Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Dan Wilcox]

You can set the font using -font-family on the command line. Also, I wouldn’t 
take that approach as Pd packages on Linux distros *should* have DejaVu Sans 
Mono as a dependency. If they don’t, the problem lies with the packaging and 
not with Pd.

enohp ym morf tnes
---
Dan Wilcox
danomatika.com
robotcowboy.com


> On Jan 28, 2022, at 3:04 PM, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay  
> wrote:
> 
> Oh this is good - now I presume many other patches one someone’s machine 
> will look awful if their Linux doesn’t find the font, so I shouldn’t feel too 
> bad. I’ll make sure they look decent with what I can expect from v0.48
> 
> Thanks!
> 
>> On 28 Jan 2022, at 13:32, Dan Wilcox  wrote:
>> 
>> Check the actual font used by setting Log level 4 All and compare "detected 
>> font" with "using font." On Linux, Pd doesn't include the font itself, so it 
>> relies on DVSM being installed to the system and Tk finding it when the GUI 
>> opens. If it can't find DVSM, it reverts to a series of backup fonts 
>> starting with the old default of Courier. 
>> 
 On Jan 28, 2022, at 1:11 PM, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay 
  wrote:
>>> 
 The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard 
 font and open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized 
 font, the rendering should be very close.
>>> 
>>> It was close enough indeed, except on Ubuntu 18 which makes a complete 
>>> mess. It might be on my side too.
>> 
>> 
>> Dan Wilcox
>> @danomatika
>> danomatika.com
>> robotcowboy.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 



___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Christof Ressi]

v0.48
According to the release notes 
(http://msp.ucsd.edu/Pd_documentation/x5.htm#s1), the font handling 
changes have been introduced in 0.48-1.


Christof

On 28.01.2022 15:04, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:

Oh this is good - now I presume many other patches one someone’s machine will 
look awful if their Linux doesn’t find the font, so I shouldn’t feel too bad. 
I’ll make sure they look decent with what I can expect from v0.48

Thanks!


On 28 Jan 2022, at 13:32, Dan Wilcox  wrote:

Check the actual font used by setting Log level 4 All and compare "detected font" with 
"using font." On Linux, Pd doesn't include the font itself, so it relies on DVSM being 
installed to the system and Tk finding it when the GUI opens. If it can't find DVSM, it reverts to 
a series of backup fonts starting with the old default of Courier.


On Jan 28, 2022, at 1:11 PM, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay  
wrote:


The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard font and 
open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized font, the 
rendering should be very close.

It was close enough indeed, except on Ubuntu 18 which makes a complete mess. It 
might be on my side too.


Dan Wilcox
@danomatika
danomatika.com
robotcowboy.com





___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list




___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

Oh this is good - now I presume many other patches one someone’s machine will 
look awful if their Linux doesn’t find the font, so I shouldn’t feel too bad. 
I’ll make sure they look decent with what I can expect from v0.48

Thanks!

> On 28 Jan 2022, at 13:32, Dan Wilcox  wrote:
> 
> Check the actual font used by setting Log level 4 All and compare "detected 
> font" with "using font." On Linux, Pd doesn't include the font itself, so it 
> relies on DVSM being installed to the system and Tk finding it when the GUI 
> opens. If it can't find DVSM, it reverts to a series of backup fonts starting 
> with the old default of Courier. 
> 
>> On Jan 28, 2022, at 1:11 PM, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard font 
>>> and open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized font, the 
>>> rendering should be very close.
>> 
>> It was close enough indeed, except on Ubuntu 18 which makes a complete mess. 
>> It might be on my side too.
> 
> 
> Dan Wilcox
> @danomatika
> danomatika.com
> robotcowboy.com
> 
> 
> 



smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Dan Wilcox]

Check the actual font used by setting Log level 4 All and compare "detected 
font" with "using font." On Linux, Pd doesn't include the font itself, so it 
relies on DVSM being installed to the system and Tk finding it when the GUI 
opens. If it can't find DVSM, it reverts to a series of backup fonts starting 
with the old default of Courier. 

> On Jan 28, 2022, at 1:11 PM, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay  
> wrote:
> 
>> The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard font 
>> and open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized font, the 
>> rendering should be very close.
> 
> It was close enough indeed, except on Ubuntu 18 which makes a complete mess. 
> It might be on my side too.


Dan Wilcox
@danomatika 
danomatika.com 
robotcowboy.com 



___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

Thanks Dan for this comprehensive reply.

> Pd tries to use the same standard font across all platforms as of around 0.48 
> or 0.49. In 0.52, we now included the italic and bold versions of DejaVu Sans 
> Mono as well.

Highly appreciated.

> The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard font 
> and open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized font, the 
> rendering should be very close.

It was close enough indeed, except on Ubuntu 18 which makes a complete mess. It 
might be on my side too.

> There is also a text patch with all the GUIs you can use to compare on 
> different systems:
> Help->Browser : Pure Data/7.stuff/tools/sizingtest.pd 

This is good to know - I now have Parallels running with Windows10 and Ubuntu20 
in MacOS so I can see in realtime what they look like.

> I would also ask Alex and the cyclone team as they have deployed a standard 
> help-file format and pushed for some of the required changes in this area.

Oh that is a great pointer - I’ll try to reach for him as I’d like to get it 
right (or at least get challenged by their requests :) - I presume they opened 
a project/pr on GitHub? I’ll check them out.

> Oh, one thing I've forgotten about: the default font is bold on Windows and 
> Linux which normal weight on macOS.

I read about it and it looks a bit different but not enough to cause issues 
with Menlo/DejaVu

Thanks again for the extensive response!

smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Dan Wilcox]

Oh, one thing I've forgotten about: the default font is bold on Windows and 
Linux which normal weight on macOS.

This is historical but I believe is also due to the font rendering on macOS 
using antialiasing which gives the normal font a similar draw size as the bold 
fonts on the other platforms (slightly a guess here). Another possible reason 
is that the bold fonts render "better" on Windows and Linux which normal 
renders "better" on macOS. Some have called for making them all the same but 
it's been a precedent I don't feel worth changing at least without a broad 
consensus of users. "If it ain't broke..."

> On Jan 28, 2022, at 12:47 PM, Dan Wilcox  wrote:
> 
> Pd tries to use the same standard font across all platforms as of around 0.48 
> or 0.49. In 0.52, we now included the italic and bold versions of DejaVu Sans 
> Mono as well. On macOS, we use a DVSM derivative, Menlo, which is included on 
> the system itself. Details are here:
> 
> https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/tree/master/font 
> 
> 
> The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard font 
> and open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized font, the 
> rendering should be very close. The relative sizing of objects and GUIs 
> should be very similar, however not *pixel-perfect*. This is down to small 
> differences in how Tk renderings things on the canvas via the underlying 
> system graphics frameworks. We also imported the tried-and-true object sizing 
> tweaks honed in pd-extended around the same time to help ensure more 
> consistent sizing.
> 
> That being said, I would basically suggest approach layouts with a bit of 
> padding here and here and don't overlying focus on exact pixel alignment of 
> things. GOPs are generally fine regarding sizing etc. There is also a text 
> patch with all the GUIs you can use to compare on different systems:
> 
> Help->Browser : Pure Data/7.stuff/tools/sizingtest.pd 
> 
> I would also ask Alex and the cyclone team as they have deployed a standard 
> help-file format and pushed for some of the required changes in this area.
> 
>> On Jan 27, 2022, at 8:06 PM, pd-list-requ...@lists.iem.at 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> (Ps any pointer on how to unify looks between OSes welcome - I found some 
>> online, mostly moaning about fonts :)
> 
> 
> Dan Wilcox
> @danomatika 
> danomatika.com 
> robotcowboy.com 
> 
> 
> 


Dan Wilcox
@danomatika 
danomatika.com 
robotcowboy.com 



___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Dan Wilcox]

Pd tries to use the same standard font across all platforms as of around 0.48 
or 0.49. In 0.52, we now included the italic and bold versions of DejaVu Sans 
Mono as well. On macOS, we use a DVSM derivative, Menlo, which is included on 
the system itself. Details are here:

https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/tree/master/font 


The result is that if you make a patch on one system with the standard font and 
open it on another with the same or ver similar (macOS)-sized font, the 
rendering should be very close. The relative sizing of objects and GUIs should 
be very similar, however not *pixel-perfect*. This is down to small differences 
in how Tk renderings things on the canvas via the underlying system graphics 
frameworks. We also imported the tried-and-true object sizing tweaks honed in 
pd-extended around the same time to help ensure more consistent sizing.

That being said, I would basically suggest approach layouts with a bit of 
padding here and here and don't overlying focus on exact pixel alignment of 
things. GOPs are generally fine regarding sizing etc. There is also a text 
patch with all the GUIs you can use to compare on different systems:

Help->Browser : Pure Data/7.stuff/tools/sizingtest.pd 

I would also ask Alex and the cyclone team as they have deployed a standard 
help-file format and pushed for some of the required changes in this area.

> On Jan 27, 2022, at 8:06 PM, pd-list-requ...@lists.iem.at wrote:
> 
> (Ps any pointer on how to unify looks between OSes welcome - I found some 
> online, mostly moaning about fonts :)


Dan Wilcox
@danomatika 
danomatika.com 
robotcowboy.com 



___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

> i compiled pd from source and yes, i'm using jack.

Same here - it works-ish and is simpler to do than SC for sure - so thanks to 
whomever wrote the compile instructions.

>> I’m new to Linux and it is quite chronophage :)
> i'm always hoping it trades some knowledge for the time spent. :)

Indeed it helps understand the beast a bit.

smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[ub]

On 27.01.22 22:31, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:

This is good news!

I’m curious, did you compile Pd or was there a binary somewhere? If so, do you 
use jack or another audio driver?


i compiled pd from source and yes, i'm using jack.


I’m new to Linux and it is quite chronophage :)


i'm always hoping it trades some knowledge for the time spent. :)




p


On 27 Jan 2022, at 21:27, ub  wrote:

hello,



all works for me.

pd 0.52.1, ubuntu 20.04, flucoma-pd from dev branch at #eeab7248



it's a very cool help patch, by the way. very interactive. nice!



cheers,

ub

On 27.01.22 21:59, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:

Sorry - they are all here:


https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-sc/releases/tag/nightly


The whole project is documented here:


https://www.flucoma.org/


And we try to help people understanding it all here:


https://learn.flucoma.org/installation/pd






On 27 Jan 2022, at 20:30, Roman Haefeli 
  wrote:

On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:17 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:


 the external works fine out of the help. Even more strange,
sometimes that works for a few minutes before getting these problems.


Where can one get the external?
Roman



___

Pd-list@lists.iem.at
  mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management ->
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list




___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

Ok thanks. Indeed the Pd, sorry for that!

If they run fine then I’ll consider it done and continue to plough with the 
other 70 helpfiles to do :)

> On 27 Jan 2022, at 21:54, Roman Haefeli  wrote:
> 
> On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:59 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
>> Sorry - they are all here:
>> 
>> https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-sc/releases/tag/nightly
>> 
> 
> You probably meant the Pd link, not SC:
> 
> https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-pd/releases/tag/nightly
> 
> I'm sorry that I'm not much of help here. The externals and help-
> patches seem to run fine here (Pd compiled from tag: 0.52-1-really,
> Ubuntu 20.04)
> Roman



smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Roman Haefeli]

On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:59 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
> Sorry - they are all here:
> 
> https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-sc/releases/tag/nightly
> 

You probably meant the Pd link, not SC:

https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-pd/releases/tag/nightly

I'm sorry that I'm not much of help here. The externals and help-
patches seem to run fine here (Pd compiled from tag: 0.52-1-really,
Ubuntu 20.04)
Roman


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

This is good news!

I’m curious, did you compile Pd or was there a binary somewhere? If so, do you 
use jack or another audio driver?

I’m new to Linux and it is quite chronophage :)

p

> On 27 Jan 2022, at 21:27, ub  wrote:
> 
> hello,
> 
> 
> 
> all works for me.
> 
> pd 0.52.1, ubuntu 20.04, flucoma-pd from dev branch at #eeab7248
> 
> 
> 
> it's a very cool help patch, by the way. very interactive. nice!
> 
> 
> 
> cheers,
> 
> ub
> 
> On 27.01.22 21:59, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
>> Sorry - they are all here:
>> 
>> 
>> https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-sc/releases/tag/nightly
>> 
>> 
>> The whole project is documented here:
>> 
>> 
>> https://www.flucoma.org/
>> 
>> 
>> And we try to help people understanding it all here:
>> 
>> 
>> https://learn.flucoma.org/installation/pd
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 27 Jan 2022, at 20:30, Roman Haefeli 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:17 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
>>> 
  the external works fine out of the help. Even more strange,
 sometimes that works for a few minutes before getting these problems.
 
>>> Where can one get the external?
>>> Roman
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> Pd-list@lists.iem.at
>>  mailing list
>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
>> https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
> ___
> Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
> https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list



smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[ub]

hello,


all works for me.

pd 0.52.1, ubuntu 20.04, flucoma-pd from dev branch at #eeab7248


it's a very cool help patch, by the way. very interactive. nice!


cheers,

ub

On 27.01.22 21:59, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:

Sorry - they are all here:

https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-sc/releases/tag/nightly

The whole project is documented here:

https://www.flucoma.org/

And we try to help people understanding it all here:

https://learn.flucoma.org/installation/pd




On 27 Jan 2022, at 20:30, Roman Haefeli  wrote:

On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:17 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:

 the external works fine out of the help. Even more strange,
sometimes that works for a few minutes before getting these problems.

Where can one get the external?
Roman


___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

Sorry - they are all here:

https://github.com/flucoma/flucoma-sc/releases/tag/nightly

The whole project is documented here:

https://www.flucoma.org/

And we try to help people understanding it all here:

https://learn.flucoma.org/installation/pd



> On 27 Jan 2022, at 20:30, Roman Haefeli  wrote:
> 
> On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:17 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
>>  the external works fine out of the help. Even more strange,
>> sometimes that works for a few minutes before getting these problems.
> 
> Where can one get the external?
> Roman



smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Roman Haefeli]

On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 20:17 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
>  the external works fine out of the help. Even more strange,
> sometimes that works for a few minutes before getting these problems.

Where can one get the external?
Roman


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

 the external works fine out of the help. Even more strange, sometimes 
that works for a few minutes before getting these problems.

I’ll keep an eye on it, hopefully someone will get a reproducible problem.

smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

Re: [PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Roman Haefeli]

On Thu, 2022-01-27 at 17:45 +, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay wrote:
> So I am fighting the fight of trying to unify the look of my
> helpfiles across the 3 oses… and I think I got a bug but I cannot
> trace where it is.

The help-file loads fine in my Pd (0.52-1) on Ubuntu 20.04. However, I
don't have the fluid.* externals installed and get a lot of "...
couldn't create" messages. Maybe the problem is in the external and not
in the patch?

Roman


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list

[PD] A quick question - a bug or me?

[Pierre Alexandre Tremblay]

So I am fighting the fight of trying to unify the look of my helpfiles 
across the 3 oses… and I think I got a bug but I cannot trace where it is.

To get the latest version I had to compile on Ubuntu (the apt is stalled at 
0.50). It works but when I load the attached file in Ubuntu 18, I get 
> corrupted size vs. prev_size
> Pd: signal 6
> watchdog: signaling pd...
(multiple times until I force quit)

and when I load the exact same patch in the same binary on Ubuntu 20 I get:
> malloc(): invalide next size (unsorted)
> Pd: signal 6
> watchdog: signaling pd...
(multiple times until I force quit)

I am trying to identify what I do wrong but any hint welcome before I do a bug 
report that is so vague it is useless…

The said file renders fine in Windows and MacOS.

Thanks!

pa

(Ps any pointer on how to unify looks between OSes welcome - I found some 
online, mostly moaning about fonts :)



fluid.chroma~-help.pd
Description: Binary data


smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
___
Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> 
https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list