Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
On Monday 05 February 2007 04:44, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > Thomas A. Schmitz wrote: > > I wasn't precise enough: for German bibliographies, there's a > > convention to have works with an author sorted by the author's name > > and edited books by the first word of the title, like so: > > At first I thought: that is really weird. But then I realised that > this is also how edited story collections are sorted in dutch > libraries, so perhaps it is not that weird. > > > [1] Hoekwater, Taco: Title... > > [2] Das Xylophon, hrsg. von...% sorted under "X"!!! > > Doing the 'Das' thing properly would be a nightmare, But that is > why Bibtex has this \noopsort trick. > > rt=title sorts every book by title. I guess the only way to achieve > > > this would be by cheating bibtex and putting some tokens in front of > > Adding a specialized sort routine to the context bst file would > not be that hard. If you run a diff between cont-au.bst en cont-ti.bst, > you'll see that they are almost the same. What I need is an exact > description of which bibtex types are affected, and what you think > the name of the sort routine should be for use in \setupbibtex[sort=] > > Cheers, > > Taco > ___ > ntg-context mailing list > ntg-context@ntg.nl > http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context Going back to my makeindex example, there is a facility there for putting in the index item as sorted different from the item as printed Would it be possible to add such a sort term? would it work? The convention with makeindex is to put the sort term followed by @ followed by the printed term. The bibtex layout is more complex, but possibly for each entry an additional specifier such as SORT =TERMNAME or SORT="sortstring" in the first example the TERMNAME would be AUTHOR, EDITOR or TITLE. The second example would be for situations where the "das" must be ignored. -- John Culleton Able Indexing and Typesetting Precision typesetting (tm) at reasonable cost. Satisfaction guaranteed. http://wexfordpress.com ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
Thomas A. Schmitz wrote: > I wasn't precise enough: for German bibliographies, there's a > convention to have works with an author sorted by the author's name > and edited books by the first word of the title, like so: At first I thought: that is really weird. But then I realised that this is also how edited story collections are sorted in dutch libraries, so perhaps it is not that weird. > [1] Hoekwater, Taco: Title... > [2] Das Xylophon, hrsg. von...% sorted under "X"!!! Doing the 'Das' thing properly would be a nightmare, But that is why Bibtex has this \noopsort trick. rt=title sorts every book by title. I guess the only way to achieve > this would be by cheating bibtex and putting some tokens in front of Adding a specialized sort routine to the context bst file would not be that hard. If you run a diff between cont-au.bst en cont-ti.bst, you'll see that they are almost the same. What I need is an exact description of which bibtex types are affected, and what you think the name of the sort routine should be for use in \setupbibtex[sort=] Cheers, Taco ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
On Feb 4, 2007, at 7:41 PM, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > What does \setupbibtex[sort=title] do ? > > Taco Hi Taco, I wasn't precise enough: for German bibliographies, there's a convention to have works with an author sorted by the author's name and edited books by the first word of the title, like so: [1] Hoekwater, Taco: Title... [2] Das Xylophon, hrsg. von...% sorted under "X"!!! sort=title sorts every book by title. I guess the only way to achieve this would be by cheating bibtex and putting some tokens in front of the author that will be effective for sorting but produce no visible output. I have a (very dim) recollection that something like this can be done in bibtex, but can't remember how and where, off the top of my head. Best Thomas ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
But how does one make an edited book be sorted by editors in the same list? Johan 2007/2/4, Aditya Mahajan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > On Sun, 4 Feb 2007, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > > > Sanjoy Mahajan wrote: > Is it possible to sort by the bibliography list by authors? The manual > says that sorttype=cite|bib? > >>> > >>> No, because there is no reasonable way to do alphabetic sorting > >>> in TeX. > >> > >> > >> Perhaps I will reveal my own fundamental confusion about bibtex but: > >> > >> What about letting bibtex (the C program) do the miserable work of > >> alphabetic sorting? Then ConTeXt could typeset (the necessary subset > >> of) bib items in that order. > > > > That functionality is there already \setupbibtex[sort=author] > > Ah, that is exactly what I wanted. I misunderstood > \setuppublications[sorttype=bib]. I thought that it will sort > according to the bib file, when it actually sorts according to the bbl > file. So > > \setupbibtex[sort=author] > \setuppublications[sorttype=bib] > > gives a bibliography sorted by author. > > Thanks, > Aditya > ___ > ntg-context mailing list > ntg-context@ntg.nl > http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context > -- Johan Sandblom N8, MRC, Karolinska sjh t +46851776108 17176 Stockholm m +46735521477 Sweden "What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the will to find out, which is the exact opposite" - Bertrand Russell ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
Thomas A. Schmitz wrote: > On Feb 4, 2007, at 6:30 PM, Johan Sandblom wrote: > > >>But how does one make an edited book be sorted by editors in the >>same list? >> >>Johan >> > > That's done automatically; author and editor appear to be treated the > same way for this sort option. I am wondering if there is a way to > have edited books in the alphabetic order by title? What does \setupbibtex[sort=title] do ? Taco ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
On Feb 4, 2007, at 6:30 PM, Johan Sandblom wrote: > But how does one make an edited book be sorted by editors in the > same list? > > Johan > That's done automatically; author and editor appear to be treated the same way for this sort option. I am wondering if there is a way to have edited books in the alphabetic order by title? Thomas ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
On Sun, 4 Feb 2007, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > Sanjoy Mahajan wrote: Is it possible to sort by the bibliography list by authors? The manual says that sorttype=cite|bib? >>> >>> No, because there is no reasonable way to do alphabetic sorting >>> in TeX. >> >> >> Perhaps I will reveal my own fundamental confusion about bibtex but: >> >> What about letting bibtex (the C program) do the miserable work of >> alphabetic sorting? Then ConTeXt could typeset (the necessary subset >> of) bib items in that order. > > That functionality is there already \setupbibtex[sort=author] Ah, that is exactly what I wanted. I misunderstood \setuppublications[sorttype=bib]. I thought that it will sort according to the bib file, when it actually sorts according to the bbl file. So \setupbibtex[sort=author] \setuppublications[sorttype=bib] gives a bibliography sorted by author. Thanks, Aditya ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
On Sunday 04 February 2007 06:51, Sanjoy Mahajan wrote: > >> Is it possible to sort by the bibliography list by authors? The manual > >> says that sorttype=cite|bib? > > > > No, because there is no reasonable way to do alphabetic sorting > > in TeX. > > Perhaps I will reveal my own fundamental confusion about bibtex but: > > What about letting bibtex (the C program) do the miserable work of > alphabetic sorting? Then ConTeXt could typeset (the necessary subset > of) bib items in that order. > > -Sanjoy > > `Not all those who wander are lost.' (J.R.R. Tolkien) > ___ > ntg-context mailing list > ntg-context@ntg.nl > http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context The examples of makeindex (romance language indexing) and Xindy (non- romance indexing) are pertinent here. All TeX has to do is provide the unsorted items at the front end. The external program sorts, summarizes provides alphabetic headers etc. Then TeX reads it in and does the final typesetting. A bibtexish program could operate the same way. -- John Culleton Able Indexing and Typesetting Precision typesetting (tm) at reasonable cost. Satisfaction guaranteed. http://wexfordpress.com ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
Sanjoy Mahajan wrote: >>>Is it possible to sort by the bibliography list by authors? The manual >>>says that sorttype=cite|bib? >> >>No, because there is no reasonable way to do alphabetic sorting >>in TeX. > > > Perhaps I will reveal my own fundamental confusion about bibtex but: > > What about letting bibtex (the C program) do the miserable work of > alphabetic sorting? Then ConTeXt could typeset (the necessary subset > of) bib items in that order. That functionality is there already \setupbibtex[sort=author] Taco ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
>> Is it possible to sort by the bibliography list by authors? The manual >> says that sorttype=cite|bib? > No, because there is no reasonable way to do alphabetic sorting > in TeX. Perhaps I will reveal my own fundamental confusion about bibtex but: What about letting bibtex (the C program) do the miserable work of alphabetic sorting? Then ConTeXt could typeset (the necessary subset of) bib items in that order. -Sanjoy `Not all those who wander are lost.' (J.R.R. Tolkien) ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Sort bibliography by authors
Aditya Mahajan wrote: > Hi Taco, > > Is it possible to sort by the bibliography list by authors? The manual > says that sorttype=cite|bib? No, because there is no reasonable way to do alphabetic sorting in TeX. > Also, why does bibl-ams not define 'conference'? This can have the > exact same definition as 'inproceedings'. That is just an oversight, I all it in the next update. Best, Taco ___ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
