Re: [neonixie-l] One slot on my clock keeps burning out tubes, while the others have been good for years. Thoughts?

[Jeff Walton]

When all of the cathodes in a single tube lose large patches of coverage in a 
short period of time, it still seems that it would be a failure of the gas 
mixture.  Over driving the cathodes for a period of time would cause an 
eventual loss of brightness but it should cause variations among the cathodes 
and not a sudden loss of coverage on all cathodes.  
GregEbert suggested to look at the socket to make sure that pins aren't 
stressed, which seems to match your description of how the tube failed...  
Three failures in the same socket does seem to be more than coincidence and it 
would be a good question to determine whether mechanical or electrical.   You 
should follow up with the group regarding future failures and/or findings as it 
is interesting. 


 Original message 
From: Nicholas Stock  
Date: 8/16/2016  8:26 PM  (GMT-07:00) 
To: neonixie-l@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: [neonixie-l] One slot on my clock keeps burning out tubes, while 
the others have been good for years. Thoughts? 

Could the photocoupler at HC2 be the culprit at all? When you change the tubes, 
is the brightness of the IN14 at that position the same as the rest?
On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 8:10 PM, gregebert  wrote:
Since it's multiplexed, it might be worth comparing the 'on' time of each tube 
(I'm guessing it's H2 on the schematic ?). You'll need a scope. Maybe there is 
a quirk in the controller firmware that leaves this particular tube on longer 
?? There's also a slight difference in the circuit around tubes H2, H3, and H4 
though nothing pops out as a possible culprit.
Any chance there's a source of heat next to tube H2 ?

Only other thing I can think of is if the particular socket puts more stress on 
this tube.



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Re: [neonixie-l] One slot on my clock keeps burning out tubes, while the others have been good for years. Thoughts?

[Nicholas Stock]

Could the photocoupler at HC2 be the culprit at all? When you change the
tubes, is the brightness of the IN14 at that position the same as the rest?

On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 8:10 PM, gregebert  wrote:

> Since it's multiplexed, it might be worth comparing the 'on' time of each
> tube (I'm guessing it's H2 on the schematic ?). You'll need a scope. Maybe
> there is a quirk in the controller firmware that leaves this particular
> tube on longer ?? There's also a slight difference in the circuit around
> tubes H2, H3, and H4 though nothing pops out as a possible culprit.
>
> Any chance there's a source of heat next to tube H2 ?
>
> Only other thing I can think of is if the particular socket puts more
> stress on this tube.
>
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Re: [neonixie-l] One slot on my clock keeps burning out tubes, while the others have been good for years. Thoughts?

[gregebert]

Since it's multiplexed, it might be worth comparing the 'on' time of each 
tube (I'm guessing it's H2 on the schematic ?). You'll need a scope. Maybe 
there is a quirk in the controller firmware that leaves this particular 
tube on longer ?? There's also a slight difference in the circuit around 
tubes H2, H3, and H4 though nothing pops out as a possible culprit.

Any chance there's a source of heat next to tube H2 ?

Only other thing I can think of is if the particular socket puts more 
stress on this tube.

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Re: [neonixie-l] Original evaluation PCB for the Burroughs BG12205-2 bar graph displays?

[MichaelS]

Thanks, Jon!

BTW - does anyone know of a source for connectors for these, or how to make 
one?


On Tuesday, August 16, 2016 at 1:44:55 PM UTC-5, Jon wrote:
>
> Care to share pictures / schematics with the rest of the list? 
>>
>> I have some of those displays (Vishay-branded) and would like to make 
>> something with them. 
>>
>> // Per. 
>>
>>
> I think I can do that... PDF of instruction manual and images of both 
> sides of the PCB attached here.
>
> Enjoy.
>
> Jon.
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] One slot on my clock keeps burning out tubes, while the others have been good for years. Thoughts?

[Nicholas Stock]

To be honest with you Brando, I've never had an IN14 tube die on me...but
perhaps I've been lucky. The fact that you've had the same position die on
you twice and soon to be a third makes me suspicious of the board. Is there
a schematic to it you can post?

On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 1:07 PM, Brando L  wrote:

> Thanks for the response Nick, check out the pics I posted in the latest
> comment. Let me know if you want to see a different angle, LED light
> pollution got in the way a bit too..
>
> On Monday, August 15, 2016 at 8:37:52 PM UTC-7, Pramanicin wrote:
>>
>> Brando, that sucks. What make and model of clock is it? Can you post a
>> picture?
>>
>> Nick
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Brando L  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Had a question for you guys, would be curious to see if anyone has seen
>>> this too.
>>>
>>> I've had a nixie tube clock for 3+ years and for some reason I've only
>>> had to replace the tube in one of the digits, but I've replaced it 2 times
>>> and now about to do it again for the third. Since this is starting to look
>>> like a pattern and my other tubes have had no issues, I'm thinking it's not
>>> the tubes fault. It's the hour position on the clock where X is: HX:MM:SS.
>>> When the tube goes, it's like a 1-2 week death; slowly bits of the digits
>>> aren't visible, and then less and less until it is digit less.
>>>
>>> What's the best way to diagnose?
>>>
>>> Much Appreciated.
>>>
>>> --
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Re: [neonixie-l] Original evaluation PCB for the Burroughs BG12205-2 bar graph displays?

[Dekatron42]

Thanks Jon!

/Martin

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[neonixie-l] Re: Dekatron Experiments

[Dekatron42]

Nice!

Could it be that you have a timing issue with the guides not being totally 
"off" when you do the reset?

Or that the reset does not load the cathode enough so that the glow steps 
to a lower potential, being K9? You can also check what happens if you 
exchange the guides, then it should step to 1 instead of 9 - unfortunately 
not telling you what the problem is but it should at least be another way 
of measuring what's happening. One more thing to try is to add a resistor 
in the RTN +55V power line as that then changes the balance between K0 and 
the other guides.

/Martin

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[neonixie-l] Dekatron Experiments

['threeneurons' via neonixie-l]

Well, those who know me, know that I have attraction to dekatrons. Here's 
some of my latest tinkering. A long while back I designed a 4000 CMOS base 
pendulum circuit. It used a 4017 counter, and a 4013 flip-flop. I revisited 
that circuit, and came up with one that just uses on 4518 dual counter:



In addition to the one chip, and the HV interfacing transistors, there's a 
clever little piece of what Don Lancaster referred to as "Mickey Mouse 
logic". The one transistor and its associated components, in the pink 
field, form an exclusive-OR gate. Half the chip along with XOR ckt, make 
the guide timing circuit. The other half of the chip is used as the 
direction flip-flop. Circuits quite nicely. HV supplies, and clock, not 
shown.


In my test circuit, I decided to run two dekatrons. One master, and one 
slave. To align the slave tube, I added a reset circuit to K0 (normally 
used as the NDX). This forces the glow to K0, instantly. Here's that 
portion of the circuit:



I hooked it such that when QD (pin 14), of the IC went high, the reset was 
issued. That meant a reset every 10 'flips'.


It worked ... mostly. I noticed something strange. If I used a A101 as a 
slave, the glow reset to K0, as expected. But using several 6802's and a 
GC10B, the glow appeared to reset to K9. After some poking around, I 
decided to check the reset, with the guides (G1 & G2) off. Then, 
indifferent to tube type, the reset forced to glow to K0. So this new 
pendulum circuit "backsteps" some tubes from K0 to K9, almost instantly.


Here's a photo of the test circuit, and video of it running:






Video  of above circuit.


Enjoy




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Re: [neonixie-l] One slot on my clock keeps burning out tubes, while the others have been good for years. Thoughts?

[Brando L]

Thanks for the response Nick, check out the pics I posted in the latest 
comment. Let me know if you want to see a different angle, LED light 
pollution got in the way a bit too.. 

On Monday, August 15, 2016 at 8:37:52 PM UTC-7, Pramanicin wrote:
>
> Brando, that sucks. What make and model of clock is it? Can you post a 
> picture?
>
> Nick
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Brando L 
> > wrote:
>
>>
>> Had a question for you guys, would be curious to see if anyone has seen 
>> this too. 
>>
>> I've had a nixie tube clock for 3+ years and for some reason I've only 
>> had to replace the tube in one of the digits, but I've replaced it 2 times 
>> and now about to do it again for the third. Since this is starting to look 
>> like a pattern and my other tubes have had no issues, I'm thinking it's not 
>> the tubes fault. It's the hour position on the clock where X is: HX:MM:SS. 
>> When the tube goes, it's like a 1-2 week death; slowly bits of the digits 
>> aren't visible, and then less and less until it is digit less. 
>>
>> What's the best way to diagnose? 
>>
>> Much Appreciated. 
>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
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>>
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Group document repository...

[Andy Tefft]

Yes, you can restrict access to individuals, but I believe they have to
have google accounts, and there's no way to integrate it with the group
membership, so it would be a manual addition/removal process for
individuals.

On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 10:07 AM, Dylan Distasio 
wrote:

> Nick-
>
> Google Drive, while not necessarily perfect, does offer the ability to
> restrict access to specific people.  Set up this way, it would not allow
> anyone else with the link to use it.  You can also set view/edit access at
> the individual level.  Hope that helps...
>
> Best,
> Dylan
>
> On Aug 16, 2016 7:24 AM, "Nick"  wrote:
>
>> Not really - the link will leak and the rights are the same for all uses
>> of the link, there is no user authorisation or permissioning control.
>>
>> Nick
>>
>> On Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:18:43 UTC+1, Roddy Scott wrote:
>>>
>>> If the link is only available to members then would that not suffice?
>>> Suscriber only access?
>>>
>>> Just a thought.
>>>
>>> On Monday, August 15, 2016 at 2:49:21 PM UTC+1, Nick wrote:

 Making it public and a direct link doesn't address the access
 requirements mentioned above - anybody with the link would have access...

 Nick

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>>
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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Group document repository...

[Dylan Distasio]

Nick-

Google Drive, while not necessarily perfect, does offer the ability to
restrict access to specific people.  Set up this way, it would not allow
anyone else with the link to use it.  You can also set view/edit access at
the individual level.  Hope that helps...

Best,
Dylan

On Aug 16, 2016 7:24 AM, "Nick"  wrote:

> Not really - the link will leak and the rights are the same for all uses
> of the link, there is no user authorisation or permissioning control.
>
> Nick
>
> On Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:18:43 UTC+1, Roddy Scott wrote:
>>
>> If the link is only available to members then would that not suffice?
>> Suscriber only access?
>>
>> Just a thought.
>>
>> On Monday, August 15, 2016 at 2:49:21 PM UTC+1, Nick wrote:
>>>
>>> Making it public and a direct link doesn't address the access
>>> requirements mentioned above - anybody with the link would have access...
>>>
>>> Nick
>>>
>> --
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[neonixie-l] Re: Group document repository...

[Nick]

Not really - the link will leak and the rights are the same for all uses of 
the link, there is no user authorisation or permissioning control.

Nick

On Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:18:43 UTC+1, Roddy Scott wrote:
>
> If the link is only available to members then would that not suffice? 
> Suscriber only access?
>
> Just a thought.
>
> On Monday, August 15, 2016 at 2:49:21 PM UTC+1, Nick wrote:
>>
>> Making it public and a direct link doesn't address the access 
>> requirements mentioned above - anybody with the link would have access...
>>
>> Nick
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Group document repository...

[Roddy Scott]

If the link is only available to members then would that not suffice? 
Suscriber only access?

Just a thought.

On Monday, August 15, 2016 at 2:49:21 PM UTC+1, Nick wrote:
>
> Making it public and a direct link doesn't address the access requirements 
> mentioned above - anybody with the link would have access...
>
> Nick
>

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