Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[P. J. Alling]

Oh, so it's bureaucratic inertia.  That's not crazy, unfortunately.  .

On 3/9/2010 3:01 PM, eckinator wrote:

2010/3/8 P. J. Alling:
   

Is the German government crazy?
 

hehe... glad you asked; I guess they all are in some way... ours is
working hard to build a reputation for being corrupt and industry
controlled at this time, so aye on that.

BUT... with regard to melatonin it is just a general rule which dies
not take into account the nature of the medication.

   



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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[eckinator]

2010/3/8 P. J. Alling :
> Is the German government crazy?

hehe... glad you asked; I guess they all are in some way... ours is
working hard to build a reputation for being corrupt and industry
controlled at this time, so aye on that.

BUT... with regard to melatonin it is just a general rule which dies
not take into account the nature of the medication.

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[P. J. Alling]

Is the German government crazy?

On 3/3/2010 6:20 AM, eckinator wrote:

2010/3/2 Sasha Sobol:
   

eckinator, thanks.
I did not know that melatonin was illegal in Germany
 

yeah, 'fraid so.
first offence, you'll get off w/o time but it will cost a couple
hundred. gotta make up your mind if taking the small risk is worth
that to you. to me it isn't.
cheers
ecke

   



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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[eckinator]

2010/3/2 Sasha Sobol :
> eckinator, thanks.
> I did not know that melatonin was illegal in Germany

yeah, 'fraid so.
first offence, you'll get off w/o time but it will cost a couple
hundred. gotta make up your mind if taking the small risk is worth
that to you. to me it isn't.
cheers
ecke

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 2, 2010, at 4:14 PM, Ken Waller wrote:

> 
> Kenneth Waller
> http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f
> 
> - Original Message - From: "Doug Franklin" 
> Subject: Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag
> 
> 
>> On 2010-03-02 12:47, John Sessoms wrote:
>>> A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to
>>> sleep.
>> So can a dose of benadryl and a dose of your favorite liquor. :-)
> 
> Knob Creek bourbon works for me.
> 
A morphine drip is most effective.

>> -- 
>> Thanks,
>> DougF (KG4LMZ)
> 
> 
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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[John Sessoms]

From: Doug Franklin

On 2010-03-02 12:47, John Sessoms wrote:


> A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to
> sleep.


So can a dose of benadryl and a dose of your favorite liquor.  :-) 


Thanks, but no thanks.

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Sasha Sobol]

eckinator, thanks.
I did not know that melatonin was illegal in Germany
--S

On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 1:14 PM, Ken Waller  wrote:
>
> Kenneth Waller
> http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f
>
> - Original Message - From: "Doug Franklin"
> 
> Subject: Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag
>
>
>> On 2010-03-02 12:47, John Sessoms wrote:
>>
>>> A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to
>>> sleep.
>>
>> So can a dose of benadryl and a dose of your favorite liquor. :-)
>
> Knob Creek bourbon works for me.
>
>>
>> --
>> Thanks,
>> DougF (KG4LMZ)
>
>
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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Ken Waller]

Kenneth Waller
http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f

- Original Message - 
From: "Doug Franklin" 

Subject: Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag



On 2010-03-02 12:47, John Sessoms wrote:


A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to
sleep.


So can a dose of benadryl and a dose of your favorite liquor. :-)


Knob Creek bourbon works for me.



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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[gldnbearz]

Actually sent that info to Boris via off-line b/c not everyone can
legally use melatonin.

- Pat

On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 11:25 AM, eckinator  wrote:
>>> I'm surprised nobody's mentioned Melatonin...
>
> enter Germany with it in your luggage - they're unlikely to catch you
> but if they do you are importing illegal medicines which is not a narc
> offense but still a crime subject to official prosecution so whoever
> catches you or gets your case on their table has no option to let you
> off the hook... keep that in mind
> cheers
> ecke
>
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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[gldnbearz]

Ooh... that combination might put you to sleep for a good while.  Some
days, the liquor leaves less of a hangover...

- Pat 

On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 11:17 AM, Doug Franklin
 wrote:
> On 2010-03-02 12:47, John Sessoms wrote:
>
>> A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to
>> sleep.
>
> So can a dose of benadryl and a dose of your favorite liquor. :-)
>
> --
> Thanks,
> DougF (KG4LMZ)

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[eckinator]

>> I'm surprised nobody's mentioned Melatonin...

enter Germany with it in your luggage - they're unlikely to catch you
but if they do you are importing illegal medicines which is not a narc
offense but still a crime subject to official prosecution so whoever
catches you or gets your case on their table has no option to let you
off the hook... keep that in mind
cheers
ecke

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-02 12:47, John Sessoms wrote:


A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to
sleep.


So can a dose of benadryl and a dose of your favorite liquor. :-)

--
Thanks,
DougF (KG4LMZ)

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[John Sessoms]

From: Tim Bray

On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Boris Liberman  wrote:

> Hi!
>
> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
> in dealing with the jet lag.


I'm surprised nobody's mentioned Melatonin.  You can buy it in most
vitamin stores and for a lot of people, it seems to help a ton in
getting a fairly uninterrupted night's sleep before your body has had
time to adust to the new zone.  Which has the effect of speeding up
the adjustment.

It tends to produce weird and intense dreams.

It works for me.  Not for my wife; the dreams are hairy enough to wake
her up, scared.

I suppose giving up alcohol and caffeine might help too, but who wants
to do that?
 -Tim


If you're not lactose intolerant, try a glass of warm milk.

Melatonin is one of the "active ingredients" in warm milk, along with 
tryptophan. It's not concentrated, so if you react intensely to it, that 
might be a better way to get the benefit with fewer side effects. Much 
lower dose than from a supplement.


I think it's actually a combination of the melatonin, tryptophan and the 
relaxing effect of the warmth, because it seems more effective than is 
accountable for from the dosage.


Alcohol and caffeine dehydrate you. The point of the no alcohol 
proscription is to warn you not to count on alcohol to re-hydrate.


Drink additional water to offset the dehydrating effect of alcohol or 
caffeine.


A small amount of red wine can actually help relax you to enable you to 
sleep.


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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Tim Bray]

On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Boris Liberman  wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
> in dealing with the jet lag.

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned Melatonin.  You can buy it in most
vitamin stores and for a lot of people, it seems to help a ton in
getting a fairly uninterrupted night's sleep before your body has had
time to adust to the new zone.  Which has the effect of speeding up
the adjustment.

It tends to produce weird and intense dreams.

It works for me.  Not for my wife; the dreams are hairy enough to wake
her up, scared.

I suppose giving up alcohol and caffeine might help too, but who wants
to do that?
 -Tim

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[steve harley]

On 2010-02-28 23:27 , Boris Liberman wrote:

I wonder what
kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
in dealing with the jet lag.


one thing i've heard is to endeavor to wake up when you are in REM 
(active dreaming) sleep, rather than in deep sleep


how do you do that, you ask?

you could try this: 

(i've only read about it, std disclaimer)

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 1, 2010, at 9:56 PM, Stan Halpin wrote:

> Boris, I violate most of the rules, and my solution to flying long distance 
> with minimal jet lag is no exception. I do consume alcohol. I am not a 
> fanatic about hydration. But the three small tricks that seem to help me are 
> similar to Ken's suggestion. First, when I get on the plane, I immediately 
> set my watch to the time at the destination. Otherwise it is too easy to fall 
> prey to the airplane schedule which is based on departure-city time.  "Bloody 
> 'ell, it's already 0300 in London and I'll be getting a breakfast in 3 hours. 
> Why are they serving me dinner!??!"  Second, drink lots of coffee when you 
> arrive in the early morning. Third, walk, visit with people, go shopping, do 
> anything to avoid sitting down until at least 1800 on your day of arrival. 
> Then get a good long sleep. If you wake up at 0330 local time, don't turn on 
> the lights much less get up; lie there and plan your day until at least your 
> normal time to get up. I won't claim that I don't feel the lag in the early 
> evening on the 2nd day, but I usually don't fall asleep in my dinner.
> I find westbound to be much easier to adapt to. 
> 
> stan
> 
That's exactly how I do it. Works fine. Jet lag is partly in one's mind.  New 
York to LA s a breeze. Detroit to New Zealand was a little tough. Left here on 
the night of December 29th and arrive in Auckland, early morning on the 31st. 
But I stayed up all day and was fine the next day. Easiest was Sydney to LA. 
Left Sydney at 2PM on Sunday, slept much of the way. Arrived in LA at 2PM on 
Sunday. Just picked up where I left off.
Paul
> 
> On Mar 1, 2010, at 12:25 PM, Ken Waller wrote:
> 
>> After traveling thru numerous time zones I try to stay on the time at my 
>> destination, regardless of what my body's time zone is. I find I'm in much 
>> better shape the first full day there.
>> 
>> Kenneth Waller
>> http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f
>> 
>> - Original Message - From: "Boris Liberman" 
>> Subject: Off Topic: Jet Lag
>> 
>> 
>>> Hi!
>>> 
>>> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
>>> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
>>> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
>>> in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
>>> eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
>>> recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
>>> for me.
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Boris
> 
> 
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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Stan Halpin]

Boris, I violate most of the rules, and my solution to flying long distance 
with minimal jet lag is no exception. I do consume alcohol. I am not a fanatic 
about hydration. But the three small tricks that seem to help me are similar to 
Ken's suggestion. First, when I get on the plane, I immediately set my watch to 
the time at the destination. Otherwise it is too easy to fall prey to the 
airplane schedule which is based on departure-city time.  "Bloody 'ell, it's 
already 0300 in London and I'll be getting a breakfast in 3 hours. Why are they 
serving me dinner!??!"  Second, drink lots of coffee when you arrive in the 
early morning. Third, walk, visit with people, go shopping, do anything to 
avoid sitting down until at least 1800 on your day of arrival. Then get a good 
long sleep. If you wake up at 0330 local time, don't turn on the lights much 
less get up; lie there and plan your day until at least your normal time to get 
up. I won't claim that I don't feel the lag in the early evening on the 2nd 
day, but I usually don't fall asleep in my dinner.
I find westbound to be much easier to adapt to. 

stan

On Mar 1, 2010, at 12:25 PM, Ken Waller wrote:

> After traveling thru numerous time zones I try to stay on the time at my 
> destination, regardless of what my body's time zone is. I find I'm in much 
> better shape the first full day there.
> 
> Kenneth Waller
> http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f
> 
> - Original Message - From: "Boris Liberman" 
> Subject: Off Topic: Jet Lag
> 
> 
>> Hi!
>> 
>> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
>> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
>> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
>> in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
>> eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
>> recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
>> for me.
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Boris


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RE: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Chris Mitchell]

Rick Womer wrote
> Boris,
> 
> Get hold of this book: How To Beat Jet Lag, by Dan Oren.  

I heard about this some time ago and wanted to get it but forgot the
author's name. So thanks, Rick, for reminding me.

Just looked on UK Amazon - 42.95 GB pounds per 141 page paperback copy!
Luckily they had a 2nd hand version for 2.76 so I ordered it.

Chris



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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Ken Waller]

After traveling thru numerous time zones I try to stay on the time at my 
destination, regardless of what my body's time zone is. I find I'm in much 
better shape the first full day there.


Kenneth Waller
http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f

- Original Message - 
From: "Boris Liberman" 

Subject: Off Topic: Jet Lag



Hi!

I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
for me.

Thanks.

--
Boris



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RE: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[John Sessoms]

From: Boris Liberman

Hi!

I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
for me.

Thanks.


Re-hydration (no alcohol)
Take a long walk
Take a hot shower
Glass of warm milk
Sleep.

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Bob Sullivan]

You need 1 day per time zone to get back to normal.
Make sure you are hydrated, water is your friend!
Sleep when you can and get some exercise.
Regards,  Bob S.

On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 12:27 AM, Boris Liberman  wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
> in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
> eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
> recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
> for me.
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> Boris
>
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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Rick Womer]

Boris,

Get hold of this book: How To Beat Jet Lag, by Dan Oren.  He is a 
chronobiologist at NIH (National Institutes of Health), who devised a beautiful 
method that only involves a sleep mask, ear plugs (optional), sunglasses, and a 
watch.

I used to be utterly disabled by jet lag for 4 or 5 days flying "across the 
pond"; but using Oren's method I can work efficiently and feel completely 
normal the day after I arrive.

The book may be out of print, but is still available on Amazon.

Rick

http://photo.net/photos/RickW


--- On Mon, 3/1/10, Boris Liberman  wrote:

> From: Boris Liberman 
> Subject: Off Topic: Jet Lag
> To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
> Date: Monday, March 1, 2010, 1:27 AM
> Hi!
> 
> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in
> the past 4
> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I
> wonder what
> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could
> offer me
> in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that
> traveling
> eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip
> back and
> recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an
> ordinary
> for me.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> -- 
> Boris
> 
> -- 
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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[David Savage]

Get your company to spring for business class seats.

:-)

On 1 March 2010 14:27, Boris Liberman  wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
> in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
> eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
> recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
> for me.
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> Boris

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Rob Studdert]

On 01/03/2010, Larry Colen  wrote:

> My technique was to undergo serious sleep deprivation before hand, staying
> awake most of 24 hours before arriving at the new location so that when I
> got there, my internal clock was totally scrambled and easy to reset.

My prescription too, always works for me but a bit late after the fact!

-- 
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Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours
Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio

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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Larry Colen]

On Feb 28, 2010, at 10:27 PM, Boris Liberman wrote:


Hi!

I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
for me.


My technique was to undergo serious sleep deprivation before hand,  
staying awake most of 24 hours before arriving at the new location so  
that when I got there, my internal clock was totally scrambled and  
easy to reset.




Thanks.

--
Boris

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Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: Off Topic: Jet Lag

[AlunFoto]

2010/3/1 Boris Liberman :
> Hi!
>
> I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
> weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
> kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
> in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
> eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
> recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
> for me.

Surely you could find some reckless doc to prescribe sleeping pills
for you, but that's certainly not what I would consider.

Here are the motions I go through myself. They come without any
guarantees, and I suspect there's a good deal of placebo effect. Which
means you have to find remedies you truly believe in for yourself.

All in your local timezone (not your body's)
1. No caffeine after lunch.
2. Last big meal no later than 18:00. snacks/bites after that should
be low-carbo or at least slow-carbo.
3. If possible, excercise enough in the evening to make your body lust for rest.

The common note to those three is to make it easier to persuade the
brain to nap at earlier hours.

Jostein

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Off Topic: Jet Lag

[Boris Liberman]

Hi!

I have traveled across 7 time zones back and forth twice in the past 4
weeks. And this time the recovery is rather tiresome. I wonder what
kind of advice (except, Boris, go visit a doctor) you could offer me
in dealing with the jet lag. Initially I thought that traveling
eastwards wasn't that much of a deal. But the last trip back and
recovery thereafter are out of what I would have called an ordinary
for me.

Thanks.

-- 
Boris

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