Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

On Nov 6, 2007, at 11:54 PM, ilya .d wrote:

> On Tue, Nov 06, 2007 at 09:34:46PM -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner  
> wrote:
>> Hmm, would be worth trying. I looked around quickly, it's not obvious
>> what is drawing it...
>>
>> .hc
>>
> not it is obvious actually, that's just form Tk.

I don't think Tk puts that border there since windoes in the Wish.app  
don't have it.

.hc


> -- 
> ilya .d
>>
>
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Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[ilya .d]

On Tue, Nov 06, 2007 at 09:34:46PM -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> Hmm, would be worth trying. I looked around quickly, it's not obvious  
> what is drawing it...
> 
> .hc
> 
not it is obvious actually, that's just form Tk.
-- 
ilya .d 
> 


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Re: [PD] 3 1/2 shaders help!

[vade]

ok, thats what I thought, so its not only an issue with sampler2DRect.

Thanks for clarifying.

On Nov 6, 2007, at 9:39 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> well, as soon as you try to use gl_MultiTexCoord1, it does not work
> anymore. I think using gl_MultiTexCoord0 sometimes works, even with
> images of different sizes, but for example the lumaglyph does not work
> without gl_MultiTexCoord1. I don't know how the information can be
> passed from gemstate.
> marius.
>
> vade wrote:
>> if that is the issue, then it should (?) work for sampler2D and
>> texture2D, but I thought we had tested that the other night at the
>> Patching Circle and found it to not work?
>>
>> ill write a simple shader shortly using square textures as inputs  
>> and we
>> can test the theory out.
>>
>>
>> On Nov 6, 2007, at 9:13 PM, marius schebella wrote:
>>
>>> yes, I was referring to cyrille's mail
>>> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2007-07/052026.html
>>> but that is already included in the current version.
>>> also, this mail seems to be related to the problem
>>> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/gem-dev/2007-08/002873.html
>>> marius.
>>>
>>> vade wrote:
 Hi.

 I was working a bit with Marius on porting the shaders, and would  
 love
 to figure out the issues with multitexturing with GLSL programs.  
 If a
 developer (chris?) would be kind enough to point me in the right
 direction...

 Marius mentioned an email a while ago pointing out a typo in a  
 GEM c
 file. Reports indicated that fixing this typo resolved  
 multitexturing
 issues. Marius checked the latest GEM builds included with Extended
 (0.4.xxx), which do include the fix for the typo (i rather than 1),
 however neither of us seem to be making any leeway wrt  
 multitexturing.

 Id love any pointers.

 Thanks,

 On Nov 4, 2007, at 7:38 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> hey,
> I was working on shaders recently and put some stuff online
> http://www.parasitaere-kapazitaeten.net/Pd/4shaders
> shader #3 is the most advanced, uses a normal map texture.
> but I am still running into problems when using multiple  
> shaders. the
> problem (again) is, that gl_MultiTexCoords1 does not get the  
> correct
> values passed from GEM.
> so the 4th shader should use two images of different sizes, but  
> I only
> got it working very rudimentary. If anyone can help me with  
> this, it
> would solve a very big problem! (chris?)
> Thanks to vade so far for his support!
> marius.
>
> ___
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>>>
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Re: [PD] 3 1/2 shaders help!

[marius schebella]

well, as soon as you try to use gl_MultiTexCoord1, it does not work 
anymore. I think using gl_MultiTexCoord0 sometimes works, even with 
images of different sizes, but for example the lumaglyph does not work 
without gl_MultiTexCoord1. I don't know how the information can be 
passed from gemstate.
marius.

vade wrote:
> if that is the issue, then it should (?) work for sampler2D and 
> texture2D, but I thought we had tested that the other night at the 
> Patching Circle and found it to not work?
> 
> ill write a simple shader shortly using square textures as inputs and we 
> can test the theory out.
> 
> 
> On Nov 6, 2007, at 9:13 PM, marius schebella wrote:
> 
>> yes, I was referring to cyrille's mail
>> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2007-07/052026.html
>> but that is already included in the current version.
>> also, this mail seems to be related to the problem
>> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/gem-dev/2007-08/002873.html
>> marius.
>>
>> vade wrote:
>>> Hi.
>>>
>>> I was working a bit with Marius on porting the shaders, and would love
>>> to figure out the issues with multitexturing with GLSL programs. If a
>>> developer (chris?) would be kind enough to point me in the right
>>> direction...
>>>
>>> Marius mentioned an email a while ago pointing out a typo in a GEM c
>>> file. Reports indicated that fixing this typo resolved multitexturing
>>> issues. Marius checked the latest GEM builds included with Extended
>>> (0.4.xxx), which do include the fix for the typo (i rather than 1),
>>> however neither of us seem to be making any leeway wrt multitexturing.
>>>
>>> Id love any pointers.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> On Nov 4, 2007, at 7:38 PM, marius schebella wrote:
>>>
 hey,
 I was working on shaders recently and put some stuff online
 http://www.parasitaere-kapazitaeten.net/Pd/4shaders
 shader #3 is the most advanced, uses a normal map texture.
 but I am still running into problems when using multiple shaders. the
 problem (again) is, that gl_MultiTexCoords1 does not get the correct
 values passed from GEM.
 so the 4th shader should use two images of different sizes, but I only
 got it working very rudimentary. If anyone can help me with this, it
 would solve a very big problem! (chris?)
 Thanks to vade so far for his support!
 marius.

 ___
 PD-list@iem.at mailing list
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 http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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> 


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Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

On Nov 6, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote:

> On Tue, 2007-11-06 at 20:45 -0500, vade wrote:
>> May I make one humble suggestion?
>>
>> Is it possible to remove the GIANT 3 PIXEL BLACK BORDER around the
>> edges of a selected patcher window on OS X? Its highly distracting  
>> and
>> really ruins the improved aesthetic  (and work) of the newer PD
>> extended nightlies.
>
>
> personally i would like to have also the 1px border in linux removed.
> there is already a border from the wm, i don't see a need for another
> one.
>
> roman


Hmm, would be worth trying. I looked around quickly, it's not obvious  
what is drawing it...

.hc


>
>
>
>
>   
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Re: [PD] 3 1/2 shaders help!

[vade]

if that is the issue, then it should (?) work for sampler2D and  
texture2D, but I thought we had tested that the other night at the  
Patching Circle and found it to not work?

ill write a simple shader shortly using square textures as inputs and  
we can test the theory out.


On Nov 6, 2007, at 9:13 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> yes, I was referring to cyrille's mail
> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2007-07/052026.html
> but that is already included in the current version.
> also, this mail seems to be related to the problem
> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/gem-dev/2007-08/002873.html
> marius.
>
> vade wrote:
>> Hi.
>>
>> I was working a bit with Marius on porting the shaders, and would  
>> love
>> to figure out the issues with multitexturing with GLSL programs. If a
>> developer (chris?) would be kind enough to point me in the right
>> direction...
>>
>> Marius mentioned an email a while ago pointing out a typo in a GEM c
>> file. Reports indicated that fixing this typo resolved multitexturing
>> issues. Marius checked the latest GEM builds included with Extended
>> (0.4.xxx), which do include the fix for the typo (i rather than 1),
>> however neither of us seem to be making any leeway wrt  
>> multitexturing.
>>
>> Id love any pointers.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> On Nov 4, 2007, at 7:38 PM, marius schebella wrote:
>>
>>> hey,
>>> I was working on shaders recently and put some stuff online
>>> http://www.parasitaere-kapazitaeten.net/Pd/4shaders
>>> shader #3 is the most advanced, uses a normal map texture.
>>> but I am still running into problems when using multiple shaders.  
>>> the
>>> problem (again) is, that gl_MultiTexCoords1 does not get the correct
>>> values passed from GEM.
>>> so the 4th shader should use two images of different sizes, but I  
>>> only
>>> got it working very rudimentary. If anyone can help me with this, it
>>> would solve a very big problem! (chris?)
>>> Thanks to vade so far for his support!
>>> marius.
>>>
>>> ___
>>> PD-list@iem.at mailing list
>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management ->
>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: [PD] no focus for gemwin on os x 10.5

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

I don't think anyone really knows, that's the problem.  It's not  
related to compiling.  You need use Rez to somehow install the mac.r  
file.  You can see the exact command in packages/darwin_app/Makefile  
but beyond that I don't really know.

Apple usually has decent docs, it just takes some digging :)

.hc

On Nov 6, 2007, at 7:32 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> I am not sure what I should do with that information, is this  
> related to compiling?
> marius.
>
> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
>>  From your Mac command line, type "man Rez".  It is a util that  
>> comes with the XCode developer tools.
>> http://www.hmug.org/man/1/Rez.php
>> The file that Jamie made is here:
>> http://pure-data.cvs.sourceforge.net/pure-data/packages/darwin_app/ 
>> mac.r
>> This might be relevant:
>> http://lists.apple.com/archives/xcode-users/2007/Jul/msg00475.html
>> .hc
>> On Nov 6, 2007, at 7:12 PM, marius schebella wrote:
>>> what is Rez?
>>> this problem is even more annoying than the two other bugs  
>>> (pix_alpha
>>> and multiTexture) I posted. If someone wants to teach me how to fix
>>> this, then I would go for it!
>>> marius.
>>>
>>> chris clepper wrote:
 It's pd and not GEM that takes care of the window focus.  Maybe  
 Rez no
 longers works on 10.5?

 On 11/4/07, marius schebella <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> hi,
> somehow gemwin does not take the focus anymore with the newest  
> release
> of the highly praised OS X. when I click on it, it just stays  
> in the
> back. I can't move it. also, topmost 1 does not work.
> anything else I can try? I am using gem 0.91 from cvs (oct 26).
> marius.
>
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>>>
>>>
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>> - 
>> --- I have the audacity to believe that peoples everywhere can  
>> have three meals a day for their bodies, education and culture for  
>> their minds, and dignity, equality and freedom for their  
>> spirits.  - Martin Luther King, Jr.




 


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Re: [PD] 3 1/2 shaders help!

[marius schebella]

yes, I was referring to cyrille's mail
http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2007-07/052026.html
but that is already included in the current version.
also, this mail seems to be related to the problem
http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/gem-dev/2007-08/002873.html
marius.

vade wrote:
> Hi.
> 
> I was working a bit with Marius on porting the shaders, and would love 
> to figure out the issues with multitexturing with GLSL programs. If a 
> developer (chris?) would be kind enough to point me in the right 
> direction...
> 
> Marius mentioned an email a while ago pointing out a typo in a GEM c 
> file. Reports indicated that fixing this typo resolved multitexturing 
> issues. Marius checked the latest GEM builds included with Extended 
> (0.4.xxx), which do include the fix for the typo (i rather than 1), 
> however neither of us seem to be making any leeway wrt multitexturing.
> 
> Id love any pointers.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> On Nov 4, 2007, at 7:38 PM, marius schebella wrote:
> 
>> hey,
>> I was working on shaders recently and put some stuff online
>> http://www.parasitaere-kapazitaeten.net/Pd/4shaders
>> shader #3 is the most advanced, uses a normal map texture.
>> but I am still running into problems when using multiple shaders. the
>> problem (again) is, that gl_MultiTexCoords1 does not get the correct
>> values passed from GEM.
>> so the 4th shader should use two images of different sizes, but I only
>> got it working very rudimentary. If anyone can help me with this, it
>> would solve a very big problem! (chris?)
>> Thanks to vade so far for his support!
>> marius.
>>
>> ___
>> PD-list@iem.at mailing list
>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
> 
> 


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Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[Roman Haefeli]

On Tue, 2007-11-06 at 20:45 -0500, vade wrote:
> May I make one humble suggestion?
> 
> Is it possible to remove the GIANT 3 PIXEL BLACK BORDER around the  
> edges of a selected patcher window on OS X? Its highly distracting and  
> really ruins the improved aesthetic  (and work) of the newer PD  
> extended nightlies.


personally i would like to have also the 1px border in linux removed.
there is already a border from the wm, i don't see a need for another
one.

roman





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Re: [PD] 3 1/2 shaders help!

[vade]

Hi.

I was working a bit with Marius on porting the shaders, and would love  
to figure out the issues with multitexturing with GLSL programs. If a  
developer (chris?) would be kind enough to point me in the right  
direction...

Marius mentioned an email a while ago pointing out a typo in a GEM c  
file. Reports indicated that fixing this typo resolved multitexturing  
issues. Marius checked the latest GEM builds included with Extended  
(0.4.xxx), which do include the fix for the typo (i rather than 1),  
however neither of us seem to be making any leeway wrt multitexturing.

Id love any pointers.

Thanks,

On Nov 4, 2007, at 7:38 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> hey,
> I was working on shaders recently and put some stuff online
> http://www.parasitaere-kapazitaeten.net/Pd/4shaders
> shader #3 is the most advanced, uses a normal map texture.
> but I am still running into problems when using multiple shaders. the
> problem (again) is, that gl_MultiTexCoords1 does not get the correct
> values passed from GEM.
> so the 4th shader should use two images of different sizes, but I only
> got it working very rudimentary. If anyone can help me with this, it
> would solve a very big problem! (chris?)
> Thanks to vade so far for his support!
> marius.
>
> ___
> PD-list@iem.at mailing list
> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list


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Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[vade]

May I make one humble suggestion?

Is it possible to remove the GIANT 3 PIXEL BLACK BORDER around the  
edges of a selected patcher window on OS X? Its highly distracting and  
really ruins the improved aesthetic  (and work) of the newer PD  
extended nightlies.

Thank you,



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Re: [PD] controlled vibrato

[Charles Henry]

>The curve won't have a continuous derivative, which may sound weird if the
>curve is played slow enough. If ever your solution is not sufficient, it
>might be better to try to come up with the integral of some continuous
>function, but it may be a bit hard to make it align with the desired
>frequencies.

>for wide vibratos, it's also important to ask yourself which scale you
>want to work in: linear vs logarithmic sound different for any
>sufficiently wide vibrato.


> [osc~  vibrato_rate]
> |
> [expr~ ($v1>0)*$f2*$v1+($v1<0)*$f3*$v1]

how about?
 [expr~ ($v1+1)/2*$f3*$v1-($v1-1)/2*$f2*$v1]

It's cheap/quick, but it has the continuous 1st derivative you
mentioned...  I just tried it and it sounds alright doesn't do
anything too weird/unexpected :)  Also, it doesn't change the location
of the zeros, or otherwise affect the duty cycle of the thing.
The two parts ($v1+1)/2 and -($v1-1)/2 are just mixing functions that
always add up to 1.  There's probably lots of variations that would
work as well or better, while still being continuous.

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Re: [PD] no focus for gemwin on os x 10.5

[marius schebella]

I am not sure what I should do with that information, is this related to 
compiling?
marius.

Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> 
>  From your Mac command line, type "man Rez".  It is a util that comes 
> with the XCode developer tools.
> 
> http://www.hmug.org/man/1/Rez.php
> 
> The file that Jamie made is here:
> 
> http://pure-data.cvs.sourceforge.net/pure-data/packages/darwin_app/mac.r
> 
> This might be relevant:
> 
> http://lists.apple.com/archives/xcode-users/2007/Jul/msg00475.html
> 
> .hc
> 
> On Nov 6, 2007, at 7:12 PM, marius schebella wrote:
> 
>> what is Rez?
>> this problem is even more annoying than the two other bugs (pix_alpha
>> and multiTexture) I posted. If someone wants to teach me how to fix
>> this, then I would go for it!
>> marius.
>>
>> chris clepper wrote:
>>> It's pd and not GEM that takes care of the window focus.  Maybe Rez no
>>> longers works on 10.5?
>>>
>>> On 11/4/07, marius schebella <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 hi,
 somehow gemwin does not take the focus anymore with the newest release
 of the highly praised OS X. when I click on it, it just stays in the
 back. I can't move it. also, topmost 1 does not work.
 anything else I can try? I am using gem 0.91 from cvs (oct 26).
 marius.

 ___
 PD-list@iem.at mailing list
 UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management ->
 http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

>>>
>>
>>
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> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> I have the audacity to believe that peoples everywhere can have three 
> meals a day for their bodies, education and culture for their minds, and 
> dignity, equality and freedom for their spirits.  - Martin Luther 
> King, Jr.
> 
> 
> 


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Re: [PD] no focus for gemwin on os x 10.5

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

 From your Mac command line, type "man Rez".  It is a util that comes  
with the XCode developer tools.

http://www.hmug.org/man/1/Rez.php

The file that Jamie made is here:

http://pure-data.cvs.sourceforge.net/pure-data/packages/darwin_app/mac.r

This might be relevant:

http://lists.apple.com/archives/xcode-users/2007/Jul/msg00475.html

.hc

On Nov 6, 2007, at 7:12 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> what is Rez?
> this problem is even more annoying than the two other bugs (pix_alpha
> and multiTexture) I posted. If someone wants to teach me how to fix
> this, then I would go for it!
> marius.
>
> chris clepper wrote:
>> It's pd and not GEM that takes care of the window focus.  Maybe  
>> Rez no
>> longers works on 10.5?
>>
>> On 11/4/07, marius schebella <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> hi,
>>> somehow gemwin does not take the focus anymore with the newest  
>>> release
>>> of the highly praised OS X. when I click on it, it just stays in the
>>> back. I can't move it. also, topmost 1 does not work.
>>> anything else I can try? I am using gem 0.91 from cvs (oct 26).
>>> marius.
>>>
>>> ___
>>> PD-list@iem.at mailing list
>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management ->
>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
>>>
>>
>
>
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I have the audacity to believe that peoples everywhere can have three  
meals a day for their bodies, education and culture for their minds,  
and dignity, equality and freedom for their spirits.  - Martin  
Luther King, Jr.



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Re: [PD] no focus for gemwin on os x 10.5

[marius schebella]

what is Rez?
this problem is even more annoying than the two other bugs (pix_alpha 
and multiTexture) I posted. If someone wants to teach me how to fix 
this, then I would go for it!
marius.

chris clepper wrote:
> It's pd and not GEM that takes care of the window focus.  Maybe Rez no
> longers works on 10.5?
> 
> On 11/4/07, marius schebella <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> hi,
>> somehow gemwin does not take the focus anymore with the newest release
>> of the highly praised OS X. when I click on it, it just stays in the
>> back. I can't move it. also, topmost 1 does not work.
>> anything else I can try? I am using gem 0.91 from cvs (oct 26).
>> marius.
>>
>> ___
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>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
>>
> 


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Re: [PD] a patch closing itself

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

That patch requires user intervention (Close this Patch? Yes/no).   
This crashes Pd-0.40-2:

[bang(
|
[; bind2.pd menuclose 1(

No prompt = crash.

.hc

On Nov 6, 2007, at 2:44 PM, Enrique Erne wrote:

> oh, i wasn't aware that there are other differences
>
> [bng] <- click here
> |
> [;
> bind2.pd menuclose 0(
>
> does crash Pd-0.40.3-extended-20071026
>
> doesn't crash Pd-0.40-2
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> eni
>
>
> On Nov 6, 2007, at 6:44 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
>
>>
>> This patch crashes on Pd-0.40-2 on Mac OS X:
>>
>> 
>> I think the bug is that if it is triggered by user clicks, it  
>> works fine, but if it is triggered in a patch, then it crashes.
>>
>> .hc
>>
>> On Nov 6, 2007, at 3:58 AM, Enrique Erne wrote:
>>
>>> menuclose from within a patch crashes extended but it works in  
>>> vanilla pd.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Die Nov  6  4:24 , marius schebella  sent:
>>>
 I think that causes pd to crash. you have to send the message to  
 some
 parent patch, together with the name of the patch, that should be
 closed, and do the menuclose from there with a dalay 0.
 marius.

 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> I just thought of a very useful reason to be able to use  
> [menuclose
> ( to close the current patch.  If we replace things like the find
> panel, preferences, etc with pd patches, then they should be  
> able to
> close themselves so you can do things like bind Return/Enter to  
> "OK"
> and Esc to "Cancel".
>
> Has anyone found a way to do this?
>
> .hc
>
> -- 
> --
> 
>
> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all  
> others of
> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power  
> called an
> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he  
> keeps
> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself  
> into
> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess
> himself of it.- Thomas Jefferson
>
>
>
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>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> - 
>> ---
>>
>> Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how  
>> to realize his wishes.  Now that he can realize them, he must  
>> either change them, or perish.-William Carlos Williams
>>
>>



 


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Re: [PD] FFTease Universal Binaries anywhere?

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

On Nov 6, 2007, at 4:41 PM, Steffen Juul wrote:

>
> On 06/11/2007, at 22.15, Thomas Grill wrote:
>
>> Steffen Juul schrieb:
>>> On 06/11/2007, at 19.43, Batuhan Bozkurt wrote:
>>>
>>>
 And I guess their sources are not available too.

>>>
>>> The source is in the CVS repo in externals/grill/fftease/
>>>
>> Not really i should remove it to avoid misunderstandings.
>> The fftease port in the pd cvs is old and incomplete.
>
> Ah, thanks for clarifying, Thomas. I'm sorry, Batuhan, i didn't know
> that and didn't check carefully but assumed it was the FFTease i was
> looking at in the Pd CVS repo.
>
> Then, with out the source, i guess your best luck is to contact Erik
> directly.

A while back, he expressed interest in adding fftease to pd- 
extended.  He was added as a developer to the CVS, but I don't think  
he's worked on it at all.  Try nagging him a bit :)

.hc


 


I have the audacity to believe that peoples everywhere can have three  
meals a day for their bodies, education and culture for their minds,  
and dignity, equality and freedom for their spirits.  - Martin  
Luther King, Jr.



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Re: [PD] controlled vibrato

[Mathieu Bouchard]

On Tue, 6 Nov 2007, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote:

but
different amps and "half rectify" them, in the first excluding the
negative values and in the second the positives, in order to create this
pseudo-sine wave.

[max~ 0] and [min~ 0] will help here.
Also [+~] to combine them after half-rectification.
Hope this helps.


The curve won't have a continuous derivative, which may sound weird if the 
curve is played slow enough. If ever your solution is not sufficient, it 
might be better to try to come up with the integral of some continuous 
function, but it may be a bit hard to make it align with the desired 
frequencies.


for wide vibratos, it's also important to ask yourself which scale you 
want to work in: linear vs logarithmic sound different for any 
sufficiently wide vibrato.


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Re: [PD] a patch closing itself

[Roman Haefeli]

can you send me a patch, where it does crash? my experience is, that it
crashes always, as long as the [; pd-somepatch.pd menuclose 1( message
is part of the patch itself (somepatch.pd).

roman


On Tue, 2007-11-06 at 09:58 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote:
> menuclose from within a patch crashes extended but it works in vanilla pd.
> 
> 
> On Die Nov  6  4:24 , marius schebella  sent:
> 
> >I think that causes pd to crash. you have to send the message to some 
> >parent patch, together with the name of the patch, that should be 
> >closed, and do the menuclose from there with a dalay 0.
> >marius.
> >
> >Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> >> I just thought of a very useful reason to be able to use [menuclose 
> >> ( to close the current patch.  If we replace things like the find  
> >> panel, preferences, etc with pd patches, then they should be able to  
> >> close themselves so you can do things like bind Return/Enter to "OK"  
> >> and Esc to "Cancel".
> >> 
> >> Has anyone found a way to do this?
> >> 
> >> .hc
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> 
> >> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of  
> >> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an  
> >> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps  
> >> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into  
> >> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess  
> >> himself of it.- Thomas Jefferson
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> ___
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> >> 
> >
> >
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Re: [PD] FFTease Universal Binaries anywhere?

[Steffen Juul]

On 06/11/2007, at 22.15, Thomas Grill wrote:

> Steffen Juul schrieb:
>> On 06/11/2007, at 19.43, Batuhan Bozkurt wrote:
>>
>>
>>> And I guess their sources are not available too.
>>>
>>
>> The source is in the CVS repo in externals/grill/fftease/
>>
> Not really i should remove it to avoid misunderstandings.
> The fftease port in the pd cvs is old and incomplete.

Ah, thanks for clarifying, Thomas. I'm sorry, Batuhan, i didn't know  
that and didn't check carefully but assumed it was the FFTease i was  
looking at in the Pd CVS repo.

Then, with out the source, i guess your best luck is to contact Erik  
directly.

Best, Steffen

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Re: [PD] FFTease Universal Binaries anywhere?

[Thomas Grill]

Steffen Juul schrieb:
> On 06/11/2007, at 19.43, Batuhan Bozkurt wrote:
>
>   
>> And I guess their sources are not available too.
>> 
>
> The source is in the CVS repo in externals/grill/fftease/
>   
Not really i should remove it to avoid misunderstandings.
The fftease port in the pd cvs is old and incomplete. It was my own 
rendition of fftease before the time that the original fftease was 
available for pd.
Now that it is, grill/fftease is rather useless.

greetings, Thomas


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Re: [PD] FFTease Universal Binaries anywhere?

[Batuhan Bozkurt]

Thanks, I didn't know that they were in the CVS. Eric Lyon's website 
does not have the sources so I thought as that. However some objects are 
missing in the CVS repo, like disarrain~, centerring~, leaker~ and 
more... But they are available in the non-intel PD package from Eric 
Lyon's . They are not ported for intel osx or is it something else? A 
search in the list returned no results.

BB


Steffen Juul wrote:
>
> On 06/11/2007, at 19.43, Batuhan Bozkurt wrote:
>
>> And I guess their sources are not available too.
>
> The source is in the CVS repo in externals/grill/fftease/
>


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[PD] [declare] trouble

[robbert van hulzen]

hi all & hc,
just downloaded last night's autobuild--looks very nice! i understand the
wish for flexible colours etc, but hc, thanks a lot for the work!
there is something however that i don't understand: why is it that pd-ext
doesn't load all the libs it comes with? the .plist it comes with contains
10 entries for loadlib, while in my tweaked prefs file for an earlier
version, there are 36.
i thought this problem might be a good reason to learn what [declare] is all
about, but i didn't manage: [declare -lib ext13 -path
/Applications/Pd-0.40.3-extended-20071106.app/Contents/Resources/extra/ext13
/] didn't do it, and neither did variations on the path. according to the
help file (not included in the ext build), "you may use a full path name",
so i'm wondering what i'm doing wrong... also [declare -lib ext13
/App...blablah] (as quoted by roman in an earlier post) doesn't work. am i
mixing up definitions of libraries? still, in verbose output, it shows that
the path i hoped to create is not searched.
i know there's been a lot of talk about [declare] (and [import]) on the
list, but it apparently didn't give me enough info to sort this out.
if i understood correctly, [declare] is different from [import] in that it
does its thing at startup rather than when banged?
i couldn't find a description in the pdpedia of either--i'll be happy to
make that entry as soon as i understand how they work.
help would be greatly appreciated!
cheers, robbert

-- 
pd-0.40.3-extended-20071106
mac osx 10.4.8, 15" G4 PB 1.67 GHz, 1 GB ram



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Re: [PD] FFTease Universal Binaries anywhere?

[Steffen Juul]

On 06/11/2007, at 19.43, Batuhan Bozkurt wrote:

> And I guess their sources are not available too.

The source is in the CVS repo in externals/grill/fftease/

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[PD] controlled vibrato

[Charles Henry]

That's not hard:  just use expr~

[osc~  vibrato_rate]
|
[expr~ ($v1>0)*$f2*$v1+($v1<0)*$f3*$v1]

$f2 and $f3 are floats for your amplitudes for above and below respectively

Chuck


On Nov 6, 2007 1:00 PM, Libero Mureddu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi list,
> continuing my experiments with vibrato and glissandos, I ended up in this:
> I´d like to have a vibrato around a certain frequency, in which I can decide
> to go upwards of a certain amount (ie one octave) but downwards a different
> one (ie. one 5th), and the possibility to control those parameters.
> In other words, I´d like to have a modulating wave that has a certain
> amplitude when goes up, and a different one when goes down.
> I do not want to use a sine wave with an offset, because I would lose the
> regularity of the 0 amplitude point.
> A friend suggested me to use two sine waves with same frequency but
> different amps and "half rectify" them, in the first excluding the negative
> values and in the second the positives, in order to create this pseudo-sine
> wave.
> See half-wave rectification here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rectifier
> I made a simulation of the kind of wave I´m thinking, see attached jpg file.
> But, once again, I don´t know how to do that in pd, and I don´t know if
> there are better ways to do that.
> Hope my explanation is enough clear!
> thanks
>
> libero
> --
> Libero Mureddu
> Vanha Viertotie, 21 as 417
> 00350 Helsinki
> Finland
> http://webusers.siba.fi/~limuredd/
> http://www.myspace.com/liberomureddu

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Re: [PD] a patch closing itself

[Enrique Erne]

oh, i wasn't aware that there are other differences

[bng] <- click here
|
[;
bind2.pd menuclose 0(

does crash Pd-0.40.3-extended-20071026

doesn't crash Pd-0.40-2




bind2.pd
Description: Binary data




eni


On Nov 6, 2007, at 6:44 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:



This patch crashes on Pd-0.40-2 on Mac OS X:


I think the bug is that if it is triggered by user clicks, it works  
fine, but if it is triggered in a patch, then it crashes.


.hc

On Nov 6, 2007, at 3:58 AM, Enrique Erne wrote:

menuclose from within a patch crashes extended but it works in  
vanilla pd.



On Die Nov  6  4:24 , marius schebella  sent:


I think that causes pd to crash. you have to send the message to some
parent patch, together with the name of the patch, that should be
closed, and do the menuclose from there with a dalay 0.
marius.

Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:

I just thought of a very useful reason to be able to use [menuclose
( to close the current patch.  If we replace things like the find
panel, preferences, etc with pd patches, then they should be able to
close themselves so you can do things like bind Return/Enter to "OK"
and Esc to "Cancel".

Has anyone found a way to do this?

.hc

 




If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of
exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an
idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he  
keeps

it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into
the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess
himself of it.- Thomas Jefferson



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--- 
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Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to  
realize his wishes.  Now that he can realize them, he must either  
change them, or perish.-William Carlos Williams



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Re: [PD] controlled vibrato

[Libero Mureddu]

Claude and Charles, thanks a lot for your solutions.

best regards,
libero
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[PD] controlled vibrato

[Collin Oldham]

Hi Libero,

Here's my pd version of your solution. I don't predict the pitch  
center of the oscillation will be perceived much differently than if  
you offset a sine wave, but let me know!


liberovib.pd
Description: Binary data


Collin


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Re: [PD] controlled vibrato

[Claude Heiland-Allen]

Libero Mureddu wrote:
> In other words, I´d like to have a modulating wave that has a certain 
> amplitude when goes up, and a different one when goes down.
> I do not want to use a sine wave with an offset, because I would lose 
> the regularity of the 0 amplitude point.
> A friend suggested me to use two sine waves with same frequency

They also need the same phase - simplest way is to use one [osc~] and 
two [*~].

> but 
> different amps and "half rectify" them, in the first excluding the 
> negative values and in the second the positives, in order to create this 
> pseudo-sine wave.

[max~ 0] and [min~ 0] will help here.

Also [+~] to combine them after half-rectification.

Hope this helps.


Claude
-- 
http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org


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[PD] FFTease Universal Binaries anywhere?

[Batuhan Bozkurt]

Hello,

I grabbed FFTease OSX PD packages from 
http://www.sarc.qub.ac.uk/~elyon/LyonSoftware/MaxMSP/FFTease/ and they 
give architecture errors so I guess they are not UB. I was using them on 
Linux before, so I need them on OSX too. And I guess their sources are 
not available too.
Does anyone have UB binaries for FFTease?
Thanks.
Batuhan

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[PD] pdpedia imports

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

Hey all,

I am not sure if anyone is waiting for me to import things for the  
various pdpedia language sites.  If so, please nag me directly.

.hc


 


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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[Frank Barknecht]

Hallo,

(I cc the list, I guess it was meant to go there as well. pd-list
doesn't set a Reply-To-List.) 

A Whillas hat gesagt: // A Whillas wrote:

> Why this discussion if Plone already so good?
> 
> I've never used Plone before so I don't know its strengths and  
> weaknesses. Perhaps the current site is just badly structured and can  
> be made right with some adjustments, but looking at plone.org and  
> puredata.info they give the feeling of a Wiki not a community site.

Indeed, the structuring is the problem, and not the capabilities of
the underlying CMS. Plone can be used to build everything that Drupal
could be used for. Work on making a better structure is well needed,
but just replacing the software is superfluous and a waste of energy,
in my opinion. 

> I guess being able to see new articles, new forum topics, news  
> updates on the front page is what gives you the feeling of life from  
> the site. 

Possible with Plone. Acutally it's already in effect in the sidebar,
which syndicates every public "News" item tagged as one in every users
home folder. But people don't use this feature that often. I just used
it to illustrate the idea. I'm all for making the sidebar the center
column btw.

> >And it is administered by IEM, who run all their stuff with Plone,  
> >so there's
> >quite a bit of knowledge and experience already there,
> 
> I'm guessing the Drupal community is probably bigger. Who are IEM by  
> the way?

Institute of Electronic Music. Also the biggest Pd center in Europe,
where the first Pd convention was hold. Also where this list and
puredata.info is hosted. 

> >not to mention the tons of content that has been uploaded already  
> >and hundreds
> >(statistics, IOhannes?) of registered users.
> 
> Can all be migrated. The surprising thing is you can't tell there is  
> all that content. And if you can't access/find it then its the same  
> as it not being there.

But just migrating it won't solve anything. Why bother with setting up
a completely new system, when the current system could be made to do
anything, the new system could be made to do, as well? Or rather: Why
not work on making the current system address the valid points you
mention?

> 2224 users isn't really going to be a migration problem :-)

I see this a bit differently: Migrating just the account data would be
no problem, but setting it up so that old URLs to old content continue
to work, teaching the 2224 users about the new system, etc. is quite a
problem. And what would we gain?

Ciao
-- 
 Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__

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Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

On Nov 6, 2007, at 3:42 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote:

> Hallo,
> Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
>
>> Yeah, I think having subpatches visually distinct would definitely be
>> useful, since they are really a hidden chunk of the current patch
>> rather than an object.
>
> Personally I wouldn't care. To me it's enough that they have a special
> name with "pd" and a funky argument. [pd THE_SCORE] is visually
> different enough to me, and often I don't care that a subpatch is a
> subpatch (e.g. in [pd count-to-10] or so).
>
> [textfile] also is different from [osc~], but do they necessarily need
> to look different? And everywhere? When using data structures to just
> hold data, a subpatch is very similar to [textfile]. Should these two
> be similar then? If you enable GOP in your subpatch, it already can be
> made to look very different from other objects.

It's a visual language, so I think it's very important to find ways  
of clearly representing things visually.  black on white with 1px  
boxes, doesn't say much.  The ends of the message boxes and atom  
boxes are nice, I think they work well.

> So in the end I think, making objects look different automatically is
> a hairy issue. Some more ways to make individual objetcs look
> different on a one-by-one base could be interesting, though.

You can write GUI objects.  I'd like to see a jMax [trigger] in Pd,  
it's quite nice.

.hc


>
> Ciao
> -- 
>  Frank Barknecht _  
> __footils.org__
>
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Re: [PD] a patch closing itself

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

This patch crashes on Pd-0.40-2 on Mac OS X:



bind.pd
Description: Binary data


I think the bug is that if it is triggered by user clicks, it works  
fine, but if it is triggered in a patch, then it crashes.


.hc

On Nov 6, 2007, at 3:58 AM, Enrique Erne wrote:

menuclose from within a patch crashes extended but it works in  
vanilla pd.



On Die Nov  6  4:24 , marius schebella  sent:


I think that causes pd to crash. you have to send the message to some
parent patch, together with the name of the patch, that should be
closed, and do the menuclose from there with a dalay 0.
marius.

Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:

I just thought of a very useful reason to be able to use [menuclose
( to close the current patch.  If we replace things like the find
panel, preferences, etc with pd patches, then they should be able to
close themselves so you can do things like bind Return/Enter to "OK"
and Esc to "Cancel".

Has anyone found a way to do this?

.hc

 




If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of
exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an
idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he  
keeps

it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into
the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess
himself of it.- Thomas Jefferson



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Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to  
realize his wishes.  Now that he can realize them, he must either  
change them, or perish.-William Carlos Williams



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Re: [PD] a patch closing itself

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

Hmm, maybe there could be a "closeme" message in Pd, you send [; pd  
closeme pd-test.pd 1( , then Pd will close that window safely...

unless people think it's feasible to get menuclose working on the  
patch itself.

.hc

On Nov 5, 2007, at 10:24 PM, marius schebella wrote:

> I think that causes pd to crash. you have to send the message to  
> some parent patch, together with the name of the patch, that should  
> be closed, and do the menuclose from there with a dalay 0.
> marius.
>
> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
>> I just thought of a very useful reason to be able to use  
>> [menuclose ( to close the current patch.  If we replace things  
>> like the find  panel, preferences, etc with pd patches, then they  
>> should be able to  close themselves so you can do things like bind  
>> Return/Enter to "OK"  and Esc to "Cancel".
>> Has anyone found a way to do this?
>> .hc
>> - 
>> --- 
>> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others  
>> of  exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power  
>> called an  idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as  
>> long as he keeps  it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it  
>> forces itself into  the possession of everyone, and the receiver  
>> cannot dispossess  himself of it.- Thomas Jefferson
>> ___
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Re: [PD] [Pd] Graphics Toolkits?

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

On Nov 6, 2007, at 11:50 AM, Patrice Colet wrote:

> Hans-Christoph Steiner a écrit :
>> Tcl is whacky, but Tk is quite flexible and well developed for  
>> making GUIs. Check out tomorrow's auto-build if you want to make  
>> your mouse cursor turn into gumby :)  It's in hcs/cursor-help.pd
>> .hc
>
> Hi, I had a look lately into your externals, and tried [cursor], it  
> seems that the canvas takes the mouse binding, then when the cursor  
> is dragged outside the message box, the selected cursor disappears  
> and takes place to the usual arrow. I've no idea how to resolve  
> this unfortunately, it happens on win32.

I fixed this, it's in today's autobuild, except there is a problem  
with the windows builds :(

How are things working on Windows otherwise, with the new colors, etc?

.hc

 


Access to computers should be unlimited and total.  - the hacker ethic



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Re: [PD] [Pd] Graphics Toolkits?

[cdr]

> when you say Tcl is
> wacky, just how wacky do you mean?  I noticed that its handling of most
> programming capabilities is pretty off-beat, but I'm finding it very easy to
> learn and understand. Would you say there are serious
> flaws or inefficiencies, or is it just idiosyncratic?

in the 'scripting language written in C' category, Perl wins any idiosyncratic 
contest. TCL also far from Lua in speed. like Lua and unlike all the others 
(Python, Ruby), you have to invent your own OO system, however Lua has 
syntactic sugar for 'object methods' and a native language feature for 'method 
lookup' so it has an edge here. all of the above are embeddable in C apps to 
some extent, but Lua wins that contest handily, being designed for that from 
the start.

none of them have the typechecking ability of Haskell/SML/Ocaml/F# which can 
find problems before they happen at runtime. and none have fast native 
compilers like Lisp (SBCL), Ocaml (ocamlopt), and Haskell (GHC). so if youre 
willing to learn a bit more, you can ditch C/duck-typed scripting languages 
entirely and reap a lot of benefits in maintainability and performance.

everything has flaws. its about picking your tradeoffs. im just not sure TCL is 
the best at anything - if youre into lists of symbols/values/procnames youre 
going to get a lot more room and performance to maneuver switching to Common 
Lisp or Scheme. if you want a performant and decent balance of modern language 
features embeddable C scripting environment, youll get more for your money from 
Lua. everything under the sun has Tk bindings anyways, so that isnt a selling 
point. i think they even still have the Gumby cursor

i wouldnt call it wacky either. theres definitely wacky shit out there. like 
this: http://kx.com/q/d/a/q1.htm

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Re: [PD] [Pd] Graphics Toolkits?

[Hans-Christoph Steiner]

Tcl/Tk shares a similar problem with many "dynamic languages" in that  
they are hard to debug, since everything happens at runtime.  The  
delayed execution levels in Tcl using "" [] and {} can be a mind bender.


.hc

On Nov 6, 2007, at 12:14 PM, Chuckk Hubbard wrote:


Gumby, nice, lol.
I have now discovered that someone created Tcl/Tk interpreters for  
Csound too.  There goes the next few months of my life.
I have to ask, though (reply off-list if it's too OT): when you say  
Tcl is wacky, just how wacky do you mean?  I noticed that its  
handling of most programming capabilities is pretty off-beat, but  
I'm finding it very easy to learn and understand, as others have  
said.  Would you say there are serious flaws or inefficiencies, or  
is it just idiosyncratic?


-Chuckk

On 11/6/07, Hans-Christoph Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Tcl is whacky, but Tk is quite flexible and well developed for  
making GUIs. Check out tomorrow's auto-build if you want to make  
your mouse cursor turn into gumby :)  It's in hcs/cursor- help.pd


.hc

On Nov 5, 2007, at 8:12 PM, Chuckk Hubbard wrote:


I have now discovered the wonder that is Tcl/Tk.
There goes the next few weeks of my life...

-Chuckk



--
http://www.badmuthahubbard.com



 



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Re: [PD] [Pd] Graphics Toolkits?

[Chuckk Hubbard]

Gumby, nice, lol.
I have now discovered that someone created Tcl/Tk interpreters for Csound
too.  There goes the next few months of my life.
I have to ask, though (reply off-list if it's too OT): when you say Tcl is
wacky, just how wacky do you mean?  I noticed that its handling of most
programming capabilities is pretty off-beat, but I'm finding it very easy to
learn and understand, as others have said.  Would you say there are serious
flaws or inefficiencies, or is it just idiosyncratic?

-Chuckk

On 11/6/07, Hans-Christoph Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> Tcl is whacky, but Tk is quite flexible and well developed for making
> GUIs. Check out tomorrow's auto-build if you want to make your mouse cursor
> turn into gumby :)  It's in hcs/cursor-help.pd
>
> .hc
>
> On Nov 5, 2007, at 8:12 PM, Chuckk Hubbard wrote:
>
> I have now discovered the wonder that is Tcl/Tk.
> There goes the next few weeks of my life...
>
> -Chuckk
>
>

-- 
http://www.badmuthahubbard.com
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Re: [PD] [Pd] Graphics Toolkits?

[Patrice Colet]

Hans-Christoph Steiner a écrit :
> 
> Tcl is whacky, but Tk is quite flexible and well developed for making 
> GUIs. Check out tomorrow's auto-build if you want to make your mouse 
> cursor turn into gumby :)  It's in hcs/cursor-help.pd
> 
> .hc

Hi, I had a look lately into your externals, and tried [cursor], it 
seems that the canvas takes the mouse binding, then when the cursor is 
dragged outside the message box, the selected cursor disappears and 
takes place to the usual arrow. I've no idea how to resolve this 
unfortunately, it happens on win32.

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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[IOhannes m zmoelnig]

Frank Barknecht wrote:
> Hallo,
> A Whillas hat gesagt: // A Whillas wrote:
> 
>> I'm an experienced web developer. I think the puredata.info does have  
>> some issues which could be fixed but with some time and effort. My  
>> recommendation would be to use an opensource CMS like Drupal to  
>> manage the community side of stuff because:
>>
>> 1. Its taxonomy module is a very powerful tool for organising and  
>> cross referencing content and is easy to use
>> 2. Its very easy to extent so modules for Pd specific content could  
>> be wiped up quickly as required.
>> 3. Massive development community and is updated and patched constantly.
>> 4. Won the "Open Source CMS Award" this year (http://www.packtpub.com/ 
>> award) so must be doing something right.

true. plone only made it under the top 5 :-)

>> 5. Excellent multi-lingual support.
>> 6. Flexible and fast setup. Content migration might slow this down  
>> however.
> 
> Not to start a CMS-comparison, but all these features are available in
> the current Plone site as well. Setup even already is done. And it is
> administered by IEM, who run all their stuff with Plone, so there's
> quite a bit of knowledge and experience already there, not to mention
> the tons of content that has been uploaded already and hundreds
> (statistics, IOhannes?) of registered users.

currently there are 2224 registered users.

there is currently a total of about 2.5GB data on puredata.info


fgsmdr.
IOhannes

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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[Frank Barknecht]

Hallo,
A Whillas hat gesagt: // A Whillas wrote:

> I'm an experienced web developer. I think the puredata.info does have  
> some issues which could be fixed but with some time and effort. My  
> recommendation would be to use an opensource CMS like Drupal to  
> manage the community side of stuff because:
> 
> 1. Its taxonomy module is a very powerful tool for organising and  
> cross referencing content and is easy to use
> 2. Its very easy to extent so modules for Pd specific content could  
> be wiped up quickly as required.
> 3. Massive development community and is updated and patched constantly.
> 4. Won the "Open Source CMS Award" this year (http://www.packtpub.com/ 
> award) so must be doing something right.
> 5. Excellent multi-lingual support.
> 6. Flexible and fast setup. Content migration might slow this down  
> however.

Not to start a CMS-comparison, but all these features are available in
the current Plone site as well. Setup even already is done. And it is
administered by IEM, who run all their stuff with Plone, so there's
quite a bit of knowledge and experience already there, not to mention
the tons of content that has been uploaded already and hundreds
(statistics, IOhannes?) of registered users.

Ciao
-- 
 Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__

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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[marius schebella]

I would go for drupal, too. but there is already so much content on the 
plone site we have now, that migration and porting would be a lot of work.
is it possible to build the site in parallel and then switch? because 
taking the existing site offline for some days(?) is a bad idea.
marius.

A Whillas wrote:
> I'm new to Pd but...
> 
> I'm an experienced web developer. I think the puredata.info does have  
> some issues which could be fixed but with some time and effort. My  
> recommendation would be to use an opensource CMS like Drupal to  
> manage the community side of stuff because:
> 
> 1. Its taxonomy module is a very powerful tool for organising and  
> cross referencing content and is easy to use
> 2. Its very easy to extent so modules for Pd specific content could  
> be wiped up quickly as required.
> 3. Massive development community and is updated and patched constantly.
> 4. Won the "Open Source CMS Award" this year (http://www.packtpub.com/ 
> award) so must be doing something right.
> 5. Excellent multi-lingual support.
> 6. Flexible and fast setup. Content migration might slow this down  
> however.
> 
> I would also use Wiki for reference documentation as community driven  
> documentation is always good I find, provided there are watch dogs to  
> revert bad changes. Also offers multi-lingual for parallel  
> translation of content.
> 
> Some good examples of API web-sites are:
> 
> * Dojo javascript Toolkit (http://dojotoolkit.org/)
>   - Drupal site
>   - Has a "Book" which is a standard Drupal module and good for intro  
> guildes and tutorials (see: http://dojotoolkit.org/book/dojo-book-0-4)
>   - Good forums
>   - Ability to track content a user has been involved in (including  
> yourself)
>   - Planet funcitonaliy (RSS feed aggregation) helping to stitch a  
> scattered community together.
> 
> * JQuery documentation Wiki (http://docs.jquery.com/Main_Page)
>   - Wiki reference manual
>   - External libraries can integrate with a central documentation
>   - Tutorials section
>   - Clean, logical grouping of functions by concept
> 
> * PHP Documentation (http://www.php.net/manual/en/)
>   - Central index of all libraries
>   - Examples for each (most) functions
>   - The best feature is the user comments which are filtered to only  
> useful input which includes examples. This usually means that most of  
> the common tasks/problems are solved for you and even iteratively  
> improved.
> 
> these are just some examples that you might consider when thinking  
> about features that are desirable on a community site based around an  
> API.
> 
> I think there is a strong argument for going with a large opensource  
> CMS, especially if you are not full time for the website as you get  
> upgrades for free and with a big community the chance that someone  
> has solved most of the problems your going to encounter already.
> 
> I'm teaching Content Management Systems at a Uni in Berlin this year,  
> which is why I'm so into CMSs at the moment :)
> 
> On 06/11/2007, at 10:22 PM, Andy Farnell wrote:
> 
>> On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 11:33:02 -0500
>> Hans-Christoph Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>>> Right, for user patches, tec.  puredata.info has sections.  Perhaps
>>> they could be improved.
>> Yeah,  I looked and failed to find the sections. Obviously the  
>> potential is there
>> for .info to be a wonderful central node, but it does have  
>> usability problems imho.
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Use the source
>>
>> ___
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>>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[A Whillas]

I'm new to Pd but...

I'm an experienced web developer. I think the puredata.info does have  
some issues which could be fixed but with some time and effort. My  
recommendation would be to use an opensource CMS like Drupal to  
manage the community side of stuff because:

1. Its taxonomy module is a very powerful tool for organising and  
cross referencing content and is easy to use
2. Its very easy to extent so modules for Pd specific content could  
be wiped up quickly as required.
3. Massive development community and is updated and patched constantly.
4. Won the "Open Source CMS Award" this year (http://www.packtpub.com/ 
award) so must be doing something right.
5. Excellent multi-lingual support.
6. Flexible and fast setup. Content migration might slow this down  
however.

I would also use Wiki for reference documentation as community driven  
documentation is always good I find, provided there are watch dogs to  
revert bad changes. Also offers multi-lingual for parallel  
translation of content.

Some good examples of API web-sites are:

* Dojo javascript Toolkit (http://dojotoolkit.org/)
- Drupal site
- Has a "Book" which is a standard Drupal module and good for intro  
guildes and tutorials (see: http://dojotoolkit.org/book/dojo-book-0-4)
- Good forums
- Ability to track content a user has been involved in (including  
yourself)
- Planet funcitonaliy (RSS feed aggregation) helping to stitch a  
scattered community together.

* JQuery documentation Wiki (http://docs.jquery.com/Main_Page)
- Wiki reference manual
- External libraries can integrate with a central documentation
- Tutorials section
- Clean, logical grouping of functions by concept

* PHP Documentation (http://www.php.net/manual/en/)
- Central index of all libraries
- Examples for each (most) functions
- The best feature is the user comments which are filtered to only  
useful input which includes examples. This usually means that most of  
the common tasks/problems are solved for you and even iteratively  
improved.

these are just some examples that you might consider when thinking  
about features that are desirable on a community site based around an  
API.

I think there is a strong argument for going with a large opensource  
CMS, especially if you are not full time for the website as you get  
upgrades for free and with a big community the chance that someone  
has solved most of the problems your going to encounter already.

I'm teaching Content Management Systems at a Uni in Berlin this year,  
which is why I'm so into CMSs at the moment :)

On 06/11/2007, at 10:22 PM, Andy Farnell wrote:

> On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 11:33:02 -0500
> Hans-Christoph Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> Right, for user patches, tec.  puredata.info has sections.  Perhaps
>> they could be improved.
>
> Yeah,  I looked and failed to find the sections. Obviously the  
> potential is there
> for .info to be a wonderful central node, but it does have  
> usability problems imho.
>
>
> -- 
> Use the source
>
> ___
> PD-list@iem.at mailing list
> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ 
> listinfo/pd-list
>






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Re: [PD] changing the look of Pd to be more readable

[Frank Barknecht]

Hallo,
Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:

> Yeah, I think having subpatches visually distinct would definitely be  
> useful, since they are really a hidden chunk of the current patch  
> rather than an object.

Personally I wouldn't care. To me it's enough that they have a special
name with "pd" and a funky argument. [pd THE_SCORE] is visually
different enough to me, and often I don't care that a subpatch is a
subpatch (e.g. in [pd count-to-10] or so).

[textfile] also is different from [osc~], but do they necessarily need
to look different? And everywhere? When using data structures to just
hold data, a subpatch is very similar to [textfile]. Should these two
be similar then? If you enable GOP in your subpatch, it already can be
made to look very different from other objects.

So in the end I think, making objects look different automatically is
a hairy issue. Some more ways to make individual objetcs look
different on a one-by-one base could be interesting, though.

Ciao
-- 
 Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__

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[PD] Using pd.info [was: Re: new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum]

[Frank Barknecht]

Hallo,
Chuckk Hubbard hat gesagt: // Chuckk Hubbard wrote:

> It's still not possible to locate "toxy", "cyclone", or "mixed" from the
> search function.  I suppose their author never put a link to them on
> puredata.info, but they are in Pd-extended, no?  Yet nothing about
> Pd-extended comes up in a search for them.  If the author never linked or
> uploaded them, is it okay for someone like me to put a link to his website
> from my puredata.info page?

Yes, that's perfecly okay. pd.info is built by its users. I think,
many people aren't aware of it, but every Pd user, after registration
at pd.info, can built her/his own little or even bigger homepage. 

The sections http://puredata.info/community/patches and
http://puredata.info/community/tracks are actually automatically
collected from the stuff people have "tagged" accordingly (see
http://puredata.info/docs/tutorials/HowToContribute/ for how this
could be done). 

What puredata.info really needs, is a new skin. So far nobody did any
work on this. There must be some artists in our community, where are
they? Here's your chance to give something nice: Design a new skin for
puredata.info! And win a beer the next time I meet you.

Ciao
-- 
 Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__

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Re: [PD] a patch closing itself

[Enrique Erne]

menuclose from within a patch crashes extended but it works in vanilla pd.


On Die Nov  6  4:24 , marius schebella  sent:

>I think that causes pd to crash. you have to send the message to some 
>parent patch, together with the name of the patch, that should be 
>closed, and do the menuclose from there with a dalay 0.
>marius.
>
>Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
>> I just thought of a very useful reason to be able to use [menuclose 
>> ( to close the current patch.  If we replace things like the find  
>> panel, preferences, etc with pd patches, then they should be able to  
>> close themselves so you can do things like bind Return/Enter to "OK"  
>> and Esc to "Cancel".
>> 
>> Has anyone found a way to do this?
>> 
>> .hc
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of  
>> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an  
>> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps  
>> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into  
>> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess  
>> himself of it.- Thomas Jefferson
>> 
>> 
>> 
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>
>
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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[Steffen Juul]

On 06/11/2007, at 22.22, Andy Farnell wrote:

> On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 11:33:02 -0500
> Hans-Christoph Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> Right, for user patches, tec.  puredata.info has sections.  Perhaps
>> they could be improved.
>
> Yeah,  I looked and failed to find the sections. Obviously the  
> potential is there
> for .info to be a wonderful central node, but it does have  
> usability problems imho.

Hey Andy. Check out . The great  
thing about the free form of that page (the tutorials page) is that  
one can add links to third party sites. Meaning one can add links to  
tutorials on other websites. Meaning they can be in any format. I've  
heard there are a bunch of wonderful tutorials in PDF including  
interactive Pd examples at a site called ObiWannabe.Co.UK.

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Re: [PD] high pass filter for images

[IOhannes m zmoelnig]

punchik punchik wrote:
> hi i making a multituouch surface with pd, i want be
> able to filter the low and middle bands in the video
> from my web cam. im interesting in just letting the
> high images pass...
> is there something like a high pass filter for
> imagens?

in Gem:
[pix_convolve] does spatial convolution with a square kernel. fill it 
with the right coefficients to produce a spatial high-pass.
[pix_tIIR] does temporal filterin using an IIR-filter of settable 
length. fill with the right coefficients to produce a temporal 
high-pass. unfortunately the taps in the filter store the images only in 
  the usual precision (e.g. RGBA32), which might yield weird results

in pdp and Gridflow there are surely solutions (which i don't know; just 
go through the manual), for spatial filtering see [pdp_convolve] (pdp) 
and [#convolve] (Gridflow).

pdp will work with higher precission (16bit instead of 8bit per 
channel), and GridFlow will even allow you to use floating point.


mfa.cae.
IOhannes

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Re: [PD] new pd wiki - practical data - includes forum

[Andy Farnell]

On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 11:33:02 -0500
Hans-Christoph Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Right, for user patches, tec.  puredata.info has sections.  Perhaps  
> they could be improved. 

Yeah,  I looked and failed to find the sections. Obviously the potential is 
there
for .info to be a wonderful central node, but it does have usability problems 
imho.
  

-- 
Use the source

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