Re: mount_null replacement?
On Fri, Oct 06, 2006 at 11:16:46AM +0200, Rogier Krieger wrote: > On 10/4/06, G 0kita <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >I notice mount_null was dropped as of OpenBSD 3.8, can someone tell > >me first of all why this was done [...] > > Various comments to the likes of 'turd polishing' can be found in the > misc@ archives. IIRC, the developers gave up on this piece of > functionality as it just wouldn't work reliably. See the archives and > commit logs for a more detailed description. > > >Specifically I'm looking to have a writable directory mounted read-only in > >another location. > > As another poster suggested, you can probably get away with local NFS > mounts. Those have worked for me since 3.8, although I never put them > to antthing resembling a stress test. YMMV. If 70,000 hits/hour to a mod_perl website running in the chroot with /usr/local/libdata/perl5 and /usr/libdata/perl5 brought in this way counts as a stress test, then this method works fine. I am very happy with this method and use it both at work and for a small NGO I support. It works much better than the null mounts I had going previously. -Dan -- "Burnished gallows set with red Caress the fevered, empty mind Of man who hangs bloodied and blind To reach for wisdom, not for bread." -- Deoridhe Grimsdaughter
Re: mount_null replacement?
On 10/4/06, G 0kita <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I notice mount_null was dropped as of OpenBSD 3.8, can someone tell me first of all why this was done [...] Various comments to the likes of 'turd polishing' can be found in the misc@ archives. IIRC, the developers gave up on this piece of functionality as it just wouldn't work reliably. See the archives and commit logs for a more detailed description. Specifically I'm looking to have a writable directory mounted read-only in another location. As another poster suggested, you can probably get away with local NFS mounts. Those have worked for me since 3.8, although I never put them to antthing resembling a stress test. YMMV. Cheers, Rogier -- If you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there.
Re: mount_null replacement?
On Wed, 4 Oct 2006, G 0kita wrote: Specifically I'm looking to have a writable directory mounted read-only in another location. Svnd mounts aren't the solution I'm looking for, I'm fairly sure. You could try local NFS mount. -- Antoine
mount_null replacement?
Hi there, I've been using null mounts for the last while to maintain a readonly filesystem under OpenBSD 3.6. For example: /etc/fstab: /home/user/dir /var/www/dir null ro,nodev,nosuid,noexec 0 0 I just tried this on an OpenBSD 3.9 system and it fails on the helper program for null (ie. mount_null). I notice mount_null was dropped as of OpenBSD 3.8, can someone tell me first of all why this was done (the changelog only shows comments about realpath failure). Secondly is there a replacement or workaround which will give me the kind of behaviour I'm looking for? Specifically I'm looking to have a writable directory mounted read-only in another location. Svnd mounts aren't the solution I'm looking for, I'm fairly sure. G.0kita
Re: mount_null
Jonas Carlsson wrote: In what ways will I suffer if I simply re-enable null mounts to bring some discspace from /home into my apache chroot on a much smaller /var partition? I've used this solution without problems for a few versions. Maybe you won't suffer at all, maybe you get corrupted file systems and/or system meltdowns. If the latter, no one here will be willing to help you out since what you've done is officially unsupported. When I used it things went bad when unmouning the nullfs's, but that was a long time ago. If at all possible, and it most likely is, try to find another way. I store files at /var/www/users/ and symlink ~/www to it. Possibly move the entire home dir into the chroot. /Alexander
mount_null
I've searched the archives without luck on this one. In what ways will I suffer if I simply re-enable null mounts to bring some discspace from /home into my apache chroot on a much smaller /var partition? I've used this solution without problems for a few versions. Thanks in advance
Re: mount_null gone?
On 05 Sep 2005 10:51:37 +0200, Artur Grabowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > nullfs never worked. Anything else you experienced can be explained by > luck or high resistance to kernel crashes and corrupted data. It's not > coming back until it's safe. In the same way as rlogin is not coming > back and we're not making xterm setuid root. Don't like it? Then > OpenBSD is obviously not for you. > > //art > it's not that I don't like it, I just could not find an explanation for the errors I got... so I'll probably try a local NFS mount instead for the fileserver directories, and set the ftp/www homedirs to be the usersdirs directly... thanks for the information - gijs
Re: mount_null gone?
Gijs Nijholt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Hello, > > After some digging through mailinglist archives, it seems that > mount_null is no longer in the GENERIC since OpenBSD 3.7 (and > mount_union as well) > This is not mentioned in the release notes as far as I can verify. > > Why is it gone and what is the alternative? Alternative to mount_null? Take a hammer and hit your disk repeatedly with it and you might get the same results. Or maybe pull out memory sticks from your machine while it's running. Removing the cpu fan could work too. Sticking long needles under your knee might emulate the sensation. Etc. nullfs never worked. Anything else you experienced can be explained by luck or high resistance to kernel crashes and corrupted data. It's not coming back until it's safe. In the same way as rlogin is not coming back and we're not making xterm setuid root. Don't like it? Then OpenBSD is obviously not for you. //art
Re: mount_null gone?
Quoting Gijs Nijholt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > What's particularly strange, it's that the command (/sbin/mount_null) > exists, but on executing the following command: > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> sudo mount_null /extended/ /home/gijs/fileserver/ > ...I get the following error: > mount_null: /home/gijs/fileserver/: Filesystem not supported by kernel > > Both filesystems are FFS, and it worked really well in 3.6. > Can anyone tell me how to fix this problem? > > On 9/4/05, Gijs Nijholt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hello, > > > > After some digging through mailinglist archives, it seems that > > mount_null is no longer in the GENERIC since OpenBSD 3.7 (and > > mount_union as well) > > This is not mentioned in the release notes as far as I can verify. > > > > Why is it gone and what is the alternative? > > (I need a way to mount my /extended partition into /home/users and > > /var/www/users/user, which are both chrooted in respectively ftp and > > apache) > > > > Or how can I get mount_null back without reinstalling the system? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > Gijs Nijholt > > This was planned imho, a few months after reporting this: http://www.monkey.org/openbsd/archive/bugs/0404/msg00119.html I got response from Otto that nullfs isn't supported anymore. I think the code is to old and hasn't a maintainer to support it any further (I could be wrong). Take a look at mount_nullfs(8) from freebsd for example: BUGS THIS FILE SYSTEM TYPE IS NOT YET FULLY SUPPORTED (READ: IT DOESN'T WORK) AND USING IT MAY, IN FACT, DESTROY DATA ON YOUR SYSTEM. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. BEWARE OF DOG. SLIPPERY WHEN WET. This code also needs an owner in order to be less dangerous - serious hackers can apply by sending mail to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> and announcing their intent to take it over. Kind Regards, Jimmy Scott This message has been sent through ihosting.be To report spamming or other unaccepted behavior by a iHosting customer, please send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: mount_null gone?
On 9/4/05, Gijs Nijholt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Why is it gone and what is the alternative? Various messages such as [1] detail why it was removed some time ago as it didn't work well enough. You'll want to read the rest of the thread for more details. Using localhost NFS mounts may provide you with similar functionality, but given the rest of the above thread, it may or may not work for you. In several cases, it works for my machihes, but your mileage may vary. Creating separate file systems for those locations or using remote NFS mounts are of course other alternatives. Cheers, Rogier References: 1. 'Re: nfs + mount_union' - MARC http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-misc&m=110234778208603&w=2 -- If you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there.
Re: mount_null gone?
On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 10:07:12PM +0200, Gijs Nijholt wrote: > Why is it gone and what is the alternative? http://undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20050527155028 > (I need a way to mount my /extended partition into /home/users and > /var/www/users/user, which are both chrooted in respectively ftp and > apache) Use a local nfs mount as a workaround. Ciao, Kili
Re: mount_null gone?
On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 10:26:36PM +0200, Gijs Nijholt wrote: > What's particularly strange, it's that the command (/sbin/mount_null) > exists, but on executing the following command: [...] It has been removed later. Ciao, Kili
Re: mount_null gone?
What's particularly strange, it's that the command (/sbin/mount_null) exists, but on executing the following command: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> sudo mount_null /extended/ /home/gijs/fileserver/ ...I get the following error: mount_null: /home/gijs/fileserver/: Filesystem not supported by kernel Both filesystems are FFS, and it worked really well in 3.6. Can anyone tell me how to fix this problem? On 9/4/05, Gijs Nijholt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > After some digging through mailinglist archives, it seems that > mount_null is no longer in the GENERIC since OpenBSD 3.7 (and > mount_union as well) > This is not mentioned in the release notes as far as I can verify. > > Why is it gone and what is the alternative? > (I need a way to mount my /extended partition into /home/users and > /var/www/users/user, which are both chrooted in respectively ftp and > apache) > > Or how can I get mount_null back without reinstalling the system? > > Thanks in advance. > Gijs Nijholt
Re: mount_null gone?
On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 10:07:12PM +0200, Gijs Nijholt wrote: > After some digging through mailinglist archives, it seems that > mount_null is no longer in the GENERIC since OpenBSD 3.7 (and > mount_union as well) > This is not mentioned in the release notes as far as I can verify. > Why is it gone and what is the alternative? same question goes for rlogin. I know it's insecure and so on... go tell Meridian about it. There's a lot of gear out there which talks only rlogin. -- Igor "CacoDem0n" Grabin, http://violent.death.kiev.ua/
mount_null gone?
Hello, After some digging through mailinglist archives, it seems that mount_null is no longer in the GENERIC since OpenBSD 3.7 (and mount_union as well) This is not mentioned in the release notes as far as I can verify. Why is it gone and what is the alternative? (I need a way to mount my /extended partition into /home/users and /var/www/users/user, which are both chrooted in respectively ftp and apache) Or how can I get mount_null back without reinstalling the system? Thanks in advance. Gijs Nijholt
