Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
On 04/15/21 02:02 PM, Stephan Althaus wrote: Hello! I have a 1-disk pool which i use only from time to time. Normally i would expect that i can import the pool after installing the disk again, (on 'cold' machine, boot with --reconfigure) the slot is not relevant. Just to check that disk and zfs label are ok, i mounted the pool on a linux machine, everything is ok there. On OI i cant import the pool, the "-f" flag does not help. Details below. Btw, just to be clear, I had this same error before i tried to import the pool with linux, so the import with linux is not the origin of the problem here. Any hints on how to dig into this further are welcome! Thanks! Stephan # zpool import Password: pool: bkp1t id: 4466948378057274312 state: FAULTED status: The pool was last accessed by another system. action: The pool cannot be imported due to damaged devices or data. The pool may be active on another system, but can be imported using the '-f' flag. see: http://illumos.org/msg/ZFS-8000-EY config: bkp1t FAULTED corrupted data c8t2d0s0 UNAVAIL corrupted data # zdb -l /dev/rdsk/c8t2d0s0 LABEL 0 version: 5000 name: 'bkp1t' state: 0 txg: 26349 pool_guid: 4466948378057274312 errata: 0 hostid: 758768731 hostname: 'Fuji' top_guid: 1576464959927753 guid: 1576464959927753 vdev_children: 1 vdev_tree: type: 'disk' id: 0 guid: 1576464959927753 path: '/dev/sda1' devid: 'id1,sd@n5396b5803dd2/a' phys_path: '/pci@0,0/pci8086,c01@1/pci1734,11e4@0/sd@4,1:a' whole_disk: 0 metaslab_array: 256 metaslab_shift: 33 ashift: 13 asize: 987837759488 is_log: 0 create_txg: 4 features_for_read: com.delphix:hole_birth com.delphix:embedded_data labels = 0 1 2 3 ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss The error occurs only on the buildtin AHCI SATA interface. Now i have tested 2 slots that are on a HBA on an LSI based Raid controller in JOBD mode. There i could import the pool, the disk is available. I did not import the pool to keep the current state for further testing. After connecting the disk back to a 'normal' AHCI port, the import is not possible as statet in the original post. weird, no? # /usr/lib/pci/pcieadm show-devs BDF TYPE DRIVER DEVICE 0/0/0 PCI -- Xeon E3-1200 v3 Processor DRAM Controller 0/1/0 PCIe Gen 3x8 pcieb3 Xeon E3-1200 v3/4th Gen Core Processor PCI Express x16 Controller 1/0/0 PCIe Gen 3x8 mr_sas1 MegaRAID SAS 2208 ... $ sudo zpool import Password: pool: bkp1t id: 4466948378057274312 state: ONLINE status: The pool was last accessed by another system. action: The pool can be imported using its name or numeric identifier and the '-f' flag. see: http://illumos.org/msg/ZFS-8000-EY config: bkp1t ONLINE c10t2d1s0 ONLINE # zdb -l /dev/rdsk/c10t2d1s0 LABEL 0 version: 5000 name: 'bkp1t' state: 0 txg: 26349 pool_guid: 4466948378057274312 errata: 0 hostid: 758768731 hostname: 'Fuji' top_guid: 1576464959927753 guid: 1576464959927753 vdev_children: 1 vdev_tree: type: 'disk' id: 0 guid: 1576464959927753 path: '/dev/sda1' devid: 'id1,sd@n5396b5803dd2/a' phys_path: '/pci@0,0/pci8086,c01@1/pci1734,11e4@0/sd@4,1:a' whole_disk: 0 metaslab_array: 256 metaslab_shift: 33 ashift: 13 asize: 987837759488 is_log: 0 create_txg: 4 features_for_read: com.delphix:hole_birth com.delphix:embedded_data labels = 0 1 2 3 # init 5 && exit updating /platform/i86pc/amd64/boot_archive (CPIO) logout Connection to fuji closed. steven@dell6510:~$ ssh -YXC fuji The illumos Project illumos-6dcbfae4aa April 2021 You have new mail. # zpool import Password: pool: bkp1t id: 4466948378057274312 state: ONLINE status: The pool was last accessed by another system. action: The pool can be imported using its name or numeric identifier and the '-f' flag. see: http://illumos.org/msg/ZFS-8000-EY config: bkp1t ONLINE c10t15d1s0 ONLINE # zdb -l /dev/rdsk/c10t15d1s0 LABEL 0 version: 5000 name: 'bkp1t' state: 0 txg: 26349 pool_guid: 4466948378057274312 errata: 0 hostid: 758768731 hostname: 'Fuji' top
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
I had a similar error when moving some disks around in a case where disks/pools moved from direct-attach SATA to/from a SAS expansion card. The original problem I saw was "invalid vdev configuration" although other cases reported data corruption. You may also want to check /var/adm/messages for errors such as: Dec 23 08:56:57 zbackup zfs: [ID 101897 kern.notice] NOTICE: vdev_disk_open /dev/dsk/c11t0d0s0: update devid from 'id1,sd@SATA_ST40 00VN008-2DR1ZGY7RTPN/a' to 'id1,sd@SATA_ST14000NM001G-2KZL20DAZ9/a' Dec 23 08:56:57 zbackup zfs: [ID 844310 kern.notice] NOTICE: vdev_disk_open /dev/dsk/c11t0d0s0: devid mismatch: id1,sd@SATA_ST4000V N008-2DR1ZGY7RTPN/a != id1,sd@SATA_ST14000NM001G-2KZL20DAZ9/a The problem seems to be caused because the system tries to open your disk under id1,sd@n5396b5803dd2/a, then sees the label pointing to c8t2d0s0, at which point ZFS tries to open *that* disk and stops because it decides that pool is corrupted (not "bkp1t"). Or vice versa on the paths. The solution is to import disks one at a time while making sure no disk is attached at the old connection position. Then export the disks one at a time. Finally attach and re-import everything once the crossed-path disks are cleanly exported. This does seem like a bug, but hopefully not an issue if you export the pool rather than just disconnecting. Hugh. On 4/15/21 5:02 AM, Stephan Althaus wrote: Hello! I have a 1-disk pool which i use only from time to time. Normally i would expect that i can import the pool after installing the disk again, (on 'cold' machine, boot with --reconfigure) the slot is not relevant. Just to check that disk and zfs label are ok, i mounted the pool on a linux machine, everything is ok there. On OI i cant import the pool, the "-f" flag does not help. Details below. Btw, just to be clear, I had this same error before i tried to import the pool with linux, so the import with linux is not the origin of the problem here. Any hints on how to dig into this further are welcome! Thanks! Stephan # zpool import Password: pool: bkp1t id: 4466948378057274312 state: FAULTED status: The pool was last accessed by another system. action: The pool cannot be imported due to damaged devices or data. The pool may be active on another system, but can be imported using the '-f' flag. see: http://illumos.org/msg/ZFS-8000-EY config: bkp1t FAULTED corrupted data c8t2d0s0 UNAVAIL corrupted data # zdb -l /dev/rdsk/c8t2d0s0 LABEL 0 version: 5000 name: 'bkp1t' state: 0 txg: 26349 pool_guid: 4466948378057274312 errata: 0 hostid: 758768731 hostname: 'Fuji' top_guid: 1576464959927753 guid: 1576464959927753 vdev_children: 1 vdev_tree: type: 'disk' id: 0 guid: 1576464959927753 path: '/dev/sda1' devid: 'id1,sd@n5396b5803dd2/a' phys_path: '/pci@0,0/pci8086,c01@1/pci1734,11e4@0/sd@4,1:a' whole_disk: 0 metaslab_array: 256 metaslab_shift: 33 ashift: 13 asize: 987837759488 is_log: 0 create_txg: 4 features_for_read: com.delphix:hole_birth com.delphix:embedded_data labels = 0 1 2 3 ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
On 04/22/21 08:12 PM, Hugh McIntyre wrote: I had a similar error when moving some disks around in a case where disks/pools moved from direct-attach SATA to/from a SAS expansion card. The original problem I saw was "invalid vdev configuration" although other cases reported data corruption. You may also want to check /var/adm/messages for errors such as: Dec 23 08:56:57 zbackup zfs: [ID 101897 kern.notice] NOTICE: vdev_disk_open /dev/dsk/c11t0d0s0: update devid from 'id1,sd@SATA_ST40 00VN008-2DR1ZGY7RTPN/a' to 'id1,sd@SATA_ST14000NM001G-2KZL20DAZ9/a' Dec 23 08:56:57 zbackup zfs: [ID 844310 kern.notice] NOTICE: vdev_disk_open /dev/dsk/c11t0d0s0: devid mismatch: id1,sd@SATA_ST4000V N008-2DR1ZGY7RTPN/a != id1,sd@SATA_ST14000NM001G-2KZL20DAZ9/a The problem seems to be caused because the system tries to open your disk under id1,sd@n5396b5803dd2/a, then sees the label pointing to c8t2d0s0, at which point ZFS tries to open *that* disk and stops because it decides that pool is corrupted (not "bkp1t"). Or vice versa on the paths. The solution is to import disks one at a time while making sure no disk is attached at the old connection position. Then export the disks one at a time. Finally attach and re-import everything once the crossed-path disks are cleanly exported. This does seem like a bug, but hopefully not an issue if you export the pool rather than just disconnecting. Hugh. On 4/15/21 5:02 AM, Stephan Althaus wrote: Hello! I have a 1-disk pool which i use only from time to time. Normally i would expect that i can import the pool after installing the disk again, (on 'cold' machine, boot with --reconfigure) the slot is not relevant. Just to check that disk and zfs label are ok, i mounted the pool on a linux machine, everything is ok there. On OI i cant import the pool, the "-f" flag does not help. Details below. Btw, just to be clear, I had this same error before i tried to import the pool with linux, so the import with linux is not the origin of the problem here. Any hints on how to dig into this further are welcome! Thanks! Stephan # zpool import Password: pool: bkp1t id: 4466948378057274312 state: FAULTED status: The pool was last accessed by another system. action: The pool cannot be imported due to damaged devices or data. The pool may be active on another system, but can be imported using the '-f' flag. see: http://illumos.org/msg/ZFS-8000-EY config: bkp1t FAULTED corrupted data c8t2d0s0 UNAVAIL corrupted data # zdb -l /dev/rdsk/c8t2d0s0 LABEL 0 version: 5000 name: 'bkp1t' state: 0 txg: 26349 pool_guid: 4466948378057274312 errata: 0 hostid: 758768731 hostname: 'Fuji' top_guid: 1576464959927753 guid: 1576464959927753 vdev_children: 1 vdev_tree: type: 'disk' id: 0 guid: 1576464959927753 path: '/dev/sda1' devid: 'id1,sd@n5396b5803dd2/a' phys_path: '/pci@0,0/pci8086,c01@1/pci1734,11e4@0/sd@4,1:a' whole_disk: 0 metaslab_array: 256 metaslab_shift: 33 ashift: 13 asize: 987837759488 is_log: 0 create_txg: 4 features_for_read: com.delphix:hole_birth com.delphix:embedded_data labels = 0 1 2 3 ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss Hello! Thanks for your spending your time! Yes, i am able to import the pool 'tank' when i leave out the disks of 'bkp1t'. The issue is, that the zfs import routine should read the zfs labels on the disks instead on insist on some device path. And in these cases just see if some other disk (that is not part of a successfully imported 'online' pool) has the correct zfs label for the "missing" disk. No? Stephan ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
I ran into this a long time ago trying to set up a ZFS image on a USB drive for a laptop. Ultimately I gave up as it had to be plugged into the "correct" USB port and that seemed to change unpredictably. Reg On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 03:01:03 PM CDT, Stephan Althaus wrote: Hello! Thanks for your spending your time! Yes, i am able to import the pool 'tank' when i leave out the disks of 'bkp1t'. The issue is, that the zfs import routine should read the zfs labels on the disks instead on insist on some device path. And in these cases just see if some other disk (that is not part of a successfully imported 'online' pool) has the correct zfs label for the "missing" disk. No? Stephan ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
On Thu, Apr 22, 2021, at 1:15 PM, Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss wrote: > I ran into this a long time ago trying to set up a ZFS image on a USB > drive for a laptop. Ultimately I gave up as it had to be plugged into > the "correct" USB port and that seemed to change unpredictably. I think this should be OK if you run "zpool export" before unplugging the USB disk. I agree that this may be difficult/impossible for a boot image though since you can't export the rpool while the system is running ... > On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 03:01:03 PM CDT, Stephan Althaus > wrote: > The issue is, that the zfs import routine should read the zfs labels on > the disks instead on insist on some device path. > And in these cases just see if some other disk (that is not part of a > successfully imported 'online' pool) has the correct zfs label for the > "missing" disk. I agree that this seems to be a bug, which could be filed against illumos/zfs. But it may be dangerous to change without a ZFS expert confirming there is not some other case that would break without the current logic. For example there might be complications for systems with multipath IO. In my case it was a lot easier to fix via disk plugging rather than learning how to edit the kernel. FWIW, deleting /etc/zfs/zpool.cache did not fix this, so the problem appears just by reading the paths on disk. Hugh. ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
I do *not* understand why there is any justification for renaming physical interfaces between boots, but I had a demonstration today when a USB port was renamed c1t0d0p0 which had previously been c11t0d0p0. I think we have reached terminal complexity. No one understands the system any longer and so they randomly break things of which they are unaware. Reg On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 08:54:14 PM CDT, wrote: On Thu, Apr 22, 2021, at 1:15 PM, Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss wrote: > I ran into this a long time ago trying to set up a ZFS image on a USB > drive for a laptop. Ultimately I gave up as it had to be plugged into > the "correct" USB port and that seemed to change unpredictably. I think this should be OK if you run "zpool export" before unplugging the USB disk. I agree that this may be difficult/impossible for a boot image though since you can't export the rpool while the system is running ... > On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 03:01:03 PM CDT, Stephan Althaus > wrote: > The issue is, that the zfs import routine should read the zfs labels on > the disks instead on insist on some device path. > And in these cases just see if some other disk (that is not part of a > successfully imported 'online' pool) has the correct zfs label for the > "missing" disk. I agree that this seems to be a bug, which could be filed against illumos/zfs. But it may be dangerous to change without a ZFS expert confirming there is not some other case that would break without the current logic. For example there might be complications for systems with multipath IO. In my case it was a lot easier to fix via disk plugging rather than learning how to edit the kernel. FWIW, deleting /etc/zfs/zpool.cache did not fix this, so the problem appears just by reading the paths on disk. Hugh. ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
On Thu, 22 Apr 2021 at 19:10, Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss wrote: > I do *not* understand why there is any justification for renaming physical > interfaces between boots, but I had a demonstration today when a USB port was > renamed c1t0d0p0 which had previously been c11t0d0p0. > > I think we have reached terminal complexity. No one understands the system > any longer and so they randomly break things of which they are unaware. Your consistent negative hyperbole in these threads is frankly exhausting. We have, today, the best introspection and debugging tools that have existed in the fifty year history of UNIX. The software might not be doing what you want at this minute, in your specific environment, but it absolutely can be understood and fixed. If you want help with something, please try engaging constructively and with some empathy for the people to whom you are sending mail. Demonstrate that you've actually investigated your issue, rather than opening and immediately closing with a fatalistic complaint about how everything is broken and the project is doomed. I don't know what happened with your USB disk having a new device name, but I guarantee that were one to examine what the system was doing, it would be possible to find out. In spite of the negativity, many people have tried to help you in your endeavours in the last few months. On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 08:54:14 PM CDT, wrote: > I think this should be OK if you run "zpool export" before unplugging the USB > disk. I agree that this may be difficult/impossible for a boot image though > since you can't export the rpool while the system is running ... > > On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 03:01:03 PM CDT, Stephan Althaus > > wrote: > > The issue is, that the zfs import routine should read the zfs labels on > > the disks instead on insist on some device path. > > And in these cases just see if some other disk (that is not part of a > > successfully imported 'online' pool) has the correct zfs label for the > > "missing" disk. > > I agree that this seems to be a bug, which could be filed against > illumos/zfs. But it may be dangerous to change without a ZFS expert > confirming there is not some other case that would break without the current > logic. For example there might be complications for systems with multipath > IO. In my case it was a lot easier to fix via disk plugging rather than > learning how to edit the kernel. > > FWIW, deleting /etc/zfs/zpool.cache did not fix this, so the problem appears > just by reading the paths on disk. If the pool is the boot pool, and consists of a single vdev (i.e., not mirrors or raid or stripes) then your situation may have improved as of the integration of: 7119 boot should handle change in physical path to ZFS root devices https://www.illumos.org/issues/7119 The hand-off between the boot loader and the system itself is a complicated affair; in particular it can be hard to determine which firmware-visible block device is equivalent to a particular OS-visible block device. To work around this, the original design for booting from ZFS (and similarly in the cache file mechanism for pools other than the root pool) is that the /devices paths and devids and so on are written in the pool label. Until 7119 was integrated, these cached values were used uncritically and there was no fallback if the /devices path for the root disk had subsequently changed. After 7119, if we cannot find the root disk, we will now attempt to scan all visible block devices looking for a device which appears to contain the correct pool/vdev GUID (a 64-bit ID) that the boot loader told us about, and import that instead. As noted in the ticket this is sufficient to boot from a single disk pool, and has enabled us to create virtual machine images that work under a variety of hypervisors -- the OS just finds the correct path on first boot. I haven't personally tried, but I would hope this might make USB pools work better as well. If not, bugs can be filed and further improvements can of course be made! Cheers. -- Joshua M. Clulow http://blog.sysmgr.org ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
"the inner workings of an operating system so complicated that no one person actually understands all of it" Bryan Cantrill in the Foreword to "Solaris Internals" , McDougall and Mauro, 2nd ed 2007 This is true of any production level OS whether Windows, Linux, BSD or Solaris derived. The FreeBSD kernel is 1.5 million lines of code. I don't even want to know what X and the window managers add. No person can remember that much even if they had time to read all of it. If they did read it all, it would be different by the time they finished. If that doesn't constitute "terminal complexity" I can find no other way to describe the situation. Could I figure out what is going on with the USB naming? Of course, that's how I made my living. But it is time consuming and simply not worth the effort. And might, for valid reasons, not be fixable. My concern is the perception a new user has when they boot an OI release. It should be good. In fact, it is already better than anything else I've tested recently. When programs which appear on the Live Image Desktop crash or icons for installation instructions referenced in the GUI install are missing and have been missing for multiple releases I think it quite reasonable to be concerned and to point out that the *user* community should be more involved in testing release candidates. I have now attempted installs of S11.4, Debian 10.9, 2021.04-rc1, 2020.10, 2017.10, Oracle Linux 8.3 and S10_u11. Of these S11.4 and OL 8.3 succeeded in booting after the install. S10_u11 just informed me that "The disc you inserted is not a Solaris CD/DVD". This is after I selected option 4 from the Solaris 10 install menu so I could install to a ZFS pool, had filled out all the fields and hit F2 to start the installation. Is this a BIOS issue? Or a driver issue? I have no idea. I suspect it's a bit of both as I do not have any documentation for the BIOS settings and this has Intel's ME, TPM and God only knows what else. After a BIOS update, it won't even boot 2021.04-rc1 in single user mode. It goes into maintenance on a login service failure booting from the DVD. I can't even investigate why. It runs Windows 10 and S11.4. The latter is far too much like Windows 10 to suit me. MATE I can live with. Unless I get lucky, this is going back on Monday and I'll get an older machine which is less likely to have driver issues. Reg On Thursday, April 22, 2021, 11:15:13 PM CDT, Joshua M. Clulow wrote: On Thu, 22 Apr 2021 at 19:10, Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss wrote: > I do *not* understand why there is any justification for renaming physical > interfaces between boots, but I had a demonstration today when a USB port was > renamed c1t0d0p0 which had previously been c11t0d0p0. > > I think we have reached terminal complexity. No one understands the system > any longer and so they randomly break things of which they are unaware. Your consistent negative hyperbole in these threads is frankly exhausting. We have, today, the best introspection and debugging tools that have existed in the fifty year history of UNIX. The software might not be doing what you want at this minute, in your specific environment, but it absolutely can be understood and fixed. If you want help with something, please try engaging constructively and with some empathy for the people to whom you are sending mail. Demonstrate that you've actually investigated your issue, rather than opening and immediately closing with a fatalistic complaint about how everything is broken and the project is doomed. I don't know what happened with your USB disk having a new device name, but I guarantee that were one to examine what the system was doing, it would be possible to find out. In spite of the negativity, many people have tried to help you in your endeavours in the last few months. ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
Am 23.04.21 um 19:48 schrieb Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss: "the inner workings of an operating system so complicated that no one person actually understands all of it" Bryan Cantrill in the Foreword to "Solaris Internals" , McDougall and Mauro, 2nd ed 2007 This is true of any production level OS whether Windows, Linux, BSD or Solaris derived. The FreeBSD kernel is 1.5 million lines of code. I don't even want to know what X and the window managers add. No person can remember that much even if they had time to read all of it. If they did read it all, it would be different by the time they finished. If that doesn't constitute "terminal complexity" I can find no other way to describe the situation. Could I figure out what is going on with the USB naming? Of course, that's how I made my living. But it is time consuming and simply not worth the effort. And might, for valid reasons, not be fixable. My concern is the perception a new user has when they boot an OI release. It should be good. In fact, it is already better than anything else I've tested recently. I would be happy if we could fix all the issues. But that would need more volunteers to help fixing bugs and enhancing the current situation. For projects with lots of developers tests with exotic hardware or configurations can be valuable. But OI in fact has problems to keep even simple things up-to-date and it gets worse every day. Complaining about things in this situation is not helpful at all without providing updates or patches that fix things. We know that many things don't work or aren't perfect. But with a single digit number of people submitting PR's to oi-userland you cannot expect more. I am trying to get more people involved for some time now. I am by far more relaxed to merge PR's than former maintainers did because I don't want to alienate the few volunteers who at least try to work on problems and updates. Talking is easy but we need more actions. The echo of my last offer to give interested people a helping hand to get accustomed to our build system was exactly zero. For me we have the strange situation that even people who claim to be maintainers for a software and claim to be OI users don't act even when I tell them that their software is outdated in OI. This is something that irritates me to the bone. Especially when the only reaction is something like "Oh that is surprising. It should be quite easy to update the package!" When programs which appear on the Live Image Desktop crash or icons for installation instructions referenced in the GUI install are missing and have been missing for multiple releases I think it quite reasonable to be concerned and to point out that the *user* community should be more involved in testing release candidates. I have now attempted installs of S11.4, Debian 10.9, 2021.04-rc1, 2020.10, 2017.10, Oracle Linux 8.3 and S10_u11. Of these S11.4 and OL 8.3 succeeded in booting after the install. S10_u11 just informed me that "The disc you inserted is not a Solaris CD/DVD". This is after I selected option 4 from the Solaris 10 install menu so I could install to a ZFS pool, had filled out all the fields and hit F2 to start the installation. Is this a BIOS issue? Or a driver issue? I have no idea. I suspect it's a bit of both as I do not have any documentation for the BIOS settings and this has Intel's ME, TPM and God only knows what else. After a BIOS update, it won't even boot 2021.04-rc1 in single user mode. It goes into maintenance on a login service failure booting from the DVD. I can't even investigate why. It runs Windows 10 and S11.4. The latter is far too much like Windows 10 to suit me. MATE I can live with. Unless I get lucky, this is going back on Monday and I'll get an older machine which is less likely to have driver issues. Reg If you have problems with so many OS's you should rethink your requirements. I would already have changed to a smaller boot disk, eg. a pair of 250GB or 500GB SSD's. There is enough space in the Z820 to add them somewhere and if you don't have enough SATA connectors you could easily add an HBA, eg. a simple LSI SAS HBA. Andreas ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
Re: [OpenIndiana-discuss] zpool import not possible after slot change
On 2021-04-23 11:30, Andreas Wacknitz wrote: Am 23.04.21 um 19:48 schrieb Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss: "the inner workings of an operating system so complicated that no one person actually understands all of it" Bryan Cantrill in the Foreword to "Solaris Internals" , McDougall and Mauro, 2nd ed 2007 This is true of any production level OS whether Windows, Linux, BSD or Solaris derived. The FreeBSD kernel is 1.5 million lines of code. I don't even want to know what X and the window managers add. No person can remember that much even if they had time to read all of it. If they did read it all, it would be different by the time they finished. If that doesn't constitute "terminal complexity" I can find no other way to describe the situation. Could I figure out what is going on with the USB naming? Of course, that's how I made my living. But it is time consuming and simply not worth the effort. And might, for valid reasons, not be fixable. My concern is the perception a new user has when they boot an OI release. It should be good. In fact, it is already better than anything else I've tested recently. I would be happy if we could fix all the issues. But that would need more volunteers to help fixing bugs and enhancing the current situation. For projects with lots of developers tests with exotic hardware or configurations can be valuable. But OI in fact has problems to keep even simple things up-to-date and it gets worse every day. Complaining about things in this situation is not helpful at all without providing updates or patches that fix things. We know that many things don't work or aren't perfect. But with a single digit number of people submitting PR's to oi-userland you cannot expect more. I am trying to get more people involved for some time now. I am by far more relaxed to merge PR's than former maintainers did because I don't want to alienate the few volunteers who at least try to work on problems and updates. Talking is easy but we need more actions. The echo of my last offer to give interested people a helping hand to get accustomed to our build system was exactly zero. Let me take this opportunity to extend you a firm virtual hand shake with a Thank You for that offer. I caught your initial offer, and was more than pleased to see it. As I am near to accepting that offer. But I'm in the middle of a build and image rollout for our hardware upgrade. This is good news for me. As when I'm finished, and all the dust lands. I'll have a surplus of hardware to re-purpose. It is my intent to use it for some serious OI development. My background is BSD. So any help you would be willing to provide to shorten the trajectory, would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks again. Be talking to you soon. ;-) --Chris For me we have the strange situation that even people who claim to be maintainers for a software and claim to be OI users don't act even when I tell them that their software is outdated in OI. This is something that irritates me to the bone. Especially when the only reaction is something like "Oh that is surprising. It should be quite easy to update the package!" When programs which appear on the Live Image Desktop crash or icons for installation instructions referenced in the GUI install are missing and have been missing for multiple releases I think it quite reasonable to be concerned and to point out that the *user* community should be more involved in testing release candidates. I have now attempted installs of S11.4, Debian 10.9, 2021.04-rc1, 2020.10, 2017.10, Oracle Linux 8.3 and S10_u11. Of these S11.4 and OL 8.3 succeeded in booting after the install. S10_u11 just informed me that "The disc you inserted is not a Solaris CD/DVD". This is after I selected option 4 from the Solaris 10 install menu so I could install to a ZFS pool, had filled out all the fields and hit F2 to start the installation. Is this a BIOS issue? Or a driver issue? I have no idea. I suspect it's a bit of both as I do not have any documentation for the BIOS settings and this has Intel's ME, TPM and God only knows what else. After a BIOS update, it won't even boot 2021.04-rc1 in single user mode. It goes into maintenance on a login service failure booting from the DVD. I can't even investigate why. It runs Windows 10 and S11.4. The latter is far too much like Windows 10 to suit me. MATE I can live with. Unless I get lucky, this is going back on Monday and I'll get an older machine which is less likely to have driver issues. Reg If you have problems with so many OS's you should rethink your requirements. I would already have changed to a smaller boot disk, eg. a pair of 250GB or 500GB SSD's. There is enough space in the Z820 to add them somewhere and if you don't have enough SATA connectors you could easily add an HBA, eg. a simple LSI SAS HBA. Andreas ___ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-di
