt with in meteoritics, covering the study of material composition, 
structure, morphological and physical properties, together with the study of 
conditions under which meteoric bodies move through the earth's atmosphere and 
in interplanetary space. Many pictures about Sikhote Alin. Used, very good. 
Ex-library copy. DJ is missing. Rare

I am asking for 399 $



Author is J. Norman Lockyer 
Title is The Meteoritic Hypothesis: a Statement of the Results of a 
Spoectroscoopic Inquiry Into the Origin of Cosmical Systems 
Book is written in English 
Book is Hardcover
Publisher: Macmillan, 1890 

First edition, with clean pages and firm binding. Slight rubbing to the brown 
cloth cover, with a small tear to the front. Feint foxing to the endpapers. One 
cracked hinge. Overall, a good clean copy. Contains 7 plates and 101 
engravings. NO DUSTJACKET. 

I am asking for 99 $


 
Shipping & Handling: Shipping is free. If you are in doubt please email with 
questions. 

cu, Gegenschein
-- 
Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir
belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de


-- 
NEU: FreePhone 3-fach-Flat mit kostenlosem Smartphone!  

Jetzt informieren: http://mobile.1und1.de/?ac=OM.PW.PW003K20328T7073a


-- 
Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir
belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de

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[meteorite-list] Test please delete

[Martin Goff]

Test post, please delete.

-- 
Martin Goff
www.msg-meteorites.co.uk
IMCA #3387
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[meteorite-list] NASA's Curiosity Rover Checks-In on Mars Using Foursquare

[Ron Baalke]

Oct. 03, 2012

John Yembrick / Jason Townsend 
Headquarters, Washington
202-358-1584 / 202-358-0359 
john.yembr...@nasa.gov / jason.c.towns...@nasa.gov 

Courtney O'Connor 
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. 
818-354-2274 
courtney.m.o'con...@jpl.nasa.gov 

Erin Gleason 
PR Manager, Foursquare 
917-859-0501 
e...@foursquare.com 


RELEASE: 12-341

NASA'S CURIOSITY ROVER CHECKS-IN ON MARS USING FOURSQUARE

WASHINGTON -- NASA's Curiosity Mars rover checked in on Mars Wednesday 
using the mobile application Foursquare. This marks the first 
check-in on another planet. Users on Foursquare can keep up with 
Curiosity as the rover checks in at key locations and posts photos 
and tips, all while exploring the Red Planet. 

"NASA is using Foursquare as a tool to share the rover's new locations 
while exploring Mars," said David Weaver, associate administrator for 
communications at NASA Headquarters in Washington. "This will help to 
involve the public with the mission and give them a sense of the 
rover's travels through Gale Crater." 

After landing in Gale Crater last month, Curiosity began a planned 
23-month mission that includes some of Mars' most intriguing 
scientific destinations. Curiosity is roving toward Mount Sharp, a 
mountain about 3 miles (5 kilometers) tall. The rover is conducting 
experiments along the way, seeking clues in the rocks and soil that 
would indicate whether Mars ever was capable of supporting microbial 
life. It is taking and sharing pictures of the trip. 

Back here on Earth, Foursquare users will be able to earn a 
Curiosity-themed badge on the social media platform for check-ins at 
locations that generate an interest in science, technology, 
engineering and mathematics. Available late this year, this new badge 
will encourage Foursquare users to explore science centers, 
laboratories and museums that pique scientific curiosity. 

NASA has been on Foursquare since 2010 through a strategic partnership 
with the platform. This partnership, launched with astronaut Doug 
Wheelock's first-ever check-in from the International Space Station, 
has allowed users to connect with NASA and enabled them to explore 
the universe and re-discover Earth. 

The partnership launched the NASA Explorer badge for Foursquare users, 
encouraging them to explore NASA-related locations across the 
country. It also included the launch of a NASA Foursquare page, where 
the agency provides official tips and information about the nation's 
space program. 

The Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL) manages the Mars Science 
Laboratory mission and its Curiosity rover for NASA's Science Mission 
Directorate in Washington. The rover was designed, developed and 
assembled at JPL, a division of the California Institute of 
Technology in Pasadena, Calif. 

To find out more about Mars Curiosity and NASA on Foursquare, visit: 

http://www.foursquare.com/MarsCuriosity 

and 

http://www.foursquare.com/NASA 

For information about NASA's partnership with Foursquare, visit: 

http://www.nasa.gov/connect/foursquare.html 

For more information about NASA's Curiosity mission, visit: 

http://www.nasa.gov/msl 

and 

http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl 

-end-

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[meteorite-list] Comet Crystals Found in a Nearby Planetary System

[Ron Baalke]

http://www.esa.int/esaSC/SEMSLRERI7H_index_0.html

Comet crystals found in a nearby planetary system
European Space Agency 
3 October 2012

Pristine material that matches comets in our own Solar System have been
found in a dust belt around the young star Beta Pictoris by ESA's
Herschel space observatory.
 
Twelve-million-year-old Beta Pictoris resides just 63 light-years from
Earth and hosts a gas giant planet along with a dusty debris disc that
could, in time, evolve into a torus of icy bodies much like the Kuiper
Belt found outside the orbit of Neptune in our Solar System.

Thanks to the unique observing capabilities of Herschel, the composition
of the dust in the cold outskirts of the Beta Pictoris system has been
determined for the first time.

Of particular interest was the mineral olivine, which crystallises out
of the protoplanetary disc material close to newborn stars and is
eventually incorporated into asteroids, comets and planets.

"As far as olivine is concerned, it comes in different 'flavours',"
explains Ben de Vries from KU Leuven and lead author of the study
reported in Nature.

"A magnesium-rich variety is found in small and primitive icy bodies
like comets, whereas iron-rich olivine is typically found in large
asteroids that have undergone more heating, or 'processing'." 
 
Herschel detected the pristine magnesium-rich variety in the Beta
Pictoris system at 15-45 astronomical units (AUs) from the star, where
temperatures are around -190ºC.

For comparison, Earth lies at 1 AU from our Sun and the Solar System's
Kuiper Belt extends from the orbit of Neptune at about 30 AU out to 50
AU from the Sun.

The Herschel observations allowed astronomers to calculate that the
olivine crystals make up around 4% of the total mass of the dust found
in this region.

In turn, this finding led them to conclude that the olivine was
originally bound up inside comets and released into space by collisions
between the icy objects.

"The 4% value is strikingly similar to that of Solar System comets
17P/Holmes and 73P/Schwassmann-Wachmann 3, which contain 2-10%
magnesium-rich olivine," says Dr de Vries.

"Since olivine can only crystallise within about 10 AU of the central
star, finding it in a cold debris disc means that it must have been
transported from the inner region of the system to the outskirts."

The "radial mixing" transport mechanism is known from models of the
evolution of swirling protoplanetary discs as they condense around new
stars.

The mixing is stimulated in varying amounts by winds and heat from the
central star pushing materials away, along with temperature differences
and turbulent motion created in the disc during planet formation.

"Our findings are an indication that the efficiency of these transport
processes must have been similar between the young Solar System and
within the Beta Pictoris system, and that these processes are likely
independent of the detailed properties of the system," says Dr de Vries.

Indeed, Beta Pictoris is over one and a half times the mass of our Sun,
eight times as bright, and its planetary system architecture is
different to our own Solar System today.

"Thanks to Herschel, we were able to measure the properties of pristine
material left over from the initial planet-building process in another
solar system with a precision that is comparable to what we could
achieve in the laboratory if we had the material here on Earth," says
ESA's Herschel project scientist Göran Pilbratt.
 
 
Notes for Editors 
 

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[meteorite-list] What Do We Know About The Origin of the Earth's Oceans?

[Ron Baalke]

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=what-do-we-know-about-the

What do we know about the origin of the earth's oceans? Is it more
likely that they derive from icy comets that struck the young earth or
from material released from the earth's interior during volcanic
activity?

Scientifc American


Tobias C. Owen of the Institute for Astronomy in Honolulu, Hawaii,
offers this overview:

"This is a very good question, because we do not yet have an answer that
everyone accepts.

"The origin of the oceans goes back to the time of the earth's formation
4. 6 billion years ago, when our planet was forming through the
accumulation of smaller objects, called planetesimals. There are
basically three possible sources for the water. It
could have (1) separated out from the rocks that make up the bulk of the
earth; (2) arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of water-rich
meteorites, similar to the carbonaceous chondrites that we see today; or
(3) arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of icy planetesimals,
that is, comets.

"The composition of the ocean offers some clues as to its origin. If all
the comets contain the same kind of water ice that we have examined in
Comets Halley and Hyakutake- -the only ones whose water molecules we've
been able to study in detail-- then comets cannot have delivered all the
water in the earth's oceans. We know this because the ice in the comets
contains twice as many atoms of deuterium (a heavy isotope of hydrogen)
to each atom of ordinary hydrogen as we find in seawater.

"At the same time, we know that the meteorites could not have delivered
all of the water, because then the earth's atmosphere would contain
nearly 10 times as much xenon (an inert gas) as it actually does.
Meteorites all carry this excess xenon. Nobody has yet measured the
concentration of xenon in comets, but recent laboratory experiments on
the trapping of gases by ice forming at low temperatures suggest that
comets do not contain high concentrations of the xenon. A mixture of
meteoritic water and cometary water would not work either, because this
combination would still contain a higher concentration of deuterium than
is found in the oceans.

"Hence, the best model for the source of the oceans at the moment is a
combination of water derived from comets and water that was caught up in
the rocky body of the earth as it formed. This mixture satisfies the
xenon problem. It also appears to solve the deuterium problem--but only
if the rocky material out near the earth's present orbit picked up some
local water from the solar nebula (the cloud of gas and dust surrounding
the young sun) before they accreted to form the earth. Some new
laboratory studies of the manner in which deuterium gets exchanged
between hydrogen gas and water vapor have indicated that the water vapor
in the local region of the solar nebula would have had about the right
(low) proportion of deuterium to balance the excess deuterium seen in
comets.

"The point to emphasize here is that this is a model, a working
hypothesis that must be rigorously tested by many additional
measurements. We need to study more comets. We also need to learn more
about the water on Mars, where we have another
chance to investigate the sources described above. On the earth, plate
tectonics has caused oceanic water to mix considerably with material
from the planet's interior; such contamination probably did not occur on
Mars, where plate tectonics does not seem to occur. These investigations
(and other related studies) are currently under way. This is an active
area of research!" **

James C. G. Walker of the University of Michigan confirms that
conclusion, adding his perspective:

"The best current thinking is that volatiles (elements and compounds,
including water, that vaporize at low temperatures) were released from
the solid phase as the earth accreted. Thus, the earth and its oceans
and atmosphere grew together.

"During accretion, the kinetic energy of the colliding planetesimals was
converted into thermal energy, so the earth grew extremely hot as it
came together. The material forming the earth was probably too hot for
ice to have been a major carrier of water. Most of the water was
probably present originally as water trapped in clay minerals or as
separate hydrogen (in hydrocarbons) and oxygen (in iron oxides), rather
than as ice.

"Since the end of the period of accretion, more than four billion years 
ago, there has been a continual exchange of volatile material--including 
water--between the surface of the earth and the planet's interior 
(that is, between the crust and the mantle). Volcanoes release water 
and carbon dioxide to the atmosphere and ocean. Subduction of sediments 
rich in volatiles takes place at deep ocean trenches. The sinking of 
oceanic crust at subduction zones carries water and carbon dioxide 
back into the mantle. These processes can all be seen at work today.

"In short, icy cometary material probably has not been impo

Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[Adam Hupe]

Wow, what a collection!  The custom wood/metal work and display table are 
beyond compare.  I was wondering if the center of the display opens and the 
specimen trays are hidden inside?  This is probably the best display system I 
have ever seen.  I could imagine having a meteorite wing attached to my house.  
Dreams are free.


Somebody asked if there was more than one complete slice of NWA 5000 in 
existence.  The answer is no.  The "Ambassador Slice"  has done more traveling 
than myself the last five years.  It has been used by NASA, The Lunar and 
Planetary Institute and a former Moonwalker to promote future trips to the 
Moon.  Now Naveen Jain, co-founder of Moon Express, the leading contender for 
the lunar X Prize is showcasing NWA 5000.  It will be interesting to see the 
private sector be the first to make it back to the Moon.  I cannot think of 
anything more exciting.

Kind Regards,


Adam







From: "valpar...@aol.com" 
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com 
Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 11:01 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

Big deal!

My collection is worth $9 million. All I need is a buyer.

Paul Swartz

> The $5 Million Meteorite Collection
> 
> http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/
> 
> "But what about us?"
> 
> ?We'll always have the pictures." ;-)
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Martin
> 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Count Deiro]

Hello List,

Just another important reason to access County Recorder's and Assessor's land 
records would be that when you go to obtain permission to hunt meteorites on 
private property you can verify that the legal owner is the person your dealing 
with. Your authorization is no good unless you have ALL the recorded owners 
sign and notarized a permission to remove an item of personal property from the 
land. That can get complicated...especially when dealing with persons holding 
different types of ownership. H&W with Right of Survivorship, Community 
Property, Tenants in Common, Trusts, Partnerships, Corporate, etc. etc.

Good luckWe are all going to need it now that the proverbial cat is out of 
the bag$5,000,000.00 collections Who knew? We did...but the media and 
the great unwashed didn't...until now.

County Deiro
IMCA 3536   
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Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Michael Mulgrew]

Thinking about this again, regardless of co-operating land management
agreements, the right-of-way in question would still be owned by the
State, so I believe that the BLM's policy would still not apply.  Does
this sound correct?

Michael in so. Cal.

On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 10:47 AM, Michael Mulgrew  wrote:
> Count Deiro and list,
>
> Really?  Well I guess I learned my new thing for the day and I can go home!  
> :)
>
> I've never come across anything like the Count described before, I am
> assuming it's only practiced in remote rural locations?  Now my
> curiosity have been sparked, as state departments of transportaion are
> typically VERY protective of their right-of-ways, a case can be made
> for them being more stringent than the BLM in several regards.  Even
> my boss, who had double my years of experience, had never heard of
> this.  I would love to see a specific example, time to do some
> research!
>
> Best,
> Michael in so. Cal.
>
> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Count Deiro  wrote:
>> Dear List,
>>
>> Michael has said that BLM does not manage any federal or state right of way
>> systems. That information may be partially, or completely, incorrect. The
>> BLM has co-operating land management agreements with federal, state and
>> county right of way owners in most western states, Nevada, as an example and
>> DOES manage the land under those right of ways and it's uses.
>>
>> My source is the BLM:
>>
>> Las Vegas Field Office
>> 4701 North Torrey Pines Drive
>> Las Vegas, NV 89130
>> Phone: 702-515-5000
>> Fax: 702-515-5023
>> Office hours: 7:30 am-4:30 pm, M-F
>> Field Manager: Bob Ross
>> Email: lvfo...@blm.gov
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Count Deiro
>>
>> IMCA 3536
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>>>From: Michael Mulgrew
>>>Sent: Oct 3, 2012 9:55 AM
>>>To: Meteorite List
>>>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership
>>>
>>>Brian and List,
>>>
>>>I am a practicing Civil Engineer and have a lot of experience with
>>>road right-of-ways. Generally the right-of-way for Federal highways
>>>are owned by the State through which they pass. States acquire the
>>>right-of-way and build the highways and then can apply for the
>>>acceptance into the Federal system, but sometimes for cost and other
>>>reasons only part of a highway may be introduced into the Federal
>>>system (such as the recent extension of I-210/SR-210 in southern
>>>California). The rural road example you give would be one where an
>>>easement for access across private land has been granted for purposes
>>>of road construction, operation, and maintenance. In the case you
>>>cite the easement probably only extends from edge of pavement to edge
>>>of pavement, thus the ditch is considered private. Ownership of road
>>>rights-of-way should be discoverable at your local County offices.
>>>
>>>The BLM does not manage right-of-ways with the Federal or any of the
>>>State systems, so this new BLM policy would not apply to finds made
>>>there. Finds made there would technically belong to the people of the
>>>State in which it was found, and that State's individual rules should
>>>apply.
>>>
>>>Best,
>>>Michael in so. Cal.
>>>
>>>On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:52 AM, Brian Burrer wrote:

 Greetings List,

 I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
 regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
 recoveries.
 I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
 on what roadside it was found on.
 Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
 under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
 the rest of their land. The road is public but the bar-ditch is
 private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
 But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
 typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
 __

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 http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
 Meteorite-list mailing list
 Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
 http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>>>__
>>>
>>>Visit the Archives at
>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
>>>Meteorite-list mailing list
>>>Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>>>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
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[meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[valparint]

Big deal!

My collection is worth $9 million. All I need is a buyer.

Paul Swartz

> The $5 Million Meteorite Collection
> 
> http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/ 
> 
> "But what about us?"
> 
> ?We'll always have the pictures." ;-)
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Martin
> 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Michael Mulgrew]

Count Deiro and list,

Really?  Well I guess I learned my new thing for the day and I can go home!  :)

I've never come across anything like the Count described before, I am
assuming it's only practiced in remote rural locations?  Now my
curiosity have been sparked, as state departments of transportaion are
typically VERY protective of their right-of-ways, a case can be made
for them being more stringent than the BLM in several regards.  Even
my boss, who had double my years of experience, had never heard of
this.  I would love to see a specific example, time to do some
research!

Best,
Michael in so. Cal.

On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 10:38 AM, Count Deiro  wrote:
> Dear List,
>
> Michael has said that BLM does not manage any federal or state right of way
> systems. That information may be partially, or completely, incorrect. The
> BLM has co-operating land management agreements with federal, state and
> county right of way owners in most western states, Nevada, as an example and
> DOES manage the land under those right of ways and it's uses.
>
> My source is the BLM:
>
> Las Vegas Field Office
> 4701 North Torrey Pines Drive
> Las Vegas, NV 89130
> Phone: 702-515-5000
> Fax: 702-515-5023
> Office hours: 7:30 am-4:30 pm, M-F
> Field Manager: Bob Ross
> Email: lvfo...@blm.gov
>
> Best regards,
>
> Count Deiro
>
> IMCA 3536
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
>>From: Michael Mulgrew
>>Sent: Oct 3, 2012 9:55 AM
>>To: Meteorite List
>>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership
>>
>>Brian and List,
>>
>>I am a practicing Civil Engineer and have a lot of experience with
>>road right-of-ways. Generally the right-of-way for Federal highways
>>are owned by the State through which they pass. States acquire the
>>right-of-way and build the highways and then can apply for the
>>acceptance into the Federal system, but sometimes for cost and other
>>reasons only part of a highway may be introduced into the Federal
>>system (such as the recent extension of I-210/SR-210 in southern
>>California). The rural road example you give would be one where an
>>easement for access across private land has been granted for purposes
>>of road construction, operation, and maintenance. In the case you
>>cite the easement probably only extends from edge of pavement to edge
>>of pavement, thus the ditch is considered private. Ownership of road
>>rights-of-way should be discoverable at your local County offices.
>>
>>The BLM does not manage right-of-ways with the Federal or any of the
>>State systems, so this new BLM policy would not apply to finds made
>>there. Finds made there would technically belong to the people of the
>>State in which it was found, and that State's individual rules should
>>apply.
>>
>>Best,
>>Michael in so. Cal.
>>
>>On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:52 AM, Brian Burrer wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings List,
>>>
>>> I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
>>> regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
>>> recoveries.
>>> I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
>>> on what roadside it was found on.
>>> Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
>>> under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
>>> the rest of their land. The road is public but the bar-ditch is
>>> private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
>>> But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
>>> typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
>>> __
>>>
>>> Visit the Archives at
>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
>>> Meteorite-list mailing list
>>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>>__
>>
>>Visit the Archives at
>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
>>Meteorite-list mailing list
>>Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
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Re: [meteorite-list] BLM Law vs Type Sample

[Michael Mulgrew]

List,

I approached the BLM for clarification on two specific points: 1)
Casual trading of meteorites for other meteorites between individuals
and institutions, and 2) Donation/trade of a type specimen for
classification purposes.  Please allow me to share the results of that
inquiry.

On item 1, casual trading, I was informed by Lucy Kuizon, BLM National
Paleontologist, "...the BLM uses the definition of “barter” as
formally described by the Internal Revenue Service (IRS). There are
several types of barter, some of which requires the filing of forms to
report certain types of exchanges that are considered by the IRS to be
reportable income by both parties in the exchange. Usually these
parties are small businesses or sole proprietors. Here is an IRS link
for reference: http://www.irs.gov/uac/Four-Facts-About-Bartering";

Further, she stated  [non-commercial trading was a term I used in my
initial inquiry], "...“non-commercial trading of meteorites” where (1)
it is a one-on-one trade or exchange, and (2) there is no IRS
reporting requirement for tax purposes, this is appropriately part of
casual or hobby collecting. This is considered personal non-commercial
use."

As casual collectors we can all continue to trade meteorites we find
on public lands for other meteorites as part of the hobby we all
enjoy.  These trades can no longer include cash, as may be the case
for commercial trades, otherwise a permit from the BLM would be
required per 43 CFR 2920 regulations.

With respect to item 2, type specimens, she wrote:

"Your description of “type specimen” is a type of “exchange” that is
benefitting the science of  meteorites.  Let me address that concept
in each of the type of collecting scenarios. First, under true casual
collecting, that is, for non-commercial personal use and no exchange
of cash or income-type services, that type of exchange is allowable,
and may be considered a donation to the educational or scientific
institution.  Under the scientific collecting permit, this type of
exchange is a little more complex and is not really acceptable. The
institution that recovers the meteorite must certify that the
meteorite will be curated in that institution in perpetuity. The
meteorite is considered federal property under the federal property
and accounting laws and regulations. The concept of removing a piece
of the meteorite in payment for the services of the agent who recovers
it is not a typical action we would allow for other scientifically
important resources we issue permits for on public lands, such as
cultural artifacts and paleontological resources. Lastly, under a
commercial permit, yes, that type of exchange is acceptable, but
probably would need to be factored into the fees and rental that would
be calculated for the permit. It may possibly lower the amount of the
rental being charged. But, that would be at the discretion of the
state appraiser. The meteorite professional must communicate this type
of exchange clearly to the BLM when applying for a commercial permit
because of the influence on the estimate of the rental fees."

I replied back that a type specimen would not really be applicable
under a scientific collecting permit since the institution will be
receiving 100% of the recovered meteorites for study and curation.

So good news, we can still trade our meteorites and are still able to
donate type specimens for classification purposes.  I hope this helps
keep a little piece of the sky from falling.

Best,
Michael in so. Cal.
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[meteorite-list] MRO HiRISE Images - October 3, 2012

[Ron Baalke]

MARS RECONNAISSANCE ORBITER HIRISE IMAGES
October 3, 2012

o Remnants of a Viscous Flow on Mars
  http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_028352_2245

  Some of the lobate flows here are pristine-looking and highly 
  reminiscent of terrestrial glaciers, whereas others appear more 
  degraded.

o Ancient Layers on Mars
  http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_028487_2180

  The terrain here is along the boundary between the ancient 
  highlands and the younger lowlands of Mars.

o Slope Streak Details and a New Streak 
  http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_028642_1800

  Some people have proposed these streaks are the traces of 
  liquid water, but most scientists think that they form when 
  very thin layers of fine dust is disturbed and slides downhill.

o Colorful Layers Exposed in the Walls of an Impact Crater  
  http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ESP_028693_1535

  This image covers most of an impact crater about 6 to 7 kilometers 
  wide. Partway down from the crater rim is a prominent bright layer 
  of bedrock. 

All of the HiRISE images are archived here:

http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/

Information about the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is 
online at http://www.nasa.gov/mro. The mission is 
managed by NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, a division 
of the California Institute of Technology, for the NASA 
Science Mission Directorate, Washington, D.C. Lockheed 
Martin Space Systems, of Denver, is the prime contractor 
and built the spacecraft. HiRISE is operated by the 
University of Arizona. Ball Aerospace and Technologies 
Corp., of Boulder, Colo., built the HiRISE instrument.

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Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Michael Mulgrew]

Brian and List,

I am a practicing Civil Engineer and have a lot of experience with
road right-of-ways.  Generally the right-of-way for Federal highways
are owned by the State through which they pass.  States acquire the
right-of-way and build the highways and then can apply for the
acceptance into the Federal system, but sometimes for cost and other
reasons only part of a highway may be introduced into the Federal
system (such as the recent extension of I-210/SR-210 in southern
California).  The rural road example you give would be one where an
easement for access across private land has been granted for purposes
of road construction, operation, and maintenance.  In the case you
cite the easement probably only extends from edge of pavement to edge
of pavement, thus the ditch is considered private.  Ownership of road
rights-of-way should be discoverable at your local County offices.

The BLM does not manage right-of-ways with the Federal or any of the
State systems, so this new BLM policy would not apply to finds made
there.  Finds made there would technically belong to the people of the
State in which it was found, and that State's individual rules should
apply.

Best,
Michael in so. Cal.

On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 5:52 AM, Brian Burrer  wrote:
>
> Greetings List,
>
> I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
> regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
> recoveries.
> I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
> on what roadside it was found on.
> Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
> under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
> the rest of their land.  The road is public but the bar-ditch is
> private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
> But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
> typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
> __
>
> Visit the Archives at
> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
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[meteorite-list] AD - LOST CITY / BUSTEE / GV / KRYMKA / OGI / EFREMOVKA - SUNDAY, 14-OCT

[Darryl Pitt]

HI Everyone!

As you may know, this coming Sunday, October 14th Heritage Auctions is hosting 
an auction of Important Meteorites---and as indicated on the subject line, 
there are quite a few. 

Please be advised the Heritage buyer's fee is 25%.   And yet, as is always the 
case, there will be great deals to scoop up, especially the lots with NO 
RESERVE. 

And here they are.   The page numbers are the pages of the Digital Catalog: 
http://fineart.ha.com/c/ecatalog.zx?saleNo=6089


NO RESERVE


Page 11 / ALMAHATA SITTA
Page 17 / MBALE
Page 24 / SEYMCHAN SPHERE
Page 33 / VALERA
PAge 37 / NWA 869  SPHERES
Page 39 / LAGUNA MANANTIALES  (my favorite - great job, Mirko)
Page 41 / CLAXTON THIN SECTION
Page 46 / SHIS.R 160 (lunar)
PAge 49 / ARISPE
Page 54 / SIKHOTE ALIN CRESCENT
Page 62 / GIBEON FLANGE
Page 62 / GIBEON ARROW ON ARMATURE
Page 67 / HERBIE HANCOCK MARS (NWA 2975 Grouplet)
Page 79 / NWA 1908
Page 79 / JUVINAS
Page 80 / DHOFAR 007
Page 91 / NWA 6565
Page 95 / WATCH
PAge 96 / EARRINGS
Page 96 / PENDANT 
Page 96 / CHONDRITE BRACELET
Page 96 / LIBYAN GLASS BRACELET
Page 97 / WATCH FACE
Page 97 / FACETED MOLDAVITE


Here is the listing of objects and where to go to bid:   http://www.ha.com/6089

All the best / Darryl

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Re: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection

[Pete Pete]

How many of those gorgeous NWA 5000 displays were created?
 
> Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2012 08:39:03 +0200
> To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> From: karmaka-meteori...@t-online.de
> Subject: [meteorite-list] The $5 Million Meteorite Collection
> 
> The $5 Million Meteorite Collection
> 
> http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/09/meteorite-collector/ 
> 
> "But what about us?"
> 
> “We'll always have the pictures." ;-)
> 
> Best wishes
> 
> Martin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Postfach fast voll? Jetzt kostenlos E-Mail Adresse @t-online.de sichern und 
> endlich Platz für tausende Mails haben.
> http://www.t-online.de/email-kostenlos
> 
> 
> __
> 
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> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list   
>   
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[meteorite-list] Critical Assessment of the Comet as Provider of Earth's Waters

[MstrEman]

 What do we know about the origin of the earth's oceans? Is it more
likely that they derive from icy comets that struck the young earth or
from material released from the earth's interior during volcanic
activity?

Full Article at


Tobias C. Owen of the Institute for Astronomy in Honolulu, Hawaii,
offers this overview:
"This is a very good question, because we do not yet have an answer
that everyone accepts.

"The origin of the oceans goes back to the time of the earth's
formation 4. 6 billion years ago, when our planet was forming through
the accumulation of smaller objects, called planetesimals. There are
basically three possible sources for the water. It could have (1)
separated out from the rocks that make up the bulk of the earth; (2)
arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of water- rich meteorites,
similar to the carbonaceous chondrites that we see today; or (3)
arrived as part of a late-accreting veneer of icy planetesimals, that
is, comets.

"The composition of the ocean offers some clues as to its origin. If
all the comets contain the same kind of water ice that we have
examined in Comets Halley and Hyakutake- -the only ones whose water
molecules we've been able to study in detail-- then comets cannot have
delivered all the water in the earth's oceans. We know this because
the ice in the comets contains twice as many atoms of deuterium (a
heavy isotope of hydrogen) to each atom of ordinary hydrogen as we
find in seawater.

"At the same time, we know that the meteorites could not have
delivered all of the water, because then the earth's atmosphere would
contain nearly 10 times as much xenon (an inert gas) as it actually
does. Meteorites all carry this excess xenon. Nobody has yet measured
the concentration of xenon in comets, but recent laboratory
experiments on the trapping of gases by ice forming at low
temperatures suggest that comets do not contain high concentrations of
the xenon. A mixture of meteoritic water and cometary water would not
work either, because this combination would still contain a higher
concentration of deuterium than is found in the oceans.

"Hence, the best model for the source of the oceans at the moment is a
combination of water derived from comets and water that was caught up
in the rocky body of the earth as it formed. This mixture satisfies
the xenon problem. It also appears to solve the deuterium problem--but
only if the rocky material out near the earth's present orbit picked
up some local water from the solar nebula (the cloud of gas and dust
surrounding the young sun) before they accreted to form the earth.
Some new laboratory studies of the manner in which deuterium gets
exchanged between hydrogen gas and water vapor have indicated that the
water vapor in the local region of the solar nebula would have had
about the right (low) proportion of deuterium to balance the excess
deuterium seen in comets.

"The point to emphasize here is that this is a model, a working
hypothesis that must be rigorously tested by many additional
measurements. We need to study more comets. We also need to learn more
about the water on Mars, where we have another chance to investigate
the sources described above. On the earth, plate tectonics has caused
oceanic water to mix considerably with material from the planet's
interior; such contamination probably did not occur on Mars, where
plate tectonics does not seem to occur. These investigations (and
other related studies) are currently under way. This is an active area
of research!"

James C. G. Walker of the University of Michigan confirms that
conclusion, adding his perspective:

"The best current thinking is that volatiles (elements and compounds,
including water, that vaporize at low temperatures) were released from
the solid phase as the earth accreted. Thus, the earth and its oceans
and atmosphere grew together.

During accretion, the kinetic energy of the colliding planetesimals
was converted into thermal energy, so the earth grew extremely hot as
it came together. The material forming the earth was probably too hot
for ice to have been a major carrier of water. Most of the water was
probably present originally as water trapped in clay minerals or as
separate hydrogen (in hydrocarbons) and oxygen (in iron oxides),
rather than as ice. "Since the end of the period of accretion, more
than four billion years ago, there has been a continual exchange of
volatile material--including water--between the surface of the earth
and the planet's interior (that is, between the crust and the mantle).
Volcanoes release water and carbon dioxide to the atmosphere and
ocean. Subduction of sediments rich in volatiles takes place at deep
ocean trenches. The sinking of oceanic crust at subduction zones
carries water and carbon dioxide back into the mantle. These processes
can all be seen at work today.

In short, icy cometary material probably has not been important in
providi

Re: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Count Deiro]

Hello Brian and List,

I have had a California, Nevada and Utah Real Estate Broker's License, as well 
as a Nevada Certified Property Manager's Certificate for nearly fifty years. 
(NV Broker 000145A) 

To bring sanity to claims of land ownership, and in order to have taxes 
collected from the right owners, and to establish liability, and to provide a 
means to place liens and establish a chain of title, most all of the United 
States adopted the "Recordation Method of Providing Public Notification of Land 
Ownership".

In nearly 100% of the counties in the US...all one has to do to determine the 
legal ownership of even the smallest parcel of land is to visit the County 
Recorder's office in person, or online, and the ownership and a wealth of other 
valuable data is available immediately and for free. 

If I found something valuable I would use the GPS to determine the exact 
physical location and if I was going
to have to provide legal proof of whose land it was I was on, I would obtain a 
Preliminary Title Report from any state licensed Title or Escrow Company for a 
small fee. That "Prelim"  provides irrefutable proof of land ownership, chain 
of title, and the existance in priority of any liens and encumbrances, and most 
important to meteorite collectors, covenants and restrictions running with the 
land.

Count Deiro
IMCA 3536



-Original Message-
>From: Brian Burrer 
>Sent: Oct 3, 2012 5:52 AM
>To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>Subject: [meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership
>
>Greetings List,
>
>I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
>regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
>recoveries.
>I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
>on what roadside it was found on.
>Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
>under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
>the rest of their land.  The road is public but the bar-ditch is
>private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
>But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
>typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
>__
>
>Visit the Archives at 
>http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
>Meteorite-list mailing list
>Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

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[meteorite-list] Roadside Hunting and Ownership

[Brian Burrer]

Greetings List,

I have been following with interest the recent chatter concerning BLM
regulations; questions arise in my mind concerning roadside
recoveries.
I would guess that ownership of the find could vary widely depending
on what roadside it was found on.
Rural county roads in Texas are typically privately owned; the land
under the road is owned by individuals who pay taxes on it just like
the rest of their land.  The road is public but the bar-ditch is
private; ownership clearly falls to the landowner.
But what about state and federal highway margins; this is not
typically (maybe ever) BLM land so what rules apply?
__

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[meteorite-list] Meteorite Picture of the Day

[valparint]

Today's Meteorite Picture of the Day: Unclassified NWA

Contributed by: Phil Morgan

http://www.tucsonmeteorites.com/mpod.asp
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Re: [meteorite-list] Problems posting to the list

[Martin Goff]

Hi Art, list,

Firstly, thankyou for the many emails i received concerning this
issue. I am not sure why but the missing posts i was referring to in
my previous post obviously did make it out to list members (so i
sincerely apologise for the duplicate posts!) However, i subscribe to
the daily summary and dont receive individual emails. I tend to look
at most posts using the list archive which i have constantly open on
my laptop, phone etc. I then refresh that page to view recent posts.
When posting myself, i find that within a minute my posts appear in
the archive which i check to see if they have actually posted.

My question is this - Why do my initial posts that i refer to still
not appear in the archive? They were obviously received by list
members so why dont they appear in the archives? Both my test posts
arrived in the archive within 30 seconds. It makes me wonder if i have
missed out on many posts in the past by looking at the archive rather
than individual emails.

Art, any ideas as to why this would happen? All posts were in plain
text and the only difference between my test post and my original post
is it contained a couple of paragraphs of text and a link to my
website. I cant fathom why this would mean it should be screened out.

If the archives for whatever reason dont show all posts then over the
years i will have maybe missed important posts. Any help explaining
this much appreciated.

Cheers

Martin

On 1 October 2012 19:07, Art  wrote:
> Hi Martin;
>
> Make sure your email client is configured to send Plain Text emails,
> not Rich Text or HTML.  This is the issue that usually causes the
> problems you mention.
>
> Regards, Art
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Re: [meteorite-list] BLM Law vs Type Sample

[Mark Bowling]

I hope you and Norm are right.  The BLM should be providing a FAQ page at some 
point that can put some of the questions to rest.
 
For the record, I'll comply with the rules.  I've never sold or traded a 
meteorite I've found so far, so I'll never need a permit.  These changed 
don't impact my past practices except now I can only collect 4% of the yearly 
limit I could before (not that I have been that lucky, but we know people who 
have, some who aren't considered dealers).
 
My home is west of the Pecos, in a state that's about 88% publicly owned.  
Quite a few times I've been wrongly hassled by federal agents.  They knew they 
were wrong and still intimidated me.  But I have found that if you show some 
knowledge of the law and drop a name (like the district ranger) they will move 
on (even though they had claimed you're breaking the law and they have to dead 
to rights(!?).  It's clear intimidation.  How many others, doing no harm and 
wanting to be lawful, give in and go home?  Now that's not most of the time.  
Agents are often very nice and will eagerly share their time and discuss their 
area of expertise if you show interest.  But there are a significant percentage 
of crusaders out there too.
 
Sure, the BLM will not staff up, or peak in your windows or lurk on this forum 
or check your auctions, but as budgets get tighter, they will look for 
revenue.  As visitor density continues to increase at a fast pace, use permits 
will be seen as a good source revenue.  As a minority, meteorite hunters will 
be squeezed, especially if a significant number of us see this as harmless or 
as not affecting them.  If we fragment on this, and casual collection is 
eventually restricted, we will have lost momentum.  And new limits will be seen 
as normal and nothing new.  We will be vilified as grave robbers, and the 
majority of well-meaning citizens, who want to protect our resources, will see 
us as such.
 
Government regulations never shrink but we can try to direct their focus.  If 
we act now and try to open a dialogue about some minor changes, we could end up 
with a good system, which would help legitimize our activities and enhance 
meteorite recovery.
 
I've known people fined by BLM & USFS for doing things that were pretty tame 
and weren't commercial activity.  And though they weren't fined to the breaking 
point, there are examples of Westerners financially ruined while proving they 
were in the right.  So I'd rather not be faced with a situation like this and 
let my pack in/pack out, tread-lightly actions speak for me as they have over 
the last 30 years.  It's funny, I've stumbled upon scores of places covered 
over by tons of trash and human excrement and no agency does anything to clean 
up these easy to find public health hazards.  Problems which impact more 
land surface than our group will cover in a lifetime.
 
If we do nothing, someone we know will be the first unlucky example.  Is Battle 
Mountain on BLM land?  Will that be the first place to see these rules played 
out?
 
Clear skies,
Mark


From: Doug Ross 
To: Meteorite List List  
Cc: nlehr...@nvbell.net; Martin Altmann  
Sent: Tuesday, October 2, 2012 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] BLM Law vs Type Sample

Very amusing (and valid) points, Martin!  Nobody likes to be subjected to new 
rules and restrictions, and it's easy to speculate about the potential pitfalls 
of the new BLM rules, but I tend to agree with Norm.  If the Feds were really 
viewing meteorite hunters as public enemy number one, they could have already 
been citing us for any of these offenses (and more) before the new guidelines 
were even issued.  I seriously doubt that the BLM secret police are going to be 
out in force, strip searching rock hounders on public land and conducting 
nickel tests on all rocks found in their possession.  Let's not get too carried 
away here, folks.  My guess is that this will all soon die down, the BLM will 
largely forget about us, and things will pretty much go back to the way they 
were.  Of course, I could be wrong

It seems to me the people most likely to suffer significant scrutiny and 
potentially serious consequences are the professional hunters, especially when 
hunting highly publicized witnessed falls.  I don't know what the solution is 
for that, honestly.  Glad I'm just an amateur hunter!  Okay, I've donned my 
asbestos suit, so flame away!  ;-)

-Doug Ross


> So in any case, when you go on BLM land, in first instance you will be
> always collecting rocks there and not meteorites,
> Therefore these rules do not apply.
> 
> Or do BLM or FED officers in the field exist, who could tell a chondrite
> apart from a terrestrial rock or who could identify an achondrite by visual
> inspection?
> 
> Could be a field of job creation:  Federal Meteorite Ranger!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Ehm...  the first US lunar will have a weight of 76 kgs. Do I have to smash
> the stone in pieces, to harvest year