Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Hallo, Luke Iannini hat gesagt: // Luke Iannini wrote: Is there any reason specifically to only accept numbers? Actually no. ;) I replaced [f $2] with [list append $2] in my copy as well now and committed the new patches to the SVN with an extended help-file. Note to all SSSAD-users: The new version (revision 10231 on SF-SVN) now requires pd 0.40 and up. This seems to be a major release and people can call it SSSAD 2.0, if they like. I don't plan any new features for now (unless Pd suddenly gets a closebang). I'm looking forward to patches built surrounding sssad.pd, which as you know deliberatly leaves out the actual state saving. It shouldn't be too hard for example to write a commun.pd wrapper now so that Memento-patches can be converted to sssad without too much trouble or to decorate sssad.pd with OSC-like pattern matching. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 6:02 AM, Frank Barknecht [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: In the near future there will be some more SSSAD_ADMIN messages I'd like to support: setlocal and savelocal to save to receivers called $2-SSSAD_ADMIN where $2 will usually be the parent's $0, to allow saving of all/some [sssad]s with canvas-local scope. Okay, the future is here: I took a different approach after looking though my old notes to make it possible to use [sssad] for local parameter saving and loading Attached [sssad-l] is compatible to normal [sssad] (but requires at a Pd with $1-$2 expansion). What's new: It also accepts a second argument which should be a number (designed for $0). If this number is 0 or missing, everything is as before. Is there any reason specifically to only accept numbers? I attached a version modified to take any argument as the local identifier; this is useful for a number of reasons (remote communication with sssad-l instances, and sharing a unique identifier with part of an OSC address...). If $2 is different from 0, the global senders and receivers SSSAD and SSSAD_ADMIN are *deactivated* completely and replaced by $2-SSSAD and $2-SSSAD_ADMIN. sssad-l-test.pd includes some tests for this and also an example, how this change can be used for local parameter handling. Comments welcome. This looks amazing. The simplicity versus Memento is a wonder : ). I have already whipped up OSC enabled versions and will be converting Memento-p (nee Semento/Polaroid) and Controctopus to embrace the future. I think it also gives me an idea for how to do fully hierarchical state-saving... Thanks Frank! Best Luke Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list sssad-l.pd Description: Binary data ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Hi Frank Barknecht wrote: Enrique Erne hat gesagt: // Enrique Erne wrote: now the point why i write this email: it would be nice to have a little note in sssad-help that says initializing is strongly recommended or similar. Hm, probably [sssad] should get a [route bang] after the [route save] as well to prohibit saving parameters that haven't been initialized - similar to the protection of the outlet. I attached a version which has this with a little demo patch. That looks great. Still, personally I will initialize all keys, this guarantees to always have complete presets. [loadbang] | [; SSSAD vol 20, freq 42, other 1.2345( An other minor issue: In my post before I wrote to do [SSSAD_ADMIN set( on load, but on a second thought this is not good practice. It would force all SSSAD to output their value, even other already existing patches. Basically i would like it if there was a possibility to let some SSSAD instances in a new patch output the value. Attached SSSAD has a possible solution. case 1) ___ [sssad vol] | [*~ 0.5] Here SSSAD would not be initialized. case 2) ___ [loadbang] | [; SSSAD vol 0.5( [sssad vol] | [*~ 0.5] Here all is good except i don't want to write the value twice. case 3) ___ [loadbang] | [; SSSAD vol 0.5( [sssad vol] / [*~] *~ is missing the init value. It would work with [SSSAD_ADMIN set( but then all SSSAD's will output their value. That seems wrong. case 4) ___ [loadbang] | [; SSSAD vol 0.5, vol bang( [sssad vol] / [*~] How about something like that? [SSSAD vol bang( could be used to specify one key to output it's value. One more [route bang] would be required. One could argue [SSSAD vol bang( should delete the value, but i can't think of a use of having a key without value. In attached SSSAD i have 2 minor changes. A [route bang] to - output a specific key (i like that change a lot and see no problem) $1 in [route save $1] to - save a specific key (this is not a clean solution and doesn't work when with [sssad save] instance, but it would allow to collect specific data) wow pretty long email for such a minor thing. thanks for having a look at it :) eni #N canvas 282 224 783 400 10; #X floatatom 130 69 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 138 102 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 594 192 list prepend add; #X obj 594 218 list trim; #X obj 438 267 s SSSAD_ADMIN; #X obj 594 124 r SSSAD_ADMIN; #X obj 594 168 route persist; #X obj 594 146 list trim; #X msg 438 201 save; #X msg 452 240 set; #X obj 438 63 bng 24 250 50 0 empty empty save_all 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X msg 594 258 other-patch 8 \; freq 12 \; vol 11 \;; #X obj 438 134 t b b; #X msg 470 167 set; #X obj 57 66 sssad vol; #X obj 56 157 loadbang; #X floatatom 192 289 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 57 180 \; SSSAD vol 11 \, vol bang \; SSSAD freq 12 \, freq bang; #X obj 290 59 bng 24 250 50 0 empty empty save_this_patch 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 285 104 t b b; #X msg 319 128 set; #X obj 58 101 sssad freq; #X obj 72 288 sssad other-patch; #X msg 281 156 \; SSSAD_ADMIN vol \, freq; #X connect 0 0 14 1; #X connect 1 0 21 1; #X connect 2 0 3 0; #X connect 3 0 11 0; #X connect 5 0 7 0; #X connect 6 0 2 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 4 0; #X connect 9 0 4 0; #X connect 10 0 12 0; #X connect 12 0 8 0; #X connect 12 1 13 0; #X connect 13 0 11 0; #X connect 14 0 0 0; #X connect 15 0 17 0; #X connect 16 0 22 1; #X connect 18 0 19 0; #X connect 19 0 23 0; #X connect 19 1 20 0; #X connect 20 0 11 0; #X connect 21 0 1 0; #X connect 22 0 16 0; #N canvas 58 42 1019 539 10; #X obj 123 24 inlet; #X obj 197 130 r SSSAD; #X obj 197 87 s SSSAD; #X obj 197 53 list prepend \$1; #X obj 197 158 list trim; #X obj 197 23 inlet; #X obj 16 258 r SSSAD_ADMIN; #X obj 16 306 b; #X obj 16 284 route set; #X obj 123 51 b; #X obj 197 221 route \$1; #X obj 574 442 s SSSAD_ADMIN; #X obj 507 156 r SSSAD_ADMIN; #X obj 507 304 b; #X obj 507 248 spigot; #X obj 633 70 loadbang; #X obj 633 248 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 1; #X obj 633 93 value \$1.SSSAD.req; #X obj 633 192 select 0; #X obj 665 139 + 1; #X obj 665 162 value \$1.SSSAD.req; #X obj 633 118 t a a; #X obj 633 214 f 1; #X obj 190 420 outlet; #X obj 123 394 route bang; #X text 207 393 filter out empty lists; #X obj 574 412 list prepend persist \$1; #X obj 123 365 list append; #X text 195 108 on SSSAD we eavesdrop the communication; #X text 656 247 - only the first instance responds to save; #X text 129 498 2007/2008 fbar; #X text 780 93 Enhancement by Enrique Erne; #X obj 507 363 list append; #X obj 507 386 route bang; #X text 591 385 filter out empty lists here \, too.; #X obj 196 249 route bang; #X obj 507 275 route save \$1; #X text 266 240 to output a specific key; #X text 539 297 dol1 to save a specific key; #X connect 0 0 9 0; #X connect 1 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0;
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Hallo Enrique, Enrique Erne hat gesagt: // Enrique Erne wrote: That looks great. hehe, I already committed it. ;) Still, personally I will initialize all keys, this guarantees to always have complete presets. [loadbang] | [; SSSAD vol 20, freq 42, other 1.2345( Yes, that's probably good practice. Basically i would like it if there was a possibility to let some SSSAD instances in a new patch output the value. Attached SSSAD has a possible solution. ... case 4) ___ [loadbang] | [; SSSAD vol 0.5, vol bang( [sssad vol] / [*~] How about something like that? [SSSAD vol bang( could be used to specify one key to output it's value. One more [route bang] would be required. One could argue [SSSAD vol bang( should delete the value, but i can't think of a use of having a key without value. Hm, maybe it could be nice to at least have the possibility to reset a key, and the SSSAD-receiver kind of represents the right, cold inlet. I tend to think of [sssad] like a variant of [list] and [value]. OTOH the syntax SSSAD vol 0.5, vol bang looks nice. Attached is a different approach for comparison: Here I introduced two new messages for SSSAD_ADMIN: setonly KEY and saveonly KEY. It may be cleaner to reuse the original messages and check if the user supplied a specific key: set KEY to only set this key, but I didn't manage to patch this (in a clean and simple way) that quick. In the near future there will be some more SSSAD_ADMIN messages I'd like to support: setlocal and savelocal to save to receivers called $2-SSSAD_ADMIN where $2 will usually be the parent's $0, to allow saving of all/some [sssad]s with canvas-local scope. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ sssad.pd Description: application/puredata sssad-initandsave.pd Description: application/puredata ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: In the near future there will be some more SSSAD_ADMIN messages I'd like to support: setlocal and savelocal to save to receivers called $2-SSSAD_ADMIN where $2 will usually be the parent's $0, to allow saving of all/some [sssad]s with canvas-local scope. Okay, the future is here: I took a different approach after looking though my old notes to make it possible to use [sssad] for local parameter saving and loading Attached [sssad-l] is compatible to normal [sssad] (but requires at a Pd with $1-$2 expansion). What's new: It also accepts a second argument which should be a number (designed for $0). If this number is 0 or missing, everything is as before. If $2 is different from 0, the global senders and receivers SSSAD and SSSAD_ADMIN are *deactivated* completely and replaced by $2-SSSAD and $2-SSSAD_ADMIN. sssad-l-test.pd includes some tests for this and also an example, how this change can be used for local parameter handling. Comments welcome. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ sssad-l-test.pd Description: application/puredata sssad-l.pd Description: application/puredata ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
[PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: Thanks a lot. This looks good in my quick test and also more simple and elegant than the dynamic patching (which I wasn't too happy with anyway). I'll do some more tests after work, but it seems now all is as with singleton and if it indeed is, I'd like to include your change. Okay, I commited this now with a bit of cosmetics and to include the fix reported by hard off regarding empty lists. New version also is attached for your convenience. Anyone using sssad.pd: Please test! Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ sssad.pd Description: application/puredata ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
HI Frank, So in a nutshell, what is different about this? I got a bit lost following this thread :) best wishes ps. Hans - will this be included in the release of 0.40.3? On 27 Jul 2008, at 11:54, Frank Barknecht wrote: Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: Thanks a lot. This looks good in my quick test and also more simple and elegant than the dynamic patching (which I wasn't too happy with anyway). I'll do some more tests after work, but it seems now all is as with singleton and if it indeed is, I'd like to include your change. Okay, I commited this now with a bit of cosmetics and to include the fix reported by hard off regarding empty lists. New version also is attached for your convenience. Anyone using sssad.pd: Please test! Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ sssad.pd___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Hallo, Si Mills hat gesagt: // Si Mills wrote: So in a nutshell, what is different about this? I got a bit lost following this thread :) It should behave just as before except for one thing: Sending a set to SSSAD_ADMIN or sending a bang into the first inlet of a [sssad] object will never output a single bang on the [sssad]'s outlet. So uninitialized [sssad] objects where just an empty list is stored will stay silent until they receive some valid data. The other change is an internal cleanup: The new sssad is completely self-contained in sssad.pd. The helper abstractions in the _sssad-subdirectory aren't used anymore and can be deleted (they will be deleted from the SVN later as well.) I don't think, the new sssad will be included in pd-extended 0.40, as that is about to be released (or maybe released already?) and the new sssad.pd isn't tested that much yet. AFAIK the old sssad was deleted from the current version of pd-extended anyway, because the libdir-loader cannot load it. Personally I think, removing sssad.pd is not a good workaround, but at least it may make more people download and test the current SVN-version. ;-) Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ __footils.org__ ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] New sssad.pd now in SVN repository - please test! [was: sssad slowness]
Frank Barknecht wrote: It should behave just as before except for one thing: Sending a set to SSSAD_ADMIN or sending a bang into the first inlet of a [sssad] object will never output a single bang on the [sssad]'s outlet. So uninitialized [sssad] objects where just an empty list is stored will stay silent until they receive some valid data. just a small remark about uninitialized [sssad] instances: scenario: 1) [sssad vol] [sssad freq] 2) change freq and save a preset XYZ SSSAD_ADMIN: list persist freq 21 SSSAD_ADMIN: list persist vol (note vol has no value!) 3) a week later in a live session.. the vol now has been changed and doesn't have its default value. let's say it's 0. 4) now load preset XYZ loading meaning something like the following: |;/ |SSSAD vol, freq 64; | |SSSAD_ADMIN set \ 5) now vol will output nothing and [sssad vol] will be empty. but the object that gets the value from vol remains on 0, which was the last value set. the problem is that the preset doesn't sound the same as one week before. thus) i think sssad behaves correct. i think this problem is the usage of uninitialized [sssad] objects. IMO a patch developer should care to always store key _with_ values. therefore i suggest to always initialize all sssad keys in your abstraction or patch. maybe like that: [loadbang] | |; / |SSSAD vol 73, freq 64; | |SSSAD_ADMIN set \ a different approach could be an empty symbol, but i don't like that. also one could check all values when loading a preset and checking for empty values but that's really ugly too. now the point why i write this email: it would be nice to have a little note in sssad-help that says initializing is strongly recommended or similar. what do you think? eni frank: it's very nice that you mention me thanks, but i am also fine without, it was more a rearrangement of existing code. if you have a changelog it'd be happy there. otherwise you can remove it whenever you want. thanks ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
