AW: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Re: 13.5 kg lunar
Hi Doug, Thanks for your most eloquent post. I see your point, but I also take the liberty to disagree, at least for a part of it. In essence, you wrote: There is the little detail of haves and have nots and thousand-dollar a gram speculations. A have not cannot participate in that, lets not beat around the bush. We can make an exception for those with obsessive-compulsive collector behavior if you like, I guess though they would be best off skipping dinner to pay the psychiatrist. But you do need big bucks to be involved I hope you recognize. The old tertium non datur actually is a very strong bias - applied to our situation it would sound like If you want a representative specimen of a lunar meteorite you have to have the money to buy it, or else you're out of the 'game'. There's always at least a third alternative. To get a specimen for free (I gave away more than one good lunar specimen for free, and I also received more than one for free), to trade for a specimen (I did this more than once), or to go out and to find a lunar rock yourself (I actually did that, too, and there were no big bucks involved). It isn't all about money - neither in the positive sense, nor in the negative sense. It's all about passion and intent, if you know what I mean. Please don't give up that ambition and dream to go to the Moon. Norbert, wasn't it Iceman that told Maverick You can be my Wingman anytime! ;-) I didn't say I gave up that dream - I just said it's two steps too far away to follow, and to me that means that it isn't realistic to follow it now. If the chance actually would arise, I wouldn't hesitate for a moment to take that chance. Maverick says thanks to Iceman. Wishing you the very best, and the first Mexican or AZ lunaite find, Norbert __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Re: 13.5 kg lunar
MexicoDoug wrote: Hola Norbert, I fail to see why you perceive a silver lining by preventing Lunar specimens to become accessible to the hands of amazed parent enthusiasts and collectors and the wonder of inspiring its wondrous effects with kids alike. What possible reason other than the desire to control or monopolize could you possibly be thinking?? Good evening Doug. I'm surprised by all the things that you read between the lines. Did I somehow offend you with my email? If yes, I beg your pardon, it wasn't intended to be offensive. I've no desire to control nor to monopolize anything. I was just expressing some mixed feelings (yes, you quoted me out of context). Some of us aren't speculators, you know and truly are excluded on the base of price. We are appreciate the possibility of an occasional Zagami incident. We have managed to be smiling all along without getting envious. Are you trying to set up some us and them scenario here? Rich vs poor? True collector vs spoiled investor? If so, you're picking at the wrong guy since I'm no member of the big boy's fraction - in fact, I'm wearing no party's color. I worked very hard for each and every piece that I have in my collection, just to fulfill a dream, and surely not to compromise other collectors. I'm driving a ten year old worn car, I'm writing this mail on a five year old laptop as I'm always saving my hard earned bucks for another meteorite sample - just to follow a dream. So don't tell me: Your post indicates that if you decided, you would like material available, but only for those who happen to have a huge purse... I never said that, and you know that I never did. Reading between the lines is a strange thing, Doug. It's a bit like gazing into a mirror, especially when you don't know who's or what's on the other side. You don't know me, Doug, and thus all what you seem to be reading between the lines, IMHO, is the projection of your own bias. And within 20 years after, much fresher Lunar specimens at the price of gold will be commonplace...for those of us still around. In the mean time, how nice that this finder seems to be happy to share the meteorite with scientists! hat is the best start... To keep this on topic, I agree with the latter statement, but I tend to disagree with the first. Meteoritics is always science first, but I really doubt that we will have enough kerosene left in about 20 years to warrant cheap private expeditions to the Moon, and back. Again, don't get me wrong: I actually have mixed feelings about that, too, and I really would enjoy a trip to the Moon, and to hunt for rocks, and meteorites up there when I'm 65. It's a nice dream, but two steps too far away to follow. Best, Norbert __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Re: 13.5 kg lunar
Hola Norbert, No need to ask for pardon Norbert, especially since in your heart you feel you meant no offense. I never saw any offense = I saw a simple statement which I agreed with in the first half (a lament not to be able to bond with the new Lunar), but I am in vigorous disagreement with your statement's second part, which I feel is the root of what rubs people the wrong way and hurts confidence about meteorite dealers: [1]For now, all I can say is that I'm a bit sad that it will virtually be impossible to get a specimen of this whopper, and its smaller anorthositic sister. The finder is obviously intending to keep the entire masses, and to stay anonymous... [2]Maybe there's a good part to that sad news, too, and that is that this whopper probably won't ruin the lunar market - for what it's worth... It sure sounded to me like you were saying the good part...is that this whopper probably won't ruin the Lunar market - for what it's worth. The Holy Roman Empire didn't take long to give you all the reason (translation: you are totally correct about the ruin ruin ruin and I honestly don't think he is capable of reading between the lines given the challenges he faces in expressing himself) I will accept as a valid interpretation all of your criticisms where I feel you may have read between my lines in your reply as well, which as far as I can tell amount to me artificially separating the Lunar haves and Lunar have nots, misclassifying you as a have, and harboring biases I am unaware I have. I won't comment on your personal situation, we've already seen one round of that on the list and it was ugly - the only time it worked was in the movies when Indiana Jones compares his scars with a cocky she-raider, not by public posting on our relative hardships... I will chalk up the my entire reply as an unwarranted reaction to your good part being this whopper probably won't ruin the Lunar market - accepting on faith whatever then that means to you and however you justify in your heart to mean you would like to see the price levels come down and are not protectionist. I personally would love to have a driveway, and then to pave it with CV3's or better yet, CM2's - they look just like asphalt. Of course, no one could drive on it and it would have a roof and a funhouse mirror maze set up on it for the whole neighborhood even if everyone else's houses were LBS and MBS (Lunar and Martian Block Stucco) construction. Every little meteorite I have the priviledge of caring for, including the most spectacular exception I am in heaven about currently in AZ, has no price tag any more. And if every one became worthless I would hardly notice and still feel priviledged to be their custodian. Thank goodness there are folks like Walter, Darren, JKG, Ingo, and even to a point, Marcin and maybe Greg are there in replies to this topic. And Matteo, the only contrarian voice might check out what his friend Michael Blood had as a viewpoint if I recall, he once mentioned he didn't care what prices were, as he was confident he could always add value and things would work out in the end. Or something like that I am sure it sounds better coming from the source's mouth. There is the little detail of haves and have nots and thousand-dollar a gram speculations. A have not cannot participate in that, lets not beat around the bush. We can make an exception for those with obsessive-compulsive collector behavior if you like, I guess though they would be best off skipping dinner to pay the psychiatrist. But you do need big bucks to be involved I hope you recognize. Please don't give up that ambition and dream to go to the Moon. Norbert, wasn't it Iceman that told Maverick You can be my Wingman anytime! ;-), and Matteo, was it Stinger who told him, Son, your ego is writing checks your body can't cash? Saludos, Doug En un mensaje con fecha 05/14/2005 6:15:03 PM Mexico Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribe: MexicoDoug wrote: Hola Norbert, I fail to see why you perceive a silver lining by preventing Lunar specimens to become accessible to the hands of amazed parent enthusiasts and collectors and the wonder of inspiring its wondrous effects with kids alike. What possible reason other than the desire to control or monopolize could you possibly be thinking?? Good evening Doug. I'm surprised by all the things that you read between the lines. Did I somehow offend you with my email? If yes, I beg your pardon, it wasn't intended to be offensive. I've no desire to control nor to monopolize anything. I was just expressing some mixed feelings (yes, you quoted me out of context). Some of us aren't speculators, you know and truly are excluded on the base of price. We are appreciate the possibility of an occasional Zagami incident. We have managed to be smiling all along without getting envious. Are you
