Hi Brent, there is some convergence happening via
http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php *" Let's get some cool people together and live in a tribe / family / team / intentional community. Experiment with better ways to live, and make the world a cooler place. We'll work together to survive and look after each other. "* Email : http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php/email_list /// Further approaches can be discussed there ? On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Michel Bauwens <mic...@p2pfoundation.net>wrote: > hi Brent, I have aggregated the wide variety of open business models at > http://p2pfoundation.net/Category:Business_Models > > not only are there solutions, but there are plenty of solutions, the key > question is of course finding the one that fits with your particular > project ... > > but the general scheme, building a community around a commons, and create > a market entity around it (such as a coop), works well > > Michel > > > On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Brent Shambaugh < > brent.shamba...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hi All, >> >> Since around mid-march or so I've spent time trying to refining the ideas >> from my Distributed Economy blog ( >> http://www.adistributedeconomy.blogspot.com/) into a proposal. I kind of >> felt like I was teaching myself all of computer science. Even though I felt >> I was learning quite a bit, it came at a considerable cost to myself. It is >> hard to think in a peer-to-peer fashion while questioning the fabric of >> academia and industry. I felt that I did not fit in anywhere and was unsure >> build a business model around it. Physically, it seemed that way too. I >> also became very cynical. I grew isolated, but thought I needed time for >> self-study so what I was writing was credible, competitive and lucid enough >> that I could put faith in it to be confident with others. Still, it's scope >> was huge, enough to be not taken seriously by itself I guess. I felt I >> basically was trying to change the operating system of the planet, and >> everything else was built on top of that (businesses, academia, etc...). >> Was the value network the business model? That, and maybe support? Do I >> just try to start something like Linux and hope for the best? That's the >> sort of scale I was envisioning. Fortunately, the web efforts have done a >> lot of the groundwork. It's more of a use then. It's hard to say I did much >> beyond understanding and some aggregation of connections that others might >> not have seen. People tell you to hold on to some things in private, while >> at the same time you want to integrate with the rest of the community. >> Maybe what I have is significant, maybe it is not. It would be great to >> share it. I believe enough in it to think it could help people. I'm almost >> done with what seems to resemble a 20 page outline. I do not want to >> fragment the community (or be fragmented from it), but at the same time I >> need some sustainable way to survive. Paradoxically, it seems it needs the >> support and the efforts and the ideas of the community to succeed. Are >> there any solutions? I'm sorry if I come off as arrogant in any way. >> >> -Brent >> >> >> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:50 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson < >> dante.mon...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Thanks Eric >>> >>> Yes, I'd be glad to follow up on the thinking and research you are doing >>> around metacurrency, and participate in the scheduled hang out. >>> >>> further note : >>> an interesting reply by June on this thread, >>> also available on the public p2pf list archive >>> >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org/ >>> >>> >>> - [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is >>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks >>> !<http://www.mail-archive.com/p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org/msg01085.html> >>> Dante-Gabryell Monson >>> - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is >>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks >>> !<http://www.mail-archive.com/p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org/msg01087.html> >>> June Gorman >>> - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is >>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks >>> !<http://www.mail-archive.com/p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org/msg01088.html> >>> Dante-Gabryell Monson >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:43 PM, Eric Harris-Braun <e...@harris-braun.com >>> > wrote: >>> >>>> Hi All, >>>> >>>> It turns out that where the technical side of the MetaCurrency Project >>>> has led us has lots to do with Semantic Data or rather, from our point of >>>> view, Semantic Computing. Ceptr, the computing stack we are designing to >>>> build our tools out of, pushes Semantics down into the lowest levels of the >>>> stack, in a way that we haven't seen with the approaches inherent embodied >>>> in RDF/URI. >>>> >>>> For folks interested in our approach, I'm scheduling a tech hang-out in >>>> the next week or two. If you want to be notified of it please drop me a >>>> line. >>>> >>>> -Eric >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:51 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson < >>>> dante.mon...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> *pre-note : I try to understand if we can , possibly collectively, * >>>>> *write an article that could be published on the p2pfoundation blog,* >>>>> *as to better explain, in words and with images / graphics , * >>>>> *some of the potentials of building on, for example, Linked Data - >>>>> and/or similar technologies enabling us to more easily redefine our >>>>> realities collectively -* >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> *If anyone wrote on these topics, or is interested in combining our >>>>> efforts and research in writing about these topics, or if some can help in >>>>> making such article in a enjoyable reading moment ( combining it with nice >>>>> imagery and stories ? Like some science fiction authors manage to do - yet >>>>> talking about the present ? ) it would be great. I mean, not only about >>>>> one specific application or project, but about the potential to work >>>>> together on various applications based on common protocols. * >>>>> >>>>> *Some call it a "Global Brain" , or a "Web Operating System" , ... * >>>>> >>>>> *Below is what I want to say to open up the topics for now ... I am >>>>> open to brainstorm further, and progressively collectively organize an >>>>> easier to understand blog post, or series of blog posts, on such topics.* >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Thanks Bob, Thanks Helene, >>>>> >>>>> for your replies. >>>>> >>>>> I sent this message initially motivated by the realization, after an >>>>> email exchange with Michel. >>>>> >>>>> Michel pointed that in his view there seemed to be little interest >>>>> regarding Linked Data / Semantic Web approaches on p2pf related forums. >>>>> >>>>> So I wondered if this was really the case, and if so, what could be >>>>> the reason, >>>>> and how could it be better communicated. >>>>> >>>>> Possibly showing how different projects may have an interest in using >>>>> such technologies in their research and development of applications, >>>>> showing overlap of different applications that want to embody such >>>>> technologies, >>>>> and overlap and re-use of the data generated by each of these >>>>> applications to enable yet new applications. >>>>> >>>>> For example, Bob in collaboration with Sensorica for Open Value >>>>> Network tools... >>>>> >>>>> Although the technologies can be re-used and adapted for a variety of >>>>> applications, >>>>> hence Netention ( mostly Seth coding for now ) researching approaches, >>>>> and inviting others into such research and development, which hopefully >>>>> can >>>>> be re-used for Open Value Networks, or for alternative forms of learning >>>>> building on available information on our wiki's , etc >>>>> >>>>> Other projects, such as metamaps, are also interested ( or already >>>>> including ) such approaches ... >>>>> >>>>> Pavlik was already talking about FOAF ( one aspect / approach using >>>>> Linked Data concepts ) many years ago. I now notice Pavlik is regaining >>>>> interest, including in Schema and Json , ... midst others, in support of >>>>> Sharing Economy applications ? >>>>> >>>>> /// >>>>> >>>>> But in a larger sense, I feel it is about contributing to the >>>>> development of remedies regarding Anoptism ( which Olivier talks about , >>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Anoptism , while facilitating at first >>>>> Holoptism ) >>>>> >>>>> In the understanding which I developed by interacting with Seth and >>>>> others via lists such as "Global Survival >>>>> List"<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/global-survival> >>>>> , >>>>> >>>>> such Web 3.0 approaches get us closer to the concept of " Noosphere " >>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noosphere >>>>> >>>>> Or should I be already speaking of Web 4.0 , since I can notice a >>>>> convergence with artificial intelligence. >>>>> >>>>> See : >>>>> >>>>> http://novaspivack.typepad.com/RadarNetworksTowardsAWebOS.jpg >>>>> ( and another graph about internet evolution >>>>> http://www.didael.it/sito/evoluzione_web.htm , also calling some >>>>> phases we have technologies for and for which we need more collaboration >>>>> in >>>>> research to reduce the threshold for its usage , "the metaweb" >>>>> http://koolaidantidote.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/metaweb_graph.gif ) >>>>> >>>>> Emergent Collective Consciousness, Approaches to Collective >>>>> Intelligence, to Emergent forms of Networked Political Economies, ... >>>>> >>>>> and can be combined with , for example, understanding in the field of >>>>> Artificial Intelligence. ( could be interesting to refer to the Global >>>>> Brain Institute ? http://globalbraininstitute.org/ ) >>>>> >>>>> There are so many implications regarding decision making, >>>>> collaboration and collective intelligence, learning, resource allocation , >>>>> and even finance... >>>>> >>>>> I see a lot of parallels between the potentials of Linked Data >>>>> approaches, >>>>> and the spirit of the Meta Currency project. >>>>> >>>>> Although there are indeed different potential approaches and >>>>> technologies, >>>>> and hopefully we can choose inter-operable ones. >>>>> >>>>> There are series of existing Ontologies. RDF Schema being one >>>>> approach which seems to be receiving wider acceptance. >>>>> There is also the use of Json. >>>>> >>>>> Then there is the potential combination between Folksonomies and >>>>> Ontologies, into Folksontologies... And I did not even mention other >>>>> interesting approaches ( slightly different then the W3C approach ? ) , >>>>> such as that of Pierre Levy >>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_L%C3%A9vy and IEML >>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Information_Economy_Meta_Language >>>>> >>>>> At least in spirit, in my understanding of it. - for each application, >>>>> various combinations of technologies may been considered, >>>>> >>>>> yet I see potential in enabling inter-operable formats, and data that >>>>> can be re-used along compatible data graph approaches... >>>>> >>>>> How can this best be explained with imagery that anyone could >>>>> understand, >>>>> and beyond any one specific project ? Enable the imagery of a new >>>>> way of creating and using data... re-using such data, enabling us to >>>>> contextualize and choose the ( political and economic ) "games" we play >>>>> based on such contextualization layers ? >>>>> >>>>> Enabling us to interact with others, and across various applications, >>>>> beyond any proprietary approaches, and beyond any social silos... >>>>> >>>>> Yet at the same time, enabling "machines" to understand ... >>>>> >>>>> Opening up whole new dimensions in terms of what seems to be widely >>>>> called "The Internet of >>>>> Things"<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_of_Things> / >>>>> Spimes <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spime> , including in support of >>>>> the Sharing Economy, or better still in my view, A Contribution Economy >>>>> based on Peer Production in support of the Commons. >>>>> >>>>> That this can be enabled by experimenting further with various >>>>> existing modules and protocols... reducing threshold for their usage, >>>>> reducing the threshold for generating data together, reducing the >>>>> threshold >>>>> for organizing ourselves using such data ... >>>>> >>>>> There are many more themes this relates to. >>>>> >>>>> For example, Architecture - Urbanism, etc >>>>> ( such as Modular Parametric Design , based on Lego Like components >>>>> that can easily be re-assembled ? ) >>>>> >>>>> There are also many risks - and in my view, a need to think how we can >>>>> be ahead of understanding the technology, to avoid it being used to trap >>>>> us >>>>> in it - and instead use it to liberate and empower us. >>>>> >>>>> Please feel free to correct me where you see fit, complement views, >>>>> give your own perceptions, etc >>>>> >>>>> There is existing code from various projects for such kind of "Web >>>>> 4.0" browsing - there has been already a lot of research. >>>>> >>>>> In my view, one of the main challenges now, is to get people to work >>>>> together on open sourced code and libre licenses, >>>>> >>>>> for developing inter-operable tools using such open protocols... >>>>> >>>>> Making the various interfaces easier to understand and use... >>>>> >>>>> But first, in my view, we need to see if people grasp these concepts, >>>>> and understand that these potentials are very real and are current - and >>>>> we >>>>> can participate in their development, and hopefully soon benefit from its >>>>> potentials. >>>>> >>>>> Also, there is funding available - for those of us who are good with >>>>> funding applications - and can enable access to such larger partnerships >>>>> -, >>>>> willing to contribute to the work of programmers, or willing to motivate >>>>> programmers to converge around a commons oriented approach - >>>>> >>>>> see : http://fisa.future-internet.eu/index.php/FIA_Research_Roadmap >>>>> >>>>> http://cordis.europa.eu/fp7/ict/ssai/fp8preparations_en.html >>>>> >>>>> Note : There are also all kinds of existing video materials that can >>>>> be used to illustrate such concepts... I am willing to bring them >>>>> together. Those who can do video editing, I d be interested in >>>>> supporting >>>>> research for creating a new video document too, in addition to blog >>>>> articles. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Forwarded conversation >>>>> >>>>> Subject: Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is >>>>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks ! >>>>> ------------------------ >>>>> >>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.mon...@gmail.com> >>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:50 AM >>>>> To: p2p-foundation <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> What would be your answer ? ( reply on this list or in private to me ) >>>>> >>>>> *A ) Interested in ( getting to know more about ) its potentials* >>>>> *B ) Not interested* >>>>> >>>>> and >>>>> >>>>> *1 ) Never heard of Linked Data >>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data>* >>>>> *2 ) Know about it* >>>>> *3 ) Actively researching Linked Data >>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data> applications ( in support of >>>>> p2p >>>>> 4 commons ? )* >>>>> >>>>> ( or whatever other replies you wish to give ) >>>>> >>>>> // >>>>> >>>>> Context of my question : >>>>> >>>>> Michel noted that in his view Linked Data has not been a topic with >>>>> much interest on the p2pf related forums. >>>>> >>>>> I wish to understand if this is simply because not many of us know >>>>> about Linked Data, and its potentials ? >>>>> >>>>> Or is it simply because it seemed too complex or technical to bring it >>>>> up on this specific list ? >>>>> >>>>> I know some of us are working on Linked Data applications, >>>>> including in support of Sharing Economy applications. >>>>> >>>>> I personally have been interested in some of its applications for a >>>>> few years, without being a programmer. I collaborated with a programmer >>>>> over the last years, to explore some of the approaches that can be taken >>>>> to >>>>> create certain applications. >>>>> >>>>> /// >>>>> >>>>> The first aim I have with this email is to have some kind of quick , >>>>> hopefully sufficiently representative set of replies. It does not have to >>>>> be on the public list - you can also reply to me in private if you like. >>>>> >>>>> From there on, I wish to open up another thread to further explain >>>>> what Linked Data can be used for with those of us who may have explored >>>>> the >>>>> topic and may see potential in supporting such research as to manifest >>>>> them >>>>> into certain applications, in support of , for example, p2p commons >>>>> oriented political economies. >>>>> >>>>> Cordially, >>>>> Dante >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ---------- >>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.mon...@gmail.com> >>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:56 AM >>>>> To: Connor Turland <connorturl...@gmail.com>, Bob Haugen < >>>>> bob.hau...@gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshap...@gmail.com>, >>>>> Benjamin Brownell <solaur...@gmail.com>, Arthur Brock < >>>>> artbr...@geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <e...@harris-braun.com>, " >>>>> m...@larky.org" <m...@larky.org>, elf Pavlik < >>>>> perpetual-trip...@wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenes...@gmail.com>, S >>>>> H <seh...@gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinid...@gmail.com> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> sent this to p2pf list ... >>>>> Cordially, Dante >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ---------- >>>>> From: *Helene Finidori* <hfinid...@gmail.com> >>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 9:33 AM >>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.mon...@gmail.com> >>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <connorturl...@gmail.com>, Bob Haugen < >>>>> bob.hau...@gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshap...@gmail.com>, >>>>> Benjamin Brownell <solaur...@gmail.com>, Arthur Brock < >>>>> artbr...@geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <e...@harris-braun.com>, " >>>>> m...@larky.org" <m...@larky.org>, elf Pavlik < >>>>> perpetual-trip...@wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenes...@gmail.com>, S >>>>> H <seh...@gmail.com> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Good idea. >>>>> >>>>> Wasn't this what we were trying to do at the Ouishare labs camp last >>>>> May? Find ways to de-silo-ize the web, enable interoperability and info to >>>>> 'find each other' based on people's (agent's') intentions and capacities? >>>>> >>>>> It would indeed be interesting to 'package' the 'value proposition' a >>>>> bit :) in a compact and direct 'aha that's what I could use it for , or >>>>> that's how it could concretely benefit society' generating way. And yes, >>>>> create a collective... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ---------- >>>>> From: *Bob Haugen* <bob.hau...@gmail.com> >>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 10:03 AM >>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.mon...@gmail.com> >>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <connorturl...@gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro < >>>>> ishanshap...@gmail.com>, Benjamin Brownell <solaur...@gmail.com>, >>>>> Arthur Brock <artbr...@geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun < >>>>> e...@harris-braun.com>, "m...@larky.org" <m...@larky.org>, elf Pavlik < >>>>> perpetual-trip...@wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenes...@gmail.com>, S >>>>> H <seh...@gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinid...@gmail.com> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We are doing some of what Linked Data requires: providing >>>>> derefenceable URIs for all objects. Most have them now; all will have >>>>> them eventually. >>>>> >>>>> We are not currently using or investigating RDF. We are starting to >>>>> offer JSON as a serialization format, which so far is the only format >>>>> that has been requested. Would happily learn and use RDF if needed. >>>>> We also plan to offer value streams (like activity streams but of >>>>> value-creating and using activities). The pace of offerings depends >>>>> on somebody wanting to use them. >>>>> >>>>> ---------- >>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.mon...@gmail.com> >>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 4:35 PM >>>>> To: Helene Finidori <hfinid...@gmail.com> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ... while at the same time enabling people to understand that this is >>>>> a research project, >>>>> >>>>> that we do not have ready products, and that people are invited to >>>>> contribute to make such visions into reality... including via their own >>>>> projects, >>>>> >>>>> using standardized modules and/or offering frameworks people can >>>>> re-use for their own purposes... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> P2P Foundation - Mailing list >>> http://www.p2pfoundation.net >>> https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation >>> >>> >> > > > -- > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net > > <http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation>Updates: > http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens > > #82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/ >
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