re: nine months

[Barry MacGregor]

 
dear all,
as an avid reader of this list I thought I would let you know that I too 
posted a note to the nine months website.  I find them quite irresponsible 
with the information they provide on breastfeeding.  As a student midwife 
with a primigravida longitudinal study and girlfriend having her first baby I am 
beginning to become aware how influential these sites are.
 
On a brighter side I have had the pleasure of meeting a couple who planned 
a home birth with a private midwife.  Unfortunately, things did not go to 
plan and the baby was born in hospital.  However, this mum told me how 
"empowered" and "strong" she felt after having her baby in her position of 
choice and without any drugs or intervention.
Finally, I have had the opportunity to meet one of these marvellous 
women.
 
Sonja

Re: ACMI and Johnson's.

[Jackie Mawson]

Title: Re: ACMI and Johnson's.



I will "listen out" for the radio adverts with great interest.

I think it was 94.5FM. Not a bad ad’ really. I was just curious.
BB Jackie.

Borders talk

[Pinky McKay]

I will be speaking at Borders Bookstore/ Chadstone 
about "Parenting By Heart" at 2 pm Sunday 17 Feb, in the childrens 
section
No Charge.
Pinky
www.pinky-mychild.com
 

ACMI/Johnson and Johnson

[louise johnson]

I was amazed when I heard the radio ad. weeks ago
especially as this sort of advertising was discussed
recently on the uk midwifery list and condemned - in
their midwives Conduct code apparently it says to
ensure that your reg. status (as a midwife) is not
used in the promotion of commercial products or
services.. 

what does it say here?

Louise

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nine months

[Pinky McKay]

Below is a copy of the letter I have just sent to 
nine months -it is tricky getting the info into their little feedback box and 
actually reading/ formatting what you write.
Pinky
 
 
I am dismayed to find a site that aims to provide 
parents with education, not only offers apologetic information about the 
advantages of breastfeeding, (you say, Breastfeeding is THOUGHT to protect...) 
but you also present breastfeeding as a LIFESTYLE choice, rather like making a 
simple choice between types of prams, for instance.Parents deserve evidence 
based information, not wishy washy biased views that imply such rubbish as 
bottle feeding will reduce sibling rivalry, for instance -how do you rationalise 
this? A breastfeeding mother has a spare hand to deal with another child, and 
surely the baby's health is her first priority. While you have some 
good information about the physiology of breastfeding, advising scheduling of 
feeds is not best practice and in fact has been associated with failure to 
thrive.
 
 Feedback from parents and professionals to my 
own book "Parenting By Heart" (Lothian 2001) shows that such pressure is not 
only detrimental to infant health but erodes parental confidence as parents 
strive to make their babies fit both predetemined schedules and their own 
unrealistic expectations.  I am certainly amazed at your claim that 
your informaton is provided by experts -you dont even supply profiles or namesof 
these "experts".
 
 I have added quotes that dispute your 
information as follows:
 
 
 
Most midwives (REALLY??) suggest that you avoid the 
“snacking and catnapping”. This will only make more work for yourself. (WHY?? 
-breast milk is readily available and humans are biologically a 'carrying', not 
a 'caching' species)Try to extend the time between feeds to at least three hours 
calculated from the time of the first feed to the time of the subsequent feed. 
Adjusting to this schedule may take two or three days. You may wish to record 
the times on paper until you reach your goal of six to eight feeds.(Babies 
dont share these GOALS - why are you advocating outcomes focussed  
management of human infants? -they are  PEOPLE NOT OBJECTS)
 
(BABIES NEED TO DOUBLE THIR BIRTHWEIGHT IN FIVE TO 
SIX MONTHS< AND TRIPLE IT IN A YEAR>When you compare a baby’s needs to 
an adult’s (who is generally not trying to gain weight – at least not to double 
or triple their current size!), it is easy to understand that expecting a baby 
to eat according to an imposed regime, is not only unrealistic, but downright 
abusive. It is also, therefore, easy to understand how such regimes, which 
restrict the duration and amount of feeds, contribute to ‘failure to thrive’. 
Consider: how often do you eat, drink, nibble, snack, or sip through an average 
day? As adults, we eat and drink according to our own body signals, not a 
predetermined schedule – and so should babies. In fact, the average need of a 
baby is to feed EIGHT TO TEN times a day, and up to TWELVE TO FOURTEEN 
times  a day during growth spurts!
 
Another reason to feed according to baby's cues is 
that babies increase their need to feed if they are 'coming down with something' 
- this is because the transfer of saliva to breast increases the production of 
antibodies to the impending illness,as well as offering comfort).
 
  Night feeding If you keep your baby’s 
feeds regular in the daytime, it is likely that you will need to feed only once 
before 5am. By about eight weeks, a night time feed can be as quick as 12 -15 
minutes from the time you get out of bed to when you return. Many babies sleep 
from 6pm to 2am. (AT EIGHT WEEKS THIS IS AB UNREALISTIC EXPECTATION AND MAY 
REDUCE SOME MOTHERS MILK SUPPLY)Waking a baby at 10pm seems to make no 
difference.(STUDIES SHOW THAT A FOCUSSED FEED AT 10-PM IN FACT DOES MAKE A 
DIFFERENCE (Pinillla t, and Birch LL. reported in Paediatrics,1993 ) Breastfed 
babies in this study and a copy done last year did sleep a five hour stretch 
(considered ALL night in infant sleep research) 
 
 When a baby starts solids at four 
months,
 
(THE RECOMMENDED STARTING TIME FOR SOLIDS (WHO) IS 
SIX MONTHS). it is likely the 2am feed will not be necessary. 
(UNREALISTIC EXPECTATIONS ONLY SERVE TO MAKE MOTHERS FEEL INADEQUATE _WHO IS 
FEEDING TO SCHEDULES (2AM??)ANYWAY?)During a night time feed, it is best not 
to turn the light on. Instead use a nightlight and avoid eye contact. Babies 
have a capacity to manipulate within the first few weeks.  (BABIES 
HAVE NO CAPACITY TO MANIPULATE IN THE FIRST FEW WEEKS _AT THIS TIME THE GOAL 
SHOULD BE TO DEVELOP TRUST BETWEEN INFANT AND PARENT _EYE CONTACT IS THE VERY 
BASIS OF TRUST _HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT PEOPLE WHO AVOID EYE CONTACT??? WHY 
CONFUSE A BABY BY CHANGING PARENTING STYLES AT NIGHT _ YES BEING QUIET IS 
SENSIBLE BUT AVOIDING EYE CONTACT IS CRUEL AND A FORM OF REJECTION AT ANY 
TIME)
 
Babies and parents deserve better than this.I 
am sorry I will not be recommending your

Re: ninemonths

[Jo Slamen]

Almost (but not quite) feeling sorry for ninemonths.  Thanks for the
referral Barb, just sent the following off to them for something to think
on:

Dear ninemonths,

Another article of concern to me appears on your web site.  It was my
understanding that demand feeding is recommended nowadays to maintain milk
supply and allow for individual differences in mother's and babies.  It is
concerning that some of the material on breastfeeding on your site seems to
be a little outdated, paying just a little lipservice to the flip side of
the coin.  I have known of a number of mothers whose milk supply has
literally drained away as they tried to 'teach' their infants to feed when
mother wants to rather than when baby dictates.  This has caused
considerable distress to the parents in many instances, as they wished to
continue with breastfeeding.  I am surprised to find an Australian site
seeming to be as out of touch with our current understanding of the basic
mechanics of breastfeeding physiology.  Please have a look at this link from
a US web site, which also deals with scheduling breastfeeds.  You will find
an interesting counterpoint to your own material
http://www.parentsplace.com/features/primer/qas/0,10338,258693_106101,00.htm
l

Regards,

Jo Slamen

- Original Message -
From: "barbara glare & chris bright" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Ozmidwifery" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 2:58 AM
Subject: ninemonths


> Hi, Another page from ninemonths to raise your blood pressure
>
> "Only feed your
> baby 3-4 hourly (newborn) otherwise it gets into the habit of "snacking
and
> cat napping".
> "Most midwives suggest that you avoid the "snacking and catnapping". This
> will only make more work for yourself. Try to extend the time between
feeds
> to at least three hours calculated from the time of the first feed to the
> time of the subsequent feed. Adjusting to this schedule may take two or
> three days. You may wish to record the times on paper until you reach your
> goal of six to eight feeds.
> If you keep your baby's feeds regular in the daytime, it is likely that
you
> will need to feed only once before 5am. By about eight weeks, a night time
> feed can be as quick as 12 -15 minutes from the time you get out of bed to
> when you return. Many babies sleep from 6pm to 2am. Waking a baby at 10pm
> seems to make no difference. When a baby starts solids at
> four months, it is likely the 2am feed will not be necessary.
>  "
>
>
http://www.ninemonths.com.au/content_page_1.asp?page_id=72&main_menu_id=5&l1
> _id=3&l2_id=6
>
>
> Barb
>
> --
> This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> Visit  to subscribe or unsubscribe.
>

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RE: aboriginal birthing customs

[Davey, Rebecca]

Erika

I did some work around setting up a Koori Midwifery Service in the ACT a
couple of years ago and got a few reports from state/territory health
departments which included great background on different communities
birthing customs (and regaining control over these customs).  From memory
the NT had a fantastic report, and so did Victoria I think.  I do have these
in hard copy at home which I could forward to you if you can't get on to the
relevant people in those Departments.  

However, the best information will come from the local Aboriginal Medical
Service.  They'll be able to put you in touch with the local
midwives/traditional birth attendants, who could point you in the right
direction.

Rebecca

-Original Message-
From: daryl and erika munton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, 12 February 2002 9:47
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: aboriginal birthing customs


I am interested to find out more about how the aboriginal women birth.  
What is their culture and customs around birth and journey to motherhood?

Twice a group of women from my church have done a cultural exchange with 
the women from Yuendemu N.T and there is a chance this will happen again 
in a year.  The possibility of actually going on this trip myself one 
day has inspired me to better understand the women I hope to meet one 
day.  I dont know if there are rules of do's and don't as far as me 
asking them myself.   Occasionally the Yuendemu women visit us but so 
far I have felt unsure about what to say and what is respectful.

Erika Munton

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Re: ACMI and Johnson's.

[Lois Wattis]

Title: ACMI and Johnson's.



P.S.   They also sponsor 
"Australian Midwife of the Year" award.  Love Lois

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jackie Mawson 
  To: Ozmidwifery List 
  Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 12:18 
  PM
  Subject: ACMI and Johnson's.
  I just heard an ad, on FM radio, 
  presented by the ACMI President, who is also a midwife it stated, re caring 
  for your babies skin – especially when it has blemishes. The ad’ was brought 
  to ‘us’ by Johnson’s. Do they sponsor the ACMI?Birthing 
  Beautifully,Jackie Mawson.Convenor of Birthrites: Healing After 
  Caesarean Inc.Visit our Website at: http://www.birthrites.orgEmail: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]Please note I am not a Professional Healthcare 
  Provider, and all opinions given in this email are not to be taken as medical, 
  or legal, advice. Please seek such advice from the relevant professional 
  service.Email me your postal details for a FREE copy of our quarterly 
  magazine, if you live within Australia - Overseas postage costs are above 
  budget, sorry!Too many 
  Gods;so 
  many 
  creeds,Too 
  many 
  paths that 
  wind 
  and wind,When 
  just the 
  art of 
  being 
  kind Is 
  all the 
  sad  world 
  needs...-- 

Re: ACMI and Johnson's.

[Lois Wattis]

Title: ACMI and Johnson's.



Jackie - the answer to your question 
is -  YES.  The ACMI's publication "Australian Midwifery News" 
has a mention of J & J on every second page "proudly sponsored by Johnson 
& Johnson Professional and Educational Service - Health Care for 
Life".  I will "listen out" for the radio adverts with great 
interest.    Kind regards, Lois 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jackie Mawson 
  To: Ozmidwifery List 
  Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 12:18 
  PM
  Subject: ACMI and Johnson's.
  I just heard an ad, on FM radio, 
  presented by the ACMI President, who is also a midwife it stated, re caring 
  for your babies skin – especially when it has blemishes. The ad’ was brought 
  to ‘us’ by Johnson’s. Do they sponsor the ACMI?Birthing 
  Beautifully,Jackie Mawson.Convenor of Birthrites: Healing After 
  Caesarean Inc.Visit our Website at: http://www.birthrites.orgEmail: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]Please note I am not a Professional Healthcare 
  Provider, and all opinions given in this email are not to be taken as medical, 
  or legal, advice. Please seek such advice from the relevant professional 
  service.Email me your postal details for a FREE copy of our quarterly 
  magazine, if you live within Australia - Overseas postage costs are above 
  budget, sorry!Too many 
  Gods;so 
  many 
  creeds,Too 
  many 
  paths that 
  wind 
  and wind,When 
  just the 
  art of 
  being 
  kind Is 
  all the 
  sad  world 
  needs...-- 

NINE MONTHS

[Pinky McKay]

Where do they find babies like THAT! maybe they 
arent mothers??
I am about to write to them 
Pinky

ACMI and Johnson's.

[Jackie Mawson]

Title: ACMI and Johnson's.



I just heard an ad, on FM radio, presented by the ACMI President, who is also a midwife it stated, re caring for your babies skin – especially when it has blemishes. The ad’ was brought to ‘us’ by Johnson’s. Do they sponsor the ACMI?

Birthing Beautifully,
Jackie Mawson.

Convenor of Birthrites: Healing After Caesarean Inc.
Visit our Website at: http://www.birthrites.org
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Please note I am not a Professional Healthcare Provider, and all opinions given in this email are not to be taken as medical, or legal, advice. Please seek such advice from the relevant professional service.

Email me your postal details for a FREE copy of our quarterly magazine, if you live within Australia - Overseas postage costs are above budget, sorry!

Too many Gods;
so many creeds,
Too many paths
 that wind and
 wind,
When just the art
 of being kind
 Is all the sad
  world needs...
-- 

ninemonths

[barbara glare & chris bright]

Hi, Another page from ninemonths to raise your blood pressure

"Only feed your
baby 3-4 hourly (newborn) otherwise it gets into the habit of "snacking and
cat napping".
"Most midwives suggest that you avoid the "snacking and catnapping". This
will only make more work for yourself. Try to extend the time between feeds
to at least three hours calculated from the time of the first feed to the
time of the subsequent feed. Adjusting to this schedule may take two or
three days. You may wish to record the times on paper until you reach your
goal of six to eight feeds.
If you keep your baby's feeds regular in the daytime, it is likely that you
will need to feed only once before 5am. By about eight weeks, a night time
feed can be as quick as 12 -15 minutes from the time you get out of bed to
when you return. Many babies sleep from 6pm to 2am. Waking a baby at 10pm
seems to make no difference. When a baby starts solids at
four months, it is likely the 2am feed will not be necessary.
 "

http://www.ninemonths.com.au/content_page_1.asp?page_id=72&main_menu_id=5&l1
_id=3&l2_id=6


Barb

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Re: VBAC

[Jackie Mawson]

> Would you
> replace the word attempted with planned?

Oops! No problems, Lynne. And congratulations on such a fantastic VBAC
success rate within your birthing unit.

Birthing Beautifully,
Jackie Mawson.

Convenor of Birthrites: Healing After Caesarean Inc.
Visit our Website at: http://www.birthrites.org
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Please note I am not a Professional Healthcare Provider, and all opinions
given in this email are not to be taken as medical, or legal, advice. Please
seek such advice from the relevant professional service.

Email me your postal details for a FREE copy of our quarterly magazine, if
you live within Australia - Overseas postage costs are above budget, sorry!

Too many Gods;
so many creeds,
Too many paths
 that wind and
 wind,
When just the art
 of being kind
 Is all the sad
  world needs...
--


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Fw: TIME!

[Rhonda]

  
  

   
   
  Time Goes On Believe it or 
  not but 8.02pm on February 20 this year will be a historic moment in time. 
  It will not be marked by the 
  chiming of any clocks or the ringing of bells, but at that precise time, 
  on that specific date, something will happen which has not occurred for 
  1,001 years and will never happen again. As the clock 
  ticks over from 8.01pm on Wednesday, February 20, time will, for sixty 
  seconds only, read in perfect symmetry 2002, 2002, 2002, 
  or to be more precise - 20:02, 
  20/02, 2002. This historic event will never have 
  the same poignancy as the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month 
  which marks Armistice Day, but it is an event which has only ever happened 
  once before, and is something which will never be repeated. 
  The last occasion that time read in 
  such a symmetrical pattern was long before the days of the digital watch 
  and the 24-hour clock - at 10.01am on January 10, 1001. 
  And because the clock only goes up 
  to 23.59, it is something that will never happen again. 
  
  

  


  
  
    IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - 
Click 
Here

ninemonths

[Pinky McKay]

Love your letters girls!
They must be wondering what has struck them.Shall 
we give them a daily dose?
Pinky