RE: Paying problems at eBay. (A follow up question)

2006-03-15 Thread Tim Øsleby
Forgot to say: Thank you to all who has helped me find a solution on this on
and off list. 
The list is an expensive place to hang around for a LBA'er, but it sure is
helpful and full of wisdom.


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 15. mars 2006 02:34
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: RE: Paying problems at eBay. (A follow up question)
> 
> What do you do to "Mutually withdraw" an eBay deal?
> 
> Those of you who has read my previous posts on my eBay experiences
> hopefully
> knows what I mean.
> 
> 
> Tim
> Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> 
> Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: 13. mars 2006 20:01
> > To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> > Subject: Paying problems at eBay.
> >
> > As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-
> > 500/6,9.
> >
> > When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> > directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller
> cannot
> > currently receive payments."
> >
> > When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> > me
> > "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> > little problem wint pay pal".
> >
> > I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> >
> > After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> > from
> > ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will
> send
> > you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> > mail
> > from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> > solve
> > anything at all?
> >
> > The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> > since auction closed.
> > What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> > booze?
> >
> >
> > Tim
> > Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> >
> > Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> > (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 






RE: Paying problems at eBay. (A follow up question)

2006-03-15 Thread Tim Øsleby
Just got a mail from the seller. He has agreed to withdraw the deal. I'm
right now sending a thanks message. Now I feel a bit bad about it. He may be
a reasonable man who just has been unlucky with his transactions. 

Never the less. So it looks like a happy ending at this "never ending
story". I've even got a new deal sealed, another lens. A bit pricier, but
safer (read newer) and better lens. 


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 15. mars 2006 02:34
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: RE: Paying problems at eBay. (A follow up question)
> 
> What do you do to "Mutually withdraw" an eBay deal?
> 
> Those of you who has read my previous posts on my eBay experiences
> hopefully
> knows what I mean.
> 
> 
> Tim
> Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> 
> Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: 13. mars 2006 20:01
> > To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> > Subject: Paying problems at eBay.
> >
> > As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-
> > 500/6,9.
> >
> > When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> > directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller
> cannot
> > currently receive payments."
> >
> > When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> > me
> > "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> > little problem wint pay pal".
> >
> > I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> >
> > After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> > from
> > ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will
> send
> > you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> > mail
> > from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> > solve
> > anything at all?
> >
> > The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> > since auction closed.
> > What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> > booze?
> >
> >
> > Tim
> > Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> >
> > Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> > (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 






RE: Paying problems at eBay. (A follow up question)

2006-03-14 Thread Tim Øsleby
What do you do to "Mutually withdraw" an eBay deal?

Those of you who has read my previous posts on my eBay experiences hopefully
knows what I mean. 


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 13. mars 2006 20:01
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: Paying problems at eBay.
> 
> As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-
> 500/6,9.
> 
> When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller cannot
> currently receive payments."
> 
> When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> me
> "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> little problem wint pay pal".
> 
> I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> 
> After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> from
> ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will send
> you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> mail
> from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> solve
> anything at all?
> 
> The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> since auction closed.
> What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> booze?
> 
> 
> Tim
> Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> 
> Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> 
> 
> 






Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Bob Sullivan
And broken English too!  Danger Will Robinson!  Danger!  Bob S.

On 3/13/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>  
>
> Sounds like a plan! Seriously, I would be hesitant about sending this guy any 
> money. Bed e-mail and problems with paypal are something to be concerned 
> about.
> Paul
>
>



RE: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Tim Øsleby
Oh. That's a comfort to know John.


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: John Forbes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 14. mars 2006 01:30
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: Re: Paying problems at eBay.
> 
> This is God's way of telling you that you should have bought a Novoflex.
> :-)
> 
> John
> 
> 
> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 19:00:32 -, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron
> > 200-500/6,9.
> >
> > When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> > directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller
> cannot
> > currently receive payments."
> >
> > When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> > me
> > "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> > little problem wint pay pal".
> >
> > I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> >
> > After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> > from
> > ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will
> > send
> > you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> > mail
> > from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> > solve
> > anything at all?
> >
> > The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> > since auction closed.
> > What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> > booze?
> >
> >
> > Tim
> > Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> > Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> > (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
> 






Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread John Forbes
This is God's way of telling you that you should have bought a Novoflex.  
:-)


John


On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 19:00:32 -, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron  
200-500/6,9.


When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller cannot
currently receive payments."

When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling  
me

"what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
little problem wint pay pal".

I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.

After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy  
from
ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will  
send
you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a  
mail
from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will  
solve

anything at all?

The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
since auction closed.
What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and  
booze?



Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)











--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/



RE: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Tim Øsleby
I have said it before, I believe. You are a wise man Shel. Your last
sentence puts things into perspective.


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: Shel Belinkoff [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 13. mars 2006 22:35
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: RE: Paying problems at eBay.
> 
> Walk away and don't look back.  There are better sellers, better deals,
> and, probably, better lenses to be had.  Look at how much time you're
> already wasting on what should be a simple, one minute transaction.
> 
> Shel
> 
> 
> 
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Tim Øsleby
> 
> No need to quote what you've already written 
> 






RE: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Shel Belinkoff
Walk away and don't look back.  There are better sellers, better deals,
and, probably, better lenses to be had.  Look at how much time you're
already wasting on what should be a simple, one minute transaction.

Shel



> [Original Message]
> From: Tim Øsleby

No need to quote what you've already written 



Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Toine
The paypal site (login first) should give you an option "add funds".
It probably lists a local norwegian back account where you should
transfer the money (don't forget to include the special numbers they
supply you. Once the money is transferred (one or more days) you
should see your money in your paypal account as funds. After that you
can pay the seller using your funds (and not your credit card).
It works for me, no idea if paypal is offering this service to Norway.
Toine

On 3/13/06, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm very new to this. How do I do that?
>
>
> Tim
> Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
>
> Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Toine [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: 13. mars 2006 20:21
> > To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> > Subject: Re: Paying problems at eBay.
> >
> > He probaly has a personal paypal account and connot accept credit card
> > transactions without upgrading his account. You could transfer money
> > on your paypal account first and after that pay with paypal.
> > Toine
> >
> > On 3/13/06, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-
> > 500/6,9.
> > >
> > > When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> > > directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller
> > cannot
> > > currently receive payments."
> > >
> > > When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> > me
> > > "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> > > little problem wint pay pal".
> > >
> > > I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> > >
> > > After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> > from
> > > ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will
> > send
> > > you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> > mail
> > > from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> > solve
> > > anything at all?
> > >
> > > The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> > > since auction closed.
> > > What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> > booze?
> > >
> > >
> > > Tim
> > > Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> > >
> > > Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> > > (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
>



RE: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Jens Bladt
Are you new to women and booze, Tim?
It's very exiting - if one don't kill you - the other will!
Regards

Jens Bladt
http://www.jensbladt.dk

-Oprindelig meddelelse-
Fra: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sendt: 13. marts 2006 20:30
Til: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
Emne: RE: Paying problems at eBay.


I'm very new to this. How do I do that?


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)

Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: Toine [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 13. mars 2006 20:21
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: Re: Paying problems at eBay.
>
> He probaly has a personal paypal account and connot accept credit card
> transactions without upgrading his account. You could transfer money
> on your paypal account first and after that pay with paypal.
> Toine
>
> On 3/13/06, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-
> 500/6,9.
> >
> > When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> > directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller
> cannot
> > currently receive payments."
> >
> > When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> me
> > "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> > little problem wint pay pal".
> >
> > I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> >
> > After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> from
> > ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will
> send
> > you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> mail
> > from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> solve
> > anything at all?
> >
> > The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> > since auction closed.
> > What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> booze?
> >
> >
> > Tim
> > Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> >
> > Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> > (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> >
> >
> >
> >
>





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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Jens Bladt
Ebay bought Paypal a while back - isn't that right?
It sounds like the seller owe money to ebay (listing fees etc. ?)
So, ebay/Paypal is blocking the seller?? (why do ebay let him list things in
the first place...?)

If the auction said Paypal is OK, I'd tell the seller to forget the whole
thing!
You will probably find a better seller/lens shortly, anyway :-)
Hopefully you won't get negative feed back for this.

Regards
Jens Bladt
http://www.jensbladt.dk

-Oprindelig meddelelse-
Fra: Tim Øsleby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sendt: 13. marts 2006 20:01
Til: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
Emne: Paying problems at eBay.


As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-500/6,9.

When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller cannot
currently receive payments."

When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling me
"what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
little problem wint pay pal".

I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.

After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy from
ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will send
you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a mail
from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will solve
anything at all?

The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
since auction closed.
What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and booze?


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)

Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)



--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.1/279 - Release Date: 03/10/2006

--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.2.1/279 - Release Date: 03/10/2006



RE: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Tim Øsleby
I'm very new to this. How do I do that? 


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)

> -Original Message-
> From: Toine [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 13. mars 2006 20:21
> To: pentax-discuss@pdml.net
> Subject: Re: Paying problems at eBay.
> 
> He probaly has a personal paypal account and connot accept credit card
> transactions without upgrading his account. You could transfer money
> on your paypal account first and after that pay with paypal.
> Toine
> 
> On 3/13/06, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-
> 500/6,9.
> >
> > When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> > directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller
> cannot
> > currently receive payments."
> >
> > When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling
> me
> > "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> > little problem wint pay pal".
> >
> > I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
> >
> > After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy
> from
> > ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will
> send
> > you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a
> mail
> > from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will
> solve
> > anything at all?
> >
> > The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> > since auction closed.
> > What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and
> booze?
> >
> >
> > Tim
> > Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
> >
> > Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> > (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 






Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread pnstenquist



Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Tim Øsleby
As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-500/6,9.

When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller cannot
currently receive payments." 

When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling me
"what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
little problem wint pay pal". 

I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.

After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy from
ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will send
you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a mail
from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will solve
anything at all?

The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
since auction closed. 
What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and booze?


Tim
Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
 
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds 
(Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)





Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Toine
He probaly has a personal paypal account and connot accept credit card
transactions without upgrading his account. You could transfer money
on your paypal account first and after that pay with paypal.
Toine

On 3/13/06, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-500/6,9.
>
> When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller cannot
> currently receive payments."
>
> When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling me
> "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> little problem wint pay pal".
>
> I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
>
> After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy from
> ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will send
> you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a mail
> from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will solve
> anything at all?
>
> The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> since auction closed.
> What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and booze?
>
>
> Tim
> Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
>
> Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
>
>
>
>



Re: Paying problems at eBay.

2006-03-13 Thread Fernando Terrazzino
>What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and booze?
sounds like a plan...

On 3/13/06, Tim Øsleby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> As some of you might know, I just won an eBay auction. A Tamron 200-500/6,9.
>
> When trying to pay the invoice by PayPal, something odd happenes. I am
> directed to a "Transaction Cancelled" page telling me "This seller cannot
> currently receive payments."
>
> When noting the seller, I get a message in rather broken english telling me
> "what happened is that im sign with ebay so you have to pay ebay. I had
> little problem wint pay pal".
>
> I retry paying via the PayPal link in the invoice. Same result.
>
> After a bit back and forth, the seller sends this message " im the guy from
> ebay i've sent ebay a message about the payment problem and they will send
> you or me a message telling us about whats going on ok." Waiting for a mail
> from eBay does not sound like a speedy solution. Is it likely it will solve
> anything at all?
>
> The seller is in US, and responds very slowly on mails. It is now a week
> since auction closed.
> What do I do? Forget the whole thing, and spend the 160$ on women and booze?
>
>
> Tim
> Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian)
>
> Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large crowds
> (Very freely after Arthur C. Clarke, or some other clever guy)
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