RE: Seeking opinions
Paul, I know what. . . to prevent whining in the future, suggest creating a hidden file for the rollback tablespace on /u004 and a soft link from the proper location. No wait, don't do that, they might go for it. ;) Mike -Original Message- Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 9:53 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L What happens when you run out of disk space on a mount point? It happened to me. I created a new datafile on another mount point, and then had to hear staff DBAs whining, why is there a rollback segment tablespace file on /u004?, as though it was a major disaster. Really, when people get into this mindset of file A MUST be in directory B, they lose all sight of what they should be doing (ensuring a smoothly running database) and concentrate more on whether every file is in the right place so that they don't have to query the data dictionary. OK, I feel better now. :-) --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had an SA teach me that one, and it's saved me from making a REALLY stupid mistake a number of times. As for your client's standards, I can see why they want to impose standards and that's a good thing. But they are a bit too rigid with it, as others have said, what happens if you run out of disk space on a mount point? I probably have bored most of the people on this list to death with this, but I still believe that the ONLY way to make sure if a datafile is part of the database is to query the database. All you need is one forgetful person who misplaces or misnames a file. Rachel --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Seeking opinions
No failover is involved. And I don't assume that I know the motivation. I know the motivation because I asked. And I have permission to ALTER TABLESPACE because I've been administering Oracle databases since 1987. --- Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Um... It depends on whether those whining staff DBAs are managing a failover environment. If you created that datafile on a file-system in a non-failover (not failover-enabled) volume group, especially when rollback segments are involved, then you've just ensured an un-open-able and un-recoverable database in the event failover should occur. Congratulations! It's not everyone who can do that so easily! If you haven't considered that, then I have to question why you have the permission to ALTER TABLESPACE. Don't assume that you know everybody's motivations... There. I feel even better... :-) - Original Message - To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 7:53 AM What happens when you run out of disk space on a mount point? It happened to me. I created a new datafile on another mount point, and then had to hear staff DBAs whining, why is there a rollback segment tablespace file on /u004?, as though it was a major disaster. Really, when people get into this mindset of file A MUST be in directory B, they lose all sight of what they should be doing (ensuring a smoothly running database) and concentrate more on whether every file is in the right place so that they don't have to query the data dictionary. OK, I feel better now. :-) --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had an SA teach me that one, and it's saved me from making a REALLY stupid mistake a number of times. As for your client's standards, I can see why they want to impose standards and that's a good thing. But they are a bit too rigid with it, as others have said, what happens if you run out of disk space on a mount point? I probably have bored most of the people on this list to death with this, but I still believe that the ONLY way to make sure if a datafile is part of the database is to query the database. All you need is one forgetful person who misplaces or misnames a file. Rachel --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send
Re: Seeking opinions
What happens when you run out of disk space on a mount point? It happened to me. I created a new datafile on another mount point, and then had to hear staff DBAs whining, why is there a rollback segment tablespace file on /u004?, as though it was a major disaster. Really, when people get into this mindset of file A MUST be in directory B, they lose all sight of what they should be doing (ensuring a smoothly running database) and concentrate more on whether every file is in the right place so that they don't have to query the data dictionary. OK, I feel better now. :-) --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had an SA teach me that one, and it's saved me from making a REALLY stupid mistake a number of times. As for your client's standards, I can see why they want to impose standards and that's a good thing. But they are a bit too rigid with it, as others have said, what happens if you run out of disk space on a mount point? I probably have bored most of the people on this list to death with this, but I still believe that the ONLY way to make sure if a datafile is part of the database is to query the database. All you need is one forgetful person who misplaces or misnames a file. Rachel --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego,
Re: Seeking opinions
I'm not disagreeing with you - that's my point in saying look inside the database! --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What happens when you run out of disk space on a mount point? It happened to me. I created a new datafile on another mount point, and then had to hear staff DBAs whining, why is there a rollback segment tablespace file on /u004?, as though it was a major disaster. Really, when people get into this mindset of file A MUST be in directory B, they lose all sight of what they should be doing (ensuring a smoothly running database) and concentrate more on whether every file is in the right place so that they don't have to query the data dictionary. OK, I feel better now. :-) --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had an SA teach me that one, and it's saved me from making a REALLY stupid mistake a number of times. As for your client's standards, I can see why they want to impose standards and that's a good thing. But they are a bit too rigid with it, as others have said, what happens if you run out of disk space on a mount point? I probably have bored most of the people on this list to death with this, but I still believe that the ONLY way to make sure if a datafile is part of the database is to query the database. All you need is one forgetful person who misplaces or misnames a file. Rachel --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do
Re: Seeking opinions
Um... It depends on whether those whining staff DBAs are managing a failover environment. If you created that datafile on a file-system in a non-failover (not failover-enabled) volume group, especially when rollback segments are involved, then you've just ensured an un-open-able and un-recoverable database in the event failover should occur. Congratulations! It's not everyone who can do that so easily! If you haven't considered that, then I have to question why you have the permission to ALTER TABLESPACE. Don't assume that you know everybody's motivations... There. I feel even better... :-) - Original Message - To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 7:53 AM What happens when you run out of disk space on a mount point? It happened to me. I created a new datafile on another mount point, and then had to hear staff DBAs whining, why is there a rollback segment tablespace file on /u004?, as though it was a major disaster. Really, when people get into this mindset of file A MUST be in directory B, they lose all sight of what they should be doing (ensuring a smoothly running database) and concentrate more on whether every file is in the right place so that they don't have to query the data dictionary. OK, I feel better now. :-) --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had an SA teach me that one, and it's saved me from making a REALLY stupid mistake a number of times. As for your client's standards, I can see why they want to impose standards and that's a good thing. But they are a bit too rigid with it, as others have said, what happens if you run out of disk space on a mount point? I probably have bored most of the people on this list to death with this, but I still believe that the ONLY way to make sure if a datafile is part of the database is to query the database. All you need is one forgetful person who misplaces or misnames a file. Rachel --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051
Re: Seeking opinions
On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Seeking opinions
and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Seeking opinions
That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Seeking opinions
I had an SA teach me that one, and it's saved me from making a REALLY stupid mistake a number of times. As for your client's standards, I can see why they want to impose standards and that's a good thing. But they are a bit too rigid with it, as others have said, what happens if you run out of disk space on a mount point? I probably have bored most of the people on this list to death with this, but I still believe that the ONLY way to make sure if a datafile is part of the database is to query the database. All you need is one forgetful person who misplaces or misnames a file. Rachel --- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a great idea. Henceforth I'm going to do the same! Thanks. --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and, on a Unix box, I ALWAYS do an fuser before deleting a file. Just in case. --- Jonathan Gennick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 02 Apr 2002 07:43:34 -0800, you wrote: Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Yeah, naming convention or no, I can't imagine not looking at v$datafile or dba_datafiles just to be sure. Jonathan Gennick --- Brighten the corner where you are mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://Gennick.com * http://MichiganWaterfalls.com * http://ValleySpur.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jonathan Gennick INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Paul, I live under similiar standards. They make sense here becuase, when one looks at the big picture, they need these types of standards to help the DBA's (there are three of them) to cope with the many many Oracle instances across multiple platforms (NT, Sun Unix, Dec Unix). I look at it this way - at least it's a standard - better than no standards at all. Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Hi Paul, How's going? What if someone on the dba group make a mistake (typo or whatever) and put the data file in the wrong place? And other DBAs didn't notice it and work on something. I don't like the idea people assume things will be in the right place because the rule says so. I'd rather trust data dictionary than somethng that has 16 DBA's hands on it. Do they also write they scripts assuming everything is where it should be? Richard Ji -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Ji, Richard INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Great point. I had recently created a DB file and forgot to put the .dbf extension on it. If someone didn't query the DD of the DB first, they might have thought it was a junk/temp file (they would have to ignore the file's timestamp) and deleted it. Rich Jesse System/Database Administrator [EMAIL PROTECTED] Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA -Original Message- From: Ji, Richard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 9:03 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: Seeking opinions Hi Paul, How's going? What if someone on the dba group make a mistake (typo or whatever) and put the data file in the wrong place? And other DBAs didn't notice it and work on something. I don't like the idea people assume things will be in the right place because the rule says so. I'd rather trust data dictionary than somethng that has 16 DBA's hands on it. Do they also write they scripts assuming everything is where it should be? Richard Ji -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jesse, Rich INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Richard, In a busy shop, I would think that there is a *less* chance of a DBA making a mistake if all databases across all platforms conformed to the same directory standard. Can you imagine how long it would take to diagnose and fix a problem if every database was set up to a different standard? Mistakes can happen, but at least with standards, if a file is in the wrong place, it would stand out like a sore thumb. Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:03 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi Paul, How's going? What if someone on the dba group make a mistake (typo or whatever) and put the data file in the wrong place? And other DBAs didn't notice it and work on something. I don't like the idea people assume things will be in the right place because the rule says so. I'd rather trust data dictionary than somethng that has 16 DBA's hands on it. Do they also write they scripts assuming everything is where it should be? Richard Ji -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Ji, Richard INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
It sounds to me that whoever architected this approach really didn't understand the idea of metadata and the flexibility that OFA provides in terms of tuning (I'm not limited to specific disks because I have customer data) and performance. My 2 cents... RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:03 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi Paul, How's going? What if someone on the dba group make a mistake (typo or whatever) and put the data file in the wrong place? And other DBAs didn't notice it and work on something. I don't like the idea people assume things will be in the right place because the rule says so. I'd rather trust data dictionary than somethng that has 16 DBA's hands on it. Do they also write they scripts assuming everything is where it should be? Richard Ji -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Ji, Richard INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Freeman, Robert INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
This is hogwash. OFA perfectly helps to separate the datafiles from different database instances. We run well over 300+ Oracle databases here and the ONLY extension we have to OFA is that I add a /data /control and /redo directory to the file systems for just a little extra protection from possible inode corruption. RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 7:38 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Paul, I live under similiar standards. They make sense here becuase, when one looks at the big picture, they need these types of standards to help the DBA's (there are three of them) to cope with the many many Oracle instances across multiple platforms (NT, Sun Unix, Dec Unix). I look at it this way - at least it's a standard - better than no standards at all. Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Freeman, Robert INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Robert, What part of what I said is hogwash. The part about the DBA's wanting similiar structures across all machine types, or the part about having standards? Huh? Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:58 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is hogwash. OFA perfectly helps to separate the datafiles from different database instances. We run well over 300+ Oracle databases here and the ONLY extension we have to OFA is that I add a /data /control and /redo directory to the file systems for just a little extra protection from possible inode corruption. RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 7:38 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Paul, I live under similiar standards. They make sense here becuase, when one looks at the big picture, they need these types of standards to help the DBA's (there are three of them) to cope with the many many Oracle instances across multiple platforms (NT, Sun Unix, Dec Unix). I look at it this way - at least it's a standard - better than no standards at all. Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Freeman, Robert INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from
RE: Seeking opinions
Tom, I am not oppositting the idea of standard. I implement OFA and other stuff, and everywhere I go the first I do is establish standards. The problem is even with standard in place one should not assume everything will be in place as is should be. Which is the problem I see as Paul described. People are relying on standard more than data dictionary. And like you said when a file is in the wrong place it will stand out like a sore thumb. But the bigger question is what will the other 15 DBAs do about it? If they trust the standard so much they will think it shouldn't be there and without querying data dictionary to confirm it some one might go ahead and delete it. And yes the chance are very small but I don't like to risk it. Richard -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:49 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Richard, In a busy shop, I would think that there is a *less* chance of a DBA making a mistake if all databases across all platforms conformed to the same directory standard. Can you imagine how long it would take to diagnose and fix a problem if every database was set up to a different standard? Mistakes can happen, but at least with standards, if a file is in the wrong place, it would stand out like a sore thumb. Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:03 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi Paul, How's going? What if someone on the dba group make a mistake (typo or whatever) and put the data file in the wrong place? And other DBAs didn't notice it and work on something. I don't like the idea people assume things will be in the right place because the rule says so. I'd rather trust data dictionary than somethng that has 16 DBA's hands on it. Do they also write they scripts assuming everything is where it should be? Richard Ji -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Ji, Richard INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line
RE: Seeking opinions
My apologies, I was reading the post *REALLY* fast (on my way to my daily deluge of meetings) and mis-read what you said completely. Upon re-reading, I agree 100% with what you said about standards. Again, removing foot from mouth. RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 11:29 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Robert, What part of what I said is hogwash. The part about the DBA's wanting similiar structures across all machine types, or the part about having standards? Huh? Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:58 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is hogwash. OFA perfectly helps to separate the datafiles from different database instances. We run well over 300+ Oracle databases here and the ONLY extension we have to OFA is that I add a /data /control and /redo directory to the file systems for just a little extra protection from possible inode corruption. RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 7:38 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Paul, I live under similiar standards. They make sense here becuase, when one looks at the big picture, they need these types of standards to help the DBA's (there are three of them) to cope with the many many Oracle instances across multiple platforms (NT, Sun Unix, Dec Unix). I look at it this way - at least it's a standard - better than no standards at all. Tom Mercadante Oracle Certified Professional -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mercadante, Thomas F INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Freeman, Robert INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the
RE: Seeking opinions
I agree. I think that some people don't understand OFA's intentions. First of all, it _is_ a standard, meant to provide great flexibility. The reason mount points are to be named in a generic fashion is to allow any type of file to reside on them. Any number of file types can happily coexist under their own appropriately named subdirectories. Under OFA, database files can be easily identified by ls /u???/oradata/$ORACLE_SID; the file name ought to include the name of the tablespace to which the file belongs. Richard's point about a file that gets misnamed is well-taken. The only identification of datafiles that matters is the data dictionary. Rely on anything else and you're asking for trouble. Thanks to all for their comments. --- Freeman, Robert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It sounds to me that whoever architected this approach really didn't understand the idea of metadata and the flexibility that OFA provides in terms of tuning (I'm not limited to specific disks because I have customer data) and performance. My 2 cents... = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Robert, Tell me a little more about potential for inode corruption and how this helps? Never heard of that one before. I stick it all in /x/oradata/$ORACLE_SID and distinguish my files by .dbf, .ctl, .arc and .rdo. Also are yall mostly Oracle or are you running anything else? - Ethan -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 9:58 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is hogwash. OFA perfectly helps to separate the datafiles from different database instances. We run well over 300+ Oracle databases here and the ONLY extension we have to OFA is that I add a /data /control and /redo directory to the file systems for just a little extra protection from possible inode corruption. RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Post, Ethan INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
To me, there is a potential problem with having the software, administrative files (init.ora, etc), and database files all under one tree. Has no one else needed to do an rm -r in an admin or datafile directory to delete an old database? While there is a certain level of trust that must be given to SAs and DBAs, I try to prevent human error -- especially when that human is me! If our datafiles all reside under the /oracle directory (under several mountpoints) while the software and admin directories are under another, it becomes that much more difficult to accidentally mangle files unintentionally. And all this aside, Oracle doesn't support OFA in any way on OpenVMS. Trying to implement it there is an excersize in futility. And cause for excessive beer consumption. :) Rich Jesse System/Database Administrator [EMAIL PROTECTED] Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA -Original Message- From: Paul Baumgartel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 11:14 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: Seeking opinions I agree. I think that some people don't understand OFA's intentions. First of all, it _is_ a standard, meant to provide great flexibility. The reason mount points are to be named in a generic fashion is to allow any type of file to reside on them. Any number of file types can happily coexist under their own appropriately named subdirectories. Under OFA, database files can be easily identified by ls /u???/oradata/$ORACLE_SID; the file name ought to include the name of the tablespace to which the file belongs. Richard's point about a file that gets misnamed is well-taken. The only identification of datafiles that matters is the data dictionary. Rely on anything else and you're asking for trouble. Thanks to all for their comments. -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jesse, Rich INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Seeking opinions
Paul Baumgartel wrote: Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Paul, Your story reminds me of a shell script I have seen which was the pride of its author and was 'fully configurable'. There was a configuration file containing assignments to about 200 variables, including those which could have been derived from others, and the great majority of which was used only once. There is a fine line between extreme logic and insanity, and wanting to regulate anything down to the most minute detail is a sure recipe for pushing people to trespass the rules. My guess is that some day space will be lacking under /a001 or /a002, or that, because of a failing batch, the rollback/undo tablespace will be massively increased, past the then current capacity of /u004. This will probably end up with soft links, and that's when one will discover that the 'find' statements in the script lack '-follow'. The road to hell ... -- Regards, Stephane Faroult Oriole Software -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Stephane Faroult INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Could any of you please summarize all the points once the discussion is over. Thanks, Ashoke -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 11:14 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L I agree. I think that some people don't understand OFA's intentions. First of all, it _is_ a standard, meant to provide great flexibility. The reason mount points are to be named in a generic fashion is to allow any type of file to reside on them. Any number of file types can happily coexist under their own appropriately named subdirectories. Under OFA, database files can be easily identified by ls /u???/oradata/$ORACLE_SID; the file name ought to include the name of the tablespace to which the file belongs. Richard's point about a file that gets misnamed is well-taken. The only identification of datafiles that matters is the data dictionary. Rely on anything else and you're asking for trouble. Thanks to all for their comments. --- Freeman, Robert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It sounds to me that whoever architected this approach really didn't understand the idea of metadata and the flexibility that OFA provides in terms of tuning (I'm not limited to specific disks because I have customer data) and performance. My 2 cents... = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Mandal, Ashoke INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
It's been a while since I've been an admin guy but let me try... Every file, directory, etc... on a file system is represented by an inode on the file system. Think of an inode (in a simple term) as another file or a pointer if you will. It contains information on that structure (rights, who owns it, the time stamp for the file, and so on...) The data block addresses that are assigned to the file are contained in the inode. The OS then uses the inode to locate the file or directory and to store information on the file or directory. It is possible for that inode to become corrupted (e.g. system crash) and I've seen 2 cases of it in the 15 years I've been doing this (both on SCO Unix). File systems that journal seem to be safer, and I've never seen it happen on such a file system but that doesn't mean it can't happen!. I've read cases of OS bugs on earlier AIX versions that could cause Inode corruption in specific cases, but I've never experienced the problem in AIX or SUN. Corruption of an inode can lead to loss of directories or data files, and therefore I like to limit the size of directories based on a number of factors, such as MTTR one directory, the SLA that I have with the customer and so on. So, by keeping my redo, control files and datafiles in separate dirs under /u0x, I reduce the likelihood of inode corruption a bit, but it is still there in the form of /u0x or the other directories falling below it. HTH RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 1:18 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Robert, Tell me a little more about potential for inode corruption and how this helps? Never heard of that one before. I stick it all in /x/oradata/$ORACLE_SID and distinguish my files by .dbf, .ctl, .arc and .rdo. Also are yall mostly Oracle or are you running anything else? - Ethan -Original Message- Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 9:58 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is hogwash. OFA perfectly helps to separate the datafiles from different database instances. We run well over 300+ Oracle databases here and the ONLY extension we have to OFA is that I add a /data /control and /redo directory to the file systems for just a little extra protection from possible inode corruption. RF Robert G. Freeman - Oracle8i OCP Oracle DBA Technical Lead CSX Midtier Database Administration The Cigarette Smoking Man: Anyone who can appease a man's conscience can take his freedom away from him. -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Post, Ethan INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Freeman, Robert INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Seeking opinions
Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
Mama always said, Anal is as anal does... --Forrest Gump PS -- You're right. They're not. -Original Message- From: Paul Baumgartel [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 4:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: Seeking opinions Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Seeking opinions
There is no major differences in your opinions/ideas here. Just think about it as enforcing a naming conventions. It's nice to have but hopefully it will last when one mount point gets filled or slow and some files need to be created/moved somewhere else violating the defined standards. So come with a standard that is doable short/long term. Regards, Waleed -Original Message- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 5:48 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Thanks, = Paul Baumgartel, Adept Computer Associates, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Paul Baumgartel INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Khedr, Waleed INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Seeking opinions
-- Paul Baumgartel [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 04/01/02 14:48:23 -0800 Hi everyone. I'm currently working at a client where the OFA standard has been (as they put it) taken to the next level. I disagree with their approach, and I'd be interested to see what list members think. The client believes that any DBA (there are about 16 on staff) should be able to locate data files in any database without querying the data. To this end, mount points are named both /unnn (e.g., /u001) and /annn (e.g., /a001). System datafiles (system, temp, rollback tablespaces) go only on the /unnn mount points, and in particular, datafiles for certain tablespaces must go on certain mount points--for instance rollback tablespace files always go on /u004. User datafiles are allowed on /a001 and /a002, tables and indexes, respectively. To my mind, this standard changes the Optimal Flexible Architecture to the Sub-optimal Inflexible Architecture, and all just to avoid a data dictionary query. What do you think? Well, since Oracle's suggested u01 is so COMPLETELY descriptive, I can't imagine changing it. Using anything so confusing as the name of a database, instance or project as the mount point or including things like index, rollback, tablespace or log is also pretty meaningless (unless of course someone does an ls to see them). If you're willing to dump Oracle's suggested confusion, separating the files out by mount point makes sense on most systems since it allows better control over the locatioin of data files and less hassle growing logical volumes [unless, of course, you use Oracle's suggested hardware raw volumes for all storage]. If the direcories fit under some heirarchy that reflects the overall database orginization that certianly helps. If the layout looks like /instancename/general_use or /oracle/general_use/instance_specific_use.dbf you can figure out most of it rather quickly: a single instance can be clocked via ls -Rl /instancename in one or the overall health of a multi-instance server can be clocked via ls -Rl /oracle/ or ls -Rl /oracle/index (for example). Trick is naming things in ways that reflect what's under the directory and giving the flat files names that have something to do with what they're used for. -- Steven Lembark 2930 W. Palmer Workhorse Computing Chicago, IL 60647 +1 800 762 1582 -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
