Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream

[Paul Atkin]

Thanks so much for the support, including the private replies.  I have 
ordered some replacement chips, I have some old boards at home I will try 
this out on before I commit to the repair job.

Cheers, Paul


On Friday, December 14, 2018 at 11:20:00 AM UTC+9, Jeff Walton wrote:
>
> You could easily replace this with a solder iron.  
>
> - Simply use a small wire clipper and cut the leads next to the body of 
> the old part.  
>
> - Then unsolder the leads from the board, one at a time and use a tweezer 
> or equivalent to remove the remains of the old part. . 
>
> - Use some solder wick across the pads on the PCB to remove excess solder 
> to get them ready for the new part
>
> - Use a flux pen or equivalent on the pads 
>
> - Place the new part on the pads until it is lined up over the pads and 
> tack one corner on each side. 
>
> - Check the alignment and use your flux pen again across the pads
>
> - With a clean, small solder iron tip, carry a small amount of fresh 
> solder and drag the iron across the leads slowly to let the flux and solder 
> wet the pads on one side at a time. 
>
> - Repeat on the other side 
>
> - Too much flux won't hurt!  The flux and solder resist on the PCB will 
> generally prevent a solder bridge. 
>
> - If you need to re-do anything, get one side right first before starting 
> on the other. 
>
> - YouTube is your friend if you want to study the technique.  The part 
> that you are looking at replacing is not difficult for you to start with. 
>
> You can do this! 
>
> - Jeff
>
>  Original message 
> From: Paul Atkin > 
> Date: 12/13/18 7:51 PM (GMT-06:00) 
> To: neonixie-l > 
> Subject: [neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream 
>
> Sorry, I forgot to post the PCB image
>
> [image: testpoints_2a.jpg]
>
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 7:03:45 PM UTC+9, Paul Atkin wrote:
>>
>> Hi All,
>> I have an IN-18 Blue Dream that has run happily for 6 years in a dust 
>> free display case.  During that time, I had just one tube go bad with an 
>> apparent gas leak.
>>
>> I have been operating it on a timer so it only powers on every evening 
>> which has also worked fine.
>>
>> Just a few days ago, the tubes didn't light up when expected.  I powered 
>> it up on a second 12V supply (confirmed working) but no joy.  The LED's 
>> light up, but on initial inspection it seems I have lost the internal 
>> 170VDC power.  I am not a specialist and have no schematic so I was 
>> wondering if anyone has skills or knowledge to help me troubleshoot this.
>>
>> Thanks in advance
>>
>> Paul
>>
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[neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream

[Robert L]

Hi Paul,

Jeff very accurately describes how I replace most SOIC and similar low lead 
count parts... What he describes works and works well! I also really like 
hot air...

That said, here's another technique that I sometimes use and may be a bit 
easier for you if you don't have tiny diagonal cutters.

The video linked below describes flooding the pins with solder and slipping 
the part off to the side. This technique is nice if the part doesn't have 
too many leads. Works fine on SOIC-8 packages!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJ_VVTyPGrU

Best regards,
Bob

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream

[Nicholas Stock]

Hear hear Jeff, wise words.

Nick

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 13, 2018, at 18:19, Jeff Walton  wrote:
> 
> You could easily replace this with a solder iron.  
> 
> - Simply use a small wire clipper and cut the leads next to the body of the 
> old part.  
> 
> - Then unsolder the leads from the board, one at a time and use a tweezer or 
> equivalent to remove the remains of the old part. . 
> 
> - Use some solder wick across the pads on the PCB to remove excess solder to 
> get them ready for the new part
> 
> - Use a flux pen or equivalent on the pads 
> 
> - Place the new part on the pads until it is lined up over the pads and tack 
> one corner on each side. 
> 
> - Check the alignment and use your flux pen again across the pads
> 
> - With a clean, small solder iron tip, carry a small amount of fresh solder 
> and drag the iron across the leads slowly to let the flux and solder wet the 
> pads on one side at a time. 
> 
> - Repeat on the other side 
> 
> - Too much flux won't hurt!  The flux and solder resist on the PCB will 
> generally prevent a solder bridge. 
> 
> - If you need to re-do anything, get one side right first before starting on 
> the other. 
> 
> - YouTube is your friend if you want to study the technique.  The part that 
> you are looking at replacing is not difficult for you to start with. 
> 
> You can do this! 
> 
> - Jeff
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Paul Atkin 
> Date: 12/13/18 7:51 PM (GMT-06:00)
> To: neonixie-l 
> Subject: [neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream
> 
> Sorry, I forgot to post the PCB image
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 7:03:45 PM UTC+9, Paul Atkin wrote:
>> Hi All,
>> I have an IN-18 Blue Dream that has run happily for 6 years in a dust free 
>> display case.  During that time, I had just one tube go bad with an apparent 
>> gas leak.
>> 
>> I have been operating it on a timer so it only powers on every evening which 
>> has also worked fine.
>> 
>> Just a few days ago, the tubes didn't light up when expected.  I powered it 
>> up on a second 12V supply (confirmed working) but no joy.  The LED's light 
>> up, but on initial inspection it seems I have lost the internal 170VDC 
>> power.  I am not a specialist and have no schematic so I was wondering if 
>> anyone has skills or knowledge to help me troubleshoot this.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance
>> 
>> Paul
> 
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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream

[Jeff Walton]

You could easily replace this with a solder iron.  
- Simply use a small wire clipper and cut the leads next to the body of the old 
part.  
- Then unsolder the leads from the board, one at a time and use a tweezer or 
equivalent to remove the remains of the old part. . 
- Use some solder wick across the pads on the PCB to remove excess solder to 
get them ready for the new part
- Use a flux pen or equivalent on the pads 
- Place the new part on the pads until it is lined up over the pads and tack 
one corner on each side. 
- Check the alignment and use your flux pen again across the pads
- With a clean, small solder iron tip, carry a small amount of fresh solder and 
drag the iron across the leads slowly to let the flux and solder wet the pads 
on one side at a time. 
- Repeat on the other side 
- Too much flux won't hurt!  The flux and solder resist on the PCB will 
generally prevent a solder bridge. 
- If you need to re-do anything, get one side right first before starting on 
the other. 
- YouTube is your friend if you want to study the technique.  The part that you 
are looking at replacing is not difficult for you to start with. 
You can do this! 
- Jeff
 Original message From: Paul Atkin  Date: 
12/13/18  7:51 PM  (GMT-06:00) To: neonixie-l  
Subject: [neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream 
Sorry, I forgot to post the PCB image



On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 7:03:45 PM UTC+9, Paul Atkin wrote:Hi All,I 
have an IN-18 Blue Dream that has run happily for 6 years in a dust free 
display case.  During that time, I had just one tube go bad with an apparent 
gas leak.
I have been operating it on a timer so it only powers on every evening which 
has also worked fine.

Just a few days ago, the tubes didn't light up when expected.  I powered it up 
on a second 12V supply (confirmed working) but no joy.  The LED's light up, but 
on initial inspection it seems I have lost the internal 170VDC power.  I am not 
a specialist and have no schematic so I was wondering if anyone has skills or 
knowledge to help me troubleshoot this.
Thanks in advance
Paul




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[neonixie-l] Re: Repair / Troubleshoot an IN-18 Blue Dream

[Paul Atkin]

Hi Nick, thanks for the welcome.  I had a maiI from Pramacin and I also 
sent a mail direct to Dieter.  He has replied so I will share what I have 
learned so far in case it can be of use to anyone else.
First point is that my clock had run flawlessly on the same power supply 
for 6 years.  I run it at selected hours on a 7 day timer, around 40 hours 
per week (so about 12,000 hours running in total with 5 of the original 
tubes - had one with a gas leak that I replaced about 2 years ago).
I sent a mail to Dieter and he was very helpful to diagnose the possible 
issue within 36 hours.  He gave me some points to test the voltages as per 
the red text on the attached image. Based on the results I got he strongly 
believes it is IC03 on the PCB (yellow circle) which is a UCC38084 current 
mode controller in an SO-8 SMD package .  It can be replaced with a 
UCC38084D, UCC38084DR or a UCC38084DG4.  
It was likely taken out by the 12V power supply which I found was dead so I 
am guessing that when it died, it sent a spike into the clock.
Unfortunately, he is not prepared to make a repair on the board and I as am 
in rural Japan so I'd need to ship it somewhere in any case.  I don't think 
I'll be able to find anyone locally that will do the job.
I have some soldering experience but have never tried reworking SMD chips.  
If I was going to attempt this I would need a hot air station but I don't 
do enough to warrant buying anything fancy.  So I am thinking to take my 
time and try to learn a new skill.  I saw a report from Dave at EEVblog who 
rates the simple 858D rework station good value and seems to work well 
enough for small jobs.  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vva2t21sOAs
If anyone knows of another cheap unit I'd love to hear - I really don't 
want to spend much at this time.
I have a few old boards laying around that I could hone my skills on before 
attempting a hack at the Blue Dream.  If I find it too challenging, I might 
contact here again [image: 😊]

If I manage to get this running again, I am going to use the best quality 
12V supply and a shitload of capacitors!!

Paul


On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 7:03:45 PM UTC+9, Paul Atkin wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> I have an IN-18 Blue Dream that has run happily for 6 years in a dust free 
> display case.  During that time, I had just one tube go bad with an 
> apparent gas leak.
>
> I have been operating it on a timer so it only powers on every evening 
> which has also worked fine.
>
> Just a few days ago, the tubes didn't light up when expected.  I powered 
> it up on a second 12V supply (confirmed working) but no joy.  The LED's 
> light up, but on initial inspection it seems I have lost the internal 
> 170VDC power.  I am not a specialist and have no schematic so I was 
> wondering if anyone has skills or knowledge to help me troubleshoot this.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Paul
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Old Russian Beta Radiometer

[Tyler Bourne]

Seems like it was most likely made in late 86 or 87.  I'll see if there are 
any later date codes.

The power supply is interesting, opens like a book with board on one side 
and power transistors/heat-sink on the other.

On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 10:37:22 PM UTC-5, gregebert wrote:
>
> Some of the parts have date-codes; looks like 1984 to 1986. Maybe 
> post-Chernobyl equipment ??
>
> Nice workmanship
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Old Russian Beta Radiometer

[Tyler Bourne]

I found a detector on ebay.  Will test it out when it gets here.
I'm not sure how they are driving the tubes since I don't see the usual 
driver chips.  I'll examine the board and see if I can figure out how 
they're doing it.
Also I have a video of the display.  Not a very good video but I'll take 
another when I have the detector.

https://youtu.be/BSRXjYZmnD8

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