RE: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
I wanted to close this old thread with a note that the mail duplicates were caused by a misconfigured filter on my side, and not related directly to this list at all. Thanks to all who responded. Peter Dennis Bartok wrote: But the point Atsushi, I and other have made is that it is *only* you receiving duplicates. Therefore I would assume it's script-foo on your side that's causing you to receive duplicates. ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
RE: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
On Sun, 2006-04-30 at 16:03 -0700, Tony G wrote: This is exactly the header that I was looking at. Thank you very much. I completely agree that the TO recipient might receive two copies depending on mailman and the recipient's MUA. I suspect that 99.999% of the time, the TO recipient *will* receive two copies. It's the sender's MUA which is sending the message, opening an SMTP connection to one (or more) SMTP servers to transmit the message, and _that_ server certainly isn't going to know that the TO recipient is already subscribed to the CC'd mailing list... Result: the TO recipient will always get two messages, one sent directly to them, and one indirectly via the mailing list. It's equivalent to listing the same email address on both the TO and CC lines. *Always*. (Unless the TO recipients MUA looks for duplicate messages and displays only one...) Data point: I always get two messages when I'm the TO recipient, one into my INBOX and one via my Mono filter, as the _headers_ are different within each message. For example, the headers for a message sent directly to me: Received: from steiner.cc.vt.edu... Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de... Received: from [172.23.4.29]... And the headers for the same message received via the mailing list: Received: from steiner.cc.vt.edu... Received: from lists.ximian.com... Received: from galactus.ximian.com... Received: from herald.ximian.com... Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de... Received: from [172.23.4.29]... Is this a bad thing? I don't think so -- when the mailing list server is down or otherwise slow (which seems to happen every few months to a year) it allows the TO recipient to get the message within a reasonable time frame, as opposed to _days_ later (if the mail server has issues). Note however, that I am on the mailman-users list, obviously run using mailman, and I do not get dupes from them even when they CC the list. This is why I am so confused about why it's only this one list where this issue is manifested. The question isn't about whether mailman-users is CC'd. It's about whether you're the TO recipient _AND_ mailman-users is CC'd -- in which case I would certainly _hope_ that you get two messages, as you'd be listed twice (see above SMTP discussion)! - Jon ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
Hello, Tony, as I wrote (Of course having To for the sender and Cc to the list is not the case you claimed above. But if you meant it, it is simply unacceptable as discussed before.) Having personal email on To: and the mailing list on Cc: is not what you claimed some of us do (you said that we put the mail list address on both To and Cc). You will receive two messages (which is not identical in message routing context but identical in message body context) obviously because we usually (I believe it is usual, according to my experience) do reply to all. The reason why we usually reply to messages in that way is already explained by others. (This time I dare removed your address from To but it is not practical to expect others to understand your favor in advance and it is very difficult to keep your favor in my memory. I think it is Do in Rome as the Romans do matter - Robert also explained it in other words. I on the other hand usually don't do reply to all in some of other mailings lists I post.) Cheers, Atsushi Eno Tony G wrote: Atsushi Eno wrote: It is technically difficult to agree with you. Can you exactly point out which mails are sent to both To and Cc to the mailing lists? If there are such ones, the evidence should lie in the message headers. As far as I have ever recognized there is none as such. And IF there are such people who tend to do that, the number I believe is absolutely small. (Of course having To for the sender and Cc to the list is not the case you claimed above. But if you meant it, it is simply unacceptable as discussed before.) Atsushi, please check your sent bin for this post you sent to the list and the post you sent on april 24 to the thread titled CultureInfo to it-IT. You did not CC the list in this one but you did on that one, and I received a dupe on that one. I get similar dupes when Miguel responds to posts since apparently he uses Reply-All. I've checked the Mailman list discussions, and this issue has been reported on and off for several years. Usually the problem is when a CC recipient matches the name of someone in the list. Mailman has a flag (set by default to On) which avoids sending dupes with the same message-id to the same recipient. I'm thinking that for v2.1.5 which is being used here, a new bug has crept in. I am checking with the Mailman-users list about this. ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
Tony, Atsushi, please check your sent bin for this post you sent to the list and the post you sent on april 24 to the thread titled CultureInfo to it-IT. You did not CC the list in this one but you did on that one, and I received a dupe on that one. I get similar dupes when Miguel responds to posts since apparently he uses Reply-All. The only person who would have received the message you are refering to twice is Marco, to whom the message was addressed. He would have received the personal copy and then a copy through the list. (considering the lag the list often has, sometimes 2 days, I see little harm in him receiving an answer right away as PM and the copy arriving through the list later) If you got two copies of that message you have a problem on your side. I keep complete archives and only one was sent through the list. From: Atsushi Eno [EMAIL PROTECTED] User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.2 (Windows/20060308) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Marco Bascietto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Mono-list] CultureInfo to it-IT References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: mono-list@lists.ximian.com X-BeenThere: mono-list@lists.ximian.com Cheers, Peter ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
RE: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
Peter Dennis Bartok wrote: If you got two copies of that message you have a problem on your side. I keep complete archives and only one was sent through the list. From: Atsushi Eno [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: mono-list@lists.ximian.com This is exactly the header that I was looking at. Thank you very much. I completely agree that the TO recipient might receive two copies depending on mailman and the recipient's MUA. It seems the consistent pattern is that I get two copies from the list whenever people here use the list address in the CC field, even when I am not in the TO field. Note to Atsushi: I do not expect people to change their behavior, I'm trying to understand what software in these many tiers is either duplicating mails or not removing dupes. I have just one more question in this diagnostic: Is anyone here receiving mail with MS Outlook 2003 and not getting dupes? If this is the case then my server is creating the dupes. If no one else is using Outlook (as would be expected with the bias of most OSS communities) then it's still possible that mailman is generating dupes and other people's MUAs are filtering them. Note however, that I am on the mailman-users list, obviously run using mailman, and I do not get dupes from them even when they CC the list. This is why I am so confused about why it's only this one list where this issue is manifested. I apologize to others who don't give a dang about my mail issues. I've been trying to ascertain if this was a general issue, bug in mailman, etc. Without this discussion I have no other way to perform a diagnosis. Thank you for your indulgence. Tony ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
But the point Atsushi, I and other have made is that it is *only* you receiving duplicates. Therefore I would assume it's script-foo on your side that's causing you to receive duplicates. Cheers, Peter PS: You should get this message twice :-) -Original Message- From: Tony G [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mono-list@lists.ximian.com Date: 30 April, 2006 17:04 Subject: RE: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list Peter Dennis Bartok wrote: If you got two copies of that message you have a problem on your side. I keep complete archives and only one was sent through the list. From: Atsushi Eno [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: mono-list@lists.ximian.com This is exactly the header that I was looking at. Thank you very much. I completely agree that the TO recipient might receive two copies depending on mailman and the recipient's MUA. It seems the consistent pattern is that I get two copies from the list whenever people here use the list address in the CC field, even when I am not in the TO field. Note to Atsushi: I do not expect people to change their behavior, I'm trying to understand what software in these many tiers is either duplicating mails or not removing dupes. I have just one more question in this diagnostic: Is anyone here receiving mail with MS Outlook 2003 and not getting dupes? If this is the case then my server is creating the dupes. If no one else is using Outlook (as would be expected with the bias of most OSS communities) then it's still possible that mailman is generating dupes and other people's MUAs are filtering them. Note however, that I am on the mailman-users list, obviously run using mailman, and I do not get dupes from them even when they CC the list. This is why I am so confused about why it's only this one list where this issue is manifested. I apologize to others who don't give a dang about my mail issues. I've been trying to ascertain if this was a general issue, bug in mailman, etc. Without this discussion I have no other way to perform a diagnosis. Thank you for your indulgence. Tony ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
[Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
Any idea why I get two of almost every email sent to this forum? What are people doing differently that sometimes causes only one mail to be generated for some posts and two mails for others? It looks like people have the habit of sending to mono-list@lists.ximian.com and then also CC mono-list@lists.ximian.com and [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've also found the need to reply all is very irritating, and I suspect this is partially responsible for the above issue. If I just reply, mail goes back to the person who posted a note because the mail list sets their address as the reply-to. If I hit reply all then I need to remove the individual before sending, since they're going to get the mail from the list anyway. Anyone else have a problem with this? I know some other forums do it the same way, but what a pain. The problem is stupid forum software that no one wants to change, nothing more or less. Thanks. ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
Hi, If you go to the preferences of the list, you can set whether you want to receive your own posts or mails you are in CC or TO. Personally I would prefer the option when Reply-To is the list but Miguel said that other people like the current setting. So I always use Reply All to target the list. (Sometimes the lists are slow so it may be preferable if you receive faster the messages that were sent directly to you.) When a message is sent to more than one list you will receive the same message (with different subject) from all the lists the message was sent to. Kornél - Original Message - From: Tony G [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mono-list@lists.ximian.com Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 4:07 AM Subject: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list Any idea why I get two of almost every email sent to this forum? What are people doing differently that sometimes causes only one mail to be generated for some posts and two mails for others? It looks like people have the habit of sending to mono-list@lists.ximian.com and then also CC mono-list@lists.ximian.com and [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've also found the need to reply all is very irritating, and I suspect this is partially responsible for the above issue. If I just reply, mail goes back to the person who posted a note because the mail list sets their address as the reply-to. If I hit reply all then I need to remove the individual before sending, since they're going to get the mail from the list anyway. Anyone else have a problem with this? I know some other forums do it the same way, but what a pain. The problem is stupid forum software that no one wants to change, nothing more or less. Thanks. ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
On Tue, 2006-04-11 at 19:07 -0700, Tony G wrote: I've also found the need to reply all is very irritating, and I suspect this is partially responsible for the above issue. If I just reply, mail goes back to the person who posted a note because the mail list sets their address as the reply-to. If I hit reply all then I need to remove the individual before sending, since they're going to get the mail from the list anyway. Anyone else have a problem with this? I know some other forums do it the same way, but what a pain. The problem is stupid forum software that no one wants to change, nothing more or less. It's not stupid forum software that no one wants to change, it's a perfectly reasonable difference of opinion: http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html I'd prefer that the Reply-To field not be munged, as is currently the case. - Jon ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
Tony G schrieb: Any idea why I get two of almost every email sent to this forum? I guess you would notice if you had signed up twice... ;-) What are people doing differently that sometimes causes only one mail to be generated for some posts and two mails for others? It looks like people have the habit of sending to mono-list@lists.ximian.com and then also CC mono-list@lists.ximian.com and [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've also found the need to reply all is very irritating, and I suspect this is partially responsible for the above issue. If I just reply, mail goes back to the person who posted a note because the mail list sets their address as the reply-to. If I hit reply all then I need to remove the individual before sending, since they're going to get the mail from the list anyway. Anyone else have a problem with this? I know some other forums do it the same way, but what a pain. The problem is stupid forum software that no one wants to change, nothing more or less. I agree that the Reply-to should be configured to the list address. However I find it very handy getting a personal copy (reply all) because sometimes there are hours of difference (in the past even days!) between getting a list email and a direct email (with the direct one being much quicker I should add). Some new to the list have been impatient in sending their message up to five times with no information added, just not having got a response to their original message at that time. Maybe you can be more specific about what emails you get twice? Have you checked the status of the Avoid duplicate copies of messages option for your subscription? Andreas ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
Re: [Mono-list] Duplicate emails from list
On Tue, 2006-04-11 at 19:07 -0700, Tony G wrote: I've also found the need to reply all is very irritating, and I suspect this is partially responsible for the above issue. If I just reply, mail goes back to the person who posted a note because the mail list sets their address as the reply-to. If I hit reply all then I need to remove the individual before sending, since they're going to get the mail from the list anyway. Anyone else have a problem with this? I know some other forums do it the same way, but what a pain. We've explained before why we don't set reply-to to the list. The problem is stupid forum software that no one wants to change, nothing more or less. Or stupid MUAs that still don't have Reply to List. - Dick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ Mono-list maillist - Mono-list@lists.ximian.com http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/mono-list
