Re: [meteorite-list] Matters Arising (cease fire! - white flag)
Let's please not let this degenerate into a debate surrounding the 2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. Lets not beat a vaca muerta. It's been pointed out that the phrase I didn't know it was loaded is a sad one which can be eliminated by safe behavior. Firearms are not toys. As a member of this forum and an NRA firearms safety instructor, the Count was duty bound to mention his concern (and was the first to show his concern). It is a serious safety issue. I hope we leave it to that, regardless of what you believe. There is no need to discuss it here any further as ONLY HURTFUL WORDS WILL FOLLOW. Let's not make it a debate between Right and Left and assume what the Right or Left think. People are diverse in their views and it's not as simple as that. Some of us in Arizona near the border live under serious threat from cross border smugglers and bandits, regardless of our political beliefs. Do not make it a debate between how many people died on what continent during select time periods. Stop with the names... The photos were innocent and for fun, but looking back they didn't treat firearms with the respect that they necessitate. Let's give the members under question the benefit of the doubt. It's highly unlikely more questionable photos will be used in the future. So let's get back to meteorites and keep your powder dry until more offensive photos are posted. If you feel the need to reply to something that someone has already written, it's easy to keep it off list (be courteous and reply in private...). Nobody should be asked OR feel that they need to leave the list. And neither side should subject the list to their private beliefs (unless they are relevant to the subject of meteoritics). Truce please! Mark Bowling Vail, AZ (TUCSON!) - Original Message From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com To: bernd.pa...@paulinet.de Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, February 3, 2010 10:14:48 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Matters Arising Hi Bernd and List, I can vouch that Peter is an asset to the List and I would hate to see him leave because some of us Americans can't keep our childish impulses under control. I currently own one gun and have owned several, including assault weapons. I support the right to private ownership of firearms. But, I also believe that all firearms should be treated with respect and they have a proper place. My current firearm has not left it's lock box in over a year - and the last time it was removed was for a cleaning. I would be a happy man if my gun is never discharged or brandished. Again, assuming the pistol that started all of this is real, juvenile tomfoolery with guns is not only irresponsible, but it's also off-topic for this list. Unfortunately, I will catch some flak from my fellow Americans for stating this in public, but we are an arrogant bunch and we think our way is always the right way. As a whole, we have little consideration for the cultures or beliefs of others. To be sure, there are a few right-leaning List members who think that Peter just needs to drink a Coca Cola, smoke a Marlboro cigarette, drink a Starbucks coffee, and watch a mindless Hollywood 3-D movie. And then Peter will realize the errors of his ways. If not, we will declare him a terrorist and bomb Scotland. Problem solved. ;) Best regards, MikeG On 03 Feb 2010 16:56:37 UT, bernd.pa...@paulinet.de bernd.pa...@paulinet.de wrote: Hello Folks, Last year, in Ensisheim 2009, I had the pleasure and the honor of meeting and talking to Peter and I can assure you that he is an extremely friendly, gentle person, a true gentleman. With utmost regret would I want to see him leave the list! He doesn't need anyone's help to make his point. He only mentions Anne because she already stated quite clearly that such pictures should not be presented on this list - they have nothing to do with meteorites. What Anne (who is, as most of you know, a native of France) and Peter state is what and how most Europeans here feel about guns and weapons: they are not toys! We should also be aware of those subtle differences between British and American English. Maybe it's the different usage of certain words on both sides of the Big Pond that caused this nasty situation. I am absolutely sure Peter did not intend to attack people as individuals. His post was aimed at the light-headed way they fooled around with guns. Do not forget that it is not only adults who see these pics. It's also children who might feel like having to point a gun, maybe onlyan airgun, right at their friend's face! Best wishes, Bernd __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list --
Re: [meteorite-list] Matters Arising (cease fire! - white flag)
Hi Mark and List, Well said Mark. I apologize to my fellow Americans for the backhanded slap I delivered in my last post. I do carry a chip on my shoulder regarding the coarser elements of our society and I let that negative attitude overtake my last post. If anyone is accused of being elitist, it should be I, and not Peter. The ironic thing is, I am probably the most dirt-poor elitist you'll ever see. ;) I am sure that Geoff and Blaine did not have any ill-will in their intents, nor did Greg. They were just having a bit of sport. Nobody would question the contributions to meteoritics that these people have made, so I think we should cut them a bit of slack regarding this. But I also think this is a learning moment for the List and Americans. Just because our government's legal documents afford us the right to own firearms in this country, it does not give us license to force our views on other cultures. The Rocks from Space POD is an eye-candy pleasure that many members on the List look forward to seeing. These members are scattered around the world and not all of them share our viewpoints on firearms and their importance to our civil liberties. I hope that this episode will teach us to be a little more careful about how we choose to exhibit our love of liberty and to be more considerate of others. As an American, I think it's great that the citizenry of Tucson can own and carry firearms. I can guarantee that Tucson has a lower crime rate for it. And I certainly won't argue the security that comes from hiking the desert with a gun - considering how many drug runners and immigrant smugglers there are out there. But, if I was a foreign visitor coming to Tucson for the first time, I would be shocked and perhaps scared to see a bunch of people walking around armed to the teeth with loaded firearms in plain view and easy reach. This would be especially true given the easy availability of alcohol. Frankly, if I had a room in Tucson and I was selling meteorites out of it - I would hang a sign on the door of my room - Please, no firearms allowed in this room. I don't see the need to carry a loaded gun to a mineral show. I visit areas of Tampa regularly that are far more dangerous than any tent at the mineral show, and I don't feel the need to wear a loaded pistol on my hip. So let's show some consideration for our overseas guests who are uncomfortable around guns - they are our guests and it is our duty to be gracious and accomodating. Best regards, MikeG On 2/3/10, Mark Bowling mina...@yahoo.com wrote: Let's please not let this degenerate into a debate surrounding the 2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. Lets not beat a vaca muerta. It's been pointed out that the phrase I didn't know it was loaded is a sad one which can be eliminated by safe behavior. Firearms are not toys. As a member of this forum and an NRA firearms safety instructor, the Count was duty bound to mention his concern (and was the first to show his concern). It is a serious safety issue. I hope we leave it to that, regardless of what you believe. There is no need to discuss it here any further as ONLY HURTFUL WORDS WILL FOLLOW. Let's not make it a debate between Right and Left and assume what the Right or Left think. People are diverse in their views and it's not as simple as that. Some of us in Arizona near the border live under serious threat from cross border smugglers and bandits, regardless of our political beliefs. Do not make it a debate between how many people died on what continent during select time periods. Stop with the names... The photos were innocent and for fun, but looking back they didn't treat firearms with the respect that they necessitate. Let's give the members under question the benefit of the doubt. It's highly unlikely more questionable photos will be used in the future. So let's get back to meteorites and keep your powder dry until more offensive photos are posted. If you feel the need to reply to something that someone has already written, it's easy to keep it off list (be courteous and reply in private...). Nobody should be asked OR feel that they need to leave the list. And neither side should subject the list to their private beliefs (unless they are relevant to the subject of meteoritics). Truce please! Mark Bowling Vail, AZ (TUCSON!) - Original Message From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com To: bernd.pa...@paulinet.de Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, February 3, 2010 10:14:48 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Matters Arising Hi Bernd and List, I can vouch that Peter is an asset to the List and I would hate to see him leave because some of us Americans can't keep our childish impulses under control. I currently own one gun and have owned several, including assault weapons. I support the right to private ownership of firearms. But, I also believe that all firearms should
