Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
25 November 2020, 04:01:13, by "Mayuresh" : > On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 09:34:41PM +0100, Riccardo Mottola wrote: > > > One of my requirements is to edit MSOffice documents on office.com. Would > > > it work with that? Aren't web-based msoffice tools actively supporting macOS Safari? Hypothetically, any recent browser powered by upstream webkit should run them ok. Not sure how different webkitgtk is from upstream webkit, or in what state WPE is on non-Linux platforms this year.
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 09:34:41PM +0100, Riccardo Mottola wrote: > > One of my requirements is to edit MSOffice documents on office.com. Would > > it work with that? > > I think it is an unreasonable expectation. > First you speak with much "lighter" browser and then come up with this. Not an expectation. I just asked whether a requirement can be met by a browser. I wouldn't assume by default that it is not. There are many requirements and many browsers (and in fact many machines, but that apart) and I have to try and find out which suits which, kind of make a matrix of that and then choose what is a best combination. Mayuresh
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
Mayuresh wrote: wip/arcticfox would be nice to start giving it a try. I think it would be nice! perhaps sooner or later I shall try to do it. A long time since I got myself dirty there, pkgin is so convenient. I'm sensing if there is interest, I hope... that a small community could gather. For now huntseeking patches of FF especially all the work done in many Distributions to get FF45 and 52 "modern" in a singe place would be good. One of my requirements is to edit MSOffice documents on office.com. Would it work with that? I think it is an unreasonable expectation. First you speak with much "lighter" browser and then come up with this. Maybe it kind of works... try... but office.com is doomed to be chromium only... Think. now Blink+v8 are the new InternetExplorer Trident. Right now some people are claiming this is good, but it is a monopoly. Internet = Google Chrome standards. Edge, Opera, Vivaldi and many more... just a skin about the same stuff. Total monopoly. Riccardo
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
On 23.11.2020 11:09, Sad Clouds wrote: On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 06:24:17 +0100 (CET) "Thomas Mueller" wrote: from Sad Clouds: > On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 16:29:27 +0530 > Mayuresh wrote: > > In the interim, would appreciate any feedback on luakit or other > > alternatives (with JS support). > x86 running Linux and Opera web browser. I gave up on Firefox years > ago. Unfortunately Opera don't provide binaries for NetBSD, but you > could try Linux emulation. I use Otter browser, which is in pkgsrc, FreeBSD ports, and haikuports. One good feature is being able to fake the user-agent for sites like Chase online banking that refuse to allow access if the user-agent is not to their software's liking Tom I had stability issues with Otter browser, random crashes, etc. Same thing happened with Firefox on sparc64. I just stick to x86 for desktop applications, where sparc64 and arm are more for tinkering and server applications. The web technology used to be small and lean many years ago, but now there is too much complexity and bloat. Because of this, it is becoming a monoculture of a handful of browser engines - Blink and Gecko. Don't even try to innovate, you'll be buried by the cost and complexity. Which is why everybody is switching to Blink, whether they like it or not. Those new Apple M1 CPUs are very interesting. As a HW. For sure they will improve situation on ARM field, but for Apple mostly :-) And in browsers it will be like you describe and as I said, we are returning to 90's, this time not with IE, but with Chrome
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
On Mon, 23 Nov 2020 06:24:17 +0100 (CET) "Thomas Mueller" wrote: > from Sad Clouds: > > > On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 16:29:27 +0530 > > Mayuresh wrote: > > > > In the interim, would appreciate any feedback on luakit or other > > > alternatives (with JS support). > > > x86 running Linux and Opera web browser. I gave up on Firefox years > > ago. Unfortunately Opera don't provide binaries for NetBSD, but you > > could try Linux emulation. > > I use Otter browser, which is in pkgsrc, FreeBSD ports, and > haikuports. > > One good feature is being able to fake the user-agent for sites like > Chase online banking that refuse to allow access if the user-agent is > not to their software's liking > > Tom > I had stability issues with Otter browser, random crashes, etc. Same thing happened with Firefox on sparc64. I just stick to x86 for desktop applications, where sparc64 and arm are more for tinkering and server applications. The web technology used to be small and lean many years ago, but now there is too much complexity and bloat. Because of this, it is becoming a monoculture of a handful of browser engines - Blink and Gecko. Don't even try to innovate, you'll be buried by the cost and complexity. Which is why everybody is switching to Blink, whether they like it or not.
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
Den mån 23 nov. 2020 06:24Thomas Mueller skrev: > from Sad Clouds: > > > On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 16:29:27 +0530 > > Mayuresh wrote: > > > > In the interim, would appreciate any feedback on luakit or other > > > alternatives (with JS support). > > > x86 running Linux and Opera web browser. I gave up on Firefox years > > ago. Unfortunately Opera don't provide binaries for NetBSD, but you > > could try Linux emulation. > > I use Otter browser, which is in pkgsrc, FreeBSD ports, and haikuports. > > One good feature is being able to fake the user-agent for sites like Chase > online banking that refuse to allow access if the user-agent is not to > their software's liking > > Tom > Otter uses qtwebkit which is a security concern. Personally, I use badwolf. It has a JS on/off on a per tab feature. > >
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
from Sad Clouds: > On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 16:29:27 +0530 > Mayuresh wrote: > > In the interim, would appreciate any feedback on luakit or other > > alternatives (with JS support). > x86 running Linux and Opera web browser. I gave up on Firefox years > ago. Unfortunately Opera don't provide binaries for NetBSD, but you > could try Linux emulation. I use Otter browser, which is in pkgsrc, FreeBSD ports, and haikuports. One good feature is being able to fake the user-agent for sites like Chase online banking that refuse to allow access if the user-agent is not to their software's liking Tom
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
On 22.11.2020 18:11, Mayuresh wrote: On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 03:46:37PM +0100, Riccardo Mottola wrote: Let me know if you want to play, help, try to compile it yourself or need a binary. Or maybe it could even go in pkgsrc I just tried *today* to compile on NetBSD/9.1 on my ThinkPad T30 (Pentium4M) and it comes up fine... wip/arcticfox would be nice to start giving it a try. One of my requirements is to edit MSOffice documents on office.com. Would it work with that? This one is way bigger problem https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoftteams/unsupported-browsers when even Microsoft went for Chrome/Chromium as core for Edge. From IE only 90's, we are getting to Chrome/Chromium only 2000's :-) But this is promising https://www.webrtcinwebkit.org/ On those "strange" browsers will be your online Outlook that old OWA interface, but still usable of course as an email client. Here you have that sad reality https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/office/which-browsers-work-with-office-for-the-web-ad1303e0-a318-47aa-b409-d3a5eb44e452
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 03:46:37PM +0100, Riccardo Mottola wrote: > Let me know if you want to play, help, try to compile it yourself or need a > binary. Or maybe it could even go in pkgsrc I just tried *today* to compile > on NetBSD/9.1 on my ThinkPad T30 (Pentium4M) and it comes up fine... wip/arcticfox would be nice to start giving it a try. One of my requirements is to edit MSOffice documents on office.com. Would it work with that? -- Mayuresh
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
Hi, Mayuresh wrote: Periodically, the topic of alternatives to firefox, particularly lightweight ones but with JS support, keeps coming. E.g. threads [1] of 2016 and [2] of 2018 and this of 2020. I think these "voices" will come up over and over, given the "trends" of the mozilla foundation with Firefox after FF 52 ESR, rustc, interface changes, giving up of seamonkey and thunderbird, etc etc. A path to explore are various Firefox forks, tried any of them? there are many, unfortunately it is a bit of a diaspora, some kept better than others. My current favourite is ArcticFox [1] on which I contribute vastly myself too. It is actually a fork of PaleMoon 27 (another browser which you can pursue, it is nice, especially the new 28 version, but the packaging poses issues, so e.g. it was removed from OpenBSD and other distros) and I do not pose any limitations on redistribution. It works and compiles on NetBSD x86 and amd64 because [2] I do test it. It is lighter and more pleasant to use with the old interface, I'm addicted to it. As compatibility expect something between FF40 and FF45 which is acceptable for many sites and better than "alternative browsers". You can watch you tube, browse wikipedia even with care use Facebook. Progress compared to PM27 is immense and a big thing is that it compiles with any gcc up to 10 on NetBSD and Linux! no more fiddling with gcc 4.8 (last release comes up to gcc 6.5 though, dev branch is gcc restriction free) Known broken things are github (well, it is broken almost anywhere if you don't have latest FF or Chrome... so), videoconferencing (WebRTC needs to be disabled like in PaleMoon [3] Let me know if you want to play, help, try to compile it yourself or need a binary. Or maybe it could even go in pkgsrc I just tried *today* to compile on NetBSD/9.1 on my ThinkPad T30 (Pentium4M) and it comes up fine... Riccardo [1] Official site: https://github.com/wicknix/Arctic-Fox while my working repository is (where 99% of development is done) : https://github.com/rmottola/Arctic-Fox [2] with quite some work I got it to "compile" on SPARC64 but it crashes on startup, help appreciated [3] I actually tried to put support back in, optional, but it fails yet to compile, help appreciated
Re: Firefox alternatives with JS : luakit?
On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 16:29:27 +0530 Mayuresh wrote: > In the interim, would appreciate any feedback on luakit or other > alternatives (with JS support). x86 running Linux and Opera web browser. I gave up on Firefox years ago. Unfortunately Opera don't provide binaries for NetBSD, but you could try Linux emulation.
