Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[josef . pktd]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 6:42 PM, John Hunter  wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Eric Firing  wrote:
>
>>> It would be nice to have a social interface for the mpl gallery like the
>>> one similar to the R-gallery
>>> [http://www.r-bloggers.com/the-r-graph-gallery-goes-social/]
>>
>> I think that the priority should go towards massive pruning,
>> organization, and cleanup of the gallery.  This would be a great project
>> for a new contributor to mpl.
>
> So as to not hijack poor Christoph's thread, who after all is looking
> for mpl alternatives, and not to abuse numpy-discussion's bandwidth
> with mpl issues, I have opened and issue on the github tracker as an
> "open thread" to register gripes and suggestions for mpl doc and
> gallery improvements, particularly as it regards API usage
>
> https://github.com/matplotlib/matplotlib/issues/524

I started, but I would like to mention that I'm very happy with the
pyplot interface (even if sometimes it takes a bit of time to figure
out which options to use).

Josef

>
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[John Hunter]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Eric Firing  wrote:

>> It would be nice to have a social interface for the mpl gallery like the
>> one similar to the R-gallery
>> [http://www.r-bloggers.com/the-r-graph-gallery-goes-social/]
>
> I think that the priority should go towards massive pruning,
> organization, and cleanup of the gallery.  This would be a great project
> for a new contributor to mpl.

So as to not hijack poor Christoph's thread, who after all is looking
for mpl alternatives, and not to abuse numpy-discussion's bandwidth
with mpl issues, I have opened and issue on the github tracker as an
"open thread" to register gripes and suggestions for mpl doc and
gallery improvements, particularly as it regards API usage

https://github.com/matplotlib/matplotlib/issues/524

JDH
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Eric Firing]

On 10/13/2011 12:22 PM, Gökhan Sever wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Benjamin Root  > wrote:
>
> Myself and other developers would greatly appreciate help from the
> community to point out which examples are too confusing or out of
> date. We
>
>
> It would be nice to have a social interface for the mpl gallery like the
> one similar to the R-gallery
> [http://www.r-bloggers.com/the-r-graph-gallery-goes-social/]

I think that the priority should go towards massive pruning, 
organization, and cleanup of the gallery.  This would be a great project 
for a new contributor to mpl.

Eric

>
>
> --
> Gökhan
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Skipper Seabold]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 6:22 PM, Gökhan Sever  wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Benjamin Root  wrote:
>>
>> Myself and other developers would greatly appreciate help from the
>> community to point out which examples are too confusing or out of date. We
>
> It would be nice to have a social interface for the mpl gallery like the one
> similar to the R-gallery
> [http://www.r-bloggers.com/the-r-graph-gallery-goes-social/]

Big +1. Just yesterday I wanted to add some cool "notes to self"
plots. IIRC there was a lightning talk at SciPy conference two summers
ago about starting a web site just like this. Don't know what happened
though.

Skipper
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Gökhan Sever]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Benjamin Root  wrote:

> Myself and other developers would greatly appreciate help from the
> community to point out which examples are too confusing or out of date. We
>

It would be nice to have a social interface for the mpl gallery like the one
similar to the R-gallery [
http://www.r-bloggers.com/the-r-graph-gallery-goes-social/]


-- 
Gökhan
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Benjamin Root]

On Thursday, October 13, 2011, John Salvatier 
wrote:
> Thank you John, those are looking useful.
>

I have been working to improve the docs.  One of the frustrating things
about the docs is the information overload in some places and the lack of
information elsewhere.  Further, the rigidity of the docs have not been
helpful.

The docs really present itself in 2 ways: the gallery/examples and the APIs.
 The latter is geared for the devs while the former is geared for helping
users with the question "how do I make a plot look like this?".

Myself and other developers would greatly appreciate help from the community
to point out which examples are too confusing or out of date. We would also
greatly welcome all critiques, suggestions, and comments on the docs.

Of course, what would be welcomed even more are patches!

Cheers!
Ben Root
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Gökhan Sever]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:03 PM, Gökhan Sever  wrote:

>
> I think, IPython is great for interaction with the OO interface of the
> matlab.  Just starting simple with:
>
> fig=plt.figure()
> ax=plt.gca()
> and keep tabbing ax., fig. or any object you create on the canvas
> .tab to get its methods and attributes. Another approach is start with the
> pylab interface and query detailed help/code with ?? in IPython (e.g.
> plt.xlabel??)
>

Sorry s/matlab/matplotlib. I am not sure if matlab has IPython like
interface to introspect objects. Definitely IDL doesn't.


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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Gökhan Sever]

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 3:21 PM, Zachary Pincus wrote:

> I keep meaning to use matplotlib as well, but every time I try I also get
> really turned off by the matlabish interface in the examples. I get that
> it's a selling point for matlab refugees, but I find it counterintuitive in
> the same way Christoph seems to.
>
> I'm glad to hear the OO interface isn't as clunky as it looks on some of
> the doc pages, though. This is good news. Can anyone point out any good
> tutorials/docs on using matplotlib idiomatically via its OO interface?
>
> Zach


I think, IPython is great for interaction with the OO interface of the
matlab.  Just starting simple with:

fig=plt.figure()
ax=plt.gca()
and keep tabbing ax., fig. or any object you create on the canvas
.tab to get its methods and attributes. Another approach is start with the
pylab interface and query detailed help/code with ?? in IPython (e.g.
plt.xlabel??)


-- 
Gökhan
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[John Salvatier]

Thank you John, those are looking useful.

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 2:39 PM, John Hunter  wrote:

>
>
>
>
> On Oct 13, 2011, at 4:21 PM, Zachary Pincus 
> wrote:
>
> > I keep meaning to use matplotlib as well, but every time I try I also get
> really turned off by the matlabish interface in the examples. I get that
> it's a selling point for matlab refugees, but I find it counterintuitive in
> the same way Christoph seems to.
> >
> > I'm glad to hear the OO interface isn't as clunky as it looks on some of
> the doc pages, though. This is good news. Can anyone point out any good
> tutorials/docs on using matplotlib idiomatically via its OO interface?
> >
> >
>
> I would start with these examples
>
> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/examples/api/index.html
>
> These examples use pyplot only for figure generation, mostly because this
> is the easiest way to get a Figure instance correctly wired across user
> interface toolkits, but use the API for everything else.
>
> And this tutorial, which explains the central object hierarchy:
>
> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/artists.html
>
> For a deeper dive, these tutorials may be of interest too:
>
> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/transforms_tutorial.html
>
> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/path_tutorial.html
>
>
> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/event_handling.html
>
>
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[John Hunter]

On Oct 13, 2011, at 4:21 PM, Zachary Pincus  wrote:

> I keep meaning to use matplotlib as well, but every time I try I also get 
> really turned off by the matlabish interface in the examples. I get that it's 
> a selling point for matlab refugees, but I find it counterintuitive in the 
> same way Christoph seems to.
> 
> I'm glad to hear the OO interface isn't as clunky as it looks on some of the 
> doc pages, though. This is good news. Can anyone point out any good 
> tutorials/docs on using matplotlib idiomatically via its OO interface?
> 
> 

I would start with these examples

http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/examples/api/index.html

These examples use pyplot only for figure generation, mostly because this is 
the easiest way to get a Figure instance correctly wired across user interface 
toolkits, but use the API for everything else. 

And this tutorial, which explains the central object hierarchy:

http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/artists.html

For a deeper dive, these tutorials may be of interest too:

http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/transforms_tutorial.html

http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/path_tutorial.html


http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/event_handling.html


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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[John Salvatier]

I second that request.

On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 2:21 PM, Zachary Pincus wrote:

> I keep meaning to use matplotlib as well, but every time I try I also get
> really turned off by the matlabish interface in the examples. I get that
> it's a selling point for matlab refugees, but I find it counterintuitive in
> the same way Christoph seems to.
>
> I'm glad to hear the OO interface isn't as clunky as it looks on some of
> the doc pages, though. This is good news. Can anyone point out any good
> tutorials/docs on using matplotlib idiomatically via its OO interface?
>
> Zach
>
>
>
> On Oct 13, 2011, at 3:21 PM, Joe Kington wrote:
>
> > Have a look at Chaco: http://code.enthought.com/chaco/  If you're
> wanting a more pythonic api, it's a good choice.
> >
> > Personally, I still prefer matplotlib.
> >
> > You don't every need to touch the state machine interface.
> >
> > The OO interface is slighly un-pythonic, but it's hardly clunky. I think
> you're referring to one of the webpage examples of it which avoids _any_
> convenience functions.  You can still use the convenience functions without
> having to rely on the state machine in any way. E.g.:
> >
> > import matplotlib.pyplot as plt
> >
> > fig, axes = plt.subplots(ncols=4)
> >
> > for ax in axes:
> > ax.plot(range(10))
> >
> > plt.show()
> >
> > All in all, matplotlib deliberately tries to mimic matlab for a lot of
> the conventions.  This is mostly to make it easier to switch if you're
> already familiar with matlab.
> >
> > To each his own, but for better or worse, matplotlib is the most widely
> used plotting library for python.  It's worth getting a bit more familiar
> with, if nothing else just to see past some of the rough edges.
> >
> > -Joe
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Christoph Groth  wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > Is it just me who thinks that matplotlib is ugly and a pain to use?  So
> > far I haven't found a decent alternative usable from within python.  (I
> > haven't tried all the packages out there.)  I'm mostly interested in 2d
> > plots.  Who is happy enough with a numpy-compatible plotting package to
> > recommend it?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Christoph
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > A few things I can't stand about matplotlib:
> >
> >  * It works as a state machine.  (There is an OO-API, too, but it's ugly
> >   and cumbersome to use, and most examples use the state machine mode
> >   or, even worse, a mixture of OO and global state.)
> >
> >  * It uses inches by default. (I propose to switch to nails: 1 nail = 3
> >   digits = 2 1/4 inches = 1/16 yard.)
> >
> >  * subplot(211)  (ugh!)
> >
> >  * Concepts are named in a confusing way. ("ax = subplot(112)" anyone?)
> >
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Zachary Pincus]

I keep meaning to use matplotlib as well, but every time I try I also get 
really turned off by the matlabish interface in the examples. I get that it's a 
selling point for matlab refugees, but I find it counterintuitive in the same 
way Christoph seems to.

I'm glad to hear the OO interface isn't as clunky as it looks on some of the 
doc pages, though. This is good news. Can anyone point out any good 
tutorials/docs on using matplotlib idiomatically via its OO interface?

Zach



On Oct 13, 2011, at 3:21 PM, Joe Kington wrote:

> Have a look at Chaco: http://code.enthought.com/chaco/  If you're wanting a 
> more pythonic api, it's a good choice.
> 
> Personally, I still prefer matplotlib.
> 
> You don't every need to touch the state machine interface. 
> 
> The OO interface is slighly un-pythonic, but it's hardly clunky. I think 
> you're referring to one of the webpage examples of it which avoids _any_ 
> convenience functions.  You can still use the convenience functions without 
> having to rely on the state machine in any way. E.g.:
> 
> import matplotlib.pyplot as plt
> 
> fig, axes = plt.subplots(ncols=4)
> 
> for ax in axes:
> ax.plot(range(10))
> 
> plt.show()
> 
> All in all, matplotlib deliberately tries to mimic matlab for a lot of the 
> conventions.  This is mostly to make it easier to switch if you're already 
> familiar with matlab.
> 
> To each his own, but for better or worse, matplotlib is the most widely used 
> plotting library for python.  It's worth getting a bit more familiar with, if 
> nothing else just to see past some of the rough edges.
> 
> -Joe
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Christoph Groth  wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Is it just me who thinks that matplotlib is ugly and a pain to use?  So
> far I haven't found a decent alternative usable from within python.  (I
> haven't tried all the packages out there.)  I'm mostly interested in 2d
> plots.  Who is happy enough with a numpy-compatible plotting package to
> recommend it?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Christoph
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A few things I can't stand about matplotlib:
> 
>  * It works as a state machine.  (There is an OO-API, too, but it's ugly
>   and cumbersome to use, and most examples use the state machine mode
>   or, even worse, a mixture of OO and global state.)
> 
>  * It uses inches by default. (I propose to switch to nails: 1 nail = 3
>   digits = 2 1/4 inches = 1/16 yard.)
> 
>  * subplot(211)  (ugh!)
> 
>  * Concepts are named in a confusing way. ("ax = subplot(112)" anyone?)
> 
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Russell E. Owen]

In article <8739ew90ry@falma.de>, Christoph Groth  
wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> Is it just me who thinks that matplotlib is ugly and a pain to use?  So
> far I haven't found a decent alternative usable from within python.  (I
> haven't tried all the packages out there.)  I'm mostly interested in 2d
> plots.  Who is happy enough with a numpy-compatible plotting package to
> recommend it?

I know folks who like HippoDraw and use it instead of matplotlib due to 
its speed. Veusz sounds promising. Both use Qt as a back end. I've not 
used either because I need Tcl/TK as a back end for much of my work.

-- Russell

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Re: [Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Joe Kington]

Have a look at Chaco: http://code.enthought.com/chaco/  If you're wanting a
more pythonic api, it's a good choice.

Personally, I still prefer matplotlib.

You don't every need to touch the state machine interface.

The OO interface is slighly un-pythonic, but it's hardly clunky. I think
you're referring to one of the webpage examples of it which avoids _any_
convenience functions.  You can still use the convenience functions without
having to rely on the state machine in any way. E.g.:

import matplotlib.pyplot as plt

fig, axes = plt.subplots(ncols=4)

for ax in axes:
ax.plot(range(10))

plt.show()

All in all, matplotlib deliberately tries to mimic matlab for a lot of the
conventions.  This is mostly to make it easier to switch if you're already
familiar with matlab.

To each his own, but for better or worse, matplotlib is the most widely used
plotting library for python.  It's worth getting a bit more familiar with,
if nothing else just to see past some of the rough edges.

-Joe



On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Christoph Groth  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Is it just me who thinks that matplotlib is ugly and a pain to use?  So
> far I haven't found a decent alternative usable from within python.  (I
> haven't tried all the packages out there.)  I'm mostly interested in 2d
> plots.  Who is happy enough with a numpy-compatible plotting package to
> recommend it?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Christoph
>
>
>
>
> A few things I can't stand about matplotlib:
>
>  * It works as a state machine.  (There is an OO-API, too, but it's ugly
>   and cumbersome to use, and most examples use the state machine mode
>   or, even worse, a mixture of OO and global state.)
>
>  * It uses inches by default. (I propose to switch to nails: 1 nail = 3
>   digits = 2 1/4 inches = 1/16 yard.)
>
>  * subplot(211)  (ugh!)
>
>  * Concepts are named in a confusing way. ("ax = subplot(112)" anyone?)
>
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[Numpy-discussion] wanted: decent matplotlib alternative

[Christoph Groth]

Hello,

Is it just me who thinks that matplotlib is ugly and a pain to use?  So
far I haven't found a decent alternative usable from within python.  (I
haven't tried all the packages out there.)  I'm mostly interested in 2d
plots.  Who is happy enough with a numpy-compatible plotting package to
recommend it?

Thanks,

Christoph




A few things I can't stand about matplotlib:

 * It works as a state machine.  (There is an OO-API, too, but it's ugly
   and cumbersome to use, and most examples use the state machine mode
   or, even worse, a mixture of OO and global state.)

 * It uses inches by default. (I propose to switch to nails: 1 nail = 3
   digits = 2 1/4 inches = 1/16 yard.)

 * subplot(211)  (ugh!)

 * Concepts are named in a confusing way. ("ax = subplot(112)" anyone?)

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