Re: [PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream

[John Harrison]

That's a huge amount of latency. Do you see that sort of latency if you 
use the webcam in guvcview?


For a cheap webcam with low latency I've had great luck with the Sony 
ps3eye. It works out of the box on Linux (ubuntu at least) but if you 
compile your own driver for it you can get even better performance:

http://bear24rw.blogspot.com/2009/11/ps3-eye-driver-patch.html



On 11/20/2010 02:05 PM, Menno van der Woude wrote:

The latency with this webcam is amazingly long, as in a second or more.



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[PD] call for testers for L2Ork iteration of pd-extended (based on 0.42.x branch)

[Ivica Ico Bukvic]

Dear fellow Pd enthusiasts,

I am pleased to report that earlier today L2Ork released latest snapshot
of its own variation of pd-extended 0.42.5. While we are working hard on
submitting isolated patches upstream (some of which have been already
submitted), many more need to be isolated before they can be provided in
a useful format. Another roadblock is that we are still stuck on 0.42.5
which makes patch integration so much more difficult into the 0.43
branch.

That said, we would love to get some feedback/testers. The tarball is
for *linux only* clients (a good number of optimizations have not been
tested on other platforms and there are already known issues,
particularly in respect to pd.tk file).

Some of the notable improvements include much faster editor (instead of
redrawing we tag and move objects wherever possible while still allowing
for legacy movement of objects not conforming to the pd vanilla
gobj_displace format), bunch of usability improvements (e.g. custom
color picker with color storing and hex editing), per-canvas toggling of
menu and background color (see Abstractions), universal shortcuts,
different scrolling algorithm. Likewise, the UI is entirely revamped to
better fit the "Gnome-ish" feel. Jack connectivity algorithm also is
automated and compensates for changes in srate, etc.

At any rate, there are bunch of other little/big fixes I honestly cannot
recall. These improvements are a product of a year of use within the
context of a 15-member laptop orchestra taking into an account feedback
from students/participants, including also my latest hac-a-thon this
past week that involved overhauling redraw to improve editor speed. So,
if any of you would be so kind as to give it a stab and provide any
feedback, that would be most appreciated.

You can get the latest snapshot from
http://l2ork.music.vt.edu/main/?page_id=56

The source tarball also includes prebuilt binaries, so assuming you have
an intel machine with Ubuntu 9.10, it should "just run." (cd pd/bin/
followed by ./pd). Otherwise, you may have to rebuild it (standard
pd-extended 0.42.x procedure).

Your feedback, particularly bug-reports are most appreciated.

Best wishes,

Ico


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Re: [PD] [PD-announce] Slit-Scanning Techniques With Gridflow

[Roman Haefeli]

On Fri, 2010-11-19 at 12:11 -0500, Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
> On Fri, 19 Nov 2010, Roman Haefeli wrote:
> 
> > I made a group of patches of which each implements a different kind of a
> > slit-scanning technique (though the use of the word 'slit' is a bit
> > stretched here).
> 
> I stretched it more with gridflow/examples/remap_video.pd, which I added a 
> few months ago. I just made two videos of it, so that people without 
> GridFlow installed can see it anyway :
> 
>http://gridflow.ca/gallery/remap_video_xor.mov
>http://gridflow.ca/gallery/remap_video_xor_2.mov
> 

Cool. I haven't seen the patch in the examples until you mentioned it.
remap_video.pd and t-morph.pd are similar in that they both delay each
pixel separately with different amounts of time. Yours uses a real-time
generated mask, while t-morph.pd uses pre-made masks.
It would be perfectly possible to use a mask that's changing over time
(a.k.a movie), but I haven't tried that yet. Have you?

Roman





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Re: [PD] Markov chains and probability

[Frank]

Hi Johnny
I think you got it all right. A useful abstraction for Markov chains  
is the list-wrandom object in the list-abs collection. Also see the  
c_markov and c_markovanal objects in the rj-library. They provide both  
analysis and generation of markov processes.

Ciao
Frank

On 20.11.2010, at 19:43, Johnny Ferguson  wrote:


Hi,

I just read about Markov chains and how they can be applied to  
selecting pitches using probability. One thing I'm wondering is how  
we assure that our note selection matches the distribution of  
probability.


Let's say our current note was C4.

For the next note:

P(D4) = 0.3
P(E5) = 0.2
P(F4) = 0.5

Would we simply generate a random number R (0..1) and say:

if R < 0.3 then
 nextNote -> D4
elsif R < (0.3 + 0.2) then
 nextNote -> E5
else then
 nextNote -> F4

I only ask, because if our random number function wasn't well- 
distributed, we might actually see higher probabilities for certain  
notes than we've intended.


Simply put, what is the most effective, efficient, and accurate way to
select the next state based on a list of note-probability pairs
connected to the current state?

I'm all right with math, but probability is not one of the areas I'm
very strong in. If anyone has a simple way of explaining this, I'd
greatly appreciate it.

I can see that markov chains could be applied to far more things than
pitch (modulation, rhythm, structure, etc.), so I want to get at  
least a decent grasp on how we implement them reliably before I  
start going nuts with the idea.


-Johnny

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Re: [PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream

[Menno van der Woude]

Thanks that helped and made it work!

The latency with this webcam is amazingly long, as in a second or more.
Speeding up the [metro] is of no influence.

Any ideas for the best (web)cam for the goal I have?
Or is the delay due to settings inside pd?
Either ieee1394 or usb would be fine.
It would be nice to bring down response to changes in the sight of the
cam to about 50 ms.

Bye, Menno.

On Sat, Nov 20, 2010 at 7:58 PM, Pagano, Patrick
 wrote:
> try pdp_v4l2
> 
> From: pd-list-boun...@iem.at [pd-list-boun...@iem.at] On Behalf Of Menno van 
> der Woude [menn...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 12:33 PM
> To: pd-list
> Subject: [PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream
>
> Hello,
>
> with the purpose of being able to track elements in sight of a cam by
> virtue of their color, I would like to use and explore the
> possibilities of pdp_ctrack. While this does work with prerecorded
> video (avi) i am unable to try it with live video, cause pdp_v4l gives
> and error. See below what happens when trying to send [open
> /dev/video0< to [pdp_v4l].
>
> pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0
> pdp_v4l: cap: name UVC Camera (046d:0802) type 1 channels 1 maxw 640
> maxh 480 minw 48 minh 32
> pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32896 depth 0 palette 0
> pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera 1 type 2 flags 0
> pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0
> pdp_v4l: cant change to norm 0
> error: pdp_v4l: no method for 'type'
>
> Does anyone know if this is a matter of buying a better cam? Now using
> a Logitech very simple usb webcam. Or do i need to load/install a
> certain driver, or send other messages to [pdp_v4l]?
> My purpose is to get coordinates (and possibly size) of colored
> elements. I want to be able to track different elements
> simultaneously, and be able to calculate distance. Maybe a combination
> with size would also allow me to calculate distance in 3 dimension.
> Then to use the data for conditional sounds (tonal and/or atonal).
> Any help appreciated!
>
> Bye, Menno.
>
> --
> www.indelucht.nl
> ---
> www.whatkeepsmegoing.com
>
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-- 
---
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www.indelucht.nl
---
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www.whatkeepsmegoing.com

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Re: [PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream

[Pagano, Patrick]

try pdp_v4l2

From: pd-list-boun...@iem.at [pd-list-boun...@iem.at] On Behalf Of Menno van 
der Woude [menn...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 12:33 PM
To: pd-list
Subject: [PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream

Hello,

with the purpose of being able to track elements in sight of a cam by
virtue of their color, I would like to use and explore the
possibilities of pdp_ctrack. While this does work with prerecorded
video (avi) i am unable to try it with live video, cause pdp_v4l gives
and error. See below what happens when trying to send [open
/dev/video0< to [pdp_v4l].

pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0
pdp_v4l: cap: name UVC Camera (046d:0802) type 1 channels 1 maxw 640
maxh 480 minw 48 minh 32
pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32896 depth 0 palette 0
pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera 1 type 2 flags 0
pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0
pdp_v4l: cant change to norm 0
error: pdp_v4l: no method for 'type'

Does anyone know if this is a matter of buying a better cam? Now using
a Logitech very simple usb webcam. Or do i need to load/install a
certain driver, or send other messages to [pdp_v4l]?
My purpose is to get coordinates (and possibly size) of colored
elements. I want to be able to track different elements
simultaneously, and be able to calculate distance. Maybe a combination
with size would also allow me to calculate distance in 3 dimension.
Then to use the data for conditional sounds (tonal and/or atonal).
Any help appreciated!

Bye, Menno.

--
www.indelucht.nl
---
www.whatkeepsmegoing.com

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Re: [PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream

[Mathieu Bouchard]

On Sat, 20 Nov 2010, Menno van der Woude wrote:

Does anyone know if this is a matter of buying a better cam? Now using a 
Logitech very simple usb webcam. Or do i need to load/install a certain 
driver, or send other messages to [pdp_v4l]?


You need either [pdp_v4l2] from pidip,

or use LD_PRELOAD to use /usr/lib/libv4l1.so as an adaptor between the 
v4l1 driver system used by [pdp_v4l] and the v4l2-only interface of the 
uvc.ko driver for your UVC camera.


Logitech Quickcam Pro 5000 and later use the UVC protocol with uvc.ko.

Logitech Quickcam Pro 4000 and earlier use the Philips protocol with 
pwc.ko. (well, there were at least two other generations of Logitech 
before they switched to Philips.)


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[PD] Markov chains and probability

[Johnny Ferguson]

Hi,

I just read about Markov chains and how they can be applied to selecting 
pitches using probability. One thing I'm wondering is how we assure that 
our note selection matches the distribution of probability.


Let's say our current note was C4.

For the next note:

P(D4) = 0.3
P(E5) = 0.2
P(F4) = 0.5

Would we simply generate a random number R (0..1) and say:

if R < 0.3 then
  nextNote -> D4
elsif R < (0.3 + 0.2) then
  nextNote -> E5
else then
  nextNote -> F4

I only ask, because if our random number function wasn't 
well-distributed, we might actually see higher probabilities for certain 
notes than we've intended.


Simply put, what is the most effective, efficient, and accurate way to
select the next state based on a list of note-probability pairs
connected to the current state?

I'm all right with math, but probability is not one of the areas I'm
very strong in. If anyone has a simple way of explaining this, I'd
greatly appreciate it.

I can see that markov chains could be applied to far more things than
pitch (modulation, rhythm, structure, etc.), so I want to get at least a 
decent grasp on how we implement them reliably before I start going nuts 
with the idea.


-Johnny

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[PD] unable to open pdp_v4l webcam video stream

[Menno van der Woude]

Hello,

with the purpose of being able to track elements in sight of a cam by
virtue of their color, I would like to use and explore the
possibilities of pdp_ctrack. While this does work with prerecorded
video (avi) i am unable to try it with live video, cause pdp_v4l gives
and error. See below what happens when trying to send [open
/dev/video0< to [pdp_v4l].

pdp_v4l: opening /dev/video0
pdp_v4l: cap: name UVC Camera (046d:0802) type 1 channels 1 maxw 640
maxh 480 minw 48 minh 32
pdp_v4l: picture: brightness 32896 depth 0 palette 0
pdp_v4l: channel 0 name Camera 1 type 2 flags 0
pdp_v4l: switched to channel 0
pdp_v4l: cant change to norm 0
error: pdp_v4l: no method for 'type'

Does anyone know if this is a matter of buying a better cam? Now using
a Logitech very simple usb webcam. Or do i need to load/install a
certain driver, or send other messages to [pdp_v4l]?
My purpose is to get coordinates (and possibly size) of colored
elements. I want to be able to track different elements
simultaneously, and be able to calculate distance. Maybe a combination
with size would also allow me to calculate distance in 3 dimension.
Then to use the data for conditional sounds (tonal and/or atonal).
Any help appreciated!

Bye, Menno.

--
www.indelucht.nl
---
www.whatkeepsmegoing.com

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Re: [PD] The (not) doppler distortion (was: overdriven speaker)

[Martin Schied]

Hi!

On 20.11.2010 05:25, Mathieu Bouchard wrote:

On Sat, 20 Nov 2010, Martin Schied wrote:

no, sorry, I can't on the quick. but I know for sure that frequency 
modulation only produces harmonics if the carrier and modulator are 
in "simple" relations like 1:5 or your example 200 to 1000.


I think that my reasoning is mostly correct and that our difference is 
that while I'm insisting that periodic signals remain periodic, you 
are insisting that nonperiodic signals remain nonperiodic, or 
something like that.
yes. My thinking of 'non harmonic" distortion is if you have a signal 
whose preceived pitch frequency is harmonically unrelated to the new 
perceived pitch after distortion. So if you had a signal of 100Hz (200, 
300, 400 ... Harmonics) base pitch and add a 70Hz and 130Hz they would 
not fit the old spectrum very well. You will again find a common 'base' 
frequency, for example 10Hz in this case, but 10Hz bands are too small 
in frequencies of 200, 300, 400Hz to be perceived as harmonics. But it's 
difficult to argue about such effects as we had to do many listening 
experiments before...





The correction I made just uses a [delread~].

For example if you have [+~ 1]-[*~ 5]-[+~ 2], you need a [delread~ a 
7], because 1*5+2 = 7.

oh, great indeed :)


it's only because of the slight delay I'd be interested to eliminate. 
But as you also said I don't expect any big difference between the 
delay free case and the vd~ case as the modulations occuring with a 
slight off phase will not sound any different. (however 2ms can be 
quite different for short percussive signals)


Well, it does sound different in some way, but the changes I get by 
changing that delay, are less special than what I get by making that 
effect happen in the first place, instead of not. It makes me think of 
other delay tricks such as comb filters.

I'm curious what you planned...


yep, that's also one of the effects I wanted to eliminate by the 
moving write head.


If you make a "moving write head" thing, though, it needs to be additive,

that's easy doable
and the energy has to get stretched like the derivative of the motion 
(the speed of the head).
or accumulated. there also might happen a supersonic bang (but before, 
there are problem with the sampling theoreme not been met anymore).
The data may have to be spread into a not-very-bounded amount of array 
elements.

its bounds could be set to a fixed maximum, like for [delwrite 1000].

too much to start off for me, I should learn proper c before and know 
more about interpolation (and the internals of pd too).


Martin
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Re: [PD] Does anyone know how to put the monitor at fullscreen without the top menu on MAC?

[Jack]

if you need, you can send the message [menubar 0( to [gemwin] to remove
the menu.
++

Jack



Le vendredi 19 novembre 2010 à 07:06 -0800, giuliano obici a écrit :
> 
> 
> 
> I apply the GEM fullscreen but still the menu bar appears on Mac
> Does anyone know how to put the monitor at fullscreen without the top
> menu on MAC?
> Giuliano
>  
> 
> http://giulianobici.com
> http://n-1.art.br
> +55(11)7697-1212
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
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Re: [PD] beginner's question - counter inside a counter?

[Thomas Mayer]

On 20.11.2010 14:51, 2bad4...@london.com wrote:
> 
> Hello,
>  
> I have built a counter that counts from 1 to 19 and then starts again from 
> the beginning.
> 
> It reads the values from the array. However I would like it to stop after it 
> reads the values three times. I was thinking of using another counter to do 
> that. Any suggestions? Where should I put the other counter and how would it 
> work?

You could count from 0 to 3*19, and then use [mod 19] and [+ 1] to get
the desired values from 0 to 19. When you read 3*19, stop it.

By the way: The "standard way" in Pd to do a counter is to use the
[f] X [+ 1] idiom.

cu Thomas
-- 
"Spielen Sie Strip Schnipp-Schnapp?" (Adam Weishaupt to Johann
Wolfgang von Goethe in: Robert Shea & Robert A. Wilson, The Golden
Apple)
http://www.residuum.org/

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Re: [PD] beginner's question - counter inside a counter?

[Alexandre Lard]

Hello,

Not sure it's the best way to do it
but as a beginner too, i would do it this way


2010/11/20 <2bad4...@london.com>

>
> Hello,
>
>  I have built a counter that counts from 1 to 19 and then starts again
> from the beginning.
>
>  It reads the values from the array. However I would like it to stop after
> it reads the values three times. I was thinking of using another counter to
> do that. Any suggestions? Where should I put the other counter and how would
> it work?
>
>  Thanks for your help.
>
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>


-- 
Alexandre Lard

http://alexandre.lard.free.fr


counter_2.pd
Description: Binary data
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Re: [PD] beginner's question - counter inside a counter?

[tim vets]

maybe something like this ? (attached)
gr,
Tim


2010/11/20 <2bad4...@london.com>

>
> Hello,
>
>  I have built a counter that counts from 1 to 19 and then starts again
> from the beginning.
>
>  It reads the values from the array. However I would like it to stop after
> it reads the values three times. I was thinking of using another counter to
> do that. Any suggestions? Where should I put the other counter and how would
> it work?
>
>  Thanks for your help.
>
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>
#N canvas 452 99 572 539 10;
#X obj 64 33 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1
;
#X obj 64 111 f;
#X obj 98 111 + 1;
#X obj 64 156 mod 19;
#X obj 64 206 tabread abc;
#X obj 64 238 osc~;
#X obj 65 274 *~;
#X obj 65 309 dac~;
#X obj 116 246 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0
1;
#X obj 163 82 sel 0;
#X obj 163 59 < 56;
#X obj 163 124 t f f;
#X msg 163 104 0;
#X floatatom 86 179 5 0 0 0 - - -;
#X obj 64 62 metro 100;
#X connect 0 0 14 0;
#X connect 1 0 2 0;
#X connect 1 0 3 0;
#X connect 1 0 10 0;
#X connect 2 0 1 1;
#X connect 3 0 4 0;
#X connect 3 0 13 0;
#X connect 4 0 5 0;
#X connect 5 0 6 0;
#X connect 6 0 7 0;
#X connect 6 0 7 1;
#X connect 8 0 6 1;
#X connect 9 0 12 0;
#X connect 10 0 9 0;
#X connect 11 0 0 0;
#X connect 11 1 1 1;
#X connect 12 0 11 0;
#X connect 14 0 1 0;
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[PD] beginner's question - counter inside a counter?

[2bad4you]

Hello,



I have built a counter that counts from 1 to 19 and then starts again from the 
beginning.


It reads the values from the array. However I would like it to stop after it 
reads the values three times. I was thinking of using another counter to do 
that. Any suggestions? Where should I put the other counter and how would it 
work?


Thanks for your help.


counter.pd
Description: Binary data
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Re: [PD] Recording and playing back

[tim vets]

2010/11/20 tim vets 

>
>
> 2010/11/20 marcello 
>
> Il 18/11/10 19:03, stéfan piat ha scritto:
>> > http://pd-tutorial.com/english/ch03s04.html
>> >
>> > 2010/11/18 jurgen mailto:noise@gmail.com>>
>> >
>> > ayoh you can't look through the book and find it yourself? ts ts
>> ts...
>>
>> I actually read the manual and looked through the book but didn't find
>> that example.
>>
>> Anyway: here's a first version of the patch that I need.
>> The problem now: I'd need a message from tabwrite that it tells me when
>> it's finished with writing to the table, so that I can start to play.
>>
>
> since your table is 44100 samples long, it will be filled in 1 second
> (assuming that you work at 44.1 kHz.)
> A [del 1000] can give you an extra bang one second later to start the
> tabplay~.
>
correction:

> Or you could work with a metro that bangs the tabwrite~ and tabplay~
> objects...
> for example:
>
> [metro 1000]
> |
> [toggle]
> |
> [sel 0 1]
> |  \
> |\
>
correction:

> [tabplay~][tabwrite~]
>
>

> gr,
> Tim
>
>
>> How can I do it ?
>>
>> thx all
>>
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Re: [PD] Pd + HTML on Android

[chrism]

Hi,

Seems work work ok on 1.6 and 2.2

Cheers,

Chris.

On Fri, 19 Nov 2010 10:23:29 -0300, Jose Luis Santorcuato
 wrote:
> Hi, great...working with a specific version of android? (yes, i dont read
> the link).
> 
> Best regards
> 
> José
> 
> 2010/11/19 chrism 
> 
>> On Fri, 19 Nov 2010 21:38:36 +1100, Richie Cyngler
>>  wrote:
>> > Could it be used to make "web apps" too?
>>
>> I guess it depends what you mean by "web apps". I can make your Pd
>> patches run on Android with HTML interfaces to control them.
>>
>> The use case I most have in mind is this:
>> 
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Chris.
>>
>> ---
>> http://mccormick.cx
>>
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Re: [PD] Recording and playing back

[tim vets]

2010/11/20 marcello 

> Il 18/11/10 19:03, stéfan piat ha scritto:
> > http://pd-tutorial.com/english/ch03s04.html
> >
> > 2010/11/18 jurgen mailto:noise@gmail.com>>
> >
> > ayoh you can't look through the book and find it yourself? ts ts
> ts...
>
> I actually read the manual and looked through the book but didn't find
> that example.
>
> Anyway: here's a first version of the patch that I need.
> The problem now: I'd need a message from tabwrite that it tells me when
> it's finished with writing to the table, so that I can start to play.
>

since your table is 44100 samples long, it will be filled in 1 second
(assuming that you work at 44.1 kHz.)
A [del 1000] can give you an extra bang one second later to start the
tabplay~.
Or you could work with a metro that bangs the tabwrite~ and tabread~
objects...
for example:

[metro 1000]
|
[toggle]
|
[sel 0 1]
|  \
|\
[tabread~][tabwrite~]

gr,
Tim


> How can I do it ?
>
> thx all
>
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Re: [PD] Recording and playing back

[marcello]

Il 18/11/10 19:03, stéfan piat ha scritto:
> http://pd-tutorial.com/english/ch03s04.html
> 
> 2010/11/18 jurgen mailto:noise@gmail.com>>
> 
> ayoh you can't look through the book and find it yourself? ts ts ts...

I actually read the manual and looked through the book but didn't find
that example.

Anyway: here's a first version of the patch that I need.
The problem now: I'd need a message from tabwrite that it tells me when
it's finished with writing to the table, so that I can start to play.

How can I do it ?

thx all
#N canvas 502 22 566 426 10;
#X obj 145 52 adc~;
#X msg 173 85 bang;
#X obj 32 337 dac~;
#X obj 49 120 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1
-1;
#X obj 116 249 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144
-1 -1;
#X obj 275 245 table table1 44100;
#X obj 164 145 tabwrite~ table1;
#X obj 42 161 tabplay~ table1;
#X connect 0 0 6 0;
#X connect 0 1 6 0;
#X connect 1 0 6 0;
#X connect 3 0 7 0;
#X connect 7 0 2 0;
#X connect 7 0 2 1;
#X connect 7 1 4 0;
#X connect 7 1 6 0;
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