Re: [Mono-list] Serialisation of nullable
type declarations from msdn2: C# [SerializableAttribute] public struct Nullable where T : struct and C# [ComVisibleAttribute(true)] public static class Nullable On 4/27/06, Atsushi Eno <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Nullable is not Serializable. I might be wrong since I just checked > MSDN doc and corcompare result though. > > Atsushi Eno > > Colin JN Breame wrote: > > Currently Nullable is not marked as Serializable which is quite irritating. > > > > Are there any plans in the future to mark it as Serializable? and are there > > any work arounds that don't involve writing custom serialisation? > > > > Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this imply that Nullable cannot > > cross an AppDomain? > > > > -- Colin > > ___ > > Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com > > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > > > > ___ > Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Xml.Serialization empty element
In the past I've done this sort of bridge work using hacks like named
elements/attributes and ignored accessors. For example
[XmlIgnore]
public bool MyFlag;
[XmlElement("MyFlag")]
public EmptyObject _MyFlag
{
get { return MyFlag ? EmptyObject() : null; }
set { MyFlag = (value != null) }
}
-David Waite
On 4/18/06, Dominik Zablotny <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dnia 18-04-2006, wto o godzinie 12:05 -0500, Jonathan Gilbert
> napisał(a):
> > Just to elaborate on this (for the original poster), XML serializtion was
> > designed with the goal of generating XML for instances of existing data
> > types, and so using it for the inverse mapping -- taking an arbitrary XML
> > structure and mapping a hierarchy of C# data types onto it -- is something
> > that is not guaranteed to work.
>
> But it's sooo convenient :P
>
> > One approach to slightly sweeten the syntax might be to add an implicit
> > conversion from your dummy class to 'bool':
>
> That solves reading bool from program, but not writing it. Anyway, I can
> live with my current solution. Thanks for all answers.
>
> --
> Dominik Zablotny
> xmpp:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> ___
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>
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Re: [Mono-list] Accessing Mono SVN via http
You can of course use http for subversion, it is the default mechanism, but is not used for the mono project. There is a bit of extra infrastructure needed to support it, as it uses WebDAV and relies on Apache 2. -David Waite On 6/9/05, Peter Dennis Bartok <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You don't use http with the svn command. If you want http to download, just > just use your browser, and use the viewcvs interface to download a tarball. > For example, this link > http://svn.myrealbox.com/viewcvs/trunk/MonoDevelop.tar.gz?root=monodevelop&view=tar > should give you a tarball of the latest monodevelop sources. > > Svn uses it's own protocol, and the urls for svn start with svn:// or > svn+ssh:// > > Cheers, > Peter > > -Original Message- > From: "Aleksandar Dezelin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "mono-list" > Date: 09 June, 2005 05:09 > Subject: [Mono-list] Accessing Mono SVN via http > > > When I try to get the latest MonoDevelop source from the svn repository by > issuing command : > > svn co http://svn.myrealbox.com/monodevelop/trunk/MonoDevelop/ > > I get the following result : > > svn: REPORT request failed on '/monodevelop/!svn/vcc/default' > svn: REPORT of '/monodevelop/!svn/vcc/default': 400 Bad Request ( > http://svn.myrealbox.com) > > How can I download the latest source from the svn repository via http? (I > must use http - I'm behind a proxy) > > cheers, > Aleksandar Dezelin > > > > -- > Linux is like wighwam, no windows no gates and apache inside... > > ___ > Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Web Services and patents
There is no application of knowledge on a computer (including writing a "Hello, World" application) which is completely safe from US patent lawsuit. There is nothing to prevent someone from having a patent against the concept of SOAP, or for that matter the concept of XML, or network-based data interchange. Whether or not these patents could be struck down in court is another matter. I suggest you worry less about patents and more about innovation. Otherwise you will spend so much time learning international patent law and researching patents that you will never produce anything. There is no guaranteed safe ground, no matter what programming language you write your implementation in, or which vendor designed the API you use. The only sanity comes from not letting the problems stop you from meeting your potential, and fighting tooth and nail the problems in the system every chance you get. -David Waite On 5/31/05, Pedro Santos Gómez <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi all, > > We're going to start a project which we want to > develop using Mono. The question is that we are going > to use Web Services. > > Now, I have mainly 3 doubts about Web Services and > patents: > > 1st) In the same way I understand that Mono implements > Windows Forms just for compatibility with .NET, but > that we can use other gui toolkits (such as GTK# or > wxNET), or implements ADO.NET for compatibility, but > we can use GdaSharp, Is there any alternative to the > .NET stack of Web Services? I mean, an implementation > of a free library of Web Services (SOAP, not xml-rpc) > that could substitute System.Web.Services. > > I've read about gnome soup, but in: > http://cvs.gnome.org/viewcvs/soup/ > I find that las entry is from April 2003, so I'm not > sure about its current state. > > 2nd) In case there's no mono "alternative", how > dangerous might be using System.Web.Services in long > term? I don't need any compatibility with .NET, I just > want to develop an application which uses Web Services > in Mono. As far as I understand in: > http://www.mono-project.com/FAQ:_Licensing > the Web Services part is not as easy to defend as the > rest of Mono, and it *could* happen to "remove the > pieces of code that were covered by those patents", > keeping Mono as a great development platform. But how > could I develop WS? > > 3rd) What would be the worst case in Web Services? All > I read in FAQs and interviews etc. is that the first > thing to do in case of problems with patents is > finding previous art. Being Web Services a standard, > is it easier to find this? Apache Axis could be an > example? Or what would be patented are the namespaces > or something like that?. If this is not possible, I've > read the next step is to try to change the > implementation. What does this exactly mean? Different > API doing the same thing? Or it would be changed just > inside? > > thank you so much for reading and of course for > answering, and sorry if my english is not as good as > could 0:-), > Pedro > > P.S: I've already read this thread: > http://galactus.ximian.com/pipermail/mono-list/2003-February/012111.html > but I'm not sure I get a clear answer, and at that > time maybe the implementation of web services was not > as complete as now. > P.S.2: I don't pretend to create any kind of flame > with patent issues or something like that, I just > think that *maybe* patent issues might be even > smoother with Web Services and I just would like > anybody to confirm or deny this. Thank you again. > > > > > > __ > Renovamos el Correo Yahoo! > Nuevos servicios, más seguridad > http://correo.yahoo.es > ___ > Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Serializing a Graph ..
the normal serialization is a bag of unique objects with references
between them; formatting with Xml implies a parent/child relationship.
The xml serializer as it exists does not make allowances to directly
create or use ID/IDREF relationships, which is what you really need
for your cyclic data structure.
-David Waite
On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 00:05:00 +, Phillip Neumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> Ive just made the same with BinaryFormatetr, instead of XmlSerialize
>
> Why does it work? Why does XmlSerilize not work?
>
>
> Phillip Neumann wrote:
>
> > Hello all...
> >
> > Im doing some work with Graph, so create some clases:
> >
> > Node
> > Arc
> > Graph.
> >
> > (A Graph is a list of Nodes)
> >
> > I like the idea about been able to save/load a graph to/from disk.
> > Im trying to XmlSerialize my graph.
> >
> > I have define my graph so, that this cannot be made, becouse:
> > 1.- Node = { X, Y, ListOfOutgoingArcs }
> > 2.- Arc= { StartNode, StopNode, Weight}
> >
> > This definition is circular
> >
> > What do u think is the best to modify, for let the graph been saved to
> > disk?
> >
> >
> > When i run this, i get this:
> >
> > System.InvalidOperationException: A cirtular reference was detected
> > while serializing an object of type Node
> >
> >
> >
> > thanks in advance,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >using System;
> >using System.Xml;
> >using System.Xml.Serialization;
> >using System.Collections;
> >
> >[Serializable, XmlInclude(typeof(Arc))]
> >public class Node{
> >
> > public ArrayList OutGoingArcs = new ArrayList();
> > public int X;
> > public int Y;
> > public Node(){}
> > public Node(int x,int y){
> > X=x;
> > Y=y;
> >
> > }
> >
> >}
> >
> >public class Arc{
> > public int Weight;
> > public Node StartAt;
> > public Node EndAt;
> > public Arc(){}
> > public Arc(Node n1, Node n2){
> > StartAt=n1;
> > EndAt = n2;
> > n1.OutGoingArcs.Add(this);
> > }
> >
> >}
> >
> >[Serializable, XmlInclude(typeof(Node))]
> >public class Graf{
> > public ArrayList Nodes;
> >
> > public Graf (){
> > Nodes = new ArrayList();
> > }
> >
> > public void Add(Node n){
> > Nodes.Add(n);
> > }
> >}
> >
> >public class M{
> >
> > public static void Main(){
> >
> > Graf g = new Graf();
> >
> > Node n1 = new Node(1,1);
> > Node n2 = new Node(2,2);
> >
> > Arc a1=new Arc(n1,n2);
> >
> >
> > g.Add(n1);
> > g.Add(n2);
> >
> > XmlSerializer seria = new XmlSerializer(typeof(Graf));
> > seria.Serialize(Console.Out,g);
> >
> >
> > }
> >
> >
> >}
> >
> >
>
> --
>
> _
> Phillip Neumann
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> www.sofsis.cl
>
>
>
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Re: [Mono-list] Visual Studio.net 2005 Enterprise Beta 1
I believe Microsoft ties their versions of Visual Studio to particular releases of .Net. After a final release is available, you may be motivated to upgrade so that you are using the final versions of the .Net 2.0 assemblies (and the correct APIs). On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 09:49:08 -0600, SigmaX <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Sijmen Mulder wrote: > > >Hi, > > > > > > > >>obviously that has a limited time license and will expire later on > >> > >>* why not download the Personal Edition beta which is (and will remain from > >>what I understand) for free: > >> > >>http://lab.msdn.microsoft.com/express > >> > >> > > > >If I recall correctly, doesn't the express edition expire, too? > > > > > > > > > I've looked everywhere and I can't find that they expire (Not to say > they don't). Microsoft's "trial editions" always expire after six > months, give or take, but do their Betas? Their so-called "CTP's" > (Monthly snapshots of dev) are replaced a month later by the next CTP > and so on, and the Beta is just a more tested and mature version. Their > dev model is looking more and more open-source-ish... though I'm certain > they'll never actually release the code, though they'll be happy for > heavy developors to file bug reports in the CTP's :-P. >Can anybody give me a link where it actually says that the > Enterprise Beta expires after a period? Or maybe something that says > you can't use it in production (Read: for-profit) environments? I've > got VS 2002 academic, which is only good for educational and > open-source-ish stuff by the license. Mono is great, but I'm holding > out for Winforms before I'm a complete convert :-P. >Anywho, that's me 2c, > SigmaX > > -- > Registered Linux Freak #: 366,862 > > "My ISP won't talk to me after lodging a support call for helping gettting > ADSL hooked up to a WinXP install running under VMWare under Linux on my > XBox." >'Anonymous Coward,' in a post on slashdot.org > > "For the eyes of the Lord range throughout the earth to strengthen those > whose hearts are fully commited to him." >2 Chronicles 16:9a > > ___ > Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Re: Ask Microsoft: Mono support
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:45:40 -0400, Ed Burnette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -Original Message- > > From: Paolo Molaro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > IMHO, if they decide to attack Mono, as detailed in the FAQ, if they > > have patents that can stand in court, we'll remove the features or > > work around the patents. This may break compatibility, but we have our > > own code and we'll adapt it. > > I read that in the FAQ. Why not do it now and make mono completely unencumbered? You > say that compatibility isn't the primary concern. An IP-free implementation would > eliminate any legal doubt that is slowing down commercial adoption. More adoption > means more users and developers and a better environment, right? Thats not really how it works. If there were four active patents total, and they were all by Microsoft about things within the .Net Framework - then sure, it would make sense to avoid it. But patents are a horrible reality of the software engineering environment today. You really cannot tie your own shoes without violating someone's patent anymore - and at that point, it really becomes a business and legal problem. In addition. the penalties for patent infringement skyrocket if you knowingly violate a patent. It is far better to just not look, play ignorant to the whole issue, and be reactionary. Or to summarize, in response to the 'why not switch now' question, my follow-on question would be 'to what?' What is there in any software engineering vertical which is not potentially patent-encombered in the US? _Every_ open-source project has an equal potential for patent infringement. Mono just gets a much larger amount of FUD over it because villifying Microsoft is so easy and fashionable. > > I think you underestimate the paranoia of lawyers, especially at big companies. > Although you and I can recognize FUD for what it is, lawyers take more convincing. When there are enforced patents on ideas like 'plugins' and 'having one program help another', lawyers really need to change their outlook on what is the best outlook on patents. -David Waite ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] about Convert class
This sure looks like you are having an IndexOutOfBoundsException on dr.GetValue(0), and not the Convert. On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 15:12:49 +, lamyae Benabdeljalil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I am using mono 1.0, and i have a problem with a lethod of the > System.Convert class. My statement is : > Hashkey=System.Convert.FromBase64String(dr.GetValue(0).ToString()); > i get the following error: > Unhandled Exception: System.IndexOutOfRangeException: Array index is out > of range. > in <0x00098> System.Data.Odbc.OdbcDataReader:GetValue (int) > in <0x00054> (wrapper remoting-invoke-with-check) > System.Data.Odbc.OdbcDataReader:GetValue (int) > in <0x003d6> Test:checkkeys () > in <0x000cb> Test:Main () > > Please, can you help me? > * > ___ > Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Cross-platform GUI.
As a developer, I would go for i), and if the UI bothers me, attempt to change it, possibly going to cocoa#. (Puts on FUD Hat) Java has a very bad reputation because of the poor quality of UI ports to the mac - I've seen many cases where tools are marked as having mac versions as soon as a user reports that the software runs on the mac. As result, most of the mac users I have spoken to avoid downloading applications with the word 'Java' on their homepage. The java apps which get downlaoded and used on the mac are ones which do not advertise the fact. I know gtk# will have some option for drawing natively on OS X. We all know 90% of GTK apps will ignore Apple HIG (even more than they ignore Gnome's HIG). And I unfortunately know that users will avoid my apps if I advertise 'mono' anywhere near their pages, because in user's minds Mono will equal inconsistent, broken UI. -David Waite On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 21:58:33 +0100, David Burnett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dan Winship wrote: > >They allegedly have cross-platform widgets, but > >Thunderbird and FireFox just suck on OS X > > In your opinion they suck not mine. Yes, I'm posting this > from Thunderbird because all the NNTP clients I've tried that follow > the Apple HIG are a load of rubbish, so I use Thunderbird for that > and its only natural I use it for email too. > Before Thunderbird came along I was using PAN with all the problems of > using an X11 app on OSX, starting up X11,lack of drag and drop > interaction, fonts with no aliasing (bad GTK compile), limited clipboard > etc, rather than using the other apps. After using Thunderbird for five > minutes I did not even notice where it didn't follow Apples HIG. > > In the end it comes down to one simple decision, would you > rather use > > i)a piece of software with out perfect adherence to Apples HIG > (GTK# native) > or > ii)a piece of software with out perfect adherence to Apples HIG and > limited clipboard, no drag and drop etc (GTK# via X11) > or > iii)no app at all ? . > > I would go for i) every time, and lets face it not many non Mac > developers are ever going to try Cocoa# unless the GNUStep guys take an > interest :-) > > Dave > ___ > Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] MS ASP .NET Bug
This is not a bug; the just takes precidence over code
structure; the contents of the script block is interpreted by a
separate engine. Without knowing the grammar of the language you are
using for the script block, the parser has no way of knowing if
sql += @"
is a valid statement or not.
As someone said, you should divide up the script close tag in your
code. Something like a CDATA block will not work, at least not with
the MS implementation (which appears to be regexp-based rather than
having a real grammar). Another option would be to separate your code
from the page.
-David Waite
On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 11:36:18 -0600, Andrew Arnott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Answer below.
>
> > so I wonder if it would happen in Mono too. The bug is simple, supose we
> > have the following in an aspx:
> >
> >void ProcessClick( object sender, EventArgs args )
> >{
> > string sql = @"<script language='javascript'>";
> > sql += @"alert('";
> > sql += nome.Value;
> > sql += "');";
> > sql += @""; // Here is the PROBLEM!
> > this.RegisterClientScriptBlock( "JJ", sql );
> > }
> >
> > The parser will only "copy" to the class definition the code from > runat=server> to <script>. The problem is that he thinks that the
> > "" literal is the tag end... So in the class definition we will
> > have only:
> >
> > void ProcessClick( object sender, EventArgs args )
> >{
> > string sql = @"";
> > sql += @"alert('";
> > sql += nome.Value;
> > sql += "');";
> > sql += @"
> >
> > Witch produces a compiler error. Would this happen in Mono? If not, should
> > it happen?
>
> I can't answer the "will it happen in Mono question", but a solution to the
> problem is to just divide your tag up:
>
> sql += @""; // Here is the SOLUTION!
>
> That will work in any implementation that has the bug.
>
>
>
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Re: [Mono-list] C# Functionality
C# has operator overloading, although some care must be taken as these operators are different functions with different rules than things like IComparer and Object.Equals(). C# does not have friend functions; it instead has the idea of an 'internal' access, where just the executable or library being built has access, allowing you to still restrict third parties from accessing certain features of your objects. -David Waite - Original Message - From: Rohit K Gupta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2004 09:44:43 +0530 Subject: [Mono-list] C# Functionality To: MONO <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi to all, i was wondering about the fact that as C++ provides for Operator Overloading and Friend Functions ,does C# Provide such functionality? Operator overloading is as its name implies we can define operator functionalities for user defined classes and friend functions are those which can be defined outside the class but declared friend to the user defined class so that it can access private memebers of the class. now by friend where i am confused is in C# we can define friend classes, members and functions but those are part of class and can be accessed in same assembly only by making the instace of the class whereas the c++ friend function can be called without instace of object but just by passing it in arguments this blurs my c++ concepts am i thinking right or worng? just help me Thanks & Regards Rohit ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Problem with XmlTextReader
On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 03:14:37 +0900, Atsushi Eno <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > Assuming you also wanted to reply to the list... > Oops :) > David Waite wrote: > > > I might be misunderstanding the problem, but... > > > > It seems like the stream could simply be Read() from; if there is no > > data, the read will block, if there is data it can go into an internal > > buffer. That buffer gets examined to see if there is enough > > information to identify and represent the next event in the pull > > parser; if not, you call Read() again, which may block again. MoveTo* > > and Read* methods will just keep reading until the conditions > > specified by the method are satisfied. > > What I've written in the previous post is "how Read() events do not > match with the *required* text stream consumption for one Read() call". > The TextReader (stream) is likely to be set as empty (not set any > contents) and thus it easily freezes. In such case are those stream > developers aware of how XmlTextReader consumes the stream at any time? My misunderstanding - I thought you were saying in your previous message that reading from the stream only when a Read() or Next*() was called was impossible; it is possible, because you are doing it already in your code :) What is infeasable is reading byte-by-byte, just enough to determine the node type. Yes, a Stream Read(byte[], int, int) is not meant to block until the length is met. You may read more into an internal buffer than is needed to represent the next event, but you will not block waiting for more than needed. > (BTW MoveTo*() never consumes the stream. Those methods must be > available for iterating attributes.) Sorry, yes, only MoveToContent() performs reading. -David Waite ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Mono: Post 1.0 plans and development update.
I have always run into pretty fundamental problems while trying to port my ASP.NET apps over to run on xsp. Much to the credit of gonzalo, these issues have usually been fixed very quickly (and I've supplied a patch or two as well), but I've always run out of time before I could get my app functioning under xsp. Solid ASP.NET support is very important to me within mono, ASP.NET 2.0 support is also going to be important to me soon. Is this work for an improved xsp/mod_mono taking place in the 'xsp' module, or in a separate module? Is there a road map for xsp? Has there been any work, or are there any plans, to support the ASP.NET 2.0 features? How can someone like myself (who unfortunately is very spotty in terms of time he has to contribute to mono) make xsp/mod_mono better? Are there bite-sized improvements I could tackle? -David Waite On Fri, 16 Jul 2004 11:12:58 -0400, Miguel de Icaza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > > I use mono essencially to make WebApplications, and i can't seen new > > good features in that area. For example the XSP sucks. We cannot use > > this kind of server in a production environment > > and i think this component should evolute for this server work as > > iqual as IIS. > > We have been working on an improved version of XSP/mod_mono, but if you > are using it and experiencing problems, we need to know about them. > > If we do not know about them, it is very hard for us to fix the > problem. We have a test suite and various programs that we run against > it, but it is not enough. > > > > Miguel > ___ > Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list > ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] New web site up
On Jun 10, 2004, at 4:25 PM, Ben Maurer wrote: On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 16:59, Erik Dasque wrote: As some of you may know, we're moving to a new site (the old one will be phased out eventually) and to new content and design. We'd love feedback on it before we push it out officially : First, I love this. It looks *GREAT*. Even if none of these comments are acted upon, it will still be great. I agree! Now, for comments: I agree! ;-) I'll add a few additional comments, take them with as many grains of salt as you like. The navigation is not confusing, but is a bit overwelming. There are the main sections at the top, the navigation bar on the left, and also buttons at the the top right. None of these are 'authorative' - the download button for example goes to the 'about mono' tab look, but is not navigatable via the about bar on the left. Also, the submenus on some items are hidden, which makes it confusing to find the 'licensing and patents' section for instance, without knowing it appears under the 'faq' section. The look of submenu items was not sufficient for me to realize (at first) that I was actually looking at a menu with embedded items. Also, clicking on the 'faq' link (without page content changing to show I was on a new link) was confusing to me, although I have used the internet for long enough to quickly figure it out. Some links in the navigation system and buttons at the top send you to an external site; there is no visual indicator that this will happen. The 'about' navigation bar could be flattened if: The FAQ was moved to 'using mono', with the general section refactored into some sort of 'relationships' page (with novell, gnome, ecma, and microsoft) Resources were moved to 'using mono', leaving 'The Mono Team' and 'Contact Us'. Actually, 'resources' is not the best categorization, since the whole site is a meta-resource for four types of people. Ok, I'll stop now, before I suggest changing it to four main categories (targeting each of 'person discovering more about mono', 'user of mono for end-user applications', 'developer using mono', and 'mono contributors') -David Waite - The orange developers section looks way too bright. Todd commented on IRC that the using section green had once been bright but was changed. I think a similar change for the orange would be good. - On the home page, the XML button does not match the blue color theme. - Without JavaScript, there seems to be no way to navigate the menu system. - On the `Contact Us' button at the top, I expected to see IRC contact information, and a link for bugzilla. Also, a link to the mailing list page would be nice. - http://www.mono-project.com/about/mailing-lists.html: - mono-list is missing - Could we cut down on the size of the mono-devel-list description. It makes lots of stuff go below the fold - http://www.mono-project.com/downloads/index.html * We should have an `older releases' page that has everything before, say, beta 1. * It might make sense to group like: Source ... Red Hat Red Hat Linux 9 Fedora Core 1 SUSE ... Windows ... Mac OS ... I think that would create less visual clutter. * Does Fedora have its own logo? Should we use it rather than Red Hat's. * Does anyone need a (tm)? - The team page does not look as professional as everything else. Could we have a redesign of that to match the rest. Also, on this page the `tab' thingy at the top has a large gap below it. - In the menu system, there needs to be a sort of `you are here' indicator. For example, the current page could be in bold, and would not be a hyperlink, or it could be a different color etc. - http://www.mono-project.com/using/emacs.html is a dead link - Where did the whitepaper miguel and I wrote about performance go? - http://www.mono-project.com/using/mcs.html is out of place in the `using' section. It contains almost nothing about using mcs. IMHO, the first few paragraphs of text should stay, and we should insert links to reference articles. - In the menu system, you are inconsistantly using Title Caps and Sentence caps. For example: * Mono and Gtk# tutorials * The Mono Runtime * CVS Write access (this one has BOTH methods!) Just pick one and stay with it. - http://www.mono-project.com/contributing/compiling.html does not have `make bootstrap' documented - http://www.mono-project.com/about/applications.html should be updated. For example, MonoDevelop is not on there. Also, obsolete programs (eg, the debug
Re: [Mono-list] RE: Is it Mono safe?
In the end, the 'Microsoft may attempt to screw Linux users over' is not the real issue, but a distraction point to help carry FUD of this sort. Patent issues are not restricted to a particular vendor or product; there are several other open-source and free-software projects which may very well infringe on patents. Some projects, such as the Linux kernel, have taken a reactive view of patents - knowing that a patent exists just means they are liable for punitive damages, so patent issues should just be worked through as they come up case-by-case. Due to this fear of Microsoft and the opportunity of mono to become fundamental infrastructure over the coming years, a more proactive approach is being taken - a legal review leading up to 1.0. So perhaps the correct response is not to counter Microsoft behavioral maybes with counter-conjecture, but instead to say that there is active work to identify legal issues. Indeed, a 1.0 release of mono might very well be "safer" w.r.t. to patents than most other free software. -David Waite On May 20, 2004, at 1:30 PM, Mark Easton wrote: Look over here: http://www.gnome.org/~seth/blog/mono and here: http://www.osnews.com/comment.php?news_id=3D7094 This is bad news :( The first link is not news but rather random blog musings and the second link is more akin to personal opinion than news. How do you convince somebody to programming in Mono if he already read that news? While there's a strong urge for Linuxites to dislike any technology that's related to MS, real developers should be without technical prejudice and the benefits of Mono pretty much speaks for themselves. Sure there's a chance that MS might do some patent slapping at some point, but is it really going to be worth their while? After all, Mono makes it a lot easier to integrate Windows solutions with cross-platform software and it makes .NET much more attractive for organisations who're afraid of vendor entrenchment or have reams of legacy software running on assorted boxes. I personally feel that MS is going to be over the moon when Mono stabilises as it will help MS to push their products onto non-Windows platforms and it will help MS push .NET to organisations that might otherwise consider Java and OSS. If you'll forgive the blasphemy, perhaps what's required for Linux to finally 'succeed' on the desktop is for MS to release .NET versions of their product lines - Imagine the joy of Windows Media Player on Linux! Mark ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list ___ Mono-list maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
