Let's eliminate the Module List

2004-08-18 Thread Andy Lester
I propose eliminating the Long Module List.  I'm talking about
http://www.cpan.org/modules/00modlist.long.html (2998 modules), not
http://www.cpan.org/modules/01modules.index.html (6800 modules).

=over 4

=item * It's no longer relevant.

Way back when, it was cool to have a single readable source of
information.  With search.cpan.org, it's just not necessary any more.
The list gives two aims:

* FOR DEVELOPERS: To change duplication of effort into cooperation.
* FOR USERS: To quickly locate existing software which can be reused.

Both are addressed, and very effectively, by search.cpan.org.

=item * Few people look at it.

Looking at pair.com's mirror logs, I see that since Jan 2003, downloads of
00mod* have averaged fewer than five per month.  Per month, not per day.
Pair is not a lightly-used mirror, either.  They served up 615K distros
for July 2004.  Five out of 615,000 is close enough to zero for me.

=item * Inclusion on the list is effectively arbitrary.

It doesn't mean anything to have a module on that list.  It's certainly
not a stamp of quality.  I don't mean to ignite the debate over whether
there should be some Perl Approved CPAN module apparatus should exist;
only that inclusion on the Module List is not it.

=item * The resources used could be better used elsewhere.

There's significant amount of human time and machine resources that go
into maintaining the Long Module List.  For that matter, it's a waste
of developer time proposing inclusion on a list that nobody looks at.

=item * search.cpan.org browsing is misleading

Browsing search.cpan.org gives the user the impression that he or she
is browsing all modules on the CPAN.  This is not the case.  The 26
categories don't make sense any more, anyway.

=back

The one bit of value that I see in this process is where Graham looks
at submissions that people have sent in and, if something seems like
it's duplicate effort, tries to redirect the author to reduce the
duplication. (http://www.nntp.perl.org/group/perl.modules/34207)
Unfortunately, that requires the author to submit a proposal for
inclusion, and since fewer than half of the authors submit the modules,
it's hardly a complete filter.

I welcome your thoughts.  How can we capture the good part of the module
list (the human filtering), and remove the obsoleted infrastructure?

xoxo,
Andy

-- 
Andy Lester = [EMAIL PROTECTED] = www.petdance.com = AIM:petdance


Re: Let's eliminate the Module List

2004-08-18 Thread Mark Stosberg
On Wed, Aug 18, 2004 at 04:54:32PM -0500, Andy Lester wrote:
 I propose eliminating the Long Module List.  I'm talking about
 http://www.cpan.org/modules/00modlist.long.html (2998 modules), not
 http://www.cpan.org/modules/01modules.index.html (6800 modules).

As a long time CPAN module author and user, I second this proposal.

Mark



Re: Let's eliminate the Module List

2004-08-18 Thread Christopher Hicks
On Wed, 18 Aug 2004, Randy W. Sims wrote:
I made a suggestion regarding this before that I thought provided a fair 
solution http://www.nntp.perl.org/group/perl.module-authors/2615, but 
no one commented. Basically, upon submission of a new module, a notice 
would be auto-posted to some list. If no one replies to that posting 
within some time frame, the module is automatically accepted. If anyone 
does reply, then it requires moderator approval. The moderator(s) isn't 
required to do anything other than monitor the discussion and act 
according to the concesus reached in the discussion. The list members do 
what is currently done on a voluntary basis on module-authors; that is, 
they make name suggestions, discuss prior art, etc.
That sounds good to me!  Are you volunteering to implement it too?  :)
--
/chris
There are two ways of constructing a software design. One way is to make 
it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies. And the other way 
is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies.
 -- C.A.R. Hoare



Re: Let's eliminate the Module List

2004-08-18 Thread Lincoln A. Baxter

On Wed, 2004-08-18 at 17:57, Mark Stosberg wrote:
 On Wed, Aug 18, 2004 at 04:54:32PM -0500, Andy Lester wrote:
  I propose eliminating the Long Module List.  I'm talking about
  http://www.cpan.org/modules/00modlist.long.html (2998 modules), not
  http://www.cpan.org/modules/01modules.index.html (6800 modules).
 
 As a long time CPAN module author and user, I second this proposal.
 
   Mark
 
ditto, I have modules on the list and not.
Sometime ago, I came to the same conclusion, it really adds no
significant value today.  I did use it years ago, before
search.cpan.org.  Not much really since.

Lincoln