Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hi, The adoption poll is closed. Authors, Please submit draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 as draft-ietf-netmod-artwork-folding-00 with only the filename and date changed. Issues raised during adoption should be addressed in -01 (including, if you are so inclined, adding an open issues section.) Thank you, Lou(and co-chairs) On 10/18/2018 9:03 AM, Lou Berger wrote: All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Oct 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Yes/support We have appreciated this tool and used it to fold JSON code examples in our draft: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ccamp-transport-nbi-app-statement-03 Italo -Original Message- From: Lou Berger [mailto:lber...@labn.net] Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2018 3:13 PM To: NetMod WG Cc: NetMod WG Chairs Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 Poll ends Nov 1 - sorry about that... On 10/18/2018 9:03 AM, Lou Berger wrote: > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Suupport Scan the artwork for horizontal tab characters. If any horizontal tab characters appear, either resolve them to space characters or exit, forcing the input provider to convert them to space characters themselves first. Support this only more strongly, e.g. the general prohibition against tabs is fine. it is hard if not impossible to get 4 implementers in a room to agree how many spaces a tab should be. > On Oct 18, 2018, at 06:03, Lou Berger wrote: > > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
On 23/10/2018 19:39, Martin Bjorklund wrote: Kent Watsen wrote: Hi Martin, one quick comment; the header used in the examples in section 8 isn't equal to the header defined in section 5.1 This is intentional. Section 5.1 says: The first line is the following 46-character string that MAY be surrounded by any number of printable characters. Ok. The rationalization here is: - scripts can easily center the text with equal amounts of some chosen character. The script in the Appendix, which was used to fold examples 8.1 thru 8.4, uses '=' characters. - manual folding is difficult to center, and hence other framing is more suitable. For instance, the example in Section 8.5. Ok, but what's the point? Why not use a fixed header? IMO it might also improve readability by have a common well-known header. I'm on the fence on this one. I like the idea of having a fixed header (and perhaps footer as well), but if they are padded to 72 characters then the header may be quite jarring to the surrounding text (e.g. the YANG tree diagram example that I provided previously, and reproduced below): == NOTE: '\\' line wrapping per BCP XX (RFC ) === module: ietf-if-l3-vlan augment /if:interfaces/if:interface/if-cmn:encapsulation/\ \if-cmn:encaps-type: +--:(dot1q-vlan) +--rw dot1q-vlan +--rw outer-tag! | +--rw tag-typedot1q-tag-type | +--rw vlan-id ieee:vlanid +--rw second-tag! +--rw tag-typedot1q-tag-type +--rw vlan-id ieee:vlanid Thanks, Rob /martin ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod . ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Yes/support Cheers, Jeff On Oct 18, 2018, 6:12 AM -0700, Lou Berger , wrote: > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hi Martin, > one quick comment; the header used in the examples in > section 8 isn't equal to the header defined in section 5.1 This is intentional. Section 5.1 says: The first line is the following 46-character string that MAY be surrounded by any number of printable characters. The rationalization here is: - scripts can easily center the text with equal amounts of some chosen character. The script in the Appendix, which was used to fold examples 8.1 thru 8.4, uses '=' characters. - manual folding is difficult to center, and hence other framing is more suitable. For instance, the example in Section 8.5. Kent // contributor ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Correct, this document only defines a file format. A separate effort will be needed to extend `xml2rfc` and `xym` and the like. For those that wish to pre-fold their artwork prior to submitting the XML (hand-crafted folding --> max readability), the `xml2rfc` will not fold it again. For those that prefer to submit the original artwork in the XML (which allows the unfolded artwork in other formats, e.g., HTML), `xml2rfc` will use an automatedly folding solution (for plain-text output only), most likely using the script in the appendix. K. -Original Message- From: netmod on behalf of Adrian Farrel Reply-To: "adr...@olddog.co.uk" Date: Tuesday, October 23, 2018 at 12:57 PM To: 'Martin Bjorklund' , "lho...@nic.cz" Cc: "netmod@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 Nicely said, Martin. The intention is that if, like Ladislav, you like to work in some long-line format, then it works as documented and the tools can wrap. If, like me, and maybe like Martin, you think pretty formatting is something that improves readability, the draft also lets you do that. A > -Original Message- > From: Martin Bjorklund [mailto:m...@tail-f.com] > Sent: 23 October 2018 17:04 > To: lho...@nic.cz > Cc: adr...@olddog.co.uk; netmod@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding- > 08 > > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 16:27 +0200, Martin Bjorklund wrote: > > > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:45 +0100, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included > in > > > > > drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt > > > > > files, > > > > > or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this work > > > > > falls > > > > > into the scope of those authors. > > > > > > > > The folding of long lines should be done as the very last (automatic) step > > > > before the document gets published. Doing it earlier means that the source > > > code > > > > in this folded form can be (accidentally) further edited, which can lead to > > > > inconsistencies. > > > > > > I will use folding e.g. for instance document examples in XML and > > > JSON. > > > > > > My plan is to keep the example files with manually added breaks in my > > > repo, and as part of validation run a script that unfolds the > > > examples, and then validate the result. The reason for this is that I > > > think readbility of the examples is important. > > > > This seems backwards to me. If you need to edit such an example, you may > have to > > remove the backslashes, reformat and insert them again. > > > > If it's not possible to fold lines according to the syntax of a given language, > > I'd prefer to keep the original lines as long as possible and rely on an > > automatic procedure just before the final document is rolled out. > > Fortunately, the draft allows us both to work the way we prefer. > > > /martin > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > > > /martin > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As long as the document is being moved around and edited, it would be > better > > > to > > > > keep the source code untouched. > > > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that > it > > > will > > > > > be in scope. > > > > > > > > > > However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending completion, > > > we > > > > > want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. > > > > > > > > > > (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is > deployed. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Adrian > > > > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > > > > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav > > > Lhotka > > > > > > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > > > > > > To: netmod@ietf.org > > > > > > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod- > artwork- > > > folding- > > > > > > 08 > >
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Nicely said, Martin. The intention is that if, like Ladislav, you like to work in some long-line format, then it works as documented and the tools can wrap. If, like me, and maybe like Martin, you think pretty formatting is something that improves readability, the draft also lets you do that. A > -Original Message- > From: Martin Bjorklund [mailto:m...@tail-f.com] > Sent: 23 October 2018 17:04 > To: lho...@nic.cz > Cc: adr...@olddog.co.uk; netmod@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding- > 08 > > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 16:27 +0200, Martin Bjorklund wrote: > > > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:45 +0100, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included > in > > > > > drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt > > > > > files, > > > > > or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this work > > > > > falls > > > > > into the scope of those authors. > > > > > > > > The folding of long lines should be done as the very last (automatic) step > > > > before the document gets published. Doing it earlier means that the source > > > code > > > > in this folded form can be (accidentally) further edited, which can lead to > > > > inconsistencies. > > > > > > I will use folding e.g. for instance document examples in XML and > > > JSON. > > > > > > My plan is to keep the example files with manually added breaks in my > > > repo, and as part of validation run a script that unfolds the > > > examples, and then validate the result. The reason for this is that I > > > think readbility of the examples is important. > > > > This seems backwards to me. If you need to edit such an example, you may > have to > > remove the backslashes, reformat and insert them again. > > > > If it's not possible to fold lines according to the syntax of a given language, > > I'd prefer to keep the original lines as long as possible and rely on an > > automatic procedure just before the final document is rolled out. > > Fortunately, the draft allows us both to work the way we prefer. > > > /martin > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > > > /martin > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As long as the document is being moved around and edited, it would be > better > > > to > > > > keep the source code untouched. > > > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that > it > > > will > > > > > be in scope. > > > > > > > > > > However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending completion, > > > we > > > > > want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. > > > > > > > > > > (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is > deployed. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Adrian > > > > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > > > > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav > > > Lhotka > > > > > > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > > > > > > To: netmod@ietf.org > > > > > > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod- > artwork- > > > folding- > > > > > > 08 > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I support the adoption. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Comments: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by > > > > > > >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC > > > authors. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is > intended > > > > > > >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover > > > this > > > > > > >eleme
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 16:27 +0200, Martin Bjorklund wrote: > > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:45 +0100, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included > > > > in > > > > drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt > > > > files, > > > > or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this > > > > work > > > > falls > > > > into the scope of those authors. > > > > > > The folding of long lines should be done as the very last (automatic) step > > > before the document gets published. Doing it earlier means that the source > > code > > > in this folded form can be (accidentally) further edited, which can lead > > > to > > > inconsistencies. > > > > I will use folding e.g. for instance document examples in XML and > > JSON. > > > > My plan is to keep the example files with manually added breaks in my > > repo, and as part of validation run a script that unfolds the > > examples, and then validate the result. The reason for this is that I > > think readbility of the examples is important. > > This seems backwards to me. If you need to edit such an example, you may have > to > remove the backslashes, reformat and insert them again. > > If it's not possible to fold lines according to the syntax of a given > language, > I'd prefer to keep the original lines as long as possible and rely on an > automatic procedure just before the final document is rolled out. Fortunately, the draft allows us both to work the way we prefer. /martin > > Lada > > > > > > > /martin > > > > > > > > > > > > As long as the document is being moved around and edited, it would be > > > better > > to > > > keep the source code untouched. > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that > > > > it > > will > > > > be in scope. > > > > > > > > However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending > > > > completion, > > we > > > > want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. > > > > > > > > (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is > > > > deployed. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Adrian > > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > > > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav > > Lhotka > > > > > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > > > > > To: netmod@ietf.org > > > > > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork- > > folding- > > > > > 08 > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > I support the adoption. > > > > > > > > > > > > Comments: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled > > > > > > by > > > > > >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC > > authors. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is > > > > > > intended > > > > > >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover > > this > > > > > >element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the > > xml2rfc > > > > > >tool automatically adds the and > > > > > > markers, > > > > > >which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, > > > > > >sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the > > > > > >xml2rfc-dev mailing list. > > > > > > > > > > Update: using the "name" attribute with does the right > > thing. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > results in > > > > > > > > > > file "ietf-...@2016-03-20.yang" > >
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 16:27 +0200, Martin Bjorklund wrote: > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:45 +0100, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included in > > > drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt > > > files, > > > or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this work > > > falls > > > into the scope of those authors. > > > > The folding of long lines should be done as the very last (automatic) step > > before the document gets published. Doing it earlier means that the source > code > > in this folded form can be (accidentally) further edited, which can lead to > > inconsistencies. > > I will use folding e.g. for instance document examples in XML and > JSON. > > My plan is to keep the example files with manually added breaks in my > repo, and as part of validation run a script that unfolds the > examples, and then validate the result. The reason for this is that I > think readbility of the examples is important. This seems backwards to me. If you need to edit such an example, you may have to remove the backslashes, reformat and insert them again. If it's not possible to fold lines according to the syntax of a given language, I'd prefer to keep the original lines as long as possible and rely on an automatic procedure just before the final document is rolled out. Lada > > > /martin > > > > > > > As long as the document is being moved around and edited, it would be better > to > > keep the source code untouched. > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that it > will > > > be in scope. > > > > > > However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending completion, > we > > > want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. > > > > > > (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is deployed. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Adrian > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav > Lhotka > > > > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > > > > To: netmod@ietf.org > > > > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork- > folding- > > > > 08 > > > > > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > I support the adoption. > > > > > > > > > > Comments: > > > > > > > > > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by > > > > >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC > authors. > > > > > > > > > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is intended > > > > >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover > this > > > > >element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the > xml2rfc > > > > >tool automatically adds the and markers, > > > > >which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, > > > > >sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the > > > > >xml2rfc-dev mailing list. > > > > > > > > Update: using the "name" attribute with does the right > thing. > > > > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > results in > > > > > > > > file "ietf-...@2016-03-20.yang" > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > > > Lou Berger writes: > > > > > > > > > > > All, > > > > > > > > > > > > This is start of a two week poll on making > > > > > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > > > > > > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > > > > > > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your > reservations > > > > > > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide > comments > > > > > > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > > > > > > > > > > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > > > > > netmod mailing list > > > > > > netmod@ietf.org > > > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > > > -- > > > > Ladislav Lhotka > > > > Head, CZ.NIC Labs > > > > PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 > > > > > > > > ___ > > > > netmod mailing list > > > > netmod@ietf.org > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > -- > > Ladislav Lhotka > > Head, CZ.NIC Labs > > PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 > > > > ___ > > netmod mailing list > > netmod@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > -- Ladislav Lhotka Head, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:45 +0100, Adrian Farrel wrote: > > Hi, > > > > 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included in > > drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt > > files, > > or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this work > > falls > > into the scope of those authors. > > The folding of long lines should be done as the very last (automatic) step > before the document gets published. Doing it earlier means that the source > code > in this folded form can be (accidentally) further edited, which can lead to > inconsistencies. I will use folding e.g. for instance document examples in XML and JSON. My plan is to keep the example files with manually added breaks in my repo, and as part of validation run a script that unfolds the examples, and then validate the result. The reason for this is that I think readbility of the examples is important. /martin > > As long as the document is being moved around and edited, it would be better > to > keep the source code untouched. > > Lada > > > > > 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that it > > will > > be in scope. > > > > However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending completion, > > we > > want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. > > > > (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is deployed. > > > > Thanks, > > Adrian > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav Lhotka > > > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > > > To: netmod@ietf.org > > > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll > > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding- > > > 08 > > > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > I support the adoption. > > > > > > > > Comments: > > > > > > > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by > > > >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC authors. > > > > > > > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is intended > > > >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover this > > > >element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the xml2rfc > > > >tool automatically adds the and markers, > > > >which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, > > > >sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the > > > >xml2rfc-dev mailing list. > > > > > > Update: using the "name" attribute with does the right thing. > > > > > > > > > ... > > > > > > > > > results in > > > > > > file "ietf-...@2016-03-20.yang" > > > ... > > > > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > Lada > > > > > > > > Lou Berger writes: > > > > > > > > > All, > > > > > > > > > > This is start of a two week poll on making > > > > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > > > > > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > > > > > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > > > > > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > > > > > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > > > > > > > > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > > > > netmod mailing list > > > > > netmod@ietf.org > > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > > -- > > > Ladislav Lhotka > > > Head, CZ.NIC Labs > > > PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 > > > > > > ___ > > > netmod mailing list > > > netmod@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > -- > Ladislav Lhotka > Head, CZ.NIC Labs > PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:45 +0100, Adrian Farrel wrote: > Hi, > > 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included in > drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt > files, > or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this work > falls > into the scope of those authors. The folding of long lines should be done as the very last (automatic) step before the document gets published. Doing it earlier means that the source code in this folded form can be (accidentally) further edited, which can lead to inconsistencies. As long as the document is being moved around and edited, it would be better to keep the source code untouched. Lada > > 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that it will > be in scope. > > However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending completion, we > want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. > > (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is deployed. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > > -Original Message- > > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav Lhotka > > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > > To: netmod@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding- > > 08 > > > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > I support the adoption. > > > > > > Comments: > > > > > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by > > >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC authors. > > > > > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is intended > > >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover this > > >element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the xml2rfc > > >tool automatically adds the and markers, > > >which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, > > >sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the > > >xml2rfc-dev mailing list. > > > > Update: using the "name" attribute with does the right thing. > > > > > > ... > > > > > > results in > > > > file "ietf-...@2016-03-20.yang" > > ... > > > > > > Lada > > > > > Lada > > > > > > Lou Berger writes: > > > > > > > All, > > > > > > > > This is start of a two week poll on making > > > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > > > > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > > > > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > > > > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > > > > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > > > > > > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > > > > > > > ___ > > > > netmod mailing list > > > > netmod@ietf.org > > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > -- > > Ladislav Lhotka > > Head, CZ.NIC Labs > > PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 > > > > ___ > > netmod mailing list > > netmod@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod -- Ladislav Lhotka Head, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hi, 1. I think you miss the point. While example XML/JSON YANG is included in drafts, and while the authors are allowed to produce those drafts as txt files, or while the authors want to achieve pretty-to-read formatting, this work falls into the scope of those authors. 2. Yes, the authors discussed the element and agreed that it will be in scope. However, we are all sort of waiting for xml2rfc v3 and pending completion, we want to move this forward for v2 that is in use today. (More than) Happy to come back and revisit this issue when v3 is deployed. Thanks, Adrian > -Original Message- > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ladislav Lhotka > Sent: 23 October 2018 14:24 > To: netmod@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding- > 08 > > On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I support the adoption. > > > > Comments: > > > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by > >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC authors. > > > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is intended > >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover this > >element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the xml2rfc > >tool automatically adds the and markers, > >which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, > >sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the > >xml2rfc-dev mailing list. > > Update: using the "name" attribute with does the right thing. > > > ... > > > results in > > file "ietf-...@2016-03-20.yang" > ... > > > Lada > > > > > Lada > > > > Lou Berger writes: > > > > > All, > > > > > > This is start of a two week poll on making > > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > > > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > > > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > > > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > > > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > > > > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > > > > > ___ > > > netmod mailing list > > > netmod@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > -- > Ladislav Lhotka > Head, CZ.NIC Labs > PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
On Tue, 2018-10-23 at 14:40 +0200, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > Hi, > > I support the adoption. > > Comments: > > 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by >the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC authors. > > 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is intended >for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover this >element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the xml2rfc >tool automatically adds the and markers, >which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, >sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the >xml2rfc-dev mailing list. Update: using the "name" attribute with does the right thing. ... results in file "ietf-...@2016-03-20.yang" ... Lada > > Lada > > Lou Berger writes: > > > All, > > > > This is start of a two week poll on making > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > > > ___ > > netmod mailing list > > netmod@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod -- Ladislav Lhotka Head, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hi, I support the adoption. Comments: 1. My general feeling is that such technicalities should be handled by the RFC editor and/or tools rather than YANG module and RFC authors. 2. xml2rfc v3 introduced a new element, , that is intended for source code inclusion. This document should therefore cover this element as well (primarily?). One problem with it is that the xml2rfc tool automatically adds the and markers, which interferes with YANG convention specified in RFC 8407, sec. 3.2. I have already raised a question about this in the xml2rfc-dev mailing list. Lada Lou Berger writes: > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod -- Ladislav Lhotka Head, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67 ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hi, I support the adoption of this document, and I intend to help by reviewing it. (one quick comment; the header used in the examples in section 8 isn't equal to the header defined in section 5.1) /martin Lou Berger wrote: > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Yes/support. Bo > -邮件原件- > 发件人: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] 代表 > Lou Berger > 发送时间: 2018年10月18日 21:13 > 收件人: NetMod WG > 抄送: NetMod WG Chairs > 主题: Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen- > netmod-artwork-folding-08 > > Poll ends Nov 1 - sorry about that... > > > On 10/18/2018 9:03 AM, Lou Berger wrote: > > All, > > > > This is start of a two week poll on making > > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working > group document. > > Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not > > support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the > > document. If yes, please also feel free to provide > comments you'd > > like to see addressed once the document is a WG > document. > > > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > > > > __ > _ > > netmod mailing list > > netmod@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > > > __ > _ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Yes/support. BR. Michael -邮件原件- 发件人: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] 代表 Lou Berger 发送时间: 2018年10月18日 21:04 收件人: NetMod WG 抄送: NetMod WG Chairs 主题: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Oct 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hi Adrian, all, What is the intended scope? 1) Is it just for examples of YANG requests/replies, or in future, instance data. If so, then I think that the solution is useful for this. 2) Or should the WG consider allowing a longer line length for YANG modules? Currently they are limited to something like 69 characters so that they can be inserted into the RFC, but possibly with line folding we could possibly consider increasing that, but perhaps that would make them harder to read/review. 3) I think that there are also cases where tree diagrams wrap and need to be constrained to 69 characters. Although I don't think that applying the folding algorithm to tree diagrams directly is necessarily a great idea, it might be that tools like pyang could be modified with an option to generate output that is consistent with the definition of the folded output so that it can be unfolded if required. To give an example of 3: Rather than this: module: ietf-if-l3-vlan augment /if:interfaces/if:interface/if-cmn:encapsulation/ if-cmn:encaps-type: +--:(dot1q-vlan) +--rw dot1q-vlan +--rw outer-tag! | +--rw tag-typedot1q-tag-type | +--rw vlan-id ieee:vlanid +--rw second-tag! +--rw tag-typedot1q-tag-type +--rw vlan-id ieee:vlanid the tooling could be modified to optionally generate this instead: == NOTE: '\\' line wrapping per BCP XX (RFC ) === module: ietf-if-l3-vlan augment /if:interfaces/if:interface/if-cmn:encapsulation/\ \if-cmn:encaps-type: +--:(dot1q-vlan) +--rw dot1q-vlan +--rw outer-tag! | +--rw tag-typedot1q-tag-type | +--rw vlan-id ieee:vlanid +--rw second-tag! +--rw tag-typedot1q-tag-type +--rw vlan-id ieee:vlanid One other question: How does the algorithm know it has reached the end of the artwork? I.e. should there also be an end line marker? Thanks, Rob On 19/10/2018 11:12, Adrian Farrel wrote: Hey Lou, As an author, I support adoption and would particularly welcome feedback from the WG to know whether this approach addresses the needs of those writing drafts for YANG models. Thanks, Adrian -Original Message- From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Lou Berger Sent: 18 October 2018 14:04 To: NetMod WG Cc: NetMod WG Chairs Subject: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Oct 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod . ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Hey Lou, As an author, I support adoption and would particularly welcome feedback from the WG to know whether this approach addresses the needs of those writing drafts for YANG models. Thanks, Adrian > -Original Message- > From: netmod [mailto:netmod-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Lou Berger > Sent: 18 October 2018 14:04 > To: NetMod WG > Cc: NetMod WG Chairs > Subject: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 > > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Support. > On Oct 18, 2018, at 6:03 AM, Lou Berger wrote: > > All, > > This is start of a two week poll on making > draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group > document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or > "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations > with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments > you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. > > The poll ends Oct 1. > > Thanks, > > Lou (and co-chairs) > > ___ > netmod mailing list > netmod@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod Mahesh Jethanandani mjethanand...@gmail.com ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Yes/support. Thanks, Rob On 18/10/2018 14:03, Lou Berger wrote: All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Oct 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod . ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Yes/support. -Qin -Original Message- From: Lou Berger Date: Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 9:11 AM To: "netmod@ietf.org" Cc: "netmod-cha...@ietf.org" Subject: WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 Resent-From: Resent-To: , , Resent-Date: Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 9:11 AM All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Nov 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
[fixed the date in Lou's message below] No objection. Kent // contributor -Original Message- From: Lou Berger Date: Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 9:11 AM To: "netmod@ietf.org" Cc: "netmod-cha...@ietf.org" Subject: WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 Resent-From: Resent-To: , , Resent-Date: Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 9:11 AM All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Nov 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
Re: [netmod] WG adoption poll draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08
Poll ends Nov 1 - sorry about that... On 10/18/2018 9:03 AM, Lou Berger wrote: All, This is start of a two week poll on making draft-kwatsen-netmod-artwork-folding-08 a working group document. Please send email to the list indicating "yes/support" or "no/do not support". If indicating no, please state your reservations with the document. If yes, please also feel free to provide comments you'd like to see addressed once the document is a WG document. The poll ends Oct 1. Thanks, Lou (and co-chairs) ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod ___ netmod mailing list netmod@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
