Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
Georg Holzmann wrote: Hallo! There are also ambisonic externals from IEM and Jasch, for better spatialization. I would not say better ;) - it depends ... Maybe a Spatialisation with Pure-Data page would be nice - is there something like that out there already? a web page, academic papers, performance documentation, patches?? Last year I did a workshop on this, you can find the files here: http://grh.mur.at/misc/PdSpatialization.tar.gz LG Georg great stuff! thanks for sharing :) rob c ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
[PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
hi, is it possible to send messages to the define_loadspeakers with the speaker definitions i would like to manipulate my spatialisation routines by manipulating the speaker definitions but don't want to create new instances of the [define_loudspeaker] each time any suggestions? thanks rob c ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
Kind of an odd way to do it...move locations of the speakers instead of the locations of the sounds ;-) One thing I would watch our for is if redefining the speakers interrupts the DSP chain or not, in which case you'd get some dropouts every time you did it. You might want to check that out before proceeding. best! d. PS... some multichannel inspiration now showing at the Hamburger Bahnhohf, Berlin: http://www.hamburgerbahnhof.de/sonder/08/leitner0108/leitnere.html robcanning wrote: hi, is it possible to send messages to the define_loadspeakers with the speaker definitions i would like to manipulate my spatialisation routines by manipulating the speaker definitions but don't want to create new instances of the [define_loudspeaker] each time any suggestions? -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 51: Distorting time ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
---BeginMessage--- Derek Holzer wrote: hi derek, Kind of an odd way to do it...move locations of the speakers instead of the locations of the sounds ;-) i like it, its kinda fun - you can have a sound orbiting then jumble up the speaker definitions in various ways not very elegant perhaps but simple and can give some nice results with minimum fuss would be interested to hear how other people create spatialisation routines/choreographies... One thing I would watch our for is if redefining the speakers interrupts the DSP chain or not, in which case you'd get some dropouts every time you did it. You might want to check that out before proceeding. yes this happens, thats why i was wondering if it was possible to to send a message rather than initiating a new instance not that this may help, just wanted to give it a try... cheers rob c best! d. PS... some multichannel inspiration now showing at the Hamburger Bahnhohf, Berlin: http://www.hamburgerbahnhof.de/sonder/08/leitner0108/leitnere.html robcanning wrote: hi, is it possible to send messages to the define_loadspeakers with the speaker definitions i would like to manipulate my spatialisation routines by manipulating the speaker definitions but don't want to create new instances of the [define_loudspeaker] each time any suggestions? ---End Message--- ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
Hey Rob, I've always wanted a graphical interface for creating these choreographies, maybe something pressure sensitive so it goes 3D, so that you could just draw the trajectories. Maybe with a few Theremins or some 3D tracking device you could dance out the movement of the sound ;-) When I bang the [define_loudspeakers] object on the left side of the help patch and send it to [print], this is what I get: loudspeaker-matrices 3 4 1 2 3 0.707107 -0.707107 -0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 -0.707107 -0 0 1.41421 0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 -0.707107 0.707107 0 0 0 0.707107 1 3 4 6.18172e-08 -1.41421 -6.18172e-08 0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 -0.707107 -0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 -0.707107 -0.707107 0 -6.18172e-08 0 0.707107 0.707107 2 3 4 -6.18172e-08 1.41421 6.18172e-08 0.707107 -0.707107 0.707107 -0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 0.707107 -0.707107 0.707107 0 -6.18172e-08 0 0.707107 0.707107 So if you wanted to do these calculations yourself somehow and create the message [loudspeaker-matrices n n n... , the [vbap] object would respond to them (I just checked this). But [vbap] can be picky about what it accepts, otherwise you get a message saying it's not a valid speaker setup (error in loudspeaker data!). I guess only the sourcecode of either [vbap] or [define_loudspeakers] will tell you what a valid set of arguments looks like. best! d. robcanning wrote: Derek Holzer wrote: hi derek, Kind of an odd way to do it...move locations of the speakers instead of the locations of the sounds ;-) i like it, its kinda fun - you can have a sound orbiting then jumble up the speaker definitions in various ways not very elegant perhaps but simple and can give some nice results with minimum fuss would be interested to hear how other people create spatialisation routines/choreographies... One thing I would watch our for is if redefining the speakers interrupts the DSP chain or not, in which case you'd get some dropouts every time you did it. You might want to check that out before proceeding. yes this happens, thats why i was wondering if it was possible to to send a message rather than initiating a new instance not that this may help, just wanted to give it a try... cheers rob c best! d. PS... some multichannel inspiration now showing at the Hamburger Bahnhohf, Berlin: http://www.hamburgerbahnhof.de/sonder/08/leitner0108/leitnere.html robcanning wrote: hi, is it possible to send messages to the define_loadspeakers with the speaker definitions i would like to manipulate my spatialisation routines by manipulating the speaker definitions but don't want to create new instances of the [define_loudspeaker] each time any suggestions? ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 192: Your mistake was a hidden intention ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
On another note, something I've never liked about vbap is this hole in the middle problem. Pan a sound from left to right through the middle of your room, rather than around the edge of the circle. Hear how everything jumps from left to right when you cross the zero point at the middle? That's the part I hate. I guess it's the inherent problem with cartesian vs polar coordinate systems. best, d. -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 73: From nothing to more than nothing ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
Derek Holzer wrote: On another note, something I've never liked about vbap is this hole in the middle problem. Pan a sound from left to right through the middle of your room, rather than around the edge of the circle. Hear how everything jumps from left to right when you cross the zero point at the middle? That's the part I hate. I guess it's the inherent problem with cartesian vs polar coordinate systems. best, d. i wonder are there any ports of any of these objects around http://www.maxobjects.com/?request=surround vbapan~ seems to allow either cartesian or polar coordinate systems rob c ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
On Mar 7, 2008, at 9:20 AM, robcanning wrote: Derek Holzer wrote: On another note, something I've never liked about vbap is this hole in the middle problem. Pan a sound from left to right through the middle of your room, rather than around the edge of the circle. Hear how everything jumps from left to right when you cross the zero point at the middle? That's the part I hate. I guess it's the inherent problem with cartesian vs polar coordinate systems. best, d. i wonder are there any ports of any of these objects around http://www.maxobjects.com/?request=surround vbapan~ seems to allow either cartesian or polar coordinate systems They are listed there as pd extenrals also, try it out. If there is source, it's usually pretty easy to port Max externals to Pd. There are some ambi ones there too. http://www.maxobjects.com/? v=librariesid_library=116requested=surroundoperateur=id_plateforme= There are also ambisonic externals from IEM and Jasch, for better spatialization. .hc As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Mar 7, 2008, at 9:20 AM, robcanning wrote: Derek Holzer wrote: On another note, something I've never liked about vbap is this hole in the middle problem. Pan a sound from left to right through the middle of your room, rather than around the edge of the circle. Hear how everything jumps from left to right when you cross the zero point at the middle? That's the part I hate. I guess it's the inherent problem with cartesian vs polar coordinate systems. best, d. i wonder are there any ports of any of these objects around http://www.maxobjects.com/?request=surround vbapan~ seems to allow either cartesian or polar coordinate systems They are listed there as pd extenrals also, try it out. If there is source, it's usually pretty easy to port Max externals to Pd. There are some ambi ones there too. http://www.maxobjects.com/?v=librariesid_library=116requested=surroundoperateur=id_plateforme= There are also ambisonic externals from IEM and Jasch, for better spatialization. great! i didn't realise this stuff was there ... easy to get lost when there are just so many externals! I'll have a look at this stuff. Maybe a Spatialisation with Pure-Data page would be nice - is there something like that out there already? a web page, academic papers, performance documentation, patches?? many thanks rob c ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
Hallo! There are also ambisonic externals from IEM and Jasch, for better spatialization. I would not say better ;) - it depends ... Maybe a Spatialisation with Pure-Data page would be nice - is there something like that out there already? a web page, academic papers, performance documentation, patches?? Last year I did a workshop on this, you can find the files here: http://grh.mur.at/misc/PdSpatialization.tar.gz LG Georg ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
On 07/03/2008, at 20.05, Georg Holzmann wrote: Last year I did a workshop on this, you can find the files here: http://grh.mur.at/misc/PdSpatialization.tar.gz Great. Took the liberty of adding it to http://puredata.info/docs/ tutorials ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
[PD] vbap define_loudspeakers messages
bip all I ben using vbap for manny yers in the ambiunix system, its a multi speaker setup for live performances and R/D, the first yers it was based on max/msp but when there came a hardcore c programmer in to the project we ported the all to carma/linux and the last weeks to stable debian/linux, sorry maxers, just better sound, on hdsp hardware, one mistake i remember vas to make the panner go from 360 to 1 -continue the cirkel, is that the problem? going to put more info on ambiunix.dk, for nu only old stuf on http:// ambiunix.komponent.dk alle software is free, just mail me. bw ha On Mar 7, 2008, at 9:20 AM, robcanning wrote: Derek Holzer wrote: On another note, something I've never liked about vbap is this hole in the middle problem. Pan a sound from left to right through the middle of your room, rather than around the edge of the circle. Hear how everything jumps from left to right when you cross the zero point at the middle? That's the part I hate. I guess it's the inherent problem with cartesian vs polar coordinate systems. best, d. i wonder are there any ports of any of these objects around http://www.maxobjects.com/?request=surround vbapan~ seems to allow either cartesian or polar coordinate systems They are listed there as pd extenrals also, try it out. If there is source, it's usually pretty easy to port Max externals to Pd. There are some ambi ones there too. http://www.maxobjects.com/? v=librariesid_library=116requested=surroundoperateur=id_plateforme= There are also ambisonic externals from IEM and Jasch, for better spatialization. .hc ___ PD-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
