Re: [netmod] Joint WGLC on "semver" and "module-versioning" drafts

[Jürgen Schönwälder]

On Sun, Jun 04, 2023 at 07:01:16PM +0200, Carsten Bormann wrote:
> On 2023-06-02, at 18:37, Jürgen Schönwälder 
>  wrote:
> > 
> > I am not aware of an official authoritative source of YANG files.
> 
> I’m not sure I understand the current discussion, but wouldn't
> 
> curl -s https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9127.xml | xmlstarlet sel -T -t -v 
> "//sourcecode[@name='ietf-bfd-ty...@2021-10-21.yang']/text()”
> 
> be considered an authoritative source for that YANG file in that RFC?
>

There are many ways to extract YANG modules from RFCs and the results
they produce are not necessarily byte-level identical. So far this was
not considered necessary. Before people go and try to engineer a
solution, it may be useful to understand why solving this problem is
relevant or important.

/js

-- 
Jürgen Schönwälder  Constructor University Bremen gGmbH
Phone: +49 421 200 3587 Campus Ring 1 | 28759 Bremen | Germany
Fax:   +49 421 200 3103 

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Re: [netmod] Joint WGLC on "semver" and "module-versioning" drafts

[Carsten Bormann]

On 2023-06-02, at 18:37, Jürgen Schönwälder 
 wrote:
> 
> I am not aware of an official authoritative source of YANG files.

I’m not sure I understand the current discussion, but wouldn't

curl -s https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9127.xml | xmlstarlet sel -T -t -v 
"//sourcecode[@name='ietf-bfd-ty...@2021-10-21.yang']/text()”

be considered an authoritative source for that YANG file in that RFC?

Grüße, Carsten


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Re: [netmod] Joint WGLC on "semver" and "module-versioning" drafts

[Andy Bierman]

On Sun, Jun 4, 2023 at 7:01 AM Kent Watsen  wrote:

> As an individual contributor and faithful YANG custodian, I cannot
> support work that changes YANG-semantics without versioning YANG itself.
> As Andy wrote before:
>
> The only correct way to remove MUST/MUST NOT from the "YANG contract"
> is to introduce a new YANG language version (1.2), and make a new
> contract.
>
> I want this work to move forward in the form of a quick (limited-scope)
> rfc7950-bis.  One idea would to support just this YANG-next issue
>  and then mark the
> versioning extension as "critical".  That said, I believe that an even
> better versioning-solution can be had if integrated into the YANG-language
> directly.
>


IMO the parsing of YANG files to produce a conceptual data model
is a critical component of the language itself.  Any statements that
affect this conversion step MUST be regular statements.
An extension is (by definition) an external statement that is not part of
the YANG language.
Critical extensions are not a good design choice.  Just add real statements
instead.

IMO most of the yang-next issues are not interesting or valuable,
so a long WG process to go through this entire list is a non-starter.

There are 3 critical changes that need to be made.
  - change "status" so deprecated and obsolete definitions are correct
  - introduce new instance-identifier data type based on RFC 7951 definition
  - introduce new identityref data type based on RFC 7951 definition




> Kent
>


Andy


>
>
> On May 22, 2023, at 6:20 PM, Kent Watsen  wrote:
>
> NETMOD WG,
>
> The chairs are extending this WGLC by two weeks (now ending June 5) in
> order to ensure adequate review, since this is important work, and a solid
> consensus is needed.
>
> Kent and Lou
>
>
>
> On May 8, 2023, at 6:49 PM, Kent Watsen  wrote:
>
> Dear NETMOD WG,
>
> This message begins a joint two-week WGLC for
> draft-ietf-netmod-yang-semver-11 and
> draft-ietf-netmod-yang-module-versioning-09
> ending on Monday, May 22nd.  Neither draft has IPR declared.  Here are the
> direct links to the HTML version for these drafts:
>
>  - https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-netmod-yang-semver-11
>  -
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-netmod-yang-module-versioning-09
>
> Positive comments, e.g., "I've reviewed this document and believe it is
> ready for publication", are welcome!  This is useful and important, even
> from authors.  Objections, concerns, and suggestions are also welcomed at
> this time.
>
> Thank you,
> Kent and Lou (chairs)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [netmod] Joint WGLC on "semver" and "module-versioning" drafts

[Kent Watsen]

As an individual contributor and faithful YANG custodian, I cannot support work 
that changes YANG-semantics without versioning YANG itself.  As Andy wrote 
before:

The only correct way to remove MUST/MUST NOT from the "YANG contract" 
is to introduce a new YANG language version (1.2), and make a new contract.

I want this work to move forward in the form of a quick (limited-scope) 
rfc7950-bis.  One idea would to support just this YANG-next issue 
 and then mark the versioning 
extension as "critical".  That said, I believe that an even better 
versioning-solution can be had if integrated into the YANG-language directly.   

Kent


> On May 22, 2023, at 6:20 PM, Kent Watsen  wrote:
> 
> NETMOD WG,
> 
> The chairs are extending this WGLC by two weeks (now ending June 5) in order 
> to ensure adequate review, since this is important work, and a solid 
> consensus is needed.
> 
> Kent and Lou
> 
> 
> 
>> On May 8, 2023, at 6:49 PM, Kent Watsen  wrote:
>> 
>> Dear NETMOD WG,
>> 
>> This message begins a joint two-week WGLC for 
>> draft-ietf-netmod-yang-semver-11 and 
>> draft-ietf-netmod-yang-module-versioning-09
>> ending on Monday, May 22nd.  Neither draft has IPR declared.  Here are the 
>> direct links to the HTML version for these drafts:
>> 
>>  - https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-netmod-yang-semver-11
>>  - 
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-netmod-yang-module-versioning-09
>> 
>> Positive comments, e.g., "I've reviewed this document and believe it is 
>> ready for publication", are welcome!  This is useful and important, even 
>> from authors.  Objections, concerns, and suggestions are also welcomed at 
>> this time.
>> 
>> Thank you,
>> Kent and Lou (chairs)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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