Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Sean Donelan]

On Mon, 23 Jun 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> On the subject, has anyone had success w/ any L2 discovery tools?
>
> psnmp seems promsing (http://psnmp.sourceforge.net/), but the lack of support
> for Cisco, Extreme, and Foundry makes it a bit limiting. I've found that L3
> topology is often well documented (and reasonably easy to decipher), but
> finding troublesome layouts in switched configs is one place where a decent
> tool could come in handy.

Fluke LAN Mapshot is a nice one-trick pony product for mapping L2
switches.  Point it at a network, give it the right snmp community
strings, and it generates a switch topology.

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[John Kristoff]

On Sun, Jun 22, 2003 at 09:24:58PM -0400, Sean Donelan wrote:
> gaps between entities I'm interested in mapping.  I want to discover
> and map the connections indviduals may know about, but no one realized
> how all the pieces were connected.
> 
> So far the recommendations have included
[...]

I'm not one to push commercial products, but I don't know of a
freely available tool that does the equivalent of what Lumeta
 does.  This being the solution based on
the original work of Cheswick and Burch.  This may be just the
kind of thing if you need to discover unexpected or even unknown
paths.

John

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Sean Donelan]

On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Andy Dills wrote:
> That's quite a "medium-scale".
>
> Is there a single entity in the world that controls 1,000 networks and
> 100,000 network devices?

Its a bit like the fish that got away.  People have varying ideas about
how big is big.  Its smaller than the Internet, but larger than a mom&pop
network.  Most americans consider themselves "middle-class," no matter
what their net worth is.

As far as a "single entity," obviously all large organizations have
learned how to delegate responsibility.  The US Military has about 3
million network devices connected to 3,000 networks.  But no single person
really controls all 3 million network devices.  Its the organizational
gaps between entities I'm interested in mapping.  I want to discover
and map the connections indviduals may know about, but no one realized
how all the pieces were connected.

So far the recommendations have included

   Cheops
   NetViz
   OpenView
   Intermapper

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Andy Dills]

On Sun, 22 Jun 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Andy Dills wrote:
>
> > That's quite a "medium-scale".
> >
> > Is there a single entity in the world that controls 1,000 networks and
> > 100,000 network devices?
>
> WorldCom^Hn

Well, sure, MCI is a single company that owns that many networks and
possibly network devices, but are you saying there's a single group of
people within MCI who are tasked with mapping, down to the host level,
across their entire network? It would seem reasonable to me that there is
some hierarchy involved...European division deals with its network, etc.


On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Jonathan Crockett wrote:

> I am a network engineer for a cable ISP.  We have over 50,000 cable
> modems and around 65,000 customer devices.  We only have 200-250
> networks, but well over 100,000 ip devices.

What would be the value of mapping all those CPEs? Not that there isn't
one, I just don't know what it is.

Andy

---
Andy Dills
Xecunet, Inc.
www.xecu.net
301-682-9972
---

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Justin Shore]

On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Sean Donelan wrote:

> 
> Its been a few years since I looked at network discovery and mapping
> tools.  Openview/et al did the job, but was always a pain to move all
> the boxes to the right spots on the resulting maps.
> 
> Has network discovery and mapping improved for medium-scale wide
> area networks for ISPs (e.g. 1,000 networks, 100,000 network devices)?
> I've found lots of discovery tools, but intelligent mapping/layout still
> seems to be a problem. The usual requirements for SNMP smart discovery,
> interface/subnet mapping, device identification and connecting the right
> symbols with the right lines to all the other symbols.

Cheops and Cheops-ng might be useful to you.

http://www.marko.net/cheops/

http://cheops-ng.sourceforge.net/

Justin

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Jonathan Crockett]

On Sun, Jun 22, 2003 at 01:16:38PM -0400, Andy Dills wrote:
> 
> On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Sean Donelan wrote:
> 
> > Has network discovery and mapping improved for medium-scale wide
> > area networks for ISPs (e.g. 1,000 networks, 100,000 network devices)?
> > I've found lots of discovery tools, but intelligent mapping/layout still
> > seems to be a problem. The usual requirements for SNMP smart discovery,
> > interface/subnet mapping, device identification and connecting the right
> > symbols with the right lines to all the other symbols.
> 
> That's quite a "medium-scale".
> 
> Is there a single entity in the world that controls 1,000 networks and
> 100,000 network devices?

I am a network engineer for a cable ISP.  We have over 50,000 cable modems
and around 65,000 customer devices.  We only have 200-250 networks, but
well over 100,000 ip devices.

-- 
Jonathan Crockett
Network Engineer
Midcontinent Communications

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[jlewis]

On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Andy Dills wrote:

> That's quite a "medium-scale".
> 
> Is there a single entity in the world that controls 1,000 networks and
> 100,000 network devices?

WorldCom^Hn

--
 Jon Lewis [EMAIL PROTECTED]|  I route
 System Administrator|  therefore you are
 Atlantic Net|  
_ http://www.lewis.org/~jlewis/pgp for PGP public key_

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Andy Dills]

On Sun, 22 Jun 2003, Sean Donelan wrote:

> Has network discovery and mapping improved for medium-scale wide
> area networks for ISPs (e.g. 1,000 networks, 100,000 network devices)?
> I've found lots of discovery tools, but intelligent mapping/layout still
> seems to be a problem. The usual requirements for SNMP smart discovery,
> interface/subnet mapping, device identification and connecting the right
> symbols with the right lines to all the other symbols.

That's quite a "medium-scale".

Is there a single entity in the world that controls 1,000 networks and
100,000 network devices?

Andy

---
Andy Dills
Xecunet, Inc.
www.xecu.net
301-682-9972
---

Re: Network discovery and mapping

[Subhi S Hashwa]

Sunday, June 22, 2003, 7:58:39 AM, Sean wrote:



> Its been a few years since I looked at network discovery and mapping
> tools.  Openview/et al did the job, but was always a pain to move all
> the boxes to the right spots on the resulting maps.

> Has network discovery and mapping improved for medium-scale wide
> area networks for ISPs (e.g. 1,000 networks, 100,000 network devices)?
> I've found lots of discovery tools, but intelligent mapping/layout still
> seems to be a problem. The usual requirements for SNMP smart discovery,
> interface/subnet mapping, device identification and connecting the right
> symbols with the right lines to all the other symbols.

www.solarwinds.net

They have excellent collection of tools which is probably what you;re
looking for.

Windows only afaik


-- 
Best regards,
 Subhi S Hashwa mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Operations Manager
 Electronic Corner Limited

Network discovery and mapping

[Sean Donelan]

Its been a few years since I looked at network discovery and mapping
tools.  Openview/et al did the job, but was always a pain to move all
the boxes to the right spots on the resulting maps.

Has network discovery and mapping improved for medium-scale wide
area networks for ISPs (e.g. 1,000 networks, 100,000 network devices)?
I've found lots of discovery tools, but intelligent mapping/layout still
seems to be a problem. The usual requirements for SNMP smart discovery,
interface/subnet mapping, device identification and connecting the right
symbols with the right lines to all the other symbols.