Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Patrick Georgi]

Am 27.06.2010 08:12, schrieb Gour:
> Fortunately, I found out about git-export using fast-import mechanism,
> but I wonder if there is any plan for git-import to make it easier to
> convert from {darcs,git,hg} which support by fast-import/export
> mechanism?
I used to work on mtn-fast-import, which interprets the git-fast-import
format and creates a monotone repository from it.
I didn't work on export due to lack of need, and dropped work on it in
favor of hg2mtn, which directly uses hg metadata (which is less lossy
than hg->git->mtn) which was my primary concern.

I put up the code at https://code.georgi-clan.de/p/hg2mtn/ but didn't
test/use it in a long time. Feel free to try it, and to report issues.
I'm also on IRC (irc.oftc.net, #monotone), but I might be a bit slow to
react for the next two weeks.


Regards,
Patrick

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 11:21:11 +0200
>> "Patrick" == Patrick Georgi  wrote:

Patrick> I used to work on mtn-fast-import, which interprets the
Patrick> git-fast-import format and creates a monotone repository from
Patrick> it. I didn't work on export due to lack of need, and dropped
Patrick> work on it in favor of hg2mtn, which directly uses hg metadata
Patrick> (which is less lossy than hg->git->mtn) which was my primary
Patrick> concern.

Hmm, based on my experience, hg's fast-import/export was the weakest
from {bzr,darcs,hg,git} and considering that I do not track much of hg
repos...

Still, nice to hear there is some work on the filed of
interoperability with other VCS-s...Monotone is approaching 1.0 and
would be nice to be ready for monotone-world-dominion. ;)

Patrick> I put up the code at https://code.georgi-clan.de/p/hg2mtn/ but
Patrick> didn't test/use it in a long time. Feel free to try it, and to
Patrick> report issues. I'm also on IRC (irc.oftc.net, #monotone), but
Patrick> I might be a bit slow to react for the next two weeks.

OK. I'm 'gour' there.


Sincerely,
Gour

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[Monotone-devel] archlinux package for guitone

[Gour]

Hello!

I've just submitted Archlinux package for guitone:

http://aur.archlinux.org/packages.php?ID=38487


Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Stephen Leake]

Gour  writes:

> So, we spent some time reading the (very nice) docs (what are you
> using for documenting?). 

The manual is written in texinfo.

> I read Concepts & Tutorial fully and skimmed more quickly through the
> rest. Now we have some questions in order to discern whether monotone
> is the right tool for our needs.
>
> We want robust system which can serve us for many years,
> multi-platform support (that's why we abandoned gtk2hs & wxhaskell and
> decided to use Qt toolkit.) with possibly some GUI tool for Mac/Win
> users/devs not too familiar with cli. 

mtn works on Linux, Mac, and Win32 (native and Cygwin). Some features
are not supported on Win32 native, but all work on Win32 Cygwin.

There is an Emacs front-end called DVC. I consider that a GUI, but some
people don't. I maintain it, and it almost eliminates the need for mtn
command line.

> a) what do you find as the reason for not wider acceptance of
> monotone? (I know darcs is not too popular as well, but, at least, it
> is used widely within Haskell community.) Is there something which is,
> according to the public criticism lacking in monotone or it is simply
> a fact that "it's too different and not named Xit"?

One issue is the version number; 0.48 sounds "experimental". There will
be a 1.0 soon.

> b) there are some possibilities for hosting darcs repos, but,
> according to the wiki, there is only one site offering public hosting
> for monotone. Do I miss some?

If you use ssh access, there is very little admin burden for a mtn
server; just creating user accounts.

The mtn version on the server does not have to be up to date; the
netsync protocol changes very slowly.

> c) considering b) it seems practical to think about using one's own
> hosting for the project, I'm curious about memory requirements on the
> server (for medium-sized project)?

Obviously, it needs a medium-sized memory :). mtn uses sqlite for the
backend database; that reads the entire database into memory.

With ssh access, only one user can access the db at a time; that reduces
the memory requirements over running multi-user access. That doesn't
work well if you have _lots_ of users (since the probability of
collisions goes up). But the time each user locks the database is pretty
short, so it really is _lots_ of users. Sorry, no numbers; it also
depends on the work flow; how often each user syncs.

> d) similar to Fossil, monotone is a bit isolated in its own universe
> due to the lack of interoperability tools.

Can you be more specific? Which tools in particular are not there?

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Re: [Monotone-devel] Re: monotone support in BE (tracker)

[Thomas Keller]

Am 27.06.10 07:28, schrieb Gour:
> On Sat, 26 Jun 2010 22:54:24 +0200
>>> "Thomas" == Thomas Keller  wrote:
> 
> Thomas> If you have questions, just go ahead and ask - a couple of
> Thomas> people (me included) have added monotone support in third party
> Thomas> tools in the past. I think Thomas Moschny could also pinpoint
> Thomas> you to some code in TracMonotone and mtn-view, which are both
> Thomas> written in Python as well.
> 
> It looks like BE devs have some problem - see
> 
> http://void.printf.net/pipermail/be-devel/2010-June/000570.html

Depends on what he wants to do with this call - it does nothing than
returning the workspace root directory of a found workspace. If this
command is run outside of a workspace or with the --no-workspace option,
the above error occurs.

Thomas.

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 07:47:07 -0400
>> "Stephen" ==  wrote:

Stephen> mtn works on Linux, Mac, and Win32 (native and Cygwin). Some
Stephen> features are not supported on Win32 native, but all work on
Stephen> Win32 Cygwin.

What is missing on Win32? (not utterly important, just curious)

Stephen> There is an Emacs front-end called DVC. I consider that a GUI,
Stephen> but some people don't. I maintain it, and it almost eliminates
Stephen> the need for mtn command line.

Very nice...I was considering using it, but darcs is not well
supported (that's why I have to use darcsum), but support for monotone
misses, accroding to the table, support for pull?

Stephen> One issue is the version number; 0.48 sounds "experimental".
Stephen> There will be a 1.0 soon.

Yeah, I've seen...around fall?

Stephen> > b) there are some possibilities for hosting darcs repos, but,
Stephen> > according to the wiki, there is only one site offering
Stephen> > public hosting for monotone. Do I miss some?
Stephen> 
Stephen> If you use ssh access, there is very little admin burden for a
Stephen> mtn server; just creating user accounts.

Good. Is ViewMTN now part of monotone? We'd like to provide web access
for the code.

Stephen> The mtn version on the server does not have to be up to date;
Stephen> the netsync protocol changes very slowly.

Good.

Stephen> > c) considering b) it seems practical to think about using
Stephen> > one's own hosting for the project, I'm curious about memory
Stephen> > requirements on the server (for medium-sized project)?
Stephen> 
Stephen> Obviously, it needs a medium-sized memory :). mtn uses sqlite
Stephen> for the backend database; that reads the entire database into
Stephen> memory.

Hmm...this needs some further investigation to discern how many MBs we
are talking here...

Stephen> With ssh access, only one user can access the db at a time;
Stephen> that reduces the memory requirements over running multi-user
Stephen> access. That doesn't work well if you have _lots_ of users
Stephen> (since the probability of collisions goes up). But the time
Stephen> each user locks the database is pretty short, so it really is
Stephen> _lots_ of users. Sorry, no numbers; it also depends on the
Stephen> work flow; how often each user syncs.

No anticipation for _lots_of multi-user access. If it will happen,
then we can think about it.

Stephen> > d) similar to Fossil, monotone is a bit isolated in its own
Stephen> > universe due to the lack of interoperability tools.
Stephen> 
Stephen> Can you be more specific? Which tools in particular are not
Stephen> there?

X-import for importing from X DVCS and (possibly) doing 2-way sync.

Tailor developer told me that mtn support is 'stable' in the sense
that there are no new patches for years, so we have to find out how
the present tailor works with current version of mtn.

Moreover, there is only single public hosting for mtn repos which
means that one has to arrange one's own setup for hosting the code,
bug tracker etc.

Thank you for input.


Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Ludovic Brenta]

Gour  writes:
> a) what do you find as the reason for not wider acceptance of
> monotone? (I know darcs is not too popular as well, but, at least, it
> is used widely within Haskell community.) Is there something which is,
> according to the public criticism lacking in monotone or it is simply
> a fact that "it's too different and not named Xit"?

I think a combination of:

- Linus considered monotone and decided to write git instead because
  monotone was too slow for his use, so lots of people noe believe
  monotone is "slow"

- Monotone does not serve over HTTP, so hosting is a bit "difficult"

- Monotone is for adults :)

The reasons are, in fact, similar for those for not using Haskell :)

> b) there are some possibilities for hosting darcs repos, but,
> according to the wiki, there is only one site offering public hosting
> for monotone. Do I miss some?

There is a second one, http://www.ada-france.org/article131.html but
only for Ada projects (I'm the admin).

> c) considering b) it seems practical to think about using one's own
> hosting for the project, I'm curious about memory requirements on the
> server (for medium-sized project)?

The monotone server currently running on ada-france.org uses 159 MiB of
virtual memory.  While syncing a second monotone process uses 39 MiB.

[...]
> I know there is tool named Tailor, but I'd like to hear about any
> experience how it works with monotone?

It works well; I use it to nightly replicate a large Subversion
repository into monotone.  I can provide help if you have specific
questions.

> e) I'll try for myself, but let me ask whether Guitone is capable to
> replace need for cli for less experienced users?

I use the command line and emacs, sorry.

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Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Thomas Keller]

Am 27.06.10 08:12, schrieb Gour:
> However, along with some other users, I was complaining on the mailing
> list about the unfortunate decision of using non-standard wiki which
> makes the whole project not suitable for all-in-one solution (DVCS +
> wiki + distribute tracker + easy hosting), but the author is fixed in
> his decision so we left it.

Have you ever tried ikiwiki? This is a nice and very expandable
(plugins) wiki engine which comes with support for different SCMs,
amongst them monotone. We're using ikiwiki for our own wiki at
http://monotone.ca/wiki and version it via the net.venge.monotone.web
branch.

> So, we spent some time reading the (very nice) docs (what are you
> using for documenting?). 

Basically texinfo, what Stephen said, with lots of custom hacked CSS
from me to make it pretty :)

> However, I'm considering alternative  to be used for our Haskell
> project...We want robust system which can serve us for many years,
> multi-platform support (that's why we abandoned gtk2hs & wxhaskell and
> decided to use Qt toolkit.) with possibly some GUI tool for Mac/Win
> users/devs not too familiar with cli. (Here darcs is lacking and I've
> to evaluate Guitone.)

Well, I can't exactly say if monotone is the right tool for you - as
others said it works good for medium-size projects, but can be slow for
particular use cases, like very big trees (tens of thousands of files)
and many, many concurrent users. Some of these issues can be
circumvented with intelligent setups (like f.e. distributed nodes and
usher as proxy), some might become blockers.

But we're actually still want you to test it out if it works, because
you have a very good and easy exit strategy with our fast export to git,
which is understood by other SCMs as well.

> From reading the docs it is not (too) difficult to conclude that
> monotone is very nicely designed system with lot of features and
> wonderful security model.

Heh, thanks!

> Some considerations we have:
> 
> a) what do you find as the reason for not wider acceptance of
> monotone? (I know darcs is not too popular as well, but, at least, it
> is used widely within Haskell community.) Is there something which is,
> according to the public criticism lacking in monotone or it is simply
> a fact that "it's too different and not named Xit"?

We discussed that here over and over and basically it was some kind of
generation change, the original developer(s) left the project, probably
also a bit overrun by the tremendous success of git, and a few people
who kept loving this SCM kept around and tried to start anew.
The community is small and the amount of active developers is even
smaller, but thats the classic vicious circle, not many users will not
lead to many patche - still, we fight and continue to fight on all
fronts as time permits.

> b) there are some possibilities for hosting darcs repos, but,
> according to the wiki, there is only one site offering public hosting
> for monotone. Do I miss some?

I guess in the (near) future indefero (http://indefero.net) will also
offer monotone hosting. I'm currently just waiting for my patch [0] to
get included in their trunk, which should happen within the next couple
of days.

> c) considering b) it seems practical to think about using one's own
> hosting for the project, I'm curious about memory requirements on the
> server (for medium-sized project)?

I have a monotone server running on a small-sized VPS with only 200MB
fixed RAM and the ability to boost that to 600MB, and I have many other
memory hogs on this system as well (spamassassin f.e.). The server works
quite well and fast - though it only serves a couple of smaller
branches, one of them being guitone.

> d) similar to Fossil, monotone is a bit isolated in its own universe
> due to the lack of interoperability tools.
> 
> Fortunately, I found out about git-export using fast-import mechanism,
> but I wonder if there is any plan for git-import to make it easier to
> convert from {darcs,git,hg} which support by fast-import/export
> mechanism?

It would be cool if somebody could pick up Patrick's work here -
unfortunately the other devs are a bit out of time in respect to this
and I'm not a git expert (which I should probably be to be able to
properly hack on this).

> e) I'll try for myself, but let me ask whether Guitone is capable to
> replace need for cli for less experienced users?

I'm the author of guitone and I'd say the recent versions should be very
well capable of replacing the CLI indeed (after all guitone is targeted
at exactly your envisioned user group). I still plan to implement access
to remote databases (thats currently in a branch, not yet in mainline)
and wait for the release of monotone 1.0 and then the final 1.0 of
guitone should be ready as well.
I'd love to get some earlier feedback from you on guitone though, so I'd
be happy if you try it out before it hits 1.0 :)

Thomas.

[0] http://github.com/tommyd3mdi/indefero-monotone

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 14:33:45 +0200
>> "Ludovic" ==  wrote:

Ludovic> - Linus considered monotone and decided to write git instead
Ludovic> because monotone was too slow for his use, so lots of people
Ludovic> noe believe monotone is "slow"

Heh, 'urban legends' :-)

Ludovic> - Monotone does not serve over HTTP, so hosting is a bit
Ludovic> "difficult"

That's a good point.

Ludovic> - Monotone is for adults :)
Ludovic> 
Ludovic> The reasons are, in fact, similar for those for not using
Ludovic> Haskell :)

lol. However, haskell is opening market in the multi-core market, what
mtn brings?

Seriously, I'm only concerned about the 'hosting'. The other two
reasons are not problematic.

Ludovic> > b) there are some possibilities for hosting darcs repos, but,
Ludovic> > according to the wiki, there is only one site offering
Ludovic> > public hosting for monotone. Do I miss some?
Ludovic> 
Ludovic> There is a second one,
Ludovic> http://www.ada-france.org/article131.html but only for Ada
Ludovic> projects (I'm the admin).

Heh, never tried it and probably I won't. ;)

Ludovic> The monotone server currently running on ada-france.org uses
Ludovic> 159 MiB of virtual memory.  While syncing a second monotone
Ludovic> process uses 39 MiB.

How many projects are hosted there?

Data on the web site seems not to be up-to-date...Otoh, I'm interested
to host one project only...Cannot say how many LOCs it could be.

E.g. darcs' SLOC is 36,746 with ~8500 patches or 'changesets'. Is it
considered medium-sized project for mtn and how many MBs we would
require to serve it?

Ludovic> It works well; I use it to nightly replicate a large Subversion
Ludovic> repository into monotone.  I can provide help if you have
Ludovic> specific questions.

Thanks a lot. 

LEt me read & try some concrete things with mtn before playing with
converting of repos.

Ludovic> > e) I'll try for myself, but let me ask whether Guitone is
Ludovic> > capable to replace need for cli for less experienced users?
Ludovic> 
Ludovic> I use the command line and emacs, sorry.

Same here. Do you also use DVC?


Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Aaron W. Hsu]

Hey Gour,

I would just like to put my viewpoint here as well. I run a fairly small
installation here, with only about 20 branches, and only maybe five of
those in active use. Some of them have high binary content, but the rest
are all text. I'm self-hosted. My comments to your concerns are below.

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010, Gour wrote:


On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 07:47:07 -0400

"Stephen" ==  wrote:



Stephen> One issue is the version number; 0.48 sounds "experimental".
Stephen> There will be a 1.0 soon.

Yeah, I've seen...around fall?


Just to be clear, the point here, in my view is not that monotone will
reach 1.0, but that Monotone is just changing versioning schemes. I've
been wonderfully impressed with Monotone's stability, and I can say that
I have had great luck in that respect, except for one bug that caused
some synching issues which were fixed very quickly.


Stephen> > c) considering b) it seems practical to think about using
Stephen> > one's own hosting for the project, I'm curious about memory
Stephen> > requirements on the server (for medium-sized project)?
Stephen>
Stephen> Obviously, it needs a medium-sized memory :). mtn uses sqlite
Stephen> for the backend database; that reads the entire database into
Stephen> memory.

Hmm...this needs some further investigation to discern how many MBs we
are talking here...


In the setup, which I mentioned above, I don't have a lot of concurrent
users, but I run the server reliably an right now it is using about 16mb
of memory. My database is only about 100MB - 200MB right now. That gives
you an idea of what a small installation looks like.


Stephen> > d) similar to Fossil, monotone is a bit isolated in its own
Stephen> > universe due to the lack of interoperability tools.
Stephen>
Stephen> Can you be more specific? Which tools in particular are not
Stephen> there?

X-import for importing from X DVCS and (possibly) doing 2-way sync.


By this I assume that "X" is a variable over the possible DVCS systems
out there?


Moreover, there is only single public hosting for mtn repos which
means that one has to arrange one's own setup for hosting the code,
bug tracker etc.


I can report on this. I run a Slackware64 box on ServerPronto's networks
and with their machines. It was very easy to configure and setup
monotone. I also installed Trac, which was very easy as well. I haven't
installed ViewMTN, but I will probably do this some time.

In my opinion the lack of many shared hosting options for doing Monotone
shouldn't scare you away, if you have the basic knowledge of how to run
a server.

  Aaron W. Hsu

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[Monotone-devel] Re: [Be-devel] monotone support

[W. Trevor King]

Ah, it was the dirname code.  Fixed now (and tested ;) in my branch:
  http://www.physics.drexel.edu/~wking/code/git/git.php?p=be.git

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 14:57:25 +0200
>> "Thomas" == Thomas Keller  wrote:

Thomas> Have you ever tried ikiwiki? This is a nice and very expandable
Thomas> (plugins) wiki engine which comes with support for different
Thomas> SCMs, amongst them monotone. 

Nope, but weas reading about it...

Thomas> Basically texinfo, what Stephen said, with lots of custom
Thomas> hacked CSS from me to make it pretty :)

Heh, it really does not look like common texinfo stuff. :-)

Thomas> Well, I can't exactly say if monotone is the right tool for you
Thomas> - as others said it works good for medium-size projects, but
Thomas> can be slow for particular use cases, like very big trees (tens
Thomas> of thousands of files) and many, many concurrent users. 

We won't most probably have such a project.

Thomas> But we're actually still want you to test it out if it works,
Thomas> because you have a very good and easy exit strategy with our
Thomas> fast export to git, which is understood by other SCMs as well.

:-)

I'm more interesting for enter stategy. ;)

Thomas> We discussed that here over and over and basically it was some
Thomas> kind of generation change, the original developer(s) left the
Thomas> project, probably also a bit overrun by the tremendous success
Thomas> of git, and a few people who kept loving this SCM kept around
Thomas> and tried to start anew. The community is small and the amount
Thomas> of active developers is even smaller, but thats the classic
Thomas> vicious circle, not many users will not lead to many patche -
Thomas> still, we fight and continue to fight on all fronts as time
Thomas> permits.

How many devs are actively working on mtn?

It seems people should become burnt with Git before looking for
alternatives.

Thomas> I guess in the (near) future indefero (http://indefero.net)
Thomas> will also offer monotone hosting. I'm currently just waiting
Thomas> for my patch [0] to get included in their trunk, which should
Thomas> happen within the next couple of days.

Great news!

Thomas> I have a monotone server running on a small-sized VPS with only
Thomas> 200MB fixed RAM and the ability to boost that to 600MB, and I
Thomas> have many other memory hogs on this system as well
Thomas> (spamassassin f.e.). The server works quite well and fast -
Thomas> though it only serves a couple of smaller branches, one of them
Thomas> being guitone.

Not bad. Maybe I should try to install some repo on my WF account and
check it out.

Still, indefero option sounds great. ;)

Thomas> I'm the author of guitone and I'd say the recent versions
Thomas> should be very well capable of replacing the CLI indeed (after
Thomas> all guitone is targeted at exactly your envisioned user group).

Wonderful!

Thomas> I'd love to get some earlier feedback
Thomas> from you on guitone though, so I'd be happy if you try it out
Thomas> before it hits 1.0 :)

I created package for Archlinux and installed. Now I need to learn
more about mtn and then I'll put guitone to some more serious testing
providing you with (hopefully) some valauble feedback.

Thanks a lot for your input.


Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Aaron W. Hsu]

Hey Gour,

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010, Gour wrote:


e) I'll try for myself, but let me ask whether Guitone is capable to
replace need for cli for less experienced users?


I have successfully used it as a substitute for command-line work for
someone who had no idea about how to use the command line at all.
However, the monotone command line is fairly simple to learn, and
Guitone expects you to understand Monotone and DVCS. Those two things
combined mean that Guitone isn't going to hand hold the user enough to
make it significantly easier to learn Guitone over a command-line mtn
program if the user has no idea how DVCS or Monotone work.

Guitone is also not just for beginners. I use it occassionally and find
it quite pleasant.

  Aaron W. Hsu

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Lapo Luchini]

Stephen Leake wrote:
> Obviously, it needs a medium-sized memory :). mtn uses sqlite for the
> backend database; that reads the entire database into memory.

Uh? Entire DB in memory? I don't think it does... of course if it fits
then access of the next users is faster, but that's normal filesystem
cache issues, not monotone loading it all.
Not the last time I checked, at least...

Myself I've sync'ed the database with the photos of the last summits a
few times, and that's for sure bigger than the RAM of laptop I did use.

> With ssh access, only one user can access the db at a time

OTOH the 'usual' access is directly with netsync protocol, and that does
not have that limit: many users can sync concurrently (OTOH it's more
difficult to set up... as difficult as creating a couple of text
configuration files and starting the server at boot time, though).

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Lapo Luchini]

Gour wrote:
> Thomas> The server works quite well and fast -
> Thomas> though it only serves a couple of smaller branches, one of them
> Thomas> being guitone.
> 
> Not bad. Maybe I should try to install some repo on my WF account and
> check it out.

In my experience a server serving all my small projects plus a comlpete
copy of mtn itself's repository used up about 200MB of RAM, but since my
server was very much memory-constrained, I decided to use usher (a small
daemon that spawns mtn server on-demand) and that uses about 6MB of
resident memory while waiting for calls, and the spawned mtn process
takes up to 105MB while sync'ing the whole mtn tree (which is a DB 200MB
worth, but really I don't think the memory needed is related to the
database size).


But you can check it yourself easily enough (taking a bit of time):

1. choose an existing project that matches and "pull" it locally, e.g.
my existing local copy of the monotone repository itself (branch
net.venge.monotone and some selected ones of the others).

2. spawn a local copy of the server

3. sync with it locally

4. check the server size

that is:

[1]
% mtn -d test.mtn db init
% mtn -d test.mtn pull monotone.ca net.venge.monotone
[2]
% mtn -d test.mtn serve --bind 127.0.0.1:4691
[3]
% mtn -d test2.mtn db init
% mtn -d test2.mtn pull 127.0.0.1 net.venge.monotone
[4]
% ps waux|fgrep mtn

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Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Richard Levitte]

You've already received good answer on a lot of your questions, I
would only repeat them.  There's one question, though, where I can
give you some cold numbers to consider.

In message <20100627081248.1e422...@gaura-nitai.no-ip.org> on Sun, 27 Jun 2010 
08:12:48 +0200, Gour  said:

gour> c) considering b) it seems practical to think about using one's own
gour> hosting for the project, I'm curious about memory requirements on the
gour> server (for medium-sized project)?

on monotone.ca (which serves more than monotone, by the way), I
collected the following data for you:

$ ps auxw | head -1; ps auxw|grep mtn
USER   PID %CPU %MEMVSZ   RSS TTY  STAT START   TIME COMMAND
monotone 17445  1.7 19.1 243504 198136 ?   SJun04 587:12 /usr/bin/mtn 
--confdir=/etc/monotone --db=/var/lib/monotone/default.mtn --norc 
--pid-file=/var/run/monotone/mtn.pid --log=/var/log/monotone/mtn.log 
--dump=/var/log/monotone/error.log --rcfile=/etc/monotone/hooks.lua 
--keydir=/var/lib/monotone/keys --quiet --bind=0.0.0.0 serve

$ ls -l /var/lib/monotone/default.mtn
-rw-r--r--  1 monotone   monotone 1668308992 jun 27 16:04 default.mtn

Cheers,
Richard

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 09:41:44 -0400 (EDT)
>> "Aaron" == "Aaron W. Hsu"  wrote:

Aaron> In the setup, which I mentioned above, I don't have a lot of
Aaron> concurrent users, but I run the server reliably an right now it
Aaron> is using about 16mb of memory. My database is only about 100MB -
Aaron> 200MB right now. That gives you an idea of what a small
Aaron> installation looks like.

This is encouraging.

Aaron> By this I assume that "X" is a variable over the possible DVCS
Aaron> systems out there?
Yes, although majority of my repos are in darcs, but I could do 

darcs --> git --> mtn

Aaron> In my opinion the lack of many shared hosting options for doing
Aaron> Monotone shouldn't scare you away, if you have the basic
Aaron> knowledge of how to run a server.

I've the knowledge, but hte variable in equation is 'time',

However, prospect of having Indefero hosting sounds terrific!


Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [Monotone-devel] Re: [Be-devel] monotone support

[Thomas Keller]

Am 27.06.10 15:35, schrieb W. Trevor King:
> Ah, it was the dirname code.  Fixed now (and tested ;) in my branch:
>   http://www.physics.drexel.edu/~wking/code/git/git.php?p=be.git

Cool, could you drop me a note when this code arrives in a release? I'd
like to blog about it and add BugsEverywhere to our list of supported
interfaces, frontends and tools.

Thanks,
Thomas.

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 09:46:54 -0400 (EDT)
>> "Aaron" == "Aaron W. Hsu"  wrote:

Aaron> I have successfully used it as a substitute for command-line
Aaron> work for someone who had no idea about how to use the command
Aaron> line at all. 

Nice.

Aaron> Guitone is also not just for beginners. I use it occassionally
Aaron> and find it quite pleasant.

Even better. ;)


Sincerely,
Gour

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[Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Gour]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 16:49:49 +0200 (CEST)
>> "Richard" == Richard Levitte  wrote:

Richard> on monotone.ca (which serves more than monotone, by the way), I
Richard> collected the following data for you:

Thank you.

All in all I must say that I'm very excited to see how user-friendly
is Monotone community. Kudos to all!


Sincerely,
Gour

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Re: [Monotone-devel] is monotone for me?

[Thomas Keller]

Am 27.06.10 15:46, schrieb Aaron W. Hsu:
> Hey Gour,
> 
> On Sun, 27 Jun 2010, Gour wrote:
> 
>> e) I'll try for myself, but let me ask whether Guitone is capable to
>> replace need for cli for less experienced users?
> 
> I have successfully used it as a substitute for command-line work for
> someone who had no idea about how to use the command line at all.
> However, the monotone command line is fairly simple to learn, and
> Guitone expects you to understand Monotone and DVCS. Those two things
> combined mean that Guitone isn't going to hand hold the user enough to
> make it significantly easier to learn Guitone over a command-line mtn
> program if the user has no idea how DVCS or Monotone work.

Yes, this is still one of the weak points in guitone until now, I meant
to implement some kind of tutorial mode / documentation for guitone for
quite some time, but other features have always been on top of the list
instead. Of course if somebody comes up with a nice HTML document with
screenshots on his own, I'm very likely pleased to quickly embed that in
guitone...

> Guitone is also not just for beginners. I use it occassionally and find
> it quite pleasant.

Thanks for the positive feedback!

Thomas.

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[Monotone-devel] [bug #30225] mtn import does not create _MTN/options

[Thomas Keller]

Update of bug #30225 (project monotone):

  Status:None => Fixed  
 Assigned to:None => tommyd 

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Follow-up Comment #1:

fixed in 28a533e35cd5ef329d60e775ae73f97b7f7cd2b6

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[Monotone-devel] [bug #30225] mtn import does not create _MTN/options

[Thomas Keller]

Update of bug #30225 (project monotone):

 Open/Closed:Open => Closed 


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[Monotone-devel] [bug #29843] mtn update ignores suspend certs

[Thomas Keller]

Update of bug #29843 (project monotone):

  Status:None => Fixed  
 Assigned to:None => tommyd 
 Open/Closed:Open => Closed 

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Follow-up Comment #2:

fixed in 09b9825420df0c252ddaf2361743820d9d0edd7b

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Re: [Monotone-devel] Re: is monotone for me?

[Stephen Leake]

Gour  writes:

> On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 07:47:07 -0400
>>> "Stephen" ==  wrote:
>
> Stephen> mtn works on Linux, Mac, and Win32 (native and Cygwin). Some
> Stephen> features are not supported on Win32 native, but all work on
> Stephen> Win32 Cygwin.
>
> What is missing on Win32? (not utterly important, just curious)

file: and ssh: netsync transports, and user formatted date parsing.

> Stephen> There is an Emacs front-end called DVC. I consider that a GUI,
> Stephen> but some people don't. I maintain it, and it almost eliminates
> Stephen> the need for mtn command line.
>
> Very nice...I was considering using it, but darcs is not well
> supported (that's why I have to use darcsum), but support for monotone
> misses, accroding to the table, support for pull?

I do pull, push, and sync from the command line. I have recently decided
I should integrate that with the GUI, so I can easily process the list
of revisions that are pulled; update the corresponding workspace, review
the changes.

-- 
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[Monotone-devel] [bug #12774] show lifetime of a branch

[Timothy Brownawell]

Update of bug #12774 (project monotone):

  Status:None => Invalid
 Open/Closed:Open => Closed 

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Follow-up Comment #2:

Closing, it's kinda hard to make something without a decent explanation of
what it's meant for.

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